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Canada's Conservatives Misled Voters With Massive Robocall Operation

timothy posted more than 2 years ago | from the now-that's-offsides dept.

Canada 401

choongiri writes "Elections Canada has just traced thousands of illegal phone calls made during the 2011 federal election to a company that worked for the Conservative Party across the country. The automated VOIP 'robocalls' appeared to be designed to stop non-Conservative voters from casting ballots in key ridings by falsely telling voters that the location of their polling stations had changed, causing them to go to the wrong location on election day. This news casts serious doubt on the legitimacy of Canada's Government. The Conservatives narrowly won their 'majority' by 6,201 votes in 14 ridings, with only 39% of the popular vote." For those as unfamiliar with the term "riding" in this context as I was, here's Wikipedia's explanation.

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Anonymous coward misled mods with FP (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160363)

-1, you can't handle the truth.

Just wow (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160367)

Wow

So... (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160375)

Show of hands, how many people on election day were going to vote but couldn't find their station?

More disturbingly... (5, Informative)

iCEBaLM (34905) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160381)

Some calls apparently were from people claiming to be with the Liberal party, acting rude, calling at very late/early hours, in an attempt to cause people who said they supported the Liberal party to not vote for them. These calls happened in multitudes of ridings (districts for you yanks) including Etobicoke Centre where the Conservative candidate won by only 26 votes. [www.cbc.ca]

Re:More disturbingly... (5, Insightful)

gl4ss (559668) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160429)

wtf?

surely some jailtime is in order? shouldn't be _that_ hard to figure out where the calls originated from(someone paid for them in some form.. even if they were done with skype-out or whatever).

sincerely some guy.

Re:More disturbingly... (4, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160607)

Perhaps Crimeminister Harper can be the first guest in the new superjails.
Tough on crime. Remember that phrase, Cons.

Re:More disturbingly... (5, Insightful)

davester666 (731373) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160641)

hahahahaha.

Like what happened in the states, like in Florida, where dead people just happen pop out of the grave and vote, or where primarily Democrat-voting districts just happen to get robocalled with the wrong date, time and/or location to vote [or that you need a passport and multiple other forms of picture ID to vote].

As long as the entire voting process, as well as the government in general, is under the direct control of the political parties that are permitted to run, every so-called 'investigation' will continue to result in...nothing happening.

This is currently an issue. (5, Interesting)

SolemnLord (775377) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160695)

So far one staffer [www.cbc.ca] has resigned as the allegations have landed, in what appears to be a case of falling-on-the-sword-itis. The scale of the scandal is actually pretty massive. As TFA points out, these calls have been confirmed to appear in 18 ridings, and others are being suspected. In those 18 ridings, the calls only hit households that were waffling Liberal (as per recent polling).

What this means is that someone had to plan the calls, get the party affiliation information on these 18 ridings (at least), hire RackNine, hire a bilingual voice actor, and see everything through. The likelihood of one person pulling all this off is next to nil, and it doesn't help that the Conservative party has a (rightly deserved) reputation for bullying and playing dirty pool with the rules.

And since it's going to come up, the Conservative Party of Canada is actually the result of a merger between two separate parties: the original Progressive Conservatives, who were the centre-right answer to the Liberal's centre-left, and the Canadian Alliance-née-Reform party, the country's (relatively)-far-right party. Prime Minister Harper was previously a member of the Canadian Alliance, and it's safe to say that his view, regardless of his party's, doesn't represent the overwhelming majority of Canadians. He's not all bad, but I will throw a party he is unceremoniously dumped from the Canadian political scene.

Re:This is currently an issue. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160723)

Resignation in politics is typically a get out of jail free card.

It is, but it still means Harper would be out. (1)

SolemnLord (775377) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160749)

And that also means that The Harper Government [thestar.com] would also be out.

Re:This is currently an issue. (4, Informative)

QuantumLeaper (607189) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160871)

Not for my States (in the USA) last two former Governors who have been convicted, one is a guest of the federal pen and the other is headed that way next month. So resigning will not always get you out of jail. If you figured out which State, it easy, it is the one that the President is from....

Re:This is currently an issue. (3, Interesting)

quantaman (517394) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160783)

And since it's going to come up, the Conservative Party of Canada is actually the result of a merger between two separate parties: the original Progressive Conservatives, who were the centre-right answer to the Liberal's centre-left, and the Canadian Alliance-née-Reform party, the country's (relatively)-far-right party. Prime Minister Harper was previously a member of the Canadian Alliance, and it's safe to say that his view, regardless of his party's, doesn't represent the overwhelming majority of Canadians. He's not all bad, but I will throw a party he is unceremoniously dumped from the Canadian political scene.

I've always felt the Harper was one of the only things keeping the Conservatives in check, and the reason for his somewhat authoritarian style is that a lot of his MPs are pretty far off the deep end so he needs to keep them under reign.

I very much doubt the plan was all Sona's doing, though I don't believe that Harper is to blame.

Re:This is currently an issue. (5, Interesting)

SolemnLord (775377) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160879)

I've always felt the Harper was one of the only things keeping the Conservatives in check, and the reason for his somewhat authoritarian style is that a lot of his MPs are pretty far off the deep end so he needs to keep them under reign.

I agree and I disagree. Harper certainly had to keep his MPs in check, but that seemed to matter more when he was running a minority government than now. You didn't hear a peep out of the fringe MPs up until the Conservatives had a majority. Without the need to appeal to Canadian moderates who would have voted for the Liberals otherwise, Harper is showing less interest in holding back the fringe MPs, and more interested in ramming his legislation down our throats. It was practical intra-party authoritarianism.

As for who might be responsible, I started writing up things and realized that I was probably sounding paranoid. I think that the Nixon comparisons [theglobeandmail.com] being made in the Globe & Mail are warranted, but I admit I could be wrong, too.

Re:More disturbingly... (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160715)

The fine on the books for this kind of thing is a mere $5000. Just a cost of doing business for the corrupt cons.

Re:More disturbingly... (4, Interesting)

Muros (1167213) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160845)

Not just jail time. Make them pay for the cost. All of it. Re-run the election in constituencies where this happened, and make the culprits pay the cost. And time & travel expenses for those who spent time driving about to the wrong places. $60 an hour and $0.50 per mile sounds fair to me.

Re:More disturbingly... (5, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160445)

Solution: Ban all robocalls and livecalls for election purposes! I am sure that Canadian would benefit from this.

Re:More disturbingly... (4, Insightful)

MightyMartian (840721) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160599)

Someone who is willing to break the law to try to fix the vote isn't likely going to care about any other law. Properly, the law should be written so that if any malfeasance like this is proven, the election results are vacated and a new election run.

Re:More disturbingly... (1)

ShieldW0lf (601553) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160613)

If this is true, it is time to start hanging people. Law or not law.

Re:More disturbingly... (2)

Guppy06 (410832) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160645)

The calls were already illegal, hence the investigation.

Re:More disturbingly... (5, Insightful)

TheRaven64 (641858) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160727)

The problem is not that these things are legal - they aren't - it's that the risk/reward ratio is wrong. If you cheat and win, then you get to run the country. If you get caught, you get a slap on the wrist.

Re:More disturbingly... (2, Insightful)

Fluffeh (1273756) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160451)

Some calls apparently were from people claiming to be with the Liberal party, acting rude, calling at very late/early hours

Interesting, it seems like more and more of the world population is wanting more libertarian, open minded, moderate type leaders - rather than the old guard, which to me seem to be in the exact same place as the likes of the **AA in the music world - grasping and clutching at grains of sand as they trickle through their fingers. As they get more and more desperate, their methods and tactics get more and more dirty, desperate and despickable.

Re:More disturbingly... (1)

Mashiki (184564) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160617)

What's odd about this is, the paid calling card is apparently from Quebec. But this guy is from Alberta? Did he drive across the country or something to get it. I also seem to remember this guy doing work for the liberals a few years ago too.

Re:More disturbingly... (1)

mcneely.mike (927221) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160693)

And these are the same people who want to pass a bill allowing warrantless internet information...
they wonder why there has been such a fight against them.

Power corrupts... the attempts to gain more power corrupt absolutely.

Legitimacy? (1)

AdamJS (2466928) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160383)

They're the Corporate-Regressive party, our own home-grown copy of American neoliberal parties like the GOP. No real Canadian actually thinks they are legitimate.

Re:Legitimacy? (4, Insightful)

jc42 (318812) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160543)

No real Canadian actually thinks they are legitimate.

So what percentage of the Canadian population are "real", and what percentage are fake?

I suppose I'm neither, since I'm not a Canadian. I was born about 50 miles south of the border. But, as the saying goes, some of my best friends are Canadian. I'd like to know how to figure out if they're real or fake.

Re:Legitimacy? (1)

mcneely.mike (927221) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160717)

I'd like to know how to figure out if they're real or fake.

Give 'em a real good feel... yeah, baby, that's the spot. I AM (a real) CANADIAN!

Re:Legitimacy? (4, Informative)

DesScorp (410532) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160563)

They're the Corporate-Regressive party, our own home-grown copy of American neoliberal parties like the GOP. No real Canadian actually thinks they are legitimate.

Is this a variation of the "No True Scotsman" argument?

Re:Legitimacy? (1)

newcastlejon (1483695) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160619)

Is this a variation of the "No True Scotsman" argument?

Perhaps. Just plain wrong is more likely. If no-one thinks the C-R party are legitimate then who voted for them (majority or not)?

Re:Legitimacy? (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160745)

Low vote rates actually.

The only province that did not vote Conservative was Quebec because we saw through his lies (and frankly, between the canadian DMCA, his worthless "Quebec is a nation only if it's in Canada" motion and his anti-democratic statement of:"as long as we are in power, Quebec will never seperate from Canada" (never mind that a provincial referendum is... well... provincial mater).

Oh and bonus (here comes the rant):
Since he gained his majority, Harper did the following:Pissing on French(Nominating an unilingual juge), Pissing on French(Nominating a english/italian communication head for his office), Pissing on French(Nominating an unilingual General Auditor... note: General Auditor of Canada has for MANDATORY requirement: Must speak english AND french), Pissing on Quebec(Replacing the painting from a Quebec artist with the Queen's Face), Pissing on Quebec(Royal navy, Royal Infantry, Royal pain in the ass), Pissing on Quebec(Forcing us to pay the cost of the Queen's birthday), Pissing on democracy(Lawful Access), Pissing on democracy(Using his powers to limit the discussion on every laws he pass... said power are supposed to be used only in extreme circumstance), Pissing on everybody(greenpeace is a terrorist organisation according to him), Pissing on democracy(if your against Keystone XL then your a traitor). There's others (like pissing on common sense: Making an omnibus law on crime(that looks like something you would find in Texas) that pushes 100% of the cost to the provinces and calling it "Though on Crime".

If there's ONE danger on canada's oh so sacred unity it's him, Hell even Piere Elliot Trudeau's son(PET was the guy that brought to Canada the stupid notion of Multi-culturalism, he was also the guy that pissed on Democracy and on Quebec by declaring marshal law and getting illegitimate data on the PQ back in the 70s) said that he might actually support seperating Quebec from Canada if Harper transform Canada in a cross-breed between China, USA and Orwell's Ociania...

PS: sorry for the rant... I really need to make a vlog for that thing :p

Re:Legitimacy? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160785)

Low vote rates? Even if 10% of Harper's votes were fake, a third of the voters voted for him. Most winners of elections in western countries get less than that.

Re:Legitimacy? (1)

Ardeaem (625311) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160835)

They're the Corporate-Regressive party, our own home-grown copy of American neoliberal parties like the GOP. No real Canadian actually thinks they are legitimate.

Is this a variation of the "No True Scotsman" argument?

No, because it wasn't an argument. It's a statement which is obviously meant to communicate the poster's view of what Canadian values are.

Vote for Cthulhu! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160385)

... at least he admits he's evil.

Re:Vote for Cthulhu! (1)

Midnight Thunder (17205) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160415)

... at least he admits he's evil.

I would, but he doesn't have a local representative.

To tell you the truth, although probably not as bad, some of the conservative government's behaviour remind over a certain 20th century German leader prior to him getting into power and duping his own people - the initials are AH. Maybe I am being a little over-reactive, but some of what Harper is doing disturbs me.

Re:Vote for Cthulhu! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160423)

You are right, you are over reacting. Killing 6 million jews is a lot worse.

Re:Vote for Cthulhu! (1)

sjames (1099) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160495)

That didn't happen until after the whole brownshirt thing.

Re:Vote for Cthulhu! (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160497)

Strange though it might seem, he didn't rise to power by killing 6 million jews. That happened once absolute power was in his hands.

Maybe the current world leaders rising to power using similar tactics won't embark on genocide, but that doesn't make what they're doing any less wrong.

Hitler was not the most evil man in history. He was just one of many, many evil men. There were plenty before him, there have been and will be plenty after him.

Re:Vote for Cthulhu! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160529)

"Killing 17 million people is a lot worse." FTFY

Not so fast there... (0)

owenferguson (521762) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160823)

Canadian Genocide is, in some ways, worse than the Nazis. Harper is just the latest figurehead propping up the genocidal, colonial regime for HRH Liz II: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6637396204037343133 [google.com]

Re:Not so fast there... (1)

_DangerousDwarf (210835) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160875)

Wow, Godwins law was proven right again super fast.

owenferguson, you sir, are a moron.

Re:Vote for Cthulhu! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160811)

Anyone who invites Godwin is over-reacting.

US voters must pay a $2 E-voting card fee but you (2, Interesting)

Joe_Dragon (2206452) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160393)

US voters must pay a $2 E-voting card fee but you can save $1 buying that card at this site (put scam site hear) we take pay pal and all major credit cards.

Don't delay pay now and avoid the $10 on site fee.

Typical (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160411)

Tories. They're the same world over.

Re:Typical (1)

newcastlejon (1483695) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160659)

Politicians. They're the same world over.

As much as I object to Tories I felt the need to FTFY.

My gran used to say "Son, the problem with politics in this country is that only politicians get into it."

Re:Typical (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160863)

By same, do you mean winning elections?

Blame Canada (1)

CrackedButter (646746) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160413)

Why isn't this in the mainstream news?

Re:Blame Canada (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160425)

Which mainstream? TFA is in a mainstream Canadian newspaper.

Re:Blame Canada (2)

tw (66899) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160427)

Read a Canadian newspaper (web or paper) or watch tv. Been in the main stream media for a couple of days.

Re:Blame Canada (1)

CrackedButter (646746) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160865)

Sorry I meant in my country, the UK, the one which shares a figurehead with Canada. I thought it would be top news here other than what the Sun on Sunday is going to look like tomorrow with Amanda Holden on the front cover!

Re:Blame Canada (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160433)

It's all over the mainstream news in Canada...

Re:Blame Canada (2)

tixxit (1107127) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160471)

The fine article is in the National Post. I'm not a huge fan, but that is certainly mainstream. Also, it was mostly known the Conservatives were behind this when the news broke around election time. That EC has now found some more evidence isn't too surprising. However, I'm sure they'll not get enough evidence to actually do anything about it.

Re:Blame Canada (4, Interesting)

Bieeanda (961632) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160483)

American mainstream news generally doesn't give a shit about international events unless it involves celebrities, celebrities dying, normal people dying en masse, or distant places that the government claims to be warring with or policing. Canadian politics simply aren't worth column inches, unless it directly affects the States or the media's ability to follow a story.

Re:Blame Canada (2)

theheadlessrabbit (1022587) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160539)

Why isn't this in the mainstream news?

Not only is the National Post a mainstream Canadian paper (one of the big 3 - The Toronto Star, the Globe and Mail, and the National Post) but the National Post is the most conservative of the three.

Imagine the Star's take on this!

Wow ... now that's some dirty politics (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160443)

Looks like we have room to improve in our own game of a--hole politics. Kudos to the Conservative Party of Canada for taking douchebaggery to a new height. I for one am looking forward to 2AM robocalls from A-mericans S-ingularly S-upporting H-elping O-bama L-ead E-lections to not be a useless lazy bastard and go vote for Obama at my new interstate voting station.

Perish the thought. (5, Insightful)

Bieeanda (961632) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160447)

This is also the government who prorogued parliament in order to head off a legal inquiry into some of their other shenanigans-- which, had it gone through, could very well have been a scandal of historic proportions.

They also made significant changes to the election system and advertised it poorly, several years ago. You Americans in the audience might be familiar with this sort of tactic: requiring forms of identification that younger and poorer voters were less likely to have, in the name of combating electoral fraud. I worked the polls that year and it was a real goddamn treat explaining to people from all walks of life that they couldn't vote because they didn't bring the right ID. Some came back later. Some didn't. The whole thing was an awful bottleneck.

Re:Perish the thought. (3, Interesting)

SuricouRaven (1897204) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160487)

There are lots of tricks. Another good one was allegedly used to advantage GW in his first presidential election in Florida - manipulating polling booth allocations. Districts likely to vote democratic were given insufficient polling stations, resulting in around-the-block queues and long journeys to discourage voters. Nothing was really shown conclusively though, as in this case deliberately trying to influence the outcome would be indistinguishable from plain old screw-the-poor-districts mismanagement.

Re:Perish the thought. (2)

517714 (762276) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160761)

Nothing was shown conclusively, but it sure is fun to dredge up old innuendo. How about this one? In Chicago (Bill Daley's hometown), which used the same machines that Daley condemned so vociferously in Florida and which have shown to have a voter error rate of several percent (people carelessly voting for someone other than the intended candidate) in nine of fifty Wards the Republicans got less than 2% of the vote [chicagoelections.com] , and in many precincts [chicagoelections.com] , it was 0% which is statistically very unlikely. But we all know that Chicagoans are simply more careful than the rest of the nation.

Re:Perish the thought. (5, Informative)

realityimpaired (1668397) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160621)

This is also a government that was found guilty of contempt for parliament shortly before the last election... the first time *any* british parliamentary system has *ever* been found guilty of that, since the introduction of the british parliamentary system almost 1000 years ago. By rights, Harper should have been in jail during the last election, not on the campaign trail.

Re:Perish the thought. (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160721)

Name fits the post. You do realize political showboating is exactly what is is right? And you do realize that it was over the NDP and Liberals refusal to come to agreement over the budget. Yay let's run like the US, and not ...oh never mind.

Even more disturbingly (4, Funny)

strathconaman (539781) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160449)

There hasn't been a government elected by the majority of Canadians since 1949! In fact I remember a government that publicly stated they would abolish a national sales tax and then didn't! That same government lasted for 7 years, through two elections, never getting more than 41% of the vote! Shocking I tell you. Just shocking.

Re:Even more disturbingly (4, Insightful)

ceoyoyo (59147) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160479)

Canadians don't elect governments. They elect representatives. If more Canadians figured that out, we'd have much better governments.

Re:Even more disturbingly (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160623)

Canadians don't vote for parties, they vote them out.

Re:Even more disturbingly (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160585)

Hasn't been a government elected by the majority of Americans for some time either. Not only is it not shocking, it should be expected. Any individual gets one vote. But as more people vote, that individual's one vote becomes less and less valuable because it confers less and less of a voice in the voting process. So less people do it.

Re:Even more disturbingly (0)

owenferguson (521762) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160861)

What's more, there hasn't been a legitimate governing body in Canada since 1931 when the colonial provisional government was dissolved ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statute_of_Westminster_1931 [wikipedia.org] ) and the provinces were granted the right to convene an assembly of first ministers and establish a federation. Instead, they didn't do so, and everyone kept play-acting that the decaying vestiges of the military government were the de jure government. They're not, although they continue to act as the de facto government. Technically, from a constitutional legality point of view, Canada has been in a state of anarchy since Dec. 11, 1931. The "Government of Canada" is just the biggest, best-organized syndicate playing out its own perverted whims in this lawless and ungoverned northern wasteland. Of course, they don't teach anyone that in the syndicate-run schools, so most people (except some die-hard Quebec Nationalists) have no idea...

A great example of biast in the media (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160455)

The legitimacy is not in question. The robocalls alegedly occured in 2-3 ridings and were targeting liberal voters.
I seriously doubt that they affected the number of seats that the liberals got.
Also of note the tories have 60 more seats than the NDP the party with the next most seats.

The handling of this story in the media is a great example of how slanted the media is in this country. When the sponsership scandal came out the media was very slow to judge, instead calling for a wait and see attitude untill all the facts came out.
Whenever the Tories sneeze on the other hand, it is irrefutable proof of thier corruption and how they're destroying the country.

Re:A great example of biast in the media (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160491)

So, some illegal calls are just fine, then. And the media is being biased when they report about them.

I can't believe we have to debate this.

Re:A great example of biast in the media (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160647)

This is exactly the mindset that pushes the Tories to continually break the law.

Re:A great example of biast in the media (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160661)

Come on, even Sun Media and the National Post aren't being particularly charitable towards the Conservatives about this. And about Toews' privacy bill. And about Peter MacKay's using military personnel to conduct investigations for politics' sake. Hopefully they come down on the crime bill soon.

Serious, but the governement is legit either way (2, Insightful)

evilcoop (65814) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160459)

It is a stretch to say that this "casts serious doubt on the legitimacy of Canada's Government'. It is disturbing and not inside baseball.

However, the government needs 154 seats to form a majority in the 308 seat lower house and it has 165, an 11 seat margin. Even if they lost all 14 of these narrowly contested ridings, they would still have had a minority government.

How many were fooled by these calls? Certainly some were, even hundreds might have been. But enough to flip more than one or two seats the other way? I doubt it.

Re:Serious, but the governement is legit either wa (5, Insightful)

ceoyoyo (59147) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160519)

There's a big difference between a minority and a majority government. And who's to say what the effect was? There was large scale elections fraud by the party that won the election, thus, their right to govern is in question. Even if no ridings were swayed, whoever was involved violated the elections act and, if they were elected, are in office illegally.

Re:Serious, but the governement is legit either wa (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160667)

No, once they are seated, they are legally in office. End of story. Especially since it has yet to be proven that anyone of importance in the parties election machine knew of this. It is likely the actions of a couple of renegades.

Personally, I think it unlikely that even a single seat would have flipped as a result of this. Chances of 11 seats flipping? Approaching zero. You go where your voter card says to go. A simple rule. Very few would be fooled by this.

Re:Serious, but the governement is legit either wa (5, Insightful)

Theleton (1688778) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160545)

Illegal methods can undermine the legitimacy of a government even if they weren't ultimately responsible for winning the election. Just ask Richard Nixon.

Re:Serious, but the governement is legit either wa (2)

Johann Lau (1040920) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160787)

I'd say it simply means any and all people involved in this, and knowingly approving of it, are simply not fit to do ANY sort of governing in any democracy. This also goes for those who cover them.

Until you followed those vectors you don't even know how much of the conservative party is left (and what exist cannot govern period). If those vectors aren't followed, what does it say about Canada's claim to being a democracy?

No honour in Canadian politics (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160463)

There hasn't been a shred of honour in Canadian politics for years. There has been money in brown envelopes passed under tables, secret backroom deals, underhanded smear campaigns. But absolutely no honour at all.

How about a recall of even a single Con. MP? Could we get enough Canadians to do that? Would that do anything at all?

and I thought the US was getting shady politics (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160509)

The conservative party has always felt to me, to be the bend over forward type of party when it comes to the US. The Liberals, not much better.
I'm posting anonymously because I'm afraid of where the north american governments are heading. Between police riots during the G8, (that's right police rioting on people), the G8 being held in a major populated area... who's bright idea was that! and the crackdown on Internet and IP rights. I think the conservative party is being bought up by corporate greed and paid off.

Not utterly off-topic (3, Interesting)

rbrander (73222) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160517)

Our fine Conservative party is working as designed, nothing new to report. It's funny the crap that people will put up with - obvious lies about war, torture, electoral fraud - once they've decided one party is 'tough' and well-organized and the other are hapless fools. As Hunter Thompson said in '72, there are only two real parties, the Winners and Losers. And people would rather go with a Winner than with Honest. (Also, the Liberals have been spiraling downwards since they were clearly convicted - in the public mind and indeed in a few court cases - with brazen corruption about using public money for their own adverts. They haven't done their time in exile yet, so we're kind of stuck with the Conservatives.)

But my Not Utterly Off-Topic factoid is that "riding" is not the only thing that has vanished in England but survives in Canada. I was looking up the "Sheriff of Nottingham" once and wondered how "Sheriff" had translated from the 1100's to a western lawman. Turns out it's a slurring of "Shire Reeve", where "Reeve" was the commoner that kept order, provided public services, and collected taxes on behalf of the nobleman that owned the shire. It mentioned that "Reeve" survives today only in small Canadian municipalities that aren't big enough to call the head a "Mayor".

What do you name this scandal? (1)

teknx (2547472) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160521)

Wow Canada, I didn't know you had it in you. You have to give them kudos for the creativity at least. They didn't go with the ol' rigging voting machines gag. A+ for creativity. If the Canadian media hasn't given a name to this debacle yet, I'd like to propose RoboGate. Shall we vote on it?

Re:What do you name this scandal? (1)

YesIAmAScript (886271) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160625)

Canada doesn't use voting machines for these elections. You mark an X in a box on a sheet of paper.

Re:What do you name this scandal? (1)

Runefox (905204) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160707)

Sure, but just as a friendly reminder, Elections Canada has moved the polling station to a deserted highway high up in the Yukon.

Not to say it's right (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160537)

Not to say it's right; but this is the right wing MO for election fraud. In the USA, the left wing prefers to register illegal voters (felons, non-citizens) or dead people. You see, the left is "progressive" and wants to extend voting rights to everybody. The right is conservative and wants to reduce voting rights. I bet it's no different in Canada. How many frozen popsicles and husky dogs voted for the other party?

Canadian political system is broken... (1)

blahplusplus (757119) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160551)

... in canada. It's using a massively out-dated first past the post system while others use proportional representation. The country has been a two party liberal/con dictatorship for a long time and the elites like it that way. There is very little difference between how liberals and conservatives enact policy. Both govern from the right. Mots Canadians sadly are just as stupid as their american counterparts. In fact a majority of Canadians don't even know how parliament works. Voting today is a mere exercise in corporate marketing and branding then in anything else.

I'd say most modern government structures in the 21st century are obsolete because of what science has discovered about the human mind.

http://bit.ly/dYaWUc [bit.ly]

Re:Canadian political system is broken... (3, Insightful)

Nemyst (1383049) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160869)

I'd have agreed before, but not now. If you can't see the difference between Harper and any Liberal, you have to be blind.

A New Election (4, Interesting)

whisper_jeff (680366) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160553)

I strongly hope this leads to a new election (with very strict oversight). Clearly the last election was tampered with in such a way that the outcome was altered, thus a new election is needed. While I hate elections, I hate knowing a party wrongly gained power even more.

Re:A New Election (1)

Guppy06 (410832) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160651)

I strongly hope this leads to a new election

Canada's already been having a new election every two weeks or so.

Re:A New Election (2)

suomynonAyletamitlU (1618513) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160833)

I strongly hope this leads to criminal investigations and long jailtime.

I'd be rather offended if anyone didn't hope for the same.

So glad our country keeps making the home page (4, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160571)

Unfortunately, I'm less glad the subject seems to keep being our Harper Government(tm) doing some technologically backwards (ACTA, the C-60 DRM bill, the C-30 internet spying bill). And now they've descended into outright voter fraud - having inherited the other sleazeball methods of US right-wing politics (attack ads, stupid "tough of crime" policies, etc.)

I hope a number of people go to jail for a long, long time over this. From what we can tell, this occurred in dozens of ridings including a number that Conservatives only won by less than 100 votes. The Cons have thrown one staffer under the bus (incidentally, he was caught trying to grab a box of ballots and run out of a polling station as well last year, but yet, managed to stay employed with the party) - but there is no way he could've gotten all the voter info and done this on such a wide scale.

Personally, I hope that the RCMP gets involved, pulls the logs from the robocall company, and each and every seat won by the Conservatives where cheating was involved is recalled. Yeah, it'll be expensive - but so is three more years of these Nixonian, Stasi-like unethical dirt bags in office.

The only robocalls I got were from the NDP. (1)

aristotle-dude (626586) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160603)

I have never voted for the NDP but I kept on getting propaganda from them presumably because the previous tenant was presumably an ardent supporter. At two different occasions, I received robocalls informing me that I was about to be placed in a conference call with the local NDP candidate around dinner time and I had a hell of a time getting the phone to hang up as it kept on calling me back when I put down the receiver.

This is why religion should not be in govt. (4, Insightful)

wisebabo (638845) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160609)

Unfortunately we, in the states (and many other countries?) have also seen this sort of thing.

The Ohio elections were tainted by claims of electronic voting irregularities (don't know what became of that) and I believe several republican operatives have been convicted of similar phone hacking activities. I could go on about the hypocrisy of republican claims of voter fraud (despite ANY actual verified proof) which their solutions have the well documented effect of disenfranchising the poor and minorities. (Notice how many times those who warn you not to trust anyone are, themselves, the ones you shouldn't trust?).

Still, it's evident that the root cause is their religious self-righteousness these people feel that allows them to justify blatantly illegal acts (to only themselves fortunately, we aren't Indonesia yet!). If you honestly believed that you, or your party is doing the work of God (unlike say Obama who Rick Sanctorum says follows a "false theology"), you'd also do ANYTHING to guide you, your family and your country into the arms of God. I suspect some of their moral "leaders" don't really believe this and are just using these issues for personal gain just like they hypocritically advocate economic policies which they know will hurt the average republican voter (but pays off handsomely for them; isn't that right Rush Limbaugh?)

Maybe that's why the founding fathers put such a clear line between Church and State (please read Jefferson's exact, specific, detailed words on the subject before claiming otherwise).

Of course what's really scary are the number of evangelicals who are HOPING that the end times are here and are willing, again, to do anything to bring it about. My American Jewish friend thinks that is the only explanation for the fact that the fate of Israel completely controls American foreign policy (in the last republican debate, all the candidates indicated defending it was of the highest national priority). He cannot imagine that the Jewish lobby, significant as it is, could possibly generate that level of support.

Our only hope, if we get another Republican into office, is that they are one of the hypocritical ones and they understand that blowing up the world won't automatically send them (and their families!) to Heaven. Fortunately, all these religious "leaders" all over the world seem to understand this; notice any high ranking Ayatollahs volunteering for suicide belt duty?

Re:This is why religion should not be in govt. (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160699)

Yep, the Republicans, who ended slavery and had to fight the DNC for 30 years to get the civil rights act passed are the ones opressing miniorities. Looking up it appears that specifically Robery Byrd (D-WV) filibustered the Civil Rights act himself and remained a star member of the DNC for the remainder of his life.

ACORN was CONVICTED of 15 counts of voter fraud in 2010, yet you are making the claim that Republicans (who you don't list specifics) are the ones responsible for all US voter fraud.
http://dailycaller.com/2010/11/23/the-voter-fraud-hall-of-shame-milwaukee-voter-fraud-conviction-makes-acorn%E2%80%99s-2010-total-at-least-15/

So to summarize, you lied about which party has historically oppressed minorities. You also lied about who is convicted of voter fraud consistantly in the US. How's it feel to be so completely biased and obsessed that you actually support people who fund voter fraud and support those who did their best to opporess miniorites throughout the last century? If we didn't have jackasses like you supporting such corruption and opporession we might be able to make progress ending it, but sadly you will continue to fight tooth and nail to keep it in place.

My Mistake! (But my overall points remain) (3, Informative)

wisebabo (638845) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160839)

You're right! A quick search shows that there have been cases of voter fraud as you say. (My apologies).

However, an equally quick search checking a non-partisan site (http://www.truthaboutfraud.org/, second hit on Google) indicates that the republican response, not only far outweighs these violations but would not have served to correct them. In fact, as I said before, the only discernible reason for these measures were to disenfranchise voters who were poor and or minorities. These, of course, are in the Democratic demographic.

I said nothing about which party has historically oppressed minorities (but from the subliminal guilt in your response I'd be willing to make a large bet that you're white!). I am fully aware that the Republican party is the heir to Lincoln. However Lyndon B. Johnson knew what he was talking about when he passed the civil rights act that he'd "given the South to the Republicans for a generation". He could read between the lines. Can you?

Unfortunately, judging from the KIND of attacks on Obama it looks like its taking a lot longer than a single generation.

Re:This is why religion should not be in govt. (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160703)

This is why religion should not be in govt.

What...the fuck? How the hell did you come to this conclusion?

Still, it's evident that the root cause is their religious self-righteousness

No it isn't evident from this article in the least. This article has absolute shitall to do with religion.

I can't even fathom the leap of logic you went from "Conservatives in Canada misled voters" to "Religion is ruining government." I won't say that religion is or is not ruining government, I just have to say that IN THE CONTEXT AT HAND, you are blowing out your ass to spout off anti-religion rhetoric.

Re:This is why religion should not be in govt. (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160713)

Of course what's really scary are the number of evangelicals who are HOPING that the end times are here and are willing, again, to do anything to bring it about. My American Jewish friend thinks that is the only explanation for the fact that the fate of Israel completely controls American foreign policy (in the last republican debate, all the candidates indicated defending it was of the highest national priority). He cannot imagine that the Jewish lobby, significant as it is, could possibly generate that level of support.

Seems pretty obvious to me: Israel is this generation's Vietnam. If Vietnam fell to the communists, so the reasoning went, the world would too. If Israel falls to Muslim, Repubs will argue, the world will too.

"Inaccuracies Happen" - Elections Canada (2)

Drophet (2013758) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160637)

Of course... not much will happen. The link below from an article about a Waterloo phone call problem, which also mentions the Guelph robocall problems listed in TFA above.

"Under the Elections Act, an election in a specific riding can be overturned if a "competent court" finds "there were irregularities, fraud or corrupt or illegal practices that affected the result of the election."

However any application to the court to contest the election must be made within 30 days of the election results being published in the Canada Gazette. A complaint can also be made the same day the applicant "knew or should have known of the occurrence of the alleged irregularity, fraud, corrupt practice or illegal practice."

Moreover, the Commissioner of Canada Elections would have to investigate and refer the matter to the Public Prosecution Service of Canada, which would in turn decide whether charges were warranted. All of which means it is premature even to suggest any election results could conceivably be overturned."

http://www.citytv.com/toronto/citynews/news/national/article/189607--inaccuracies-happen-elections-canada-says-after-misleading-phone-call [citytv.com]

So What's Next? (2)

andcarne (657052) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160687)

How do we go about ensuring some sort of repercussions happen as a result of this? It seems to me that the Conservatives are able to pull off all kinds of stuff time and time again, without any effect. Should we, as voters, start recall campaigns? Or is there some mechanism for Elections Canada to invalidate an election?

Seen this first hand (3, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160725)

I lived in the Minister of Defence, Peter Mackay's riding for a few years in university.

There were literally people by the polling station in the student union telling students (most would vote Green Party) the polling station had moved. There was no liberal candidate as the Green Party Leader and the Liberal leader weren't opposing each other in their ridings. (No liberal candidate in Antigonish, no green wherever the liberal's from)

Absolutely Despicable.

So What (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160771)

Oh, the Canadian press and some minority politicians will feign indignation over this, months after the election, just as they are indignant over auditor reports that their policies waste ta payer money and are destructive to the country and ignore existing laws. But nothing will happen. The Canadian electorate will continue to snore. And the well-connected will continue to collect. A pity this is not a democracy...

Misled? Why not just say lied and tricked? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160789)

What's with the conservative friendly language?

This whole thing is disgusting - and only the conservatives benefited.

Time for a new election NOW! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39160829)

This actually says there is a very high chance that the past election was stolen, any chance is too big of a chance to be tolerated. If there is any shred of dignity in them, they will have to do a completely new election immediately and every law they passed while in office will have to be reviewed and decided whether to uphold it or cancel it outright as it is no longer a legally endorsed law as it was made my criminals or through the help of criminal aid.

And the lowest possible sentence anyone in this scandal should get is 20 years in no less than a medium security prison without chance of parole and I would honestly say the death penalty had better be on the table as one of the options as I would like to see a few people hang for this as an example. This is treason here.

I honestly wish my own country, the USA hadn't sold us out and had done this a few times over the past 12 years, but no such luck. Many of us Americans actually look up to you Canadians now as the land of the free (minus your cable and phone companies of course...). You are closer to free than we are now, don't fall down this slope, trust me, unless you are already earning millions, you won't like where it leads.

Torqued Headline? (3, Insightful)

_DangerousDwarf (210835) | more than 2 years ago | (#39160859)

The headline is seriously torqued, bordering on libel.

The Conservative Party of Canada hasn't be proven to have committed any crime.

The robocaller company (RackNine), is "Conservative" connected by virtue of having Conservative Party of Canada as a customer and I guess being based in the west.

The facts haven't come out yet, so we shouldn't throw stones.

It is plausible that the robo calls were done by one or two people. Canada is a bilingual country, no voice actor is required.

It seems highly unlikely that this was funded and organized by the Conservative party of Canada as an official part of their strategy.

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