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78 comments

Defeated. (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40132935)

About eight months ago, I was searching around the internet to find out why my computer was running so slowly (it normally ran quite fast, but had gradually gotten slower over time). After a few minutes, I found a piece of software claiming that it could speed up my PC and make it run like new again. Being that I was dangerously ignorant about technology in general (even more so than I am now), I downloaded the software and began the installation. Mere moments after doing so, my desktop background image was changed and warnings that appeared to originate from Windows appeared all over the screen telling me to buy strange software from an unknown company in order to remove a virus it claimed I had.

I may have been ignorant about technology, but I wasn't that naive. I immediately concluded that the software I'd downloaded was, in fact, a virus. In my rage, I broke numerous objects, punched a hole in the wall, and cursed the world at the top of my lungs. I eventually calmed down, cleared my head, and realized that the only remedy for this problem was a carefully thought out plan. After a few moments of pondering about how to handle this situation, I decided that since I barely knew how to properly handle a computer, I should turn it over to the professionals and let them fix the issue.

Soon after making the decision, I drove to a local computer repair shop and entered the building with my computer in hand. They greeted me with a smile and stayed attentive the entire time that I was explaining the problem to them. They laughed as if they'd heard it all before, told me that I'm not the only one who has trouble operating computers, and then gave me a date for when the computer would be fixed. Not only had they told me that the computer would be completely repaired in at most two days, but the price for their services was surprisingly low, and to top it all off, they even gave me advice for how to avoid viruses in the future! I left the building feeling confident in my decision to seek professional help and satisfied knowing that such kind-hearted people were the ones doing the job.

The very next day, I received a phone call from the computer repair shop whilst I was at a local library researching computer viruses. I had stumbled upon a piece of software that appeared to be very promising, and I was about to do more research on it, but seeing as how I required my computer as soon as possible, I decided to put the matter on hold. Upon answering the phone and cheerfully greeting the person on the other end, I was greeted with a high-pitched shriek. Startled, I asked what was wrong. A few moments passed where nothing was said, and suddenly, the person on the other end said to me, in a low voice oozing with paranoia, "Come pick up your computer." They hung up immediately after saying that, and I couldn't help but notice that they sounded as if they were on the verge of tears. I briefly wondered if it was due to stress from work, and then drove to the computer repair shop to acquire my computer.

I was positively dismayed upon entering the building. The inside of the computer repair shop looked nothing like the image from my memories. There were broken computer parts scattered throughout the room, ceiling tiles all over the floor, blood splattered in every direction I looked, and even a human toe on the ground. After processing this disturbing information, I began panicking and frantically looking around for my computer. I spotted an employee covered in blood sitting up against the wall, and noticed that his wrists had been slashed open. Thinking quickly, I ran up to him, grabbed him by the collar of his shirt, shook him around, and began screaming, "Where is it!? Where is my computer!?" After a moment of silence, he passed away, completely shattering my expectations. "What a meaningless individual," I thought.

Enraged, I tore the building up even further than it already had been in my desperate search for my computer. Eventually I discovered a door leading to an area that was normally only accessible to employees. I entered without hesitation and was met with a long, skinny hallway that a single person would have trouble moving about freely in. I proceeded down the dark hallway and bumped into the body of an employee hanging from a rope tied to something on the ceiling. I screamed, "Not only do you people have the gall to allow my computer to be endangered, but even in death you intend to block my path!?" After finally managing to push aside the worthless obstacle, I traveled down the hallway and came to a small black door. I entered without a moment's notice, and in the middle of the dark and dreary room, I spotted my computer; it was completely unharmed. With a sigh of relief, I picked it up, left the building, and drove home as if nothing of importance had occurred there.

Upon returning home and hooking up the computer (whilst wearing a cheerful expression the entire time), I, to my horror, discovered that the computer hadn't been repaired. There was nothing in the world that could have contained my fiery anger at that point. I broke almost every single one of my possessions, smashed all the windows on my house, physically abused my family, and then drove back to the computer repair shop to defile the dead lumps of meat that had failed to carry out the task I had given them. After realizing that I shouldn't be meaninglessly wasting my time with such worthless pieces of trash, I remembered the piece of software that I'd discovered earlier. With renewed confidence, I blissfully visited the local library, downloaded the software, and took it home to install on my computer.

I knew. I knew, even before installing it, that MyCleanPC [mycleanpc.com] would be my salvation. MyCleanPC [mycleanpc.com] would come through with flying colors where no one else could. MyCleanPC [mycleanpc.com] would completely, totally, and utterly eradicate the virus in the most merciless, efficient way possible. MyCleanPC [mycleanpc.com] was not a piece of software that could fail to meet my exceedingly high expectations. MyCleanPC [mycleanpc.com] would not fail me like all the other imbeciles had. At that point, it could be said that I could genuinely see into the future and be accurate in my predictions. I gleefully began installing MyCleanPC [mycleanpc.com] and laughed like a child at the thought of finally being able to attain revenge upon the virus that had shamed me so.

I was absolutely in awe of MyCleanPC's [mycleanpc.com] wonderfully efficient performance. Without a single issue, MyCleanPC [mycleanpc.com] utterly annihilated in moments the virus that many others had failed to remove after hours of attempts. I let out a victory cry and swore to never turn to any "professionals" to fix my computer ever again. Once again, I was able to predict the future. I knew that I would never need any worthless "professionals" again as long as I had MyCleanPC [mycleanpc.com] by my side.

MyCleanPC [mycleanpc.com] is outstanding! My computer is running faster than ever! MyCleanPC [mycleanpc.com] came through with flying colors where no one else could! MyCleanPC [mycleanpc.com] totally cleaned up my system, and increased my speed! I couldn't believe how much overclocking my gigabits and speed were doing! Even restructuring the BIOS wouldn't allow for the miraculously high degrees of efficiency that MyCleanPC [mycleanpc.com] allowed me to attain.

I highly and wholeheartedly recommend that you use MyCleanPC [mycleanpc.com] if you're having any computer troubles whatsoever. In fact, even if you're not having any visible problems, I still recommend that you use MyCleanPC. [mycleanpc.com] There could be dormant or hidden viruses on your system, or problems that MyCleanPC [mycleanpc.com] could easily and efficiently resolve. Just by using MyCleanPC, [mycleanpc.com] your gigabits will be running at maximum efficiency, and at last, you'll be overclocking with the rest of us! What are you waiting for!? Get MyCleanPC [mycleanpc.com] today!

MyCleanPC: For a Cleaner, Safer PC. [mycleanpc.com]

Re:Defeated. (1)

jjjhs (2009156) | about 2 years ago | (#40133229)

Holy fuck, Slashdot keeps letting these fucking spam comments through. God damnit Slashdot, put a spam filter or something. In fact whenever I post as AC my comment may never be seen, but this shit gets through? Holy shit.

Re:Defeated. (1)

AngryDeuce (2205124) | about 2 years ago | (#40135269)

I know, right? They can filter for too many caps, but not for this constant, endless bullshit?

Any post with the text 'mycleanpc' in it should be automatically rejected and the IP address that attempts to post it blocked from posting for a 24 hour cooling off period. Most trolls have short attention spans and will quickly lose interest.

It's a really great robot (5, Funny)

NoNonAlphaCharsHere (2201864) | about 2 years ago | (#40132943)

It issues press releases that say "everything is under control, nothing to see here, move along". When pressed, it says "what radiation?".

Re:It's a really great robot (-1, Offtopic)

Rape'sGoodForTheSoul (2648973) | about 2 years ago | (#40132947)

Around a year ago, I was mindlessly surfing the internet (as I often do) when I came across an enigmatic web page. The page, which looked like a warning from my web browser, informed me that I had a virus installed on my computer and that to fix it, I should install a strange anti-virus program that I'd never heard of (which I found peculiar considering the fact that I already had anti-virus software installed on my computer). Despite having reservations about installing it, I did so anyway (since it appeared to be a legitimate warning).

I cannot even fathom what I was thinking at that time. Soon after attempting to install the so-called anti-virus software, my desktop background image changed into a large red warning sign, warnings about malware began making appearances all over the screen, and a strange program I'd never seen before began nagging me to buy a program to remove the viruses. What should have been obvious previously then became clear to me: that software was a virus. Frustrated by my own stupidity, I began tossing objects around the room and cursing at no one in particular.

After I calmed down, I reluctantly took my computer to a local PC repair shop and steeled myself for the incoming fee. When I entered, I noticed that there were four men working there, and all of them seemed incredibly nice (the shop itself was clean and stylish, too). After I described the situation to them, they gave me a big smile (as if they'd seen and heard it all before), accepted the job, and told me that the computer would be working like new again in a few days. At the time, I was confident that their words held a great degree of truth to them.

The very next day, while I was using a local library's computer and browsing the internet, I came across a website dedicated to a certain piece of software. It claimed that it could fix up my PC and make it run like new again. I knew, right then, merely from viewing a single page on the website, that it was telling the truth. I cursed myself for not discovering this excellent piece of software before I had taken my PC to the PC repair shop. "It would've saved me money. Oh, well. I'm sure they'll get the job done just fine. I can always use this software in the future to conserve money." Those were my honest thoughts at the time.

Two days later, my phone rang after I returned home from work. I immediately was able to identify the number: it was the PC repair shop's phone number. Once I answered, something strange occurred; the one on the other end of the line spoke, in a small, tormented voice, "Return. Return. Return. Return. Return." No matter what I said to him, he would not stop repeating that one word. Unsettled by this odd occurrence, I traveled to the PC repair shop to find out exactly what happened.

Upon arriving inside the building, I looked upon the shop, which was a shadow of its former self, in shock. There were countless wires all over the floor, smashed computer parts scattered in every direction I looked, fallen shelves on the ground, desks flipped over on the ground, and, to make matters even worse, there was blood splattered all over the wall. Being the reasonable, upstanding, college-educated citizen that I was, I immediately concluded that the current state of the shop was due to none other than an employee's stress from work. I looked around a bit more, spotted three bodies sitting against the wall, and in the middle of the room, I spotted my computer. "Ah. There it is." Directly next to it was the shop's owner, sitting on the ground in the fetal position.

When I questioned him, he kept repeating a single thing again and again: "Cannot be stopped! Cannot be stopped! Cannot be stopped!" I could not get him to tell me what was wrong, but after a bit of pondering, I quickly figured out precisely what happened: they were unable to fix my computer like they had promised. Disgusted by their failure, I turned to the shop's owner (who I now noticed had a gun to his head), and spat in his general direction. I then turned my back to him as if I was attempting to say that nothing behind me was worth my attention, and said to him, "Pathetic. Absolutely, positively pathetic. I asked you to do a single thing for me, and yet you failed even at that. Were I you, I'd be disgusted by myself, and I'd probably even take my own life. Such a worthless existence isn't even worthy of receiving my gaze!"

After saying that, I left the shop with my computer as if absolutely nothing had occurred there. And, indeed, there was nothing in that shop that was worthy of my attention. Still understandably disgusted by their inability to fulfill the promise, I said to myself, "I'll have to take this into my own hands." After getting into my car to drive home, I heard a gun shot from inside the repair shop. Being that it originated from the worthless owner of that shop, I promptly decided to ignore it.

Once I returned home, I, filled to the brim with confidence, immediately installed the software that I'd found a few days ago: MyCleanPC [mycleanpc.com]. The results were exactly what I expected, and yet, I was still absolutely in awe of MyCleanPC's [mycleanpc.com] wonderful performance. MyCleanPC [mycleanpc.com] removed every last virus from my computer in the span of a few seconds. I simply couldn't believe it; MyCleanPC [mycleanpc.com] accomplished in moments what "professionals" had failed to accomplish after days of work!

MyCleanPC [mycleanpc.com] is outstanding! My computer is running faster than ever! MyCleanPC [mycleanpc.com] came through with flying colours where no one else could! MyCleanPC [mycleanpc.com] totally cleaned up my system, and increased my speed!

If you're having computer troubles, I highly recommend the use of MyCleanPC [mycleanpc.com]. Don't rely on worthless "professionals" to fix up your PC! Use MyCleanPC [mycleanpc.com] if you want your PC to be overclocking, if you want your gigabits to be zippin' and zoomin', and if you want your PC to be virus-free.

Even if you aren't having any visible problems with your PC, I still wholeheartedly recommend the use of MyCleanPC [mycleanpc.com]. You could still be infected by a virus that isn't directly visible to you, and MyCleanPC [mycleanpc.com] will fix that right up. What do you have to lose? In addition to fixing any problems, MyCleanPC [mycleanpc.com] will, of course, speed up all of your gigabits until every component on your PC is overclocking like new!

MyCleanPC: For a Cleaner, Safer PC. [mycleanpc.com]

Re:It's a really great robot (2)

formfeed (703859) | about 2 years ago | (#40139031)

To be fair, they did have the robot ready already a year ago.
But it took them a year to figure out how it could retain its full mobility while being fitted with a schoolgirl uniform.

Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Worse (-1, Troll)

theodp (442580) | about 2 years ago | (#40132945)

The next Japanese nuclear accident (it's inevitable) will be even worse [cringely.com]: 'The amount of Cesium 137 in the fuel rods at Fukushima Daiichi is the equivalent of 85 Chernobyls.,,there is a 90 percent chance of a large earthquake in the minimum three years required to remove just the most unstable part of the fuel load at Fukushima Daiichi. The probability of a large earthquake in the 10+ years required to completely defuel the plant is virtually 100 percent. If a big earthquake happens before that fuel is gone there will be global environmental catastrophe with many deaths...The very logic of time and probability that scares the bejesus out of me is being completely ignored, replaced with magical thinking.'

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (2)

mug funky (910186) | about 2 years ago | (#40132993)

"global environmental catastrophe"

them's fightin' words.

gonna need a rundown of the effects this will have.

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (5, Insightful)

mug funky (910186) | about 2 years ago | (#40133019)

the linked article is quite the troll, too. peppered with terms like "it is my belief", or "probably". it's an interesting opinion, but i call shenanigans on any authority the writer claims (and he claims a lot - talking about TMI like it's at all relevant).

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (3, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40133225)

jesus. on one side we have tepco and the iaea (both of whom have enormous vested interests in maintaining the reputation of nuclear power as being 100% A++++++++ safe would buy again!!), and on the other we have people claiming that the cores are currently melting through the earth into borneo and spawning lizard people.

as of right now, all that matters if that if a major quake hits, the fuel pools could very well collapse, and the sky shine caused by fractured and burning fuel rods will make further work at the site extremely difficult (i.e. deadly). sure, you can pretend that is never going to happen and is impossible, but unfortunately it's not. spent fuel will heat itself to combustion if not continuously cooled (otherwise why would you keep it in a continuously cooled pool.. duh) and the area is extremely prone to earthquakes.

hopefully tepco can build some haphazard crane apparatus and remove the spent fuel before something bad happens, but if not.. well.. sucks to be japanese!

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (1, Insightful)

khallow (566160) | about 2 years ago | (#40134145)

as of right now, all that matters if that if a major quake hits, the fuel pools could very well collapse

We already had the largest quake that particular area is likely to see for the next few centuries and these fuel pools didn't collapse. It's one thing to claim uncertainty when we don't have evidence available one way or another. And another to claim uncertainty in the face of a solid demonstration to the contrary.

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (1)

Serious Callers Only (1022605) | about 2 years ago | (#40134209)

There is another huge earthquake well overdue on the three fault line which underlie Tokyo, not so far from Fukushima.

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (1)

khallow (566160) | about 2 years ago | (#40134263)

So what? How big is this "huge" quake? Odds are good that it'll be about the size of a large aftershock to a 9.0 magnitude earthquake.

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (1)

Ol Olsoc (1175323) | about 2 years ago | (#40137961)

Seriously khallow, are you saying that there won't be an earthquake in the area in the next few centuries?

Your logic is astounding - this means that you can build a reactor with no protection from Tsunami or earthquake because it will be decommissioned by the time the next event happens! All because they already had one.

Those predictions are only based on educated guesses, and there is no reason why they couldn't have an identical quake with similar destructive power a couple months apart.

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (1)

gullevek (174152) | about 2 years ago | (#40138735)

And can you predict for 100% that the next huge earthquake will be in the next 5, 10, 50, 100 years? Current we can only do possibility estimates, that in X years an earthquake in the strength of Y might come in the chance of Z%.

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (1)

Ol Olsoc (1175323) | about 2 years ago | (#40138885)

And can you predict for 100% that the next huge earthquake will be in the next 5, 10, 50, 100 years? Current we can only do possibility estimates, that in X years an earthquake in the strength of Y might come in the chance of Z%.

And I have seen 50 year floods that came two years apart.

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (1)

gullevek (174152) | about 2 years ago | (#40151357)

You still cannot predict it.

So anyone who tells you, it can predicted is lying.

But, that of course, that does not mean to ignore it and not build to the worst possible thing that can happen. Or ignore all scientists that tell you, you should do it ...

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (1)

khallow (566160) | about 2 years ago | (#40138757)

and there is no reason why they couldn't have an identical quake with similar destructive power a couple months apart.

Sure, there is. Where's the energy for that second quake going to come from?

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (2)

Ol Olsoc (1175323) | about 2 years ago | (#40138923)

Sure, there is. Where's the energy for that second quake going to come from?

The same place the other quake came from. Can you state with 100 percent surety that all the energy in the first quake was spent, and that it was starting again at zero.

Do you know the if the rate of movement has remained the same as prior to the last earthquake? Are all variables the same? If the predictions are for an earthquake of X magnitude every X years, is that a lock?

You are trying to play statistical games with a greater degree of confidence than the statisticians would be comfortable with.

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (0)

khallow (566160) | about 2 years ago | (#40152399)

Can you state with 100 percent surety that all the energy in the first quake was spent, and that it was starting again at zero.

Sure, that's what an earthquake is by definition. An expending of built-up potential energy.

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (1)

Ol Olsoc (1175323) | about 2 years ago | (#40195935)

Sure, that's what an earthquake is by definition. An expending of built-up potential energy.

The concept that an earthquake will release 100 percent of stored energy is not possible to predict, nor likely to happen The stored energy might not be released totally because of either the landmass being stopped before that happens, or the energy might just be transferred to another section as stress. In any event, your concept might be of interest to those who try to predict earthquakes, because if removes a whole lot of uncertainty - if it was true.

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (0)

khallow (566160) | about 2 years ago | (#40153141)

You are trying to play statistical games with a greater degree of confidence than the statisticians would be comfortable with.

Physics is not statistics. This is where your problem lies. Earthquakes dissipate energy which doesn't magically return. Further, we have a fair idea how much builds up on a particular fault. This not only tells us the rate at which earthquakes can happen, but also how much energy can build up on those faults. The Japanese quake was big enough that it used up most of the potential energy built up on that fault segment. We'll have to wait for that potential energy to build up again before we'll have another such quake.

But even if we ignore that, we still have that the fuel pools weathered the earthquake and tsunamis just fine. Another "huge" earthquake isn't good enough, it's got to be a lot stronger locally than the one that just happened. Engineering isn't statistics either.

Nor is your "it could happen" scenario. There's always a nonzero chance that sufficiently bad things happen to break whatever it is that we're looking at. What makes it useful statistics is to know the likelihood of such things. That's where those "educated guesses" come in. What makes it useful engineering is to then account for those statistics in design and accident response planning. If new information comes out, then account for that by plant refits or changes in accident response.

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (1)

Ol Olsoc (1175323) | about 2 years ago | (#40196371)

Physics is not statistics. This is where your problem lies. Earthquakes dissipate energy which doesn't magically return.

You really need to show exactly how all the energy is gone after the earthquake. Allow me to show how it might be, but is not a given.

Take potential energy. Have a rock on top of a 100 foot cliff that falls to a ledge 50 feet below, but not 100 feet below at the bottom of the cliff.

Does the rock dissipate all it's potential energy? Is there none left? If all the energy is dissipated, the rock will have nothing left to fall the last 50 feet. Obviously false.

So now let us take this concept and turn it on it's side.

If two landmasses are moving past each other at a rate of say 10 inches a year, after say 6 years, they should have moved 5 feet apart. (This is a large amount, but makes for easy calculation) But something has them locked together. At some amount of stress on the locked area, something breaks, and the landmasses move very quickly into a new position. A new state is reached, but no necessarily one in which there is no further stress on the landmasses. If you have 5 feet of movement by the main landmass, and the new state has been reached after 2 feet of movement, then it isn't likely that all the stress has been removed. Even then, is the new state one where the two landmasses will slip past each other more easily? This will mean a higher frequency of smaller earthquakes. Is it a stronger lock between the two landmasses now? This will mean a longer period between earthquake with much larger events.

Further, we have a fair idea how much builds up on a particular fault. This not only tells us the rate at which earthquakes can happen, but also how much energy can build up on those faults. The Japanese quake was big enough that it used up most of the potential energy built up on that fault segment. We'll have to wait for that potential energy to build up again before we'll have another such quake.

A fair idea at best....How much energy was dissipated? At what point will the fault fail again? And could you give me the physics that show with certainty that 100 percent of the energy that was stored was released? Are there no failure mechanism that would allow only a partial release? Is there a stress riser involved in the old or new state? Might another fault with stronger or weaker rock not exist? Would a stronger or weaker rock not exist somewhere under any circumstances?

I live on the eastern part of the country. Last summer, there was an earthquake in Virginia. Here, a couple hundred miles north of the quake, our bit of real estate moved somewhere between 6 inches and a foot. I watched the pergola on my patio become a trapezoid for a second or two. Other places nearby hardly felt anything. Point is, earthquake energy isn't some nice neat package, where X number of feet of strain are built up, and X is always released.

For an extremely loose definition of "just fine". As in exposed fuel rods are an okay situation.

Another "huge" earthquake isn't good enough, it's got to be a lot stronger locally than the one that just happened. Engineering isn't satistics either.

The earthquake wasn't the problem - the Tsunami was. And it is well noted that a lot of people there had the same opinion of statistics that you do. Worked out just fine, didn't it.

Under no circumstances was the engineering at Fukushima anywhere near acceptable. I'd done research, and there are many examples of Tsunami in Japan that were higher than the one encountered at Fukushima.

There is evidence as marked by debris that show without a shadow of a doubt that there was a good chance - to the point of near certainty - that a Tsunami would occur there that would top the seawalls, would you ignore it in the same way as they did? Probably is my guess. Sounds like statistics, eh? Let us do some historical stats of earthquakes in the area.

1896 Meiji-Sanriku earthquake is an interesting example 38.2 meter (125 ft) waves. 1933 Sanriku earthquake 28.7 metres (94 ft). TEPCO estimates that the tsunami that followed the earthquake and inundated the plant was 14 meters high which was more than twice the designed height. Bloody hell! Those earthquakes were all in the same area.

The real engineering failure was that that reactor had no business being there at all. In a Tsunami prone area, the place to build such a facility is inland, on a river side at a altitude that is above what a Tsunami would affect. Building one at sea level, with walls that are designed to stop the water is frankly stupid. But walls that were only a fraction of the height of two tsunamis that occurred in the recent past is almost beyond comprehension. Even if the plant were to survive the Tsunami with adequate walls, it is highly likely that the Tsunami would destroy the Transmission lines to the rest of the country. Fail

And one of the most amazing things that I have seen is how people come in here and argue about this stuff, trotting out deaths as the metric for safety, as if what occurred is somehow proof of just how safe nuclear generation of power is.

It's just like saying, we can make your town look like the set of some apocalyptic movie, and you'll have to evacuate some day, and you won't be able to go back for years if ever. But not many people will be killed.

And I'm pro-nuclear. There will come a day in the not too distant future, where we will have to make a choice between a standard of living like we have now, or to return to the middle ages for a while. We just don't need stupidity like the Fukushima Generating plant showing us how badly engineering can mess things up.

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40134323)

Well, unless you can find another planet for the huge earthquake it will not be larger than 9.5

source [yahoo.com]

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (2)

ewok85 (1705550) | about 2 years ago | (#40135151)

Best estimates put any earthquake centered around Tokyo at magnitude-7 - the effect felt at Fukushima would be negligible.

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (1, Offtopic)

lexsird (1208192) | about 2 years ago | (#40134719)

I am sure if whales and dolphins could talk they would say to the Japanese in a Samuel Jackson voice; "Karma mother fuckers, have some!"

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (1)

mug funky (910186) | about 2 years ago | (#40138581)

yeah, the polar opposite opinions shit me to tears.

just saying the linked article is in the "sky is falling" camp, which i grow tired of.

i also grow tired of the "nothing to see here" camp.

i'm just saying the truth is always somewhere in between. i'd much rather everything be okay, but i know it's not peachy (and TEPCO isn't really saying it is, either. they use bucketloads of saving-face-speak, but from the beginning i've been able to read between the lines without much difficulty - things are bad, but don't panic is the message).

i'm sure the Japanese of all people are aware of the risk of earthquakes. i'm sure their list of priorities makes some kind of sense. that Cringely guy is pretty much implying they don't have a clue what they're doing and that at the eleventh hour they're going to call up the Americans to please save them. this is kinda insulting - maybe in a business setting that would be the case, but we're talking much higher stakes here, and people do tend to rise to these occasions.

do i have every confidence? of course not. but i don't think we should be donning brown trousers just yet either.

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40133055)

Fat chicks: what a waste of a perfectly good vagina.

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (-1)

ArsenneLupin (766289) | about 2 years ago | (#40133175)

Fat chicks: what a waste of a perfectly good vagina.

... but do they give lasting hickeys at least?

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (1)

ewok85 (1705550) | about 2 years ago | (#40135115)

"global environmental catastrophe"

them's fightin' words.

gonna need a rundown of the effects this will have.

Simply the existence of radioactive material in the environment would be enough - it would mean large areas of land, water tables and ocean would be off limits and would put severe limits on local industries - especially farming and fishing.

The actual risk to human life or destruction of nature would probably be minimal if managed properly. Still be a massive pain in the butt.

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (3, Insightful)

hcs_$reboot (1536101) | about 2 years ago | (#40133033)

To be fair, since March 2011 there has been a lot of catastrophic articles about "what if a meltdown?" (there was a meltdown) "what if another earthquakes?" (there has been a lot of 7+ aftershocks not far from Fukushima). As of today, while the situation is bad, it stays far from the cataclysmic future that was predicted in March/April 2011.

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (5, Insightful)

Sycraft-fu (314770) | about 2 years ago | (#40133337)

I think what some people forget is that the plant was hit with the worst natural disaster, short of a meteor strike, that it could be. A 9.0 quake, which are exceedingly rare (and remember the scale is logarithmic) and a massive tsunami. Then there were a number of fuckups in the response, like not having the right kind of generator on hand. All that, and it still didn't "do a Chernobyl."

None of that is to say it is perfectly safe, but it should provide some perspective on the thing.

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (2)

drinkypoo (153816) | about 2 years ago | (#40134637)

I think what some people forget is that the plant was hit with the worst natural disaster, short of a meteor strike, that it could be.

I think what you're forgetting is that a lot of people didn't think what happened could happen. Now you're making a totally unsupported declarative statement about the same thing.

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (0)

citizenr (871508) | about 2 years ago | (#40134437)

To be fair, since March 2011 there has been a lot of catastrophic articles about "what if a meltdown?" (there was a meltdown) "what if another earthquakes?" (there has been a lot of 7+ aftershocks not far from Fukushima). As of today, while the situation is bad, it stays far from the cataclysmic future that was predicted in March/April 2011.

There has been a ton of scientific publications predicting deaths in thousands (official WHO predicted minimum 4000) in 1986 after Chernobyl. Turns out people didnt die en masse, in fact cancer levels stayed at a global average level.

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (0)

The Master Control P (655590) | about 2 years ago | (#40136657)

Cancer rates near Chernobyl did not stay at average. Cancers of the throat and especially thyroid suddenly became very common for quite a few years in the surrounding areas, as did birth problems (premature, miscarriage, defects).

And does the WHO estimate include the 50% of the liquidators who cleaned it up who are now dead? And the other 50% who are now crippled old men as they turn 45 and 50?

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (1)

citizenr (871508) | about 2 years ago | (#40138401)

Cancer rates near Chernobyl did not stay at average. Cancers of the throat and especially thyroid suddenly became very common for quite a few years in the surrounding areas, as did birth problems (premature, miscarriage, defects).

And does the WHO estimate include the 50% of the liquidators who cleaned it up who are now dead? And the other 50% who are now crippled old men as they turn 45 and 50?

WHO report is about those 170K workers, and in fact they were able to only (you can almost feel the sadness of the person writing it, sadness that people didnt die like it was predicted) account for average cancer rates (0.5% leukemia, etc).

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40150015)

I wish people like you would stop with this bulldust! I keep hearing it every time Chenobyl is mentioned. The church I used to go to (in Sydney), used to (and probably still does) take children from near Chenobyl who are suffering from cancer and gives them a nice holiday in Sydney for a few months. And there was far more than the 'global average levels' of cancer sufferers. The ones they take are usually terminal, they aren't going to live to be too old. Also, one of my mothers doctors used to practise medicine near there (she went there years after the meltdown), and she says it's a lot worse than the Government choses to admit. The doctor herself got cancer whilst there. According to her, everyone there is sick, and she attributes the main factor to the higher than normal radiation in the area which has been caused by (and still being caused by) Chenobyl. After having seen the number of cancer suffering kids that my church looks after and hearing the testimony of the patients themselves and a Doctor paractising in the area, I'd say a minimum of 4000 is way below the reality.

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40133051)

Spent nuclear fuel rods isn't the real danger. The real danger is the iron used in the steel construction of the pool. When that steel hits the ocean water of the next tsunami (which is all but guaranteed to happen in the next 20 days), it will slowly dissolve and raise the iron content of the Pacific ocean to a level above what life can survive. I'm talking a huge global catastrophy of dead fish, whales, plankton, seaweeds, etc, becuase of elevated levels of iron. All the biological material will then float to the top of the ocean where it will collect, and since fish are full of oils, it is only a matter of time before lightning or some sailer tossing his cigarette initiates a conflagration that consumes all the world's oxygen in a huge fire. 7 Billion people dead, suffocated to death, because the Japanese are negligent about their nuclear facility.

Fearmongering from idiots. Am I doing it right?

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40133211)

eh that wasn't bad, the only tragic thing here is that the spent nuclear fuel actually can catch fire and liberate contaminants years after it's been used, thanks to decay heat and its proximity to similar chunks of self-heating waste.

if there's another quake that shakes unit 3's or 4's spent fuel pools to the extent that water drains out faster than it can be replaced (very high likelihood), there will in fact be a major environmental catastrophe. that's a given based on how the reactor buildings were designed.

yeah it sucks, but that's what you get for choosing a uranium fuel cycle instead of a thorium one. gotta have that sweet plutonium for bombs after all.

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40139719)

If you are implying that thorium cycle somehow solves the problem of spent fuels, think again. [iaea.org]

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (0, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40133221)

You forgot to add that this will ALL happen by 23rd of Dec, 2012 during the rare alignment of the galactic cores and the "unknown" 4th neutrino type which were triggered by the multi-Chernobyl radiation beams emanating from Fukushima that hit the sun.. OUR SUN!! These neutrinos, when reacting with water, act like a microwave. But they ignore people and oceans and other surface water because..... 4th neutrino type only boils water in the mantle! and the polar shift. There must be a polar shift that will flip the earth by 67.257 degrees *exactly* because conservation of momentum laws shall not apply. And Africa will rise 2km!

Haven't you people seen the 2012 documentary???!!??

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (5, Funny)

Kavafy (1322911) | about 2 years ago | (#40133937)

You forgot to say that it will cause all PCs to be infected with a strange, all-powerful virus that can only be removed with MyCleanPC.

Me: Cringely is a moron (5, Informative)

Sycraft-fu (314770) | about 2 years ago | (#40133299)

The guy is a professional troll (actual name Mark Stephens). Literally, he writes stupid shit designed to inflame people. He's wrong all the time (he predicted big Y2K problems on account of Windows NT), he's a liar (claimed to have a PhD from Stanford, was in fact a TA) and so on.

Don't give his dumb ass the ad revenue from links.

Just as a simple counterpoint, his data about earthquakes is totally fucked. This was the biggest quake on record in Japan, previous winner was an 8.6 in 1707. Also, while quakes happen over there all the time, they don't all happen in the same spot. For example in 2003 there was a pretty big one in Hokkaido, an 8.3, that only caused one death. However if you look at a map you find that Hokkaido is quite a distance from Tohoku where the last quake was off of. So even if a quake happens in 10 years (like he has any idea if that will happen) there's no saying if it happens in the same place.

Guy is a moronic troll that has made a good living of it for years. Stop feeding him.

Re:Me: Cringely is a moron (5, Informative)

subreality (157447) | about 2 years ago | (#40133487)

Seconded, and further: Even if another 9.0 happened in the same place, it wouldn't magically release all the radioactive material. The scary problem was when it required huge amounts of very high pressure water to cool. At this point the reactors are in cold shutdown. The fuel might fall over and a few rods may break open. The situation might get a little worse, but no quake can release any significant percentage of the fuel at this point.

Also, Cringley's a fucking dumbass troll and should be ignored. Normally I hate taking the bait, but this issue's too easy to get people stirred up, so extra debunking is in order.

Re:Me: Cringely is a moron (2)

PingXao (153057) | about 2 years ago | (#40136617)

I'm not an alarmist claiming the reactor buildings are in imminent danger of falling over at Fukushima, but I think you're wrong about the consequences of spent fuel rods breaking open. That would be a very bad thing indeed.

Re:Me: Cringely is a moron (1)

subreality (157447) | about 2 years ago | (#40137675)

It is bad! But consider that a significant percentage of the fuel has already failed, likely a lot of it being completely melted. Breaking some more won't be a catastrophic "85 Chernobyls" release; it's just an incremental increase over what's already happened. It's also not likely to be a large increment: the catastrophic failure was not due not to the earthquake, but rather to the tsunami wiping out the generators which were critical for cooling. That's no longer a problem.

The thing to be concerned about (at least as far as earthquakes go) is whether the meltdown has left things more fragile inside. There's likely some small percentage of intact fuel that's precariously arranged and might suffer further damage in another quake, but again, that's a relatively small incremental increase, not a sudden jump of orders of magnitude.

A bit harsh? Re:Me: Cringely is a moron (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40133601)

For many, Cringely ( Mark Stephens ) is synonymous with the Tech industry in the United States. He's had a loyal following since the late 80's!

Here's his Wikipedia page:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_X._Cringely

Here's his IMDB page:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_X._Cringely

Presidential Task Force:
Given the confusion over his almost-but-not-quite-PHD etc. I decided to check up on his claim to have worked on the Presidential Commission.. wondering if he might have elaborated a bit.. but yes, there's his name ( Mark C. Stephens ) on page 166 under "Public's Right To Information Task Force" under the "Office of the Director of Technical Staff"
http://www.threemileisland.org/downloads//188.pdf

Re:Me: Cringely is a moron (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40133629)

> So even if a quake happens in 10 years there's no saying if it happens in the same place.
after a bit of research... I'm say'n.. the odds aren't minimal at all... specially considering what's at risk.

  Hell, Cringely's article even headlines a diagram from the Japanese for quake probabilities in the region!
http://www.cringely.com/2012/05/24/the-next-japanese-nuclear-accident-its-inevitable-will-be-even-worse/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+ICringely+%28I%2C+Cringely%29

Look for yourself... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_seismicity_in_Japan

Turns out the Sanriku area ( where the 2011 quake happened ) is a 'quake and tsunami hotbed. And yes they do happen in bunches.
i.e.

"In 2003, the Sanriku coast was affected again with a series of earthquakes including the 7.0 May 26, 2003 Miyagi-Oki quake, injuring 171 and causing $97.3 million in damages.[21] and a July 26, 2003 quake with 676 injured persons, and 11,341 buildings were damaged with $195.4 million in damages.[22]"

then:

"The 2005 Sanriku Japan Earthquake occurred at 6:39am" ...and many many more in Japan's history. The Sanriku area is specifically singled out as a high tsunami risk area.. remind me again why they built a nuclear power reactor there?

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40133321)

The WHO even said that nobody died or got sick as a direct cause of the disaster last year when 3 out of 6 reactors exploded.
So as long as we pretend there is nothing to be worried about, we can all live our lives happily every after.
Ignorance is bliss, especially if your government is the Japanese one....

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (1)

The Master Control P (655590) | about 2 years ago | (#40136701)

You know why they said that? Because no one has been, and no one will be, exposed to a dose of radiation that has acute effects. A total of half a dozen people working directly at the site have been exposed to an amount of radiation (200-400mSv) associated with the first detectable increase in risk for cancer.

bad assumptions made (2)

dutchwhizzman (817898) | about 2 years ago | (#40133381)

These statistics assume that the very probable big earthquakes that will hit Japan in the foreseeable future will actually damage the Fukushima site in such a way that Cesium 137 in significant quantities will become either airborne or diluted in sea water. Sure, there is a risk, especially for "minor" radiation leaks, but a catastrophe scenario in which all the 85 chernobyls worth of Cesium 137 will actually be released in the wild is extremely unlikely unless Godzilla will come to the site, eat all the Cesium and starts farting.

Re:bad assumptions made (1)

PPH (736903) | about 2 years ago | (#40135475)

Exactly. Last years quake/tsunami did little or no direct damage to the containment structure. What caused the big mess was the inundation of backup generators and subsequent loss of cooling at a running plant. The plant is now shut down and cool. So a similar seismic event will be a non issue.

A big quake might cause the rubble to settle a bit more and kick up some cesium dust. But they could throw up a lightweight tent (inflatable dome) over the sites to keep rain water out and dust in.

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (3, Funny)

TapeCutter (624760) | about 2 years ago | (#40133405)

there is a 90 percent chance of a large earthquake in the minimum three year...[snip]...magical thinking

So your saying that specific area is levelled by a major earthquake and a tsunami every 3yrs or so? Doesn't it strike you as odd that the Japs would have to rebuild every 3yrs or so with the full knowledge that they will have to do it all over again in another 3yrs? It is not remarkable that Fukushima Daiichi was built 41yrs ago, so by your calculations had already survived a dozen such events before it fell apart?

The incident was a catastrophe, with or without the nuclear reactors, there's no need for hyperbolic "what ifs" based on what are clearly dubious claims.

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40133439)

Priorities:

1. Keep the damaged reactors in cold shutdown.
2. Maintain and enhance water treatment.
3. Fix the leaks in the containments.
4. Decontaminate the site.
5. Remove fuel from spent fuel pools.

These have to be performed in order. In order to remove fuel from the spent fuel pools you will need to have people rebuild and operate the cranes to move the fuel. To do that, the site has to be decontaminated enough to allow humans to work in the reactor buildings which requires the first three priorities to be met.

One item to note: even though the former NRC Chairman at one point claimed that the spent fuel pools were dry, he was incorrect. There has been no damage to any of the fuel assemblies due to lack of cooling. All damage that has occurred (which hasn't caused any apparent significant radioactive releases) was due to debris falling into the pools.

Really, the priority still has to be on the reactors. I can understand the feeling that since a catastrophic earthquake recently devastated the site, that it can happen again. This is a gambler's fallacy. And even if it wasn't, the removal of spent fuel is not as trivial as you make it out to be. It has to cool down to the point where it doesn't exceed the rating of a dry cask. The timeline for that is typically around 10 years. So the most 'unstable' part of the fuel load (as you put it) can't be removed right now. An appropriate compensatory action would be to enhance the structural integrity of the spent fuel pools and provide additional redundant cooling capability. But again, this will require decontamination.

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (3, Insightful)

LordLimecat (1103839) | about 2 years ago | (#40133597)

And despite the things that you probably said in your TL;DR post more people die from basically any other form of energy generation than have or likely will die from either Fukushima Daiichi or Chernobyl.

Banqiao dam? Coal mine accidents? Toxic chemicals from solar panels? No, but the real problem is 2 japanese workers who were hospitalized for 1 day for mild radiation exposure and a population that might have cancer levels slightly above "margin of error" compared to control.

Hooray for perspective!

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (1)

khallow (566160) | about 2 years ago | (#40134243)

You can get a little safer than where it is now, but not much more. The pools are already designed to handle vast earthquakes and more importantly, they have shown that they can indeed handle such earthquakes. Why move the fuel rods, when they're already in a good spot?

Stop being scared stupid, and think about it.

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (1)

nojayuk (567177) | about 2 years ago | (#40135437)

They need the space in the reactor building pools to take the damaged rods and debris from reactors 1 through 3. In the case of reactor 4 the spent fuel pool is pretty much full of fuel rod assemblies, some of which were due to be transferred to the site's longer-term storage pond some time last year but without a working crane this didn't happen.

The next step in the TEPCO plan is to build a weather shield over reactor 4 similar to the one they put over reactor 1. They can then rebuild the crane system on reactor 4 and start emptying the spent fuel pond.

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (1)

citizenr (871508) | about 2 years ago | (#40134421)

'The amount of Cesium 137 in the fuel rods at Fukushima Daiichi is the equivalent of 85 Chernobyls.,,If a big earthquake happens before that fuel is gone there will be global environmental catastrophe with many deaths...

you mean 85 x 50 = ~4000 people will die?
This is LESS than deaths from vehicle accidents in Japan .. EVERY YEAR.
I dont see anyone banning cars, but OH NOES EVUL NUCULAR ENERGY lets ban it!117one

Re:Cringely: Next Japan Nuke Accident Will Be Wors (1)

hairyfeet (841228) | about 2 years ago | (#40134683)

Why did this person get labeled troll? I'm personally for nuclear power (although i think we should at the very least be reprocessing and looking at Thorium reactors) and i found the article he linked to quite interesting. One could argue if those figures are correct that Japan doesn't have time to waste when it comes to cleaning up the mess and I would argue with Japan sitting next to the ring of fire if they build any new reactors they should be smaller and easier to shut down and get out of there in case of catastrophic earthquakes, maybe something along the lines of the small pebble reactor designs.

But no matter which side you are on in the nuclear debate, and I'm of the mind there is simply no truly viable alternative with our ever growing power needs, the article he linked to is an interesting take on the probability of another major earthquake and what the damage will be if it happens. Its a good read and certainly not worthy of a troll label IMHO.

What's the robot for? (5, Insightful)

TWX (665546) | about 2 years ago | (#40132957)

I see that it can carry about 130lb. I don't see anything about mechanized welding, or drilling, or any other kind of pipe fitting or other heavy work that would be useful in a damaged machine that one is trying to stabilize. What is the real purpose of this robot? If it's to test the tech to see if they can produce it domestically instead of relying on American robots, then that's cool, but it's not exactly something earth-shattering when there have already been robots exploring the ruins and taking samples. If there's some greater purpose or more industrial use then I would like to know what that purpose is.

Re:What's the robot for? (-1, Offtopic)

Rape'sTheBestToday (2648975) | about 2 years ago | (#40132961)

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Re:What's the robot for? (1)

Beryllium Sphere(tm) (193358) | about 2 years ago | (#40133257)

The maneuverability on non-level and obstacle-covered surfaces may open more areas to inspection. That was the capability they emphasized.

Re:What's the robot for? (1, Funny)

Walterk (124748) | about 2 years ago | (#40134543)

I see that it can carry about 130lb. [..] What is the real purpose of this robot?

Carrying out the dead bodies?

Wonderful post! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40133201)

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Robots, bah (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40133235)

Go in Soviet style, using "bio robots". (that's what they called people, preferably starting with the CEO)

Remember what turned a newt into Godzilla? (2)

PolygamousRanchKid (1290638) | about 2 years ago | (#40133277)

The robot, called 'Rosemary,' is about the size of a lawn mower and has four extended treaded feet that swivel up and down to help it climb over obstacles.

But after a few hours in the Fukushima Daiichi EZ-Bake-Nuclear Oven, it will morph into this critter: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/cc/Mechagodzilla.jpg [wikimedia.org].

Call it Rosilla. Maybe a real life Roseanne Barr can battle it, while crushing paper houses, and being attacked by plastic model tanks, with fire crackers on their gun barrels?

So what do they do with the highly radioactive robot Rosemary after it crawls out of the reactor? Can they de-radioactivize it, or something like that? Or does it get buried in a concrete coffin for future generations to deal with?

The need a robot because (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40133555)

The need a robot because Japan has a serious shortage of niggers

A Japanese Robot huh? (0)

Lord_of_the_nerf (895604) | about 2 years ago | (#40134137)

Must have cost a bit to refit it so it's mouth didn't move sensuously.

Re:A Japanese Robot huh? (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40134277)

Must have cost a bit to refit it so it's mouth didn't move sensuously.

And it doesn't have enought tentacles.

great movie (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40134689)

Fukushima diaries coming to a theatre near you.

Thank you! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40134755)

Domo arigato, Mr. Roboto!

When asked for a comment... (2)

Chris Mattern (191822) | about 2 years ago | (#40137611)

...the robot replied, "Here I am, brain the size of a planet, and they're making me clean up dangerous radioactive waste."

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