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Linux TV

michael posted more than 13 years ago | from the not-as-good-a-combination-as-peanut-butter-and-chocolate dept.

Television 126

Stealth Dave writes "ZDNet has an article about a new television from Sylvania which is basically a Linux box with a 27" monitor and TV tuner (800x600 resolution, even)! It runs a Geode single-chip solution and is broadband capable. Lots of cool features, and is designed to support a hard drive as well. The ZDNet article has a surprising amount of details without being too technical to lose their broader audience." This "news story" reads a lot more like an advertisement, but take it for what it's worth.

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126 comments

No Firewire port? (1)

tf23 (27474) | more than 13 years ago | (#373085)

What is this? No firewire port? If they put USB ports on the thing, why not Firewire?

Re:Tivo Functions (1)

hmckee (10407) | more than 13 years ago | (#373087)

Maybe you should read the entire article. They go on to say that the "Ch. 1 platform also supports an internal hard disk option, presumably to add the feature of video recording and storage." It's not a guarantee for video recording support, but maybe they're not into making vaporware statements. With flash memory you'll probably be allowed to make the upgrade if it's released.

what about the screen? (2)

trb (8509) | more than 13 years ago | (#373088)

The difficulty with such a tv isn't with the software, it's with the screen.

TV screens usually have longer persistence phosphors, brighter, non-interlaced, slower refresh, and lower resolution. Computers screens have shorter persistence, dimmer, interlaced, faster refresh, and higher resolution.

That's because a computer user typically sits two feet away from the screen and a tv watcher sits twelve feet away. Computer users need to read very small text, tv watchers don't read lots of info off the screen. Using the wrong kind of screen for the job would be annoying for any one of the reasons listed above. Try to compromise at a point in between, and you end up with an image that's too dim or bright, too flickery or with trails behind moving objects, or too blurry.

The requirements for the two types of screens are very different, and each has specially designed displays. It's certainly true that it's not economical to make a CRT screen that does both of these jobs well. Are there flat LCD (or other technology) screens that do both well? Maybe some day, but not yet in the mass market price range.

rm -rf /Family Feud (4)

bahtama (252146) | more than 13 years ago | (#373089)

It seems everyone these days is going to Linux stuff like people were going to dot-coms a few years ago. I think too many companies are trying to capitalize on the increasing popularity of Linux to try and sell more products. Just because someone slaps Linux in a blender doesn't mean it will work better or that everyone will rush out to buy it.

Companies should analyze whether putting Linux in their products will actually be useful after the excitement is over. I think there are too many paper pushers out there that read an article on Linux and wet themselves, convinced that putting it in everything will be a great idea.

=-=-=-=-=

Re:Good Idea for multistandard TV (1)

dehuit (57744) | more than 13 years ago | (#373090)

I already have a PAL compliant TV. Oh, wait, now I don't have to buy a NTSC compliant TV if I enter the states. Still no solution for the NTSC vhs tapes I get all the time..

Self refering? (1)

mr (88570) | more than 13 years ago | (#373091)

If you look around at some of the embedded Linux pages out there it becomes clear that Linux is fast becoming

Errr, if you go to linux pages looking for linux info...that is what you will see.

BSD has all the benefits for the embedded world but doesn't have the FORCED 'sharing' of the GPL.

Just what I need... (2)

jwriney (16598) | more than 13 years ago | (#373092)

A television with a network connection. I can see it now.

Kiddie 1: "D00d! 1 r00t3d tH1s pH@t t3l3v1s10n!!"
Kiddie 2: "L33t! J00 0wnZ!"

I better go firm up my firewall...

--jwriney

Re:Self refering? (1)

jedidiah (1196) | more than 13 years ago | (#373093)

What exactly is the harm posed to Tivo by the need to release their Linux kernel source?

Note that they need not release anything else, including the "family jewels".

You are indulging in the sort of FUD on only worthy of a WinDOS lemming.

COOL!!!! (1)

modman (321805) | more than 13 years ago | (#373095)

FOX News just had a story about the "All your base are belong to us" web site!!!!!

We are famouse!!!!

Face it guys, This IS world domination (5)

Ded Mike (89353) | more than 13 years ago | (#373096)

....I mean, TV fer chrissakes!!!

The answer to the "why Linux?" questions typical of mainstream media was telling and amounted to "Because it was there, and we didn't have to license it!" Once the reporters begin to understand what the GPL REALLY means, the lid will be off and we will all be mainstream.

REPORTER: Why Linux?

SAVVY ENTREPRENEUR: Because we already owned it and held the license for it. So do you. So does everybody. We DID contribute to the Linux International organization, but we didn't have to. We already owned the software and system. So do you.

REPORTER: Huh???!!!

SE: (continuing) Yeah. The GPL meant that we could build on work already done by others, take that work for free, extend it and give the stuff we paid people to do back to the community/source. For free. We the spent our investors' money in making the idea consumer-friendly and affordable. Because we didn't HAVE to take on or license a partner or partners' technology, we have a better chance of survival. Our business model works BECAUSE OF THE GPL. We can be assured that, from the standpoint of the operating system and hardware drivers, at least, we don't have exposure to intellectual-property or copyright issues...There may be patent issues on the terms of the interface, or the functions of the system, but we wrote that into the business plan and are funded to either license or defend against Gemstar. We were prepared for that when we made the decision to enter the space.

REPORTER: But...but...but...you didin't pay for the software......!!!!!!!! That's STEEEEEALING!!!! (begins to swoon)

SE: No, it's not. You can't steal something you already own. More importantly, we paid people to extend the work others did and then gave that work back to the community to be further extended by those same people...That gave us another tremendous advantage. Because we set the project up on a publicly accessible project hosting platform, we can look at those people continuing to volunteer to improve the project and extend it's functionality and get to know them and perhaps hire the best of them based on work they have already done and that has proved a valuable extension and great fit for our business. It makes the problem of finding the personnel resources necessary to grow our business faster than the competition that much easier; thereby further ensuring the success of our business. We concentrate on the consumer. We made a TV behave and receive data like a computer...It's still a TV...simple to operate. Inexpensive. That's our business: to extend the TV as an appliance and add some computer functionality to it. Because we own the base platform the technology is built on, we're free to extend it or allow the community to do so while we continue to make it cheaper and easier to use. Understand?

REPORTER: BUT YOU DIDN'T PAY FOR THE SOFTWARE!!! YOU DON'T HAVE A PLATFORM PARTNER!!! HOW WILL YOU SUCCEED? WHO WILL PAY FOR YOUR SUPPERBOWL ADS?

SE: Ummmm...I think maybe you better read the first paragraph of the GPL. I think that concludes the interview. Thanks.

Questions from the audience:

1. How long befor Gemstar goes after these guys?

2. What's the next great embedded Linux platform/idea?

3. How long befor CE REALLY is dead?

4. Does J2ME have a chance without Sun GPL'ing the whole J2 package?

Re:Why Linux? (1)

jedidiah (1196) | more than 13 years ago | (#373099)

This is simply bullshit.

There's quite a bit they can add without any need to publish their source. You're just spreading misinformation.

OTOH, by pointing out Microsoft as the prime example of the BSDl you demonstrate the key failing of that licence.

A Microsoft is free to use public sweat as corporate welfare in order to quickly deploy "embrace and extend" like Winsock.

Winsock: The ultimate counter-argument to the BSDl.

OTOH, Copyleft only requires you to provide source for what you CHANGE and then distribute. This is why suitable counterarguments to your rant can be found in abundance. These include the Linux versions of Oracle 8i, Maya, Bentley Microstation, Quake 3 and Corel Draw.

All of those are built on top of GNU software.

Re:CmdrTaco says: (1)

jedidiah (1196) | more than 13 years ago | (#373101)

$200 is cheap for a 27" TV set. At $800 you are getting close to the top of the line in conventional tube TV's and starting to overlap the lower end of conventional projection TVs.

Re:Do it yourself Linux TV (3)

Adnans (2862) | more than 13 years ago | (#373103)


  • Athlon 900 (workstation). A Celery 500 might have trouble doing realtime compression. It does have MMX right? No offense, but Celery's suck ;)
  • BT848 Hauppauge (old)
  • 7200RPM IDE disk, UDMA, unmasked IRQ (mp1e 1.80-something
  • V4L2 [sourceforge.net] which is much better at capturing data than the standard V4L1 stuff

I would reccommend capturing at 640x480 or 320x240 if you are going to playback on a TV, you'll save a lot of space/cpu without losing anything. Use xawtv for tuning your card, v4lctl or plain xawtv. Then you do something like this:

$ mp1e -G 640x480 -b 4.0 > some_file.mpeg

Experiment with the bitrate and picture size for best results. I haven't tried playing back these captured streams on the DXR3 but I'm sure it's possible. Something to try over the weekend :)

Good luck...

-adnans

See, I told ya..... (1)

R3 (15929) | more than 13 years ago | (#373106)

This is just what our fearless leader BillG predicted in his visionary book "The Road Ahead" (revised and updated edition), way back in 1995:

Interactive Television is the "Next Big Thing! (tm)

(Bill, 5:108 - "From Internet to Highway")

I submitted this weeks ago... (2)

illumin8 (148082) | more than 13 years ago | (#373111)

I submitted this weeks ago... but the gods at Slashdot didn't think it was newsworthy enough... NadaPC is offering the same device with a different subscription model. Check it out here [nadapc.com].

How Open/Closed will it be? (2)

iReflect (215501) | more than 13 years ago | (#373116)

I wish the article mentioned how open or closed this is going to be. Will we be able to tweak linux and run programs other than the ones preinstalled? If so, I imagine many of us could use one if the price is right. If not, it doesn't really matter as someone will hack it within a month or so. So I guess either way, it'll be somewhat open. I just hope they let people do with it what they want (and not be like the makers of cueCat)

Do it yourself Linux TV (5)

Adnans (2862) | more than 13 years ago | (#373118)

I've been running my own doityourself Linux TV typing thing for a couple of months now. Photo's of the actual TV, click here (1) [alsaplayer.org] and here (2) [alsaplayer.org]. The setup supports everything from basic text, mp3 playback, gnapster'ing all the way to fullscreen DVD viewing.

Hardware:
  • Sony PAL TV with s-video and dual SCART input (G4xx supports both PAL and NTSC output)
  • AMD Athlon 700
  • Matrox G400 MAX (any G4xx dualhead will do)
  • Hollywood+ / DXR3 MPEG decoder card
  • Trident 4DWave NX
  • Wireless SK7100 keyboard (full Linux support using 'hotkeys')
  • Logitech wireless mouse (PS/2)

Software:
  • Linux 2.4.0-XFS [sgi.com] (80Gig *bloody fast*, journalled XFS data partition)
  • Debian Woody (the best :)
  • XFree 4.0.2 + Matrox mga.o binary with HAL
  • WMaker 0.60.4, for proper Xinerama support
  • aviplay + plaympeg for fullscreeen DivX ;-) / MPEG2 playback
  • AlsaPlayer [alsaplayer.org] for music *grin*
  • ROX [sourceforge.net] for cool desktop icons and File browsing
  • Anything else that runs OK at 640x480 or 800x600

The TV..erh..Linux box automatically boots up in KDM so logging in is as simply as switching to the "X Win" channel and typing your user/login :) Unfortunately KDE2 (still) doesn't support Xinerama properly so running it on the TV-out screen :0.1 is tricky at best, impossible for newbies. The Trident NX card, using ALSA, is also hooked up to my Dolby Digital / DTS amp through the S/PDIF which gets me full 5.1 digital audio out.

Latest addition to the software list is MP3sb [mp3sb.org] which catalogs all your MP3's and has provides you with multiple views of your colection. Konqueror displaying the PHP3 client [alsaplayer.org]. Anyway, lots of fun hacking this stuff...

-adnans

Re:No Firewire port? (1)

BradleyUffner (103496) | more than 13 years ago | (#373119)

They wouldn't want you to be recording any of the TV shows now would they?
=\=\=\=\=\=\=\=\=\=\=\=\=\=\=\=\=\=\=\=\=\= \=\=\=\

Re:It's not new! (was Re:Tivo Functions) (2)

dattaway (3088) | more than 13 years ago | (#373120)

I used to detect commercials by detecting the fade to black editing when the station switched from the program to the commercials. There's a quick fade to black on the picture signal.

I had an old Zentith television that had a capacitor go bad and did the same thing. It was the only thing that ever broke on a television that I really appreciated. To bad it didn't blank the sound --the most annoying part of commercials.

Why? (2)

NineNine (235196) | more than 13 years ago | (#373123)

This isn't meant as flamebait, but I'm honestly interested in WHY anybody would want this? Buy this, and you get a smallish, clunky TV, and a tiny, underpowered, immobile computer. Why would I want to use this, when I can watch my 36" TV with a satellite from my couch, with my P800 laptop computer on my lap with a DSL connection? What benefits does this provide outside that most geeks don't already have?

Re:copyright-protected linux tv? (1)

kmrym (324422) | more than 13 years ago | (#373124)

Hmm... This is either "they" from "that's what they say" or an insider.

More to the point, even if there were some sort of copy protection built in, consider how easy it would be to undermine. Software can be played with (especially LINUX), and hardware can be re placed/moved.

Re:copyright-protected linux tv? (1)

TheLarch (26624) | more than 13 years ago | (#373125)

Since when do you call 800*600 High Definition? It's basicaly the digital equivalent of the PAL System used in most of western Europe (France now the only exception as far as I know. Next you'll be saying DVDs are High Definition media, which is only true if you compare them to VHS. Aahrgh!!!

Re:Good Idea for multistandard TV (1)

jedidiah (1196) | more than 13 years ago | (#373127)

VCRs are dirtcheap these days. If you already have a TV or computer capable of understading the other signal standard, there really isn't much excuse to not get one if you're really being innundated by foreign format video tapes.

Re:Why? (1)

DeadInSpace (320683) | more than 13 years ago | (#373129)

Why would I want to use this, when I can watch my 36" TV with a satellite from my couch, with my P800 laptop computer on my lap with a DSL connection?

- 36" TV . $1200
- p800 laptop . $3000
- DSL . $50/month

- Ch.1 WebTV . $899

perhaps that's why?

----

Re:Huh? (1)

jedidiah (1196) | more than 13 years ago | (#373131)

Actually, most of the problems currently facing HDTV are directly related to the fact that old TV's are purely hardware based solutions. Make TV's a bit more upgradeable and modular and you solve quite a bit of the headache of moving from one video format to another.

Re:And Cisco (1)

Uri Idyuut (324107) | more than 13 years ago | (#373133)

I dont think you understand the rules of this little game. MS has already been mentioned in the thread and by mentioning it again you are endangering slashdot through recursion. Stop it.

Don't take it personally, it's not your fault (2)

unitron (5733) | more than 13 years ago | (#373135)

It's only because you aren't part of the tight-knit little clique of the first quarter of a million to get accounts here.

Re:It's not new! (was Re:Tivo Functions) (2)

unitron (5733) | more than 13 years ago | (#373136)

Well, this new one is a Zenith and according to you they've already figured out an easy way to do it.

Zenith. The penguin goes in before the name goes on.

Two obvious questions: (2)

fm6 (162816) | more than 13 years ago | (#373137)

  • When's your IPO? ;)
  • Since you're using ROX anyway, why bother with KDE?

__________________

I can spare the Karma to say.... (2)

fm6 (162816) | more than 13 years ago | (#373138)

Imagine a Beowulf Cluster of these!

__________________

Re:copyright-protected linux tv? (1)

Velox_SwiftFox (57902) | more than 13 years ago | (#373139)

Yes, that's the way it works. They call 800x600 resolution high resolution TV monitors. Ridiculous a that sounds to someone who knows anything about computer displays.

The really sad part of this is that you can put together a nice TV/computer/DVD player/Digital VCR box using something like ATI's Radeon All-in-Wonder, with really high-res monitors - but the software drivers that are needed to perform these functions are all available for MS Windows but not Linux...

copyright-protected linux tv? (2)

lupa (218669) | more than 13 years ago | (#373140)

since the TV is billed as a "high resolution HDTV-ready monitor with a built-in conventional TV tuner," i'm sure we'll hear about some sort of HDTV copy prevention built into it. seems like an interesting little ploy, to me - i don't care if the internet appliance *is* linux, i'm not going anywhere near HDTV until i know it has no inherent/embedded copy prevention.

Re:And Cisco (1)

porky_pig_jr (129948) | more than 13 years ago | (#373141)

How do you know? Did you see the code? Which functions exactly? Which hardware platforms/IOS releases?

Re:Two obvious questions: (1)

Adnans (2862) | more than 13 years ago | (#373142)

  • Hehehe :)
  • The KFM part of Konqueror is just too heavyweight for TV File browsing. ROX simply feels better. On the other hand Konqueror has a WEB browser rocks!

Re:How will they market it? (1)

Plum (253578) | more than 13 years ago | (#373144)

I think we'll see that Linux will recieve the similar amount of hype here that it did during the surrection of Tivo: absolutely nothing. Remember Linux scares the masses like Nightmare on Elm Street wished it ever could.

Re:Whadda Deal (1)

Velox_SwiftFox (57902) | more than 13 years ago | (#373145)

A remote telephone, or a telephone function in the TV's remote, would allow muting to take place. It might give a boost to interest in Linux Telephony support too.

How will they market it? (2)

alewando (854) | more than 13 years ago | (#373146)

It'll be interesting to see whether they'll trumpet "linux inside" when they market the device.
  • On the one hand, Linux is still a buzzword and there are people who'll buy a linux device just for the sake of it or hoping to play with its innards.
  • On the other hand, tv/net appliances are not a market linux geeks are likely to consume in.
It's nice to see embedded linux getting some work, but does this have any effects broader than mere novelty value (as far as we're concerned)?

Why Linux? (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#373147)

Why did they choose Linux? Had they chosen FreeBSD or something they could save face and not have to tell anyone how they did it. With the GPL, any hard work or software magic they do has to be open source too.

Ever hear of a company called MicroSoft? They use tons of BSD code, and they don't have to show it to you.

CmdrTaco says: (3)

krich (161944) | more than 13 years ago | (#373150)

"A box like that could be a great little inexpensive MP3 server or something."

It's not new! (was Re:Tivo Functions) (1)

blanalex (85657) | more than 13 years ago | (#373153)

>First killer app: commercial skipper

I'm sorry but I already got a VCR with that function. At the end of the show it's recording, the VCR rewinds at the beginning of the program and mark all the commercials.

What would be the new feature here, is that we could watch the show without the commercial even before the show is over

Re:Good Idea for multistandard TV (1)

snoop_chili_dog (314897) | more than 13 years ago | (#373156)

No one's replied to my post. All the other posts have repliers. What's wrong? Is it something I did. I feel so lonely and unloved.

A far more novel idea: Our own cable channel (1)

Niscenus (267969) | more than 13 years ago | (#373157)

Let's be honest, when ZDTV started it was M$. As it goes, TechTV is still centered more on Windows and Macintosh.
Why not have our own? PNP! You can see it now: Open Magazine Daily Edition. Think Geek Sunday Auction. Linux Newbies Morning Edition. The Six O'Clock World According To Slashdot.
I'm willing to be five dollars says Ted Turner, who, by the way, is a dothead, though not quite an addict, yet, might find that to be an intriguing concept.
Hmm...FIRST COPYRIGHT!
see Harlan Ellison for more details;-)
Just putting it out there, dotheads welcome to sound off. I like this idea. I don't think much of the box, but this...this I like.

Re:Speaking of one big Advertisment... (1)

flacco (324089) | more than 13 years ago | (#373159)

The Oracle Ad was extremely annoying. There it was right in the middle of the page and so large that it obscures most of the beginning of the article. Not to mention that it didn't get removed by my filtering software. Not good. Not good at all.

Freakin hideous, isn't it? I already complained to ZDNet a week ago about this new "in your face" advertising tactic. Revolting.

Forget banners, here's the future of e-commerce! (3)

BlowCat (216402) | more than 13 years ago | (#373160)

This "news story" reads a lot more like an advertisement
Actually it is. I'm going to patent a new method of advertizing in Internet by inserting the word "Linux" into the ad and submitting it to slashdot editors.

Re:Do it yourself Linux TV (2)

Adnans (2862) | more than 13 years ago | (#373161)

No, but it's as simple as adding a BT8[47]8/etc card to the box and using something like VCR [stack.nl] or mp1e for Linux. I've had quite good results with mp1e and V4L2 recording ST: Voyager episodes at 768x576 @ 25fps on my other box. Broadcast 2000 had a little trouble with the resulting mpeg but the latest version should work fine. You will have to handedit the stream to get rid of the commercials. Bottom line: since it's a whitebox PC you can add functionality as you like, given enough funds / spare time :)

-adnans

Re:Whadda Deal (1)

Tiroth (95112) | more than 13 years ago | (#373162)

I believe line doublers start around $800, so you really are getting a deal.

No component video inputs (1)

pomakis (323200) | more than 13 years ago | (#373164)

It looks like a pretty cool device, and quite flexible, but one thing I find odd is that it doesn't have any component video (Y, Cr, Cb) inputs. Without component video, this TV will never be taken seriously by true home theatre aficionados.

Re:Do it yourself Linux TV (2)

drix (4602) | more than 13 years ago | (#373165)

Hi, can you give me the specs on your box. I've got a DXR3 and I've been trying to do the exact same thing - use mp1e to encode stuff from my BTTV for future viewing. When recorded at 768x576 I should get no quality loss whatsoever when spitting the MPEG video back out on my tv (NTSC is 768x576 isn't it?) I don't think my Celery 500 can handle doing that realtime though and I'm considering an upgrade. What kind of processor usage are you seeing and what are your specs. Thanks!

--

Re:Why? (1)

NineNine (235196) | more than 13 years ago | (#373166)

They can take my PC (not PC/TV, not PC/TV/telephone, not PC/TV/telephone/breadmaker) away from me when they pry it out of my cold, dead, hands.

A few reasons... (3)

Ungrounded Lightning (62228) | more than 13 years ago | (#373168)

Why did they choose Linux? Had they chosen FreeBSD or something they could save face and not have to tell anyone how they did it. With the GPL, any hard work or software magic they do has to be open source too

But they don't WANT to close it up. They're licensing the hardware to other manufacturers, so there's nothing to be gained (and a lot to be lost - like willingness of other manufacturers to buy) by closing the software.

Also: They apparently want to sell to early-adopters, who have been asking for Linux.

If nothing else, I bet the customers don't want their TV crashing constantly, script-kiddies changing their channels or turning it on at 3 AM, the boss finding out what porn they're watching, and the movie companies showing up to bust them for viewing homemade copies of rented movies.

If your TV's on the net with closed-source appware how do you know it's not open to all of the above?

Good Idea for multistandard TV (2)

snoop_chili_dog (314897) | more than 13 years ago | (#373169)

The good thing about this is that most video cards adjust automatically for ntsc and pal format. This way you won't have to buy a pal compliant TV if you leave the states. At least if they did it right.

Actually, I CAN imagine... (2)

Ungrounded Lightning (62228) | more than 13 years ago | (#373170)

ObSlashdotStupidity: Can you imagine a Beowulf cluster of... oh, never mind. :-)

Actually, I can.

I imagine it doing a wall-of-monitors bigscreen, in software, in real-time.

B-)

Re:See, I told ya..... (2)

unitron (5733) | more than 13 years ago | (#373171)

That was after they revised and updated it to include the internet, right?

Actually (proprietary) interactive television has been the "Next Big Thing!"(tm) almost as long as the videophone.

Tivo Functions (3)

Srin Tuar (147269) | more than 13 years ago | (#373172)

I'd consider one worthwhile if it had Tivo-like recording/playback of video.

Even better would be an API, so that I could make applets for them and load them into flash. I could imagine trading these online.

First killer app: commercial skipper. Record a show beforehand, or start watching it late and it automatically trims commercials from the show. People might be surprised how short their favorite shows really are.

Of course advertisers would become more wary, and we may need to patch our video-spam killers now and then...

Re:Two obvious questions: (2)

fm6 (162816) | more than 13 years ago | (#373173)

I agree about Konqueror. Its rendering engine still needs some work, but even so it's my Linux web browser of choice.

But Konqueror runs fine under other desktops and window managers. You just need to have the KDE libraries installed. So you can also use the ROX desktop (which I will have to give a spin when I have time). Or if you want a real TVesque desktop, there's Englightenment...

__________________

Re:How will they market it? (2)

SquadBoy (167263) | more than 13 years ago | (#373175)

If you look around at some of the embedded Linux pages out there it becomes clear that Linux is fast becoming the standard for things like this and they are doing it because it is free both beer and speech. They like the cost. They also like having the right to make it do exactly what they want it to do. If you read up on it a bit it quickly becomes clear that dispite what many posters here will say that Linux just makes sense for these types of things.

purty kewl! (2)

KingAzzy (320268) | more than 13 years ago | (#373176)

Now *this* is an internet appliance as it should be. I was at first skeptical, expecting that there would be a >$1.5k price tag attached to this 'rather small' TV. But I am quite pleased to see a $899 price on it.

I'd like to see what sort of price for similar features but on a 60" model.

BTW... ain't Linux just *cuuuuuuuuuuute* all dolled up like that? :-)

Other uses for this? (3)

martyb (196687) | more than 13 years ago | (#373177)

Seems like this would be a great tool for people whose vision is impaired. Let's face it, 800x600 on a 27-inch monitor provides large fonts, and enough space to be useful.

One downside, though. There would not be much space left over if you had one of these on your desk. I mean, really, wouldn't you just HAVE to hook it up to a PSX2, too? ;)

Fantastic! (2)

Kynes23 (38777) | more than 13 years ago | (#373178)

The revolution is here at last! Full-screen streaming video content, available for free over the airwaves? Truly, this was Linux's calling.

Yuck (1)

kaoshin (110328) | more than 13 years ago | (#373181)

I thought it looked nice until I scrolled down and saw the remote. It looks like cross between a nintendo 64 joystick and a chinese typewriter!

Speaking of one big Advertisment... (1)

bihoy (100694) | more than 13 years ago | (#373182)

The Oracle Ad was extremely annoying. There it was right in the middle of the page and so large that it obscures most of the beginning of the article. Not to mention that it didn't get removed by my filtering software. Not good. Not good at all.

Huh? (1)

mr bushley (324084) | more than 13 years ago | (#373183)

I fail to see why this is any more important than an ordinary HDTV tuner. The fact that it runs on linux doesn't overcome the obstacles HDTV is currently facing; its not reason enough to convince me to purchase one.

Re:And Cisco (1)

Uri Idyuut (324107) | more than 13 years ago | (#373184)

Ever hear of Linux? They use tons of BSD code and they dont have to show it to you unless you ask.

Yet another service (1)

metoc (224422) | more than 13 years ago | (#373188)

I was sold until I saw the $8.95/month service charge. I already have cable, broadband internet and I like my TV Guide (portable, readable, cheap, and shareable). If someone hacks the Linux component I may reconsider.

Re:Good Idea for multistandard TV (1)

snoop_chili_dog (314897) | more than 13 years ago | (#373191)

Go to www.dvdoverseas.com [dvdoverseas.com]. They have lots of multi-standard tv's and VCR's. Someday I'm going to have to get one so I can start buying Australian DVD's. For some reason theirs have more scenes for less money.

Re:Whadda Deal (1)

fliplap (113705) | more than 13 years ago | (#373192)

um see, most people don't care if their TV can route packets and serve files, and i dont know anyone that cares to have a telephone attached to the TV. They look at this and go, "oh neat, a TV with the internet!" And it also says you can use any ISP, you aren't tied into theirs, although if you want the channel listing its $8.95 a month, you could just tune to the TV Guide channel or goto TV Guide.com.

Sylvania is bad beans (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#373194)

I work at a major retail store. Lets just call them "Sears Roebuck and Co." for me to remain anonymous. We sell these things and they get returned more than any other TV we sell. I beleave they are manufactured by Funui electronics, who seems to make Zenith TVs too.

New HOWTO: Turn your Linux box into a VCR (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#373195)

For my money, I druther get me a better, cheaper TV and interface it to my fully functional Linux box a la this new HOWTO that the Linux Documentation Project just posted this week: VCR-HOWTO - Using your GNU/Linux computer as a VCR [zdnet.com]. Now if I could only decide which TV/Video Capture Card [zdnet.com] to buy :-)

Hackable? (1)

Alien54 (180860) | more than 13 years ago | (#373196)

I mean, come on now....

Can it accept a hard drive, can we fine tune the set up? can we load our own software so that we have our own home brew TIVO in it.

There are just so many questions, once the Genii is out of the bottle....

Just watch out for the High Voltage thingies there...

;-)

Re:Why Linux? (1)

dachshund (300733) | more than 13 years ago | (#373197)

With the GPL, any hard work or software magic they do has to be open source too.

Is that so? I didn't realize that anyone who wrote applications that ran on the Linux operating system was required to open-source their code...!

Re:Self refering? (1)

SquadBoy (167263) | more than 13 years ago | (#373198)

OK Please point me to a page about embedded BSD. I have also recently come to prefer the BSD license. I would be happy to be wrong on this one but don't think that I am.

Re:Do it yourself Linux TV (2)

drix (4602) | more than 13 years ago | (#373199)

No DXR3 is definitely backward compatible with MPEG1; this much I've verified. I've got a huge hard disk and I figure with the proper processor upgrade & a couple days of hacking I'll whip something up to pause live TV. DIY Tivo :)

--

Re:Tivo Functions (2)

shokk (187512) | more than 13 years ago | (#373200)

Tivo
A Tivo costs about $399 for the cheap model, into which you put a $100 drive to hack the Tivo into using and then buy a $200 lifetime subscription.

Computer equivalent
$100 Soundblaster Live (need the SPDIF)
$200 PIII 700
$25 Linksys ethernet card
$100 mobo for it
$30 case
$15 floppy
$100 hard drive
$300 ATI All In Wonder Radeon
no TV Guide show directory
Geekfactor - priceless
- And you're inevitably going to want to add a wireless keyboard and mouse, a DVD drive, CDROM drive etc etc

Seriously, the Tivo above is cheaper and I won't have to throw it into the project box after getting sick of it continually crashing. You might cheap out on a few of these parts, but then your just fudging the numbers, and not really by all that much. My time is worth too freaking much to play with these parts anymore. I want to watch the shows, not do work to get to watching them. I have stuff to do! Buy the Tivo and sit down. You'll be able to use the spare time to think about some real ground breaking projects instead of reinventing the wheel.

Won't Microsoft be pissed... (1)

jhantin (252660) | more than 13 years ago | (#373201)

over another company shipping an Internet browsing product-- Linux-based, at that-- having a "channel bar", as it were, that blows the doors off IE's gimmicky bookmark pane?

On a side note, I wonder if you can actually get a shell on this beastie as shipped, or whether we're gonna have to wait for someone to take the thing apart to figure that out.

ObSlashdotStupidity: Can you imagine a Beowulf cluster of... oh, never mind. :-)

Sylvania, Maytag, Kenmore (2)

heroine (1220) | more than 13 years ago | (#373202)

The good news is it's computers people are going to be able to use. The bad news is when are software engineers going to be relagated to the Maytag repair man?

Speaking of Linux TV (1)

iomud (241310) | more than 13 years ago | (#373203)

How bout an actual show on techtv or something similar dedicated to Linux that'd be nice wouldn't it, an hour long show targeted to an intermediate/advanced audience.

Re:rm -rf /Family Feud (1)

shokk (187512) | more than 13 years ago | (#373204)

Watch out for when they dump it like everything else in a few months. If folks at LNUX still have jobs, they still have a bit more room to fall. The shame will be if RedHat suffers from this and we no longer have a nice quality Linux distro left.

Integration of the Ch.1 Appliance (2)

Dr. Dew (219113) | more than 13 years ago | (#373205)

The concept is very cool. Execution looks fine, too, to me.

But hey now, I'm going to spend $8.95 per month for what exactly? Do I really need to access the TV station's web site in PIP while I watch the program? I do not.

This is the way of things, and I guess I understand. If you got the bare-bones Ch.1 service at $8.95 per month, you'd have to use the TV for more than 8 years to have the service cost overtake the hardware cost. Lucky if the hardware lasts that long (let alone Ch.1).

Still, given that they're using a free operating system I can obtain elsewhere, and a Web connection I can maintain (and must pay for) elsewhere, I'm not that excited to have an online TV guide for nine bucks a month. At least with OnStar in the car, I'm getting service I can't duplicate on my own.

Of course, I may not be the target audience. I don't own a television. I watch movies on the monitor that came with my first IBM PC: An Amdek with RCA in (only)...

Whadda Deal (3)

maggard (5579) | more than 13 years ago | (#373206)

A 27" TV with what's basically a WebTV built into it.

So why not just buy any other 27" TV with line-doubling and plug in a cheapie home PC? It'll do more and be easier to upgrade in the future. I dunno 'bout you but I expect my TV sets to last at least 10 years, anyone here expect Ch.1 Inc. to last that long or to coninue supporting this product?

Indeed it apparently can't even do Digital-VCR functions. Give me TiVo + router + firewall + webcaching + light fileserving + telephone + HDTV (& not via some damn 3rd-party add-on but integrated & used throughout) + in-house streaming and I'll buy. Otherwise it's just another TV with yet-another fancy channel guide & some pre-set "portal" crap.

And Cisco (1)

Kancer (61362) | more than 13 years ago | (#373207)

Ever hear of a company called Cisco? They use tons of BSD code, and they don't have to show it to you.

Re:Whadda Deal (2)

maggard (5579) | more than 13 years ago | (#373208)

So it's a TV with WebTV built in - BFD (exactly my point.) except of course at least webTV has some sort of show ie-ins and this is just a plain browser.

If it was somehow different / more / groundbreaking (like any of the items I listed) then it might be worth attention. Without that it's just a TV with WebTV built in (and just 'cause it's Linux-based doesn't make it any less a yawner.)

So would you let a friend buy something that's so clearly going to outlive it's usefulness?

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