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Windows Phone 8 Detailed, Uses Windows 8 Kernel

Soulskill posted more than 2 years ago | from the starting-from-scratch dept.

Windows 267

MrSeb writes "Thanks to a leaked video — a video that Microsoft made for Nokia — we now have lots of details about Windows Phone 8 (WP8). From deep Windows 8, Skype, and SkyDrive integration, through to the addition of NFC 'wallet' payments and BitLocker encryption, it sounds like Windows Phone 8 will be close to iOS and Android in terms of features. The interesting stuff is under the hood, though: WP8 will have the Windows 8 kernel instead of the Windows CE kernel of its predecessors. Through the Win 8 kernel, WP8 will support native code and multi-core processors. It will also have the same network stack, security, and multimedia support as Windows 8. While Win 8 apps won't be directly compatible with Windows Phone 8, Windows Phone manager Joe Belfiore says developers will be able to 'reuse — by far — most of their code.'"

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267 comments

Scrolling (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38918601)

And it'll still scroll more smoothly than an Android.

Re:Scrolling (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38919783)

Maybe less smooth than CE kernel which is better at (hard) realtime than either Linux or iOS.

Multi-purpose phones. (5, Funny)

SuricouRaven (1897204) | more than 2 years ago | (#38918635)

Now with 'handwarmer' function!

Re:Multi-purpose phones. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38918715)

Also the battery life has caught up with the network speed. Both last about 82ms!

code reuse shares vulnerabilities (0, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38918671)

Great, now anyone who manages to hack a win8 desktop also gets phones for free -- and vice versa. Species that have little diversity are always at risk of extinction.

Re:code reuse shares vulnerabilities (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38918777)

Android uses a Linux kernel.
iOS uses XNU (same as OSX)

You argument is invalid, and therefore you are a moron. Have a good day !

Re:code reuse shares vulnerabilities (4, Insightful)

SJHillman (1966756) | more than 2 years ago | (#38918787)

Does that mean anyone who hacks a Linux desktop gets their Android phone too? If anyone that hacks a FreeBSD box also gets Mac OS X boxes too?

Re:code reuse shares vulnerabilities (3, Informative)

anonymov (1768712) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919457)

At least, for some values of "hacks" and some values of "gets their phone".

Here [github.com] , for example, how to get root on Android using generic Linux kernel vulnerability.

Re:code reuse shares vulnerabilities (4, Insightful)

neokushan (932374) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919003)

Only if the hack involves something deep within the Kernel - which in terms of hacks, is generally pretty rare. Most hacks come from privilege escalation, usually because of some shoddily written plugin (i.e. just about anything Adobe makes). I very much doubt that Microsoft will offer WP8 users the same level of...freedom that Windows users get. Hell, you'll be lucky to even sideload apps.

Xbox too? (4, Interesting)

spire3661 (1038968) | more than 2 years ago | (#38918675)

Im pretty sure anyone with a brain figured this was the general direction they were gonna go when Win 8 was announced. MS wants to unify mobile, living room and desktop. The Xbox 720 will probably be the Win 8 kernel too.

Re:No Comments (0, Troll)

miknix (1047580) | more than 2 years ago | (#38918811)

From TFA:

through to the addition of NFC 'wallet' payments and BitLocker encryption (...) It will also have the same network stack, security, and multimedia support as Windows 8.

emphasis mine

Re:Xbox too? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38918833)

Hopefully Xbox 720 will have better ventilation for cooling!
Microsoft should have recalled all the xbox360's because they were not designed properly.

Re:Xbox too? (2)

neokushan (932374) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919037)

The 360 didn't "overheat", its internal peak temperature was never an issue. The problem was the motherboard warping through the process of heating and cooling. Adding extra cooling wouldn't fix the issue, merely delay it.

Re:Xbox too? (0, Flamebait)

PessimysticRaven (1864010) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919119)

Hopefully Xbox 720 will have better ventilation for cooling!
Microsoft should have recalled all the xbox360's because they were not designed properly.

I have to laugh whenever someone tries to bring up the RROD issues. I've had ONE bulky Jasper XBOX360 for several years, which has gotten near-constant usage, and never once have I had an overheating/RROD issue.

Maybe if people didn't wrap them in blankets and shove them into dust-filled corners of entertainment systems with barely an inch on any side to breathe, they wouldn't have issues?

Re:Xbox too? (1)

mcgrew (92797) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919741)

My daughter works at a GameStop, and she wouldn't touch an Xbox just because of how many of them come back with the same problems.

I think you just got lucky. I had a Chevy Vega that lasted years with no problems, too. Just because my Vega was a good one doesn't mean that 75% of what came from the assembly line wasn't crap.

Re:Xbox too? (3, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38919805)

That's because you weren't paying attention. The number of consoles affected has been estimated at between 23% and 54% [wikipedia.org] . In other news, anecdotes aren't data.

You seem to think that you're somehow smarter than most people. A general rule of thumb is that anyone who believes themselves to be an expert probably isn't; people who are smarter and know more realize how much more there is to know. For a more elegant statement, refer to Socrates [wikiquote.org] . For a more scientific statement, see here. [wikipedia.org]

Re:Xbox too? (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38919043)

It was explicitly stated as the idea when Windows 7 was getting close to sale-able. XNA means you can code once, write 3 interfaces, and release on Xbox, WinPhone 7, and Windows 7. This is just going a few steps furthur down the road.

Re:Xbox too? (3, Interesting)

epiphani (254981) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919361)

Possibly stupid question: where's the video that leaked? I can't find it on that site or the one it links to as a source. Anyone know? /Could be my noscript causing problems

Re:Xbox too? (1)

InsGadget (2092854) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919901)

Possibly stupid question: where's the video that leaked? I can't find it on that site or the one it links to as a source. Anyone know? /Could be my noscript causing problems

The video was never released to the public.

Same apps on smaller screen does not work. (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38918687)

"While Win 8 apps won't be directly compatible with Windows Phone 8, Windows Phone manager Joe Belfiore says developers will be able to 'reuse — by far — most of their code."

Good. I'll only need 8 handsets to display the ribbon in MS Office.

Bizarro World (5, Insightful)

RazzleFrog (537054) | more than 2 years ago | (#38918693)

I predict a world where Microsoft has the best mobile platform but can't break the stranglehold of Apple and Google.

Re:Bizarro World (4, Funny)

coinreturn (617535) | more than 2 years ago | (#38918753)

I predict a world where Microsoft has the best mobile platform but can't break the stranglehold of Apple and Google.

I highlighted the part that shows what a wild imagination you have.

Re:Bizarro World (4, Insightful)

RazzleFrog (537054) | more than 2 years ago | (#38918815)

You can say wild but companies learn from their mistakes. Look at how they've done with XBOX and Kinect. As a PS3 owner I can tell you that they leveled Sony.

Re:Bizarro World (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38918921)

But then we're talking about a product which is mainly famous for:
GIANT ENEMY CRAB,
600 US DOLLARS
RI-IDGE RACER!
ATTACK ITS WEAK POINT FOR MASSIVE DAMAGE *ahem*
and PS3 HAS NOT GAMES

Some may try to argue they level themselves.

Re:Bizarro World (1)

neokushan (932374) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919171)

It's kind of amusing, Sony could be seen as "Team Blu" while Microsoft is clearly Team Green. And then think back to a time when Intel (who mostly use blue colour schemes) and AMD (Green-Green-Green...At least in the CPU world) had an almost identical conflict - Team blue were the big lugs who couldn't be stopped, at least until they shot themselves in the foot (Prescott - hot, expensive and limited scope for improvement), meanwhile Team Green brought out some great tech that was just solid - cheaper, faster and cooler, than the competition. Then suddenly Intel pulled the finger out and today AMD is nowhere near the giant it once was. Sure, they still compete and they aren't going anywhere, but it just goes to show that when two companies switch places, they can easily switch back.

Of course, I'm not expecting Sony to not shoot themselves in the foot a few more times.

Re:Bizarro World (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38919111)

Look at how they've done with XBOX and Kinect.

And Zune and Tablet PCs.... oh, wait...

Re:Bizarro World (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38918897)

I predict a world where Microsoft has the best mobile platform but can't break the stranglehold of Apple and Google.

I highlighted the part that shows what a wild imagination you have.

Why is it "wild"?

Apple has proven its superiority over everyone - at this time. Tech is extremely volatile. Any dislike for any company and their business practices is very ... short sighted.

Re:Bizarro World (2, Insightful)

PessimysticRaven (1864010) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919155)

Methinks he's referring to your implication that Microsoft having the "best" mobile platform is laughable, at best. Sort of like saying RIM has the best management team, bar-none.

Re:Bizarro World (-1, Flamebait)

Kenja (541830) | more than 2 years ago | (#38918797)

And I predict a world where the same malware/worm runs on Windows desktops, XBox and MS phones.

Re:Bizarro World (2)

SJHillman (1966756) | more than 2 years ago | (#38918855)

Then you should beware of all of the Android malware coming out also infecting your Linux boxes...

Re:Bizarro World (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38919057)

not quite, I think

Don't quote me on this, I'm talking from what I've heard/read, I haven't programmed for Android to know for sure.

AFAIK Android runs on a java virtual machine on the linux part of Android. Any malware that where to directly attack the linux part of an Android device would first have to break out of this VM. If this where the case then yes, it would also be possible infect linux boxes.

Re:Bizarro World (2)

toadlife (301863) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919253)

Native android apps have the ability to run shell scripts, which run in the "linux" part of Android. There is nothing to break out of.

Re:Bizarro World (1)

Microlith (54737) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919497)

Show me one (any) incidence of this occuring.

Re:Bizarro World (1)

SJHillman (1966756) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919635)

That's my whole point. Just because they share a part of a kernel doesn't automatically make one vulnerable to every piece of malware on the other.

Re:Bizarro World (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38919881)

That's my whole point. Just because they share a part of a kernel doesn't automatically make one vulnerable to every piece of malware on the other.

No you idiot. Android applications mostly run on dalvik and native sdk. They don't share the software stack.

Win 8, XBOX and Win phone 8 would, making a common virus is easier. It is not a matter of "ooohhhh show me where " slashdot mentality but common sense.

Re:Bizarro World (3, Informative)

Tridus (79566) | more than 2 years ago | (#38918865)

Just like all that Android malware is also taking over Linux desktops, right?

Re:Bizarro World (4, Insightful)

FuegoFuerte (247200) | more than 2 years ago | (#38918861)

We're almost there already. Win Phone 7 is a bit short on apps perhaps, but already has many features the other two don't (and yes, there are some features the others have that WinPhone 7 doesn't).

There's still plenty of room for improvement in Windows Phone, but it's been improving rapidly already. I've owned one for about 6 months now I think (since the HTC Arrive came out on Sprint, whenever that was). It's been more stable than the "feature phones" I've owned, with the exception of my original Nokia 6185 in the '90s. If this keeps up, with Google's "Screw Security and Privacy" attitude, and Apple's "You can have it our way or you can't have it at all" "we know what hardware you want" attitude, I think Microsoft may even be able to break the stranglehold, with proper execution.

Re:Bizarro World (4, Insightful)

bonch (38532) | more than 2 years ago | (#38918891)

Don't count out Microsoft. They broke Sony's stranglehold at the height of the PS2.

Re:Bizarro World (3, Interesting)

binarylarry (1338699) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919145)

If anyone broke anyone, it was Nintendo putting a size 6 Japanese boot in both Microsoft and Sony's ass.... at the same time.

Re:Bizarro World (1, Funny)

RazzleFrog (537054) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919485)

That makes absolutely no sense. Nintendo was and is the leader that Sony and XBox have been eating away at.

Re:Bizarro World (2)

localman57 (1340533) | more than 2 years ago | (#38918967)

I predict a world where Microsoft has the best mobile platform but can't break the stranglehold of Apple and Google.

They may not want to break Apple or Google's stranglehold...on the non-corporate user. But RIM is on the ropes, and is thought to be soon for sale. Many IT departments have only grudgingly accepted Apple and Android phones onto their networks. It seems like Nokia / Microsoft / RIM's network and customers might be a formula for success in the corporate world.

Re:Bizarro World (1)

DogDude (805747) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919347)

I think you're right. Using the current Windows 7.5 Phone, it's pretty clear that it's designed to integrate with Exchange (and it does it well). Home users don't know what Exchange is, but it's used in 70% of businesses worldwide. I think that people who want toys will stick with the iPhone, and maybe the Android stuff.

Re:Bizarro World (1)

owlnation (858981) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919083)

I think you are right that they won't beat out Android or iPhone -- however, all RIM's users will belong to MS, very, very soon.

Re:Bizarro World (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38919139)

They already been there, done that with WM 6.5. I like installing GPL apps on my phone and not being tracked by the OS manufacturer.

Then they went and made WP 7.

Windows 7 Phone apps (2)

tooyoung (853621) | more than 2 years ago | (#38918721)

While Win 8 apps won't be directly compatible with Windows Phone 8, Windows Phone manager Joe Belfiore says developers will be able to 'reuse â" by far â" most of their code.'"

Will they be able to reuse their Windows 7 Phone code, or was that a dead end?

Re:Windows 7 Phone apps (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38918909)

You could write Silverlight for Windows Phone 7, and Silverlight ports to the metro winrt stack...so yes (I think).

Re:Windows 7 Phone apps (1)

Eirenarch (1099517) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919017)

From the reports it is not clear how the current apps will be supported except that they will work. It is reasonable to assume that developers will be able to change and redeploy the code but it is not known if the APIs will be unified and if new APIs will be usable in the old apps. Of course any .NET code that the is pure logic will work everywhere. The XAML code is tricky because it depends on the sets of controls that they will choose to make available

Re:Windows 7 Phone apps (3, Interesting)

gbjbaanb (229885) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919525)

its not that clear if they will be fully supported however.

From Herb Sutter's recent "Why C++" [msdn.com] presentation (here's a transcript [alejandrosegovia.net] ), he mentions that mobile development moves towards native... with the implication that native mobile code will be much more predominant with Windows and phone 8.

I should imagine there will be native (winRT) APIs but not sure if they will create wrappers for the old .NET phone APIs. Certainly Silverlight is no longer even listed under the technologies available for mobile development! I think you'll be ok to redevelop apps for windows phone 8, but they won't work without a little modification.

Don't show it to Apple, they will patent it (-1, Flamebait)

G3ckoG33k (647276) | more than 2 years ago | (#38918761)

Don't show it to Apple, they will patent it. Oh no, it is the ever so anti-anttrustlaw (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_antitrust_law) Microsoft-Apple pact behind it.. Ever so sorry, false flag.

Re:Don't show it to Apple, they will patent it (-1, Troll)

bonch (38532) | more than 2 years ago | (#38918915)

What a totally arbitrary flamebait post.

Liar or Lawyer? (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38919605)

What a totally arbitrary flamebait post.

Liar or Lawyer?

Please tell us why it would be arbitrary.

Apple has become a patent lawsuit filing sore monkey ass.

Microsoft was a sore part of the world long before.

They never sued each other for the last few, petty years. Why not?

Intellectual respect?! ;) LOL!!!

Re:Liar or Lawyer? (1)

larry bagina (561269) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919753)

Samsung, HTC, and LG have licensed Microsoft's patents for use in Android. The only major player not to is Motorola and they're currently being sued by Microsoft. So given that Microsoft likes to patent things and collect royalties on their patents, why wouldn't they patent everything they could?

The Dream (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38918829)

Could this finally be the realization of the long held dream of write-once, run-anywhere malware?

So much for backward compatibility, huh? (5, Interesting)

Shag (3737) | more than 2 years ago | (#38918871)

Or forward. Or sideways. WP8 won't be binary compatible with WinCE-based WP7 (which itself wasn't compatible with WinCE-based WM6), nor with desktop Windows 8, nor with, apparently, any other OS that's ever existed. Sure hope they make it real easy for developers to build their existing code for WP8.

Oh, and it'll also be real interesting to see whether any WP7 devices can be upgraded to WP8.

Re:So much for backward compatibility, huh? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38918937)

Windows Phone apps are written in bastardised .NET I think so they should go over to a new version pretty easily.

Re:So much for backward compatibility, huh? (2)

localman57 (1340533) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919025)

It doesn't have to be. Palm switched off of the old DragonFire micros to a newer more modern one sometime around 8 years ago. The processing power difference was sufficient that they could run the 68k code in an emulator, and it ran as good or better than on the original platform. That's mostly because 90% of the processing power of most Palm apps was consumed in system library calls, and they recompiled the libraries to take advantage of a lot of native code. I don't see why they couldn't do a CE emulator for older apps.

Re:So much for backward compatibility, huh? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38919395)

8 years ago was about the time Palms started to die off from main stream use...coincidence? No i think not.

Re:So much for backward compatibility, huh? (2)

localman57 (1340533) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919671)

Palm messed up a lot of things around that time, but backward compatibility wasn't one of them. Forward vision, well, that really took a nosedive after the palm III and V, in my opinion.

Re:So much for backward compatibility, huh? (1)

Missing.Matter (1845576) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919325)

Microsoft has traditionally been very good about giving old devices updates to the latest version. There's no reason to believe at least the last generation will be upgradeable, if not all of them.

Re:So much for backward compatibility, huh? (1)

ComfortablyAmbiguous (1740854) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919495)

It would be far more of an issue except that windows 7 phone apps are running in the CLR. They just need a new CLR runtime engine for the new environment and to ensure library compatibility and every 7.5 app should run on 8.

Re:So much for backward compatibility, huh? (3, Informative)

recoiledsnake (879048) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919777)

>Or forward. Or sideways. WP8 won't be binary compatible with WinCE-based WP7 (which itself wasn't compatible with WinCE-based WM6), nor with desktop Windows 8, nor with, apparently, any other OS that's ever existed. Sure hope they make it real easy for developers to build their existing code for WP8.

WP7 apps will run on WP8.

http://wmpoweruser.com/brandon-watson-squashes-rumours-that-windows-phone-7-apps-will-be-incompatible-with-windows-phone-8/ [wmpoweruser.com]

Computer in a phone (3, Interesting)

TheLordPhantom (2527654) | more than 2 years ago | (#38918873)

I haven't really seen Windows 8 yet, but, this could potentially be a really awesome direction. I don't much like Windows personally, but I have always wished phones, tablets in particular had the flexibility of a general purpose computer. I'm crossing my fingers and hoping Microsoft let's this happen.

Re:Computer in a phone (1)

Microlith (54737) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919521)

I have always wished phones, tablets in particular had the flexibility of a general purpose computer.

They always have. OS vendors have been happily not delivering that. Microsoft won't go much farther, what with the lock down they're demanding on these devices (well, all devices with Windows 8.)

Re:Computer in a phone (2)

recoiledsnake (879048) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919821)

I haven't really seen Windows 8 yet, but, this could potentially be a really awesome direction. I don't much like Windows personally, but I have always wished phones, tablets in particular had the flexibility of a general purpose computer. I'm crossing my fingers and hoping Microsoft let's this happen.

Windows 8 x86 tablets will have that.

Windows Phone will become the best (3, Insightful)

ndtechnologies (814381) | more than 2 years ago | (#38918925)

Mark my words, and I can't believe I'm even saying this, but Windows Phone, will soon be considered the best mobile platform, due to it's unification with the desktop, and XBOX. Unfortunately, it won't mean much because people will still want shiny iPhones and will clamor to the numerous free Android phones that they can get. From a technical standpoint, there is nothing about Android that is good. The reason it is so popular, is because it is cheap and most people can get one. There, I said it. /standby to be marked as Troll in 3, 2, 1

Re:Windows Phone will become the best (3, Insightful)

jdastrup (1075795) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919135)

I tend to agree with much of what you said. But I think it's more that they have the potential to become the best. They are late in the game, but they can learn from everyone else. A major problem they will have is getting developers to make apps for it. To compete with Android, it will have to be free. If not, as long as their marketshare numbers are a fraction of the Android devices out there, developers will dismiss it and so will everyone else.

Re:Windows Phone will become the best (1)

Missing.Matter (1845576) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919391)

major problem they will have is getting developers to make apps for it.

They in fact do not have this problem. The windows phone marketplace is growing at a faster rate than the android store at the same point in its lifecycle. Today they have 60,000 apps after only 16 months. Yes Android and iOS stores have an order of magnitude more, but at some point (much before half a million apps I'd say) there are diminishing returns associated with the number of apps in a store.

Why? (Re:Windows Phone will become the best) (3, Insightful)

EXTomar (78739) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919185)

I never understood the desire to unify desktop and other things (XBox) on a phone let alone why is it valuable. There is value in creating apps that interface with other systems but one is overstating the value of a whole phone dedicated to interfacing this way when it turns out people would rather have other features (mobile location services, e-readers, etc).

Another way to think about not: Are people chomping at the bit who support Android and iPhone to get or sharing accessing to their home machines? These platforms aren't popular because of this nor do I see that changing in two years. If you can answer "Why do you think that is valuable?" then I can begin to see your stance otherwise I suspect that such features are "gee-whiz" but not necessary or the best use of the mobile phone platform.

Re:Why? (Re:Windows Phone will become the best) (-1)

DogDude (805747) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919377)

Windows Phone is designed for business users. It's specialty is Exchange integration, and it does it pretty damn well. I think that MS is going to leave the toy phone market to Apple, and focus on the massive business user market, where people are not clamoring for bells and whistles and toys on their phones.

Re:Why? (Re:Windows Phone will become the best) (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38919423)

"Why do you think that is valuable?"

More options with fewer trinkets and fewer hurdles when switching between trinkets.

A low end user can get their e-mail just fine on almost any smartphone, they will probably never do anything more complicated than web browsing, but the option would be there.
A business traveller probably already has a tablet and a phone, by actually treating both of them as computers internally, it becomes trivial to keep both up to date so that if he forgets one of those two somewhere he can use the other until the replacement arrives.
A casual gamer can get Tetris from one location and just install it with all 3 UI options (desktop, tablet, and phone) and destroy those Capitalist Pig-Lines anywhere.
A hardcore gamer will be limited by the hardware, as always.
A Linux fanatic will still be busy compiling Linux on all their kitchen appliances, making a beowulf cluster, and trying to track down the bug that causes the blender to spin up while the 'eggs and toast' script runs.

As you can see, it benefits everyone. Except iFans.

Re:Why? (Re:Windows Phone will become the best) (1)

Microlith (54737) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919543)

I never understood the desire to unify desktop and other things (XBox) on a phone let alone why is it valuable.

Lock-in. Inability to transfer outside the Microsoft domain due to how much is tied up in their platforms.

Re:Windows Phone will become the best (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38919243)

Mark my words, and I can't believe I'm even saying this, but Windows Phone, will soon be considered the best mobile platform, due to it's unification with the desktop, and XBOX. Unfortunately, it won't mean much because people will still want shiny iPhones and will clamor to the numerous free Android phones that they can get. From a technical standpoint, there is nothing about Android that is good. The reason it is so popular, is because it is cheap and most people can get one. There, I said it. /standby to be marked as Troll in 3, 2, 1

For the Android I got, I paid about what I would have paid for an iPhone at the time I got it, and in return got 4G, the ability to swap out batteries during long away-from-power times, a screen I think looks better, and most importantly to me, I can customize it to the way I want it, rather than the way Apple thinks it should be.

By the way, your post isn't a troll, it's flamebait, although I suppose the distinction is a fine one.

Re:Windows Phone will become the best (1)

w.hamra1987 (1193987) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919285)

This is where Microsoft always wins, Integration. Look at their desktop, you have Internet Explorer (I know it sucks), with Microsoft Office, with Outlook, with the Windows Search system, with Windows Live and its many applications, all tightly integrated and interconnected. Yes, their system is very closed, but it provides a sort of unification that us, Linux fans, can't yet realize. KDE has been pushing that way for long, but sadly, the fact remains that most applications aren't aware of each other's shareable resources. This is where Microsoft still has an edge over the rest.

If they are to integrate the phone OS and the Xbox into their desktops, it will prove to be a killer combo, and a major selling point. Add Windows Live cloud support for syncing everything together from the net, and Microsoft is a winner.

As much as i hate that company, and hate to admit this, but Microsoft are doing a very good job with integrating everything together.

Re:Windows Phone will become the best (2)

sootman (158191) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919337)

> Windows Phone, will soon be considered the best mobile
> platform, due to it's unification with the desktop, and XBOX.
> Unfortunately, it won't mean much because people will still
> want shiny iPhones and will clamor to the numerous free
> Android phones that they can get.

Or maybe the reason it won't mean much because most people do not give a shit about integrating with their desktop and/or their XBox? What I want out of a mobile device is a really great experience when I'm out and about.* You might as well say "Windows Phone will soon be considered the best mobile platform because it makes the best waffles." "Best at X" means NOTHING if no one cares about X.

* which Windows Phone may well offer, but it's probably a case of "too little, too late." MS has a DECADE headstart with Windows CE and Apple ate their lunch in about a year.

Re:Windows Phone will become the best (1)

Missing.Matter (1845576) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919639)

What I want out of a mobile device is a really great experience when I'm out and about.*

True, that's a good goal to have for a mobile device, but you're not always out and about. In fact sometimes you're at home and there are data and apps on your home computer you might like to access. When we talk about integrating, we're talking about using and app on the desktop, then getting up and leaving and having the same app/data on your mobile phone. Edit your data on the phone then come back to your PC and it's all there.

Could you imagine being on a call, walking in your front door, then transferring that call onto the computer using skype? Or what about playing a game on xbox, pausing it, then hopping on a bus and picking up where you left off on your phone? That would be some pretty cool stuff, and I could see this as the groundwork.

Re:Windows Phone will become the best (1)

Microlith (54737) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919727)

Microsoft tying all of their properties together would probably be an awesome way to see them back in court, but probably not (can't be seen attacking a "Job Creator"). Of course, if they were all broken up into separate companies we might see some sort of cross platform way of doing this instead of it all being tied into one company that will probably patent the shit out of it and sue anyone who tries to enable such compatibility.

Re:Windows Phone will become the best (1)

0123456 (636235) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919451)

"Mark my words, and I can't believe I'm even saying this, but Windows Phone, will soon be considered the best mobile platform, due to it's unification with the desktop, and XBOX."

So Windows 8 Phones will have an integrated keyboard, mouse and Xbox controller?

Free Upgrade? (1)

Merk42 (1906718) | more than 2 years ago | (#38918951)

Is this a free upgrade for anyone already running WP7?
I guess the name, as silly as it is, makes sense now. Windows Phone is only on phones (as opposed tablets) and gets FREE upgrades. Windows 8 does not.

Re:Free Upgrade? (1)

DogDude (805747) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919275)

Unlike Apple, Windows doesn't really have a history of charging for anything but the largest OS updates. Windows Phone 7 to 7.5 was a free update, even though they were a full year apart.

Re:Free Upgrade? Not for kernel changes (2)

daboochmeister (914039) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919443)

Unlike Apple, Windows doesn't really have a history of charging for anything but the largest OS updates. Windows Phone 7 to 7.5 was a free update, even though they were a full year apart.

Yeah, but I don't believe they've ever changed to an entirely new kernel before for free. What do you think they are, an open source company or something?

Re:Free Upgrade? Not for kernel changes (1)

DogDude (805747) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919545)

True, but there's no precedent in the cell phone market for ever charging for OS updates, I'm pretty sure. I don't see any reason why they'd consider starting to do so now.

Explains why no native SDK (3, Interesting)

caywen (942955) | more than 2 years ago | (#38918961)

I'll bet this was in the roadmap for some time, and helps to explain why they do not offer a native SDK currently.

I think this is great for their phone platform as the Windows 8 kernel is likely to be far more robust in the areas of thread scheduling and memory management. Given that Windows 8 demonstrably can execute even in 128MB RAM (http://windows8beta.com/2011/10/windows-8-runs-on-64mb-and-128-mb-ram), the resource impact probably isn't an issue.

not surprising (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38919033)

Why would this surprise anyone? Windows has been touting one OS that works for all platforms since the very first tablets with windows XP were released.

Windows 8 will show us if they are visionaries or just extremely stubborn.

compatibility for viruses? (2, Insightful)

nik_qc (1202403) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919075)

So, viruses for Windows 8 will be also portable to WP8? :)

Re:compatibility for viruses? (0)

jdastrup (1075795) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919223)

No. The VIRUS_COMPATIBLE flag will be set to false by default, and that is honored by everyone.

Re:compatibility for viruses? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38919751)

No as windows 8 on phones will probably be the arm version while desktop being still x86. That could change with amd/intel offerings in the future though. Viruses would still have to deal with differences between a platforms. A virus would have to only completely rely on kernel vulnerabilities rather then the desktop environment unless that shares code as well. So it definitely increases the chances of cross platform viruses but I doubt it will be the majority as there will be big differences between a moble and desktop platform where the mobile is usually highly locked down.

Shared Kernel is a weakness, not a strength (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38919181)

If developers port their code with too much re-use, you're going to see a lot of terrible apps on Windows 8 phone.

Fundamentally, apps that work well on a conventional screen need to have a different UI than ones on a touchscreen. And, the interface should vary between the size of devices as well. If developers just took Mac OS X apps and recompiled them as iPad apps, the results would be horrific.

So you have:
Windows 8 "slate" devices
Conventional Windows 8 desktops/notebooks
Windows 8 Phone devices

Each should have applications thought out, from the ground up, for their respective platforms.

Microsoft may best Apple in the sheer volume of phone apps as a result of this strategy; however, most of them will suck.

Re:Shared Kernel is a weakness, not a strength (1)

thomasw_lrd (1203850) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919433)

I think that where the "developers will be able to 'reuse — by far — most of their code." comes in. The UI code will have to be changed, but the functionality can still be the same.

HW / SW platform (1)

postdan (962573) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919247)

I'm waiting for the day when mobile HW and SW platform will not be linked. I buy a phone and I buy the licence for the operating system i want (Android, Windows, I-something, Linux etc.)

Re:HW / SW platform (1)

DogDude (805747) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919441)

I think you're going to be waiting a long time. The price of these things without subsidization from the phone companies would be pretty damn high. Besides, I've got to imagine the demand for a phone without phone service has got to be pretty low.

Re:HW / SW platform (1)

postdan (962573) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919565)

The phone companies sell subsidized phones and MS, Google, Android sell the software. HW+SW + sim card = usable phone (at least here in Europe)

Re:HW / SW platform (1)

Microlith (54737) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919739)

The price of these things without subsidization from the phone companies would be pretty damn high./blockquote.
$500-$600 without subsidization, $0-$300 with. You readily pay back the difference with their plans.

Re:HW / SW platform (1)

LynnwoodRooster (966895) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919587)

Get an HTC Evo 3D - it can run Android, Windows 95, Windows XP, or Linux [geeky-gadgets.com] . You can't run iOS, but that's because Apple refuses to make it available.

Re:HW / SW platform (1)

postdan (962573) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919797)

I can have many OSs on my Android mobile phone just by running Teamviewer. The phone must become some sort of mobile computer. At home/work I want to put the phone in a cradle and use it with a monitor, keyboard and mouse, just like any computer. So, the OS must be separated form the HW

Leaked... yeah right (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38919619)

Not marketing! Not marketing! Curiously many leaks abound.

Finally (1)

amiga3D (567632) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919719)

It took a while but maybe MS has pulled their head from their asses. If not it might at least be a glass belly button so they can see where they're going.

Windows 8, C#, .NET (5, Interesting)

Dan East (318230) | more than 2 years ago | (#38919721)

Windows Phone 7 is C# only, which is why I don't support the platform with my games (99% of my C++ code is shared between the iOS and Android builds, which is how it should be). So if Windows 8 developers can "reuse — by far — most of their code" does that mean Windows 8 is C# only too, or that Windows Phone 8 will allow 3rd part apps to be written in C++?

IMO, if Windows Phone 8 doesn't support C++, it is dead in the water from the perspective of 3rd party apps. Only the really big players have the resources to completely rewrite their iOS or Android apps (mainly games, which usually aren't intimately tied to the native GUI) in C#. That is one of the reasons there aren't many apps for Windows Mobile 7, and certainly why there isn't as much commonality as you see between iOS and Android apps. If MS had half a brain they would allow development in C++, and include APIs like OpenGL ES which is supported by both Android and iOS, which will make it very easy for developers like me to release my games for Windows Mobile 8.

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