Beta

Slashdot: News for Nerds

×

Welcome to the Slashdot Beta site -- learn more here. Use the link in the footer or click here to return to the Classic version of Slashdot.

Thank you!

Before you choose to head back to the Classic look of the site, we'd appreciate it if you share your thoughts on the Beta; your feedback is what drives our ongoing development.

Beta is different and we value you taking the time to try it out. Please take a look at the changes we've made in Beta and  learn more about it. Thanks for reading, and for making the site better!

The Destruction of Iraq's Once-Great Universities

Soulskill posted more than 2 years ago | from the long-term-casualties dept.

Education 444

Harperdog writes "Hugh Gusterson has written a devastating article about what has happened to Iraq's once great university system, and puts most of the blame for its total collapse on the U.S. Quoting: 'While American troops guarded the Ministries of Oil and the Interior but ignored cultural heritage sites, looters ransacked the universities. For example, the entire library collections at the University of Baghdad's College of Arts and at the University of Basra were destroyed. The Washington Post's Rajiv Chandresekara described the scene at Mustansiriya University in 2003: "By April 12, the campus of yellow-brick buildings and grassy courtyards was stripped of its books, computers, lab equipment and desks. Even electrical wiring was pulled from the walls. What was not stolen was set ablaze, sending dark smoke billowing over the capital that day."'"

cancel ×

444 comments

Obligatory question (-1, Redundant)

jcreus (2547928) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925529)

How many Libraries of Congress is that?

News? (4, Interesting)

bazorg (911295) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925553)

Some [wikipedia.org] have even suggested that it was on purpose.

Re:News? (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925979)

Mainly Naomi Klein, who is known for just making stuff up as she goes along.
Seriously though, the primary thing to blame for the end of Iraq's universities is Islam, because it was what fuelled the anger of the looters (against the un-Islamic curricula and against the education of women), because it is what makes Iraq inhospitable to science now and because it is what is preventing the Iraqi government from funding the building of new ones even though there's plenty of oil money available.
The only thing the US can be blamed for is naïveté. At least the military top and the administration had this attidude of "muslims are just like us, except they call God Allah". This is also why things turned out so shitty when the US didn't keep the oppressive military rule in place and why Iraq's democratic project is coming apart at the seams. Most of Iraq's problems were essentially caused by the US top refusing to do their homework before they went in.
Then again, the only way to prevent all this would have been to institute a tight (and expensive) military rule followed by a thorough (and expensive) re-education program. I can see the headlines now. ... Maybe the current situation is as good as it can get. The US went in there to prevent Iraq from being a pain in the butt and I think it helped. It's a shame we cannot keep people from each other's throats but even the US isn't powerful enough to do that everywhere on the globe, so yeah. Reality sucks.

Re:News? (3, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38926137)

Yes.

The Arab-Muslim world has the highest rates of illiteracy on Earth. Like everything else, the Arabs will of course blame that on America and the Jews, rather than taking a long hard look at themselves.

Re:News? (5, Informative)

rednip (186217) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925997)

Possibly the greatest military blunder off all time was coalition provisional authority order number 2 [wikipedia.org] which dismissed the Iraqi army. This action sent hundreds of thousands young unemployed trained soldiers into the hands of the various mullahs. Arguably, it was the tinder that fuel the Iraqi civil war. L. Paul Bremer [wikipedia.org] , the man who committed the blunder was rewarded with the Presidential medal of Freedom.

Books and computers and desks are easy to replace (-1, Flamebait)

goombah99 (560566) | more than 2 years ago | (#38926081)

I'm a research scientist I haven't physically been in a library in 8 years. No need. At first I did miss all the old articles but those are now online too. Even reference books have been replaced. I never did use the library for text books and now those are on ipads and OLPC and Kindle.

Any stolen Computers would be obsolete by now.

And desks are not that hard to replace. Even makeshift sawhorse desks work great for studying. That's what I used in grad school.

And the labs. Well perhaps some of that could have been recycled. But it's also a chance to update them. Thus the start up costs seem like the real issue. Most of the legacy stuff was due to be replaced and good riddance. But replacing it all at once may be a strain.

Re:Books and computers and desks are easy to repla (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38926127)

"I'm a research scientist I haven't physically been in a library in 8 years. No need. At first I did miss all the old articles but those are now online too. Even reference books have been replaced. I never did use the library for text books and now those are on ipads and OLPC and Kindle."

What f*#$ing relevance does this have to Iraq's looted university libraries?! Do you really think the Iraqis had digitized all their library articles and books back in 2003, many of which would likely have been unique one of a kind items? Or, did you just come in here and feel like talking about yourself and you gadgets?

That's one way to look at it.. (5, Insightful)

VMaN (164134) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925559)

.. I guess you can't blame the looters.. I mean no-one wan looking, so it's like they WANTED all their shit stolen, right?

Re:That's one way to look at it.. (5, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925613)

Bullshit, if you destabilize a government, as much as dictatorial it might be, you ought to take the responsability of the outcome.

Read the Geneva Conventions if you don't believe me.

What do they have to do with the USA? (5, Insightful)

overshoot (39700) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925921)

Read the Geneva Conventions if you don't believe me.

Like the Convention Against Torture, those are very handy for us to use for convicting the petty thugs running penny-ante countries when we catch them.

However, they don't apply to the USA. Or won't, anyway, until some other country has the power to apply them to us.

Re:That's one way to look at it.. (5, Insightful)

SplashMyBandit (1543257) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925625)

Agree completely. Everyone (including many in the US) seems to blame the US for everything.
Looters ransacking universities - oh, that's the fault of the US. Oh, Iranians being cantankerous - well, that's the fault of the US for proviking them. Pirates in the Indian Ocean - that's the fault of the US for not going ashore and pacifying Somalia. Problems in Somalia - that's the fault of the US for going in to Mogadishu in the 90's. Terrorists running around the World blowing innocent folks up - well, that's gotta be the fault of the US for doing nothing or too much (take your pick).

I'm a non-US citizen and see that the US gets treated as a punching bag by many (even, unfortunately, by my own countrymen). I mean, the US does enough bad stuff by itself (****ACTA!***) that there is no need to go blaming them for stuff that actually isn't their fault. I mean, how come people can't take personal responsibility for themselves and see that others also need to do the same (eg. the looters in this case). This "crying wolf" that the US is (allegedly) at fault for all the sh1t going on is getting lame (unfortunately that lameness doesn't even mean it will stop soon).

Re:That's one way to look at it.. (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925643)

The US military are scum and soldiers are criminals.

There was no reason for this war and yet the US won't take responsibility for the consequences. Fuck the US military and those who support it. Scumbags.

Re:That's one way to look at it.. (0, Troll)

Totenglocke (1291680) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925849)

The US military are scum and soldiers are criminals.

There was no reason for this war and yet the US won't take responsibility for the consequences. Fuck the US military and those who support it. Scumbags.

And that's all very true - but it still has jack shit to do with Iraqi's looting their own universities,

The USA is responsible for looting in Iraq. (1, Insightful)

s-whs (959229) | more than 2 years ago | (#38926019)

The US military are scum and soldiers are criminals. There was no reason for this war and yet the US won't take responsibility for the consequences. Fuck the US military and those who support it. Scumbags.

And that's all very true - but it still has jack shit to do with Iraqi's looting their own universities,

Of course it does. Take away the system that keeps the a-holes doing what they would really want to do, i.e. they don't give a damn about others, take want to take what they want but normally can't because they'd get caught quickly by the police.

Looting is what will happen, everywhere, in the USA. or Europe, or wherever. Just look at what happens with floods for example.

So the USA destroyed the infrastructure of power, thereby they enabled the looting. The USA is responsible.

Btw. this reminded me of something I wanted to say about a story, not long ago on slashdot, about being able to recognize serial killers. I didn't get round to writing it down then, so I will do it now: When I read that, I thought how pathetic this research was, because there are so much bigger problems that these people don't analyse at all. Esp. that a sociopath like George Wanker Bush, who was unbelievably actually elected to power by people in the USA (really? Why did anyone vote for this a-hole? I knew he was scum the first time I saw him talk on TV), and did thousands of times more damage and caused thousands of times more deaths (together with his sociapath cronies, but as the president has so much power in the US, he is responsible).

Why don't psychologists go analysing people in politics and say 'he is a sociopath and should be barred from being in any position in power'?

Re:That's one way to look at it.. (-1, Troll)

gatkinso (15975) | more than 2 years ago | (#38926047)

I totally agree. However at the US Army Rape Loot and Pillage training centers they distinctly instruct the soon to be rapists/looters/pillagers to NOT destroy the infrastructure so that there will more something to rape/loot/pillage on the next go 'round.

Re:That's one way to look at it.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925909)

Actually there was a very good reason for that war. It was about showing the radical Muslim world that the U.S. is not a paper tiger as Bin Laden had claimed. Bin Laden cited the U.S.'s failure to enforce the terms of the cease fire and other agreements from the Gulf War (which was started by Iraq by the way) as one of the reasons that he went ahead with the 9/11 attacks.

Unreasonable (1)

mosb1000 (710161) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925991)

I don't think I'd call posturing a "very good reason." I'd use the words "unreasonable reason," that way I'd be taking it back before I even said it.

Re:That's one way to look at it.. (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925957)

The military is merely a bunch of poor, brainwashed plebes who are servants of the government; in turn, the government is just the brainwashed servants of the global elite (aka the Jews). The Jews are smart enough to learn in Nazi Germany that if you don't control propaganda, then you are a victim of it.

That's a little unfair. (2, Insightful)

mosb1000 (710161) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925973)

I hate the military as much as anybody, but I don't think it's fair to take it out on the soldiers. I think most people don't really understand what they're getting into when they sign up. They sign up thinking they'll be fighting bad-guys, not blowing up innocent children to further some political agenda (or shuffling around paper-work and doing dishes, which is often the case too).

Then once they're in they try to make the best of a bad situation. There are sociopaths in the military (the same as you would find anywhere) but I don't think it's the standard. And it's very telling that the military heavily supports Ron Paul. Obviously they don't like being overseas blowing up innocent women and children, or they would support one of the chichen-hawk warmongers instead.

Re:That's one way to look at it.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38926115)

This is what passes for "insightful" on slashdot these days?

How far this site has fallen.

Re:That's one way to look at it.. (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925783)

Looters ransacking universities - oh, that's the fault of the US.

Take the sophomoric anarcho-libertarian dick of out of your mouth a second. The US killing the law enforcers is the fault of the US. ubi remedium ibi ius: there can be no rights without a mechanism for enforcing them.

I mean, the US does enough bad stuff by itself (****ACTA!***)

ACTA is oppressive and immoral but it is nowhere near as bad as causing the death of hundreds of thousands of people in an offensive war and destabilising a whole region. People on the Internet mobilise angrily when their free speech is threatened but don't take the time to consider whether anyone listens to what they say. The modern information overload has become more stupefying than any of the Roman circenses.

Re:That's one way to look at it.. (5, Insightful)

thegarbz (1787294) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925793)

The counter point is that if the US want to claim to be the world police then they should be prepared to receive the complaints when things turn sour.

World Police (1)

overshoot (39700) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925937)

Pay attention: part of being the police is never having to say you're sorry. Especially if you're a prosecutor, you can do anything with the power you have and the worst that can happen is it doesn't work. None of it ever comes back to you.

Re:That's one way to look at it.. (4, Insightful)

fa2k (881632) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925833)

Looters ransacking universities - oh, that's the fault of the US.

To be fair, the looters probably wouldn't have looted if the US didn't invade Iraq. It's easy to stay on moral high ground when you don't have boms dropping all around you.

Re:That's one way to look at it.. (4, Insightful)

tokul (682258) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925847)

Agree completely. Everyone (including many in the US) seems to blame the US for everything.
Looters ransacking universities - oh, that's the fault of the US.

They toppled Iraq's legislative, judicially and executive powers. Guess what happens when you remove basic administrative controls from the mob.

Re:That's one way to look at it.. (0)

geoffaus (623283) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925963)

I completely agree - in this case it was Iraqi's making their own bad situation worse for their future generations - did they think this would hurt the Americans or were they just being typical mindless thieves that only care about themselves - oh well if thats the future that they choose for themselves good luck to them.

Re:That's one way to look at it.. (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925971)

Well, if the US had kept out of Iraq it would has saved hundreds of thousands of lives and the nation of Iraq would have not been destroyed. Therefore the US is to blame, 100% to blame. All to prevent Saddam trading oil in currencies other than dollars and to 'steal' Iraq's oil. America is becoming modern tyranny...a fascist state.

Iran has every right under international law to create a nuclear power industry. All the Americans want, like Iraq, is to do is gain control of Iran's oil and gas and do that at any cost, including the destruction of much of Iran and its people which is genocidal....the nuclear thing is to scare the sheep. However, this one may backfire and be very, very costly. I don't think the Iranians are planning to win but to cause as much damage as possible. Then we don't know how the Russians and Chinese will react.

America has been involved in nearly all the wars...direct and proxy, since the end of WW2 (and many before) and this has resulted in the death and maiming of millions. The notion of the US being a 'world policeman' is joke and a perverted view of how the US administration projects and reinforces its national interests.

Re:That's one way to look at it.. (4, Insightful)

ianare (1132971) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925985)

It's true that the US sometimes gets blamed unjustly, but in this case the blame is squarely on the shoulders of the US military and government.

Iraqis had been living in poverty for over a decade due to the first Gulf war and then UN sanctions. Now, almost overnight, there is no more police, military or government. It's pretty obvious that in this type of situation people are going to loot. The same thing would happen anywhere.

As the occupying power, it is the responsibility of the US for ensuring the security of the people and the infrastructure.

Re:That's one way to look at it.. (1)

Slashdot Assistant (2336034) | more than 2 years ago | (#38926049)

Agree completely. Everyone (including many in the US) seems to blame the US for everything.
Looters ransacking universities - oh, that's the fault of the US. Oh, Iranians being cantankerous - well, that's the fault of the US for proviking them. Pirates in the Indian Ocean - that's the fault of the US for not going ashore and pacifying Somalia. Problems in Somalia - that's the fault of the US for going in to Mogadishu in the 90's. Terrorists running around the World blowing innocent folks up - well, that's gotta be the fault of the US for doing nothing or too much (take your pick).

Everyone blames the US for these things? Please don't presume to speak for me.

The US and the coalition of the willing bear responsibility for having neither a plan nor an intention to secure these important cultural sites. Hussein needed to be removed - he was a murderous and evil bastard, but the invasion was followed by a plan that paid scant attention to Iraq's cultural treasures. Neglecting the security of these institutions, having Bush appointees (in some case, Bible college graduates in their 20s, with no relevant experience) instead of a people actually qualified to manage reconstruction, and banning all Baath party members from participation in the new regime. Party membership didn't mean that someone was a Hussein loyalist. Think Mugabe's policy of indiscriminately removing white farmers that heralded the collapse of agriculture in Zimbabwe.

Most of the examples you cite are things for which I've rarely heard the US blamed. On blaming the US, although more generally the west, for enflaming Islamist passions, the basic motivation of the Islamists is ignored. Those fuckers aren't simply happy to see the world divided in to Islamland and Freedomland - what they require from is unquestioning compliance with their ideology. Look at Denmark's experiences. Denmark, hardly a bastion of western imperialism, saw its embassies burnt, its companies boycotted, and its citizens threatened because of a series of cartoons published by a private business. Even here in Ireland, Liam Egan, thinking himself a latter-day Lawrence of Arabia, became more Wahhabi than the Wahhabis and began his mission to bring Islamism to Ireland. In Egan's case, he seemed to spend most of his time posting anti-Semitic shit to the MPAC website (an Irish branch of the Muslim Public Affairs Council, which in this case, was practically a one-man council) and arguing with people on the Internet. Some have unkindly said that this is why his wife fucked off to the UK. Egan's dream of seeing Ireland transformed in to a caliphate were cruelly dashed when MPAC was closed (allegedly by intelligence services) and he fled to Saudi Arabia. In reality I suspect that his Wahhabi paymasters simply cut their losses, on realizing that Egan was indeed completely fucking useless, and serving only to make Muslims appear violent and dumb as a sack of hammers (as if their co-religionists in Buttfuckistan weren't already doing enough here).

Western nations should be blamed for support given of some pretty unpleasant regimes, and their support of pretty unsavory groups under the philosophy of "the enemy of my enemy is my friend". Of course, just like with colonialism, these events can only for so long be cited as the source of contemporary woes. Sooner or later a people sound like a middle-aged man, blaming all that is wrong in his life on his childhood. Muslims in the middle-east have made it perfectly clear that they're more than capable of fucking things up without western aid.

You're a non-US citizen, and you now have it on record that I blame you for the stream of hyperbole and nonsense that is post #38925625.

Re:That's one way to look at it.. (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38926057)

The US eliminated the police and military system that provided security for the universities and everything else in Iraq. They were obliged to take over the job and provide security. A huge job. But other than securing oil fields, their efforts genuinely sucked. Their stated reasons for going in there were bogus, and the priorities made no sense. The most clear example of this is the fact that as the military rolled into Baghdad, you'd think that securing all the sites with the supposed "weapons of mass destruction" that were the reason for invading would be the #1 priority. Instead, the oil fields were promptly secured, and the military rolled right on by nuclear facilities and didn't bother to secure those sites until much later. The local Iraqis were rolling out drums of uranium yellow cake from nuclear facilities at will, with nobody to stop them. Thankfully, people weren't interested in anything nuclear, they just wanted the drums to store water, so they emptied the yellow cake onto the ground. Nobody was there to stop them.

It's pretty sad that even for the stated goal of stopping a WMD program, the US didn't properly secure relevant sites. They were too busy securing the oil. And if securing WMD sites wasn't a priority, obviously universities weren't either, but that's the point: when the US set priorities for securing the country in the aftermath of the invasion they were negligent on a grand scale.

Re:That's one way to look at it.. (5, Insightful)

iusty (104688) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925645)

That's not quite right.

The problem is that US went in and replaced the security structure (policy, army, etc.) of the Iraqi state with its own troops. However, in the process of doing so, they provided this only for some parts of the country.

Look at it this way: before US went in, Iraqi police (probably) protected the universities. After US went in, noone did. Yes, of course, the looters are the ones that actually stole the stuff, but US has its own part to blame in this, IMHO.

Blame it on those who started the war (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38926009)

In case you forgot, before the war was started those looter were kept in check by the local law. Guess who invaded and let the looter lose despite having control of the country, despite knowing looter would come out ? Yep. You got it.

Re:That's one way to look at it.. (1)

timeOday (582209) | more than 2 years ago | (#38926075)

Once the looting starts, what is the point of standing by and doing nothing? I would like to think at least some of the looting was by people who intended to safeguard national treasures.

US Troops stole all the books . . . (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925561)

. . . . and set the buildings on fire?

Re:US Troops stole all the books . . . (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925779)

Great, they can now study up on the Basics of How to Blame Female Victims and Kill Them, Stoning Victims 101, Death to America by Allah Ackbar, and "Daddy, that man's religion is different. You're right son, let's kill them"

Re:US Troops stole all the books . . . (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925925)

why dont you go masturbate to jesus's abs or whatever you fuckwad christians do.....

Re:US Troops stole all the books . . . (2)

aix tom (902140) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925929)

Funny enough, such books would have been unlikely to be in Iraq universities at that time.

Iraq was a dictatorship, it was somewhat communist, but the government and the people in charge where not Islamists.

And The Museums (3, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925567)

I remember seeing footage of a curator of a Baghdad museum weeping at the destruction that had been wrought upon the building and its collections.

Blame the US? (0, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925583)

How about we blame the looters first?

Re:Blame the US? (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925627)

If you nosy fucks had stayed the fuck out of there, there wouldn't have been any looters in the first place. You had no business in there, your stupid, pig-headed cowboy "Amerca!-Freedom!-Fuck-yeah" attitude caused the death of hundreds of thousands of people and the almost total destruction of the country. All for a few fucking barrels of oil. You should be fucking proud of yourselves. "Mission accomplished" indeed.

Re:Blame the US? (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925727)

Fuck Iraq and Fuck you.

We should have just glassed the entire miserable hell hole that it is and the vermin Muslims that inhabit it.

Re:Blame the US? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925761)

Iraq was not muslim before the Kuweit war. It had a good school system and freedom for women. It was a far more advanced country than Kuweit.

Re:Blame the US? (3, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38926043)

I'm assuming that you mean Iraq was not Islamic. Iraq has been Muslim since its conquest by Arabs in the 7th century. Anyway, even that would depend on how one defines 'Islamic'.

In Islamic countries, the term 'Islamic' implies the definition of whichever is the majority sect in that country. So in Iran, Bahrein, Iraq & Azerbaijan, it would mean Shia. In all other Islamic countries, it would mean Sunni. The Baath Party existed in order to give Muslim minorities in any Muslim country e.g. Sunnis in Iraq or Alawites in Syria an ideology to back up their forceful seizure of power, and that's what existed in both Iraq & Syria. Since they were dominated by minority sects, obviously they didn't declare their countries as 'Islamic' countries, or the consequences would have been disastrous for them. Had Saddam done that, Iraq would have become a Shia country, negating any of his gains, and similarly, had Assad (Hafez or Bashar) done that, Syria would have become Sunni. (In the case of the Alawites, most Sunnis don't consider them to be Muslims, but one Shia seminary in Iran recognized them as a Shia sect.)

However, none of that meant full religious plurality & tolerance, as your misleading phrase 'Iraq was not Muslim' would seem to imply. In both Iraq & Syria, since the Baathists were so outnumbered and they saw that there was no way the Christians were going to take over their country, they co-opted them, giving them lower rung posts within their set up (like Tariq Aziz in Iraq) and giving them a few limited freedoms (Syria still is the only Muslim country that has holidays on Christmas and Easter - something unheard of in the Muslim world). Also, since both Syria & Iraq were both heavily backed by the Soviets during the Cold War, their regimes tended to be more socialist, if not communist, so that encouraged some Atheism amongst them.

Comparing it to Kuwait, I agree that Kuwait was pretty much a backwater country, whose own people pretty much lived on the beaches while guest workers slaved away - much like the other GCC countries. Freedom for women was probably the only thing that Saddam had, but the same was true of Libya and Tunisia. As countries become more Islamic, the freedom of women gets eroded.

Re:Blame the US? (5, Insightful)

santax (1541065) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925633)

Those ARE the looters... Hence they where protecting some oilfields instead of the citizens they came to 'free'.

Re:Blame the US? (0)

tbird81 (946205) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925701)

Have you tried to put out an oilfield fire? It's pretty hard.

Why weren't you there protecting the university?

why werent YOU there ? (4, Insightful)

unity100 (970058) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925717)

u.s. invaded, removed iraqi military and police. u.s. army took over in their place.

it was their responsibility to protect those cultural heritages. instead, they protected fucking oil fields.

a few pieces from those museums could buy years' worth of output from any given oil well. they were that important.

Re:why werent YOU there ? (4, Interesting)

Slashdot Assistant (2336034) | more than 2 years ago | (#38926061)

The oil fields had to be protected - you'll no doubt recall what Hussein did when he was forced out of Kuwait? Oil revenues were to provide much of the funding for reconstruction. The allies should have made plans to secure the oil fields and cultural facilities. Iraq has an amazing cultural heritage, that if encouraged, could help provide a basis for a proud nation - not to mention tourism when they stop shooting one another.

Re:Blame the US? (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925955)

Precisely!!! Reading the usual 'Hate-America-first' comments above, one would think that after a day of quiet, CENTCOM encouraged the locals to go and loot their universities & museums, and the locals were only too happy to comply!

It's all in their blood - they do not have the same Western traditions of a respect for higher learning. Look @ them today - despite having elections, they've largely become another Iran, and the local Chaldean population in Northern Iraq has fled, due to religious persecution, to Syria, of all places.

Can we be surprised? (1, Insightful)

slashdyke (873156) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925585)

Can we be surprised? After all, if Iraq did not have, nor was a threat to our (Western) cheap oil, we would not have cared about what happened there.

Re:Can we be surprised? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925595)

Iraq under that dead dictator guy was a threat to Israel. No oil there.

Re:Can we be surprised? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925693)

Yeah, that Saddam guy was a real threat to israel and the world. Just imagine if he started hurling rocks at them, or something.

Stop buying into the bullshit. Saddam was a threat to no one. There were no weapons of mass destruction. In fact, if anything, Saddam was the fulcrum that kept the whole shebang going. He kept Iran in check, he kept Al Qaeda at bay, he kept the whole region under a modicum of stability. Now Iraq is nothing more than a fucking cesspool.

Re:Can we be surprised? (1)

SplashMyBandit (1543257) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925729)

That's right Saddam was a saint. What a crock. Sure, Saddam was not guilty of some of the things that circulate about him - but has was a bad azz. Removing him was a good thing - especially for his own citizens (the numbers killed in the Iraqi Civil War are still less than the numbers killed by Saddam during the Shia Uprising).

Education is a pillar of any modern society (5, Insightful)

msobkow (48369) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925597)

Even in videogames, you can not develop technology to attack or defend your virtual community without taking care of the essentials for your population first: making sure they are fed, clothed, housed, and educated.

The Iraqi universities are not the only victims of a failure to recognize the importance of these social pillars.

The First Nations of Canada have many communities where even those basic needs are not properly managed and delivered to the people.

Heck, the whole COUNTRY of Canada suffers from a government which places an emphasis on imprisoning people for growing plants that the majority of the population wants to see legalized, taxed, and regulated in poll after poll.

Without an educated and comfortable population, a nation has no hope of competing on the global market and being a "real player." Education creates jobs, it creates technology, and it improves the processes of business and society. Even people like Marx recognized that society would evolve into a "communist" or "socialist" state as the people became educated and concerned about more than their own personal needs. (Marx never espoused a revolution such as Russia or China had; he was merely discussing where he saw society evolving to.)

Re:Education is a pillar of any modern society (1)

msobkow (48369) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925609)

I click too quick.

The problem with the Harper Government's emphasis on their omnibus crime legislation is that it's taking away funding from education, retirement plans, and even medicine. It's a seriously screwed up set of priorities that man and our government has about where and how to spend our national and provincial budgets.

Re:Education is a pillar of any modern society (1)

DigitalJanitor (21725) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925629)

Even in videogames, you can not develop technology to attack or defend your virtual community without taking care of the essentials for your population first: making sure they are fed, clothed, housed, and educated.

So videogames are now the measure of morality?

Re:Education is a pillar of any modern society (1)

msobkow (48369) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925639)

A good videogame is as good a model of society as any social studies or economics textbook. They wouldn't be any fun to play if they didn't try to follow the rules of reality, would they?

Maybe we SHOULD make such videogames part of the mandatory education of anyone who wants to be a leader in government at any level.

"Not enough minerals" (1)

tbird81 (946205) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925735)

"You require more vespene gas"

and, sadly, "my life for Aiur!"

Re:Education is a pillar of any modern society (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925777)

Heck, the whole COUNTRY of Canada suffers from a government which places an emphasis on imprisoning people for growing plants that the majority of the population wants to see legalized, taxed, and regulated in poll after poll.

I think you're missing the whole point of legislation in the modern world. It's not to be a "global player" it's about strategic division of labor. If China manufactures, the US writes software, Japan designs machines, Europe controls finances, etc - only the people with access to all of the areas involved have a say over what the Human race does and does not do as a whole. People don't need to be happy, they need to be kept in check such that none can rise to rival the elitists that control the world economy - just look at the UN and the whole outlandish notion that there should be a single world government when even in countries like the US with an incredibly branches hierarchical structure the top level, the federal government, is the cause of virtually all issues the population faces in their daily lives - in spite of having absolutely no benefit outside of providing military security from foreign powers.

Re:Education is a pillar of any modern society (1)

msobkow (48369) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925811)

I don't think things are anywhere near that organized. Nor do I believe any nation is interested in being pigeon-holed in such a fashion. Sure China built it's finances on manufacturing, but they've invested heavily in education, housing, etc. with those monies and are trying to become an innovator, even going so far as to launch their own (effective!) space program.

I don't buy into the theories and paranoia about "The Bilderberg Group", "The Illuminati", or any other "secret society" running the world with any logic or sense. It's all just one big ant hill with a few queens trying to steer the masses in what they see as the "right direction" and meeting in private from time to time to discuss issues that the general population doesn't know about or even want to think about.

Just like your little video game icons, really.

Re:Education is a pillar of any modern society (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925827)

Who gives a shut about the fucking Indians? They don't work, get everything for free, are responsible for a disproportionate level of crime and keep demanding more.

Fuck them, build death camps ala Auschwitz and exterminate every last one of those useless savages.

Cowboys - the epitome of culture? (4, Informative)

G3ckoG33k (647276) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925605)

"While American troops guarded the Ministries of Oil"

That is what happens when you think cowboys are the epitome of culture. Still:

"In the months preceding the 2003 Iraq war, starting in December and January, various antiquities experts, including representatives from the American Council for Cultural Policy asked the Pentagon and the UK government to ensure the museum's safety from both combat and looting. Although promises were not made, U.S. forces did avoid bombing the site. On April 8, 2003 the last of the museum staff left the museum. Iraqi forces engaged U.S. forces from within the museum, as well as the nearby Special Republican Guard compound. Lt. Col. Eric Schwartz of the U.S. third Infantry Division stated that he was unable to enter the compound and secure it since they attempted to avoid returning fire at the building."

"According to museum officials the looters concentrated on the heart of the exhibition: "the Warka Vase, a Sumerian alabaster piece more than 5,000 years old; a bronze Uruk statue from the Acadian period, also 5,000 years old, which weighs 660 pounds; and the headless statue of Entemena. The Harp of Ur was torn apart by looters who removed its gold inlay."[3] Among the stolen artifacts is the Bassetki statue made out of bronze, a life-size statue of a young man, originally found in the village Basitke in the northern part of Iraq, an Acadian piece that goes back to 2300 B.C. and the stone statue of King Schalmanezer, from the eighth century B.C. In addition, the museum's aboveground storage rooms were looted; the exterior steel doors showed no signs of forced entry. Approximately 3,100 excavation site pieces (jars, vessels, pottery shards, etc.) were stolen, of which over 3,000 have been recovered. The thefts did not appear to be discriminating; for example, an entire shelf of fakes was stolen, while an adjacent shelf of much greater value was undisturbed."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Museum_of_Iraq#Damage_and_losses_during_2003_war [wikipedia.org]

I guess these cowboys did what they could to protect the museum, but "forgot" about other parts of culture, like the university library. Protecting that oil must have appeared as more important.

Just goes to prove (1)

DigitalJanitor (21725) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925607)

Just goes to prove that knowledge wants to be free.

Blaming America for Iraqi's failures (0, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925611)

FTFA "Armed militias threatened women who did not cover themselves and intimidated professors who said things they did not like"

Americans did not loot / destroy the Universities, the religious Iraqi's who did not like women/minorities being educated that destroyed them. Iraq today makes enough money from oil to re-build any college / university that is wishes, but it chooses not to.

Iran and the Iraqi's that follow them are much more to blame for the aftermath mess.

Re:Blaming America for Iraqi's failures (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925707)

And 9/11 is not the fault of Al Qaeda, it's 100% the fault of those idiots who decided to be in those towers when the planes hit.

See what I did there? It's amazing how you pigs always manage to justify every single fuck up you do, no matter how bad it is.

Re:Blaming America for Iraqi's failures (1)

AHuxley (892839) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925773)

The problem is all the US officer class gets very very well educated - you don't get to occupy a part of the world to play out "Grozny" in front of the press.
i.e. much international law exists that the USA held up during the cold war with glowing terms about "ensure their security", "educational" and "education of children".
So I guess they got around it via "education of children" and "institutions devoted" is not a university :)

Keep them stupid (2)

spectrokid (660550) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925635)

has done wonders in the past....

U.S. is not to blame. (-1)

Jane Q. Public (1010737) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925637)

The U.S. is to blame for lots of things in regard to Iraq, but that is not one of them.

That is rather like saying that because the police were busy containing an unruly crowd at the Superbowl, they are to blame for looters who broke into businesses elsewhere.

We might question their priorities, but blaming them for the criminal acts of others is just not valid.

Re:U.S. is not to blame. (2, Insightful)

santax (1541065) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925663)

Would this have happened if the USA didn't started this illegal war over some oil? If the anwser is NO (and it is) then we should blame those money-hungry, trigger happy, backward idiots. Those responsible and those who supported it should be brought to justice in The Hague, just like any other warcriminal. But unfortunally our EU goverment are all bought up by those criminals and would rather eat their own kids than do what is right.

Re:U.S. is not to blame. (0, Troll)

SplashMyBandit (1543257) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925753)

Stuff got looted in Iraq with or without a US invasion. I understand you disagree with the reasons for going to war in Iraq but ffs you can't pretend Iraq was a paradise - not by a long way. The US may have bungled the war and left a mess behind, but it is still far far better than if Saddam had of stayed in power. Don't let your antipathy to the US blind you to the reality of what Iraq was actually like and would have remaind if not given an unwelcome (by the ruling Tikriti's; the majority of Iraqis didn't like the US, but actually tolerated them as an end to a means - most of the real trouble came from Sunni-Shia sectarian violence) course-correction this decade.

Re:U.S. is not to blame. (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925987)

"Stuff got looted in Iraq with or without a US invasion."

Excuse me sir, but you don't know what you are talking about. Had Sadam stayed in power more than a MILLION people that is dead would be alive today, the stuff in the museums will be intact instead of traveling Europe or US, and the Universities would be OK.

Iraq was not a paradise, it was a dictatorship and nothing would move without Sadam permission. You removed the power and left a void.

You only cared about stealing their oil, witch was the real reason for the invasion.

Re:U.S. is not to blame. (2, Insightful)

ianare (1132971) | more than 2 years ago | (#38926073)

No, Iraq is worse off now than it was under Saddam. At least under Saddam there was security, basic services, good access to health care, and one of the best education systems in the middle east.

I'm not glorifying the bastard mind you, there were political kidnappings, executions and torture under Saddam. But this hasn't stopped, far from it, there has been an increase in political and ethnic violence, as well as corruption.

In other words, it's better to live under the rule of a ruthless dictator than it is to be "liberated" by the US.

Re:U.S. is not to blame. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925819)

Would this have happened if the USA didn't started this illegal war over some oil?
If the anwser is NO (and it is) then we should blame those money-hungry, trigger happy, backward idiots. Those responsible and those who supported it should be brought to justice in The Hague, just like any other warcriminal. But unfortunally our EU goverment are all bought up by those criminals and would rather eat their own kids than do what is right.

Illegal or no, attempted genocide and mass graves are a justification for war - and Iraq had a lot of them under Saddam.

Re:U.S. is not to blame. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925875)

Illegal or no, attempted genocide and mass graves are a justification for war - and Iraq had a lot of them under Saddam.

I agree. That's why I think U.S.A. should invade North Korea, Ethiopia, Syria and China next.

Re:U.S. is not to blame. (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925715)

As far as international laws are concerned, any (decent / respectable) occupying country is responsible and accountable for the security of the occupied territories / countries. That is the reason Ariel Sharon was indicted in court even though the Sabra and Shatila massacre in Lebanon in 1982 were ordered by Amine Gemayel and conducted by his fundamentalist Christian Militia.

The US is legally responsible for all the security mishaps during the occupation...

Re:U.S. is not to blame. (0)

martin-boundary (547041) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925719)

Nope, it's more like saying that the police attacked indiscriminately and extremely violently a peaceful Superbowl crowd while chasing a single killer hiding at the stadium. When the crowd went apeshit crazy and rioted, it's the police's fault.

Re:U.S. is not to blame. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925765)

The entire reason the US went to the region is to steal oil and make it easier to control the area. Destroying their means of education is a huge step towards that. It makes me sad there are people still blind to reality, but the worst part is you probably vote.

Re:U.S. is not to blame. (2)

ticktickboom (1054594) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925835)

well, the US is to blame. for it not going to war with unwarranted reasoning, it would not have happened. but it wasn't a weapons of mass destruction, it was the whole mid easy. 1 at a time. we had to totally destroy their infrastructure, medical and educational framework, because it was better than ours. like Norton AV from the earlier 80's, a true American company. put your name on things that are not yours, sell things that you did not right, violate every copyright there is, buy the competition out because they are better than you, then throw everything away. a true american company mr norton died when he was about 35 from severe alcoholism, prolly brought on by the stress caused by stealing and underhandedness. tis the american way tho. we couldn't let a 'terrorist' nation have anything better than we do. then again, this stuff happens in war.

Re:U.S. is not to blame. (1)

ianare (1132971) | more than 2 years ago | (#38926055)

The police in your example WOULD be held responsible. If a big sporting event is taking place in a city, you would expect the police to increase their presence. Which, in fact, they do.

Donald Rumsfield (0)

The Grim Reefer (1162755) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925655)

"The images you are seeing on television you are seeing over, and over, and over, and it's the same picture of some person walking out of some building with a vase, and you see it 20 times, and you think, "My goodness, were there that many vases?"

George W. Bush on the Iraq war (1)

chrb (1083577) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925873)

"Free nations are peaceful nations. Free nations don't attack each other. Free nations don't develop weapons of mass destruction."

"You know, one of the hardest parts of my job is to connect Iraq to the war on terror."

"Oh, no, we're not going to have any casualties."

Re:George W. Bush on the Iraq war (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38926121)

That theme that Bush bought from Natan Sharansky - that free nations are peaceful nations - does not apply to Muslim countries. After all, Pakistan, for instance, too has had elections, but a huge portion of their population support the Taliban. In all the 'Arab Spring' countries, dictators of varying ideologies - from pro Western Ben Ali & Mubarak to anti Western Gadaffi - have been overthrown, but in all these countries, people have been voting in Islam. Islamic parties have swept the elections in Tunisia, Egypt & now Kuwait, while in Libya, they are doing what they can to make Shariah their constitution. Once they're done, women would have to go veiled, be subjected to FGMs, marry as young as 9, and men can get back to having 4 wives. Oh, and as far as religious minorities go, the less said, the better - just look @ the plight of Copts in Egypt or Assyrians in iraq.

Connecting Iraq to the war on terror would have been easy, had they not bought into the bs that Islam is a good & peaceful religion, particularly when that was the main motivation behind the 9/11 attacks. Iraq was not tied to 9/11, but they did host terrorists - in the follow-up to the war, the Iraqis gunned down Abu Nidal, who had been sheltered in Iraq all those years. But the prioritization was wrong - it should have started w/ attacks on Afghanistan and Pakistan, and this too, just a major arial campaign, w/ no boots on the ground, but using ICBMs if needed. No need to nuke them, but definitely destroy the entire military infrastruction of both Pakistan and the Taliban. Next should have been Iran, Iraq, Syria & Lebanon - essentially eliminate all nuke sites in any of these countries, and pulverize them until Hizbullah & Islamic Jihad got flattened, and regimes in all 4 countries got overthrown.

However, the place to stop was there - just overthow the regimes, and tell the people there that while they could have whatever government they wanted, if they hosted Jihadis or persecuted minorities - be it Assyrians in Iraq, Zoroastrians in Iran, Alawites or Druze or Maronites in Syria and Lebanon, they'd be attaced again. No US or NATO troops in any of these countries for peacekeeping or worse, nation-building (which is not the job of the US Army. Just a warning that they'd be pulverized again if any of the above behavior happened.

The next should have been the Gulf fanatics - Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Kuwait and Emirates - hold them responsible for 9/11, and oust their regimes, and give them the same warning as above - host jihadis, or ill-treat minorities, and be prepared for a ton of bricks. Oh, and in all the above examples, make it clear to them that if jihadi teachings come out of their mosques, those mosques are toast. No need to repress the populations - let them be free, but if they try starting wars on Israel or anyone else, they'll be flattened again. Oh, and make them take in all the Palis (since there is anyway a labor shortage in the Gulf) and leave the Israelis alone.

Had it all been done this way, the US would actually have fought off the 'War on Terror' (really a 'War on Jihad') w/o much casualities. But that would have necessiated not buying the 'Islam is Great' bullshite!

A fragmented Iraq was desired (1)

AHuxley (892839) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925681)

Dumb, in debt and split.
"Special Report Scientists become targets in Iraq" Nature (29 June 2006)
http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v441/n7097/full/4411036a.html [nature.com]
Then you have the luck that is "Iraqi arms scientists killed before they talk" http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2004/aug/23/20040823-124014-3141r/?page=all [washingtontimes.com]
Someone has been clearing out many Iraqi scientists and intellectuals. Whats left seem to be getting "money went to American universities to do curriculum development".

As usual, US to blame, no accountability (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925699)

This is the result of a corrupt society, or more likely a complete lack of Iraqi identity.
As much as the US bungled Iraq,
In the end of the day it is up to Iraqi citizens to have some sense of social responsibility.
Unless... They don't see themselves as Iraqis. Rather, as self serving sects, based on either family ties or religious beliefs.
We've seen the exact same behavior in the so called Arab spring in Egypt.
Although the destruction of historical artifacts in the case of Egypt is deliberate -
the memory of Egypts non Islamic history must be eradicated,
some extremists have openly called for the destruction of the pyramids.
The Arab world is now undergoing an orgy of violence and vendetta, per the Iraqi model.
the US only sped up the process by throwing it's allies under the bus. Nothing more.

Re:As usual, US to blame, no accountability (1)

AHuxley (892839) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925825)

So your in Iraq and take some "social responsibility" on the phone or as a local ...
The phones are all signals intelligence to the USA, meetings of locals would be infiltrated or seen as real defiance.
So expect a day or night raid and then a nice trip to meet new people from around the world in smaller and small rooms.
"Social responsibility" really fits with the role of the Occupying Power.

10 years of war (1)

mapkinase (958129) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925713)

10 years of war, and that's what you are worrying about?

People kill each other in dozens and hundreds at one moment, in tens of thousands over time.

Good work, /.

Re:10 years of war (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925951)

Ten years of war? What are you talking about? The United States hasn't been at war for almost seventy years - since the end of World War II.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Declaration_of_war_by_the_United_States

Vat '69 (1)

BeerCur (627281) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925739)

"I have every confidence in my scrounging abilities, and I have a case of Vat '69 hidden in your footlocker. " Smarft and/or connected people will find a way. in the Internet era.

tired of this kind of news (1)

zugedneb (601299) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925743)

if all the student had muscles, knew kung fu, and had some kalashnikovs, they could defend what is worth defending...

take the lessons of history, and learn to fight, u lazy weak coward fucking civilians, so that u don't have to depend on mercenaries or goodwill...

So it's the US's Fault Again?? Really?? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925887)

The U.S. had to get the infrastructure going first, the water, power plants, hospitals. The resources for protecting the universities, libraries and museums were just not there. Ask any Iraq vet and quit trying to pin everything on the U.S.

GW Bush (5, Interesting)

Required Snark (1702878) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925893)

Has everyone forgotten that the goal of the Iraq war was to get access to their oil? (And get revenge for the first Gulf War.) It was never about "weapons of mass destruction". The warmongers who came in with Bush (i.e. Cheney and his crew) were calling to overthrow Hussein the entire time Bill Clinton was in office. This is all well documented, even if it was never reported in the main stream press.

So Iraq was supposed to be a push over, and the US was going to install a puppet government that would do what the US oil cartel wanted. This would be a counterbalance to Saudi oil power. Remember Bush and Cheney are both originally oil men, and they wanted to go back to the "good old days" of western dominance of Middle Eastern oil production.

There was no planning about anything except securing the oil resources. They made no plans about securing any civil society, not just the schools. They didn't even have a real plan to secure any weapons, or even the known stockpiles of uranium ore (yellow cake) that Iraq had obtained. Access to weapons was one of the things that made the following civil war so bloody, and made it hard for the occupation forces to restore order.

All the top military US military leaders left right after the collapse of the Hussein regime because they knew that it was going to be a disaster, and they didn't want their legacy to be associated with the resulting fuckup. Something like half the administrators who went over in the first wave to try and restore some kind of government did not have passports! They had never been outside the US. A sizable chunk were people who had worked for the Bush/Cheney election campaign and had no relevant experience. In short, completely clueless.

The winner on all of this has been Iran. Their regional power and influence in the Arab world has increased dramatically. A lot of the weapons that were looted during the lawless fall of Iraq ended up in Iran, by the way. Meanwhile, the US has been mauled by asymmetrical warfare in both Iran and Afghanistan. They win, we loose. The unexpected result that thwarted Iran has been the Arab Spring, specifically the near civil war in Syria. Otherwise they are well on their way to being the dominant Gulf power. They may still come out on top.

So here is the bonus question: Why has GW Bush been the invisible man during the current presidential campaign? The US withdrew combat troops from Iran and Bush's name never came up. That's like talking about the US Civil War without talking about Lincoln, or WWII without FDR or Churchill or Stalin. You would expect that he would be asked about the end of the conflict he started. We get nothing.

Now the press is all over the perceived weakness of the Republican contenders. It would be reasonable for someone in the press to ask the last elected Republican candidate, even if all they got was a "no comment". Again, nothing. When the Republicans scream about how Obama hasn't fixed the economy, no one, Democrat or Republican talks about how the Bush administration screwed it all up. Remember TARP and it's bailout were authorized when Bush was still in office. If you look at the press accounts, it's like our economic mess fell from the sky without human intervention.

I'm wondering what will happen during the Republican convention. Will Bush show up? Whoever the nominee is, do you think they want to be seen with Bush on stage? It would be like being endorsed by Charlie Manson. If Bush is a no show, will the press ignore the non-event? I assume that McCain will be there, and Palin will get some air time, so how could they not talk about Bush?

The disappearance of GW Bush is emblematic of the memory hole that now dominates US political discourse. We don't need the complexities of New Speak or the Ministry of Truth. Collective amnesia in the media is so much more effective.

Mission accomplished (1, Insightful)

overshoot (39700) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925897)

It's all a matter of priorities. And like water and power systems, there really wasn't much profit to be made from universities.

why would they do that? (1)

issicus (2031176) | more than 2 years ago | (#38925907)

It seems kind of odd stealing public property, but I guess it wasnt really public it was Saddams. Maybe they were trying to help tear down the regime.

Arabs (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925923)

are a low-IQ NAM race, so there's no point in trying to educate them.

This is what happens when you're an inbred, low-IQ cesspool of genetic diseases.

America is a WMD (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38925941)

How quickly people forget. The US should never have invaded in the first place. It had nothing to do with 9/11 and all to do with being seen to be doing something. I predicted before Bush was elected that he would be off to war with any excuse. In this case it was those non existent WMDs. The country is now a basket case and yes it's America's fault. Yes they inflicted massive destruction. With all the wrong reasons, immoral actions (torture etc.), death and destruction they have just made more enemies. Why do people feel they have to vote for one of two parties (or none) that are funded by corporations (military included)? Why doesn't the US have a green party of any significance? If so many are religious in America, what happened to the commandment thou salt not kill? What about love your enemy? Forgiveness? The US has spent so much money on war and locking people up instead of positive things its no wonder they are going broke.

What also went missing (1)

hellop2 (1271166) | more than 2 years ago | (#38926025)

Were the western friendly college kids who could safely walk down the streets before we invaded.... for what reason again?

Not the US' fault (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38926031)

A bunch of Iraqis destroyed some stuff in Iraq, and now some retards want to blame it on the US. No, that does not follow.

The decay has more to do with the emigration (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38926033)

The decay has more to do with the emigration of thousands of scientists who don't want live in a country where bombs explode all the time and many people don't know how to earn their living, besides from stealing and robbing. horstfx

who (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38926053)

gives a romeo alpha about these camel jockeys - the middle east is a vermin-filled pus hole and can rot; btw, it's a win-win watching them blow themselves up

Bullshit? Never blame the looters and other scum (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#38926105)

Why is it the losers of the world always attack the winners? It wasn't the U.S., it was the Iraqi scum that stole, raped, burned, and acted like a muslim turd from a pig.

Not Popular (1)

craigminah (1885846) | more than 2 years ago | (#38926135)

I know this won't be popular opinion, but I believe war should be horrific enough for people to want to avoid it at all costs. Fighting wars where every civilian death or collateral damage report is posted in the news makes people object to the "senseless violence" but I believe that prolongs the war itself. Fighting wars in a civilized manner only prolongs them...anyone remember Star Trek's "A Taste of Armageddon"? Same idea but they took it a little further... (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Taste_of_Armageddon)
Load More Comments
Slashdot Account

Need an Account?

Forgot your password?

Don't worry, we never post anything without your permission.

Submission Text Formatting Tips

We support a small subset of HTML, namely these tags:

  • b
  • i
  • p
  • br
  • a
  • ol
  • ul
  • li
  • dl
  • dt
  • dd
  • em
  • strong
  • tt
  • blockquote
  • div
  • quote
  • ecode

"ecode" can be used for code snippets, for example:

<ecode>    while(1) { do_something(); } </ecode>
Create a Slashdot Account

Loading...