The Pledge 121
According to the film trades, director Sean Penn fought bitterly for months with Warner Brothers about how to release The Pledge.
Penn had warned that this wasn't a mainstream Hollywood movie, aimed at megaplex crowds accustomed to such movie verities as warm characters and happy endings.
Penn wanted the movie released slowly, as an art film, so it would have time to build and find its audience, so people would be prepared for it.
The danger, he cautioned, was that people would flock to The Pledge thinking it a showcase for just another Nicholson tough-guy performance, as in A Few Good Men.
Assuming Penn did argue this way, he was right. But he lost the fight against the dependably venal Hollywood studio execs, who wanted the movie released as widely as possible before people realized how brilliantly unconventional and depressing it is. Trailers for The Pledge were blatantly misleading, suggesting a cop-on-the-trail-of-a-vicious-killer adventure ("I made a promise!") In the two theaters where I saw the movie, people had obviously been fooled, and there were lots of squirming kids.
As a result, unprepared audiences are reportedly struggling with this chilling movie, which is not lighting up at the box office, as Sean foresaw.
The Pledge is an anti-mainstream mainstream movie.
Faithful in spirit to the story written by the broody Swiss novelist Friedrich Durrenmatt, it's told in an almost European style (they can make bleak movies there) free of formulaic marketing notions of how much grimness American ticket-buyers can bear and will pay for. In the U.S., the idea seems to be that movies are an escape from reality, not a portrayal of it.
The Pledge conjures up Atom Egoyan's wonderful but determinedly grim The Sweet Hereafter, released in l997. That movie was marketed just the way Penn wanted The Pledge to be -- in small theaters in selected cities. It exceeded expectations, whereas The Pledge can't possibly succeed as the blockbuster Warner Brothers pretended it would be.
This is a haunting movie about isolation, obsession, aging and madness. Nicholson delivers one of the great performances of his life as retiring Reno police detective Jerry Black, who leaves his own retirement party to investigate the murder-mutilation of a little girl and, in more than one sense, never comes back.
Black becomes obsessed with the idea that a vicious rapist-murderer is stalking young blonde schoolgirls who wear red dresses. His ex-colleagues believe the murders have been solved and that he's going crazy and getting senile.
Black buys an old gas station and bait shop at the epicenter of the area where the victims have vanished or been murdered. Though he poses as a retired cop who is now an angler, it gradually becomes clear to the audience that he's anything but retired, that he is honoring his pledge on his "eternal salvation" to the mother of one of the victims: he will find the killer. A host of top-notch actors drop in briefly and shine while they do: Vanessa Redgrave, Robin Wright Penn, Sam Shepard, Aaron Eckhart, Helen Mirren, Mickey Rourke.
Don't expect a light-hearted moment in this movie -- the colors are muted, the climate harsh and forbidding. The open shot is eerie and depressing and it just gets worse. There is an incredibly powerful cinematic moment on a turkey farm where parents learn their daughter has been slaughtered. Nicholson incorporates loneliness and alienation into his language, facial expressions and body posture. He is wrestling with all sorts of demons, from retirement and aging to the kind of obsession that seems credible for a conscientious detective in these circumstances.
Nicholson's detective visibly begins to wear under the strains of his life. He looks grizzled, chain-smokes, walks stiffly, forgets words and thoughts. Gradually -- in the kind of plot development unimaginable in most mainstream Hollywood films -- we come to realize that he is prepared to make any sacrifice, including any chance at a new life, and the people he most loves, to bring the killer to justice.
The movie has trouble ending, and gets a bit improbable. And even the most discriminating movie-lovers aren't always psychically prepared for a movie as unsparing as this one. You keep expecting the film to lighten up, to give us a ray of hope, for the Nicholson character to get on with his life, to see the light, for justice to prevail. But Penn has gone for unyielding honesty and fidelity to a story.
Like The Sweet Hereafter, -- whose influences seem distinctly present here -- the movie's message is that life is a real horror sometimes and, as one character points out, God can be greedy. There are devils out there, as Detective Black tells the bereaved mother. But if you can handle The Pledge -- the (minimal) gore isn't the problem here, but the truth behind it -- you won't regret it. It's a beautiful, worthwhile and fascinating movie, the kind Hollywood isn't supposed to make anymore.
Again, what this is about.. (Score:1)
As many of you know, this is becoming a regular Sunday a.m.
Tech culture is very loosely defined here as movies and programs there's a lot of interest in..it's a subjective choice. I respond in part to e-mail subjects and other nodes on various threads. I look for interesting movies, those with tech themes, and those with attitude and POV.
This is the fourth week, and the readership is high I'm told. So has the quality of many of the comments. Lots of smart ones.
As with any public Net/Web online community discussion, there will be flames, adolescent chest-thumping, testosterone discharge, odd and off-topic respones, attacks on the writer, personalizing of disagreement..etc. Most of you know this, but this is the inevitable chorus that accompanies any open site..It's not going away and it's not debatable or particularly important. Just think of it as living near an airport with jet noise.
Remember that only a small fraction of readers post, and of those, only a small fraction flame or are overtly hostile. Unfortunately noise to sig ration is high.
We're all human, and sometimes take the bait, but in general it's a waste of time -- if you focus on reading the increasing number of very smart reviews that are being posted and comments about film history and technique, you'll find it as rewarding as I and others have.
Flame diversions are only momentarily satisfying, IMHO and even then rarely.
This topic will work a lot better if we don't take that bait, and respond instead to the significant number of people who actually want to talk movies and culture. They are here in large numbers -- many lurkers because of the head-butting -- and are ultimately more interesting and significant. Eventually the people who want to talk will grow and dominate...maybe.
The good news is that this is beginning to work. Please feel free to e-mail me your own suggestions for movie and Tv topics, as many of you already are.
Again, my review just gets the conversation going. It's not meant as the last or only word, just the first.
I've been lucky in that I've gotten paid to review movies for nearly 10 years now and really love it..if I could afford to do it full-time, I would. Next best thing is participating in this column. My reviews are discussion-starters, and your opinions are as good -- or in many cases,much better -- than mine. But all criticism is subjective, valid to the individual. My wish is that this grows into an open movie/culture discussion, and it seems off to a good start.
A reminder that any kind of movie discussion -- here, in mags or papers, has to discuss plot..I never give away endings, but unless you simply say this movie is great or sucks, you can't discuss the movie without discussing..well, the movie. I don't ever give away endings, but like most professional critics, I always discuss some plot. People who understandably don't want to know anything about a movie might best stay away from this column and discussion. If you do discuss plot in your posts, it's nice to indicate that in the subject heading.
Plse e-mail me if you have any questions about it..thanks...
Jonkatz's first real achievement (Score:5)
Re:Jonkatz's first real achievement (Score:1)
use LaTeX? want an online reference manager that
Anti-Mainstream Mainstream is the Mainstream. (Score:5)
One can consider a hollywood film to be an extended phenotype. It is the modern extension of our instinct to tell stories and educate of old, but stripped of any real worthwhile qualities. If only Hollywood were not dominated by commercial concerns, and existed to create good films for their own sake, I don't think this vacancy and and the other problems I have mentioned would be a problem.
The United Kingdom has, of late, set up a highly succesful method of making films which is government funded, though indirectly. Government owned television stations, such as Channel 4, make excellent films such as Trainspotting, Shallow Grave and 4 Weddings and a Funeral. These films are designed to be good to watch, not to make money. And they represent the true counterculture sweeping the film world from Europe (Dogme 95 is another example).
It would be good if America, through PBS, were to implement a similar profit free, for the love of it system. It would give us some innovative and interesting films, and a relief from Hollywood.
They fuck you up, your mum and dad.
Re:Jonkatz's first real achievement (Score:1)
Or the "first reply to first post" posts would gain importance. I'd like to see that happen!
SamSpade sez: comp-u-geek (Score:1)
This means you connect using normal web http and authentication info www.cnn.com&entertainment&story-id=aEfz to host 1066606061 and fetch /
1066606061 is just another way of writing the IP address 63.147.29.237
The URL is accessible as http://63.147.29.237/ (login as www.cnn.com&entertainment&story-id=aEfz if needed) and is hosted by 63.147.29.237
Movie reviews in general. (Score:1)
Friedrich Duerrenmatt's "Der Verdacht" (Score:1)
Re: (Score:2)
Off to a bad start (Score:1)
Do note that while the big American studios may be attempting to break away from their lackluser performance as of late, they still can't resist the temptation to fsck with the source material. The book on which this movie is based (Das Versprechen) takes place in Switzerland, so I wonder what else they've changed -- and does Hollywood ever change a book for the better?
Granted, this may not be entirely related but... (Score:2)
www.please-fire-this-simp.com (Score:1)
Its Atom Egoyan not Aton Egoyan.
You have missed the mark on your cliche: Did you really mean "dark and forbidding" and not "dark and forboding". If your gonna be a writer lets ask that you work on your reading comprehension a little.
And lastly; hearing "In the two theaters where I saw the movie, people had obviously been fooled, and there were lots of squirming kids." was rather disappointing. I thought that Mr. Katz, with his obvious cinematic insight was being given private screenings... a setting more fitting of his mighty stature.
Public funding... (Score:2)
I didn't know trainspotting was funded that way..but I can't imagine the government ever supporting filmamkers, not this one. The British model of news gathering makes me think you have a point there..but what about government control?
Never saw the CNN or any other review (Score:3)
and in fact, theirs doesn't read like mine, as shud be instantly obvious..but if it did, how do you know they're not plagiarizing me?
OT: slashdot and culture (Score:3)
Movies and Music and other arts can promote and create aand change the social climate we live in. Things like social dysfunction can be promoted, accidently or otherwise.
Geeks are protrayed as criminal hackers, for example. Or the general population is examined in depth for the essence of True Evil, while downplaying the inherent complexity ordinary lives have, and downplaying the presence of the natural good that people also have. This can lead to things like the alienation and separtion documented in HELLMOUTH.
So little things like the movie reviews can have a deeper meaning.
More than mere entertainment when viewed in the context of the broader culture in which we live, and the ends that we struggle for, outside the context of the corporate "Lab Rat" management philosophies [amazon.com].
Re:Friedrich Duerrenmatt's "Der Verdacht" (Score:2)
There is a piece by Friedrich Dürrenmatt called "Der Verdacht" ("The Suspicion"). However, it is different from "Das Versprechen" ("The Pledge").
"The Pledge", as you mentioned, has been filmed twice under the title "Es geschah am hellichten Tag" ("It Happened in Broad Daylight"), in 1958 [imdb.com] and 1997 [imdb.com] which was a TV release only that I have yet to see.
Friedrich Dürrenmatt is definitely one of the most interesting writers of the last century and you should check out his writing or have a look at his works that have been filmed [imdb.com].
The Family Man... (Score:2)
...I'd be interested in your review of The Family Man, if you were willing..didn't see that, but heard a lot about it..
"Der Verdacht" (Score:2)
This is interesting..would ou be willing to say morea bout Der Verdacht.I'd be very curious to know how they differ...
Re:Never saw the CNN or any other review (Score:2)
Oh, that's easy. Because you're an idiot.
Channel 4 is not government owned! (Score:1)
Government owned television stations, such as Channel 4
Channel 4 [channel4.co.uk] and FilmFour [filmfour.com], the film-making branch, are independant companies, although they might indirectly attract funding through the Arts Council for certain films [lifestyle.com].
Also, I'd hardly rate 4 Weddings as not designed to make money and counterculture...
Good question.. (Score:2)
Maybe Smoke Signals..Anybody else ever see that?
Excruciatingly Unconvincing (Score:2)
Many movies today are trying to forge new paths into relaltively untouched areas of movie-making. Strange/different endings, multiple plots that culminate in the end, etc. Many directors are trying now to avoid the cliche "Hollywood Ending." The problem, in my view, with "The Pledge" is it's a blatently obvious attempt to avoid the "Hollywood Ending." In an attempt to produce a movie that might stir up some conversation and controversy among it's patrons, Sean Penn merely produces a movie that loses its cohesion and unravels into its threads at the end.
Reading Roger Ebert's review of the movie helps put some perspective on the movie. Ebert states, "Sean Penn's 'The Pledge' begins as a police story and spirals down into madness" (Suntimes [suntimes.com]). Ebert rather enjoyed this spiral into madness. I did not. It left me wanting more. It left me rather distressed.
Maybe that is what Penn wanted? I'll tell you one thing, I am definitely interested to see Penn's next movie.
Re:Again, what this is about.. (Score:1)
And so you wrote about The Pledge? I mean, reviewing SF movies or ones with large mass appeal (I'm sure Hannibal wouldn't be that objectionable, even if it's not geek-specific) is one thing, but this movie isn't going to be seen by many (if not most) Slashdot readers, and probably belongs somewhere else.
Your Sig (Score:1)
What the hell is that mess? I read the whole thing - but frankly I dont know what the hell he was trying to say..?????? do people actually read that crap - wow.
Re:Off to a bad start (Score:1)
Although not a book, A Few Good Men was originally a stage play. The play's author, Aaron Sorkin, reworked his script to develop the screenplay, and in IMHO, did an excellent job. Although the play itself is good, it doesn't carry the power and drama that the screenplay does. The film version combined a good script with an outstanding cast (including our friend Mr. Nicholson in a role that many people now know him by) to create a truly outstanding film. It both entertains and leaves the audience thinking afterwards.
LOL (Score:2)
Thanks for the fix on Atom..love the post..never been to a private screening in my life..
Wanting more.. (Score:2)
...interesting comments..but I'd be curious about what you meant when you said you wanted more?
P.S. Because...(not to slight Mr. Ebert) (Score:2)
...to me, madness was sort of the brave point of what Penn as doing, the very part that wasn't a Hollywood ending..
Re:Channel 4 is not government owned! (Score:1)
Re:Slashbot's Paradise (Score:1)
A+ for effort!
Re:Never saw the CNN or any other review [OT] (Score:1)
Or is it more of a social thing - Everone must love linux & open source, but hate M$ and JonKatz?
-chaswell
Oh masterful troll, teach me your ways (Score:1)
Pop Culture...very interesting post (Score:2)
I think this is important. Pop culture is an almost universal language to many people on
Coded once.. (Score:2)
...what a catastrophe..No, I think you're on solid ground there, though I love your idea that people who can't code shouldn't be allowed into movie screenings..that would sure alter movie criticism.
Re:Channel 4 is not government owned! (Score:1)
----
Re:www.please-fire-this-simp.com (Score:1)
Please re-read: "You have missed the mark on your cliche: Did you really mean "dark and forbidding" and not "dark and forboding?"
What are *you* talking about?
Culture as a mirror (Score:2)
I think what you're saying is very true. Culture is a mirror. For reasons I don't quite understand, but would love to hear more about, tech and pop cultures seem very related..Don't know why, tho
Re:Public funding... (Score:1)
----
Re:Anti-Mainstream Mainstream is the Mainstream. (Score:2)
Except that, if it were done by PBS, it would have to be done by current PBS love child, Ken Burns. I don't think I could take that.
PBS is good at science and nature (Nova, Nature), investigative reporting (Frontline) and reasonably good at news (Lehrer). It is not good at drama. Almost all of the good drama shown on PBS comes from England. Masterpiece Theater: British. Mystery: British.
The most recent piece of domestic (US) drama I can recall on PBS is a half-assed effort that totally butchered Langston Hughes' Cora Unashamed. That is a story that leaves the reader unable to speak afterwards. And how they could get a boring performance out of CCH Pounder, I will never know. Of course it was beautifully photographed. Style over substance from PBS.
Re:Off to a bad start (Score:1)
There are a few cases where the movie is better than the source material (be it play, short story, or novel). In the case of over-long "technothrillers" (*cough* Tom Clancy *cough*), the films they make are at least as good as the books, because they can remove a lot of the extraneous bullsh*t that the author tacked on and no editor would stand against him.
Also, a number of the Bond films make improvements on the Ian Fleming sources (imho). From Russia With Love, for instance, in the literary form, features only two groups, MI6/Bond and SMERSH/Red Grant (with Tatiana sort of caught in the middle). The film adds intrigue by throwing SPECTRE into the mix.
And in Goldfinger, Ian Fleming himself, said that they improved the novel with the screenplay (Fleming died just after Goldfinger wrapped filming).
The three eighties Bonds that took both title and plot points from Bond short stories (For Your Eyes Only, Octopussy, and The Living Daylights) all did an amazing job of stitching together several disparate short stories and improving them through packaging.
Re:Off to a bad start (Score:1)
In other words, the Bond films may or may not be considered Hollywood, depending on how broadly you cast your net.
Re:Excruciatingly Unconvincing (Score:1)
FP and channel 1 (OT, sort of) (Score:2)
You know, I think that GimpBoy's on to something here. Do you know why there's no channel 1 on a US television? Because the FCC realized that stations would fight tooth and nail to be the "first post" on the dial. If you take away FP by simply putting a post (or two or three) at the start of the discussion, then the value of FP goes away, and we at least get rid of that annoyance.
I Luv Jon Katz (Score:2)
Please write us more Mr. Katz, please.
--
You can't imagine how much I really do love Jon Katz.
Re:Culture as a mirror (Score:1)
If young people like something, then it becomes absorbed into "pop culture." Everyone else sits up and pays attention, including those who profit from advertisement schemes. Someone more educated in such things may disagree with me on this (anyone? anyone?), but hasn't anybody else come to the conclusion that "counterculture" is a subset of "pop culture"?
Aren't "geeks" just another clique?
PLEASE NO! (Score:1)
i LIKE open source coders writing code! hell, we should FORCE, them in to LOCKED rooms. till the next release is done.
now, if critics had to hand code their text in html, or better asci codes for html....
nmarshall
The law is that which it boldly asserted and plausibly maintained..
Hmm (Score:1)
Re:Anti-Mainstream Mainstream is the Mainstream. (Score:1)
-Crass (1978ish)
The mainstreaming of the anti-mainstream has been going on forever.
Re:Off to a bad start (Score:1)
What's so brave.... (Score:2)
Seriously. I haven't seen this film, but when I look back at the films that I have recently seen described as "brave" or "an unflinching portrayal of the real world" they were mostly nasty pulp fiction getting off on showing violent nasty people get away with it. And they have that "if you can handle it" arrogence that forces people to treat it as though its art instead of (non sexual) porn. Theres nothing particluarly deep, or IMHO really talented about having a story where everything sucks at the beginning and everything sucks at the end. A film like that CAN be good or deep or whatever, but it can also be badly written, badly portrayed and in its own way just as cliched as the so called "holywood ending".
If this film is good, it will be because it was a well made and acted film, just like dozens of other well made and acted films that happened to have more or less upbeat endings. But when reviewers use terms like "brave" and "unflinching" it all translates with me as "pretensious".
Kahuna Burger
Re:Granted, this may not be entirely related but.. (Score:1)
"Es geschah am hellichten Tag" (Score:1)
there is also a television remake [imdb.com] from 1997.
why is this in /. (Score:3)
Is there anything remotely nerdish about the film?
Is there anything about this film except that JonKatz likes films in general and this one in particular?
If
Topic moderation should be introduced...
Re:Never saw the CNN or any other review [OT] (Score:1)
Actually, I think that's exactly it...it's very "slashdot" (read: elite) to advocate Open Source or Linux and put down MS and Katz.
For his part, Katz doesn't write anything that is any worse than many of the "informative" articles link by /., but he'll not get a good rap from the /. mob because it's fashionable to hate him. Some of his articles are trite, some are well done. Some are uninformed, some are great pieces of writing.
The easiest way to tell, by the way, that it's "in style" to Katz-bash, is the sheer number of people that post the "get this guy outta here" messages, rather than just filtering him out and letting him fade away.
Just remember when posting:
-Jer
Why is "unhappy ending" described as "realistic"? (Score:4)
A college football team faces a new coach and interpersonal conficts, as well as personal problems for individual team members. They fight their way through close games with larger schools all the way to the BIG Game... which they lose because this movie is about the other team and their personal challenges and triumphs.
A fucked up and misogynistic teenager manipulates and occasionally date rapes teen girls until he either 1) gets the shit kicked out of him by one's older brother, 2) gets send to JV and sexually assaulted by an older boy, 3) gets aids and dies a nasty death because he doesn't get tested and find out the truth until its too late, 4) we don't know because this is a "gritty realistic" movie that ends after only one day during which he didn't suffer any consequences.
Every story is a little slice. There are very few movies where you couldn't play the "well, if this was THEIR movie" game and see it completely differently. The thing is that a couple of centuries (if not millenia) of writers have had the intelligence to know who they are writing for and pick the slice and the endpoint that their readers/viewers are looking for and will enjoy the most. The greek tragedies were just what they said. They were no more "realistic" in their morbidity than the comedies were in their expansive happy endings. They were just written for different audiences and expectations.
So if I as a reader/veiwer enjoy one kind of ending point, and find another to be unneccassarily depressing or for that matter find that that particular slice isn't one I will spend my recreational time on, I no more deserve to be told that I "can't handle the realism" or "want a holywood ending" than the guy who hates romantic films and wants the "holywood ending" of lots of violence and gore.
I doubt The Pledge is any more unflinchingly realistic than When Harry Met Sally. Its just picking a side of a story that most people don't find enjoyable. If it can pull it off, great, but if it fails thats its fault as a movie, not ours as veiwers.
Kahuna Burger
Where's the Rugrats review???? What about Rent? (Score:1)
C'mon katz boy, where's the Rugrats review? A lot of your reviews lately belong on salon or msnbc or [insert non-geek site here] so why don't you just break down and admit you've run out of tech stuff to talk about (unless you want to do what, a 20th story on hell-orifice).
The only non-geek thing you haven't talked about in the entertainment world is musicals.
What's next, your analysis of the state of current broadway musicals?
Re:Anti-Mainstream Mainstream is the Mainstream. (Score:1)
This is a common idea and I suppose I have no disagreement with it, per se.
My problem is with your proposed "solution" - to wit, put the government in charge of the movie business. Do you really want this?
No one will argue with your charge that the need to be "commercial" can produce very shlocky trashy output. (On the other hand, this is not the same thing as saying that all movies produced within a commercial system are bad, right?)
My problem is with the notion that movies (or any art) produced on the government's dime are necessarily any better. All right, movies in Hollywood serve one master (the almighty dollar, the mass lowest-common-denominator moviegoer). But art produced PBS-style serves another master (primarily, the bureaucrats who have to approve the grants; and, ultimately, the tastes of snobbish upper-middle-class cocktail-party-goers).
This just replaces one master with another. Why is the second one necessarily better? Is 4 Weddings and a Funeral really better than Fight Club? Is Shallow Grave really better than The Sixth Sense?
In fact, let's just expose this "let's have the government fund art so it's not subject to market forces" mantra for what it really is. It is upper-middle-class snobs petitioning the government to take money away from the working class to fund their tastes.
It is essentially a transfer payment from the lower classes to the rich (who, after all, could just fund PBS-type ventures on their own if they really think such things are so important).
Re:Anti-Mainstream Mainstream is the Mainstream. (Score:1)
Hollywood is trying to co-opt the real rebellious, non-mainstream filmstyles for its own moneymaking schemes.
What do you mean trying? Its a done deal. It didnt help any that the "counter culture" turned out be much, much more venal than their daddy's culture.
The lesson to be gleaned from counter culture is simple: cliques sell.
Re:Jack Nicholson macho thriller?? (Score:1)
Re:Excruciatingly Unconvincing (Score:1)
Re:Culture as a mirror (Score:1)
Yet many of these individuals are painfully predictable, since they take whatever stance or action is the exact opposite of what is pushed by "pop culture." By doing this, they aren't showing independent thought at all, they are still slaves to popular culture just as much as those that follow it. The only difference is that they wait for what popular culture says, then do the exact opposite, thinking to themselves that they are unique.
(It reminds me of good old Monty Python, where the whole mass of people claims in unison, "We're all individuals." Then one chap pipes up, "I'm not!") Why is it that all of these counterculture folks look and act exactly the same? How unique does that make them?
I don't mean to be troll-bait, but I am curious what others think about this.
JMTC,
Padanando
Re:Public funding... (Score:1)
Interesting statement. I take it this means that, when the government does suppress political stories and reporting, it does it in ways which are illegal and/or invisible.
(I mean, that's what you're saying, right? Essentially, you're saying "The government never covers anything up, because I never see any evidence of it!" Which...uh...kinda misses the point, right? :)
i'd bet that they're expending them on suppressing and controlling things far more worrying than what their funded media are producing.
I'll take that bet. I'll bet that you are wrong and that the government pays special attention to media output regarding its actions.
I don't know much about the UK, but here in the U.S. it has been reported that during the Yugoslavia, uh, bombing, the Army had special "advisors" over at CNN.
And you think it's a good idea to get the media even more in bed with the government? The mind boggles.
Re:Why is "unhappy ending" described as "realistic (Score:1)
I love the old Annette Funicello/Frankie Avalon beach movies. I'd probably have found them saccharine and annoying if I had seen them when they were made, but today the optimism, friendliness and joy in life that fills them seems so refreshing in a culture that has turned its back on those things.
Over the last 30 years, the attitude shapers of US culture have decided that bleakness, pessimism, ugliness and cynicism are the only "realistic" or "authentic" way to see the world. It's a corrosive, lazy attitude that is at least as destructive as relentless optimism. That's how we get a Presidential election where candidates don't need to stake out real positions -- everyone in the media is writing about spinning and scheming because they're all too cool to talk about anything as lame as what the candidates actually stand for.
Re: (Score:1)
Great point, but... (Score:2)
This is a great and smart point, but I promise you, this movie has nothing in common with When Harry Met Sally..the point is very well taken, but the truth is, sad and bad endings in Hollywood arre rare, and more interesting, the thing about this movie I found so surprising was that it wasn't sugar coated in any way..no happy love, life or other outcome..very rare, I think. True of Crouching Tiger, tho..
I'd be eager to know what you think when you see it, but I think the Pledge is more unflichingly realistic than many movies I've seen, tho not more than "The Sweet Hereafter."" Talk about bleak..
Ouch! (Score:2)
Mimicking msnbc..you know how to hurt a guy..At the moment, sticking to movies, tho...certainly happy to write about the R-rats..have done SImpsons and South Park, etc., repeatedly and in many forums..MSNBC? Yuk..I'll go incinerate myself.
But if you think I'll ever run out of tech stuff to write about..now there's wishful thinking..you ought to see the queue of backed up columns. How could somebody run out? I could write 20 a week, and all of the ideas come from out there..very neat.
P.S But let's be fair.. (Score:2)
The movie reviews are generating a lot of interest..lots of readership, comments, e-mail, etc. I think to be democratic, people in the
And remember -- nobody has to read anything they don't want to read or aren't interested in..
also. (Score:1)
the folks out there get to decide..if lots of people read it, talk about, then it belongs..if not, they don't..you could argue that all movies are inherently tech..fact, I would argue that. You could make that case for Rent too, which had a huge tech component to its production..but no musicals for me..the rugrats on the other hand..
Answered this before, but..no Kremlim purity (Score:3)
Lots of people have expressed interest in a place to talk about tech culture, movies, TV shows..So since there are very few movies dealing straight out with tech..sci-fi, antitrust, we broadened it to see if there are people on a sunday morning who want to talk about pop culture, a huge tech interest..seems there are. Some movies will be more head-on than other..antitrust..others are just interesting..the readers get to decide..I don't feel hidebound by Kremlin-like definitions of what's ideologically acceptable. And for the record, most reviews are done after I get a lot of e-mail from people who plan on seeing them and want to talk about them..
Limited releasd != good (Score:2)
Who selects those "selected" cities anyway?
In context, the implication is that limited release is good, while letting the rubes in Podunkville see anything but formulaic "blockbusters" is bad. Um, is this the same Jon Katz who wrote of the tragedy of how dull life can be for small-town and rural geeks?
What is to be gained by this big-city (sorry - "selected" city) elitism?
It's bad enough when economic necessity forces small town theaters to show only mass-market Hollywood tripe. It's worse when media elite (I'm afraid that's you this time, Jon) act like that's a good thing and encourage this unfortunate trend.
Watched it twice..and Hummph! (Score:2)
..and disagree, as to other people..and sir, I am no tech writer, thank you..Hummmph!
But you're wrong..the movie isn't borrowed from other movies, but the famous book on which it's based..don't know of another movie like it, truthfully.
You're in good company.. (Score:2)
astute is good..I'd add piercing and insightful..Want a ILUVKatz T-shirt, soon available on Think Geek?
(Aw, I love him, too, the rascal)
Re:Left Behind -- awesome! (Score:2)
Actually, do it here yourself..
Re:Again, what this is about.. (Score:2)
If you really want to render the flamers, lamers, and "adolescent chest-thumpers" irrelevant, just ignore them -- set your threshold a little higher and go on with your life, stay on topic, and (if you will pardon my language) quit your bitching. Getting on your pedestal and crowing about how inferior they all are compared to you (and your coolly intellectual prose, which -never- gives way to passion, right?) doesn't make you look any better, believe me.
I'd like to add that I'm not making this post because "you are JonKatz and I disagree on that basis alone." I'm making it because your high-handed attitude nauseates me. I have no grudge against your regular articles; I've read a good potion of them, and have no quarrel, with their content or with you personally. By all means, write your articles, say what you like, but don't tell your readers how to respond to it. If people want to flame you and insult you, that's their business, just as how I choose to respond to you (and your article) is mine. Choosing to insult and condescend them first with a "shame on you" finger-wagging isn't the solution.
Fight Club - the film is better than the book (Score:1)
Genereally, however, you're right: books are almost always better than the film. Why? Maybe it`'s the fact that films are usually intended for a larger audience (and cost more), but I think part of the reason are just the differences in the media. In a book, you can use a whole page to describe a setting, the film can only show it, and if the viewer doesn`t notice a detail then it's lost, whereas the reader always gets every aspect of the story.
The Ending Sucked. (Score:1)
Re:Don't be surprised by how........ (Score:3)
The limited release paradigm (Score:2)
It is actually possible, and perhaps likely, that medium sized town residents will be LESS likely to see a film like The Pledge if it has a traditional 1000+ screen debut, rather than a slow rollout. The problem is, when a film opens on that many screens, if its initial audience is small, the theater chains pull it as soon as they can and replace it with True Independence Godzilla Harbor's Angels as soon as possible. Then, even though it was showing in PodunkVille for a week, it is GONE, and if you didn't get off your ass that one week, you missed it. And you didn't know before hand that it would be better/different from True Independence Godzilla Harbor's Angels, so you missed it. Time to wait for the video.
In a slow rollout, however, the studio invests less money, because they need to market the film in fewer areas and make fewer prints. This means that the film can be a financial success with a smaller absolute gross. When a film is showing on half the screens in an area, each venue does twice as much business. This keeps the film around a while longer, and those prints that were made for the initial limited release start being moved around the country to various places as the "big town" audiences fade. NOW, when it comes to PodunkVille, everyone who might be interested has heard of it, and it can probably stay a few weeks, and more people overall can see it.
It doesn't always happen this way, but there have been many films that have achieved modest success using this strategy. I have had the opportunity to see films in a small city (Rochester, NY) that I would have missed had they recieved "large" releases.
--
gnfnrf
Re:Again, what this is about.. (Score:1)
Stop Picking On Me! (Score:4, Posted by Jon Katz)
Re:Culture as a mirror (Score:2)
Easy. (Good) entertainment is food for the brain. That's the same reason why Olympic athletes eat so much.
Re: "Der Verdacht" (Score:1)
Re:FP and channel 1 (OT, sort of) (Score:2)
Hmmm... I think not. (Score:1)
Would have been good if not for the ending ... (Score:2)
A friend and I went to see this the other night simply because we were looking for something to occupy our time. The Pledge was our only choice at 11pm at the local cinema and I was hesitant as the previews leaned towards a "retired-cop-takes-one-last-case" standpoint. Don't get me wrong, I love Nicholson but his more recent movies haven't been as good as his earlier ones.
I was pleasantly surprised, then, as the movie meandered its way through the retired cop's madness. The last five minutes, however, *completely* ruined the whole experience for me. I can't say what I was expecting in the way of an ending, but they couldn't have ended this movie worse even if they had chosen the "Wow, it was all a dream! Fancy that." route. I can think of any number of ways the writer might have chosen to end his story, but the actual ending was akin to someone taking a steaming shit on a wonderfully and woefully prepared meal. As a result, my friend and I came out of the theatre feeling cheated and angry. We weren't expecting a happy ending, a predictable ending or even a depressing ending - we would have been happy with any well-crafted ending but not one that seemed like an after-thought.
ian.
Re:Friedrich Duerrenmatt's "Der Verdacht" (Score:1)
Dürrenmatt has written three so called "crime novels" in the fifties: Das Versprechen (The Pledge, The Promise), der Verdacht (The Suspicion), der Richter und sein Henker (the Judge and his Executioner/Hangman, film with Jon Voight by Maximilian Schell). All three books are relatively easy to read, certainly when compared later works as "The Assignment". All three were recently re-issued in english, "The Pledge" now comes with Nicholson on the cover.
The b/w movie from the fifties "Es geschah am Hellichten Tag" has IMHO the big drawback of Rühmann as the main character. Rühmann was IMHO never an actor, he always played himself, and it shows.
Similarly, I don't think Jack Nicholson can ever escape his "mentally deranged" typecast, I'm still always reminded of Cuckoo's Nest/Shining when he starts smiling his evil grin. I think the real genius was Polanski -- in Chinatown, Nicholson had to wear this white bandage on his nose, so for most of the movie you didn't have to look at his all-too-familiar face and think "when is he going to turn crazy"? But I've yet to see The Pledge.
The "Es geschah am hellichten Tag" film only touches on the taboo of sexual abuse, and the perception of that issue was totally different in the Switzerland of the fifties and the U.S. of today. Dürrenmatt wrote the script first (and later transformed it into a novel), the original intent of the film was actually to warn innocent children from the bogeyman. This was the fifties, hey.
The film today has IMHO documentary character only, for it shows a non-Heidi-cheese-banks-chocolate view of Switzerland in the late fifties. Well at least for us swiss it has documentary character. You get to see what gas stations in rural areas looked like...
Chinatown (Score:1)
Simple solution Jon.. (Score:1)
If you see an @ in a link [kuro5hit.com]...
Don't click!!
--
Re:Answered this before, but..no Kremlim purity (Score:1)
Here is a smattering of statistics taken at random by pressing those cute little topic images at the top of today's
Let's count the number of articles from the beginning of the year for each topic:
Films: 13 (of which 11 are somehow related to
Justice: 2
PDA: 5
Gnome: 5
Games: 25
So films rank second after games and far ahead of any other topic (do I hear "escape, escape, escape from reality!"?)
I also agree with our european counterpart's observation that too much attention is given to Hollywood productions. There is a whole other world out there.
Re:Public funding... (Score:1)
There is also the fact that if the government were to fund moviemaking, producers would have to allow for X amount of time and $US battling in court over what Congress considered appropriate subjects for publicly funded art. Hmmm, sounds familiar.
Re:You're in good company.. (Score:1)
Once again proving that "any publicity is good publicity"... and his detractors even spelled his name right ;)
Heartbreaking, sophisticated (Score:4)
Aesthetically, it's very compelling -- highly nuanced performances by Jack Nicholson and Robin Wright Penn being its strongest points.
The tension is managed perfectly. I found it, at times, nearly unbearable.
In terms of the script, which, as you might expect from a film directed by Penn, is literate beyond reproach, I think it's worth noting that this novel adaptation is strikingly different from much recent Hollywood fare not only because it's terribly dark. It's also a portrait of psychological repression -- a theme that informed much of the best mid-century American and British cinema (think Hitchcock, Kazan, Preminger, et. al) as well as film noir, but which became passé the further Hollywood in the 70s and 80s moved from examining character and instead toward embracing sensation (for which you can thank Messrs. Spielberg, Lucas, etc.). This would be of limited interest were not the entire story dependent upon what Nicholson's character hiding the truth from himself...
There is another enormously powerful subject here, too: the effect of police work upon the police. What happens when you see too much evil? With our cinema too much given over to the triumphalism and cartoonish representations of cops in Drug War America, this is a subject begging to be explored.
The final shots of the film may leave you in agony. Beware, casual moviegoers! This isn't the spookhouse make-believe of "Hannibal." Real monsters are much scarier.
Re:Great point, but... (Score:1)
movie I found so surprising was that it wasn't sugar coated in any way..no happy love, life or other outcome..
A happy love, life, or other happy ending is sugar coating?
but I think the Pledge is more unflichingly realistic than many movies I've seen, tho not more than "The Sweet Hereafter."" Talk about bleak..
Bleakness is the standard of "unfliching realism"?
Exactly what sort of nihilistic, depressing, utterly and totally useless worldview is required for these statements?
"the USA of 'Chinatown'"? (Score:1)
What should I, everyday American, do in response to the movie Chinatown? Enlighten me. Complete the sentence, "Because of the things X, Y, and Z which happened in the movie Chinatown, people should do A, B, and C immediately if not sooner."
I mean, what about Chinatown is supposed to be so representative of the US as a whole? People impregnating their own daughters (a huge national issue)? What?
Re:A Metacomment, not Off Topic... (Score:3)
One other interesting thing about this film it that it makes one wonder about the nature of destiny, genius, talent, madness, the self. This film reminds me of the notion that the variety of beliefs and personalities out there may just be simply the result of an inherently chaotic universe. We are very much affected by the circumstances of our lives.
You don't believe me?
What if the killer HADN'T died in that car crash? What if he had actually made it to the little girl, drawn a knife, and attempted to molest/kill her? Maybe all of Nicholson's ex-colleagues would have stopped considering him a madman and would have blessed him for the genius in his passion. His live-in girlfriend may have still resented him for putting her daughter at risk.. but I think she would not have considered Nicholoson a crazy nut.
Do you think that maybe then Nicholson would not have gone mad? Instead he would have perhaps made peace with himself in his old age. Toni Morrison once observed that it is very American to not give credence to the notion that people are often the sums of what the world makes of them. It's the external directly shaping the internal. It happens more than we like to think in our highly individualistic culture. (The reason why it's unamerican to admit this is that it's the scariest thing for you to tell the quintessential American--someone who's had the beautiful American dream of liberty and individuality stuffed down his throat all his life that maybe he isn't as original as he thought he was--that maybe some or a good part of who he is comes from the external world.)
I think that if the killer could have somehow managed to make it to the little girl, everything could have turned out differently. It's funny how fate works.. and how sometimes destiny throws us a bone and sometimes it doesn't. We as a society praise obsession when it yields visible immediate and usually monitary results. Everything else is crazy or nonsense. But ask yourselves -- what is the difference between madness and genius? I tell you that the two are very closely related!
That being said, this movie is not only visually very captivating, but it explores some human themes--some questions about the self--that are not often explored in the mainstream. I am glad to have seen it!
Re:You're in good company.. (Score:2)
on a side note why does everyone^H^H^H^H most people hate you? I could never understand this "get JonKatz" thing everyone has. but then agin you probably don't know as well. I thought and all I could come up with is the E-mail address, I would kill for an @slashdot.org address.
P.S I would like it to be mike@slashdot.org
________
Friedrich Dürrenmatt and Sean Penn (Score:2)
Dürrenmatt is exactly the kind of thing I would never have expected to see on
However, what really blows me away is that Sean Penn would read Dürrenmatt, and that by all accounts he seems to have made a decent art house film of it. Wasn't he the guy who married Madonna and got a reputation for beating people up? I seem to recall him as the butt of jokes back in the 80's as the archtype of the Hollywood ruffian actor with poor impulse control.
I guess this just goes to show that everybody can grow up.
Re:Again, what this is about.. (Score:2)
Far ahead of any other topic? (Score:2)
Re:Off to a bad start (Score:2)
1) Bladerunner. Nuff said.
2) Legend of Sleepy Hollow is nothing like the Washington Irving (?) story, but is still an impressive film.
3) Various Bond films already cited - Connery's films mostly worked, the others mostly didn't.
4) Tim Burton's Batman films are a bit of an advance on the comic strips (the other Batman films are better dropped in a big hole and lost).
5) The Crow was a good film made from a bit of a mess of a comic book - the book would be best described as "concept art" for the film.
Grab.
President Nader (Score:2)