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Iran Reverse Engineers Cobra Attack Helicopter

Soulskill posted more than 2 years ago | from the lightning-turnaround dept.

The Military 532

Hugh Pickens writes "Continuing its tradition of reverse engineering and fabricating its stockpile of 40-year old American weaponry, Iran announced that it is about to unveil its first ever domestically produced Cobra attack choppers. Nearly 50 years after the U.S. introduced the legendary Bell AH-1 Cobra, once the backbone of the U.S. Army's attack helicopter fleet, Iran's locally-grown Cobras will be armed with 'different types of home-made caliber guns, rockets and missiles,' according to Iran's semi-official Fars news agency. 'All the phases of designing and manufacturing of the chopper have been done inside the country and the helicopter enjoys some capabilities which make it preferable to Apache Choppers,' says Brigadier General Kioumars Heidari. Iranian officials stress that Iran's military and arms programs serve defensive purposes and should not be perceived as a threat to any other country, reports the FARS news release. More photos available here."

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..came on.. (5, Funny)

martiniturbide (1203660) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124491)

...came on... make it open source. !!!

Really? You came on this article? (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124501)

Some people have the weirdest fetishes.

What?! -1 Flamebait? (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124659)

The moderators apparently know no honour.
The post above is a bit inane, but it is not Flamebait,
nor does it deserves to be moderated down twice into
-1.
Shame on you, moderator.

Please mod parent UP to offst moderator abuse (0, Offtopic)

JOrgePeixoto (853808) | more than 2 years ago | (#40125159)

The moderators apparently know no honour.
The post above is a bit inane, but it is not Flamebait,
nor does it deserves to be moderated down twice into
-1.
Please mod it up to recover the guy's Karma.
Shame on you, moderator.

Stargate (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124511)

No! Haven't they watched Stargate SG-1?

It's all going to end in tears.

Re:Stargate (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124715)

not really.. it was the deathglider rebadge that ended in tears.. the X302 worked except for the hyperdrive.

Is Iran really such a threat? (-1, Offtopic)

JOrgePeixoto (853808) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124517)

I'm sorry for being slightly off topic, but this is important:

Do you know of any studies/argumentations about the likelihood of
Iran using atom bombs against Israel? There are 1,573,000 Israeli Arabs and 1,240,000 Israeli Muslims (many, but not all, of the Arabs are Muslims) - not counting the people in the Palestinian territories that are not Israel citizens.
Would Iran really kill countless innocent Muslim civilians, including women and children?
I mean, Ahmadinejad may be a buffoon, but AFAIK he is no Hitler and no Stalin.
I would like to see this debated.

I have seen news that Israel is about to perform a preemptive strike against Iran, and this is horrible. Not only because of the direct loss of life, but because it fosters anti-semitism, anti-Christianism and anti-Americanism among the Muslim population, and countless people are being killed because of this hatred.

Re:Is Iran really such a threat? (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124541)

Fuck yes, if that's what they perceived as required to gain regional dominance. If not, then probably not.

Ahmadienjad is not a buffoon, he's a puppet.

Re:Is Iran really such a threat? (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124561)

Ah-mad-dinner-jacket is a buffoon!

Re:Is Iran really such a threat? (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124575)

We could debate the situation between Israel, palestina, and Iran all we want, but we have no idea what the facts are here. Journalism isn't what it used to be, and every single story about those three are biased beyond all reconing. Not in outright lies, but in leaving out "details" and drawing lots of attention to others.

How can we give judgement if we have no idea of the conditions these people live in?

Give me facts, and I will give you arguments.

One thing we can say for sure is that Nuclear bombs (fission or fusion), will always be beyond a last resort. The backlash of using one is so tremendous, that countries rather go to war in the traditional means (tanks, generals, the occasional trumpeteer) than anything involving massive genocide.

It's the reason people are terrified of terrorists getting nuclear arms. Because they simply don't care about the backlash.

Iran is a tossup (0, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124991)

One thing we can say for sure is that Nuclear bombs (fission or fusion), will always be beyond a last resort. The backlash of using one is so tremendous, that countries rather go to war in the traditional means (tanks, generals, the occasional trumpeteer) than anything involving massive genocide.

The arabs (well, muslim arabs) are famous for having far more genocides in their history than anyone else, and if you discount the latter part of the 20th century, they're in a completely unchallenged first position (no, the number 2 position has absolutely nothing to do with Germany). And yes, they generally used knives, not atomic bombs.

Their last 3 wars on israel were all attacks as muslims, all started by these muslims (involving multiple countries simultaneously, only really common factor is the paedophile prophet's faith), not as Egyptions or Syrians, and the goal was to start another genocide in all cases.

If these people get access to nuclear bombs, a nuclear war will start in a matter of months, how can you possibly interpret their history in any other way ? Iran is a tossup. It's muslim, has a history of aggression, but not nearly as bad as that of the arabs. But frankly, do we really want tossups here ? Besides, Israel is not going to risk it, if Iran goes nuclear Israel has shown in the past that they'll make the first strike.

Re:Is Iran really such a threat? (4, Insightful)

demachina (71715) | more than 2 years ago | (#40125065)

I don't recall there being any backlash when the U.S. used nukes on Japan, they became one of Americas closest allies soon after.

The devestation at Hiroshima and Nagasaki wasn't really much different than the firebombings of Tokyo by the U.S. or Dresden by the British, excepting for radiation sickness and long term cancers, but fire bombing led to burns that were pretty much as bad. The nukes just required fewer air planes to do the damage, but they were still massively expensive to make.

Needless to say a fusion bomb on a large city would be horrific but very few nations have those. A fission bomb would certainly be worse than 9/11 if an Al Qaeda like group managed to set one off in a Western city so its obviously something to be avoided.

But the U.S., Britain and Russia have been killing large numbers of civilians since World War II with little repercussion so I think your statement "will always be beyond a last resort" is a little overly breathless.

Re:Is Iran really such a threat? (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40125103)

I suspect you did not exist when the US nuked Japan. The rest of your statement is inane drivel as well.

Re:Is Iran really such a threat? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124577)

"but AFAIK he is no Hitler" ?? WHAT this guy is soooo much like Hitler, where the hell you been living the past 10 years!

Re:Is Iran really such a threat? (3, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40125009)

That's something many people don't know about. The one place where Nazism, and it's blend of socialism and ethnic genocide is popular, is the middle east. The entire middle east, that is, including Turkey. It is very popular in Iran.

Please moderate parent UP to offst moderator abuse (-1, Offtopic)

JOrgePeixoto (853808) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124633)

Some moderator keeps moderating down as "Troll" everything I post
regarding politics, even though my posts are respectful and reflect
my honest political views. This has happened some 5 times.

I hope this idiot is caught by the metamoderators.

Re:Please moderate parent UP to offst moderator ab (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124797)

Some moderator keeps moderating down as "Troll" everything I post
regarding politics, even though my posts are respectful and reflect
my honest political views. This has happened some 5 times.

I hope this idiot is caught by the metamoderators.

It's because you don't have the "correct" opinion for these losers.

Mod parent UP to offset moderator abuse (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124957)

Read the parent post.
Can it possibly be construed as "Troll"?

Re:Is Iran really such a threat? (2)

Locke2005 (849178) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124657)

Ahmadinejad is a buffoon, and he's not the person running Iran.Ayatollah Khamenei is the one that could actually order a nuclear attack. Unlike Ahmadinejad, Khamenei doesn't make threats against Israel, and has publicly stated that the use of nuclear weapons is immoral. He will also still be in power long after Ahmadinejad is gone.

Re:Is Iran really such a threat? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40125043)

True, just like there's plenty of palestinian law against terrorism ...

http://dailycaller.com/2012/05/14/iranian-defectors-khamenei-said-anti-nuke-fatwa-wont-matter/ [dailycaller.com]

If you want to know whether or not muslims would really do this, why not read a story from the quran :

http://www.answering-islam.org/Authors/Arlandson/jews.htm [answering-islam.org]

Re:Is Iran really such a threat? (2)

RodBee (2607323) | more than 2 years ago | (#40125131)

Ever read about this guy on the bible named Samson?

Based on him, I can assume every Christian country is a super strong whoremonger terrorist.

Yeah, Troll, generalizations are bad for everyone.

Re:Is Iran really such a threat? (1)

Veritatis_splendor (2648359) | more than 2 years ago | (#40125045)

Ahmadinejad is a buffoon, and he's not the person running Iran.Ayatollah Khamenei is the one that could actually order a nuclear attack. Unlike Ahmadinejad, Khamenei doesn't make threats against Israel, and has publicly stated that the use of nuclear weapons is immoral. He will also still be in power long after Ahmadinejad is gone.

Um, that eases me.
The prospect of another war in the Middle East scares the shit out of me. As the GP said, this fosters hatred, which makes Jews/Christians/Americans be murdered all over the world.

In fact, those assassinations of Iranian nuclear scientists (which many people assume to be carried by the Mossad) may be a bad idea.

Re:Is Iran really such a threat? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124723)

Do you know of any studies/argumentations about the likelihood of
Iran using atom bombs against Israel?

You mean besides their stated intention to?

Re:Is Iran really such a threat? (2)

blackpaw (240313) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124917)

You mean despite the fact they have *never* said that, in fact quite the reverse - that the use of nuclear weapons is immoral and against the tenets of Isal?

But don't let mere facts get in the way of your knee jerk predjudices.

Re:Is Iran really such a threat? (5, Informative)

phantomfive (622387) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124753)

Would Iran really kill countless innocent Muslim civilians, including women and children?

Yes. You may not be aware of the brutal suppression of the Green Movement. [wikipedia.org]

Any regime that suppresses free speech is an oppressive government.

Iran is muslim (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40125093)

Iran sent their own children into minefields, walking slowly through them to clear a path by getting hit by mines, until the mines were exhausted. But no worries ! They gave them small little plastic keys, that the government claimed would take them to heaven "if" they died. They sent all the orphans they had. Why ? Because that's what muslim law says, orphans become slaves of the caliph, which Iran takes to mean they owe their lives to the government.

The keys called attention to the fact that, according to the highest authority of shi'a islam "to kill and be killed for allah is the purest part of islam".

http://www.themodernreligion.com/ugly/unholy.html [themodernreligion.com]

Islam is a barbaric, monstrous religion, and it's the real threat.

Re:Iran is muslim (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40125187)

Islam is a barbaric, monstrous religion, and it's the real threat.

Fundamentalist Christianity is no spring chicken either.

Re:Is Iran really such a threat? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124757)

"There are 1,573,000 Israeli Arabs and 1,240,000 Israeli Muslims (many, but not all, of the Arabs are Muslims) "

I think I remember the answer to this one - the winner is 71077345

Re:Is Iran really such a threat? (1)

0123456 (636235) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124785)

Do you know of any studies/argumentations about the likelihood of Iran using atom bombs against Israel?

About as likely as Britain launching a first strike against the USSR during the Cold War?

Re:Is Iran really such a threat? (1, Informative)

jvillain (546827) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124843)

This article over at Foreign Policy is a good read to see how much of a threat Iran really is. And why every one if focused on the wrong threat.Story [foreignpolicy.com]

Re:Is Iran really such a threat? (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124817)

Would Iran really kill countless innocent Muslim civilians, including women and children?

Of course they would (and they have on a smaller scale). If a Muslim dies as part of an attack on Israel they are martyred and get guaranteed entry into paradise. So there is little downside from a theocratical perspective. Plus the Palestinians are probably Sunni, the Iranians are Shiite. There is no shortage of sectarian violence between Sunnis and Shiites, apparently each has little problem with killing the other. Each side believes the other to be heretics to some degree.

Re:Is Iran really such a threat? (0)

RodBee (2607323) | more than 2 years ago | (#40125147)

Mr. Limbaugh, is that you?

Re:Is Iran really such a threat? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124941)

First of all, Ahmadinejad comes from a Jewish background (see http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/iran/6256173/Mahmoud-Ahmadinejad-revealed-to-have-Jewish-past.html), and his anti-Israel rhetoric may have to do with Iranian politics more so than any real desire to destroy Israel.

Second of all, there are about 25,000 Jewish people in Iran, so Israel would need to be really careful in how they strike if they really do attack Iran.

Re:Is Iran really such a threat? (3, Insightful)

PopeRatzo (965947) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124959)

I would like to see this debated.

No, I don't really believe you would.

I think you'd like to see everyone agree with you that Iran would not kill "countless innocent Muslim civilians" and that we should somehow take comfort in the fact that Ahmadinejad "is no Hitler and no Stalin". I'm sure that late neighboring buffoon, Saddam Hussein, was "no Hitler and no Stalin" but he had no compunctions about killing "countless innocent Muslim civilians". In fact, just about every time I look at the news I see muslims killing "countless innocent Muslim civilians", and more often than not, it's thanks to some "buffoon" who's "no Hitler and no Stalin". So pardon me if your assurances about Ahmadinejad do not really convince.

I have seen news that Israel is about to perform a preemptive strike against Iran, and this is horrible.

We have seen this news since about 2002. Every six months or so, a parade of neoconservatives who have failed at foreign policy (Ledeen, Wolfowitz, Bolton, Podhoretz, etc) shows up at the right-wing talk shows with breaking news that Israel is going to launch a strike against Iran "within 60 days". No joke, this is as regular as Autumn follows Summer. If you tune into any of the Salem Radio talkers, Hugh Hewitt, Dennis Prager, Michael Medved, you will hear these predictions at least once a week. The funny thing is that not one of them has ever mentioned their own long string of failed predictions.

I don't know if Israel is going to launch a strike on Iran, and I don't know if Israel wants to launch a strike on Iran, but I know for sure that Israel doesn't want to launch a strike anywhere near as badly as this string of former foreign policy advisers to Republican administrations. And this act has been going on since at least the 1970s.

Oh, and the good news? Mitt Romney has already stated that he's going to hire all these same psychopaths to advise his administration on foreign policy. He's putting the pro-war band back together, and this time with an extra helping of St John's Revelations, LDS-style.

Re:Is Iran really such a threat? (3, Interesting)

bmo (77928) | more than 2 years ago | (#40125195)

Oh, and the good news? Mitt Romney has already stated that he's going to hire all these same psychopaths to advise his administration on foreign policy. He's putting the pro-war band back together, and this time with an extra helping of St John's Revelations, LDS-style.

He's already started it. The entire board of the Foreign Policy Initiative all except for William Kristol himself are part of his foreign policy team.

And the only reason why WK isn't on the team is that it would be too obvious.

There is *nobody* in the Press talking about it. The silence and tacit approval from the Fourth Estate is fucking disgusting.

You know what I see? I see rampant electoral fraud this November geared to get Romney elected and we're all just fucked. The fix is in. The fix was in two years ago. The loony-tunes unelectable candidates were picked by the GOP leadership to ensure that Romney, their patsy, would get the nomination. There is no other logical explanation for the disgusting crew of unlikeable and shit-for-brains candidates like Crazy Bitch, Mr. Hairpiece, Pizza Guy, etc.

Yeah, I know, tighten the tinfoil, bmo, but the more you watch what's going on, the more it seems like tinfoil is required.

And so we head toward Permanent War.

--
BMO

Re:Is Iran really such a threat? (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40125177)

A better question: Israel has hundreds of Nukes. Would Iran want a single nuke on Tehran? They would loose 15 million Iranian.

Obviously not.

During Iran-Iraq war, Iraq used chemical weapons against Iranian army and civilian. Iran never retaliated with chemical weapons stating that chemical weapons are inhumane. Iran still has thousands of people suffering from the effects of those weapons (incidentally provided by western countries).

Mass Production? (2)

dark12222000 (1076451) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124519)

I'm curious what their ability is as far as mass production. I'm also curious why they are producing a 40 year old variant instead of targeting a newer one - I suppose it's a lower barrier to entry and probably a lot easier to get pieces for...

I find it interesting that they didn't release any specific armament specs. This may suggest they don't have any arms plants with sufficient production.

Re:Mass Production? (5, Insightful)

ThePeices (635180) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124585)

I'm also curious why they are producing a 40 year old variant instead of targeting a newer one -

Its a wee bit difficult to reverse engineer a helicopter that you dont own.

Re:Mass Production? (0)

dark12222000 (1076451) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124905)

I'm sure there's at least a few helicopter bodies out there that are more modern then a cobra. They may not be as complete, and they may be harder to put together, but I am almost positive they exist.

Also realize that a lot of helicopter models tend to be "descended" from earlier ones. You don't need an entire new copter if you have most of one of it's predecessors.

Re:Mass Production? (4, Informative)

couchslug (175151) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124971)

They are great helicopters, and their size and simplicity are reasons the US Marine Corps still use both UH-1 and AH-1 variants.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bell_AH-1_Cobra [wikipedia.org]

SuperCobra are up to a Z variant.

Re:Mass Production? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40125089)

That's probably part of it, but the USMC often times uses old equipment because that's what they can afford. Hence why there was so much WWII equipment in use during Vietnam.

this is why it is stupid to spend on military R&am (1)

Dan667 (564390) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124525)

everyone will just copy whatever is developed.

Re:this is why it is stupid to spend on military R (3, Insightful)

couchslug (175151) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124985)

Decades later....doh....

Re:this is why it is stupid to spend on military R (1)

OeLeWaPpErKe (412765) | more than 2 years ago | (#40125105)

Yes, but they'll only do so 40 years later ... at which point, what's the problem exactly ?

lulz (3, Insightful)

girlintraining (1395911) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124527)

, Iran's locally-grown Cobras will be armed with 'different types of home-made caliber guns, rockets and missiles,' according to Iran's semi-official Fars news agency. 'All the phases of designing and manufacturing of the chopper have been done inside the country and the helicopter enjoys some capabilities which make it preferable to Apache Choppers,' says Brigadier General Kioumars Heidari. Iranian officials stress that Iran's military and arms programs serve defensive purposes and should not be perceived as a threat to any other country,

So, basically, you're copying 40 year old tech from your enemies, but because you can't buy the bullets or missiles to shoot, you're going to arm them with whatever you can cobble together. It's like Junkyard Wars, only with dictators instead of teams. Yeah... I can see why they say we shouldn't perceive it as a threat... but it's not because they're dangerous or anything. They'll probably kill more of their pilots in training flights than we would with a bombing run or twenty.

Re:lulz (4, Insightful)

aurispector (530273) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124671)

They aren't really a military threat to anyone, at least not as a conventional military. It's doubtful they could produce reliable engines for this helicopter - even the chinese seem to have trouble with this.

Who knows what they'll do when they finally make a nuke, but that's another issue.

The main threat is their export of radical islamic revolution. This is a sideshow. Heck it might just be a dog and pony show and all they did was refurb an existing one.

Re:lulz (0)

moogied (1175879) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124845)

Actually a general was ordered to try and attack a us navy force as part of a war game. The general was suppose to be 'iran'. He blew up almost all of the navy force before they even knew what was up. He was later discharged for it. He utilized speed boats and a shit ton of home made explosives.

Re:lulz (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40125019)

Training games are meant to train forces. The officer in question basically went off-script in order to prove a point, which wasn't the concern of the exercise.

Basically, he was an ass, and he continued being an ass until he was shown the door.

But, enjoy that particular net-legend all you wish.

Re:lulz (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40125193)

Training games are meant to train forces ...

Which seems quite incompatible with the heavily scripted based stuff in your very next sentence.

The officer in question basically went off-script in order to prove a point, which wasn't the concern of the exercise. Basically, he was an ass, and he continued being an ass until he was shown the door. But, enjoy that particular net-legend all you wish.

No, he went off script because he was a Marine and believed in hard, realistic and practical training. He was averse to seeing young troops die because someone at the pentagon wanted a paper exercise. You want a heavily scripted exercise run a computer simulation. You want to actually train troops you let them have the freedom to act, get things wrong and learn from it.

There is a reason the Marine Corp has a capability exceeding what one would normally expect for a force their size. Hard, realistic and practical training has a lot to do with it.

Re:lulz (2)

phantomfive (622387) | more than 2 years ago | (#40125051)

If you don't think the military is prepared for Iran utilizing speed boats and home made explosives, you're wrong. That's all any public article talks about when comparing the US and Iranian militaries.

Re:lulz (-1, Troll)

jvillain (546827) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124883)

Iran's ground forces are some of the strongest in the region and they have considerable missile arsenal. They are far stronger than Iraq or Afghanistan both of which just defeated NATO. People can make fun of Iran all they want but the top priority in the US and the EU even before the economy is the threat that Iran supposedly poses an existential threat against a country with between 100 and 200 nuclear weapons. So mock all you want.

Re:lulz (1)

OeLeWaPpErKe (412765) | more than 2 years ago | (#40125127)

In all honesty defeating nato is like defeating the french when they're not even trying.

Re:lulz (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40125189)

when whose not trying? The Iranians or the French?

Re:lulz (1)

inhuman_4 (1294516) | more than 2 years ago | (#40125175)

Iraq or Afghanistan both of which just defeated NATO

You cannot honestly think this is true.

In Iraq NATO got the regime changed, put in place a democracy, built up the military to defend the fledgeling regime from terrorists (sponsored from neighboring countries) and then left. There new regime is still shaky, but not really in danger of falling a part despite the Americans leaving Baghdad almost a year ago.

In Afghanistan the Taliban have been pushed into Pakistan, hence all the drone strikes in Pakistan. So while they have not given up, that is mainly because they are hiding out in another country. Almost all of their "fighting" is roadside and truck bombs. They have not fielded a major force in years.

The only hope any of these places had of "winning" is if the Americans decide to go home before the new government was in place. This didn't happen in Iraq, and unless the drone strikes in Pakistan stop working, it probably won't happen in Afghanistan.

Re:lulz (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124901)

Who knows what they'll do when they finally make a nuke

Probably use some variant of the delivery system the US planned on in 1941. A barge floated into an enemy harbor.

Re:lulz (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124965)

The main threat is their export of radical islamic revolution.

Yes, it's very important the current dictators in the Gulf states aren't replaced by one's who will nationalize the oil production.

Re:lulz (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124887)

... but because you can't buy the bullets or missiles to shoot, you're going to arm them with whatever you can cobble together. It's like Junkyard Wars ...

Doubtful. They can't by guns and ammo from the people they originally bought the Cobra from but there is no shortage of other nations who are perfectly happy to sell them guns and ammo. The homemade stuff has probably gotten exaggerated as translated from one language to another. I'd wager standard Soviet designs for guns and ammo. The guns are probably imported but local manufacture of such a design is feasible. Or maybe they just tossed home-made in there to make the threat of sanctions seem less effective.

Re:lulz (4, Interesting)

gman003 (1693318) | more than 2 years ago | (#40125013)

So, basically, you're copying 40 year old tech from your enemies, but because you can't buy the bullets or missiles to shoot, you're going to arm them with whatever you can cobble together.

You say that like they'll be building guns out of steel pipe and ball bearings. But the truth is, making guns in a new caliber and making ammunition to match is easy enough that some hobbyists do it in their garage.

There are, apparently (I Am Not A Military Expert), valid military reasons to make your guns and ammunition incompatible with the enemy's. America and the rest of NATO were the first to use 5mm-caliber small arms - the M16, FAMAS, L86, etc. are all chambered for a standard 5.56mm round, and I believe most even have compatible magazines.

The USSR and the rest of the Warsaw Pact could have used the same, but that would mean that, in a war, any ammunition supplies the enemy captured would be usable to them. While that would also mean that any ammunition supplies they captured could be used by them, they decided not to take that risk, and instead created an essentially-the-same-but-incompatible 5.45mm round. The Chinese, likewise, eventually created their own version, this one in 5.8mm. While none of their ammunition can be used in anothers' weapons, they have essentially the same performance characteristics.

Iran is simply doing the same thing. Instead of using NATO-standard 7.62mm miniguns, 20mm autocannons, 40mm grenade launchers or 2.75" rockets, they'll use ones that are just slightly incompatible, but nearly identical in performance.

From a theoretical standpoint, there's two reasons for doing so. One reason is economics - trying to stimulate their own arms industry, rather than import from others. If you mandate the use of incompatible ammunition and weapons, foreign production becomes useless, while the domestic industry gets nearly-guaranteed profitability.

Another could be that they are more concerned about being invaded, rather than invading others. You are, after all, more likely to be the one capturing supplies, rather than having your supplies captured, when you are on the attack. History would seem to bear this view out - during the Cold War, neither side used intercompatible ammunition, and as it turns out, neither side much wanted to invade the other. The most notable case of cross-compatible weaponry was in WW2, when the British designed the Sten gun to use the same ammunition as the German MP40. And guess what (spoiler alert)? Britain later invaded Germany!

OK, that's probably a massive simplification of things (remember, IANAME), but still, look at things from Iran's view for a second. The US, a country they have *very* poor relations with, just invaded two countries next to them and occupied them for years. And now it almost seems like they are, once again, manufacturing evidence of WMDs and putting out agitprop to get the citizens ready, once again, to invade some Middle-Eastern country. Even if they actually *are* guilty of trying to build nukes (honestly, I wouldn't be that surprised if they were), can you blame them for worrying that the 1st Armored is going to be driving towards Tehran sometime soon, and planning to defend themselves?

Unleash the lawyers (5, Funny)

oldhack (1037484) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124531)

Blast them with patent infringement suits. The mullas are screwed now.

Scrap Yard Blowout - This spring only!!! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124543)

This smells of a scapyard buy to me, they bought a ton of boneyard cobra chasis and engines and re-armed them. Big deal, Move along...

Next they'll off-shore them (4, Interesting)

porsche911 (64841) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124545)

I can see them off-shoring production to China and getting 100's a month. Their big problem is going to be training pilots fast enough.

As far as the "age" - it was a good design then and is still a good design. Upgrade the weapons to something more modern and they are going to be very dangerous on a battlefield.

the big problem is going to be getting new pilots (1)

swschrad (312009) | more than 2 years ago | (#40125021)

because all the trained ones go down thud. God/Allah/yo'momma forbid they ever try and fire any of that backyard armament. gas pipe ain't good gun barrels. and I'm not going to say why ;)

GO GET 'EM MOSHE !! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124551)

Tear up some rug, pesian rug !!

A Turkey Shoot Approaches (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124559)

Wait until they get a taste of our theatre-wide laser weapons. We could blind and crash their entire fleet in a few seconds from across the Gulf.

Re:A Turkey Shoot Approaches (1)

ThePeices (635180) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124615)

Wait until they get a taste of our theatre-wide laser weapons. We could blind and crash their entire fleet in a few seconds from across the Gulf.

yeah! sock it to 'em! hit them with weapons that dont exist yet!

Also, why stick to theatre-wide laser weapons ( that dont exist), we could also use antimatter weapons (that dont exist yet) on them too.

Hooray for the USA!

Re:A Turkey Shoot Approaches (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124811)

Lets not forget some photon torpedoes (definitely don't exist) if we are going to imagine shit up.

English writing? (1)

DAldredge (2353) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124601)

On the red plate in this http://www.jamejamonline.ir/Media/images/1389/02/11/X00873991516.jpg [jamejamonline.ir] picture is that writing in English?

Re:English writing? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124639)

I'm pretty sure the last word is "flight".

Re:English writing? (2)

jonnythan (79727) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124665)

Yeah, and so is the "Rescue" label and some other printing on the side of the cockpit. The plate says something like " TOP IMPORTANT REMOVE BEFORE OPERATIONAL FLIGHT."

Why would they do that?

Re:English writing? (1)

drinkypoo (153816) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124729)

Maybe they got those parts as surplus and just used them :)

Is Iran really such a threat? (-1, Offtopic)

JOrgePeixoto (853808) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124613)

I'm sorry for being slightly off topic, but this is important:

Do you know of any studies/argumentations about the likelihood of
Iran using atom bombs against Israel? There are 1,573,000 Israeli Arabs and 1,240,000 Israeli Muslims (many, but not all, of the Arabs are Muslims) - not counting the people in the Palestinian territories that are not Israel citizens.
Would Iran really kill countless innocent Muslim civilians, including women and children?
I mean, Ahmadinejad may be a buffoon, but AFAIK he is no Hitler and no Stalin.
I would like to see this debated.

I have seen news that Israel is about to perform a preemptive strike against Iran, and this is horrible. Not only because of the direct loss of life, but because it fosters anti-semitism, anti-Christianism and anti-Americanism among the Muslim population, and countless people are being killed because of this hatred.

(Posting again because some dishonest a**hole moderated me down - see http://tech.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2876637&cid=40124517 [slashdot.org] )

Re:Is Iran really such a threat? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124807)

you were moderated down because YOU are the asshole.

Re:Is Iran really such a threat? (-1, Flamebait)

Veritatis_splendor (2648359) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124927)

How exactly has the GP infringed Slashdot's guidelines?

Scrap Yard Blowout!! Sunday! Sunday! Sunday!! (1)

CaptnCrud (938493) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124647)

Meh, I think they bought some boneyard cobra chasis and engines, then re-armed them. Move along, Move along...Why build new when you can buy cheap!

It's just a glorified Huey (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124649)

Seriously, the AH-1 Cobra was based on the UH-1 Huey. It's a fifty year old airframe and one of the most common helicopters in the world and has been so for decades. It's a good bird but seriously, it's like they figured out turn an old ford cargo van into an APC.

What advances have we made? (1)

bigsexyjoe (581721) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124683)

Have we made any advances in helicopter technology that is beyond Iran's reach? I understand the purpose of this article is to mock Iran, but what if they start copying nuclear weapons from that era? And how long will it take them to build equivalents to our modern helicopters?

Re:What advances have we made? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124713)

Considering we poses stealth helicopters, yes... yes we have. Also attack helicopters are only useful against certain kinds of targets, and drones are not one of those targets. So Iran having this type of hardware is not really a concern, unless we invade them with a land army before we establish total air superiority... which is unlikely.

Re:What advances have we made? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124951)

On the other hand the US Marine Corp still uses the Cobra. Heavily upgraded from the older models but its still not at the Apache or Comanche level. Which is not necessarily a bad thing, less maintenance per flight hour. Greater reliability.

That said, the new Iranian birds will be nothing like the current Marine birds.

Re:What advances have we made? (1)

CaptnCrud (938493) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124791)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manhattan_Project [wikipedia.org] About 23 billion dollars I would say is what keeps them from developing there own tactical nuke.

Re:What advances have we made? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124823)

No, nothing, nothing at all. No helicopter technology. No nuclear improvements either.

In fact, we can barely put a nail in a board.

Re:What advances have we made? (1)

CaptnCrud (938493) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124853)

Thats right you dont, you typically use mud bricks.and mortor. : p

Re:What advances have we made? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40125169)

Mud bricks in a mortor? Ok...

The additional photos are from 2010(!) (4, Informative)

datorum (1280144) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124707)

I just figured out that the "more photos" link actually points to a forum thread from 2010.

Re:The additional photos are from 2010(!) (2)

Lancer (32120) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124769)

Not only are the "more photos" two years old, they're pictures of upgraded American Cobras that were sold to Iran before the 1979 coup.

Re:The additional photos are from 2010(!) (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124967)

Ay, mate, and man thee swashplate before ye pull collective in me ayatolla assahola.

Turnaround Time (0)

SniperJoe (1984152) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124711)

Given Iran's apparent 40 year turnaround time between gaining possession of a piece of military technology and producing reverse-engineered copies, I suppose I should start preparing for Iran's version of the RQ-170 Sentinel drone around 2041.

Re:Turnaround Time (1)

the eric conspiracy (20178) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124747)

Are you sure it wasn't Photoshop that got reverse engineered?

the future (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124789)

I'm pretty sure the muslims have a secret society, We have our own controlling everything. They want peace, but ours want control. They want defense, we like offense. Wars will continue to rage until everyone reaches and grasps democracy and capitalism. Irans next on the hit list, and it will make the NWO, terrorism and things that intrude our lives much more prominent over the coming years. Without these secret societys we could have peace on earth. With them there will never be peace, and our ability to govern our world through real democracy will cease to exist.

Cispa, and all the other laws aren't making it so its available to federal law enforcement agencys; they already have the technology. Simply its bringing it down to the local level, where your neighbor hood cop can look up and see that you purchased a fleshlight two years earlier. It's a scary situation and terrorism and the threat of terrorism will just further their cause. Secret societys like evil in the world because it helps their goals of furthering survillencing of every living soul on this planet.

Terrorism is helping the secret societys, and they are the one portraying it as a daily occurance, they are most likely funding both sides of the conflict.

Call me a conspirator, but if you look over everything thats been going on in the government, whether 9/11 was done by terrorists or the government, you'll notice that a police state is arriving, secretly its already here, but openly its not.

Actually this isn't a joke (4, Interesting)

Grayhand (2610049) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124793)

If you want to bring them to their knees accidentally loose some F-22s over Iran. If they tried to reverse engineer then deploy them it'd bankrupt the country. Even better yet would be a 30 year old Osprey prototype. The point is we're the only country that spends enough on their military to maintain such cutting edge aircraft. They can mimic 40 year old aircraft but the modern ones are too expensive to build and are drastically more expensive to maintain. It's not just that all they have access to is 40 year old aircraft it's that they were far more practical than modern aircraft. Look at the A-10s they are phasing out. They were wildly successful and the basic technology wasn't all that different than was used in the 50s. The joke is the technology has both gotten so good and so delicate as in the breakdown rate that far more planes are lost due to mechanical failure than enemy gunfire.

Re:Actually this isn't a joke (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40125033)

Are they actually phasing out the A-10s? I've heard this a few times since the early 90s, but so far they haven't been able to find anything that is as robust that can fill its combat role.

Re:Actually this isn't a joke (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40125111)

May be the F35 could do a better job of screwing with their budget. Now if the insurance company would pay for the missing planes...

Trust no one (5, Funny)

Quiet_Desperation (858215) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124857)

In related news, Adobe announced that the Iranian government has purchased several licenses of Photoshop CS6.

Where's Ahmadinejad flying? (1)

damn_registrars (1103043) | more than 2 years ago | (#40124981)

They often seem to portray President Ahmadenijad as one of the world's greatest geniuses. I expect to see a patriotic picture of him flying one of these.

Cobra (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40124997)

There are many aircraft in the US Fleet that are decades old in core design I think most of you are missing the point, Iran has a good relationship with Russia and can fit any new aircraft with modern surveillance and weapons

Saudi Arabia are more active much more then Iran on a Global scale supporting Islamic Jihad, Iran operates more on its back door, the US most impotent friend and Partner in the Middle East is the Islamic funding Terrorist Monarchy called the Saudi Loyal Family whos next emphasis is in the Balkans remember the Balkans and Clintons support of Islamic scum and their establishment in that region

Everything comes full circle it always does

Awesomness (0)

bryan1945 (301828) | more than 2 years ago | (#40125037)

"We have used the finest bubblegum, paper maiche, and Legos to build a custom attack helicopter that has abilities that the Apache could never achieve. It's mostly how fast it shakes apart, but that is a mere engineering problem to be solved when our latest shipment of Bazooka Joe gum arrives! Halla malla hoobooey!"
Next they'll strap some jets to a camel and call it a stealth fighter.

Iran is the new China (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40125095)

80% of the benefit is achieved at 20% of the effort. That ratio is improved by stealing IP in manufacturing, historical operational experience, and hindsight.

In the unlikely event they are ever in a military conflict they will be disposed of quickly so Iran can move on to the next one. Maybe they will export to Russia, North Korea and Cuba. :D

JJ

Did you examine the cockpit.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40125097)

Wow! Those instruments are increadibly old mechanical indicators. I think the only special advantage they will have is in posing as a sitting duck!

Those aircraft have one flaw (3, Funny)

axlr8or (889713) | more than 2 years ago | (#40125121)

To fire the weapons, you must think in American

Why Iran REALLY wants a nuke : (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40125123)

Having a nuke is the ONLY way to make sure your country is
not taken over by the US.

That's why N. Korea, Iran, and any other country which doesn't want to
end up being a puppet of the US wants nukes.

The US acts like it is waging a war on terror, but the sad truth is that much of the
terrorism has been done in response to things the US has done. This is something
that is well known within the Pentagon and in the White House. All that "war on terror"
propaganda is put out for the consumption of the idiots in the US who will provide
their bodies or the bodies of their children for use by the US military.

If you do not believe what I have written, you need to educate yourself.

It must be so embarassing... (0)

msobkow (48369) | more than 2 years ago | (#40125181)

It must be so embarrassing for the Iranian government to be in a dick-waving contest with the US and the world when the best they can show is a tiny example of 50 year old technology. The fact that they'd even think to brag about it shows how much their internal media must be censored, or how stupid they think their people are for them to be impressed by this "accomplishment."

What happened to their threats to reverse engineer the drone that crashed^H^H^H^H^H^H^H they captured. Can we expect to see that in 2061?

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