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Operators: Nokia Would Sell Better With Android

Soulskill posted more than 2 years ago | from the just-what-nokia-wants-to-hear dept.

Android 439

nk497 writes "Mobile operators are complaining that Nokia's Lumia line of handsets would sell better if it ran a different OS — or if Microsoft was more willing to put marketing money behind Windows Phone. 'No one comes into the store and asks for a Windows phone,' said an executive in charge of mobile devices at one European operator. He said Microsoft's software worked nicely with PCs and allowed you 'to do tons of cool things,' but few customers knew this. 'If the Lumia with the same hardware came with Android in it and not Windows, it would be much easier to sell,' he said."

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False choice (5, Interesting)

noh8rz3 (2593935) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715477)

I think this argument is interesting, but is ultimately a false choice. You can't have android on the lumia because it doesn't exist that way. Is like saying, iPhone would be better with android on it.

The bet thing ms / Nokia can do right now is take their lumps, invest in advertising, and have faith that they have a great product on the shelf. Build it and people will come.

The only concern is that while ms has deep pockets to take a bath for a while, Nokia is more precarious. Acquisition, anyone?

As Steve jobs said, "real artists ship."

Re:False choice (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39715677)

Yup. people forget that nokia's windows phones have poorer hardware than the android or iphone counterparts and cannot multitask properly or as well as a typical quad core android phone. They have single core processors and shitty graphics. Add to that the shitty mongo/bongo or whatever its called windows interface and the typical micro$oft (yes thats M$ indicating the piles of cash the convicted monopolist formerly had. eventually it will become MS when office gets supplanted by google office and they will no longer be relevant) bloatware and you get a mess in a generic square package. obviously the whole point of releasing phones on this obsolete platform was for the former M$FT shill who is now CEO of nokia to drive it into the ground so M$ could buy them out for cents on the dollar. the fact that nokia is now run by a crook should not surprise anyone. dump your stock and get out if you have any.

 

Re:False choice (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39715873)

[...] and the typical micro$oft (yes thats M$ indicating the piles of cash the convicted monopolist formerly had. eventually it will become MS when office gets supplanted by google office and they will no longer be relevant) [...]

Nope, sorry buddy, but the dollar-sign variant went WAY the hell out of style about fifteen years ago. Plus, nowadays it labels you as a tool at best, a bitter douchebag at worst. But hey, congrats on getting your post ignored! Way to help the perception of ACs here, asshole!

Re:False choice (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39716045)

youe welcome. the M$ will never be out of style as long as M$ astroturfers exist on /. sorry shill.

Re:False choice (0, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39716107)

No, you're a tool if you use M$, regardless of prevailing opinion.

For instance, you're also a tool if you say "Faux News". Even though Fox News is pretty much ridiculous. You're a tool if you say Republicon or Demoncrat, and I've totally seen both used unironically and defended as though it were some clever political statement. Whether your target is morally corrupt or pure, you're a tool.

A true story (5, Interesting)

killmenow (184444) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715483)

Our company runs almost entirely on Microsoft products. We use Exchange Server and Microsoft Outlook for our e-mail. We use self-signed SSL certs.
This week an employee got a Nokia Lumia 900. He brought it in for us to help him get the e-mail set up. It won't accept self-signed certs. It's a pain in the ass to get set up. He took it back and got an iPhone.

We have people running iPhones, Blackberries, and Android phones all connecting without problems. But you got a WP7 device? Sucks to be you.

Re:A true story (3, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39715533)

You know MS... never buy something until SP1. I assume the same should be true of Windows Phones.

Re:A true story (5, Informative)

killmenow (184444) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715575)

To be fair, it's not really *that* difficult to install the trusted root cert on the WP7 device. It's just...why should we have to jump through that hoop? All of those other devices *just work*.

Re:A true story (3, Insightful)

jd (1658) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715611)

I usually recommend waiting to SP2 as SP1 is usually poorly tested. XP, for example, only truly became stable after SP2 due to problems with SP1, and Windows 95 SP1 was notorious for adding massive security holes (beyond the usual ones).

Re:A true story (4, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39715621)

These things will not be fixed. They are part of the plan. Just like the extremely limited bluetooth-implementation in WP. You cannot even send or receive a vcard, let alone transfer a MP3. Microsoft "learned" this from Apple. It seems these ultra restrictive OSses are the new trend. Worse thing is: people don't seem to care - or more likely, they simply don't know it. Sad.

Re:A true story (1, Insightful)

sosume (680416) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715933)

Typical result of a project where Scrum was applied. You end up with exactly what you need to do the job, but don't expect any extras.

WP7 SP1 already happened (3, Informative)

pavon (30274) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715813)

WP7 "SP1" is called Mango, and it is what is shipping on the Nokia Lumia.

Re:A true story (3, Interesting)

UnknowingFool (672806) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715615)

MS specifically has made WP7 a consumer phone and excluded enterprise options like this and abandoned the enterprise. Yet for some reason you can get Word, Excel on it. And when I mean "get", it has limited functionality as you would expect in a mobile version. The decision to put development towards Office while ignoring other enterprise necessities is truly strange.

Re:A true story (4, Insightful)

Andy Dodd (701) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715831)

I think that's MS's biggest misstep - In the process of redesigning their OS, they basically threw the entirety of their existing market out. Their Windows Mobile core userbase was more enterprise-oriented. WP7 was a massive step backwards for many WM6.x users - nearly all of whom went over to Android. So MS now has a "me-too" "shiny UI" OS, with very little app development, and little prospect of app development because they keep dicking around with developers - http://www.xda-developers.com/feature/enjoying-chevron-say-goodbye-to-your-developer-unlock/ [xda-developers.com]

Re:A true story (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39715763)

Our company runs almost entirely on Microsoft products. We use Exchange Server and Microsoft Outlook for our e-mail. We use self-signed SSL certs. This week an employee got a Nokia Lumia 900. He brought it in for us to help him get the e-mail set up. It won't accept self-signed certs. It's a pain in the ass to get set up. He took it back and got an iPhone. We have people running iPhones, Blackberries, and Android phones all connecting without problems. But you got a WP7 device? Sucks to be you.

Congrats. You saved $99 for your entire company. Get a cert if you allow data you care about to be exposed to the public Internet. Ever hear of man in the middle? Train your users to purposedly accept self signed certs from their personal devices, it's asking for it.

Re:A true story (1)

Twinbee (767046) | more than 2 years ago | (#39716095)

Can someone who's in contact with Microsoft send this to them? It would be nice to have some competition with Android/IOS, and it's good if MS knows that its potential customers don't like to faff around.

DIY (4, Interesting)

rzr (898397) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715487)

just install nitdroid on n9 ... well dont hold your breath , but it's booting and you can install apps, anyway I prefer meego/harmattan :-) -- http://rzr.online.fr/q/omap3 [online.fr]

Re:DIY (3, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39715841)

Why would want to do that? Meego is a much better software platform. I don't care what people say, Android is a mediocre piece of shit that only succeeded because it carries the Google name. The runtime sucks and the SDK is a complete joke. It is also made by a company with dodgy ethics.

--
Disclaimer: I work for TAGA (The Arrogant Google Assholes)

LOL the market has bitched. (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39715489)

and nokia has become a bitch.

What a relieve to hear (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39715491)

People don't want Windows.

Customers don't know about windows? (1)

cpu6502 (1960974) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715515)

Microsoft's software worked nicely with PCs and allowed you 'to do tons of cool things,' but few customers knew this.

That's a strange statement. Do the customers have their eyes closed when they see the Windows banner splash across their PC? Hmmm. It seems natural to me that if you have windows at home, and on your laptop, you'd want it "on the go" as well.

Re:Customers don't know about windows? (3, Interesting)

wed128 (722152) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715667)

hmm...My mother (very non-technical) bought an iPhone as a PC replacement. All she does is e-mail, and she was tired of what a PITA her windows machine was to maintain.

This iPhone just works. credit where credit is due.

Re:Customers don't know about windows? (-1, Troll)

busyqth (2566075) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715879)

This iPhone just works. credit where credit is due.

No credit due!

Apple doesn't deserve ANY credit for the iPhone. They just took a bunch of existing technologies and slapped them all together.
Even the electronics isn't Apple's. It's just a rebadged HTC design.

Other companies did all the hard work and Apple just STOLE it all, and patented it, and is now suing the original creators.
Remember, good artists copy, GREAT ARTISTS STEAL!

Re:Customers don't know about windows? (1, Funny)

LDAPMAN (930041) | more than 2 years ago | (#39716129)

your so right! I mean other than the SOC, multi-touch, Cocoa Touch, the iOS kernel, and a bunch of other stuff it's exactly like an HTC phone.

Re:Customers don't know about windows? (5, Insightful)

0123456 (636235) | more than 2 years ago | (#39716009)

It seems natural to me that if you have windows at home, and on your laptop, you'd want it "on the go" as well.

People who use Windows at home and at work probably know they don't want it on their phone as well.

I was shocked a few years ago when I rented a car in Italy and it had a Windows logo on the steering wheel; no idea what it was running, but I was continually expecting a BSOD across the dashboard.

After decades of dealing with Microsoft crap, Windows is a negative branding, not a positive one.

Re:Customers don't know about windows? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39716115)

It was an Italian car? Windows was probably installed to increase its reliability.

Re:Customers don't know about windows? (1)

EzInKy (115248) | more than 2 years ago | (#39716185)

Most people think of PCs and laptops as computers but see phones as phones. Now, though you and I might think it's fantastic carrying a full Linux distro in our pockets, the vast majority just want to be able make calls and text.

Android? (4, Interesting)

kurt555gs (309278) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715527)

The N9 was an unknown home run. Really. They killed it and used most of the parts for the Lumia, but Nokia could have knocked one out of the park with Maemo / Harmatten.

Fools.

Re:Android? (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39715623)

They didn't. Elop did.

Re:Android? (1, Informative)

moderators_are_w*nke (571920) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715999)

And it still sold more than the Lumia

Re:Android? (1)

Desler (1608317) | more than 2 years ago | (#39716033)

The N9 barely sold more than the Lumias have. So, no, it wasn't a homerun.

Re:Android? (3, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39716171)

The N9 wasn't advertised, wasn't sold in most countries and Nokia had already announced that it wouldn't be developed even before it hit the stores.

Duh (5, Insightful)

markdavis (642305) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715531)

Well, that article is mostly a "duh". Of course people come in wanting one of two things- #1 Android or #2 iPhone. It is going to take a LOT of work on Microsoft's part to try and get visibility now.

Nokia ditched perfectly good Linux based mobile OS's for their high-end phones and now they will have another uphill battle.

Re:Duh (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39715819)

Nokia ditched perfectly good Linux based mobile OS's for their high-end phones

The legend says. I knew it as bloated, buggy software created by a badly mismanaged team, late and missing the point (which would be creating a viable platform).

now they will have another uphill battle.

Sounds like it's going good at AT&T and Amazon, no?

Re:Duh (1)

Mr_Silver (213637) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715823)

Well, that article is mostly a "duh". Of course people come in wanting one of two things- #1 Android or #2 iPhone. It is going to take a LOT of work on Microsoft's part to try and get visibility now.

Nokia ditched perfectly good Linux based mobile OS's for their high-end phones and now they will have another uphill battle.

Given, as you rightly said, people come in wanting either Android or iPhone, Nokia would probably still have had the same problem even if their platform ran Linux - and the integration with Windows PC's may not have been as good,

Maemo/Harmattan/MeeGo even better (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39715547)

I have an Nokia N9. The multitasking with swipe is brilliant. Did you close the app? (as simple as swipe down) No? Then it is still running. And by running I mean actually running, not the half-baked task-switching employed in Windows Phone or iOS. And it takes only a swipe to see which apps are running. Even on Android I am often guessing whether an app is still active or not, which can be quite annoying.

QML/QtQuick makes app development easy yet powerfull. The normal Linux kernel with X makes porting easier. The N9 truly is a great device for novices, power-users and hardcode hackers.

Re:Maemo/Harmattan/MeeGo even better (2)

sethstorm (512897) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715749)

The N9 truly is a great device for novices, power-users and hardcode hackers.

Only if you don't account for all the good parts of the N900 being Elopped off(Hardware keyboard) or locked away(Aegis with warranty flags). A slide-on/USB passthrough keyboard that works with the N9 would be, at best, a way to mitigate the keyboard issues while removing Aegis is the one that would make it much like the predecessor that most of us have, the N900.

Re:Maemo/Harmattan/MeeGo even better (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39715947)

Hardware keyboard is a personal thing. As for Aegis, it's not all bad. It provides a much more fine grained security settings, and it provides per-app hardware-encrypted files. Really nice to have iff you, the *owner* are in control of the keys. Unfortunately that got Elopped: you are NOT in control. You can however install your own kernel (no special cracking required) which disables Aegis, including the good bits. Sad.

Re:Maemo/Harmattan/MeeGo even better (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39716061)

google: inception N9

Re:Maemo/Harmattan/MeeGo even better (2)

jpstanle (1604059) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715927)

I have not used the N9, but I share your sentiments on the issue of multitasking. Last year I transitioned from Maemo on my n900 to an android handset after my charging connector went on the fritz (for the second time, though this time out of warranty). While it was nice to finally have a mature ecosystem full of applications, I immediately found android's task switching to be infuriating. I had no idea what was running and what wasn't. It seemed like whether an application was merely hidden or killed outright seemed like a matter of sheer chance at first.

Maemo handled it much better, and it's interface was cleaner, more intuitive, and far more powerful. All it needed to be perfect was a small bit of polish and for developer support to reach critical mass. I miss my N900, and I wish Nokia would have stuck to its guns and doubled down on Meego/QT :(

Re:Maemo/Harmattan/MeeGo even better (1)

Aggrajag (716041) | more than 2 years ago | (#39716163)

I just bought the N9 after trying both Android and iPhone. I finally found a phone and OS that I actually like.

Current Lumia couldn't run Android (0, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39715553)

The current Lumia 900 probably couldn't even run Android. It is a single core CPU with 512MB of RAM.

I personally find it funny the Smartphone market is the inverse of the PC market. Android is a resource hungry, WP7 is not. Windows 7 is resource hungry where Linux isn't.

Slashdot community bashes Windows 7 and praises Linux. Slashdot community bashes WP7 and praises Android. Odd.

Re:Current Lumia couldn't run Android (4, Informative)

jcdr (178250) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715855)

Sorry you are wrong: I got today the Android 4.04 (ICS) update to my Nexus S, that have a single 1GHz A8 CPU and 512Mo of RAM, and it run perfectly well and smooth. In addition there is already a few hackers that run ICS on a N9, the port is not complete, but the performance is not the problem.

Nelson Muntz says... (1)

sconeu (64226) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715567)

[VOICE type="Nelson-Muntz"]
HA HA!!!
[/VOICE]

Wait a bit (4, Interesting)

Moses48 (1849872) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715573)

Wait till October. WP8 will come out and you'll see so much marketing your eyes will bleed. At least that's what my sources say.

Re:Wait a bit (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39715703)

I hope so. I've got an Android phone and an iPhone and I have to say, I really do like the Windows Phone better than either. It's different, so you have to adjust a little, but it's really quite brilliant.

Re:Wait a bit (1)

BeerCat (685972) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715839)

Can Microsoft and Nokia really afford to be the "also rans" until October? (assuming that the marketing $ to accompany WP8 boost its share)

By then, the iPhone 5 will likely be out; Samsung will have a new Galaxy. New WP phones will need to be pretty kick ass to make a dent in that.

Re:Wait a bit (1)

Missing.Matter (1845576) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715929)

New iPhones and Androids are becoming nothing more than a bump in specs. It's been that way for a good while now, and the only people who seem to really care are the internet forum dwellers. The general population just wants a phone that do not buy phones the way we do. A girl I know got an android phone for the sole reason that it was the only pink smartphone. It broke recently and she got an iPhone because she didn't like Android. Were there a pink Windows phone in the store, she probably would have bought that. While you and others on these forums are pragmatic in your cellphone choice, considering specs, features, ecosystem, etc. most people out there are completely arbitrary, and completely swayed by emotions and marketing. Microsoft doesn't need to compete with the iPhone 5 and Galaxy III... they just need to compete with their marketing.

Re:Wait a bit (1)

UnknowingFool (672806) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715941)

Pfft. Everyone knows to wait till SP1 for MS products which means Early Spring before Win8 gets the kinks out. Can Nokia last that long?

APOLLO !! BEHIND THE NONSENSE !! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39715959)

Uh-huh. That's why MS tools said October 2010. ALong the lines were gems like 3/4 of a m^HBillion dollars of marketing. Then, when the fizzle, didn't, it was, wait for the "next". That sort of was the NoDo, which was at most fixes. Then after that great white hope never went nowhere, there was, wait for the "next". That was WP7.5 (OS version 7.10). And of course, the "Nokia will be the great blonde hope" (are Finns also blkones?) that will bring the Phoenix up from the smoldering pits. So along those lines, ... here's to WP8 - APOLLO !! Bound to be the one that does it. Here it is, thought, less than six months away from release (October) and no ones knows anything about it. No tools. No nothin. I hear the fizzle, like a wet bottle rocket - a bit of noise but it aint' going nowhere !!

Oooh, smart. (5, Interesting)

RightSaidFred99 (874576) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715585)

I'm sure Nokia wants to become Just Another Android maker. That'll sure fire them up.

They're gambling. If they go Android, they'll be dead in 5 years, nothing really differentiates them there. With Windows, they may be dead in 5 years (or 2 ;) but they may also hit a home run and come out way ahead.

Contrary to what neckbeards and fanbois would have you believe, Windows Phone 7 is very nice. The only thing holding me back from WP7 is the shit, circa 2010 hardware. That they need to get a handle on, and soon.

More importantly, the convergence Windows 8 would have with an Atom based phone is very huge. You could buy a phone that could be your phone, but you could then slot into a tablet and have the same phone be your tablet. Then you could slut it into a laptop "shell" and have it be your laptop. Then plug in a keyboard and mouse and use it as your desktop. Same machine, just a little phone you plug into different "shells". For 90% of the population a dual core Atom running at ~1.6Ghz with 4Gigs of memory will be able to handle all their computing needs.

If Nokia can get in on that shit, they're golden.

Re: Oooh, smart. (4, Funny)

wed128 (722152) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715713)

Then you could slut it into a laptop "shell" and have it be your laptop.

Giggity.

Re: Oooh, smart. (4, Insightful)

thammoud (193905) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715729)

Seems to be working for Samsung. Nokia made a terrible mistake with LIMITING themselves to Windows. They should have provided both.

Re: Oooh, smart. (1)

Flipao (903929) | more than 2 years ago | (#39716029)

Seems to be working for Samsung. Nokia made a terrible mistake with LIMITING themselves to Windows. They should have provided both.

This, there is nothing stopping them from releasing Android products and no matter what they say, their WP7 phones are not that different from the ones made by HTC or Samsung. They should have at least given it a go but Elop is one of the biggest Microsoft shareholders and there's no way he'd ever let that happen so he's dragging Nokia down with him.... I'm amazed they're keeping him on the job, he's tearing the company apart.

Re: Oooh, smart. (2)

Missing.Matter (1845576) | more than 2 years ago | (#39716039)

Nokia had two good options and a third very bad one:

1) Fend for themseslves against Samsung and HTC with Android
2) Partner with Microsoft against Samsung and HTC with Windows Phone
3 (the bad one): Try to create a 5th ecosystem and still fend for themselves

For a company on the brink, billions of support and backing from Microsoft is pretty hard to turn down.

Re: Oooh, smart. (1)

alexander_686 (957440) | more than 2 years ago | (#39716169)

I am going to disagree with you here. It’s better to do one thing perfectly then two things well.

Partly this is informed by seeing Toyota Camry beat up GM’s mid size cars for decades. If Toyota figured out how to improve manufacturing of the Camry they would implement it worldwide. GM was catching up at the end – before it went bankrupt it had two different models (Chevrolet Malibu , Saturn Aura (which was a rebranded Opel)) that could hold it’s own. But it still boggled my mind that G.M. would spend so many resources duplicating itself.

Re: Oooh, smart. (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39715739)

Uh huh huh uh huh uh huh huh uh huh you said slut

Re: Oooh, smart. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39715759)

Then you could slut it into a laptop "shell" and have it be your laptop.

I think you're using a different definition of 'laptop' than most.

Re: Oooh, smart. (2)

jimicus (737525) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715899)

If "nice product" was all you needed to be a success, we'd all have HD-DVD players - and before that, Betamax VCRs.

Re: Oooh, smart. (1)

UnknowingFool (672806) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715913)

You mean the shit hardware that was imposed by MS specs? I'm not sure where your optimization comes from but I didn't see any announcement of Windows 8 for Intel tablets or phones. There was Windows 8 RT which is specifically ARM. This phone/tablet has been tried before with no luck. MS does not have a history of executing well on the first attempt.

Re: Oooh, smart. (1)

0123456 (636235) | more than 2 years ago | (#39716037)

For 90% of the population a dual core Atom running at ~1.6Ghz with 4Gigs of memory will be able to handle all their computing needs.

Shame about the twenty minute battery life.

Re: Oooh, smart. (1)

Twinbee (767046) | more than 2 years ago | (#39716145)

What makes you think Android will be dead in 5 years?

Re: Oooh, smart. (1)

Rob Y. (110975) | more than 2 years ago | (#39716191)

There was nothing preventing them from putting out Android phones *and* this end-all atom based thing that you dream of.

The Android market is competitive, but whoever has the shiniest new device does well, and that could've been a Nokia device. Currently Samsung and HTC seem to be swapping places back and forth, but they're both selling lots of hardware. If Windows Phone ever takes off, all the Android OEM's are gonna be there too, so Nokia thinking that 'having the 3rd 0S to themselves' was worth waiting till October, 2012 to have a viable system was just nuts.

They're *partially* right, see the *Meego* N9. (4, Interesting)

sethstorm (512897) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715593)

The Linux based (!=Android) N9 outsells the Windows phones despite being geographically hobbled. Microsoft's Elop is just in the way of letting it happen.

That, and despite having Aegis, the N9 is far more open out of the box. You can do all the "cool things" that the operator is thinking about as well as the things that the operator doesn't want you doing - unlike the more easily boxed-in Android platform.

Re:They're *partially* right, see the *Meego* N9. (0, Troll)

21mhz (443080) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715967)

The Linux based (!=Android) N9 outsells the Windows phones

Source?

I work for Orange UK (3, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39715601)

I work in the upgrades department, which means that people buy phones from me. I can tell you from personal experience, no one ever comes on the phone and asks "You got any of those windows phones?" My current ratio is 20 iphones for every 17 android devices to every 1 windows phone. Nobody buys them, and here's the reason: they're all inferior, by a long shot. HTC released the one series of phones a couple weeks back, android to the core. Where are the quad core phones for windows? I dont see them.

Re:I work for Orange UK (1)

sglewis100 (916818) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715809)

I work in the upgrades department, which means that people buy phones from me. I can tell you from personal experience, no one ever comes on the phone and asks "You got any of those windows phones?" My current ratio is 20 iphones for every 17 android devices to every 1 windows phone. Nobody buys them, and here's the reason: they're all inferior, by a long shot. HTC released the one series of phones a couple weeks back, android to the core. Where are the quad core phones for windows? I dont see them.

I'm not sure about your numbers. Besides being slightly anecdotal, you went from nobody wants Windows, to 1 in 38 want Windows. All joking aside, nobody is going to release a quad core phone for Windows, the OS isn't ready for it, and the spec doesn't call for it. Nokia is capable of slapping a better processor in a case, there's just really no reason to do so at this time.

Re:I work for Orange UK (2)

BeefMcHuge (1594193) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715935)

Why does everyone care about quad-core phones? I currently have a htc 7 pro windows 7 phone (tbh not sure of the specs) and the interface is as snappy as any android phone I looked at. Its battery life is better and it makes calls. I also love the interface, I don't think I can ever go back to the icon interface of android/iOS. I keep up with facebook/twitter/google+ and watch a few videos on the phone and it does these things very well. Why do I need a quadcore? The screen is to small to "game on" but it runs your normal phone games (i.e. angry birds etc) just fine. I know that over time programs require more power but I have yet to see anything that this HTC pro 7 cant do better then my old android. I bet most people feel the same way. While power is nice what exactly will you do with it? I know when my gaming PC starts getting old because it cant run the newest games at max settings anymore but my phone? I have yet to see anything it does sluggishly and because its a phone (you know, the thing you make calls on) I would prefer that I did not have to charge it every 3 hours because the extra processing power is eating up the battery.

Re:I work for Orange UK (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39716077)

Why does everyone care about quad-core phones?

The same reason people want whatever camera "has the most megapixels." [xkcd.com]

One of the other phone discussions even had a few people posting about how phone reviews are caught up entirely on the number of cores, not even how fast they are or how many are active on the phone, just how many are on the board.

Re:I work for Orange UK (1)

nefnet13 (1735408) | more than 2 years ago | (#39716011)

You do realize that hardware is only part of the experience of owning a device, right?

Good software can make up for *some* deficiencies in hardware. That being said, Windows Phones would have a lot easier time competing if they could check off a couple more spec boxes, and Nokia can't build a new camera stack soon enough; the UI is nice but it could perform LOTS better.

The chicken was born from a egg (1)

del_diablo (1747634) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715613)

While it might seem obvious now, now that Android has a decent looking Ecosystem. But look at this, in 2-3 months time, perhaps Microsofts stratergy regarding how to handle its Xbox live intigration with phones, might pay off? Perhaps some of us will get a Windows Phone, merely to get access to the markedplace.
This seems to be a case of hatching a egg to get a chicken, too stave away that pesky chicken and the egg problem. Of course, it might also fail, this is Microsoft and Nokia, with Nokia as the bottom and possible losing chesspiece in a match.

Nokia would sell better with Android software? (0)

zaxbowow (1590757) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715669)

More like Nokia hardware would run slower, more laggy and have to be rebooted frequently with Android on it. BTW: WP7 devices now have all top 5 spots [amazon.com] for devices on Amazon rated by customer satisfaction

Re:Nokia would sell better with Android software? (1)

cyber-vandal (148830) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715795)

Amazon ratings of course are far more relevant than sales figures.

Re:Nokia would sell better with Android software? (0, Troll)

21mhz (443080) | more than 2 years ago | (#39716183)

There are best seller ratings [amazon.com] , too. Lumia 900 topped the chart for more than a week immediately after the sales start, despite being split into two separate items by color. Now the black variant is at #3, and cyan went down to #11, after becoming backordered up to 9 days ahead.

Re:Nokia would sell better with Android software? (2, Interesting)

Nerdfest (867930) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715843)

I'm sure that's completely astroturf-free as well. MS has been putting a lot of effort into astroturfing reviews, pimping their phone on developer sites, and even shilling here as far as I can tell. They may be able to buy their way into being a viable mobile OS, but they'll need to get a bit more subtle about it. Like many of heir previous marketing, the current efforts are a little embarrassing.

Re:Nokia would sell better with Android software? (1)

dmesg0 (1342071) | more than 2 years ago | (#39716005)

The problem is most people don't understand what's going on and believe all those fake reviews.

IMHO Amazon should do something about it, it hurts their reputation as well. Or maybe they receive a nice compensation from MS for turning a blind eye on astoturfing?

Re:Nokia would sell better with Android software? (3, Informative)

dmesg0 (1342071) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715915)

I went through a lot of Lumia 900 reviews on Amazon. Most of them repeat the same stuff. And for most of the reviews, Lumia 900 is the only review, nothing else ever reviewed. Several reviewers had the same text posted on different colors of Lumia 900 and had no other reviews.

My guess is that MS/Nokia shills are everywhere, not just on Slashdot...

Re:Nokia would sell better with Android software? (1)

dmesg0 (1342071) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715943)

s/for most of the reviews/for most of the reviewers/

Re:Nokia would sell better with Android software? (1)

busyqth (2566075) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715919)

Well at least we now know where Microsoft's marketing budget is going...

two articles everyone should read (1)

quantic_oscillation7 (973678) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715673)

Communities Dominate Brands: These Steps or Nokia is No More - the way back to profits and growth http://goo.gl/fzi3u [goo.gl] Communities Dominate Brands: Nokia Profit Warning (again) - Here is what you need to know why it is actually far worse http://goo.gl/MZxIA [goo.gl]

In other news... (3, Interesting)

Missing.Matter (1845576) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715679)

In other news the Lumia 900 is topping the charts at Amazon, selling out there, and selling out at AT&T stores and online. AT&T recently stated that the launch is exceeding expectations, which couldn't have been very low given the giant marketing blitz behind the device. Further, TFA states: "Rival operator T-Mobile says the Lumia 710 is among its most popular phones."

So where's the disconnect? Right here: "Microsoft's software worked nicely with PCs and allowed you 'to do tons of cool things,' but few customers knew this." So wait, you're telling me that people don't know about Windows Phone, so they don't ask for it, so it won't sell, so you don't want to sell it? It's circular. How about you tell people about it, maybe they'll like it, and then maybe it will sell, then maybe you'll want to sell more? People buy what they know, and as AT&T and T-Mobile are showing, if you advertise a device, it will sell. This doesn't say anything about the relative merits of the operating system, unlike what this summary is trying to imply.

Re:In other news... (3, Informative)

zaxbowow (1590757) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715755)

Amen brother. More like Nokia hardware would run slower, more laggy and have to be rebooted frequently with Android on it. BTW: WP7 devices now have all top 5 spots [amazon.com] for devices on Amazon rated by customer satisfaction I know I posted this already. It beared repeating, and you comment beared elevation.

Re:In other news... (1)

Missing.Matter (1845576) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715981)

Heh... I was just looking through some of the names on that list. I didn't realize some phones had such ridiculous names as "Galaxy S II Epic Touch 4G" "DROID RAZR MAXX 4G"

Re:In other news... (1)

erroneus (253617) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715765)

Android didn't need this when it got out there. All it needed was association with Google and people went for it. It was all about the brand and reputation. At the time, Google was good. At the time, Microsoft was bad. Now, Google is "undecided" and Microsoft is still bad.

Re:In other news... (3, Informative)

Missing.Matter (1845576) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715835)

No, the biggest reason for Android's success was the Motorola Droid being launched on Verizon, the nation's largest cellular carrier, as an alternative to the iPhone. People were *clamouring* for an iPhone, but couldn't get it because itw as AT&T exclusive. The G1 on T-Mobile was an absolute dog, and Android floundered for a couple years until it caught on with Verizon. It was a gigantic void waiting to be filled, and Android was lucky enough to fill it first. It had *nothing* to do with Google's brand, and everything to do with it being the only viable smartphone on the nation's largest carrier.

Re:In other news... (1)

CubicleZombie (2590497) | more than 2 years ago | (#39716203)

People were *clamouring* for an iPhone, but couldn't get it because itw as AT&T exclusive.

I wanted something iPhone like that wasn't an iPhone. Didn't really matter who the carrier was. In fact, I went from AT&T to Verizon to get it.

Now I want my old phone back because I don't trust Android and I'm sick of ads on everything.

Sorry, but no. (2, Insightful)

erroneus (253617) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715731)

No amount of marketing money would convince users to use a Windows phone. And seriously, it wouldn't matter if it was identical to iPhone, pixel-for-pixel. People don't want Microsoft on their phones. They think it means it will crash. It doesn't matter what reality is. It just doesn't.

Re:Sorry, but no. (1)

Skapare (16644) | more than 2 years ago | (#39716013)

They real test is if they will want to replace Windows with Android for their PC back home.

Re:Sorry, but no. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39716119)

As opposed to crashing ios android and linux? At least reboots clear up most of microsoft's issues.

Windows 8 (1)

DCstewieG (824956) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715811)

I think Microsoft is just sitting back waiting until Windows 8 comes out. Most people will learn about the new Windows and Metro no matter what, then they just have to be shown the phone that works like what they [now] already know (and, for Microsoft's sake, hopefully like).

Malware (1)

Skapare (16644) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715867)

But isn't the wide open Android market full of malware? What are they gonna do about that?

But is it $10B easier to sell? (1)

scorp1us (235526) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715869)

Offering $100 rebate on a $99 phone means 100 million free phones... (Using the $10B MS gave Nokia) that's a lot of phones by anyone's standards. But it'll be pathetic if WP7 isn't worth paying for... and unless sales are at least modest, that is the market verdict.

From all accounts the N9 was the pinnacle of Nokia engineering. People *wanted* it. But alas, Nokia would not sell it in any market that matters.

duh? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39715923)

What else to say?

Re:duh? (1)

Eponymous Hero (2090636) | more than 2 years ago | (#39716059)

just this: cool story bro

Microsoft fucked Nokia Hard (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39715961)

Microsoft could not have done a better job of killing Nokia if they actually purchased them and started instituting anal cavity searches for all customers.

The only question I have is why?

No one comes into the store and asks for a Windows (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39715975)

And thats why Windows 8 is a Fail boat.

Nokia rolled the dice (1)

Mannfred (2543170) | more than 2 years ago | (#39715995)

The big marketing hurdle of Nokia isn't going to be in pushing Windows Phone - once Windows 8 launches and the Metro UI becomes ubiquitous then more people will be comfortable with it on their phones as well.

The big marketing problem for Nokia will be in convincing people to shell extra for a Nokia branded Windows Phone - I've been satisfied with my (cheaper) HTC Windows Phone with largely the same functionality and apps for the past 11 months.

This is coincidentally the same problem they'd face in the Android handset market as well.

MS History Lesson (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39716027)

MS has a history of not putting any effort behind mobile OSes and mobile devices. Can't say as I blame them but they don't see the big picture.

Apple and Google both know what they are - nifty tech companies. They make nifty gadgets (and in the case of Google, nifty tech, too) and don't get too bogged down in one market niche. Is Apple a computer company? Yes and No. Is Apple an MP3 player company? Yes and No. Is Google a search engine? Yes and No. Is Google an OS company? Yes and No. You can't define them by what they sell and they sell whatever you want to buy.

MS, on the other hand, is a software company - cut and dried. They weren't always just that but their two big successes in Windows and in Office atrophied their legs and stranded them in that position. Now they will live or die by Windows and Office.

Dude (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39716031)

Nokia would sell better with a pack of fishsticks. At least then you'd have _some_ fun.

Probably better for the finnish economy too.

really? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39716049)

Wait...its tough to get traction when youre a new offering and theres two big players in the market?

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