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The Bride Of Macrovision

timothy posted more than 13 years ago | from the but-imagine-the-children! dept.

Music 388

Marty writes: "Coming soon to a CD near you, Safeaudio, the Bride of Macrovision. Those wonderful people at Macrovision, who brought us such wonderful technological innovations as, well, macrovision copy protection on VHS tapes, is now taking a stab at the CD market with a new scheme called Safeaudio. The press release about the beta test can be seen here, which I found initially on Stereophile. It's designed to prevent copying of audio CDs to a CD-R (no technical details are given). Might as well get rid of that whole pesky fair use provision of copyright law, right? After all, according to Macrovision, "We believe that SAFEAUDIO provides an opportunity for the music industry to regain the billions of dollars lost to unauthorized casual copying." Better we all buy multiple copies of the same CD so we can keep one in the car, one at work, one at home so the music corporations can regain their rightful billions that we've stolen by making personal copies or compilation CDs for our own use."

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Re:Just what is "Fair Use"? (1)

ryanbeed (81667) | more than 13 years ago | (#383509)

Also not a lawyer. But I'm in the content creation side of the biz and I make it my business to know something about copyright. Fair use is generally the side of copyright that covers the protection of the greater good. The state of the art. It allows you to use works to create transformative works (the biggest example is parody) it also allows you to use snippets (or possibly complete works) for educational use (videos in classrooms) or for review/comment purposes (either to say it's a good/bad piece of work, here's a snippet to sho you why, or to say that the views expressed in it are good or bad.

The other things that have fallen into the /. definition of fair use have been making backup copies (applies definitely to sofware, I don't know so much with traditional media things) and space/time shifting. Space and time shifting are definitely valid points. OK. There it is and yes, legally what the copy protection schemes + the DMCA are doing effectively ends the comsumers rights of fair use.

Re:Slashdot will never give in (1)

jaoswald (63789) | more than 13 years ago | (#383512)

Don't you see, though?

The artists won't make money by performing *music*, but they'll be able to make it up by consulting and tech support revenue.

This way, they'll be able to make gobs of money, just like open source software, right?

Re:Slashdot will never give in (2)

Misch (158807) | more than 13 years ago | (#383513)

How else other than through the slale of records is an artist supposed to create his music?

I'm not sure what you're asking, but i think you mean "How else other than through the sale of records is an artist to support themselves?" It's called "Go on tour." You know how much artists royalties amount to from a song on a CD? 8.5 CENTS. They get much more from sales of tickets & band merchandise at concerts.

How much do you think it costs to purchase instruments and rent a recording studio? Don't know? Let me tell you then it's quite a bit!

And the price is dropping every day because microphone prices and digital mastering equipment prices are dropping through the floor. More and more people have access to high-quality recording equipment. Get a few good microphones, some good recording equipment, and some space away from ambient noise, and you have a decent recording area.

Would you like the work of your inspiration to be copied without regard to your rights as the creator?

Finally making a good point. What about the will of the artists? The will of the artists went out the window once they signed their recording contract.

I think you're missing the fact that there are a couple of different camps on this issue. There's blatant piracy, and then there's this issue of FAIR USE. Blatant piracy is obviously wrong, but telling me I can't make a copy of a CD I purchased to take to work with me so I don't have to carry a whole pile of CD's with me is wrong

Re:But will it be as successful as vhs macrovision (1)

NecroPuppy (222648) | more than 13 years ago | (#383515)

Many DVD players do not have passthroughs.

Err.... Ok. Then how does one handle cable in? (Again, showing my ignorance.) At home, my setup is:

Cable in -> Cable box -> VCR -> Game system(s) -> TV

Where would I plug a DVD into that?

Just grit your teeth and ride it out. (1)

cherrycoke (146050) | more than 13 years ago | (#383516)

I think that the degree of hyperfocus on compliance with the apalling DMCA, along with the resulting development of new protection schemes, is very likely to (eventually) produce a substantial legislative lashback. Sooner or later, somebody in office is going to recall the existence of provisions for fair use, dust them off, and hold them up for the MPAA and the RIAA; this will very likely emerge from consumer anger with emerging technologies.

The point is, this comically Orwellian crackdown on the replication/distribution of copyrighted works (even in legally permissible ways, in many circumstances) may actually prove to be valuable in the long run, as infuriating as it is at the moment. These kinds of circumstances remind people that they do have rights. Historically, individual rights tend to prevail (in the Western hemisphere, at any rate), and these rights reassert themselves when attacked.

So. Um. That's all I've got...

Re:Will this work??? (1)

CharlieHedlin (102121) | more than 13 years ago | (#383517)

Yeah, they probally did say that. Have you noticed color TV progams can be seen on Black in White TV's (granted, not in color) and vice versa?

Had there not been compatibility color TV would have been a hard sell.

Re:D2A2D (1)

Borealis (84417) | more than 13 years ago | (#383518)

Yes, its obvious to most slashdot readers that there are numerous ways to get around this... but this isn't really targeting the tech-heads, they are going after the casual user with this, and it might just work for that.

The casual user doesn't have to know how to do this, all they have to do is download the latest rip off the net. There will be enough people with technical expertise out there providing rips that the casual moocher just has to know how to use the napster du jour.

Correct me if I'm wrong... (2)

Psmylie (169236) | more than 13 years ago | (#383522)

I was under the impressrion that the macrovision copy protection required both a hardware and software element... meaning that if the recording device and the media being copied both have macrovision on it, then the copies fail (or the signal is interfered with so it records funky). I used to have 2 VCR's, a newer and an older one. If I tried recording from the old to the new, it would crap out, but if I did the recording on the old one (without macrovision on it) then everything was hunky-dory.

The point I'm trying to make is that if this new copy protection works the same way, then it will only work on brand new hardware... so just hold on to those older devices.
Of course, they could try to release cd's that only work on macrovision-enabled cd-players, but I don't think that would go over too well("You mean I have to buy a new cd player to listen to the latest Britney Spears P.O.S? Fook that! I'll get it off the net!")

D2A2D (3)

Stavr0 (35032) | more than 13 years ago | (#383535)

Duuh-obvious. CD to Line out to line in to CDR for the first copy, that cleans the MV then it's free-for-all from then on. (Oh and a 192+kbps MP3 for good measure while we're at it)
---

And this is going to work *how*? (2)

Russ Nelson (33911) | more than 13 years ago | (#383601)

And this is going to work exactly *how* if I rip a CD, decode the MP3 into a .wav file, and burn an audio CD with it? Or even, God Forbid, download the MP3 from the Internet? Do any of these people think for more than a few seconds about these things?
-russ

Will this work??? (1)

keesh (202812) | more than 13 years ago | (#383606)

I was under the impression that you could simply stick a CD reader on one IDE cable and a writer on another, and then do a pretty much direct copy between one and the other without having to actually read (parse?) what's on the disc and make sense of it. Surely this would work regardless of what the CD is like, so long as you make sure you just copy what's there exactly...

This might stop CD -> Hard Drive -> CDR, but if I understand how all this works (which I probably don't) then a direct copy doesn't actually have to make sense of the CD at all. If an ordinary player can read it, surely it can also read an exact (down to the pits and troughs) copy? Or have I misunderstood?

Fair Use (4)

merlin_jim (302773) | more than 13 years ago | (#383611)

I would like to issue an apology to the music industry. Apparently, making a copy of The Matrix soundtrack because I had left mine at the house was simply aggrevious. I'm sure that making that compilation CD of love songs for my girlfriend last Valentine's Day cost the industry billions. And encoding all my CDs into MP3 and burning a single disk with all that audio data on it, so my new MP3 player in my car will work, must have put several recording companies out of business.

Once again, my apologies to a bloated industry which seems to be concerned only with stopping a technological revolution, at the cost of freedom, dignity, and profit.

Where does it end? (1)

CyberKnet (184349) | more than 13 years ago | (#383615)

I'm not as affected by these sort of things as some people are... that might be because I have a slower uptake on new stuff. I also keep my CDs in a huge box which generally gets carted around with me.

I wonder though... if changing the format of CDs meant that everyone had to get a new CD player to play new CDs... I dont believe that RIAA would go ahead. But dont put it past them to put it in DVD2 (ala the next big thing... not neccessarily called DVD2). Cassettes are still around. *some* new music still gets released on vinyls.

CDs being phased out soon because of SAFEAUDIO? I highly doubt it.

---

How special. (1)

Perianwyr Stormcrow (157913) | more than 13 years ago | (#383620)

Well, if they can succeed where every other highly intelligent music industry shill has failed, well bully for them.

If I were a music industry executive, I'd be questioning them REALLY closely about how they are different than every other worthless protection scheme out there...

(Come to think of it, this may be something for consumer music CD recorders. If it is, then it affects me not at all.)

--Perianwyr Stormcrow

It's been tried before (1)

Ryu2 (89645) | more than 13 years ago | (#383623)

I haven't seen technical details about this scheme, but other companies have tried similar schemes (the most recent being some company in Germany). All of them have proven to be impractical because they break a significant portion of existing audio CD players.

Having said that, there's talk about media detection capabilities in future CD or DVD players (search for Jim Taylor's DVD faq), so you can still burn them to *D-R, you just can't play them, if a song is designated (probably by a watermark) not to be played on recordable media. Of course, all you need in that case is a firmware patch.

is this anything like safedisc? (1)

abcbooze (245097) | more than 13 years ago | (#383639)

Well if it is I hope they know that safedisc copyprotection can in fact be copied by using an app called CloneCD. Unfortunatly there isn't a *nix version of this app. The point is that no one though safedisc protection could be copied with cdrs and it is possible.

no worry... (1)

330w0lf (320913) | more than 13 years ago | (#383644)

and just like before, give it 2 weeks after they begin using it mainstream, and someone will find a way around it. I still have my little Video Copy-Protection-Stopper-Box in the closet. Heck.. Get a live card and set wave out as record device and grab the tracks........ ok, so its sloppy, but it works (and any idiot can do it, which explains how i thought of it)

I trust the Chinese on this one. (1)

Perianwyr Stormcrow (157913) | more than 13 years ago | (#383645)

They'll bust anything in hardware we Americans care to throw at them.

So I can just go over there and get h4x0r3d versions of whatever audio gear I care to use.

--Perianwyr Stormcrow

Depends on how it works. (2)

Christianfreak (100697) | more than 13 years ago | (#383649)

I think it will stop Joe Luser but won't stop anyone who knows how to make exact images (copying the bits on the disk). Still if they can do it, it defenatly sets a dangerous precident. I can understand the Music Industry's point when it comes to Napster, but fair use of your own stuff? I hate lawsuits but I sure hope that when this hits the market that someone decides to stand up for the little guy... (maybe we need Homer Simpson).

"One World, one Web, one Program" - Microsoft promotional ad

But will it be as successful as vhs macrovision? (4)

Chuck Flynn (265247) | more than 13 years ago | (#383650)

If the copy-protection scheme is to succeed, it must be as undetectable as possible by the end user. I don't mean that he won't realize he's using a copy-protected format, but that his ears won't be able to tell the difference between a copy-protected one and a non-protected one.

VHS macrovision is popular precisely because it's undetectable in how it alters visual quality. You'll hear lots of complaints by people who are unable to copy videos correctly, but you'll never hear a complaint by anyone about how macrovision has degraded their signal -- it hasn't.

We're almost at the stage where digital watermarks are completely seamless. Ten years ago, inititives like this would've been scoffed at. Now, they're becoming reality.

Mirror? (5)

Dman33 (110217) | more than 13 years ago | (#383654)

Could somebody please mirror the crack for SafeAudio?? :)

Re:And this is going to work *how*? (2)

keesh (202812) | more than 13 years ago | (#383655)

Marketroids: It stops thoe evil hacker people copying your music.Record Company:OK, we'll use itMarketroids:Excellent. That will be fifty billion dollars please.Record Company: Erm...Marketroids: Well it's that or get copied. Oh, and we've patented it so no-one else can do it.Record Company:OK, we'll take ten please.

Seems to me as if they did think about it quite well...

Safe from what? (3)

SnowDog_2112 (23900) | more than 13 years ago | (#383658)

Folks have been talking about this since at least May 2000 (thanks to Google for quick search results):

http://www.prostudio.com/studiosound/may00/comm_ eu r.html

So this isn't really _new_ news. On the other hand, the fact that it's being tested probably is.

The real story here is something we've known all along. The big companies see a huge loss of income from the teching up of the people. As we get access to cd burners, computers with broadband, etc... they see their traditional revenue streams eventually drying up. They're grasping for straws.

It sucks, really. They couldn't make it illegal to copy content for fair use, so instead they just standardize it out of existence. Since they're all in bed together anyway, we all stand to lose in the end.

They won't be happy until the only way you can hear music is a streaming connection, for which you will pay by the second....

Slashdot will never give in (2)

MSBob (307239) | more than 13 years ago | (#383659)

Whatever form of copy protection gets proposed slashdot editors are always first to get their panties in a knot. No thought is given to the implication of the piracy of media content or intellectual property. How else other than through the slale of records is an artist supposed to create his music? How much do you think it costs to purchase instruments and rent a recording studio? Don't know? Let me tell you then it's quite a bit! Even if they could scrap through to buy a battered guitar or drums what about feeding their wives and kids? Would you like the work of your inspiration to be copied without regard to your rights as the creator? Think about it. The so called community gets very upset at every hint of violating the GLP license but if someone else tries to protect THEIR own intellectual property then all of a sudden it's not right and it's restricting freedom? Yeah, right I'm with you all the way on this one!

Installed Base (2)

WinPimp2K (301497) | more than 13 years ago | (#383671)

That should really say it all, but the folks at Macrovision are 'forward looking'. So, lets look forward to:
Macrovision 'protected' CDs going south faster and with less reason than unprotected ones.
A 15% (average) increase in the retail price of music CDs to cover the royalties going to Macrovsion for their 'protection'.
If you doubt the price increase, reread the bit about how Macrovision will control when and how the 'technology' will be 'upgraded'.In short, they are fishing for a constant revenue stream from the music distributors.

Re:D2A2D (2)

Aggrazel (13616) | more than 13 years ago | (#383673)

Yes, its obvious to most slashdot readers that there are numerous ways to get around this... but this isn't really targeting the tech-heads, they are going after the casual user with this, and it might just work for that.

So if they use this method to sell a few million more CDs to people who have no idea how to get around this... well, they'd say it was a success.

This would be a good thing, if, of course, the music industry decided to lower the cost of individual CDs to compensate for the lower instance of copying... but we all know the chances of that happening...

Bit-by-bit copy? (1)

sdriver (126467) | more than 13 years ago | (#383676)

I still don't understand how this will stop ripping from the ATAPI drive digitally? How do they stop a perfect copy? A CD is a CD is a CD. There is nothing to stop that. The only devices that will be affected will be CD->(Digital2Analog)->(Analog2Digital)->CDR. Stupid.

Speculation (1)

elbarsal (232181) | more than 13 years ago | (#383679)

Since there are no actual technical details provided, I can only guess that their copy protection scheme will rely on having control over the method used to actually read digital data from the CD.

It would seem to me that the best in raw CD reading and writing (I'm mostly unfamiliar here, but DiskJuggler and CDRWin come to mind for Windows, and CDParanoia for *nix) could still digitally reproduce these CD's, or evolve to do so if they don't already.

More interesting will be getting a CD burning utility to remove the copy protection, instead of burning a bit-for-bit copy of the original and supposedly protected media.

Ed

Sauce for the goose... (5)

vrmlguy (120854) | more than 13 years ago | (#383683)

Did anyone else notice this?
The SAFEAUDIO Toolkit will be distributed with Macrovision's SAFECAST(TM) digital rights management technology that enables 'time lock' and 'number of usage lock' functions while providing persistent security. This feature ensures that CD replication facilities will always be using the latest release of SAFEAUDIO and by allowing Macrovision to control the timing and delivery of toolkit upgrades.
I love it! Macrovision apparently doesn't trust the recording industry to not make copies of the software!

--
Dave: Open the pod bay doors, HAL.
HAL: Screw you, Dave!

Re:is this anything like safedisc? (1)

Dogun (7502) | more than 13 years ago | (#383684)

I was under the impression that dd tended to work pretty well in that respect?

disinformed (1)

shunryu (321987) | more than 13 years ago | (#383685)


Might as well get rid of that whole pesky fair use provision of copyright law, right?

Not neccessarily so, see most corporations will always want a scapegoat to fall back unto should their corporation lose funds somewhere down the line (overpaid exec's, bad artists, etc.), which is where claiming the loss of millions is stemming from others pirating music.

Now, according to that press release there isn't much said on what steps the program takes to ensure nothing is used, so who's to say this even works for one, and who's to say someone won't circumvent it down the line. Personally I feel those in the industry could, and can create an industry standard which wouldn't allow this to happen, but won't, because once again, they can't come back later and cry losses, thereby creating stinkers (legal mumbo jumbo) in order to create disinformation abroad to hide the fact that sometimes their losses aren't always those pirating, etc. (e.g. Record execs vs. Napster)

The complete press release once again seems to focus on a product and all its greatness with no real detail other than supporting paragraphs referencing how great this product is. How does it work though, is it an encryption based program, steganographic based product? What about some of these CD's with enhanced videos on them, these cannot be copied, and yet they didn't need any special program such as Safecopy to make them, why not use these schemes? Well more power to Macrovision for blindly capitalizing on an idea.

Fidel Castro -- My kind of hacker [antioffline.com]

Re:D2A2D (1)

ryanbeed (81667) | more than 13 years ago | (#383688)

maybe. Current macrovision is pretty smart about those types of things. Considering what they do to VHS is essentially a watermark (except that it just screws up the timing signal) what they're probably doing is adding something to the signal. That is unless they're just basically putting something on the disk that says "I am not copyable" then yes D2A2D would work, but I guess I'm saying is don't count on it.

Uh.huh. (4)

PopeAlien (164869) | more than 13 years ago | (#383699)

Well, If this is anything like Macrovision, you need to get all that hardware compliant.. I can see getting the major manufacturer to get together and install limitations on those home CD recorders (non-pc based), but won't this limitation have to be hardware installed on all those no-name burners as well?

Macrovision sucks bad by the way. When I first tried to run a signal from a DVD to my TV, I had to go through my VCR (really old TV, no RCA inputs).. The Macrovision signal would f*ck with the signal level coming through the VCR, and it didn't matter that I wasn't trying to *copy* the DVD, it wouldn't let me watch it. What sort of complications would this introduce to audio CD's, and *WHY* would people purchase new hardware that is less reliable? Shiny new packaging?

They'll never learn. (1)

rzbx (236929) | more than 13 years ago | (#383704)

When will they ever learn that you can't copy protect anything, no matter what, it will be broken. It's just a natural thing. D*mn millionaires, they just won't give up and live their lives, what are they trying to accomplish? One person can live on a million dollars for many years and still be happy(atleast 10 years). A waste of time. We need to stop with the copy-protection that is only in the interest of the rich and worry about getting rid of these darn'd lawyers and other scum of the earth, they can find something better to do.

Just goes to show you.. (4)

norton_I (64015) | more than 13 years ago | (#383708)

This just goes to show that the RIAA is always lying through their teeth when they way "We aren't concerned about casual copying. We are just trying to stop mass piracy."

They really want to take away your rights to use music you purchased legally.

I can see the case for macrovision, at least on rental videos: When you only pay $2.50 to rent a video for 3 days (or whatever), you shouldn't be allowed to copy it, even for personal use. But trying to apply the same logic to CDs that you buy is just wrong.

Since maybe .1% of all music copying (legal or illegal) is cdda->cdda (as opposed to MP3 or other file formats, possibly on a CD), they really have no justification for doing this, other than to screw their customers.

Macrovision is evil incarnate. (1)

AFCArchvile (221494) | more than 13 years ago | (#383713)

First they created the Macrovision protection scheme on VCRs and TV-Out devices. Then they created SafeDisc, which is responsible for ruining all sorts of game titles (including Diablo II, which is notorious for its flawed implementation of SafeDisc). And now this.

Is nothing safe from the grasp of Macrovision? Well, DeCSS has already been created; that's one example of a medium they neglected to taint.

Moderation (2)

cavemanf16 (303184) | more than 13 years ago | (#383716)

Can I mod down Macrovision for trolling on the issue of 'protecting copyright'? Has Slashdot developed a moderation system for moderating websites? :)

Yet another troll technology that will probably be a lame attempt to protect those with money like *cough* DeCSS *cough*. Oops, I meant, tried to protect the rich...

Just what is "Fair Use"? (2)

Ralph Wiggam (22354) | more than 13 years ago | (#383718)

Like a vast majority of Slashdotters, I am not a lawyer. We also throw around the phrase "fair use" a whole lot. Could someone that really is a lawyer (or close) give the legal difinition of "fair use", please?
Marty, the story submitter, claims that Macrovision, as well as this new system, SafeAudio, are crushing our rights to copy stuff that we paid for and own. Are companies really required to give you a "plaintext" version of the music/video you buy so that you can make personal copies? I wouldn't think so.
Then you can get into the whole discussion about how companies are allowed to encode content, but people are not allowed to decode it because of the DMCA.
I own an old Apex 600a DVD player so Macrovision doesn't concern me much.

-B

Vaporware - and what is it meant to do?! (3)

Cyberdyne (104305) | more than 13 years ago | (#383723)

What are they actually trying to stop here? Me ripping CDs to disk with cdparanoia? Copying CDs on those CD+CDr hifi systems? Copying to tape?

The first one has been tried - just screw with the error correction info on the CD. That way, "dumb" audio CD players are OK, but CD ROM drives do extra error correction and "correct" the signal wrongly, screwing up the rip. Nice try, but it didn't work reliably with audio CD players, and ISTR you could bypass the problem with raw reads on a CD ROM drive anyway. Oops. Can't remember who tried that one, but it didn't get very far - CDs kept being returned "It doesn't play in my CD player!" etc...

CD->CDr copying would be much the same, I imagine: properly designed, it should just be ripping straight from one drive onto the other. No chance there, then.

OK, so are they trying to stop people copying to tape by screwing with the signal? That's been tried before as well: the Beatles were among the first, adding a high-frequency tone to their LPs to interfere with the bias signal on a tape deck. That one didn't get anywhere either: again, it broke on some players, and was trivial to circumvent (low-pass or notch filter, anyone?).

So: They claim to have some magic bullet anti-piracy solution which blocks copying. No indication what sort of copying, or how it blocks it, just a press release... Why do I get the feeling it's not going to get very far?!

Re:Will this work??? (2)

GreyLurk (35139) | more than 13 years ago | (#383737)

It will probably work similar to DVD's, where only licenced players will be able to read these CD's, and Licenced players will be policed so that they cannot do a direct CD to CD copy, and the industry will prosecute in court any company which builds a CD to CD copy-capable drive.

The problem with introducing this so late in the game with CD's though, is that there will still be a lot of old CD-RW drives and CD ROM drives on the market that can bypass the whole scheme.

Huh? (3)

mwalker (66677) | more than 13 years ago | (#383741)

But how does it work. They claim you can use existing mastering equipment to create cds like this. Even more impressive, they claim:

The SAFEAUDIO Toolkit will be distributed with Macrovision's SAFECAST(TM) digital rights management technology that enables 'time lock' and 'number of usage lock' functions while providing persistent security. This feature ensures that CD replication facilities will always be using the latest release of SAFEAUDIO and by allowing Macrovision to control the timing and delivery of toolkit upgrades.

If you can lock the number of times someone plays a song, you are NOT making a cd that will play in a cd player. You need software for that, and it sounds to me like this is software for win32 pc's only. This sounds like yet another attempt to create cds that will execute a program on your computer that decrypt tracks on the cd. Even though it now has DMCA protection, all these schemes have the problem of either needing an external conduit (the net) to give the user the key, or embedding the key on the cd, which is all too easy to hack.

This is an old (and stupid) idea.

Prove me wrong?

Something's got to go. (2)

bill_mcgonigle (4333) | more than 13 years ago | (#383746)

The technology was developed jointly by Macrovision and TTR Technologies, Inc. in response to the widespread availability of CD burners and disc compilation software.

Hmmm, they're not even trying to pretend this is to stop piracy? This is so people can't make their own compilations? Surely this is prime fair use.

But the cat's out of the bag on CD's. They can't sacrifice backwards-compatibility so they either have to mess with the digital signal or put data in the non-music blocks on the CD. Open source tools already know how to read CD's and skip non-data blocks.

At least with VCR's the Macrovision signal is supposed to be out of range of the TV's display circuitry, but in range of the VCR's recording circuitry, so, in theory, you don't get signal degredation. I can't see how they can accomplish backwards compatibility, unadulterated audio signals, and effectiveness (unless they plan to attack linux cd tools with DMCA). Pick any two.

A warning to the music industry (2)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#383749)

I intend to start applying a restrictive license to everything I post to the net. It will permit all of the usual uses, such as reading online, archiving a copy, etc. But it will specifically require that the first page of any printed copy of any such work, even if it is contained within a compilation with other such works, must contain the full copyright notice. As one individual, I can't expect to ever prove that they have run afoul of my license. But if thousands of us do the same, it may work.

And if the copyright holders on music that the big labels aren't interested in put similar restrictions on songs they release as MP3s, we could easily see the recording industry violating the licenses of indy artists in their overzealous search for fair use that they don't like. A class action lawsuit on behalf of the very indy artists that they aren't interested in distributing could be an excellent test case for re-establishing fair use in the modern networked world. Hopefully, there are some lawyers out there interested in free speech issues looking for a chance to do just that.

SCMS (1)

jbuilder (81344) | more than 13 years ago | (#383753)

Isn't this what SCMS (Serial Copy Management System) was invented for? So that you could copy your stuff, but no one else could make a copy *from* that? WTF is up with the recording industry? They make *more* money each and every year than the previous year and they *still* cry poor.

Hopefully the RIAA et al will realize that using this will do more harm than good....

And the award goes to... (1)

Rudeboy777 (214749) | more than 13 years ago | (#383756)

Congrats to marty, submitter of this story, for the story with the most sarcastic tone ever submitted to Slashdot. It was a pleasure to read :)

But seriously, it sems that every copyright story I read these days makes the "fair use" clause more and more unattainable. These stories NEVER get press in the mainstream media, only Napster soundbytes with undertones that imply all Napster users are criminals. I'm not one for conspiracy theories, but is there really no interest to John Q. Public about these issues? Does anyone else feel that groups like RIAA are trying to hurry decisions through the courts at rocket-speed so that by the time Joe Average realizes he's fucked, your friendly neighbourhood megacorp can say "Why didn't you complain back then?"

multiple copies of the same cd (2)

didjit (34494) | more than 13 years ago | (#383757)

how many people actually need multiple copies of the same cd? i've never burned extra copies of cd's i own so i can have one for the car, one for home, and one for the discman. i usually just bring the cd to where i want to play it. man that's really complicated.

Re:Slashdot will never give in (5)

SnowDog_2112 (23900) | more than 13 years ago | (#383769)

Yes, there is a vocal contingent of anti-intellectual property folks out there who want nothing more than to see all copyrights fade away.

But there also a bunch of us moderate folks who are annoyed that we're being stopped from doing things we have every legal right to do, through the power of these media companies.

If I buy a CD, I can do with it whatever I want, for my own use. I can copy it onto tape so I can listen to it in my car, since I don't have a CD player in my car. I can burn it into MP3s so I can have a 1000-song jukebox in my PC. I can make another CD copy of it, so I can archive my original and not lose anything when the CD gets scratched (which does happen, this isn't a weird "what if" scenario).

The recording industry knows these things are perfectly legal, but they are so greedy they are willing to sacrifice our ability to do these perfectly legal things to secure for themselves a few more dollars.

Re:Will this work??? (1)

osorronophris (318023) | more than 13 years ago | (#383774)

I believe you're basically right about that. Once one has data, there's nothing anybody can do to keep one from copying said data. It's basically like trying to keep someone from making photocopies of a piece of paper. There could be changes to the software that generally reads CD's and what-not. But that should only affect M$ users. :)

New revenue for an old dog (5)

scoove (71173) | more than 13 years ago | (#383775)

Better we all buy multiple copies of the same CD so we can keep one in the car, one at work, one at home...

Imagine the new revenue opportunities for the recording industry as you check out of Best Buy:

Sales clerk: Now we just have a few questions before we can sell you Tupac's Greatest Hits. First, will this CD be for home, office, auto or portable use?
Purchaser: Well, I guess mostly for home. But I'll probably listen to it in the car too.
Sales clerk: Oh, then you'll want our enterprise license. It'll allow you full locational use rights. Do you ever have passengers in your car?
Purchaser: Well yea. Sometimes.
Sales clerk: OK. We'll mark you down for the 10 seat license expansion. As you may be aware, CD media is subject to wear and tear and replacement can be expensive. Would you like the optional RIAA replacement warranty, allowing you to obtain a replacement CD should this one become damaged, for only an additional $9.95?
Purchaser: Err... I guess so.
Sales clerk: Fine. That brings your total to $43.45, not including sales tax. They'll ring this up front for you.



*scoove*
"RIAA: Revenue Increase Absent Artists"

whipersnappers! (2)

Transition Cat (115549) | more than 13 years ago | (#383777)

Back in my day we didn't have digitally perfect copies and hackers to defeat copy protection.

We made our copies onto analog cassette tapes in real time and traded hissy compilations amongst ourselves and we liked it!

....

Re:And this is going to work *how*? (1)

pcosta (236434) | more than 13 years ago | (#383781)

I don't see how this can work without breaking all current CD player. Macrovision works only with analog video, they can't encrypt the CD digital audio without making it incompatible with every player out there. Maybe they mean it as an analog copy protection scheme, (altough I can't see any use for that).

Macrovision conflicts with projection TVs (1)

Jammer@CMH (117977) | more than 13 years ago | (#383782)

Macrovision copy protection, from what I've read, often causes problems with projection TVs, particularly if the signal runs through a video pre-processor first. A line doubler causes the macrovision perterbation to become visible in much the same way that a second inline VCR would.

Perhaps someone with a projection TV who hasn't disabled their Macrovision can comment.

Re:But will it be as successful as vhs macrovision (4)

NMerriam (15122) | more than 13 years ago | (#383784)

You'll hear lots of complaints by people who are unable to copy videos correctly, but you'll never hear a complaint by anyone about how macrovision has degraded their signal -- it hasn't.

I take it you've never had one of those visit's to a friend's house where they complain because no matter what they do, they can't get the DVD/VHS player to work right. Oh, yeah, you can't plug a DVD player into a VCR that's connected to a TV. Or a VHS player through a cable box, or a DSS box, or anything else becasue the Macrovision screws it all up.

God forbid someone should desire to plug all their stuff into the TV at once -- you're trying to rip off the content producers!...

---------------------------------------------

Question: (1)

superflex (318432) | more than 13 years ago | (#383797)

(1) Can anybody tell me about a successful copy protection scheme that has been devised to date?

I mean, I know my memory has been going downhill ever since the age of 14 (ah, the glorious early 90's...), but I know I can't think of one that hasn't been hacked...

Re:Reasons that won't work (1)

Maxwell (13985) | more than 13 years ago | (#383799)

dual tray home audio cd-r components already do this. they have an internal D-A-D converter.

so
1) just like the original home cd-r's
2) just like both original and dual deck cdr's

Shrug, what's the diff?

JKL

No matter. (2)

supabeast! (84658) | more than 13 years ago | (#383801)

This one will likely be just as successful as Macrovision's pervious attempts at CD copy protection, Safedisc and Safedisc 2.

Both Safedisc and Safedisc 2 can be defeated with generic cracks that were released as soon as the schemes came on the market. Safedisc and Safedisc 2 software are almost always released with specific cracks in .iso format before they ever hit the stores.

Macrovision's attempts at copy protection are worthless. They are sold to moronic executives with little technical knowledge, people too ignorant to realize how useless Macrovision protections on CDs are.

Re:Slashdot will never give in (5)

norton_I (64015) | more than 13 years ago | (#383803)

The problem isn't that people (well, at least me) think that the music industry should be able to defend their rights. I for one, would be happy to see Napster shut down... What I object to is that they try to take away my legal rights to fair use, etc. under the guise of "protecting their intellectual property". That is what this technology does (or claims to do -- I am skeptical that it works). Almost no illegal uses of CDs will be prevented by this, and many, many cases of fair use copying will be prevented. That why the RIAA is evil.

Re:But will it be as successful as vhs macrovision (1)

shuffler (109898) | more than 13 years ago | (#383804)

VHS macrovision is popular precisely because it's undetectable in how it alters visual quality. You'll hear lots of complaints by people who are unable to copy videos correctly, but you'll never hear a complaint by anyone about how macrovision has degraded their signal -- it hasn't. Hook up the output of your DVD player to your VHS VCR. Hook up the output of your VHS VCR to your TV. Play a DVD and notice how Macrovision degrades the video signal on your TV even though you're not making a copy. The combination of DVD and VHS Macrovision results in a lot of angry DVD owners.

Shank Audio! (1)

Lede Singer (253091) | more than 13 years ago | (#383807)

If I purchase a CD, than I own the rights to it, and so what if technology permits me to copy it for my own uses. I've been burning CD's for a few years now, and I can HONESTLY say that most are for me to listen to the same songs I purchased, but in different mixes or whatever.

However, if they're so concerned about all of us "robbing them blind", why don't they give us just a little less incentive to "rape them" and DROP THEIR PRICES! I'm being serious and sarcastic at the same time. Don't try and sell me a product at a cost several dozen times what it took to make it, and then tell me not to find an alternative!

You can't copyprotect what you can see/hear (1)

innerCap (307832) | more than 13 years ago | (#383809)

When are they going to give up? If the sound can make it to your ears, then you can burn a copy onto a cdr. D-A-D. Same with video. Camcorder/microphone. RCA cables. Not until they figure out how to make our ears and eyes authenticate media will this crap work.

Locks are for the toolkit itself, not CDs (3)

Jammer@CMH (117977) | more than 13 years ago | (#383810)

I think that the time lock and number of usage locks are applied to the SafeAudio toolkit itself, to restrict the usage of the toolkit by the replication facility. This can ensure that the facility is always using a recent version, as an old version would lock up.

Not a problem for the consumer. Just quality assurance for the labels, and a pain in the butt for the replication facility.

Re:multiple copies of the same cd (4)

TheGratefulNet (143330) | more than 13 years ago | (#383811)

how many people actually need multiple copies of the same cd

ever had your car broken into and your cd's stolen? ever loaned out a cd to a friend only to never get it back, or get it back in a very scratched manner?

ever have them 'missing' from work?

--

Re:And this is going to work *how*? (1)

jfk3 (215200) | more than 13 years ago | (#383813)

Aside from the main point of this discussion... If you're going to put it back on a CD-R (in CDDA format), you don't want to rip it to MP3. You're losing quality that way. Use a ripper that will allow you to make an exact bit for bit copy for best results.

Re:Huh? (1)

taniwha (70410) | more than 13 years ago | (#383814)

This sounds like yet another attempt to create cds that will execute a program on your computer that decrypt tracks on the cd

and will that program run under Linux .... will we need a 14yr-old in Outer Mongolia to pull a couple of all nighters before we can play them?

Why do you have to make copies? (1)

wadetemp (217315) | more than 13 years ago | (#383815)

I have never understood this. Why do people demand that they be able to make multiple copies of music CDs to store in different places? Honestly, how hard is it to take a few CDs that you think you might like to listen to at work WITH YOU? So say you work 10 hours... that would give you enough time to listen to 11 or 12 average length CDs. Is that too many to put in a CD holder and pack in to work? Same with the car... how long are you going to be driving? An hour? Two? That's not enough time to listen to your whole collection I'm willing to bet. So pick some you want to listen to for the day and take them with you!

I guess the moral of the story is that there's only enough time in the day to listen to so much music... indescision about what you want to listen to during that limited amount of time is your problem, not the record industry's. If you're going to fight for something, fight for the lowering of CD prices instead!

(Of course, copying CDs because prices are so insanely high might be one way to get them to drop prices is one way to do that... ) :)

Re:You can't copyprotect what you can see/hear (2)

Eric Smith (4379) | more than 13 years ago | (#383816)

Intel is already trying to move the decryption of digital media into the speakers and monitor. If they are successful with this, there is NO question in my mind that once it becomes technologically feasible (probably MANY years from now), they will try to push the decryption into the human.

I used to think that such suggestions were paranoid to the extreme, but now I realize that with all the billions of dollars that the RIAA and MPAA *claim* to lose every year, they will be delighted to fund research into the necessary technology.

Phillips Magnavox... (1)

Arethan (223197) | more than 13 years ago | (#383817)

Is it just me, or will this idea completely kill the entire line of CD to CDR standalone burners that have been on the market for the past year or so? Philips Magnavox might not like this too much, considering that they were one of the first to produce those units.

Not really much of an argument, but it's a thought that crossed my mind.

Re:Uh.huh. (1)

cowwie (85496) | more than 13 years ago | (#383823)

Yeah, same problem with my DVD player as well. I had originally hooked up my DVD player to my parent's TV to let them watch something, and it was absolutely horrid... brightness would dim and get bright randomly, lines danced around the screen, and all kind of bad things. Then I hooked up the DVD player through my VCR and it's not as bad. There's an occasional place where it will get dim, and I have to turn the audio up.. but it's better than having to buy a new TV set when I'm already so far in debt.

Thank you again Macrovision... who cares how bad you screw the consumers as long as big businesses don't lose any money.

at least mp3 did one good thing for us (5)

TheGratefulNet (143330) | more than 13 years ago | (#383827)

it lowered our expectation on sound quality.

I used to chase hi-end audio till it drove me to the poorhouse. it was a never ending quest to get that perfect reproduction of music.

then came mp3. it taught us that content was usually more important than raw audiophile quality. at least as long as the audio was listenable; which with good mp3 encoders, it is.

so how does that relate to this story? well, if we have to start making copies by going via the analog domain instead of purely digital, then so be it. that used to be a big no-no, but with the widespread acceptance of mp3 and its lower quality sound, a regular old analog-to-analog copy (actually, digital, analog, analog, digital) doesn't look so bad anymore.

there is no standard on earth, imaginable or real that can prevent an analog copy (since you have to be able to LISTEN to it at some point) from working.

so far the music industry has declared war on its own customers. do they think we'll just take it sitting down? restrict our LEGAL right to make personal-use copies and not only do you risk litigation and more black-eyes but we consumers will always find a workaround to your madness. and angering us will only persuade us to NEVER line your pockets with our spare change ever again. create an enemy in us and you'll go poor sooner than if you had just let us use the music as currently allowed by law!

--

Obvious... (4)

KurdtX (207196) | more than 13 years ago | (#383830)

Well, the obvious solution to Safeaudio would be to buy no copies of any disk that uses it. And then continue boycotting until they realease a copyright-law compatible version. There isn't any CD out there that would drastically affect my life if I didn't have it.
No sales -> No consumer support -> No Safeaudio

Kurdt

Re:But will it be as successful as vhs macrovision (1)

Evangelion (2145) | more than 13 years ago | (#383831)


TV doesn't have RCA ins (it's old). DVD doesn't have COAX out.

End result? shelling out $50 (cdn) for a macrovision nuking box.

--

Once a Criminal... (1)

ackthpt (218170) | more than 13 years ago | (#383832)

...always a criminal. According to the MPAA, RIAA, NFL, ABC, CBS, DISNEY, et al. I'm just the sort of scum they desperately need to corral and reign my filthy habits of copying content, even if it's for my own personal use, because some bystander might hear Burning Down The House from my car at an interesection or the neighbor might see through the window a recording of the Superbowl. What a rascal I am, I should just stuff my wallet and my rights into a big envelope and send it to Dick Cheney so all the right people get a piece of me.

--

If you can read it you can write it (1)

decipher_saint (72686) | more than 13 years ago | (#383833)

No matter the format, no matter the protection, if it can be read it can be written. Its only a matter of time before copy protection is broken.

-----

Re:Huh? (2)

MindStalker (22827) | more than 13 years ago | (#383834)

Read it again, this is a software lock against the record labels. Meaning they have to pay so much for every million or so cds they produce, and this software will stop working once they have made so many cds. Yes something else to drive UP the price of CDs while reducing their value.

Better be COMPATIBLE with older CD players. (2)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#383835)

Why will people want to junk all their CD audio equipment and buy more just to protect the RIAA.

If new CDs won't play on old players, people will just not buy the new discs, and market forces will FORCE the record houses to comply.

And if the new CDs are backward compatible, then they remain copyable.

Re:But will it be as successful as vhs macrovision (2)

abischof (255) | more than 13 years ago | (#383836)

  • Ok, I'll admit some ignorance here, as I don't own a DVD player, but couldn't you hook them up in a different order?

    VCR -> DVD -> TV
Theoretically? Maybe. Actuality? Nope -- I know of no DVD player that has A/V inputs :-/. Being that consumer DVD players can't record, it actually makes sense that no A/V input is provided.

Alex Bischoff
---

Workarounds (1)

athakur999 (44340) | more than 13 years ago | (#383837)

How long until someone creates a "write to file" DirectX driver that pretends it's a hardware driver?

Heck, I can even see some adventurous soul tapping the lines right before the last D2A conversion on a sound card and capturing that to a file.

Regardless of what the RIAA/MPAA/whatever try, our eyes and ears don't conform to any copyright protection schemes. Until they figure out a way to change that, there will always be a way to get by it.

Re:But will it be as successful as vhs macrovision (1)

CharlieHedlin (102121) | more than 13 years ago | (#383838)

I have a setup with a doulby digital reciever that acts as a video switch and a TV with RCA inputs, so I don't have to run my DVD player through my VCR for RF output, but in testing I have.

The really odd thing, everthing works fine just using the VCR for composite => rf conversion (or at least it did until my VCR's rf modulator went out recently). However, It would go foul as soon as I pressed record.

I know this is different than most people reported. I believe this is a functin of my VCR passing the signal through unaltered until I hit record. Then it is monitoring what is being recorded.

Anyone else experience this? This is with a JVC dvd player and JVC VCR.

Fair Use Legislation (1)

Overzeetop (214511) | more than 13 years ago | (#383839)

I suppose one way to fight back (for those of us in the US) would be to see how many congressmen here we can get to consider the idea of supporting legislation protecting fair use. Perhaps if it's couched in terms of the DMCA:Since they've passed legislation making it illegal to circumvent legitimate copy protection, it should only be fair that copy protection schemes which place and undue burden on Fair Use should also be illegal. It should go both ways!

This technology is not required in Canada (4)

dstone (191334) | more than 13 years ago | (#383850)

There's an aspect of Canadian law that really:
1) makes me happy we have this law currently
2) will piss me off if technology like this takes off

In Canada, March 19, 1998, Part VIII of the Copyright Act came into force. Until then, copying any sound recording for almost any purpose infringed copyright. Part VIII legalizes one such activity: copying of sound recordings of musical works onto recording media for the private use of the person who makes the copy.

Specifically, the Copyright Board says their ruling "does not legalize (a) copies made for the use of someone other than the person making the copy; and (b) copies of anything else than sound recordings of musical works. It does legalize making a personal copy of a recording owned by someone else." So to fufill the spirit of Canadian copyright law, I assume Macrovision's technology will continue to allow me to make copies of all my friends CDs for my own personal use (which the law allows).

Re:Will this work??? (1)

swv3752 (187722) | more than 13 years ago | (#383854)

And if it doesn't work on existing CD players it just won't fly at all.

Re:But will it be as successful as vhs macrovision (4)

Squid (3420) | more than 13 years ago | (#383857)

but you'll never hear a complaint by anyone about how macrovision has degraded their signal -- it hasn't.

That's because most people haven't figured out WHY the picture curls at the top, or why it keeps getting lighter and darker on a cycle. Until I researched Macrovision I thought all my storebought tapes were being damaged at the checkout line when they demagnetize the anti-shoplift tags!

Re:Huh? (1)

elbarsal (232181) | more than 13 years ago | (#383858)

Regarding the time and usage locks - I get the impression that they are saying that the SAFEAUDIO software will be subjected to this, using their SAFECAST technology, ensuring "that CD replication facilities will always be using the latest release of SAFEAUDIO".

The other interpretation (time and usage locks on music CD's) would lead to the conclusion that Macrovision is way off the mark in the viability of their technology, IMHO.

Ed

RIAA a Monopoly (1)

cc_pirate (82470) | more than 13 years ago | (#383860)

The only reason crap like this works is because the RIAA is essentially a monopoly. A giant consortium that gets away with murder that a single company would never be able to without having the Justice Department breathing down their neck. They appear to collude on prices with each other, etc. I know that there are a lot of little record labels, but lets face it, their dollar amounts are nothing compared to the big 4 in the RIAA. That plus they can't afford to get their music played on mass market radio stations.
Is there anyway we can get a group of big wig tech heads (Stallman, etc.) to ask the Justice Department to investigate the RIAA the same way M$ is being investigated? I mean, making non-standard audio formats to lock smaller labels out (DVD-audio anyone?) and trying to kill our fair use rights is EVIL. It'd be nice if we actual got JUSTICE once instead of just the LAW.

"...they had the law and they had justice. They understood they were two different things. Justice carried a sword." - D. Drake

Re:No matter. (2)

Eric Smith (4379) | more than 13 years ago | (#383863)

The problem with the introduction of a new copy protection system now ISN'T whether it is hard to crack. The problem is that in the past, they could do this sort of thing, but the consumer could lawfully circumvent the protection (provided that he or she didn't violate the copyright). This allowed for fair use.

But now, thanks to the DMCA, it is illegal to circumvent any new copy protection system they come up with, no matter how cheesy it is. The DMCA only requires that the copy protection be "effective", and in the one major test of the legislation to date, the judge decided that the lame copy protection of DVDs was "effective" because the DMCA made it illegal to bypass it. (What a wonderful example of circular reasoning!)

The DMCA also states that it does not limit fair use. However, the same judge decided that fair use was not a defense against DMCA actions.

Re:at least mp3 did one good thing for us (1)

AlXtreme (223728) | more than 13 years ago | (#383864)

Hear Hear!
mod this guy up!

Re:But will it be as successful as vhs macrovision (1)

NecroPuppy (222648) | more than 13 years ago | (#383865)

Hook up the output of your DVD player to your VHS VCR. Hook up the output of your VHS VCR to your TV. Play a DVD and notice how Macrovision degrades the video signal on your TV even though you're not making a copy. The combination of DVD and VHS Macrovision results in a lot of angry DVD owners.

Ok, I'll admit some ignorance here, as I don't own a DVD player, but couldn't you hook them up in a different order?

VCR -> DVD -> TV

Is the signal screwed up that way too?

Re:But will it be as successful as vhs macrovision (1)

Apache (14188) | more than 13 years ago | (#383866)

Oh, yeah, you can't plug a DVD player into a VCR that's connected to a TV.

Not always true. At home, I have my apex 600a plugged into my vcr which is plugged into my tv. With macrovision turned on, dvds play just fine. I checked to see what would happen if I tried to record a tape with macrovision turned on; During the recording, image quality was degraded to fuzzy black and white. Playing back the copy showed no image at all. With macrovision off, it copies and plays just fine. I suspect it depends on how your VCR is implemented.

Fair Use Explained (2)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#383867)

You can check out Stanford's fair use [stanford.edu] web site for more information. Also, see EFF's Understanding Fair Use Rights [eff.org] .

Re:Macrovision conflicts with projection TVs (1)

Coward, Anonymous (55185) | more than 13 years ago | (#383868)

I have a Sony KP-53V75 projection TV and have experienced no problems with Macrovision from either my DVD player or VCR.

Damn Recording Industry (1)

honkytonkin (311393) | more than 13 years ago | (#383869)

First the boy bands, and now this, good God what is the world comming to? Actually, its no big deal, just a little challenge--doesn't the recording industry know this? They need to make CDs that dont scratch so easily, and then i wouldn't have a need to make backups, but there just asking people to hack this shit.

Re:But will it be as successful as vhs macrovision (1)

flink (18449) | more than 13 years ago | (#383870)

Many DVD players do not have passthroughs.

Re:Huh? (2)

SnowDog_2112 (23900) | more than 13 years ago | (#383871)

I didn't say the huge loss of income was today, or even tomorrow. But it's coming.

And even if it isn't, it's potential loss of revenue. Folks have more disposable income than ever (well, maybe not so much now as 8 months ago, but ...) and so maybe they think we actually _would_ spend more than we are, even though we're spending more than we used to.

Re:D2A2D (2)

Squid (3420) | more than 13 years ago | (#383884)

but this isn't really targeting the tech-heads, they are going after the casual user with this, and it might just work for that.

I imagine there's a lot of casual users who basically use their iMac or cheap Circuit City consumer PC as a glorified CD player. But then, they have to make the connection between the copy protection and the fact that they can't even play it legally.

Re:multiple copies of the same cd (2)

Enry (630) | more than 13 years ago | (#383887)

I own close to 300 CDs. When I go on a plane, or take a drive, I don't want to lug all 300 CDs with me. I shouldn't have to. This is why I bought a Nomad Jukebox - so I can take that small device with me and listen to all of my legally purchased music whereever I am.

Re:Moderation (1)

demon (1039) | more than 13 years ago | (#383889)

DeCSS was the name for the code that broke CSS (Content Scrambling System) - the encryption/authentication system for DVDs.
_____

MP3 (2)

nightfire-unique (253895) | more than 13 years ago | (#383891)

It's a shame, but the industry is forcing me to "steal" their music.

I need music. I want to consume music under the terms granted in copyright law. If the big boys can't follow these terms, then I don't have any choice other than to "steal" the music by downloading MP3 versions of songs I like, with no money going to copyright holders or artists.

I wish there was another way. But, alas, it looks like "theft" may be my only option.

--
All men are great
before declaring war

Re:Just what is "Fair Use"? (2)

jfk3 (215200) | more than 13 years ago | (#383893)

IANAL... But last I checked The Audio Home Recording Act of 1992 (U.S.A) gives us the right to make copies of our music. See: http://www.hrrc.org/html/ahra.html for more info.

Right: Doesn't matter. (2)

powerlord (28156) | more than 13 years ago | (#383894)

It doesn't matter that the copy protection is worthless.

Thanks to the equally worthless DMCA (a most agregeous piece of tripe, and a good example of why all officials in office when it passed should be ousted, since they refused to do a roll-call vote and specify who was involved), cracking the protection scheme, and possibly, distributing the crack, are now illegal (within the U.S. anyway).

What the end results of all this mean, depend on how the DeCSS trials go.

Re:But will it be as successful as vhs macrovision (1)

lynnroth (213826) | more than 13 years ago | (#383895)

I get the same thing with a Sony DVD player and a RCA VCR. Passes through fine until the record button is pushed.
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