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Macbook Owner With Defective GPU Beats Apple In Court

Unknown Lamer posted more than 2 years ago | from the justice-actually-served dept.

Portables (Apple) 280

New submitter RockoW writes "A few years ago, Apple sold defective computers of the MacBook Pro line. They had the defective Nvidia 8600M GT GPU. In this case Apple refused to take the computer back and issue me a refund. Instead, they promised to replace the 8600M GT boards when they failed, up to four years from the date of purchase. Three years later, the MacBook Pro failed and they refused to replace it. This guy took them to the court and won by their own means."

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280 comments

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Cool, but... (-1, Flamebait)

MoronGames (632186) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724395)

This is a huge problem for almost every manufacturer. Take a look at the HP DV series of laptops for example. Why are we picking on Apple and not the GPU manufacturers here?

Re:Cool, but... (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39724419)

Apple charges top dollar for their hardware.

You would feel bad about "picking on them" for why?

Re:Cool, but... (5, Informative)

CnlPepper (140772) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724427)

Apple is responsible for the products it supplies. It is up to Apple to seek damages from Nvidia, not the consumers.

Re:Cool, but... (3, Informative)

JoeMerchant (803320) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724983)

In my case, the GPU wasn't at fault, it was Apple's faulty application of heat sink compound that caused the chip to fail.

Re:Cool, but... (1, Insightful)

Tough Love (215404) | more than 2 years ago | (#39725147)

Apple's rapacious greed knows no bounds.

Agreement (5, Insightful)

Bananatree3 (872975) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724431)

Apple got slammed in court for one simple reason: they guaranteed replacement for 4 years. 3 years in, they reneged on their promise. Simple, blatant double talk.

The customer had the documentation to prove his case, and he won.

Re:Agreement (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39724571)

That can't be right...

How could that customer create forgeries and attack Apple and get away with it?!

The nerve of some people.

Re:Agreement (0, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39724705)

That can't be right...

How could that customer create forgeries and attack Apple and get away with it?!

The nerve of some people.

The judge must have been a fandroid.

Re:Agreement (3, Funny)

binarylarry (1338699) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724707)

Agreed. Fuck this guy.

He should be banished from Apple Island and be forced to walk the cursed earth... using Windows Phone.

Re:Agreement (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39724857)

And lo, it is written in the Book of Jobs that whosoever should cast aspersions upon the Name of Apple and contradict the infallible Word of Dogcow shall be cast from the Kingdom of iHeaven to forever walk the cursed earth with phones containing the mark of the Green Beast, That Which Holds Back Enlightenment. And when the time of His second coming occurs, the earth-walkers and their foul Green Beast shall be destroyed by His Disapproving Glare and the believers shall inherit the iEarth. So it was written, so shall it be done in the name of our LORD, Steven Jobs, sosumi. Let us pray.

Re:Agreement (4, Funny)

jd2112 (1535857) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724917)

Agreed. Fuck this guy.

He should be banished from Apple Island and be forced to walk the cursed earth... using Windows Phone.

I think that forcing Windows Phone on him counts as cruel and unusual punishment.

Re:Cool, but... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39724433)

A) I don't see how this is "picking on Apple" and I especially fail to see how we're picking on Apple since yours is the first post.

B) If HP had made a public statement that they would replace all DV laptops if the graphics card failed, and then refused to replace a laptop when the card died, and the owner then sued HP and won, I'm pretty sure that would also be pretty likely to make it to the Slashdot front page.

Re:Cool, but... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39724439)

You mean nVidia. AMD/ATI did not have this problem.

Re:Cool, but... (4, Insightful)

acid06 (917409) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724441)

Because Apple is the company which promised to replace his laptop up to 4 years after the date of purchase if it failed but then refused to replace it 3 years later?
Sure, the problem is with the GPU, but since Apple itself *promised* to do something for a customer, they should respect their own words.

Re:Cool, but... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39724771)

They probably ran out of mainboards with that chip given the failure rate...

Re:Cool, but... (4, Insightful)

jedidiah (1196) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724895)

Not an excuse. They are a "premium luxury" brand. If they couldn't do right by the customer with the parts they had on hand then they should have given the customer a better replacement.

THIS is what separates the real "quality" brands from the ones that are just over hyped by mindless consipicous consumers.

Re:Cool, but... (4, Insightful)

CosaNostra Pizza Inc (1299163) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724443)

This is a huge problem for almost every manufacturer. Take a look at the HP DV series of laptops for example. Why are we picking on Apple and not the GPU manufacturers here?

maybe because Apple reneged on their promise. That's reason enough.

Re:Cool, but... (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39724445)

because it was their duty to replace and they tried to get out of it
it's up to apple to take it to the component manufacturer if they believe they're failing more than an acceptable amount of the time

Re:Cool, but... (4, Informative)

Nominei (1998390) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724455)

Nvidia settled a class action lawsuit about these GPUs.

(link: http://www.techspot.com/news/43614-customers-get-shafted-in-nvidia-class-action-suit.html [techspot.com] )

Re:Cool, but... (3, Funny)

jd2112 (1535857) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724965)

Thats the problem. The lawyers made millions and all Apple got was a $10 coupon off thier next nvidia purchase.

Re:Cool, but... (2)

gl4ss (559668) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724467)

cool story bro but apple sold it to consumer and the boards were only replaceable by apple and only available through apple..

Re:Cool, but... (-1, Troll)

Sarten-X (1102295) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724477)

Because this is Slashdot. Apple is that evil bad nasty walled-garden company that makes products those filthy commoners like, and has grown huge doing it. Those GPU suppliers also make the nice hardware we use, though, so we don't complain about them nearly as much.

Re:Cool, but... (1, Insightful)

Moheeheeko (1682914) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724537)

So when the engine Lotus used in their car blows up, we should let Lotus off and complain at Toyota right? Your sig is very fitting here.

Re:Cool, but... (4, Insightful)

gl4ss (559668) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724701)

dunno, but if I bought a lotus from lotus and it blew up I'd complain to lotus - not to the company that was contracted to do the piece that broke. it's not like brembo(or whatever) is responsible to consumers for toyotas brake problems..

toyotas brakes fail and people don't go complaining to brembo..

Re:Cool, but... (4, Insightful)

XxtraLarGe (551297) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724749)

Because this is Slashdot. Apple is that evil bad nasty walled-garden company that makes products those filthy commoners like...

No. I'm a Mac user, and Apple has always done the right thing if something went wrong with the hardware on my computer, but in this case they were wrong. They went back on a promise, they should be held responsible.

Re:Cool, but... (1)

Moheeheeko (1682914) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724489)

Because they knowingly used bad parts and then refused to correct the mistake, when they promised they would. Plus on other laptops its not as impossible to replace parts as it is on a Macbook, so he couln't very well complain to NVIDIA and have them send him a new GPU.

Re:Cool, but... (1)

dietdew7 (1171613) | more than 2 years ago | (#39725161)

They didn't 'knowingly use bad parts'. As far I know none of the manufacturers knew ahead of time they would have a problem. I have a Dell laptop that was part of this whole mess.

Re:Cool, but... (5, Insightful)

Ecuador (740021) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724493)

Because they admitted in court that it would not cost them anything to fix it, nVidia was paying the bill, but they still refused and they didn't even have an argument on why they were refusing. They just wanted to make it hard for their customer. RTFA, the description of how the trial went is comedy gold.
I've had enough horror stories with with Apple products around me to not be surprised, it seems that for every iphone they replace no-questions-asked they void the warranty on a few iMacs just to balance it out. Since the average apple customer thinks Apple can do no wrong, these incidents usually don't generate any fuss.
Good for the OP!

Re:Cool, but... (2)

mark-t (151149) | more than 2 years ago | (#39725173)

...they didn't even have an argument on why they were refusing

Actually, they did... it just wasn't a very good argument.

Their argument basically amounted to the company simply adhering to its own policies... although admittedly the article was sketchy on what policies those were that would actually deny the repair.

Re:Cool, but... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39724495)

Well, easy-to-understand terms: I buy a car from GM. This car uses an electrothermic flange belt also used by Ford and Chrysler. The part is found to be defective across all manufacturers. Ford, Chrysler, and GM all take steps to replace this part for their owners. GM then decides not to honor their obligation to a consumer such as yourself who has bought the car, and is taken to court.

In the situation above, is GM being "picked on"?

In the situation above, should I as a consumer in any way give a shit who made the part for my car? If I buy a hamburger from McDonald's and the beef gives me anal cancer, do I take action against the meat distributor?

Re:Cool, but... (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39724801)

If I buy a hamburger from McDonald's and the beef gives me anal cancer, do I take action against the meat distributor?

Obviously not, don't be ridiculous. You take it up with the cow.

Re:Cool, but... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39724499)

Because Apple designed, tested, picked the parts for and finally sold this device. And if a component turns out to be of poor quality, Apple can to work it out with the GPU manufacturer while the person buying Apple's stuff can work it out with Apple. What's so wrong about that?

Re:Cool, but... (4, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39724517)

This is a huge problem for almost every manufacturer.

And Apple is one of the few who gets apologists jumping in to defend them by pointing this out.

Re:Cool, but... (0)

MobileTatsu-NJG (946591) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724737)

Haters breed apologists. Think about that next time you support a double standard.

Re:Cool, but... (5, Insightful)

jedidiah (1196) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724923)

You've got it backwards.

It's the shills and apologists that breed haters.

If there were less mindless hype surrounding Apple, there would simply be less of a story here. Although if Apple just lived up to their supposed reputation there wouldn't have been any story at all.

Re:Cool, but... (1)

MobileTatsu-NJG (946591) | more than 2 years ago | (#39725011)

Okay, fine, I'll concede to it being a cycle. You're still not going to shut up any apologists even if they are, like in this story, clearly in the wrong. They'll try harder the next time around.

 

Re:Cool, but... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39724987)

What double standard? There's plenty of hate on other companies. Google, MS, Facebook, Sony, you name it. Those don't see the level of apologists as Apple gets

Haters don't breed apologists. Fanboys do.

Re:Cool, but... (1)

MobileTatsu-NJG (946591) | more than 2 years ago | (#39725107)

What double standard? There's plenty of hate on other companies. Google, MS, Facebook, Sony, you name it.

Yeah, they all have equal hate, that's why Microsoft has never been mentioned here as working with Foxconn, right?

Haters don't breed apologists. Fanboys do.

Heh. Yeah, people just kept coming out of the woodwork and started apologizing for no reason. Haters, sick of the apologies coming from out of nowhere, decided to combat them by finding stories that made the fanboys' company look bad.

Yeah, you really thought that one through, didn't you?

Re:Cool, but... (1)

cpu6502 (1960974) | more than 2 years ago | (#39725165)

I don't hate Apple.
I hate their fans, because they seem to believe Apple is god (i.e. flawless). There was a time I would have said Amiga was better than Apple, and Apple was better than Microsoft (90s).

For that reason I used Amigas and Macs frequently, but with the stability of the Windows NT OS (specficially XP and 7), there's very little difference. Yes MS has flaws but so too does Apple; to pretend apple is flawless seems ridiculous. THAT is why her fans annoy me.

Re:Cool, but... (1)

nxcho (754392) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724545)

Because Apple makes and in many cases retails the end user product. In most countries, either the manufacturer or the retailer is responsible for consumer complaints and warranties. It's the car manufacturer who is responsible for the faulty floor mat, even if it is made by a subcontractor.

Re:Cool, but... (4, Insightful)

sjames (1099) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724555)

Because it's up to Apple to replace the Apple hardware. They are then free to seek damages from the GPU manufacturer.

Re:Cool, but... (4, Informative)

cjcela (1539859) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724599)

Don't be so blind. The customer purchased the computer AND an extended warranty from Apple. The GPU manufacturer said to all parties they will foot the bill for the defective hardware. The repair was free for Apple, but they decided to take this customer to court just because. Then, in court, they lied to the judge, saying that the hardware was different, etc. Apple is usually good with warranties, but notoriously for forcing their way on everybody, be it for good or bad. In this case, they were wrong, and behave like morons, and drag one of their customers to court. It is infuriating.

Re:Cool, but... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39724621)

Simple, follow the money. In the case of a laptop (e.g. from Apple) you buy it from Apple. You do not pay the GPU manufacturer, Apple does that.

Apple is responsible to the buyer because they took the buyer's money.
The GPU manufacturer is responsible to Apple as they took Apple's money.

Re:Cool, but... (2)

uniquename72 (1169497) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724691)

This is a huge problem for almost every manufacturer. Take a look at the HP DV series of laptops for example. Why are we picking on Apple and not the GPU manufacturers here?

Because this story is about Apple, not HP or Nvidia. RTFA.

Re:Cool, but... (1)

Vicarius (1093097) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724979)

We'd love to RTFA, but the website is still slashdotted and does not load.

Re:Cool, but... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39725195)

Several years ago I had a Compaq laptop with a GPU that failed. As far as I know, the fault was not Nvidia's, it was HP's. The motherboard wasn't well designed and would flex an unreasonable amount due to thermal stress. This had the effect of eventually causing the solder on the BGA to separate and lose contact. I probably could have reflowed it, but it would have only been a temporary fix until the motherboard flexed enough for the problem to happen again.

If You're Going To Make Promises ... (4, Insightful)

WrongSizeGlass (838941) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724415)

If Apple promised to replace parts they knew to be defective for up to four years then they'd better step up. The court costs far outweighed the costs of replacing the GPU in his MacBook (and probably 100's of others). The cost of the bad press? It seems Apple has always been willing to test the patience of their customers' loyalties.

Re:If You're Going To Make Promises ... (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39724461)

My macbook pro 2.2GHz with the 8600 died 3.75 years after purchase. Apple replaced the motherboard for no charge, even exchanged my old magsafe (which was recalled) for a new (better design imho) one and even gave me a new USB keyboard for my 4 year old one with a stickey key.

Re:If You're Going To Make Promises ... (1, Interesting)

noh8rz3 (2593935) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724469)

Apple promised to replace parts they knew to be defective for up to four years

this seems reasonable for me. It's not like all parts were defective - there was a higher error rate. Normally the computers have a 1 year warrantee, and you can buy a 3 year for $200 I think. Because of the nvidia thing they extended the warrantee from 1 year to 4 for free on the affected part. This is standard for product manufacturing - if there's an indication of a problem, offer longer warantees.

The issue seems to be apple not honoring their promise within the four year window. but this sounds like isolated cases, and could be for any number of reasons (user voids warrantee, the problem turns out to be a different part, etc). Without knowing the deets we can't rule on if it's egregious or not

in general, I've found the genius bar people to be extraordinarily generous in fixing issues, often for free when it was my fault. Once I cracked my iPad LCD and they gave me a replacement refurbished one for free.

not to mention the benefits of talking to genius bar people for support, rather than calling some foolio in india.

Re:If You're Going To Make Promises ... (1)

jbov (2202938) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724767)

It's not like all parts were defective

Because of the nvidia thing they extended the warrantee from 1 year to 4 for free on the affected part.

The problem is the damage caused by an overheating GPU extends beyond the GPU itself. I'm not sure how Apple, HP, or any other manufacturer got away with replacing the GPU with the same known-to-be-defective GPU in the first place. All in all, if Apple provided a 4 year replacement for the part, it sure beats the 1 year extended warranty service, with a 90 day warranty after each service, that HP provided.

Re:If You're Going To Make Promises ... (0, Troll)

cpu6502 (1960974) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724921)

>>> this sounds like isolated cases, and could be for any number of reasons (user voids warrantee, the problem turns out to be a different part, etc).

Apparently the court disagreed. A warranty is a warranty. This reminds me of Toyota refusing to replace engines that had failed after only ~25,000 miles. They claimed the blame belonged to the customer, and forced owners to shell-out ~$6000 on new engines for their 1-2 year old cars/trucks. (It was later discovered the engines were running too hot, thus causing the oil to sludge, and not the customers' fault.)

The civil lawsuit eventually sided with the customers and Toyota had to reimburse them for their fees. I will NEVER understand why these corporations like Apple/Toyota think they can offer a warranty, and then not honor said warranty. Maybe they believe the customers will not bother seeking legal recompense.

Re:If You're Going To Make Promises ... (4, Informative)

v1 (525388) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724755)

If Apple promised to replace parts they knew to be defective for up to four years then they'd better step up. The court costs far outweighed the costs of replacing the GPU in his MacBook (and probably 100's of others). The cost of the bad press? It seems Apple has always been willing to test the patience of their customers' loyalties.

For more details on the problem check this link [apple.com] . Here's the header:

In July 2008, NVIDIA publicly acknowledged a higher than normal failure rate for some of their graphics processors due to a packaging defect. At that same time, NVIDIA assured Apple that Mac computers with these graphics processors were not affected. However, after an Apple-led investigation, Apple has determined that some MacBook Pro computers with the NVIDIA GeForce 8600M GT graphics processor may be affected. If the NVIDIA graphics processor in your MacBook Pro has failed, or fails within four years of the original date of purchase, a repair will be done free of charge, even if your MacBook Pro is out of warranty.

I'm surprised anyone has been refused replacement inside 4 years. I bet I've repaired around 170 of these units for this problem, and I have only just recently started seeing Apple refuse a warranty repair, because the computers are starting to cross 4 years old. The only time I see problems of this nature is if they purchase old stock and don't register. Apple assumes a computer is sold 30 days after manufacture if you don't send in your registration. If you need warranty service and are on the edge you may need to submit your proof of purchase to update your purchase date on record with Apple to get warranty coverage. Maybe that played into this case?

And this problem stems not from Apple, but from Nvidia. I started seeing this issue on new machines a few months after this model was first released, and Apple started going rounds with Nvidia around the 10 month mark, just before these machines were going to start falling out of the 1 year warranty. Nvidia insisted this was not a defect and refused to cover anything. We had to start refusing repairs for some machines after the 1 year mark. Then about 2 months after that I found that Apple had gotten sick of Nvidia stalling and denying, and decided to cover these repairs, before they had even gotten Nvidia to budge. Apple sent notice to users that had paid for a repair that would now be considered covered, and refunds were issued. Apple started the repair extension program for this issue and covered repairs from that point forward. This was months before Nvidia was forced to accept responsibility and start reimbursing Apple for the defect.

So I find it unfortunate that Apple is receiving a lot of FUD and bad press on this. They do tend to go the extra mile for their customers, they're consistently rated at the TOP for customer service. They were footing the bill for Nvidia's screw-up long before they were guaranteed of getting anything back. Try to find an example of that from any of the other computer manufacturers out there.

Re:If You're Going To Make Promises ... (1)

cpu6502 (1960974) | more than 2 years ago | (#39725013)

>>>Try to find an example of that from any of the other computer manufacturers out there

My Commodore Plus/4 died after just 1.1 years, so even though the warranty had already expired, Commodore gave me a brand-new 128. Has Apple ever done anything like that (free upgrade to the latest model Mac)?

Re:If You're Going To Make Promises ... (1)

noh8rz3 (2593935) | more than 2 years ago | (#39725185)

maybe they didn't have any C4s on hand. I broke my iPad (my fault) and they gave me a refurbished one for free. Not the newest model, but not too shabby nonetheless.

Re:If You're Going To Make Promises ... (4, Insightful)

StikyPad (445176) | more than 2 years ago | (#39725067)

They were footing the bill for Nvidia's screw-up

No, they were footing the bill for their own screw-up. The part may have been defective, and nVidia may have made it, but Apple approved it for use in their own products based on, clearly, insufficient validation that the part met their standards. In the real world, that's how it works.

Re:If You're Going To Make Promises ... (1)

scharkalvin (72228) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724905)

And now that there is a precedent Apple will have to make good on EVERY similar failed Macbook. And thanks to /. every geek that owns one knows this.

Re:If You're Going To Make Promises ... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39725069)

Cost of the bad press? My guess is zero.

It just works. (5, Insightful)

i kan reed (749298) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724429)

I remember that slogan. Not too long ago even. Before that it was "Think different" and buy the most common mp3 player on the planet. I dislike apple because I dislike marketing, and Apple is like an avatar of marketing; the essence of style over substance given form.

Re:It just works. (-1, Troll)

spire3661 (1038968) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724519)

I use apple gear every day in my line of work (mostly the mobile stuff). They may be stylish, but they also PERFORM. So many of you marketing haters forget that their gear actually fucking performs, esp. in the hands of a skilled user. I hand built my own (very high performance) computers for over 15 years, yet im typing this on a store bought mac (screaming fast PC right next to it)...... Techies wouldnt buy the stuff if it didnt do work for them.

Re:It just works. (3, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39724807)

So many of you marketing haters forget that their gear actually fucking performs, esp. in the hands of a skilled user.

Mod up, we have someone who knows how to hold their iToys right! Everyone, crowd around his wisdom and experience, we have much to learn.

Re:It just works. (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39724811)

Way to attack a point he never made....

He said their MARKETING causes dislike for him, not their performance.

Get your Macinpanties out of a bunch please.

Re:It just works. (3, Insightful)

bobbutts (927504) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724841)

"hand built" You mean you slapped some components into a case and installed your own OS? It appears you can't OUTPERFORM a Mac for a fraction of the price like the rest of us system builders, which makes you a failure as well

Re:It just works. (0)

Amouth (879122) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724889)

let me know how it "preform"s in 2-3 years while on the road, as the battery needs to be replaced and you have to dismantle it or send it off to them.. also would love to see a work study done to show the loss of efficiency due to only having a single mouse button.

Re:It just works. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39725201)

This is a good point. My English teacher invited all students to bring their laptops to class yesterday and guess where 1/4 of the PC laptop users had to sit: right next to a wall outlet because their batteries won't last.

I've had my MacBook pro for > 3 years and it still holds a good charge (~3-4 hours under web browsing condition).

Re:It just works. (1)

PeanutButterBreath (1224570) | more than 2 years ago | (#39725047)

. . .esp. in the hands of a skilled user.

Current Apple products are intended for the mass-market consumer. On shouldn't have to be some kind of elite user in order to enjoy an advantage.

BTW, I also use Apple gear every day in my line of work (mostly desktop stuff), and I am writing this from a store bought Mac that just had to have its failing hard drive replaced (which it took some "genius" four days to complete).

Re:It just works. (1)

firex726 (1188453) | more than 2 years ago | (#39725109)

I have to agree.

There are more powerful devices then Apple ones, but how you interact with them also counts for something.

Re:It just works. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39724639)

I'm sorry, I know our posters say "think differently" but our real slogan is "no refunds."

Can't you open your Mapple menu and click on the compassion bar?

Re:It just works. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39724709)

I remember that slogan. Not too long ago even.

I do not, nor does the US Patent and Trademark office (At least, not for Apple.)

Can you please cite a source for it?

Slashdotted (0)

d3ac0n (715594) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724435)

Yep, page is already down.

Re:Slashdotted (1, Informative)

d3ac0n (715594) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724665)

Whoops! Scratch that. It loaded, but slowly.

Re:Slashdotted (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39724805)

It's down now :P

Not what you think (4, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39724481)

I did in warrantied repairs for an Apple authorized service provider for two years. I can't tell you how many of these repairs apple picked up the tab on. I have never seen another computer company take as much responsibility as they have on this issue. The repair to replace the logic board that contained the defective GPU was a $1700 repair from a third-party authorized repair center and I did an average of 2 to 3 a week for 2 years.

Try stacking up those numbers against any other computer companies defective products in what they did to fix them

Re:Not what you think (1)

mehrotra.akash (1539473) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724551)

If it costs $1700 to replace a GPU, something is VERY wrong

Re:Not what you think (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39724583)

Re read. 1700 to replace the logic board. The board cost 1400 itself from apple. That is the whole board that makes up the computer. Just an FYI

Re:Not what you think (1)

Ryanrule (1657199) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724869)

Yeah, that board costs like a third of that at most. Someone got rich. Someone always gets rich.

Re:Not what you think (1)

J. T. MacLeod (111094) | more than 2 years ago | (#39725051)

The cost of replacement boards is high due to small supply, not due to cost of manufacturing (because manufacturing is what they're no longer doing).

Re:Not what you think (1)

mehrotra.akash (1539473) | more than 2 years ago | (#39725101)

A lot of components: CPU,RAM,HDD,Wireless cards,etc are still removable arent they?
Its the motherboard+GPU thats being replaced right? (Atleast thats the way it is in my laptop, maybe Macbooks are special, IDK)
Then again, my entire laptop cost $700

Re:Not what you think (1)

firex726 (1188453) | more than 2 years ago | (#39725129)

Yea, these were laptops, it's not a $1700 video card/GPU like in a desktop. Replacing the mobo/logic board/system board is basically swapping out the entire computer.

Re:Not what you think (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39725159)

Yeah and? That's too much money. When I owned a MBP I had a horrible time getting apple to fix anything, as a matter of fact they regularly denied problems and their people seemed to be instructed to all tell me that anything wrong with my machine was "something they'd never seen before, huh" Every person I talked to on the phone seemed to say this, every person at the apple store said this.. it was always very forced and unnatural and unprompted. This was on problems that seemed to be very common on internet forums.

Oh and apple deleting my threads, and apple denying the problems for months and then issuing a patch a day after I spoke to an engineer who had "never heard of" the problem I was having and had fixed. The fact they put me on the line with an engineer after I said I had a workaround.

Also telling me an extended warranty was like 3 or 400 because I had "a professional product" and then looking at me like I was crazy for asking for an onsite warranty (You know like the one professionals with other laptops get, apple doesn't have such a thing for any of their products). I'm on call because I'm a professional I can't give you my laptop and it's full of secrets anyhow.

Implied quality is clearly more important than actual quality, I've never had more hardware failures in any machine I've ever owned. It was also the most expensive computer I'd ever bought both in upfront cost and maintenance. The warranty was beyond useless I will not lose my machine and risk wiping it for something I could fix myself. (Yeah I know I can backup, but by the time I've backed up, packed up, and shipped off, picked up, unpacked, and restored.... I've given the same time investment I could have gotten with my warranty and had to use a shit loaner laptop with none of the software I need for 3 weeks, professional product indeed)

No onsite warranty at any price.. a premium "professional product". They sell premium feelings to people who want to feel like they're professionals by spending more money.

iGPU (1)

Frankie70 (803801) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724939)

It's an iGPU - not just a regular GPU. It's welded to a lot of other things. All of those things have to be replaced.

Re:iGPU (1)

mehrotra.akash (1539473) | more than 2 years ago | (#39725123)

"i" as in Apple's "i", or integrated?

Re:Not what you think (1)

gl4ss (559668) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724759)

I did in warrantied repairs for an Apple authorized service provider for two years. I can't tell you how many of these repairs apple picked up the tab on. I have never seen another computer company take as much responsibility as they have on this issue. The repair to replace the logic board that contained the defective GPU was a $1700 repair from a third-party authorized repair center and I did an average of 2 to 3 a week for 2 years.

Try stacking up those numbers against any other computer companies defective products in what they did to fix them

it's not like they had any choice on picking up the tab. they were known to be defective(anyhow, due to accounting/tax reasons it's helpful for them to upmark the replacement board which they were "paying" for.)..

Re:Not what you think (1)

Jesus_666 (702802) | more than 2 years ago | (#39725023)

In my experience Apple is usually pretty good with replacing stuff that is broken on arrival. If I remember correctly they reacted to the Geforce bug fairly quickly once it was confirmed by Nvidia and back in the iBook days they made trading in the battery-shaped hand grenades Sony made for a real battery very quick and painless.

Of course promising four years of free repairs and then only doing three is a dick move. I'd expect more from Apple.

Re:Not what you think (4, Informative)

Hope Thelps (322083) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724871)

The repair to replace the logic board that contained the defective GPU was a $1700 repair from a third-party authorized repair center and I did an average of 2 to 3 a week for 2 years.

From the article: "At one point, the judge asked Apple how much it would have cost them to have simply replaced my logic board when I had taken it in, and one of the Apple guys said “Oh, it wouldn’t have cost us anything, Nvidia foots the bill for each board we replace.”"

Re:Not what you think (1)

The MAZZTer (911996) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724991)

Try stacking up those numbers against any other computer companies defective products in what they did to fix them

Microsoft's infamous problems with the XBox 360 overheating RROD problems come to mind. AFAIK they handled that pretty well, I have never owned an MS console though so I have no personal experience.

Nintendo replaced my GBA and my copy of Mario Kart GBA for free when the warranty was technically voided (I had dropped my GBA one too many times and only that specific game failed to work, though other copies of that game did and the game worked on my brother's GBA). Warranty was voided since I used a Code Breaker (use of such cheat devices typically voids the console's warranty, at least it did then) and I told them as such, they still replaced it for free anyway. :)

Re:Not what you think (2)

girlintraining (1395911) | more than 2 years ago | (#39725007)

Try stacking up those numbers against any other computer companies defective products in what they did to fix them.

Microsoft, during the RROD debacle with the Xbox 360s. Dell, HP, Compaq, etc., after selling defective batteries and adapters that would explode. HP, for selling printers, faxes, and copiers that would catch fire. Sony Viao's, which would overheat...

Just because Apple made an expensive mistake doesn't mean it should get more respect for owning up to it. In fact, Apple has a reputation for coming up with odd explanations for denying a service request. Similar stories are never heard from other OEM vendors because they don't generally do crap like this. And if you really want to get down to brass tacks, Apple makes more profit than any other OEM in the industry, and have built their entire brand identity on shit not falling apart... so I think they should be held to at least a marginally higher standard.

Apple screwed up. No excuses, no apologizing. They. Screwed. Up. What they should have done is pulled the parts from circulation when the problem was discovered and replaced them at the time. When was the last time you heard of a recall where you had to wait until after your computer was a boat anchor to get it replaced?

One guy had a problem, won a legitimate lawsuit (1)

Dynedain (141758) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724597)

As anecdotal examples go...

My MBPro was affected by the problem. I knew about it, and a little over 3 years after purchase (extended warranty had expired) the telltale symptoms started appearing (horizontal stripes on the screen). I scheduled an appointment, took my machine in to the Apple Store, and Apple replaced the video card, no questions asked. Took about 2 days because they didn't have the part on hand in-store.

Re:One guy had a problem, won a legitimate lawsuit (3, Informative)

UnknowingFool (672806) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724751)

Same thing with my MacBook. The HD failed after 4 years ( no extended warranty). I was looking up how to replace it myself as I thought 4 years of constant use was reasonable. I came across an Apple support article that depicted the exact failure messages I was getting stating to bring in the laptop. So I made an appointment at the nearest Apple store and pasted the article in the ticket. They replaced the HD free of charge. They could not replace it with the same HD model or OS version so they upgraded both.

Moar anecdotes (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39724831)

As anecdotal examples go...

My MBPro was affected by the problem. I knew about it, and a little over 3 years after purchase (extended warranty had expired) the telltale symptoms started appearing (horizontal stripes on the screen). I scheduled an appointment, took my machine in to the Apple Store, and Apple replaced the video card, no questions asked. Took about 2 days because they didn't have the part on hand in-store.

I had two of them, identical units with the same Nvidia GPU. One never exhibited the problem and works beautifully to this day. The other had its logic board replaced within three days by an authorized Apple shop.

I have no idea why Apple decided to be a dick about this guy's computer; goodness knows they've replaced thousands of others.

Huh? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39724609)

Shouldn't there be a "holdingitwrong" tag or something?

mirrored article (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39724623)

http://www.dubjah.org/ShameOnApple

Link (1)

Casca1 (656425) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724663)

Damn Slashdot effect! What do you mean, 404?!?!?!?!?!?!

Apple just replaced by 6 year old iPod (1)

lemur3 (997863) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724753)

they arent terrible, i guess... they replace 6 year old products..

they just replaced my 2005 1gig iPod Nano with a new 6th generation 8gig iPod nano... for free, only took a little over a week.

Apple has determined that, in very rare cases, the battery in the iPod nano (1st generation) may overheat and pose a safety risk. Affected iPod nanos were sold between September 2005 and December 2006...Apple recommends that you stop using your iPod nano (1st gen) and follow the process noted below to order a replacement unit, free of charge

Re:Apple just replaced by 6 year old iPod (1)

jedidiah (1196) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724999)

Why should it take a whole week to replace something? You should be able to walk into an Apple store and have it done pretty much instantaneously.

I had a Mini that needed a brain transplant. An exchange would have be simpler since they ended up reformatting it anyways. That would have saved me the week or so being without a machine.

Re:Apple just replaced by 6 year old iPod (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39725031)

It is a defective product with possible personal injuries from the ipod battery. It is far cheaper for Apple to send a replacement than to settle a liability suit.

Re:Apple just replaced by 6 year old iPod (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39725099)

It's a safety issue. A device that stops working is not, and thus does not have to be replaced.

Opposite Anecdote (4, Interesting)

IKnwThePiecesFt (693955) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724769)

That's strange... I had this exact same problem and Apple replaced my motherboard for free when the time came. I wonder why they denied it for him?

Re:Opposite Anecdote (1)

gullil (1959802) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724925)

They have some test they do at the Apple stores which involves plugging in an external HD and checking if it spins up/is detected. When I brought mine in 3.5 years after purchase, they could not get the test drive to spin up, but the guy was really cool about it and still replaced it.

nVidia plague on MacBook Pro (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#39724815)

My 2007 MacBook Pro had its motherboard replaced for free out of warrantee because of this issue, and I didn't have to push hard at all. I eventually replaced that model with a mid-2010 MacBook Pro only to find the nVidia chip there fails with great regularity when paired with Lion. After another free post-warantee motherboard swap failed to solve the problem they actually replaced the entire system for free with a newer model. I'll be leery of future nVidia-powered laptops but my experience with Apple support was extremely positive in the long run.

Apple replaced my logic board 4 yrs out (1)

schlachter (862210) | more than 2 years ago | (#39724903)

Same thing happened to me. My Macbook Pro motherboard fried about 4 yrs out. Apple replaced the motherboard for free; no questions asked. The bill was $1,200 b/f Apple waived it.

They also replaced my iPhone screen when 1 pixel went bad for free...no questions asked...2 months after my 1 yr warranty had expired.

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