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Monkeypox Scare Grounds Flight In Chicago

timothy posted about 2 years ago | from the when-that's-the-good-news dept.

Medicine 109

Hugh Pickens writes "AP reports that when a Delta Airlines flight touched down at Midway International Airport in Chicago, the passengers looked out the window to see the jet surrounded by fire trucks, police cars and ambulances. Health officials came through the door wearing facemasks and other protective gear. As it turns out the bedbugs that infest hotels appear to be the source of red marks on a 50-year old Minnesota woman that prompted health officials to quarantine the jet for fear they were dealing with something much more serious: monkeypox. Lise Sievers called her mother during a layover in Detroit and told her that one of the children she visited and is trying to adopt in Uganda had some pus-filled red bumps and also mentioned she had some small bumps of her own, a rash that she suspected was the handiwork of bedbugs. Those two very different bumps — one with pus, one without — got jumbled up in Siever's mother's mind, and she called a hospital near her Indiana home to ask about treatment for her daughter. 'She told them her daughter is on a flight back from Uganda and has some red bumps which are pussing and what should she do to treat them,' says Roger Sievers. 'She was looking for some general advice.' Health officials feared they were looking for monkeypox, a rare and sometimes fatal disease mostly in found in central and western Africa. After the passengers waited on the plane for a couple of hours, officials brought good news. 'They came back down and told my mom it was bed bug bites and they started releasing people.'"

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109 comments

We need communism now! (0)

For a Free Internet (1594621) | about 2 years ago | (#39831217)

Decaying capitlist imperialism is hell for most of the people on this planet! Throw the bourgeoisie and their rotten system in the trash can! Workers to power!

Isn't 'diversity' wonderful... (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39831227)

Welcome to Africa...

We have enough American kids that need adoption... (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39831235)

Stop brining in ugandians, we have enough children in our country that need addoption. If you don't like our country so much, then GTFO, and go live in uganda yourself.

Re:We have enough American kids that need adoption (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39831421)

But then who will feed the bed bugs?

Re:We have enough American kids that need adoption (2)

s0nicfreak (615390) | about 2 years ago | (#39831881)

Oh please, take a real look at how kids waiting for adoption in the US live vs kids in Uganda.

Re:We have enough American kids that need adoption (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39831949)

Mod this back up for truth.

Good news, you got bedbugs! (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39831239)

Well, the alternative is monkey pox!

Blabbermouths (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39831245)

Keep the authorities in the dark, get home, go to doctor, deal with problem. Because of people's paranoia, fears and wild overreactions we need to operate our personal lives more carefully, keep the leukocytes at arm's length, leak what little private info we have on a need to know basis.

Re:Blabbermouths (4, Insightful)

Shinobi (19308) | about 2 years ago | (#39831283)

So, your "privacy" is more important than the risk of carrying a highly contagius and painful disease that could very well require quarantine? Because that's what monkeypox is. I've helped treat people who have it, it spreads quickly as hell, and the enclosed nature of an airplane means that you need to check them out like this.

If you really think that your "privacy" or convenience is more important than the risk of spreading a disease like that to 10, 100 or potentially thousands of people, the world is better off by putting a bullet through your head.

Re:Blabbermouths (4, Informative)

Shinobi (19308) | about 2 years ago | (#39831321)

As a follow-up, I should point out that TFA saying it is rare is a bit of a misnomer: It's rare in Europe and North America. In Africa, it's not very rare.

Re:Blabbermouths (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39831345)

yes, it is, and your talk of bullets makes it abundantly clear that you are not to be trusted with any sort of power. In short, fuck you.

Re:Blabbermouths (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39831459)

a highly contagius and painful disease that could very well require quarantine? Because that's what monkeypox is.

Highly contagious - er, no. Person to person transmission is RARE. So long as infected monkeys or prairie dogs aren't on the plane, the passengers should be pretty safe. Go read up on it again, nurse. It's ignorant people like you that cost a LOT of money. There is nothing worse than an idiot with initiative. Love - a doc.

Re:Blabbermouths (4, Informative)

Shinobi (19308) | about 2 years ago | (#39831489)

The description is incorrect, possibly because it's written by worthless, status-obsessed docs in shiny western offices, where they rarely encounter it.

However, if you had been lessed obsessed about artificially propped-up status and wages, and instead worked on the ground for a year or two in, say, Sierra Leone, or Congo, empirical evidence down there would tell you it's NOT rare, it IS highly contagious. But *fatalities* ARE rare.

Re:Blabbermouths (3, Insightful)

Guppy (12314) | about 2 years ago | (#39831709)

The description is incorrect, possibly because it's written by worthless, status-obsessed docs in shiny western offices, where they rarely encounter it.

It would have been best if they had qualified "Rare" with something like "in the west" or "outside of endemic regions". But textbook descriptions are written by western docs, for the use of western docs, who have enough problems as it is with students/patients who hear hoofbeats and think Zebras.

Re:Blabbermouths (1)

geekoid (135745) | about 2 years ago | (#39835061)

Experts are well away of exactly how contagious it is. You are an idiot and know nothing about the medical community in the US.

It's slightly less contagious the small pox. You're problem is you aren't an expert, you don't understand the verbiage, and don't understand what rare means.

Fatalities are 1 to 10 percent.

Re:Blabbermouths (2, Insightful)

AtomicAdam (959649) | about 2 years ago | (#39832001)

It's funny how all Doctors/Lawyers/"OMG I"M CETIFIEdEd PROFESSIONAL"s seem to post as Anonymous cowards. BTW you think a real doctor would show a "nurse" professional courtesy, instead of using the term disparagingly. It leads me to believe that most ACs are just twelve year old trolls.


If there wasn't a threat why were crews brought in, why were they not letting people off the plane? Ask yourself these kind of things before ever posting again. Be sure to log in first.


Humbly I modify a quote from the parent. "There is nothing worse than an Anonymous Coward with initiative and time." Love - AtomicAdam

Re:Blabbermouths (1)

icebike (68054) | about 2 years ago | (#39833221)

If there wasn't a threat why were crews brought in, why were they not letting people off the plane? Ask yourself these kind of things before ever posting again. Be sure to log in first.

Apparently you've never heard of swatting [wikipedia.org] and the tendency in the US of over-reacting to any simple event.

But the answer was that there wasn't a threat. (Bed bug bites, while unsightly and disgusting are not a threat.)

Nor would real Monkey pox be that contagious requiring full quarantine. It is not spread by casual contact. Even under their own protocol, it was an over-reaction.

Re:Blabbermouths (1)

geekoid (135745) | about 2 years ago | (#39835035)

Yes, but substantially higher when it a bunch of people in a tight metal tube for hours.

If you are a doc, please stop practicing. You lack the ability to take situations into account before rendering an opinion.

How do people get monkeypox?
Monkeypox can spread to humans from an infected animal through an animal bite or direct contact with the animal’s lesions or body fluids. The disease also can be spread from person to person, although it is much less infectious than smallpox. The virus is thought to be transmitted by respiratory droplets during direct and prolonged face-to-face contact. In addition, it is possible monkeypox can be spread by direct contact with body fluids of an infected person or with virus-contaminated objects, such as bedding or clothing.

These factors mean that while on the craft infection probability sky rockets, and it[s a risk to the next passengers.

Re:Blabbermouths (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39833473)

> the world is better off by putting a bullet through your head.

I find this attitude interesting, albeit somewhat hypocritical. You'd happily help people treat a physical disease, but argue in favor of killing somebody because of their opinion. And if somebody disagrees with that, should they also call for your execution? Taken far enough, that has potential to lead to a lot more deaths than the people who got sick from the bedbugs. We'd all be better off with a bit more tolerance, no?

THIS! (4, Insightful)

thegarbz (1787294) | about 2 years ago | (#39831403)

This attitude is exactly why the world is going to be horrendously screwed when the next super flu breaks out. Wild overreactions to highly contagious diseases are the only appropriate reactions. Its one thing to queue up and get groped by the TSA to protect us from the terrorist boogeyman, but quite another to be inconvenienced due to a credible possibility that everyone on the plane may need to shortly check into a hospital along with everyone they've had contact with.

Let me guess, your kids don't get vaccinated either?

Re:THIS! (1)

BradleyUffner (103496) | about 2 years ago | (#39831423)

Wild overreactions to highly contagious diseases are the only appropriate reactions.

If they are appropriate reactions, then they aren't overreactions.
This reminds me of the time my boss told the department that he expects us all the get "Exceeds Expectations" on our performance reviews.

Re:THIS! (2)

TheLink (130905) | about 2 years ago | (#39831597)

Huh, overreaction? Do you really want monkey pox and other nasty diseases endemic in the Africa to not be rare in your country?

It's not overreaction at all. It's appropriate reaction. When the next super pandemic breaks out, the main solution is likely to be quarantine. The hospitals won't cope, and when the doctors and nurses start getting sick themselves it all falls apart and you'd be better off not going to the hospital for anything. Stay at home, and wait for the disease to kill all it can kill and/or evolve to be less lethal (that can happen in a short time - it can't spread if it kills too fast[1]).

[1] Quarantine in theory can actually work very well in breeding diseases to be less nasty and lethal.

Re:THIS! (2)

LordLimecat (1103839) | about 2 years ago | (#39831651)

From what Ive read, monkeypox is not a good candidate for a pandemic, since it spreads through blood-to-blood contact or rodent bites.

Your post IS an overreaction.

Re:THIS! (0)

TheLink (130905) | about 2 years ago | (#39832873)

1) I didn't claim monkeypox was a good candidate for a pandemic.
2) Do you have any believable citations for your claim on how monkeypox spreads?

The following contradicts your claim:
http://www.who.int/mediacentre/factsheets/fs161/en/ [who.int]

Secondary transmission is human-to-human, resulting from close contact with infected respiratory tract excretions, with the skin lesions of an infected person or with recently contaminated objects. Transmission via droplet respiratory particles has also been documented. Transmission can also occur by inoculation or via the placenta (congenital monkeypox). There is no evidence to date that person-to-person transmission alone can sustain monkeypox in the human population.

Despite the last sentence, based on the rest of the paragraph I doubt you'd still want anyone who might have monkeypox to roam freely.
1) It's still a nasty disease to get
2) Some other animal might get it from the human, and monkeypox might be sustainable in that species.

Seems that Prairie Dogs can get it.
http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm5224a1.htm [cdc.gov]
http://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/10/3/03-0878_article.htm [cdc.gov]
And I doubt all the 87 infected humans were exposed to the blood of prairie dogs, or bitten.

Re:THIS! (2)

icebike (68054) | about 2 years ago | (#39833263)

Despite the last sentence?

No.
You do not get to dismiss the KEY sentence in the paragraph. Just NO.

Close contact with someone's used tissue MIGHT transmit it, and maybe being coughed on. But the passenger had no such coughing symptoms.

This is not some horrible disease that spreads like wildfile. The reaction was defiantly an over-reaction based on their own hands off (2000 mile away) diagnosis from third hand information. They violated their own protocols.

Re:THIS! (1)

geekoid (135745) | about 2 years ago | (#39835095)

coughed on, touch the same thing. Hell the NEXT passengers could get it.

Here is something you people need to know. Introducing a virus into a new set of population risks mutatin to better fit the population. The particular disease would be incredibly hard to eradicate.

The response was appropriete for the information they had. As someone who has studied these types of break outs, I am glad for this response.

Re:THIS! (1)

geekoid (135745) | about 2 years ago | (#39835079)

How do people get monkeypox?
Monkeypox can spread to humans from an infected animal through an animal bite or direct contact with the animal’s lesions or body fluids. The disease also can be spread from person to person, although it is much less infectious than smallpox. The virus is thought to be transmitted by respiratory droplets during direct and prolonged face-to-face contact. In addition, it is possible monkeypox can be spread by direct contact with body fluids of an infected person or with virus-contaminated objects, such as bedding or clothing.

http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/monkeypox/qa.htm [cdc.gov]

Learn before you post.

Re:THIS! (1)

0111 1110 (518466) | about 2 years ago | (#39831657)

When the next super pandemic breaks out

Ah. Super pandemics. The scourge of mankind. When was the last one again? 1918?

This absolutely was an over-reaction. There was no reason to believe that the passenger was infected with some sort of exotic tropical virus. If she had presented with her symptoms to most doctors they would no doubt just tell her to call an exterminator or prescribe a topical corticosteroid and not create a major panic and have her quarantined.

I hope you do not work in the medical field. Something about hoofbeats and zebras comes to mind. The only reason to have suspected a zebra in this case was the mention of a central African country. That is most definitely not sufficient. Red bumps. :facepalm:

Re:THIS! (2)

TheLink (130905) | about 2 years ago | (#39832963)

No reason? Based on the information they had, they had good reason to suspect the passenger might have a serious contagious disease from Uganda.

And that passenger was on a plane that will land in the USA. They hadn't seen the patient to be sure that she didn't have monkeypox OR something worse yet.

So do you actually propose letting the passenger and all of them head off to their various destinations without examining any of them? Yeah maybe the fire trucks were unnecessary (not sure why they were there) but the rest is reasonable assuming shit actually happened- cops to handle any uncooperative passengers, ambulances to take the cooperative infected away.

You'll be glad to know that I do not work in the medical field. However I also hope you do not work in the medical field either. You seem even more incompetent than I am when it comes to medical matters.

Re:THIS! (2)

thegarbz (1787294) | about 2 years ago | (#39834071)

Ah. Super pandemics. The scourge of mankind. When was the last one again? 1918?

Yep, we are over due for another one.

This absolutely was an over-reaction. There was no reason to believe that the passenger was infected with some sort of exotic tropical virus. If she had presented with her symptoms to most doctors they would no doubt just tell her to call an exterminator or prescribe a topical corticosteroid and not create a major panic and have her quarantined.

Indeed. If some kid showed up in a clinic with little red pimples Monkeypox would be the last thing on people's mind. However if a kid showed up in a clinic with little red pimples and told everyone he'd just returned from a foreign disease filled country the diagnosis is likely to change very quickly.

Symptoms are only ever half of the story. The history is as important as the symptoms themselves.

Re:THIS! (2)

AtomicAdam (959649) | about 2 years ago | (#39832029)

I humbly agree. This was not an over reaction. This was the right amount of action. Not everything is a government conspiracy trying to take away our rights and rape us to death... Most things they do are... Just not everything and definitely not this.

Re:THIS! (1)

thegarbz (1787294) | about 2 years ago | (#39834059)

It's not overreaction at all. It's appropriate reaction.

That's effectively what I just said.

I used the words "wild overreaction" as a direct reply to the GP.

Re:THIS! (1)

LordLimecat (1103839) | about 2 years ago | (#39831645)

Wikipedia [wikipedia.org] is indicating this is NOT highly contagious:

Limited person-to-person spread of infection has been reported in disease-endemic areas in Africa.

...

Monkeypox is usually transmitted to humans from rodents, pets, and primates through contact with the animal's blood or through a bite

Nor does it seem to be super deadly-- between 1-10% fatality rate even in Africa.

Maybe it IS an overreaction? Should a flight be grounded if one of the passengers has AIDS, since that is far more deadly and far more transmissible?

Re:THIS! (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39833019)

HIV is not as contagious as monkeypox, nor does it normally kill as fast. And it is unlikely that stereotypical virgin slashdotters will get AIDs.

Nor does it seem to be super deadly-- between 1-10% fatality rate even in Africa.

5% would be a pretty high fatality rate for an infectious disease. Not as high as the 1918 flu, but high enough to worry about. Even 1% is nothing to take lightly. And do read on - not all monkeypox is the same.

Might be a good idea if you do not rely solely on wikipedia for your information.
http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/monkeypox/treatmentguidelines.htm [cdc.gov]
www.state.nj.us/agriculture/divisions/ah/diseases/monkeypox.html
http://articles.latimes.com/2010/sep/26/opinion/la-oe-orent-pox-20100926 [latimes.com]

There are two distinct genetic lines of monkeypox. The less severe West African strain entered the United States in 2003 in the body of an infected Gambian pouched rat. It spread in a pet store to dormice and to caged prairie dogs, and eventually caused 81 human infections, none of them serious and none of which spread. The far deadlier Congo basin strain causes a disease that is "virtually indistinguishable" from typical smallpox, says virologist Mark Buller of St. Louis University.

In the Congo basin, an area crossed and re-crossed by battling armies in the Democratic Republic of Congo's long civil war, people are suffering, almost out of sight of the rest of the world, from a monkeypox strain that causes disfiguring rashes, headaches, fevers and sometimes blindness. About 10% of those affected die â" a rate approximating the African death rate from smallpox.

If the last part is true, that's not something to take lightly.

Re:THIS! (1)

LordLimecat (1103839) | about 2 years ago | (#39834109)

But that reinforces what I said: barring getting bitten by (or exposed to the blood of) a rodent, you generally arent going to catch the disease, and it generally isnt transmissible.

Re:THIS! (4, Insightful)

hey! (33014) | about 2 years ago | (#39831855)

Another way of looking at this is that three out of ten of the top causes of death worldwide are classes of infectious diseases that can spread from person to person: respiratory infection, diarrhoeal diseases, and tuberculosis. TB, the smallest of the three, kills something like 1.3 million people/year -- probably more in one year than terrorism has killed in all time.

Of course deaths/year isn't the right metric for where we should put our attention and money. The best metric would be *preventable* deaths/year. You're over two hundred times more likely to die from a mistake in hospital care than you are from terrorism, and that's preventable. Infectious diseases are often preventable through hygiene and surveillance. We spend 8.8 billion dollars on the Centers for Disease Control every year, as opposed to 59 billion on Homeland security; which do you think provides the biggest bang for the buck in terms of lives saved?

You don't want to be lackadaisical about a viral pathogen like Monkey Pox that already has the capability (albeit weak) of spreading from human to human because mutation can cause a strain to be more infectious than expected.

Re:THIS! (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39832019)

"Its one thing to queue up and get groped by the TSA ..."

The TSA agents _are_ monkeys, if they get infected and they touch and cough on every ape that passes by, god forbid.

Follow the Paw (1)

cffrost (885375) | about 2 years ago | (#39831281)

Somebody needs to find that monkey paw. No doubt some shyster's put a pox on Delta for their dastardly short-sell scheme.

Filthy American Hotels... (-1, Flamebait)

flyingfsck (986395) | about 2 years ago | (#39831285)

The interesting thing is that only country that I have ever been bitten by bugs/lice in a hotel was in America and I have been in some very backward places. American hotels are dirty. It is actually a good thing that the TSA tries to keep visitors away...

Re:Filthy American Hotels... (2, Informative)

DigiShaman (671371) | about 2 years ago | (#39831875)

Bedbugs used to be a thing of the past thanks to the wide spread use of DDT in the 50s. Their reemergence was only a matter of time now that it was banned. But, New York is a melting pot for people all over the world, and someone brought the bugs with them. Eventually they spread like wildfire and the rest they say is history.

Stupid people... (1, Insightful)

Shoten (260439) | about 2 years ago | (#39831287)

"Hey, I just wanted to ask about treatment for this disease that my potential daughter has in FUCKING UGANDA that I've been exposed to, but I'm not going to really be clear in my mind as to the symptoms, especially after I've already come back to the United States and am walking around in a large metropolitan airport."

Can we start imprisoning people for being idiots yet? Please?

Re:Stupid people... (1)

Amlothi (207848) | about 2 years ago | (#39831329)

I know it's Slashdot and nobody expects you to RTFA, but you didn't even read the summary:

Hey, I just wanted to ask about treatment for this disease that my potential daughter has in FUCKING UGANDA that I've been exposed to, but I'm not going to really be clear in my mind as to the symptoms, especially after I've already come back to the United States and am walking around in a large metropolitan airport.

1) I'm pretty sure she'd know it's truly her daughter, but maybe you want them to do a maternity test first?
2) The daughter wasn't in Uganda at the time of the phone call.
3) The summary doesn't mention that the mother was ever exposed or at risk of exposure.
4) The daughter (not the mother) was in the airport and, according to the summary (I know, I know... who bothers to read all the way through before posting?) she was pretty clear the bumps were from bed bugs.

The one part of your post that is seemingly correct is the subject line. However, that was probably a coincidence as you probably intended to be pointing the "Ha ha, you're stupid!" finger away from yourself.

Re:Stupid people... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39832351)

The potential daughter is a child in Uganda. There is no indication that this child is actually female except in the GP's mind.

The potential adoptive mother--you know her as The Daughter--flew home to the US. She knew that her symptoms differed from the child's and were likely the result of bedbugs.

The potential grandmother, aka The Mother, heard "bumps" and "puss" and decided to call a doctor.

Re:Stupid people... (2)

Shoten (260439) | about 2 years ago | (#39833253)

Addressing the points you raised...

1, "Potential" daughter, because she was adopting the girl. Maternity is not a factor here; it's an adoption. I'm assuming it's pretty rare for maternity tests on adopted children to come back positive, but maybe I'm just stupid that way...so I figured we'd pass on the test.
2, It doesn't matter where the daughter was during the phone call. My point is that the phone call happened (to quote myself) "after I've already come back to the United States," which is the problem. If you go to a third world country and pick up a disease, look into it before you walk around the main terminal, eh?
3, No, it doesn't. But someone doesn't go all the way to Uganda NOT to see the child they are thinking of adopting there. I don't think I'm reading too much into it by assuming there was contact of some form, especially since she knew the daughter's symptoms, ya know?
4, The problem is that a person who had been exposed a disease in a third world (and, if the term existed, fourth world) country was already walking around in public when they first started questioning it, AND they were fuzzy on the details of the symptoms. This is, as epidemiologists, say "very bad."

But hey, maybe you're right...maybe it's not the adopting mother who is stupid here. There is something odd about posting a comment that amounts to "why don't you read it first" without really understanding the comment you were referring to.

Re:Stupid people... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39834545)

4, The problem is that a person who had been exposed a disease in a third world (and, if the term existed, fourth world) country was already walking around in public when they first started questioning it, AND they were fuzzy on the details of the symptoms.

The woman who traveled to Uganda knew her symptoms were from bedbug bites. The only mistake she made was talking to her mother on the phone and relating that a child she visited had pussy sores. It was her mother, the potential grandmother, who was sketchy about the symptoms.

But hey, maybe you're right...maybe it's not the adopting mother who is stupid here. There is something odd about posting a comment that amounts to "why don't you read it first" without really understanding the comment you were referring to.

Dude. You are so far from the reading comprehension high ground that you're looking up at the waves.

Re:Stupid people... (2)

swalve (1980968) | about 2 years ago | (#39831575)

I heard the woman on the radio yesterday. Seemed like a sweet woman, but sounded very much like that Aunt we all have whose mind cannot be changed by anything, and who speaks in nothing but implication. "Wellll, she WAS in Uganda, and she DOES have these red bumps. I don't THINK it's monkeypox, but I'm going to keep saying monkeypox until you believe it's monkeypox and overreact, and then I can say that I told you it certainly wasn't monkeypox. Monkeypox."

Re:Stupid people... (0, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39831629)

It's lupus.

Re:Stupid people... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39831683)

You need to RTFA; neither of your two statements correctly refer to what happened here.

Never talk to strangers (0, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39831289)

Geesh... it's getting bad. Don't say anything to police... don't ask hospital personnel anything

Re:Never talk to strangers (0)

kelemvor4 (1980226) | about 2 years ago | (#39831333)

Geesh... it's getting bad. Don't say anything to police... don't ask hospital personnel anything

This is America, if you don't know that by the time you hit the age of 18 then it is unlikely you will live a long and free life here.

Re:Never talk to strangers (2)

ScentCone (795499) | about 2 years ago | (#39831415)

by the time you hit the age of 18 then it is unlikely you will live a long and free life here

Citation, please. Or at least some non-rabid babbling, if you can muster it.

One way to avoid a premature death is to make sure that you don't die of a horrible tropical disease you've picked up from someone spreading it around in an aircraft on their way back from Uganda. But thanks for the really insightful perspective.

Re:Never talk to strangers (1)

0111 1110 (518466) | about 2 years ago | (#39831605)

Still, his point is well taken.

"She told them her daughter is on a flight back from Uganda and has some red bumps which are pussing and what should she do to treat them," Roger Sievers said. "She was looking for some general advice."

I don't know wtf she expected to happen making a report like that to a public hospital. Saying something like that in the US has very obvious and somewhat ridiculous consequences which would be unlikely to occur in most other countries. Despite what many Americans seem to believe there is such a thing as an over-reaction. Based on an unverified, second hand report, the health authorities acted as if there was a confirmed Ebola Zaire infected passenger. Just because someone has red spots does not mean they have Monkey Pox or Ebola FFS. Is it that everyone is terrified of being sued that makes Americans so easy to rile into hysterics? The motto of 'better safe than sorry' is the real infection in this country.

An intelligent response would have been to first verify the symptoms. Hell, they could have called the passenger herself to ask about her symptoms. I think people need to start getting fired for being overly cautious from time to time and not just for erring in the other direction.

Re:Never talk to strangers (3, Interesting)

ScentCone (795499) | about 2 years ago | (#39831655)

An intelligent response would have been to first verify the symptoms

Which you would have done how ... by preventing people from leaving the plane until you could check her out, right? Right. That's what they actually did.

Hell, they could have called the passenger herself to ask about her symptoms.

So, you're will to risk a big outbreak of a very nasty tropical disease by gambling that the passenger in question will answer her cell phone once they touch down, but before anyone else is allowed to leave the plane, and that if it sounds like the pox in question, that in the five minutes or so you have left before they deplane, you're then going to scramble the authorities to contain the problem?

consequences which would be unlikely to occur in most other countries

So, most other countries, finding out that a passenger on an inbound flight from Uganda is exhibiting signs of what could be the highly contagious monkeypox ... just shrug their shoulders? You know that's not true.

Re:Never talk to strangers (0)

0111 1110 (518466) | about 2 years ago | (#39831769)

The CDC fucked up. It's that simple. Based on "better safe than sorry" they inconvenienced and scared a plane full of passengers for absolutely no reason. There was no conclusion they could draw from a second hand report of symptoms. They were clearly wrong to make a diagnosis of monkey pox. Even the most cursory direct examination of the patient would not have given the slightest reason to suspect monkey pox over insect bites. The patient herself even suspected that they were just insect bites. She was not sick. She did not have a fever. Holding the plane for 2 or more hours based on some red bumps? That cannot be justified just because she was recently in Uganda.

So, most other countries, finding out that a passenger on an inbound flight from Uganda is exhibiting signs of what could be the highly contagious monkeypox ... just shrug their shoulders? You know that's not true.

What signs of monkey pox? The red bumps? Seriously? I don't think we should start holding aircraft on the ground for hours every time a passenger has some red bumps. Not even if they have recently been to Africa. And as far as the mother talking about pus, they should have confirmed that with the patient herself before drawing any conclusions. I'm sure it must get boring at the CDC without any major epidemics happening at the moment, but geez. This isn't rocket science. Even a first year med student should have been able to do better than this.

Re:Never talk to strangers (1)

ScentCone (795499) | about 2 years ago | (#39832051)

They were clearly wrong to make a diagnosis of monkey pox.

They didn't make a diagnosis of monkeypox. They reacted to a hospital employee's considered opinion that it might be monkeypox, and did the standard thing you do to see whether or not it is. It wasn't. They didn't diagnoise it as such.

What would you be saying if a planeload of people who did have monkeypox were busy spreading it around all of their familiy members, coworkers, fellow students, bus passengers and everyone else because the very sort of conjecture you think was lame at the hospital was lame in the opposite direction at the CDC? You'd be saying, what .. "It's a shame that now hundreds of thousands of people are scared by an actual very contagious disease that is actually spreading from the passengers on that plane, but at least we didn't scare only the passengers on the plane when we heard a report of a person covered with pussy sores flying out of Uganda.

Even a first year med student should have been able to do better than this.

What would they do better? Conclude that pussy sores on a person leaving a tropical area known for monkeypox are just nothing to worry about? Because that's all they had to go on until they could see the person in person. In a big metal tube that person had just been sharing for hours with a couple hundred other people.

Re:Never talk to strangers (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39832415)

What would they do better? Conclude that pussy sores on a person leaving a tropical area known for monkeypox are just nothing to worry about?

Most women with pussy sores just have herpes.

Re:Never talk to strangers (1)

sjames (1099) | about 2 years ago | (#39832531)

They could have taken an hour and 55 minutes off of the hold time with one question: "Does anyone here have a fever?" The fever comes before the bumps.

Re:Never talk to strangers (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39833547)

And you trust a plane-load of tired, usually dehydrated, and currently alarmed passengers to accurately gauge and honestly report their own body temps? It's a good thing you don't handle events like these for a living.

Re:Never talk to strangers (1)

sjames (1099) | about 2 years ago | (#39833639)

Actually, it's not that unlikely someone will speak up if asked. If not, they do have these amazing space age thingamajigs that can confirm it in a couple seconds.

Re:Never talk to strangers (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39832133)

Sorry, but no. There are certain criteria under which a quarantine is entirely justified, and due to the mother's (accidental) conflation of two people's symptoms, this appeared to fit these criteria. The fact that the flight originated in Uganda is very important, as there are quite a few endemic pathogens present with which most American doctors could never have anything beyond a textbook familiarity. Anecdote: a coworker of mine and his girlfriend lived in Uganda for several years; at one point she wound up with an infection that required a top-tier medical facility to fly in a specialist from South Africa. Granted, she was a chimp researcher, but the disease was human-transmissable.

I will agree with you on one point: the CDC did f*** up. If they checked enough of the boxes on the "quarantine" matrix for this particular plane, every passenger on that initial flight from Uganda should also have been tracked down and quarantined as they were rather likely to be further transmission vectors.

Again, while an epidemiologist may very well be a doctor, very few doctors are epidemiologists.

Perfect captcha: monkeys.

Re:Never talk to strangers (1)

geekoid (135745) | about 2 years ago | (#39835151)

in pretty much any civilized part of the world, if you report someone is coming into the country with pussing red spots, there going to want to contain.

" Just because someone has red spots does not mean they have Monkey Pox or Ebola FFS"
correct. You seem to be missing the puss bit.

No one is in hysterics. A proper response isn't hysterics.

"An intelligent response would have been to first verify the symptoms."
ah, so you haven't actually studied this sort of thin, have you?
There is a good chance people will down play what they are seeing. Bring in a disease that spreads to people and animals so easily would be a significant problem.

These disease are hard enough to shut down, giving people a chance to depart to the 4 winds before doing and verification would have been irresponsible.

Of course, if they didn't do this an it turned out to actually be monkeypox, you would be talking about incompetence of Americans and stupidity. Cause people like you are fucking twats always looking for some reason to whine.

Re:Never talk to strangers (1)

sjames (1099) | about 2 years ago | (#39832429)

The best way to puck up a drug resistant flesh eating infection is in the hospital.

Monkeypox? (0)

tkrotchko (124118) | about 2 years ago | (#39831301)

"monkeypox, a rare and sometimes fatal disease"

As opposed to MonkeyShines, a more common and fun disease.

omg (-1, Troll)

slashmydots (2189826) | about 2 years ago | (#39831351)

I would fucking kill that dumb bitch. I mean how arrogant and clueless do you have to be to potentially get exposed to some foreign disease then show symptoms yourself then get on a plane. Everyone with a brain knows that's not a good idea and usually illegal. She's lucky it didn't turn out to be monkey pox.

Re:omg (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39831363)

She knew it was bedbugs you half-witted retard.

wrong title (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39831395)

It's the other way round - symptoms of a potentially fatal disease were handled professionally. Happily it was something different but I am sure nobody on that plane would like to have spread such a disease around their families and friends.

Ugh, more hugh Pickens spam! (1, Insightful)

g051051 (71145) | about 2 years ago | (#39831455)

Seriously, you guys either need to stop posting his spam as stories or just give him the keys to the store and get out of the way. Why is this even considered for a Slashdot story? There's no News for Nerds, Stuff that Matters angle AT ALL. And that's typical of the spam from Hugh Pickens. You ban other spammers, now do the same for him.

Re:Ugh, more hugh Pickens spam! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39832083)

Seriously, you guys either need to stop posting his spam as stories or just give him the keys to the store and get out of the way. Why is this even considered for a Slashdot story? There's no News for Nerds, Stuff that Matters angle AT ALL. And that's typical of the spam from Hugh Pickens. You ban other spammers, now do the same for him.

Then you should go vote his stories down when they hit recent.

In-fact just write a script to do it. Call it the hugh-NOPick-a-nator. Have it mod his stories as BIGSPAM. You would then just solved all your problems with technology, that calls for a drink. Please... think of the drunks.

Re:Ugh, more hugh Pickens spam! (1)

marcello_dl (667940) | about 2 years ago | (#39832089)

It IS a notable story, the first time in 10+ years that I hear a story about airports where security officials and procedures do the right thing.
Send 'em a pie. :)

Re:Ugh, more hugh Pickens spam! (1)

g051051 (71145) | about 2 years ago | (#39833127)

Notability isn't the issue. The issue is the type of story. That story was already covered to death in the regular press. Slashdot is for tech stories, and this doesn't have *any* tech angle at all. Unless you count someone using a cell phone?

Travel Fun (2)

Sponge Bath (413667) | about 2 years ago | (#39831471)

The good news is the person next to you on the plane does not have monkeypox. The bad news is that person's clothes, and now the plane seats, are infested with bed bugs. Thanks for sharing.

There is no protection from the inconsiderate behavior of your fellow traveller.

YOU FAVIL ^IT (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39831555)

partner. And sif of its core Of reality. Keep

Smart Fast Action Still Can Happen?! (3, Insightful)

mtrachtenberg (67780) | about 2 years ago | (#39831571)

This is incredibly cheering news. There are still people in government capable of responding quickly and effectively to try to corral a potentially devastating epidemic.

After all the news about the TSA saving us by groping four year old girls, this is practically redemptive news. Not everyone in government is a fool, even after the thirty year decline.

Re:Smart Fast Action Still Can Happen?! (1)

_ivy_ivy_ (1081273) | about 2 years ago | (#39831813)

Not everyone in government is a fool, even after the thirty year decline.

I don't think there are very many fools in government, aside from about 535 in charge of the operation.

Re:Smart Fast Action Still Can Happen?! (1)

ClintJCL (264898) | about 2 years ago | (#39833405)

A few years of federal government contracting will clear your misconception right up. ;)

Re:Smart Fast Action Still Can Happen?! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39832047)

mm hm. they sent firetrucks. that'll help!

Use best approach for available information (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39831789)

From what I am reading here (and there), the authorities acted in the best interest of everyone concerned, even if it did "inconvenience" the people on that airplane. The results if it were a worst-case scenario (monkeypox) could have been devastating! As a wise person once said, "Sh!t happens! Deal with it!"...

So, wait... (3, Insightful)

s0nicfreak (615390) | about 2 years ago | (#39831903)

The child in Uganda actually has the symptoms of Monkeypox, right? How do we know the mother doesn't have it and just isn't showing it yet? How is this child not going to infect others when he is bought over to America?

Re:So, wait... (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39833817)

also, why the hell are people importing Ugandan children? There are more than enough American children who need homes.

This isn't even do-gooder nonsense. This is just a holier-than-thou thing. I bet she tells her friends who had their own children or bought local that they were destroying the environment, while she's saving the starving children of the third world.

The TSA: America's HealthCare Professionals (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39832045)

Wow! LoL Tax dollars at work big time! First, the TSA was the Terrorists at the Gates, then became the Perverts at the Gates and now have morphed into World HealthCare Pros at the Gates. Where will it end? Napolitano's Homeland [in] Security Theater becomes HealthCare Theater. Will we see her and her lap-dop Pistol on Broadway in a new Burlesque Show about the Obama's?

LoL

KFC? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39832053)

Monkey POX!!!?!?! NO SIR, I like my Chicken Pox JUST fine thank you. With Barbecue Sauce Please.

Adopting from Uganda? (1, Offtopic)

Sebastopol (189276) | about 2 years ago | (#39832059)

American orphans aren't good enough for her? Pathetic.

Re:Adopting from Uganda? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39832645)

She might not qualify for adopting an American child. Unfortunately, it's many times easier to adopt abroad than it is to help a local child.

Re:Adopting from Uganda? (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39833201)

Why is that pathetic ? They're all just kids. It's not as if the american kids fought in nam or something.

Maybe the lady in question was born in uganda herself and would like a child from the same area.

Also, while being an orphan in the US certainly doesn't sound all that pleasureable, one could make the argument that those kids are at least fed and given a bed to sleep in. I have no expertise on the subject but i imagine orphans in uganda are often not as well off.

Oh, only bedbugs (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39832123)

In the 21st century... We had that one figured out 40 years ago.

Yes, people, the idiots are driving the bus (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39832193)

Sigh...gotta love it when some random busybody can just spawn a thought and all of a sudden we're all under a terrorist attack/disease outbreak/gamma ray burst. You wanna talk about modern weapons putting too much power into the hands of one person...how about the Internet? Any stupid moron can start an outrage that stops traffic in Manhattan by coming up with the idea that blah, blah, blah, outrage! Monkeypox? Sigh...

Bedbugs (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39832395)

If they hadn't banned Malathion and DDT, we wouldn't be worrying about bedbugs in the U.S. Or in Africa.

They're rampant in Mexico, btw. But don't stop anyone at the border, don't inspect furniture or other items shipped from there. It's raaa-a-a-acist!

Health care as an arm of the State (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39832773)

"she called a hospital near her Indiana home to ask about treatment for her daughter"

First mistake.

Health care in this country has essentially become an arm of the State.

Best to DIY, where possible.

Great (1)

Dripdry (1062282) | about 2 years ago | (#39832999)

So they let her off the plane and onto the streets to spread more bedbugs.
This city astounds me sometimes.

Why a couple of hours to figure out its bed bugs? (1)

mdmkolbe (944892) | about 2 years ago | (#39833255)

I understand the quarantine and think it was justified, but if this was a simple symptom mixup, then why did it take a couple of hours to clear it up?

CDC's quick response: good. Slow follow through: bad.

pus filled bumps (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#39833893)

woman visits children with pus filled bumps, in africa, and isnt scared shitless. mother conflates symptoms, calls hospital for advice. America is doomed, due to our complete lack of understanding of infectious disease and how to report symptoms accurately. thank god the TSA can do something right. I work with trained professionals in the mental health field who can barely describe the simplest medical condition without hyperbole or misinformation. cant even get straight what a virus or bacterium is. hell, dont even know that soda pop contains sugar.

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