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New Service Lets Users Try Apple's New IPad For 30 Days Before Buying

samzenpus posted more than 2 years ago | from the give-it-a-spin dept.

IOS 150

zacharye writes "A new subscription service allows potential gadget owners to test out new devices like Apple's new iPad tablet before committing to a purchase. YBUY, which bills itself as a try-before-you-buy online subscription service, charges users a flat monthly fee of $24.95 for access to a wide range of consumer electronics as well as home and kitchen gadgets. Users can choose one device at a time from YBUY's catalog and trial the gadget for up to 30 days before returning it. Beginning in April, the company's inventory will also include Apple's new iPad."

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ill have double (0)

wjh31 (1372867) | more than 2 years ago | (#39370881)

with eggs and bacon

Re:ill have double (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39371037)

The new Apple iPad: now with more GAY!

Re:ill have double (1)

jaxtherat (1165473) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371283)

You should see how nuts some of the blogs dedicated (yes dedicated) to the new Ipad are O_o:

http://whereismynewipad.tumblr.com/post/19363428088/when-it-comes [tumblr.com]

Re:ill have double (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39371811)

This might actually be useful. All the people who own Ipads bought them because they're fanbois or they feel it adds status.
This is for the people who might actually use an Ipad.. all 4 of them.

Re:ill have double lard (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39371333)

with eggs and bacon

Dear Americans:

The only way to gain weight is to eat more calories than you burn. More calories than you burn means you eat more food than you need. Eating more food than you need is called overeating. You got fat because you're gluttonous. You stay fat because you're lazy. This is good since it means you can stop being lazy. But you can't do that if you make a bunch of excuses.

Oh yeah and if you have children and you overfeed them the same way you overeat, you are a child abuser. Diabetes and premature death is worse than most things we call abuse like slapping someone around.

Re:ill have double lard (0)

retchdog (1319261) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371463)

if you compare the calories of eggs and bacon to, say, a muffin or scone, you might be surprised. eating eggs, especially boiled or poached, actually gets kind of unpleasant at the 400 calorie mark... even bacon (crispy) is only ~50 calories a slice.

Re:ill have double lard (1, Offtopic)

Formalin (1945560) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371695)

Yeah, moderation. A fried egg, couple strips of bacon and some whole grain toast is a fine breakfast, moreso if you have a pear or something like this with it.

Eating a pound of bacon for breakfast is something altogether different, though. Limey style (back) bacon is better too, vs. north america's fatter (belly) bacon. Kind of hard to find here, though.

Re:ill have double lard (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39372771)

Yeah, moderation. A fried egg, couple strips of bacon and some whole grain toast is a fine breakfast, moreso if you have a pear or something like this with it.

Eating a pound of bacon for breakfast is something altogether different, though. Limey style (back) bacon is better too, vs. north america's fatter (belly) bacon. Kind of hard to find here, though.

I (as an American) did not know what real bacon was (or a breakfast) until I went to England.

At face value... (1)

MobileTatsu-NJG (946591) | more than 2 years ago | (#39370883)

At face value, this sounds pretty slick. Kinda like Netflix for blinkie things. I do hope their 'completely sanitized' procedure actually works, though. The last thing I would want is to rent a tablet then find somebody's snooping my email.

Re:At face value... (1)

mhajicek (1582795) | more than 2 years ago | (#39370911)

"But we never received your returned item. You owe us $600."

Re:At face value... (1)

MobileTatsu-NJG (946591) | more than 2 years ago | (#39370935)

Shock! Horror! And... a good way for their business to dry up in a hurry.

Incidentally, if you lose your cable box you'll be out $500, too.

Re:At face value... (1)

Cormacus (976625) | more than 2 years ago | (#39370949)

UPS package tracking FTW

Re:At face value... (1)

rhook (943951) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371105)

I'm sure they pay for return postage and insure it. And the tracking number proves you sent it back.

Re:At face value... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39371379)

I'm sure they pay for return postage and insure it. And the tracking number proves you sent it back.

No, the tracking number proves you sent _something_ back. Suppose they claim they received an empty box, then what?

Re:At face value... (2)

rhook (943951) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371479)

The last several times I sent something through UPS they verified the contents. They do this now because of all the people mailing packages of drugs.

Re:At face value... (1)

causality (777677) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371705)

The last several times I sent something through UPS they verified the contents. They do this now because of all the people mailing packages of drugs.

Wouldn't they rather claim something similar to the telecoms' "common carrier" status? In other words, is there really zero chance that the one cleverly-concealed package of drugs that slips by wouldn't get them in trouble for drug trafficking?

Re:At face value... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39371767)

really? I ship UPS several times a year and they have never verified the contents. I drop them off with a label already on the box though.

Maybe you just look like a drug dealer?

Re:At face value... (4, Interesting)

tripleevenfall (1990004) | more than 2 years ago | (#39370975)

It sounds more like people will rent things for vacations and flights who have no interest in actually buying the things.

Re:At face value... (3, Insightful)

MobileTatsu-NJG (946591) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371001)

What's wrong with that?

Easy solution (1)

rhook (943951) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371087)

Wipe the device before you send it back. It's not hard to do.

Re:Easy solution (1)

MobileTatsu-NJG (946591) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371239)

It depends on the device, it depends on the customer, and it depends on the company who claims they'll be sanitizing it.

Re:At face value... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39371095)

At face value, this sounds pretty slick. Kinda like Netflix for blinkie things.

Yes, sort of like Netflix. A Netflix where all the new releases and ridiculously popular items are all checked out and have been reserved for the next six months.

Re:At face value... (1, Interesting)

Daniel Phillips (238627) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371305)

Well given that this whole article is just an advertisement, how about we consider a fact people really need to know?
iPad market share fell by 7 percent last quarter [ilounge.com] . It would seem that in spite of a carefully crafted perception to the contrary, Apple's tablets are headed in the same direction as Apple's phones: absolute numbers shipped up, market share down. Apple's response will be to cut margins to slow the decline. This will not show up as a revenue slip for a while. So for now, Apple's share price will continue to tread air. But the writing is on the wall.

Re:At face value... (1)

Nerdfest (867930) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371457)

It is a walled garden, but you're not supposed to tease the plants.

Re:At face value... (4, Insightful)

MobileTatsu-NJG (946591) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371591)

I really do wish people around here would understand what fuck 'marketshare' actually means. Apple could sell 20% more iPads this year than last and still fall in marketshare. Why? Because their marketshare was 100% until their competitors came along.

If you want to experess doom and gloom, go by how much their sales of dropped, not marketshare. Derr.

Re:At face value... (1)

Daniel Phillips (238627) | more than 2 years ago | (#39372003)

I really do wish people around here would understand what [bleep] 'marketshare' actually means. Apple could sell 20% more iPads this year than last and still fall in marketshare.

See, it turns into a race between increasing absolute numbers and decreasing margin. That is where market share really counts, simple.

I have to ask: why is only Apple fanbots who profess not to care about market share? I am sure Apple does, as does everyone in business.

Re:At face value... (1)

Relayman (1068986) | more than 2 years ago | (#39372269)

I don't think that Apple worries about market share as much when they're shipping every unit they can make. Currently, they are constrained by production, not by competition. And, let's see, how much does Amazon lose on every Kindle sold vs. Apple's profit on every iPad sold?

Re:At face value... (1)

Daniel Phillips (238627) | more than 2 years ago | (#39372681)

Of course Apple worries about market share, because it worries about its prospects on a timeframe of more than just one quarter. What I said about Apple cutting its margins? It already happened. Quadrupling its screen resolution has a price: higher bill of materials cost. [techspot.com] . Now hang on for a moment... some actual numbers are not going to kill you. Let's think about what the numbers actually mean. So Apple's bill of materials went up 6% expressed as a fraction of selling price. That translates to roughly $38 extra cost against Apple's gross margin of $319. That is 12% profit decrease. So Apple needs a 12% increase in volume just to stay flat. And with Apple's stratospheric stock price, breaking even is nowhere near good enough. See what I mean? This is already heading in the direction of Apple as a shrink stock, even faster than I expected.

Re:At face value... (1)

mattack2 (1165421) | about 2 years ago | (#39373019)

Then short the stock please, I look forward to the short squeeze.

Re:At face value... (1)

MobileTatsu-NJG (946591) | more than 2 years ago | (#39372271)

> I have to ask: why is only Apple fanbots who profess not to care about market share?

Apple isn't hurting for cash, developers, or new customers. An alternative question is why, exactly, are the Haterade Addicts so fixated on marketshare? Is it because there's a really good reason, or is it just interesting because it's a number that went down?

Re:At face value... (2)

causality (777677) | more than 2 years ago | (#39372009)

I really do wish people around here would understand what fuck 'marketshare' actually means. Apple could sell 20% more iPads this year than last and still fall in marketshare. Why? Because their marketshare was 100% until their competitors came along.

If you want to experess doom and gloom, go by how much their sales of dropped, not marketshare. Derr.

Seems to me you need both figures to get the whole picture.

Let's say your sales go up a little but your marketshare drops drastically. It means you're doing a little better and your competitors are doing much better. It indicates you are no longer so competitive.

Short-term, it's just like you say -- no big deal, it's a fairly new market, etc. Long-term, if that doesn't change, it will prove to be unsustainable. That's the part that remains to be seen. It's easy to have good sales and good marketshare when there are no other players in the market. I'm much more interested in what happens when that environment changes.

Re:At face value... (1)

MobileTatsu-NJG (946591) | more than 2 years ago | (#39372149)

Long-term, if that doesn't change, it will prove to be unsustainable

Why? Apple has millions of units out there and plenty of software to support it.

I wouldn't mind, but this is the exact same rationale people have been using to predict Nintendo's death for over 10 years.

Re:At face value... (1)

Daniel Phillips (238627) | more than 2 years ago | (#39372207)

Long-term, if that doesn't change, it will prove to be unsustainable

...this is the exact same rationale people have been using to predict Nintendo's death for over 10 years.

By no means the end of Apple, but the end of Apple as a good investment. To understand this using your own analogy, just look at Nintendo's five year performance:

http://finance.yahoo.com/echarts?s=NTOA.F+Interactive#symbol=ntoa.f;range=5y;compare=;indicator=volume;charttype=area;crosshair=on;ohlcvalues=0;logscale=off;source=undefined [yahoo.com] ;

Re:At face value... (1)

Rakishi (759894) | more than 2 years ago | (#39372151)

Yeah, it'll be just like that thing apple used to sell. The Macbook I think it was called. Never gained enough market share so they had to kill it. Oh wait.

a) Not having 100% market share doesn't matter as long as you don't keep losing that market share indefinitely.

b) Marketshare is different from marketshare. A Ferrari and a Jetta are both cars, according to you logic that'd put them both in the same market. Apple doesn't care about people who buy $100 tablets and would have never bought an iPad.

Re:At face value... (1)

causality (777677) | more than 2 years ago | (#39372609)

I see you making some statements of the obvious. The thing is, I didn't dispute any of them. I was talking about Apple's performance as a company when compared to competitors. You know, that thing I kept referring to? Yeah, that.

If there is something I said that you believe is in error, as in factually incorrect, let me know.

Re:At face value... (1)

Rakishi (759894) | about 2 years ago | (#39373125)

I see you making some statements of the obvious

Yes, when I talk to dense people I tend to try to dumb it down to their level. Apparently I need to do so even more with you.

Apple has shown itself perfectly capable of retaining market share while keeping margins high. Their competitors have not. This is because Apple positions their products at the high end and generally competes on features instead of price. They are a brand and not a chine made piece of plastic.

Other competitors cut each other's throats to get the cheapest computer, monitor, phone and tablet out into the marketplace. Apple does not. In essence they are not Apple's competitors but simply each other's competitors.

Re:At face value... (1)

Chuck Chunder (21021) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371609)

absolute numbers shipped up, market share down.

In other words, doing well where it actually matters to a company, not doing so well where it matters to dick-waving fanboys?

Re:At face value... (1)

Tough Love (215404) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371717)

Let's all just give a big shout-out to Apple for helping make this the year of Linux on the Tablet!

Re:At face value... (1)

sco08y (615665) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371771)

Let's all just give a big shout-out to Apple for helping make this the year of BSD on the Tablet!

FTFY.

Re:At face value... (1)

Tough Love (215404) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371833)

Let's all just give a big shout-out to Apple and Linux for helping make this the year of No Windows on the Tablet!

FTFY.

Re:At face value... (1)

Relayman (1068986) | more than 2 years ago | (#39372233)

Shipped is not the same as sold. Any number for Kindle shipments or sales is bogus as Amazon doesn't release that information.

The first hit is free (1)

dkleinsc (563838) | more than 2 years ago | (#39370889)

Just like any other drug.

Re:The first hit is free (1, Insightful)

pankkake (877909) | more than 2 years ago | (#39370959)

Except in that case most people will realize they don't have an use for one.
At least that's my experience of iPad users. Past the "it's so cool" period, they pretty much only use it in the toilet.
I don't think Apple will like this.

Re:The first hit is free (1)

rhook (943951) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371115)

And yet they still buy each new model at release.

Re:The first hit is free (1)

davester666 (731373) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371175)

Well, there are a lot of people around the world with toilets.

Re:The first hit is free (1)

Tough Love (215404) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371369)

Is there an app for wiping?

Re:The first hit is free (1)

Relayman (1068986) | more than 2 years ago | (#39372303)

Maybe not, but there is an app for unrolling the toilet paper. The faster you unroll it, the more points you get. It's called "Enjoy Toilet Paper" by Lee Jason ($.99, 3 out of 5 stars). Personally, I just check out Facebook while sitting.

Re:The first hit is free (2)

realityimpaired (1668397) | about 2 years ago | (#39372821)

Personally, I just check out Facebook while sitting.

That would certainly explain the vast majority of the content on Facebook...

Re:The first hit is free (1)

CohibaVancouver (864662) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371169)

At least that's my experience of iPad users. Past the "it's so cool" period, they pretty much only use it in the toilet.

Not my experience. Gave my wife an iPad last Christmas . Nearly three months on I'm amazed how much she still uses the thing - Scrolling through photo albums, epicurious recipes when cooking, watching TV shows, playing games with our kids, Facebook - On and on. In our house it's a total multipurpose device - Every week she's using it in some new, nifty neat way.

Re:The first hit is free (3, Insightful)

billcopc (196330) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371501)

Same as my wife. For a lot of people, a tablet can be the ideal device. If they spend most of their time in a web browser anyway, and don't do a whole lot of typing, the tablet is a shoe-in. A laptop is too much for them.

Re:The first hit is free (0)

Tough Love (215404) | about 2 years ago | (#39372741)

Totally agreed, and it's a great reason to get her an Android tablet. Save some money, get more free stuff, and flash sites work too.

Re:The first hit is free (1)

billcopc (196330) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371469)

For me, that's exactly how it played out. I'm a programmer, I need a beast of a machine with a good keyboard and tons of display real estate. The only time I ever use the tablet is for playing Angry Birds on the crapper.

For my wife though, the tablet is her new PC. She uses it almost exclusively, because it does 99% of what she needs from a computer: surf the web, play dinky little games, read email, stream youtube. The other 1% is when she needs to edit a real word doc or print something for work.

Thing is, there are a lot more non-tech users like my wife, for whom a tablet is enough "computer" for their needs. This YBUY thing could take off, but then again, if you want to try an iPad, you can go to any Apple store and play with the demo units. The YBUY service might be more for people who want an iPad, but only for a week or two (e.g. trip or business demo). In my case, I could rent one to test an iPad app I'm developing, because I don't do enough of that kind of work to justify spending $600 on one.

Re:The first hit is free (1)

sco08y (615665) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371841)

Except in that case most people will realize they don't have an use for one.
At least that's my experience of iPad users. Past the "it's so cool" period, they pretty much only use it in the toilet.
I don't think Apple will like this.

Yup, definitely on the shitter, plus on the train, or when I'm waiting for someone. Getting half and hour back here or there adds up.

Re:The first hit is free (1)

tomhath (637240) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371295)

Yes, but 30 days means people either:

A) Are still on the honeymoon and think it will be useful to them

B) Set it aside after a few days and decided to return it "later"

Returned iPads resold as new? (1)

Nidi62 (1525137) | more than 2 years ago | (#39370919)

I would hope that this company will have a decent amount of iPads listed as "used" at a reduced price. At lot of things can happen to an electronic gadget in 30 days, especially if the person doesn't have to worry about not being able to return it.

Re:Returned iPads resold as new? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39370977)

Or resold as "slightly used" at $1 discount.

Re:Returned iPads resold as new? (1)

Eponymous Hero (2090636) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371049)

thinking the same thing. before too long all they'll do is churn out refurbs.

Re:Returned iPads resold as new? (1)

rhook (943951) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371129)

But they do have to worry about paying for it if they should damage it.

This isn't news, this is an advertisement (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39370929)

There is no article to discuss, it just goes to a quote of a giant press release. This is spam.

Re:This isn't news, this is an advertisement (3, Informative)

tripleevenfall (1990004) | more than 2 years ago | (#39370987)

I tagged "slashvertisement"

Re:This isn't news, this is an advertisement (5, Insightful)

a_nonamiss (743253) | more than 2 years ago | (#39370989)

It's a shameless plug, but it's also an interesting service that many geeks would probably be quite interested in.

Re:This isn't news, this is an advertisement (-1, Flamebait)

Tough Love (215404) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371401)

...it's also an interesting service that many geeks would probably be quite interested in.

Sorry, if you use Apple you have to turn your geek card.

Re:This isn't news, this is an advertisement (1)

causality (777677) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371789)

...it's also an interesting service that many geeks would probably be quite interested in.

Sorry, if you use Apple you have to turn your geek card.

Agreed. That's the way I feel about Facebook too.

Especially for those who remember Apple prior to OS X, the major selling point of Apple and "computing for the rest of us" was that they made devices that didn't require a geek to use. And I admit that claim had some merit; completely non-technical people I know who bought a Mac some years back were delighted not to have all the problems with it that they had with Windows PCs.*


* Most of which involved malware, some involved the tendency Windows had to accumulate cruft and require periodic reinstalls, some came from flat-out refusing to read the fucking manual (the one written in 5th-grade English just like the newspaper), and others came from their inability to choose quality software and expressing surprise that the NoName Freeware with no reviews that they got from Tucows caused problems.

The maker of games... (1)

GmExtremacy (2579091) | more than 2 years ago | (#39370953)

It better Gamemaker as such never before.

Terms of service: lost device liability (4, Informative)

rwade (131726) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371005)

From the Terms of Service [ybuy.com] :

6. Delivery Confirmation

Because many instances may occur at your delivery address that is beyond our control, you agree that any delivery confirmation provided by the carrier is deemed sufficient proof of delivery to the card holder, even without a signature.

So let's say that UPS claims to deliver it to you but takes no signature -- and the box promptly walks away. From the language above, it sounds like you have the responsibility to hassle with UPS for an insurance claim.

And on the Chargeback Policy in case you decide that it wasn't your fault that a device didn't exactly isn't on your doorstep when you get home:

7. Chargeback Policy

All references to a “chargeback” refer to a reversal of a credit/debit card charge placed on www.ybuy.com. There is no reason for a chargeback to ever be filed. If a credit is due, simply contact us and we will gladly issue it. Unnecessary chargebacks are theft and can be prosecuted. If you feel that your credit/debit card was used fraudulently on www.ybuy.com, please contact us for immediate resolution at support@ybuy.com.

YOU AGREE THAT YOU WILL NOT CHARGEBACK ANY AMOUNTS CHARGED TO YOUR CREDIT/DEBIT CARD ON THIS SITE. IF YOU CHARGEBACK A CREDIT/DEBIT CARD CHARGE FOR A PAYMENT INITIATED BY YOU, YOU AGREE THAT THIS SITE MAY RECOVER THE AMOUNT OF THE CHARGEBACK IN ADDITION TO $ BY ANY MEANS DEMED NECESSARY, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO RECHARGING YOUR CREDIT/DEBIT CARD OR HAVING THE AMOUNT RECOVERED BY A COLLECTION AGENCY.

Re:Terms of service: lost device liability (1)

AarghVark (772183) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371141)

Selling your soul to the Devil seems tame in comparison.

In fact, I think the Devil might be contacting their legal department for some pointers after this one.

Re:Terms of service: lost device liability (4, Informative)

Overzeetop (214511) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371197)

You can put anything you want into terms and conditions. If it violates their service agreement with the CC processing service (which it is practically guaranteed to), it will be null and void. Credit card companies value your revenue stream more than they value the vendors. It's very hard to run a service without being able to accept MC/Visa/Amex - and if they really use this tactic, and the CC companies get an earful from several customers, it's likely to put them out of business.

Yes, you might have to fight with UPS or Fedex or USPS about the delivery - but often (again) you can cry foul to the CC company, and they'll refund your money and take it up with the carriers insurance. For the big carriers, it's cheaper to pay the occasional claim and save the 1-1.5 minutes of downtime getting a signature. You'll notice that tomorrow, none of the carriers will leave the iPads without a signature in any place that's even remotely dicey. Dell boxes tend to get the same careful treatment. These guys track cost/benefit very carefully.

Re:Terms of service: lost device liability (1)

causality (777677) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371677)

You can put anything you want into terms and conditions. If it violates their service agreement with the CC processing service (which it is practically guaranteed to), it will be null and void. Credit card companies value your revenue stream more than they value the vendors.

I just wouldn't do business with these "fine people" in the first place.

Reading their ToS it occurred to me. Honest businessmen wake up every morning, in a cold sweat, trembling, saying "man, today's the day, I can feel it in my bones! A satisfied customer I haven't wronged in any way is going to seek justice against me, I just know it! They'll probably do it with a chargeback. How EVIL! Damn, I gotta protect myself!" Oh wait, no they don't. Honest businessmen don't do that at all, come to think of it...

Re:Terms of service: lost device liability (2)

silas_moeckel (234313) | more than 2 years ago | (#39372177)

Hope they do not take Amax because there is no way that will stand up to them. You can return anything physical for a full refund period. Anything intangible you can say you do not want. It's heavy handed and some people abuse it but there is no opting out of it.

Re:Terms of service: lost device liability (1)

Opportunist (166417) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371273)

And considering how UPS and other deliverers usually either toss them over the wall if nobody's home or simply hands it to a neighbor (at least in my country), I guess that will happen more than just occasionally.

Re:Terms of service: lost device liability (1)

billcopc (196330) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371529)

"There is no reason for a chargeback to ever be filed" and "YOU AGREE THAT THIS SITE MAY RECOVER THE AMOUNT OF THE CHARGEBACK IN ADDITION TO $ BY ANY MEANS DEMED NECESSARY" (sic)

Pretty sure that statement's in breach of their merchant agreement. At least it would be for me. Sounds like they found their lawyer at the bottom of the foreign owner's family.

Re:Terms of service: lost device liability (1)

causality (777677) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371547)

That's an incredibly asinine ToS.

There is no reason for a chargeback to ever be filed. If a credit is due, simply contact us and we will gladly issue it.

In other words ... "trust us! we never make mistakes and we always act on good faith, that's why we demand that you surrender the usual means of recourse in the event that we grossly fail you..." Yeah, that's what honest people always require.

Unnecessary chargebacks are theft and can be prosecuted.

If chargebacks and the private arbitration that could result are theft, then a legal suit in a real court must be robbery! Yes, as everyone knows, honest businesses always threaten their customers up-front, without reason or provocation, while calling them potential thieves. Damn, where do I sign up?

So do the four major credit card companies have a contact address where we can advise them that one of their merchant account holders is potentially in violation of their agreement, maybe also ask if this is representative of their business practices in general? I mean, since they like a strict Terms of Service then what's good for the goose is good for the gander, right?

Did they hire some RIAA lawyers to draw up this ToS? I would never do business with these people for any reason. They seem to expect that none of their customers will act on good faith. Why shouldn't I assume that such an expectation comes from people who, themselves, do not intend to act in good faith? I hope they fail and go bankrupt, only to be replaced by companies with similar business models who have some respect for their own customers.

If this catches on (2)

DarkOx (621550) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371085)

Its the final nail in brick and mortar retails coffin. There will be no reasons to even visit the local shop to have a look at something you are going to order on New Egg or Amazon later. Retail at least could hope that might stop in to see the new IPad and leave with something else that just had to have on impulse, now habitual online shoppers will have no reason to set foot in a local store. The can just try out $ITEM in the own home.

Re:If this catches on (4, Insightful)

DragonWriter (970822) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371247)

Its the final nail in brick and mortar retails coffin.

I dunno, it doesn't really affect the one compelling advantage of brick and mortar retail -- walk in, walk out with the product today.

There will be no reasons to even visit the local shop to have a look at something you are going to order on New Egg or Amazon later.

People doing that (unless they change their mind and buy at the store) are a burden, not a benefit, to brick and mortar stores.

Plus, the main browsing advantage of brick and mortar stores isn't browsing a single chosen item before buying it, its side-by-side comparison of competing items.

Plus, compared to the ToS posted for YBUY, in-store browsing (even if you are unusually prone to impulse buying under those circumstances) involves less financial risk than YBUY's delivery liability and chargeback-recovery policies.

Re:If this catches on (2)

lexman098 (1983842) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371847)

Plus, the main browsing advantage of brick and mortar stores isn't browsing a single chosen item before buying it, its side-by-side comparison of competing items.

I'd argue that's actually the main benefit of online shopping. They provide way more details about the item than a tiny postcard in front of a shelf. Comparison shopping is a main driver for cheap online prices as well.

rent a center can say we do the same with no shipi (1)

Joe_Dragon (2206452) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371337)

rent a center can say we do the same with no shipping or we use own own trucks and crew

Re:If this catches on (1)

billcopc (196330) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371595)

Brick and mortar still wins at "pay now, get it now". There's nothing that annoys me more in this world than women, but my second greatest annoyance is slow/costly shipping for online purchases. If I can drive/bus/taxi to a store 10 minutes away, get my gadget, and get home an hour later vs ordering online, paying $75 in shipping, waiting four days and having to stay home all day because no big name couriers work after 5 pm... yeah, I'm going to the store, saving my money and my time. Even if the retail price is a few points higher than online, it's still a win. If I have any problem with the item, and need repair/replacement, then brick and mortar wins BIG!

Re:If this catches on (0)

causality (777677) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371899)

There's nothing that annoys me more in this world than women

The only ones that annoy me are the majority who are well into adulthood but never really grew up and matured emotionally. They like to complaine, whine, play childish mindgames, and they demand to be an object of worship, getting quite impatient if there is even a moment where they are not the center of attention. They also have a very hard time saying what they mean and meaning what they say. That show "Jersey Shore" provides some particularly obvious and egregiously childish examples. No interaction with women like that is ever going to be a good thing for you. You can be lonely and retain your dignity, but that will be the first (and not the last) thing you lose if you give these the time of day.

Of course, some fraction of them are true ladies. They long ago got over the fact that they have a vagina and they want to relate as equals in an honest way. Those are worth more than their weight in platinum because they are priceless. If you meet one like that, cherish her and be glad you met her, even if you have no intention of being with her. If you have yet to meet one, I assure you they do exist, they just aren't loud and flashy and in-your-face so you might not have noticed them. Of course, that assumes you have enough character and refinement yourself to notice and appreciate them.

Re:If this catches on (1)

billcopc (196330) | more than 2 years ago | (#39372647)

Yes.

Or try for two weeks free via an Apple Store. (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39371119)

Apple Retail Stores have a 14-day, no restocking fee, no-questions-asked-as-long-as-it's-not-damaged return policy on iPads. (And Macs, and iPods, and purchased-outfit iPhones, and pretty much anything that's not software...)

Just buy one at an Apple Store, and return it if you don't like it.

(Posting AC because I'm a Genius.)

Re:Or try for two weeks free via an Apple Store. (4, Funny)

tooyoung (853621) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371515)

(Posting AC because I'm a Genius.)

I'm a genius too, but I hardly ever post anonymously.

Re:Or try for two weeks free via an Apple Store. (1)

antdude (79039) | about 2 years ago | (#39372965)

But you're too young! ;)

Pavlovian Response (1)

Sponge Bath (413667) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371245)

Of course the headline shouts about Apple, when the main point is that the company allows renting a range of devices. Haters and fan boys rejoice... oops never mind.

$25/30d - shipping + ??? = profit? (4, Insightful)

Overzeetop (214511) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371263)

I'm a bit baffled - $25, less packaging and shipping, on a $500 item (even at wholesale, say $400) means a payback period of no less than 24 months. That's probably longer than the expected lifecycle of a device like this. How many people would be interested in trialing a original iPad?

On the flip side, do you really buy enough stuff to justify $300/year? Especially when you can't get 2-3 similar items to play with side by side (Transformer, iPad, and Note; or three digital cameras like the Lumix TZ20, Sony HX30v, and the Canon SX 260HS).

And then there's the whole - pay retail for a returned and worn product part. I'm sure there's a marketing case for this, but clearly I'm not the demographic!

Re:$25/30d - shipping + ??? = profit? (2)

MetalliQaZ (539913) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371313)

Probably they aren't paying the $500 retail price that we do. Either they have some kind of agreement or even the very first recipient of a product gets a refurbed item

Re:$25/30d - shipping + ??? = profit? (1)

DigiShaman (671371) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371429)

I doubt there's much markup for retail stores selling iPads. Most likely stores will sell iPad units because of all the money they make on 3rd party accessories and other impulse purchases. However, Apple products to tend to retain one of the highest used resell value out there. So that at least might work in their favor to entice the whole try-before-you-buy thing.

Re:$25/30d - shipping + ??? = profit? (1)

Overzeetop (214511) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371533)

The resale may be what they plan on using to make up the difference. A well refurbed Apple item will fetch 70% or more of the retail value after a year as the new ones come out. They might be able to flip a lot of these tablets for $300 (for the $500 model, next year's $400 model) around launch time, which means that if they cost $420 wholesale (probably higher at launch, who knows) and they can sell them for $300, less about a 5% return rate and shipping costs of $10, for $275 net. To them, 12 months only costs $145. That's still not great, as there would be no profit after shipping this thing out 11-12 times in a year - $25/mox12mo = $300, less $120 in shipping/packaging/processing (it's free both ways, and $5 for box and shipping is pretty cheap), $5 in typical refurb to check and wipe with a tech at $20/hr burdered x 12 round trips = $60. It's already gone.

I'm sure there are lower cost items. Maybe they're hoping you'll just not use the service for most of the year.

Re:$25/30d - shipping + ??? = profit? (1)

DigiShaman (671371) | more than 2 years ago | (#39372403)

That's a pretty good rough breakdown. Makes me wonder if they'll start pulling a "BlockBuster" or some such. The real profit will be in late fees (no automated billing, just must renew manually each month online) and returned damage fees.

Re:$25/30d - shipping + ??? = profit? (2)

stephanruby (542433) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371485)

I'm a bit baffled - $25, less packaging and shipping, on a $500 item (even at wholesale, say $400) means a payback period of no less than 24 months.

The $25 subscription fee doesn't cover the purchase price of the device. It only covers the trial of it (and potentially the trial of other devices). If you decide to keep your iPad after one month, then you would buy it at their full listed price (with no discounts).

Also, it's a subscription fee, so after you've tried out the iPad and a couple of other gadgets after a couple of months, they intend to keep on charging you that $25 a month even if you don't order any other new items.

Re:$25/30d - shipping + ??? = profit? (1)

rgbrenner (317308) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371525)

Of course they are losing money on the iPad. It's a product that will get people to sign up for their service. It's like that 1 good song on a CD album. Or that $50 HD on sale today only on an ad flyer for Best Buy -- while everything else is regular price.

And so far, I would say their going pretty good. They got an article on slashdot. And now I know they exist. +1 for brand recognition.

Re:$25/30d - shipping + ??? = profit? (1)

Gen-GNU (36980) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371605)

At end of product life cycle (when a new, shinier iPad comes out, for example), old stock could be offloaded through places like Amazon, which already provides for selling of used electronics. This business plan is very similar to what car rental agencies have used for quite a while.

Re:$25/30d - shipping + ??? = profit? (1)

billcopc (196330) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371625)

You're ignoring the fact that they will resell the item as a refurb, recouping a significant chunk of the purchase price. I still see private individuals selling the original iPad for $400 - good old Apple resale value hilarity. I doubt YBUY is worried about this stuff. Any cash they earn by renting them out is gravy on top of the eventual resale, and it's quite likely they've negotiated a volume discount with Apple.

Re:$25/30d - shipping + ??? = profit? (1)

rgbrenner (317308) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371831)

What discount would Apple give them? They have _maybe_ 100 of these (probably a lot less). That's not a volume purchase. And there are some people that would have purchased iPads, but decided to rent them instead, and decided they didn't like it.

I really don't see what the upside is for Apple to negotiate with them.

Re:$25/30d - shipping + ??? = profit? (1)

billcopc (196330) | more than 2 years ago | (#39372655)

Tons of people buy iPads, change their minds, then resell them in the used market. That "hurts" Apple more than a rental.

May work in your country... (2)

Opportunist (166417) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371307)

In my country (as well as most of Europe that I'm aware of) you have the right to return what you buy online within 14 days without questions asked. By law. Some companies already extended this, knowing that people will either return it right away anyway or keep it anyway, so 30 days no-fee returns are pretty common already.

So... well, maybe a nifty idea but I fail to see the news.

Ohhh, slashvertising... never mind, silly me, living in the past when /. was about news and not ads.

Re:May work in your country... (1)

DigiShaman (671371) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371549)

Not exactly the same, but I got burned by E-Bay-ing something with PayPal. I was selling a used NEC MobilePro which was basically the precursor to the netbook running WinCE. Not cheap. Anyways, the buyer returned it on the 29th day stating it wasn't what he thought it was and that the sell was based on false advertising. That was a lie! He never e-mailed me to complain or work the deal out. Instead, it came back pre-loaded with a bunch of project data indicating a deadline a week before shipping it back to me. That motherfucking cunt bitch ass whore rented it from me on MY DIME!!!

From then on, I never sold on E-Bay or used PayPal. The whole scam is a racket for sellers.

Internet contract for one month ??? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39371347)

Dont you have to sell your firstborn to get service.
Then you are on the hook for a couple of years!
Verizon, AT&T, and other crooks.

How long before... (0)

GumphMaster (772693) | more than 2 years ago | (#39371353)

How long before Apple legal drones come up with some way to call this unauthorised distribution of their "intellectual property" and start demanding a cut of the rental?

Just don't loan one to a Dutchman (1)

Culture20 (968837) | more than 2 years ago | (#39372011)

You won't be able to get a warrant to get it back!
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