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KDE 4.8 Released

Unknown Lamer posted about 2 years ago | from the never-ending-progress dept.

KDE 165

jrepin writes "The KDE community has released version 4.8 of their Free and open source software bundle. The new version provides many new features, improved stability, and increased performance. Highlights for Plasma Workspaces include window manager optimizations, the redesign of power management, and integration with Activities. The first Qt Quick-based Plasma widgets have entered the default installation of Plasma Desktop, with more to follow in future releases. KDE applications released today include Dolphin file manager with its new display engine, ..., and KDE Telepathy reaching its first beta milestone. New features for Marble virtual globe keep arriving, among these are: Elevation Profile, satellite tracking, and Krunner integration. The KDE Platform provides the foundation for KDE software. KDE software is more stable than ever before. In addition to stability improvements and bugfixes, Platform 4.8 provides better tools for building fluid and touch-friendly user interfaces, integrates with other systems' password saving mechanisms and lays the base for more powerful interaction with other people using the new KDE Telepathy framework."

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LALALALALA (0, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#38819799)



Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#38819887)

Another one who has never tried KDE since 3.x and bases his opinion on old reviews or misconceptions.

Re:LALALALALA (3, Insightful)

ByOhTek (1181381) | about 2 years ago | (#38820091)

Just because someone doesn't like KDE 4.x doesn't mean they haven't tried it.

Mind you, I've tried, IIRC, 4.1, 4.2 or 4.3 and 4.4 or 4.5 and haven't liked it in any of those, over 3.5

Different people have different tastes.

Re:LALALALALA (5, Insightful)

Enderandrew (866215) | about 2 years ago | (#38820357)

Opinions are subjective?

That being said, I think it stands head and shoulder above the competition. It is the most feature-rich desktop on the planet. And if you don't like how something looks or operates, you can customize it to look and operate exactly how you want.

And honestly, given the choices of a Windows 8 (Metro) desktop, Gnome Shell, Unity, Lion, and KDE 4.8 as modern desktops, only Lion and KDE are particularly appealing to me. And sadly Lion seems to be slowly morphing OS X into iOS. I'm beginning to think that perhaps only the KDE devs understand it is about having the right interface for the right hardware.

With KDE the same stack can easily switch between a Netbook interface, a traditional desktop shell, a more modern desktop shell, and a tablet interface. They don't force one interface for every situation.

Re:LALALALALA (1, Interesting)

ByOhTek (1181381) | about 2 years ago | (#38820535)

I'll take Win XP (classic) or KDE 3 over Win 7, which I'll take over any of those.

Someone was posting the other day (or even today?), it seems almost pathological that people seem to need the "latest" and "most modern". Do the extra features actually add much? I don't feel much gain from them.


Enderandrew (866215) | about 2 years ago | (#38821063)

What advantage does XP have over KDE 3?

What advantage does KDE 3 have over 4?

Re:LALALALALA (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#38822249)

To one fellow I know there is one little thing missing from KDE4 that he became very used to in KDE3 that's keeping him from "moving on", as it were, kpager.

A little app that puts a thumbnailed view of each desktop or workspace so that, at a glance, he can see which desktop has what on it. This isn't like the pager in KDE4 that only puts a frame and an application icon to represent the apps that are running and their size and position. kpager actually creates a thumbnail version of each desktop, background, contents of windows, everything.

If there were such a thing in KDE4, I've looked on behalf for him, I could get him to move on from Kubuntu 8.04 to something newer.

Can anyone point out an equivalent to kpager from KDE3.5 for KDE4? It would make life a lot easier dealing with my friend.


Kjella (173770) | about 2 years ago | (#38823083)

Someone was posting the other day (or even today?), it seems almost pathological that people seem to need the "latest" and "most modern". Do the extra features actually add much? I don't feel much gain from them.

Well, there's two significant reasons why I'd pick Win7 over WinXP.

1) SSD alignment, both for performance and lifetime, you can hack it into working on WinXP too but it's not good at it.
2) 64-bit so I can have 16GB of RAM. Now if you say PAE or XP 64-bit, I say try it.

When it comes to UI, I really can't say I care... everything since win2k is good enough for me, yes I've tried Linux and Macs but there's nothing about the ability to organize applications that gets me excited. I can do it with virtual desktops or exposé (too fancy for slashdot) or a plain old win2k style taskbar and alt-tab. It works, if you're annoyed about it you're not spending nearly enough time in the apps themselves.


Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#38820789)

Just because someone doesn't like KDE 4.x doesn't mean they haven't tried it.

Mind you, I've tried, IIRC, 4.1, 4.2 or 4.3 and 4.4 or 4.5 and haven't liked it in any of those, over 3.5

Different people have different tastes.

I think KDE is just the extreme opposite of Gnome 2. Its just as bad, only in a different way.
KDE and Gnome desktops are SHIT. Fortunately applications written using the QT framework haven't jumped the shark.
No stupid ribbons, no wasted spaces, although they should work on using a consistent font.
There is nothing worse than an application that uses in its GUI 20 different fonts.

Death to desktop environments and to shitty GUI designers that think that a desktop pc is a tablet or worse a smartphone..


Jorl17 (1716772) | about 2 years ago | (#38820937)

Agreed. That's why I roll my own desktop environments built from what I like. I tend to chose more gnome-like things, though I much, much, prefer to code GUIs with Qt.


Airline_Sickness_Bag (111686) | about 2 years ago | (#38821081)

Upgraded my machine from a dual core to a faster quad core processor, quadrupled the memory, and went from CentOS 4 to Mint 12 w/ KDE 4.x. KDE 3.5 felt faster.


Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#38821281)

Unless you talk to the Gnome and Ubuntu guys. Their way is the one true way, that why the actual functionality of the GUI keeps going down.


dotancohen (1015143) | about 2 years ago | (#38821553)

Just because someone doesn't like KDE 4.x doesn't mean they haven't tried it.

Mind you, I've tried, IIRC, 4.1, 4.2 or 4.3 and 4.4 or 4.5 and haven't liked it in any of those, over 3.5

Different people have different tastes.

If it is a matter of taste, then I agree that KDE 4, nor any other desktop, will satisfy everyone. If things are broken or unintuitive for you, though, I would really like to know so that the issue could be addressed. You can reply here or email me, my Gmail username is the same as my /. username. Thanks.

LOL (1)

G3ckoG33k (647276) | about 2 years ago | (#38821939)

"Mind you, I've tried, IIRC, 4.1, 4.2 or 4.3 and 4.4 or 4.5 and haven't liked it in any of those, over 3.5"

Mind you, I've tried, IIRC, Gnome 1.x and haven't liked it in any of those, over 1.0x

so, what or where does this matter? KDE is better, but not the main target funding for RedHat or Ubuntu. That is it.

Re:LALALALALA (5, Informative)

justforgetme (1814588) | about 2 years ago | (#38819939)

No, it doesn't. It actually rocks. I really have become bored of all that desktop environment hate going on
in semi knowledgeable circles (cough... /. cough....) . KDE has always been a powerhouse of a desktop
environment and a feature complete one at that. It definitely can become option heavy but this is exactly
what a user that needs a productive environment wants.

The only thing that I don't like about KDE is that whenever I touch an "out of the box" implementation of it
I feel like using an overpolished windows NT machine. But that is only the KDE aesthetics not being my
kind of soup. Software wise it still is a top notch environment.


ByOhTek (1181381) | about 2 years ago | (#38820133)

Really? I've tried 4.1, 4.2 or 4.3 and either 4.4 or 4.5... Can't remember which in the latter two categories. Never got the feeling of Windows NT at all. I got that feeling from KDE 3.5...

From the perspective of someone who likes it, could you tell me what changes you've notted since 4.4?


ifiwereasculptor (1870574) | about 2 years ago | (#38821173)

I'm someone who likes it and I can tell you what changed. Stuff works properly now. That's a pretty good summary. For example, 4.4 still had Dolphin launching four instances of your media player if you launched four video files, instead of simply queueing them for play in a single window. That sorf of jerky behaviour is now gone and bugs are quite rare.


pinkeen (1804300) | about 2 years ago | (#38821697)

I always thought that is something that the media player should take care of (like smplayer, you can even turn this off) not the DE.


Osgeld (1900440) | about 2 years ago | (#38820299)

I have always felt that the pre 4 versions were just windows NT that for some reason just sucked up a bunch of horsepower for unneeded fluff, the kde 4 series is much departed from that, but now I cant stand using it ... dont worry I cant stand gnome 3 either.

maybe I am stuck in the 90's as some people claim (which is odd cause KDE's setup remind's me so much of the windows 3x program manager) but I just rather not mess around with the whole new flashy toy like DE's , just give me something that has a menu, a taskbar or 2, some buttons, and stays the fuck out of my way.


Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#38820801)

The great thing about KDE is that, if you're willing to mess with it for an evening, you can get it doing that (or anything else you want it to). This has been true since the earliest releases, and is still true today.


justforgetme (1814588) | about 2 years ago | (#38823025)

and stays the fuck out of my way

that's why I like the xmonad window manager. Sure you have to master haskell and unix in order to make it work for you but on top of a gnome environment or a good self roll it's just plain awesome! (pun not intended)

Re:LALALALALA (3, Interesting)

danomac (1032160) | about 2 years ago | (#38820339)

For me, I initially hated 4.x. However, I did grow to like some things about it.

I actually had to use 3.x last week on one of my old machines I'd forgotten to update, and everything just felt so damn backwards.

Re:LALALALALA (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#38820367)

Agreed. I've tried Gnome but have stuck with KDE for the last 10 years because it comes with everything I need. No need to hunting for DVD burning software, a music player or anything else that Gnome doesn't bother shipping with.


Jorl17 (1716772) | about 2 years ago | (#38820997)

I'll have to disagree, but it's obviously a matter of taste. I hate the excessive amount of point-and-click in KDE: I think it's "fat", slow (tried many distros and even different *nixes) and confusing. I don't like Gnome either and just use openbox+fbpanel+pcmanfm+nm-applet+gedit+QtCreator+gnome-term+ario+smplayer+chromium+libreoffice+my own apps.

OTOH, I'm known to be picky. However, I'd take Gnome anytime instead of KDE: I might add that my first Linux experience was with KDE 3 and, well, let's say I was very glad once I saw the likes of gnome at that time.


Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#38821847)

fail. in fact you don't need to point and klick anything in kde, there is one krunner to rule them all.

now you're not only known to be picky, you are also known to be wrong.


Jorl17 (1716772) | about 2 years ago | (#38822037)

Sure. It's not a marketing fail of them not to publicize it. No, it's always the end-user's fault, isn't it? Oh, right, you're being a bitch.


Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#38822413)

looking at various posts here it's evident that several end users know about it (look for people mentioning alt-f2, although that's supposedly not needed anymore), and it was advertised - but it seems people need pictograms these days. Is that a failing on kde's part as well?


justforgetme (1814588) | about 2 years ago | (#38823135)

openbox+fbpanel+pcmanfm+nm-applet+gedit+QtCreator+gnome-term+ario+smplayer+chromium+libreoffice+my own apps

When you are done with my refrigerator, would you mind giving it back please? :-P

Anyway, I think that; if you are able to roll your own it's definitely preferable. But my initial post was just to contradict the AC who trolled at the prime spot. In general I prefer gnome as a base for my systems, mostly I think because I have become good at bending it my way. Still I have to acknowledge that KDE does offer a complete desktop env that in the right hands can surpass a gnome based workstation os.

Still, just my opinion.


Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#38821107)

The only thing I don't like about KDE is the cashew. Why can't you remove the cashew?

Can you remove the cashew in 4.8?


Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#38822453)



TitusC3v5 (608284) | about 2 years ago | (#38821621)

The hate isn't completely unfounded. I really enjoy the look of 4.x, but every single version I've tried (4.1-4.7) has had stability problems. On three different machines, all of which have didn't have nearly as many issues with KDE 3.x, Gnome 2.x/3.x, XFCE, etc.

I'll gladly make it my preferred DE once it's safe to use on a primary machine, but until then, I'll stick with the feature-lacking Gnome 3.x.

Sadly... (2)

Pausanias (681077) | about 2 years ago | (#38821911)

I want something with the power and configurability of KDE but the non-crazy, makes me feel claustrophobic window layout of GNOME.... Sadly after many years as a Linux users I find that that environment is called Windows 7 + VMWare.

/. Trollbait (0, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#38819863)

GNOME 3 and Unity are the BEST!!

KDE sucks (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#38819867)

If I don't get first post it's because KDE sucks

Re:KDE sucks (1)

hedwards (940851) | about 2 years ago | (#38819903)

No, it's because you posted it a matter of like 6 minutes after the first poster did. Unless the competition includes a time travel application, I think it's safe to say you wouldn't have ended up with first post on those either.

Re:KDE sucks (1)

stms (1132653) | about 2 years ago | (#38819983)

Gnome 2 had time travel but they removed it because the UI was too clunky.

Re:KDE sucks (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#38820177)

OSX still has it, it's called timemachine....

Re:KDE sucks (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#38820443)

Gnome 2 had time travel but they removed it because the UI was too clunky.

You mean Gnome developers left a single option exposed? Oh no!

Fixed akonadi? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#38819921)

Topic says it all. This has been one of the worst pieces of *expletive* that has made it into KDE and crippled kmail

So how's the Windows version coming along? (3, Interesting)

hairyfeet (841228) | about 2 years ago | (#38819949)

Last time i tried it it piled on the dependencies and I couldn't uninstall it without restoring from disk image but if its gotten better i wouldn't mind giving it a go. i have a ton of off lease XP machines piling up and can't stand the XP Fisher price UI and I give the KDE guys credit for having a nice UI, so how's it coming along? Great, good, lousy? How easy is it to install and uninstall? How easy is it to switch back and forth?

Re:So how's the Windows version coming along? (1, Flamebait)

ByOhTek (1181381) | about 2 years ago | (#38820157)

Last I heard, KDE didn't replace the XP UI, just gave it a bunch of KDE apps.

And if you don't like the Fisher Price UI of XP, do what I do, switch to the classic UI. It once again looks professional (if boring), rather than like a kids toy.

Re:So how's the Windows version coming along? (2)

udoschuermann (158146) | about 2 years ago | (#38820555)

Fisher Price UI of XP

I always called it the Toys-R-Us UI, but it comes down to the same thing. I am not alone! :)

(I think I like Fisher Price UI better, actually).

Re:So how's the Windows version coming along? (3, Interesting)

hairyfeet (841228) | about 2 years ago | (#38822869)

Yeah if its one i'm actually gonna keep i get Aston [astonshell.com] and put on it, its what I run on my XP nettop and is quite nice. of course i'm not gonna blow $30 a pop on some off lease boxes i'm selling but hate dealing with that Fisher price UI (And nooooo, switching to the fugly as fuck Win98 UI isn't an improvement, thanks ever so) so it looks like I'll be hacking MSStyles.dll and putting on a nicer theme. And no you're not alone, many of use can't fricking stand the Fisher price UI, I like the Win 7 UI, Vista Black was okay (too bad the OS attached to it blew chunks) and KDE had a nice silvery look, but that blue is just fucking horrible to look at for any length of time. Whomever picked that shit out must have been color blind!

Watch me get hate for saying this next part, but fuck if I care, i just wish the Linux community would get all on the same page, quit all this damned rivalry and 50 bazillion distro crap, and actually make an OS usable by the masses, is to too much to ask? I need a rock solid OS that is as easy to use as Win 7 or OSX and gives a minumum 7 years support without dealing with that apt-dist-upgrade clusterfuck as I've yet to see a machine actually upgrade without having drivers broken. I know you will never get a stable ABI as long as Torvalds has a pulse but can't you either make a REAL LTS or find a way not to shit all over the drivers during an upgrade? Hell there isn't even a 'find drivers" or "rollback drivers" button and Windows has had that for a decade!

Look, this is your chance geeks, for the first time in history all the stars are aligning, the XP dieoff is filling shops like mine with insanely overpowered laptops and desktops, Ballmer is gonna shoot MSFT in the head trying to turn Windows into WinTab, most people only care about online stuff now, you've never had a better shot, all you have to do is accept the fact the world isn't a bunch of damned programmers and get rid of the fiddly bullshit and CLI wanking off, that's all. you wanna keep the wank fest in server fine, all well and good, but you ain't never gonna sell that Bash crap to the masses. you gotta "think different' to steal a line, think iOS and Win 7, call it dumbing down if you like, just give us something simple, easy to use, and supported 7 years. Make it so my grandma could run it with ZERO help from me,lots of big icons and pretty pictures and wizards. Hell my 71 year old clueless dad installed his own Win 7 and everything ran OOTB with ZERO input from me, that is what you need to shoot for, an OS that even the clueless can run.

You've got most of the basic parts already, KDE is VERY pretty and consistent, you've got most of the guts and drivers written, you just need to put it in a friendly package and stop updates/upgrades from tearing the thing apart, that's all. you have until Apr 2014 but the sooner the better as all us shops are scrambling for Win 7 Start CALs simply because we can't find a Linux that fits the bill. give it to us and you'll have a support network that makes the Apple stores look like a bad joke. We WANT you to succeed, we really do. But with the mess you have now literally we'd go broke trying to support you. you could use the XP dieoff to take a HUGE bite out of MSFT's ass, you just gotta want it and be willing to change, are you?

Re:So how's the Windows version coming along? (1)

MrHanky (141717) | about 2 years ago | (#38820165)

You won't get the KDE desktop UI on Windows XP. KDE for Windows is just the software collection, and since Qt uses Windows widgets on Windows, you'll get KDE applications that look like Windows applications, just not very well tested.

Re:So how's the Windows version coming along? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#38820179)

I've installed 4.7.4 in Windows 7, primarily to use kmail and akregator. From my limited usage, I haven't had any issues with them. In fact, it seems more stable than what Kubuntu shipped on their last initial release. (Kubuntu has always seemed to work better after updating from their updates repo.) Amarok, on the other hand, has been a bit hit and miss.

As far as I can tell, everything is installed in whatever kde folder you designate to install into, and you just have to delete that folder to remove the applications (and may have to remove your kde settings directory, too, if you want to clean up everything). If someone else has found that to not be the case, I'd appreciate the enlightenment.

Re:So how's the Windows version coming along? (1)

Osgeld (1900440) | about 2 years ago | (#38820323)

gees, its only been a fucking decade and you still bitching and whining about a 3 version ago UI from windows? turn it to classic, its 3 mouse clicks dink.

Re:So how's the Windows version coming along? (1)

AvitarX (172628) | about 2 years ago | (#38821271)

I'm highly concerned about "Nonrectangular Item Boundaries".

1) I want the whole space an item take up to be the item
2) I've had issues in the past (I think IE in Win95) where I would click the non-icon center of the "e", and not launch.

Actually, all of the dolphin changes look unpleasant.

Re:So how's the Windows version coming along? (1)

archen (447353) | about 2 years ago | (#38821661)

Yeah, non rectangular boundaries doesn't sound like an improvement. It just sounds like it's making things harder to click. You should already have a good indication if something is going to run by the icon highlighting with a mouse hover, so I'm not sure why reducing the click area is a benefit.

I've been ok with the KDE4 changes (not ecstatic but ok with them), but I haven't been happy with dolphin. For some reason I've found it very clunky. I've tried various settings, but nothing seems to work better for me either. Multi column view seemed promising but the implementation is rather bad. If you have a file with a very long name, the column can stretch all the way across your screen and you have to manually scroll back to click on the next directory. Directories aren't highlighted either, so you have no idea what directory a column is actually shown. (that seems very basic mistake that hasn't been corrected).

Considering all the different implementations and ideas floating around in file managers, I'm surprised that dolphin hasn't implemented some of the better ones... well, better.

Re:So how's the Windows version coming along? (1)

AvitarX (172628) | about 2 years ago | (#38822461)

I actually like it a good deal, it feels pretty fast to me too.

Small clickable area I don't like though, and am I crazy to want three lines of text for names, center truncated (like OSX)? I don't want extra long filenames going crazy, and I don't want things in variable sized layouts. There is a need for some whitespace to click the background (to unselect all, or copy to a folder rather than opening a file or copying to a subfolder), but not so much as they show. I am curious too, does this mean the +/- select/unselect are going to be all over the place too, but I need to try it before I assume that I suppose.

Re:So how's the Windows version coming along? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#38821307)

No one's giving you the right answer. I'm looking at KDEPIM on my Windows box and it's got the Oxygen widgets, it has had them for the last two 4.X releases, but I think I might have had to enable it manually in the KDE System Settings (it's in the Control Panel). It looks and works stellar other than the long start up time for each application.

New in konsole (5, Informative)

vlm (69642) | about 2 years ago | (#38819957)

I'm guessing konsole will get a lot more use with this crowd, that, say, Marble. I'm not sure this feature list is worth the effort of upgrading, but here it is:

http://konsole.kde.org/changelog.php [kde.org]


        Before any window is opened, make sure pty device has right size before starting the terminal process.
        Allow an image to be set as the background in the terminal window.
        Close session reliably when the session process doesn't die with SIGHUP.
        Don't show the default profile in menu New Tab list when no others are listed.
        Add "Select All" action for selecting the whole history of this session.
        Add popup menu for drag-n-drop operations using KonqOperations::doDrop.
        Bidirectional text support is on by default.
        Left-To-Right direction will always be used in the terminal area even when the language is Right-To-Left.
        Add support for Unicode decomposed characters and in general better unicode displaying.

Re:New in konsole (1)

dargaud (518470) | about 2 years ago | (#38820263)

Allow an image to be set as the background in the terminal window.

Seriously, who _wants_ this shit ? Black is not good enough for you now ?

Re:New in konsole (4, Informative)

danomac (1032160) | about 2 years ago | (#38820383)

Hey, I actually like that idea. I can have ssh sessions open for up to five different machines... I'd definitely find it useful to attach different backgrounds to each one so I immediately know which machine I'm currently using. It would prevent me from entering commands in the wrong session, which I've done multiple times before with somewhat disastrous results...

Re:New in konsole (1)

dargaud (518470) | about 2 years ago | (#38820623)

I already hate the fact that aliasing is forced on us in all major OSes nowadays and really miss the sharp chars of WinXP, so I don't want readability to suffer even more. But I understand what you mean. I prefer to use a nice PS1 in .bashrc such as (warning, I doubt it's gonna pass easily through the bowels of /.): PS1='${debian_chroot:+($debian_chroot)}\[\033[01;32m\]\u@\h\[\033[00m\]:\[\033[01;34m\]\w\[\033[00m\]

Re:New in konsole (1)

ilikenwf (1139495) | about 2 years ago | (#38820983)

+1 On the AA fonts thing...any time I setup a new install of Archlinux or Debian I spend 2 hours making the fonts nice and crisp...

Re:New in konsole (1)

bjwest (14070) | about 2 years ago | (#38820685)

Having the hostname in the prompt doesn't give you a hint as to which machine your currently using?

Re:New in konsole (1)

The Moof (859402) | about 2 years ago | (#38820753)

You might want to try a better approach, like setting your terminal's prompt variable to something useful. That way, you can see who is logged in where right on your command line. Arbitrarily setting a background image after connecting seems like it won't solve the issue of typing the wrong commands in. Whose to say you don't change server2 to a different image on a whim, and just type in the wrong command again mistaking it for server1? It'd be easier to glance to the left on me current line and see something like:

[joe@server2 /etc]$

That tells me who I'm logged on as, what server I'm on, where I'm at, and whether or not I have root privileges.

Re:New in konsole (2)

Stachybotris (936861) | about 2 years ago | (#38820425)

Hmmm... I like not showing the 'default' tab when there is only one session type. It always whigged me out that it wanted me to select the only option that I have configured.

Re:New in konsole (1)

Jorl17 (1716772) | about 2 years ago | (#38821041)

I still prefer gnome-terminal. But I need to find a really good, fast, configurable, screen-like term.
Or just type screen.

fedora rawhide (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#38819959)

is this available on fedora rawhide yet, if not, how does one make it so? thanks

Pause after click fixed? (1)

danbuter (2019760) | about 2 years ago | (#38820181)

I loved KDE3. I have been less than impressed with KDE4. Even though it looks nice, there was always a one or two second pause after I clicked anything on the desktop before the program would open. This got really irritating. Is it fixed? If so, I'd be much more likely to use KDE4.

Re:Pause after click fixed? (5, Informative)

mx+b (2078162) | about 2 years ago | (#38820271)

Probably. I am running KDE 4.7 (actually just updated to 4.8 today, so haven't much experience with the updates yet), and it goes swimmingly on my old dell laptop (about 7 years old, maxxed out the RAM at 1 GB). No real hang ups or delays. Runs just fine. I think a lot of the hangups were the older versions of Nepomuk/Akonadi and friends, but the last few releases have really dramatically improved performance and integration, to the point where you don't even notice they exist (as far as resource usage; I'm growing to appreciate the semantic tags on files more and more as time goes on).

kmail ? (1, Interesting)

dargaud (518470) | about 2 years ago | (#38820241)

I hope they fixed the absolute disaster that is kmail2. Which was a forced upgrade in the last kubuntu. Never seen such a complete disaster in software, and I've tried to upgrade several systems taking all appropriate measures.

Re:kmail ? (1)

Dorkmaster Flek (1013045) | about 2 years ago | (#38820363)

I don't care if they have. I've already switched to Thunderbird. The migration to the Akonadi backend in kmail2 was a complete disaster. The upgrade migration tool for your existing mailbox didn't work at all. I didn't care about losing it, so I started fresh. I still couldn't get the damn thing to stop spitting up errors when trying to apply my filters, even after recreating my entire folder structure from scratch and updating all my filters. Half the time it spat out errors when checking the mail too. Fuck kmail2.

Re:kmail ? (1)

dargaud (518470) | about 2 years ago | (#38820661)

Same here, but there's no way to export the email store from kmail and I could find no email software that could import a kmail email store, so I'm stuck. I migrated to thunderbird on my work PC as well, foregoing my entire store. But on my personal system, I'll be damn if I let go of my emails that date from 1986 and went through decades of Pine, Outlook Express and kmail. Fuck kmail2.

Re:kmail ? (2)

i.r.id10t (595143) | about 2 years ago | (#38820703)

IIRC they are "just" mbox files. Set up thunderbird, let it create a simple mbox file for like 1 throw-away message, exit thunderbird, copy over your mbox files.

Re:kmail ? (1)

dlenmn (145080) | about 2 years ago | (#38821105)

Google around. There are some scripts out there that do the job (and some that don't, so back up your email first). I successfully migrated from Kmail to Thunderbird with them.

Telepathy (1)

MonsterTrimble (1205334) | about 2 years ago | (#38820567)

and KDE Telepathy reaching its first beta milestone.

Is it an adequate replacement for Pidgin & Kopete yet? And do I have the ability to have it minimize to the systray? Kopete was by far my favorite client but once the improvements and bugfixes stopped I had to jump ship to the (IMHO) inferior Pidgin. The lack of facebook chat did it for me. And since it's taken like 4 years to get to beta with this, I question whether re-inventing the wheel was a good idea.

Re:Telepathy (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#38820667)

actually telepahty is not a case of reinventing any wheels, it's an implementation of erm, empathy? epifany? well never mind, some gnome-chat-technology anyway.

Re:Telepathy (1)

denvergeek (1184943) | about 2 years ago | (#38820767)

Kopete and Facebook work fine for me. Google "kopete facebook", and check the first result. Facebook exposes chat via XMPP, which Kopete supports.

Re:Telepathy (1)

Dragonslicer (991472) | about 2 years ago | (#38821017)

As far as I know, Kopete can't currently send messages through XMPP for Facebook. I remember reading somewhere that Facebook changed something about how it does the XMPP connection, and I don't think Kopete hasn't fixed that yet.

Re:Telepathy (1)

MonsterTrimble (1205334) | about 2 years ago | (#38822865)

I know it can now, but back then (late 2008, early 2009 as I recall) it didn't. At that point Facebook was using it's own homebrew chat backend. it took until 2010 for them to actually implement XMPP.

As Dragonslicer eluded to, there are a *LOT* of bugs still in the program as it stands now, and with it taking however long to get a *BETA* version out, I wonder why bother?

And the Regressions? (5, Interesting)

TheNinjaroach (878876) | about 2 years ago | (#38820657)

I love KDE and have used it exclusively since the 3.2 days, but damn am I getting tired of the regressions. Things that used to work beautifully are suddenly bugged beyond use. I expect that to happen with early revisions of major releases, but the trend that started in 4.1 continues through a clean install of 4.7.2 that shipped with my distro.

In any case, thanks for the best desktop environment I've ever used. KIOSlaves (if they are still called that) are awesome, and we should all be thankful for KHTML, which laid the foundation for Webkit-based browsers everywhere.

Is it any better? (1)

antdude (79039) | about 2 years ago | (#38820957)

I used KDE v4.4.3 in stable Debian and didn't like it. I loved v3.x and v2.x, but v4 was bleh for me. I know about Trinity fork, but I am waiting for it to be mature, popular/official, and have a lot of support.

Re:Is it any better? (1)

SomeKDEUser (1243392) | about 2 years ago | (#38821445)

It'll happen at the same time the magical pink unicorn farm gets discovered on Mars...

Re:Is it any better? (1)

antdude (79039) | about 2 years ago | (#38821529)

Basically, never. :)

Re:Is it any better? (1)

SomeKDEUser (1243392) | about 2 years ago | (#38821605)

Yup... But you have to be fair: there are two years between 4.4 and 4.8. And the progress has been very fast. It is to me a bit of a mystery why Debian stable does not upgrade the GUIs faster. The base components, the server bits, sure. But there is no valid reason to no update KDE and GNOME to their latest releases.

      On the contrary: bugs in interfaces are in many cases not logic bugs, but unexpected behaviour, or inconsistency. And keeping the old version won't help.

Re:Is it any better? (2)

antdude (79039) | about 2 years ago | (#38821713)

It's not the bugs. It's the usability, design, etc. in v4.3. Did KDE v4.8 get much better in those areas?

Re:Is it any better? (1)

SomeKDEUser (1243392) | about 2 years ago | (#38821787)

I use it every day, because I think it works great and looks good. Objectively, it is faster, snappier and more stable. It also got features at each release.

Subjectively, I think the looks were always good, but that they improved with time. But that is, of course, subjective. There are not many styles I can say I have kept for a long time before I felt the need to change -- oxygen is the exception: it is clean, clear and, to me, beautiful.

But Your question is too vague to be answered meaningfully. What bugged you? Why? Could it not be changed? Did you report a bug (in a non-insulting, non-inflamatory way)?

Re:Is it any better? (1)

antdude (79039) | about 2 years ago | (#38821909)

I did not like the design, usability, etc. I preferred v3.5.10's. For now, I am using old Gnome v2.3.

Re:Is it any better? (1)

SomeKDEUser (1243392) | about 2 years ago | (#38822003)

Which is completely meaningless. you cannot "not like the design". It can be too distracting, the icons not recognisable enough, the contrast can be too high or too low. You can dislike gradients, find the colours depressing or garish. but you cannot "not like the design".

"Usability" does not exist. There is only a collection of actions required to perform given tasks, which you could not easily find, or which you found too time consuming, or which gave you RSI.

I will guess that you are one of those guys who are somewhat sorry that DEs exist at all, but know that for sure, they should never have left their mid-nineties shape. I have bad news for you: these will disappear, and KDE4 is the only one which in the future will still do what you expect -- provided you configure it so.

Re:Is it any better? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#38822269)

Yup... But you have to be fair: there are two years between 4.4 and 4.8. And the progress has been very fast. It is to me a bit of a mystery why Debian stable does not upgrade the GUIs faster. The base components, the server bits, sure. But there is no valid reason to no update KDE and GNOME to their latest releases.

      On the contrary: bugs in interfaces are in many cases not logic bugs, but unexpected behaviour, or inconsistency. And keeping the old version won't help.

Are you kidding ? Updating KDE on a stable release would wreak havoc for users.
Debian stable is STABLE for a reason. Damn the last thing I want is to see is DE being updated just because its the latest shiniest release. And lets not forget that with KDE new release may fix old bugs but they sure as hell introduce many many new bugs. So thanks but no thanks. People that want software continuosly updated should use a rolling release distro. Especially when we're talking software that extends its tendrils down to the core system.

Fix some damn bugs already. (1)

bjwest (14070) | about 2 years ago | (#38821039)

All these new features are great (when they work), but they need to keep new feature additions to new versions. Minor version updates are supposed to be to fix bugs and improve performance, not add new features complete with new bugs. There are a ton of old bugs, quite a few of which are major issues, that they need to work on before adding in more to the mix.

The KDE developers are as bad as the Ubuntu dev team. They add in a new feature, then move on to the next new feature completely ignoring the cries for help from their users about the bugs they just introduced.

I'm already looking for a distro change, possibly Mint, or even going back to plain old Debian. I'm beginning to think I may need a DE change as well.

Re:Fix some damn bugs already. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#38822737)

I think you hit the nail on the head. Adding new features is cool.
Going through list of bugs is not fun. So, let's rewrite everything and hope for the best.

Question for other KDE users (1)

toadlife (301863) | about 2 years ago | (#38821353)

I've always loved and used KDE (even the early 4.x versions were better than gnome IMO), but one thing about it annoys me. In Windows 7, if I have one window partially overlapping another window, if I click a file from the background windows, the focus will not be shifted to the background window until I release the mouse button. This allows me to click and drag a file from the background window to the foreground window without the background window becoming the foreground window. In KDE, the second you click on the background windows it becomes the foreground window. This feature in Windows 7 (and XP?) is incredibly useful and I never noticed how usefull until I started using KDE again recently. Does anyone know if KDE can be configured to emulate this behavior?

Re:Question for other KDE users (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#38821805)

I don't think KDE has exactly what you specify, but it has some other options in this area. You can play with settings like "focus follows mouse". I'm on a windows system right now, so I can't give you exact instructions, but it's worth checking out. My favorite is to set it up so that the window under the cursor is always in focus, but NEVER comes to the foreground unless explicitly told to (say, by clicking titlebar or alt-tabbing). This setup certainly solves your drag-and-drop problem, but it takes some getting used to. It's hard to tell which settings you'll like better without giving them each a lengthy trial.

Re:Question for other KDE users (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#38823397)

My KDE works that way. Also, middle click on the background window will activate it but will not put in on top.

This is configurable in System preferences -> Window behaviour -> Window behaviour. Play with the options and see what suits you best. I think your options would be in the Window Actions tab.

finally (1)

komrix (2452390) | about 2 years ago | (#38821523)

I really like that KDE keeps updating...I personally think it has a better flow than GNOME and is much less clunky than Unity. The last update was a bit glitchy but still I really like the way that it looks. I have been using it on BT5 for about 6months now and I much prefer it to the GNOME counterpart.

Application Geometry settings (0)

kmahan (80459) | about 2 years ago | (#38822183)

Great -- another KDE release where they provide all sorts of new stuff but they still won't (can't?) fix bugs. I'm guessing all the developers that understand how the core of KDE works have left.

Is it too much to ask that the ability to specify a geometry (and placement) when starting an app be fixed so that it works? Not on shiny new apps but some of the core apps -- like konsole. This has been being reported since 4.0 was rolled out.

Re:Application Geometry settings (2)

lbbros (900904) | about 2 years ago | (#38822329)

System Settings > Window Behavior > Window specific overrides.

That's exactly what you're looking for, and oh, it's been there for several releases.

Re:Application Geometry settings (1)

kmahan (80459) | about 2 years ago | (#38822409)

% konsole 200x200+40+50

This doesn't work. How does one do this (so a simple script can pop up several windows in fixed locations with fixed sizes)

Dump akonadi (4, Interesting)

blackpaw (240313) | about 2 years ago | (#38822499)

Its a fucking disaster. I used to blame kmail2 but came to realise its a decent frontend, its the back end that drags it down.

4.8 RC2 Gmail imap account, working fine for weeks. Nothing changed, then I get that perpetual rotating wait icon, followed by the
"Unable to fetch job" error when trying to access sub folders. Reboots don't make any difference.

I know the deal - the only reliable way to fix it is to delete the virtuoso/nepomuk databases and all kmail configs and recreate the account from scratch, but you know what? I just can't be bothered any more. Tired out and fed up. I've been a good boy, I given up hoping for a search that works, I don't attempt to integrate with google calendar or contacts any more, I don't expect address expansion to work reliably. Theres bug entries ate bugs.kde.org related to this months old with no dev attention, not even to confirm or reject then.

Its just easier to use my webmail or Thunderbird. At least it always works, even if its not as integrated with the kde desktop.

So one less reason to use KDE at all.

Razor-qt (1)

MonsterTrimble (1205334) | about 2 years ago | (#38822919)

I keep thinking that Razor might be the best thing to happen to KDE in a LONG time. I keep thinking a Razor-based distro might be good for what ails me.

Re:Razor-qt (1)

blackpaw (240313) | about 2 years ago | (#38822991)

I'm going to have to check it out, I like qt, both for its looks and its API. KDE has a huge infra structure with it I'd be reluctant to give up but they've bet the farm on nepomuk/akonadi, which are complete clusterfucks, as said in Jurassic Park - "Dennis, our lives are in your hands and you've got butterfingers?"

Re:Dump akonadi (3, Interesting)

qbast (1265706) | about 2 years ago | (#38823199)

And let's not forget about mysql + virtuoso + maildir akonadi resource + kmail2 taking over 1GB of resident memory whenever they feel like it. When KDE 4.7 came out, I switched to Thunderbird. Later when buying a new laptop I noticed that almost all applications I run are multiplatform anyway. So now I run Windows 7 as my main OS. It needs some getting used to after using Linux/KDE for last 10 years.
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