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GNOME 3.4 Released

Unknown Lamer posted about 2 years ago | from the desktop-develops-sock-thievery-problem dept.

GNOME 147

supersloshy writes "The popular GNOME desktop environment has just announced the release of version 3.4. User-facing updates include, among others, a new look for many GNOME applications, smooth scrolling support in GTK, integrated document search in GNOME Shell, a new dynamic background, improved accessibility configuration options, new high-contrast icons, and more documentation. Developer-facing improvements include the release of GTK+ 3.4 and updates to standard GNOME libraries as part of the latest GNOME Developer Platform."

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147 comments

Will this be any different? (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39498165)

Let's see how many messages pass by before the usual flamewar against GNOME erupts...

Re:Will this be any different? (0, Flamebait)

MemoryDragon (544441) | about 2 years ago | (#39498191)

Flame on: Gnome is unbearable...

Re:Will this be any different? (0)

bacon.frankfurter (2584789) | about 2 years ago | (#39498325)

Not if you use Unity... (*snicker!*)

Re:Will this be any different? (2)

Jeremiah Cornelius (137) | about 2 years ago | (#39498455)

It's just like Lion, only different.

(Actually, with the right extensions, and Docky? I quite like Gnome 3.)

Re:Will this be any different? (1)

IANAAC (692242) | about 2 years ago | (#39498549)

... with the right extensions, and Docky? I quite like Gnome 3.)

Don't know about it being like Lion, but I agree that it's pretty nice with the right extensions. Workspace Navigator is my favorite, at the moment.

Re:Will this be any different? (4, Informative)

unixisc (2429386) | about 2 years ago | (#39498621)

Comice OS - a distro of Linux - took GNOME 3.2, and made it look exactly like OS-X. I'd think it's not difficult to tweak it so that it looks like Lion.

Multiple monitors? (2)

AliasMarlowe (1042386) | about 2 years ago | (#39498649)

Actually, with the right extensions, and Docky? I quite like Gnome 3.

Are you using multiple monitors? If so, which extensions made the difference for you? I ask this because I tried Gnome 3 and gave up on it due to its nastiness towards multiple monitors. All of our PCs at home are now on xfce due to the apparent nonexistence of sane Gnome options.

Re:Multiple monitors? (2)

jdjennings (1583569) | about 2 years ago | (#39499223)

Same here. Multiple monitors makes Gnome 3 (and Unity, for that matter. Shuttleworth admitted as much) unusable. Cinnamon tries to make things better, but I ended up with XFCE.

Re:Multiple monitors? (4, Funny)

Grishnakh (216268) | about 2 years ago | (#39499671)

You don't need to use multiple monitors. The Gnome developers, who are UI experts and should never be questioned, have determined that multiple monitors are distracting and too complicated for anyone to use, so they don't support them. You need to just get rid of your extra monitor so you won't be confused and stop questioning the Gnome developers, because they are the world's premier UI experts and should never be questioned.

Re:Multiple monitors? (2)

TheDarkMaster (1292526) | about 2 years ago | (#39499795)

How can I mod the parent Insightful and funny at the same time? :-)

Re:Multiple monitors? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39500045)

Now you can't do either.

+5 Flamebait... (1)

AliasMarlowe (1042386) | about 2 years ago | (#39500773)

How can I mod the parent Insightful and funny at the same time? :-)

At the present time, GP's sarcastic comment is at "+2 Flamebait". So if any moderators just up-mod that post as "underrated", it could reach the elusive "+5 Flamebait" level! Perhaps a prouder achievement than anything in Gnome 3...

Re:Multiple monitors? (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39501461)

Same problem here. It's actually a problem with almost everything nowadays. It used to work much better 10 years ago, go figure.

I have four monitors made up of two twinview screens with Xinerama stitching them together (because X.org sucks). The only things that work correctly with this setup are KDE and OpenBox. Even the XFCE window manager doesn't work properly so although I use XFCE as my DE I have to run OpenBox as the window manager.

On top of that, I can't use anything with compositing because of Xinerama. Honestly, X.org is falling way behind in this regard. Windows and OSX work a hell of a lot better than Xorg when it comes to multiple monitors.

Re:Will this be any different? (1, Insightful)

uberjack (1311219) | about 2 years ago | (#39498479)

After getting used to GNOME 2 with Compiz Fusion, I can't stand GNOME 3, and I'm having an impossibly difficult time finding a replacement. I've tried GNOME 3, GNOME Classic, Mate, and even KDE, and at this point, I have to either endure xfce's bugs, or wait until Mate's are ironed out. All along, my install of Mint 10 is aging, and given that its support period is ending, I'm basically stuck between a rock and a hard place. I don't understand why GNOME's devs would screw its supporters this way. Not only is 3 inferior to anyone who likes any sort of flexibility, but its interface is downright maddening at times.

Re:Will this be any different? (1)

0123456 (636235) | about 2 years ago | (#39498581)

I don't understand why GNOME's devs would screw its supporters this way.

The other alternative was to start fixing Gnome 2's numerous bugs, and where's the fun in that?

Re:Will this be any different? (5, Insightful)

Ignacio (1465) | about 2 years ago | (#39499443)

The other alternative was to start fixing Gnome 2's numerous bugs, and where's the fun in that?

Yeah, why fix bugs we know when we can go write a whole bunch of NEW ones!

Re:Will this be any different? (1)

unixisc (2429386) | about 2 years ago | (#39498745)

Why, what was the problem w/ KDE?

Re:Will this be any different? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39500199)

It isn't Gnome 2. The font feels ugly. The interface feels dark. The icons are too small. The task tray is in the wrong spot. The toys in the tray are too numerous. Yes, I know I can fix all of these things, but why would I want to spend hours doing it when I can just get the desktop I want with minimal effort?

Re:Will this be any different? (1, Troll)

KugelKurt (908765) | about 2 years ago | (#39500309)

The font feels ugly.

Fonts are rendered by FreeType just as under GNOME. If you feel that fonts look different, you're imagining things. Either that or you are lying.

The interface feels dark.

Strange, considering that white and light gray are the default theme colors. Sure you're not lying?

The icons are too small.

Which icons? Dolphin has a slider in the status bar to resize icons. There isn't even a need to go to some options menu.

The task tray is in the wrong spot.

Move the panel

The toys in the tray are too numerous.

Which toys? If you have toys there, you have installed them on your own.

Yes, I know I can fix all of these things, but why would I want to spend hours doing it when I can just get the desktop I want with minimal effort?

Hours? Now there is no denying that you lie. Panel position and icons sizes are changed within seconds, not minutes, let alone hours.

Re:Will this be any different? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39501179)

My standard response to your bullshit: Make KDE look exactly like Gnome 2. Otherwise, just shut up.

Re:Will this be any different? (1)

ichthus (72442) | about 2 years ago | (#39500205)

KDE is beautiful, but buggy:
It won't play videos over an smb:// connection. VLC simply throws an error.
Press the power button to shut down the computer. Now, wait for 45 seconds before the shutdown actually gets called.

I tried both Fedora 16 and Mint 12 KDE versions. Both distros exhibited these same bugs, whereas the Gnome flavors worked just fine. Either both of these distros have the same configuration issues, or these are simply long-standing bugs in KDE -- and they're both showstoppers for me.

(I did try the "Protocols=smb" fix to no avail, BTW)

Re:Will this be any different? (3, Informative)

KugelKurt (908765) | about 2 years ago | (#39500333)

KDE is beautiful, but buggy:

It won't play videos over an smb:// connection. VLC simply throws an error.

How is VLC supposed to play videos over KIO slaves when VLC is a pure Qt application that does not support KIO?

Re:Will this be any different? (1)

ichthus (72442) | about 2 years ago | (#39501637)

I don't know the answer to this question. As a user (and not a KDE/QT developer), all I know is that VLC will do this in Windows and in GNOME. The fact that VLC (as with several other applications like XMMS) will not stream in KDE seems to (apparently to the user) be a problem with KDE and not the various applications themselves.

If the problem is that the applications simply aren't communicating the way KDE expects them to, then I would ask why KDE is reinventing the wheel. I can do an smbmount and then point VLC to the file located past the mount point and it works fine. I would think the application would simply be given a file handle -- regardless of whether the file is stored locally or on the network. The Linux OS handles this just fine. Why is it a problem in KDE?

Re:Will this be any different? (1)

Curunir_wolf (588405) | about 2 years ago | (#39498753)

I haven't encountered any major issues with xfce, although it does have some idiosyncrasies. Still much better than dealing with Gnome 3. At least with xfce I can actually get some work done.

I hadn't heard about Mate before...

Hello everyone. I've made a GNOME2 fork. I've called it "Mate". My english is not so good. And so, maybe I can not give support in English. Correct me if I'm wrong. Any suggestion is welcome.

Yea, okay, looks like a dead-end. I'm sticking with xfce. Those guys should, too. It will probably be easier to do what they want with that base instead of the Gnome 2 base

Re:Will this be any different? (3, Insightful)

tuppe666 (904118) | about 2 years ago | (#39499289)

(Mate) looks like a dead-end. I'm sticking with xfce. Those guys should, too. It will probably be easier to do what they want with that base instead of the Gnome 2 base

Using cinnamon http://cinnamon.linuxmint.com/ [linuxmint.com] its a step forward from Gnome 2 without the regressions.

Re:Will this be any different? (1)

RDW (41497) | about 2 years ago | (#39500315)

Yea, okay, looks like a dead-end. I'm sticking with xfce.

A little more Googling might lead you to the official site, whiich has a support forum (in English), and actively updated repositories for various distributions:

http://mate-desktop.org/ [mate-desktop.org]

Use extensions and gnome-tweak tool (1)

kubusja (581677) | about 2 years ago | (#39498763)

Use extensions and gnome-tweak tool - probably you can fix your problems with the right extension.

Initially I was also rejected by GNOME 3 but now after adding a few extensions I just love it and it is the best desktop I ever used.
I love win key and Alt-~

dock@gnome-shell-extensions.gnome.org
alternative-status-menu@gnome-shell-extensions.gnome.org
drive-menu@gnome-shell-extensions.gnome.org
apps-menu@gnome-shell-extensions.gnome.org
places-menu@gnome-shell-extensions.gnome.org
Break_Dynamic_Workspaces@rmy.pobox.com
remove-accessibility-icon@martin-weusten.de

Also hacking is relatively simple javascript - I hacked so my dock is always between my screens (I have monitor on the left at work and on the right at home).

Re:Will this be any different? (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39498785)

In a chat room somewhere in the darkest corners of IRC:

tehGnomez: People who don't use Linux keep complaining about how difficult it is to get set up the first time. If we want to crush our enemies, we need a simple, one-click UI.
gnomoz: Most of those complaints are about getting a stable setup if you don't exactly follow a distro.
tehGnomez: Nonsense, all it takes is sudo pkgmgr -m -r -!prig '/dev/usr' to sort out that kind of issue. It must be the UI that's to blame.
gnomoz: Not everyone memorizes the pkgmgr manual before even installing an OS.
tehGnomez: That's crazy talk, it's not like they have anything better to do.
gnomoz: Well, actually some of us do have something better to do, and I have something better to do than try to convince you not to ruin your UI.
***gnomoz has disconnected.
tehGnomez: Bah, he must've been a Micro$oft $hill all along. Everyone, get to work on our new UI!
*rampant cheering from the gnomelets*

Re:Will this be any different? (1)

cupantae (1304123) | about 2 years ago | (#39499007)

endure xfce's bugs

I'm tempted to accuse you of not ever really trying Xfce. I use Xfce every day, and it is certainly not buggy. Neither the debian stable version nor the current version.
The problem is that it seems incomplete to some people. However, if you're comfortable with the command line, you might actually prefer it, as I do. The sophistication of Gnome/KDE applications can just make things more difficult, in that respect. I don't think there's anything much that you can do with Gnome 2 but not Xfce. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Re:Will this be any different? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39499337)

What's the problem with using GNOME 3 stack? You can use compiz as the window manager and gnome panel 3 as the panel! Works for me (TM).

Re:Will this be any different? (1)

Ksisanth (915235) | about 2 years ago | (#39501083)

I moved to my own cobbled together Compiz standalone shortly after Gentoo devs forced the issue with KDE4 (the second or third time). I was really ticked at the KDE devs -- and separately, the Gentoo devs -- at that point. Basically, I was used to the way I had things set up and I didn't want anyone compelling me to make changes I didn't want to make for reasons that ultimately had nothing to do with me. I didn't care what these people's vision of the future was, and didn't understand why they were "screw"ing the users who had supported KDE for so long.

I knew if I switched to Gnome, the same thing was going to happen, and soon. Of course, now the compiz packages I use are getting removed from portage, so I made them local packages. When the deps change again and break compatibility, I can look forward to a new round of hell. But either way, it's my responsibility--I can complain to myself about all the bugs that I've failed to address. Puts things in perspective. I understood, but didn't fully appreciate just how complicated this crap is, but now I just couldn't imagine any screwing involved. Screwing implies some satisfaction on at least one end!

Re:Will this be any different? (5, Insightful)

justforgetme (1814588) | about 2 years ago | (#39498231)

What's to flame? GNOME 3 was good, now it's better

<runs and hides>

Re:Will this be any different? (1)

Githaron (2462596) | about 2 years ago | (#39498977)

I didn't like Gnome3. Cinnamon was a nice compromise though.

Re:Will this be any different? (4, Insightful)

tuppe666 (904118) | about 2 years ago | (#39499125)

Cinnamon is not a nice compromise. It is simply great. Its a way of accessing everything that is great about Gnome3 without any of the short term regressions.

Re:Will this be any different? (1)

gspear (1166721) | about 2 years ago | (#39499755)

I was disappointed to find out that cinnamon won't implement 2-D virtual desktop configurations either, something I started usng with swm, and through olvwm, fvwm, sawfish, and compiz+wall plugin. nd if you had to stick with one dimension, I'm finding gnome-shell's vertical layout of multiple desktops more sensible than cinnamon's horizontal layout.

Re:Will this be any different? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39499199)

Right now, Cinnamon is the only compromise for Gnome3. You either live with Gnome3 is Gnome2 capatibility mode, Cinnamon, or live with a horrible tablet user experience which is Gnome3.

Gnome3 is actually a REALLY good way to determine if you are a power user. If you like Gnome3, you are not a power user. Gnome3 is tedious and cumbersome to such a degree, no power user would be interested in using it. It does, however, seem to greatly appeal to the neophyte Linux users who actally are application centric and who are more than happy to live with a dramatically inferior user experience simply because they never used the power of conventional desktops in the first place.

I look forward to wasting my ample free time (4, Insightful)

Pausanias (681077) | about 2 years ago | (#39499159)

My graduate students and I happily live in blissful ignorance of all this, running GNOME 2 under Ubuntu LTS (long term support) 10.04. I am able to configure my entire desktop without any need for downloading extensions. I have been able to go for a long time without a reinstall; this wonderful stable setup was an LTS to LTS upgrade from Hardy.

Now 10.04 is not going to be supported forever. I am greatly looking forward to flushing all my hard-won knowledge of this desktop down the drain and spending time looking on line for this-or-that extension that will enable us to maintain the smooth workflow we have had so far. Indeed who am I to question to the wave of progress in GUI engineering. I bow down to my software engineer overlords who will enlighten me with the flaws in my current workflow and who will teach me to use my time in more efficient ways. I am grateful to you, GNOME 3 dev team, for this bountiful treasure of GUI improvement that awaits me in the near future.

Re:I look forward to wasting my ample free time (1)

Stormwatch (703920) | about 2 years ago | (#39501005)

Now 10.04 is not going to be supported forever. I am greatly looking forward to flushing all my hard-won knowledge of this desktop down the drain and spending time looking on line for this-or-that extension that will enable us to maintain the smooth workflow we have had so far.

Look into Mate, the Gnome 2 fork.

Re:Will this be any different? (0)

0123456 (636235) | about 2 years ago | (#39498433)

Nah, everyone who wants a usable desktop has switched away and no longer cares how much the Gnome boys fsck theirs up.

2012 is going to be year of the linux desktop! (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39498171)

With GNOME 3.4 2012 is most certainly going to be year of the linux desktop!

Re:2012 is going to be year of the linux desktop! (1)

justforgetme (1814588) | about 2 years ago | (#39498241)

With GNOME 3.4 2012 is most certainly going to be year of the linux desktop!

Either that or with the new version of TurboJPEG

Re:2012 is going to be year of the linux desktop! (1)

tuppe666 (904118) | about 2 years ago | (#39499163)

With GNOME 3.4 2012 is most certainly going to be year of the linux desktop!

With OSX 2012 is most certainly going to be year of the Apple server.
With Windows Phone 7.5 2012 is going to be the year of the Microsoft Phone.

Re:2012 is going to be year of the linux desktop! (1)

Psion (2244) | about 2 years ago | (#39500735)

Meh. Been there, done that. For me, 2008 was the year of the Linux desktop.

Let the KDEvsGNOMEvsETC wars begin! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39498195)

title ^

Re:Let the KDEvsGNOMEvsETC wars begin! (1)

unixisc (2429386) | about 2 years ago | (#39498771)

I'm waiting for the day that a complete GNUSTEP based DE will be available, but until then, my favorite is KDE. GNOME2 had too many limitations, and GNOME3 seems to be worse.

All good so far (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39498207)

But how will my distro of choice mess it up?

That's what I want to know.

Maybe put the window buttons of the bottom.

Slow news day? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39498209)

Meh.

Re:Slow news day? (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39498607)

I dislike GNOME as much as the next guy, but how exactly is news about the a new version of a major desktop environment "slow news"?

Engineers. They love to change things. (3, Insightful)

cpu6502 (1960974) | about 2 years ago | (#39498245)

Yet another new look for no apparent reason. (shrug). I guess it ain't so bad. I'll adjust. Or just keep using Lightweight ubuntu/LXDE instead.

Re:Engineers. They love to change things. (2)

justforgetme (1814588) | about 2 years ago | (#39498287)

The look isn't any departure. From what I see on the screens it is similar to 3.3, 3.2, 3.1. And the things that did change i personally like. search bar in overview mode has much better visibility this way and the transparent buttons also seem to be more effective. The other optical changes seem quite minute so I hope they also worked on some bug squashing and didn't just wax poetic about the illustration the whole time...

Re:Engineers. They love to change things. (1)

nschubach (922175) | about 2 years ago | (#39498511)

All I really want is the ability to pin any app to the dock without having to create .desktop file for it... and the ability to always launch a new app instead of the default action of bringing up the previous instance.

Re:Engineers. They love to change things. (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39498657)

Pinning the app icon is as simple as adding the app to your favorites. Simply search for it as if you were going to launch it and right mouse click on the icon and select "add to favorites". If it is already running you can right mouse click on the app icon in the dock. If you mean pin apps that don't have .desktop files - that is a freedesktop standard.

As for default to lauch - https://extensions.gnome.org/extension/67/dash-click-fix/

Re:Engineers. They love to change things. (1)

Curunir_wolf (588405) | about 2 years ago | (#39498801)

Oh, wow, so they're still recognizing right mouse clicks? They should just go ahead and deprecate that and just do mono-button for all mice. Nobody needs more than one mouse button...

Re:Engineers. They love to change things. (3, Interesting)

nschubach (922175) | about 2 years ago | (#39499037)

You can't favorite a program you download off the Internet to a subfolder of your home folder without that .desktop file. That's a usability problem. I don't care what the standard says.

If you mean pin apps that don't have .desktop files - that is a freedesktop standard.

Fine.. .then have Gnome Shell create that .desktop file using the executable name and default the path to the folder you ran it from and add it to favorites. Is it really that hard? Currently, if I right click on an app in that bar there is no option to add it to favorites. I have to open a terminal to run the application every time. The only workaround without manually creating the desktop file is using alacarte, but I find that doesn't always put the run path in the desktop files and some apps don't like that.

You can do it in Unity, however. But Unity has some other really big issues that keep me from using it.

As for default to lauch - https://extensions.gnome.org/extension/67/dash-click-fix/ [gnome.org]

This should be a setting somewhere. I still don't know how to add/search for extensions (without this webpage?) Last time I checked by typing Extensions in launcher search, nothing comes up. There's also no apparent visible way to do it from the task bar or launcher. I can download new background images fairly easy... why are extensions hidden away?

Re:Engineers. They love to change things. (1)

spitzak (4019) | about 2 years ago | (#39501489)

I agree that is really stupid. Since you can double-click on the App in the folder and run it, Gnome obviously has all the information necessary to make it run from the dock. Just create the .desktop file with a pointer to the app and the same Icon the file browser is showing and it is done. This should be automatic.

Re:Engineers. They love to change things. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39499059)

You can launch a new instance by dragging the icon from the dock and dropping it anywhere on the desktop. It's just as fast as clicking for me.

Being able to configure the default action would be nice, too.

Re:Engineers. They love to change things. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39500685)

Another vote for Lubuntu. Blazing fast, does everything I need (admittedly my needs are basic), can be tweaked to look and work the way I want. Preferred even over Gnome 2 and XFCE.

I am hoping Unity and Gnome 3 will cause more folks to discover Lubuntu. Good stuff.

Epiphany - Web (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39498293)

"Epiphany, the GNOME web browser, has been renamed Web. "

Ok. Now that I learned what Epiphany is, it changes. Not that the original name meant anything useful, but Web is even worse: too general.

Re:Epiphany - Web (5, Funny)

jojoba_oil (1071932) | about 2 years ago | (#39498451)

Tech Support: What web browser are you using?

User: Web.

Tech Support: Right. What's the program you use to view the web?

User: Web.

Nope. Can't see how this would be a problem. Ever.

But I think they were going for the same idea that Microsoft had when they added "Internet" and "Email" links to the start menu in XP. Generic shortcuts that launched whatever program you had setup as your default. At least Microsoft didn't rename the entire programs...

Re:Epiphany - Web (1)

unixisc (2429386) | about 2 years ago | (#39498605)

Well, in Vista & 7, they canned Outlook Express and replaced it w/ Mail. But one could call it Microsoft Mail. A good solution here would have been to rename Epiphany as GNOME Browser. That would have made it simpler.

Re:Epiphany - Web (2)

AliasMarlowe (1042386) | about 2 years ago | (#39498865)

They did the same thing years ago with Totem, which is just called "Movie Player" (to considerable annoyance).

Re:Epiphany - Web (5, Interesting)

tuppe666 (904118) | about 2 years ago | (#39499237)

They did the same thing years ago with Totem, which is just called "Movie Player" (to considerable annoyance).

What is wrong with it, is it needs no be universal. Its time to get rid of ALL the silly naming. Thing what is wrong with "Gnome Movie Player" or "Gnome Web". Let the renaming continue; "Epiphany" and "Totem" mean nothing.

Re:Epiphany - Web (1)

unixisc (2429386) | about 2 years ago | (#39499433)

Fully agree w/ you here. Get rid of these funny names, as well as the fun that people have when they get to name software titles, inevitably giving it stupid names. On the KDE side of things, drop the K's - KMail, KDevelop, Kate, Kerry, Kleopatra, Krusader, et al, and just give them proper names, like KDE Mail, KDE Development Studio, KDE Text Editor, KDE Search, KDE Cert Manager, KDE File Manager and so on. Of course, if a different group is providing the app, such as Chromium, Firefox, Opera, Libre Office, and so on, retain their names, since their brands are already recognized. Give them names that make it obvious as to what they are.

Re:Epiphany - Web (3, Interesting)

b4dc0d3r (1268512) | about 2 years ago | (#39500167)

This is a good idea. It is entrenched, however, by the idea of a 'unix name' or 'package name'. At sourceforge, you register with a unix name, which is in the URL. So the featured project Scribus is located here:
http://sourceforge.net/projects/scribus/ [sourceforge.net]

I need to install KDevelop, which package do I get? Easy, it should be apt-get kdevelop. What about "KDE Development Studio"? Well, I'd probably need some sort of GUI thing to let me select, and then know what the package name is.

Short, unique names are how we do things, and getting that to change will require more than just the projects changing the official names. It has to satisfy the point-and-click people as well as the command-line people.

Re:Epiphany - Web (1)

unixisc (2429386) | about 2 years ago | (#39498481)

I used Epiphany once, and found it too minimal. At this stage, is it too much to expect browsers to have Firefox like news feeds on their bookmarks bar? Firefox & derivatives have it, and IE8 and beyond has it, but others don't. I found that annoying, whether it was Epiphany, Konqueror, Safari, or Opera. Never got to check whether Chrome supports it or not, and I would be interested to know whether Camino does. As for the name, I think it's an improvement in that most of the FOSS names just suck - who would guess that Totem is a music player, or that Avidemux or Cinerella are video editors?

My commentary... (5, Informative)

Junta (36770) | about 2 years ago | (#39498331)

My problems with Gnome 3:
-Extensions are a very awkward approach to what should be simple config changes. For example, there are two hotcorners by default, upper-left and lower-right. Rather than offering a straightforward configuration to disable it, you have to dig through extensions and find either the extension to disable upper-left, the different one to do lower-right, or the third one that disables both. This accumulates quite atrociously with all the settings.
-Because of the extensions being particularly invasive and pretty much required, the 'oh no' screen is easy to hit.
-In the event of an 'oh no' screen, gnome shell does not care that your apps are still running and could conceivably be used if gnome-shell would just let you restart without logout. It just says 'screw you, log out and kill all your applications'. I've tried starting metacity and it will run, but I can't get rid of the 'on-top' oh no screen.
-No window title search, like has been in Compiz scale and KDE for a very long time. Very hostile to large window count scenarios.
-No way to show all windows belonging to an application in activities view exclusive of other windows
-The application button is sloppy-focus unfriendly

What I like about gnome 3:
-Hot-plugged multi-display is handled pretty well (one of my biggest reasons to lean toward gnome away from KDE, less work when I dock my laptop).
-I actually do like the new alt-tab,alt-above-tab. Having two tiers helps that be almost useful (had given up on alt-tab as unscalable without this)
-Nominally having all task switching/launch elements hidden, but taking over the full screen when you want to switch or launch applications. Keeps my workspace cleaner and doesn't limit the real estate used to facilitate task switching/launching to some small corner of the screen when it is the only thing I am thinking about while that is happening.

Re:My commentary... (1, Interesting)

Nerdfest (867930) | about 2 years ago | (#39498365)

Well said. Most of the things I need are now handled, or are at least configurable. The speed is good (I find Unity extremely slow on my low-powered laptop, while Gnome Shell is fast). The Gnome Live extensions integration is quite nice, but a better grouping/searching facility would be nice. I do find that Gnome shell leaks memory, but at least it can re re-started quickly and easily if required with no application closing required. I find the notifications are still not quite as nicely integrated as in Gnome 2 or even Unity.

Re:My commentary... (3, Interesting)

Pi1grim (1956208) | about 2 years ago | (#39498971)

> The Gnome Live extensions integration is quite nice

Are you kidding me? The sole fact, that the only place where you can turn extensions on and off is website is somewhat strange, if not you use a stronger word. Imagine me installing an extension and then needing to disable it later on — I need internet connection to disable an extension that is already installed on my system. This whole web-centric touch-ui with special disabilities support policy is leaving majority of users with unusable interface. Well, I guess, at least those people with special needs, that use Gnome3 on a x86 tablet while having a 24/7 internet connection will be delighted.

Re:My commentary... (2)

Nerdfest (867930) | about 2 years ago | (#39499509)

You can install the advanced configuration program and turn extensions on and off through that as well. There's even an extension that adds it to the user menu.

Re:My commentary... (1)

Pi1grim (1956208) | about 2 years ago | (#39498769)

You can restart gnome-shell without logging out. Just type ALT+F2, type in "r" without the quotes, just the letter r, and hit enter.

What seems to really be the problem — is failure to implement plugin-based dash search. Unity is doing a stellar job at providing "lences", wish there was a similar thing for gnome 3. Or, better yet — support for unity lences.

Re:My commentary... (1)

Junta (36770) | about 2 years ago | (#39498925)

But that doesn't rid me of the 'oh no screen', but a logout and login does...

Re:My commentary... (2)

dballanc (100332) | about 2 years ago | (#39499513)

You can ALT-F4 the "Oh no screen". It's silly that you can't close it any other way, but it is just a window.

Re:My commentary... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39498987)

is failure to implement plugin-based dash search. Unity is doing a stellar job at providing "lences", wish there was a similar thing for gnome 3.

No, it's there. Just create an extension that implements a SearchProvider: http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-shell/tree/js/ui/search.js#n69

Re:My commentary... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39499363)

I use GNOME fallback with XMonad. I'm able to kill the "Oh no!" window with Mod4/Win+C. I haven't tracked down the cause of the "Oh no!" window, but it doesn't stop me from using the environment.

And yes, it occurs on every machine I've got with GNOME 3 installed.

Re:My commentary... (1)

unixisc (2429386) | about 2 years ago | (#39499917)

Does it allow me to make a pic of me & my kid the wallpaper? Does it allow different wallpapers for different screens?

Testing the three big ones (1, Informative)

jones_supa (887896) | about 2 years ago | (#39498391)

I did some testing with DEs lately and I my best friend I found from GNOME3 + Gnome Shell. Everything is nicely in its place, providing an intuitive, minimalist desktop. I had to hack the theme though, to not display titlebars when maximized, as the title is shown in the top bar anyway (tutorial [webupd8.org] ). However the whole thing is quite similar to Unity, but for some reason Unity runs dog-slow (?). If you want a more full-fledged desktop, KDE4 seemed very snappy and smooth too.

Open Sores FAIL! (again..and again... and again..) (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39498419)

LOL. Gnome 3.4 is as bad as any other open sores project. You losers wouldnt know how to write software if god himself [sfweekly.com] came down and showed you. You losers, just give up already and leave the software coding to the adults. LOL.

FTFY (0)

znrt (2424692) | about 2 years ago | (#39498495)

"The popular GNOME tablet environment has just ..."

i'm using a real desktop and have no use for tablets, so gnome made itself irrelevant as of 3.0 already.
happy new release day anyway!

Re:FTFY (1, Insightful)

IANAAC (692242) | about 2 years ago | (#39498627)

i'm using a real desktop and have no use for tablets, so gnome made itself irrelevant as of 3.0 already. happy new release day anyway!

These comments give me a chuckle. It's pretty obvious you've not seriously even tried to *use* Gnome3/Shell. It makes pretty heavy use of the keyboard use (and, in fact, shines when you rely on your keyboard instead of a mouse).

Re:FTFY (1)

znrt (2424692) | about 2 years ago | (#39499175)

These comments give me a chuckle.

you're welcome!

It's pretty obvious you've not seriously even tried to *use* Gnome3/Shell.

and you're pretty right about that. i very soon realized the metaphor was useles for me.

It makes pretty heavy use of the keyboard use (and, in fact, shines when you rely on your keyboard instead of a mouse).

if i'd want to rely on heavy keyboard use I always could stick to good old tty (I spend much time in that land anyway). however, if I use a gui it's for a reason. that being: having a configurable layout with fast acces to functions a click away, a configurable and stable overview of running processes and a convenient way of task switching. i really don't need much more. sadly, Gnome3/Shell only gives me the latter so it's of not much use for me.

I'm however glad you like it and can throw keystrokes at a broken ui designed for casual users all day long. and I'm particularly glad because the fact that you are enabled to experiment such glorious joy doesn't prevent at all me of using some sane and truly sophisticated gui, ... like xfce for instance.

so let's chuckle together, bro :-)

Re:FTFY (1)

RocketRabbit (830691) | about 2 years ago | (#39498653)

I find it quite a stretch to say that Gnome is a popular tablet environment.

Quick, name five tablets using Gnome. Or, name three that have sold more than five million units.

Re:FTFY (2)

unixisc (2429386) | about 2 years ago | (#39499061)

Name ONE! I can't think of any. I can think of one that uses KDE's Active Plasma - the Spark.

Re:FTFY (1)

RocketRabbit (830691) | about 2 years ago | (#39499391)

That's my point in a nutshell. If you could name one, it'd be merely a very unpopular tablet UI. If you could name five, independent of sales figures, it'd be a legitimate tablet UI. I you could name three that sold five milon or more, it'd be a very popular tablet UI.

I think this is one of the many problems over at the Gnome super secret headquarters - they are fully deluded. They have a couple thousand groupies standing in a hall of mirrors, shouting into an echo machine, so it looks like there are billion of them, and the Gnome developers and UI designers live in this fantasy world.

Re:FTFY (1)

znrt (2424692) | about 2 years ago | (#39499351)

I find it quite a stretch to say that Gnome is a popular tablet environment.

Quick, name five tablets using Gnome. Or, name three that have sold more than five million units.

I can name none, but I already said I'm not interested in tablets.
however, if it isn't for tablets, what the faq is it supposed to be for?

ok, we might say it's an overhauled gui trying to look macosish. it even might succeed at that (ask a mac user, please). again, if I'd want a mac I would use a mac. it's very ok for me if gnome3 attracts more (probably broke) mac users but ... why in heaven should I degrade my own user experience? wasn't linux all about choice?

Re:FTFY (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39499893)

Feel free to say fuck here if you think it's appropriate.

Now to the actual points: First, there are a lot of people who really like the direction GNOME is going, and that includes long time linux users / developers like me. Don't try to extrapolate from your opinions to everyone else... Personally I think GNOME 3 is the first time a linux UX is going somewhere, instead of just being a almost-but-not-quite competent clone of another product.

Second: "wasn't linux all about choice?" Thankfully no: http://www.islinuxaboutchoice.com/ . For those to lazy to click through to Ajax's post, I'll reference the summary: "the chain of logic from 'Linux is about choice' to 'ship everything and let the user chose how they want their sound to not work' starts with fallacy and ends with disaster."

Re:FTFY (2)

unixisc (2429386) | about 2 years ago | (#39499967)

Easy answer to this one - are you willing to pay premium prices for an Airbook, or any other Mac? If not, you could buy OS-X and try installing it on a normal PC, but you'd be on your own. OTOH, there is a Linux distro called Comice OS which has the Mac look & feel, so if you wanted a Mac but were on a budget, it would make pretty good sense to get this distro on one's laptop. Unless of course one thought it was too much of a hassle, and more worthwhile sinking the extra cash on a Mac

interesting consequence of gnome 3 (4, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39498507)

It added two more desktop environments to the linux world: Mate (a fork of Gnome 2 http://mate-desktop.org/ ) and Cinnamon (a fork of Gnome 3 http://cinnamon.linuxmint.com/ ). These new alternatives to Gnome 3 don't get the attention that they deserve.....

Re:interesting consequence of gnome 3 (1)

Githaron (2462596) | about 2 years ago | (#39499151)

I currently use Cinnamon some of what Gnome3 takes away. I hope eventually it will get more attention.

Fix bugs, don't break UI... (2)

RocketRabbit (830691) | about 2 years ago | (#39498597)

I think it's time for Gnome to have a feature and UI freeze, for perhaps a year or two, and concentrate on fixing bugs in all the various subsystems. Every new release focuses on new features, but there are numerous bugs in Gnome from five or more years ago!

Take Apple as an example. Their UI has undergone little change since OS 10.4 (minor tweaks excluded) and they have concentrated on improving the underlying stuff. This could be a methodology that Gnome might take to heart.

Instead, the Gnome developers and design team will continue to sparkle a phone / tablet friendly UI on top of a desktop system, with the unrealistic goal of making legacy software work on a touch UI with a simple recompile. Sally buggers.

Unix (1)

unixisc (2429386) | about 2 years ago | (#39498661)

Can/will any BSD distros support this? Like GhostBSD? NetBSD? Or have they already implemented systemd dependencies on it that would effectively make it Linux only? Also, any idea whether this new DE has been embraced by other Unixes, such as Solaris, OpenIndiana, HP/UX and so on?

Almost as good as Windows 8 (2)

Curunir_wolf (588405) | about 2 years ago | (#39498683)

This is great news! Gnome 3 is certainly surpassing Windows 8 now. If only they could implement all that "log in with your web account" stuff like Windows 8 does, it will be awesome!

For my tablet.

Nothing wrong... (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39498757)

apart from:

1. for such a minimalist interface that has chosen to be modal the flip between modes isn't snappy enough.
2. when in overview the keyboard short cuts (ctrl alt pagedown) is so slow to respond I might be better off using the mouse.
3. the 'max half screen'/side-by-side thing was good until some one thought it and said ' maximise screen the same kind a thing' and bolted it on. Now I've had to turn it all off. Double clich the title bar, use the maximize icon in the title bar. Thats how you maximize.
4. Sometime access to a list of apps is quick the oldway and using search rather than a place in a menu stored in muscle memory. Fixed by plugin.
5. It getting harder and harder to avoid pulseaudio and the like. If you want or need low latency audio, bekind and give us an option to bypass some of you hardwork without getting arsy about it.
6. Same for browser preferences, mailclients, networking.
7. button in to title bar removed. plubin puts the back thankfully. Doesn't cost any realestate maintains a paradime
8. it would also be nice to adopt the blender way of telling you the code that will action a control when you hover so you can write macros

but is fixable in c of javascript although I wish they had picked python as well. GSettings and pyGobject is are start but

Wayland (1)

unixisc (2429386) | about 2 years ago | (#39498781)

Does the GNOME3 team have any plans to make their DE run on Wayland?

Re:Wayland (2, Insightful)

0123456 (636235) | about 2 years ago | (#39498831)

Does the GNOME3 team have any plans to make their DE run on Wayland?

No. That would result in such an accumulation of suck in one place that the universe would implode.

Who needs a DE? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39500785)

Openbox, tint2, and gmrun provide all the desktop environment I need. I have multiple desktops, easily customized hot keys, a task bar with a clock and a window picker. Only trouble I have is the rare occasion when I need to run a graphic file manager and nautilus decides to fuck everything up because I still have figured out how to force everything to use Thunar instead.

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