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Guild Wars 2 Release Date Announced

Soulskill posted more than 2 years ago | from the once-more-unto-the-breach dept.

Role Playing (Games) 128

New submitter Woldry writes "After five years in development, Guild Wars 2 has been given a launch date: August 28, 2012. ArenaNet's aim is to provide 'a living, breathing online world that challenges convention, that's designed for fun instead of grind.' There's a beta weekend planned for July 20-22 for those who have pre-purchased the game (and for those who have gotten legitimate beta keys in advance)." Rock, Paper, Shotgun has a good write-up of some hands-on time during one of the earlier beta weekends, saying, 'Time after time, Guild Wars 2 impressed me with just how carefully no, how smartly everything has been thought out. Those things that annoy us in other games are simply banished here.'

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WOOOOO! (4, Interesting)

samazon (2601193) | more than 2 years ago | (#40478383)

Unlike WoW, when this game sucks my boyfriend in, I'll actually be there playing with him. :D

Re:WOOOOO! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40478511)

Unlike WoW, when this game sucks my boyfriend in, I'll actually be there playing with him. :D

I will make your boyfriend gay. Thus, you will be forever alone.

Re:WOOOOO! (-1, Troll)

fluffythedestroyer (2586259) | more than 2 years ago | (#40478557)

This post is screaming for trolling...must... not .. post...

what the hell makes you think he's gonna let you out of the kitchen ?

damn it...you made me say it again...

Re:WOOOOO! (4, Funny)

samazon (2601193) | more than 2 years ago | (#40478591)

LOL the irony here is that the crafting (and cooking) is my favorite part of gw2 so far.

Re:WOOOOO! (3, Interesting)

Kalendraf (830012) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479051)

This is the first game I've ever played where I've actually enjoyed the resource gathering and crafting. The resource gathering also encourages exploration.

Re:WOOOOO! (1)

fluffythedestroyer (2586259) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479229)

Most of the time professions are just time gathering games which is an excuse to make you play the game longer and more. Blizzard told so about their profession system when wow was out. It does make sense when you have a monthly subscription and you have to keep your payers busy. Nothing wrong with that but if GW2 is making it fun that it's a really good thing compared to other known games.

Re:WOOOOO! (4, Interesting)

Baloroth (2370816) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479419)

GW2 doesn't have a monthly subscription model, so they don't need a time sink system as much as WoW did. That means they can actually make the crafting fun, rather than just laborious.

Re:WOOOOO! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40478579)

Maybe if you sucked your boyfriend a little more he wouldn't need to play games at all...

Re:WOOOOO! (-1, Troll)

fluffythedestroyer (2586259) | more than 2 years ago | (#40478609)

Maybe there's a reason he plays game and he's not with her girlfriend. I think they need a help... a therapist

Re:WOOOOO! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40478769)

Or maybe they're not codependent twits who need each other's undivided attention 24/7.

OBAMACARE UPHELD! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40478397)

Suck it, conservative assholes!

Re:OBAMACARE UPHELD! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40478469)

Wait till some whacky conservative makes you buy a clubbed seal or a membership to the RNC ... because according to this decision they can make you buy anything claiming it as a tax.

Re:OBAMACARE UPHELD! (-1, Offtopic)

crazyjj (2598719) | more than 2 years ago | (#40478647)

Ha, what's new? My state government already makes me buy car insurance, the state and federal government make me pay taxes so they can spend my money on whatever crap they like (incl wars that I don't support), and everywhere I turn there is some fine or fee for something. I'll just add this one to the pile.

Re:OBAMACARE UPHELD! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40478719)

They make you buy car insurance because you're driving and could hurt other people. They make you pay taxes only if you earn money. It's really questionable to require someone to buy something simply because they are alive. Please let me know if you can come up with any such examples.

Re:OBAMACARE UPHELD! (0)

Iniamyen (2440798) | more than 2 years ago | (#40480411)

They make you pay taxes if you own property, free and clear. And they make you pay taxes until you die. They can tax whatever they want, and they do. Don't make act like there aren't already "questionable" tax laws.

Re:OBAMACARE UPHELD! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40480787)

You are now born a debt slave.

Re:OBAMACARE UPHELD! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40478803)

According to the 10th, states CAN do it ... the federal government, my god ... if they can do this then what can't they do. The idea of limited government is dead.

Re:OBAMACARE UPHELD! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40478899)

Boy, if only we'd just gotten a plain old Public Option like every other civilized country in the fucking world, but no, conservatives didn't want that, so now they're getting fed this shit sandwich. I find it hard to sympathize...

Re:OBAMACARE UPHELD! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40479515)

What you call civilized I call bankrupt and underwater. In that regard the US is close to being civilized too. It isn't just the "conservatives" that didn't want it ... the MAJORITY of the ENTIRE country didn't want it. Congress had to pass it by trickery against the wishes of the people. The only winners here believe in a socialist America.

Re:OBAMACARE UPHELD! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40485105)

All the polls I've read have shown overwhelming support for a public option. Then again, they probably asked poor people, and Lord knows they don't deserve an opinion, am I right?

Re:OBAMACARE UPHELD! (-1, Flamebait)

Creepy (93888) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479311)

Sounds like a lot more health care underwriters will have time to play this game come August. My wife let me in on a secret a few days ago that her work would can all of them or move them to new positions today if the law was upheld because they are now superfluous.

Re:OBAMACARE UPHELD! (-1, Offtopic)

ravenscar (1662985) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479825)

Car insurance is not directly analogous. You can choose not to drive. In fact, large numbers of people go about their lives without getting behind the wheel of a car. If you don't want car insurance you simply commute using another option. Granted that this is easier for some people than others (geographic location, career choice, etc.), but people can still choose to live a life where a license to drive is not required. The same goes for all of the other state required insurance. For example, don't want to have to buy medical malpractice insurance - don't become a doctor. Don't want to post construction bonds - don't become a contractor. According to the ACA, if you exist and are in the U.S. you need to purchase health insurance. Suddenly, you don't have any choice (unless you want to pay a fine). That is very different from the car insurance mandate.

I'm not arguing on the merits of the law or the decision. I'm just pointing out why, in my opinion, the use of the car insurance analogy seems rather weak to me.

Re:OBAMACARE UPHELD! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40482531)

The difference is...

Federal government effects the whole country, you have to move to another country to avoid the laws.

State government ( which is where these decisions should be made in the first place) only effects the residents of that state. If you dont like the state laws, move to a state that has laws that you can agree with.

This is the basic problem with the Federal Government making all these mandates. If they mandate that every citizen of the US is required to buy (fill in the blank here) then we will all be required to purchase states item, the federal government has taken our freedom of choice. Welcome to the new Republic of Communist America.

Re:OBAMACARE UPHELD! (1)

0123456 (636235) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479383)

The best thing Obama could have hoped for would be that Obamacare would be tossed out. Now the Republicans are outraged and far more motivated to turn out and vote.

Fortunately in GW2 every class has a heal spell and resurrection only costs a few copper pieces when you die, so health care isn't a big issue there.

PLAY THIS GAME! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40478437)

I'm serious.

i've played in all beta events and it's seriously dampened my willingness to play any others in the RPG genre.

i've almost a 20 year history with RPG computer gaming and this is the one I (and lots of others) have been waiting for.

Really? (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40478447)

"Those things that annoy us in other games are simply banished here."

There are no other people?

Re:Really? (3, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40478519)

not so you'd notice.

by that i don't mean the servers are empty, quite the opposite, but the game is huge and more importantly, what others are doing has no negative impact (imo) on what you're doing.

if you want, they're quite easily just NPC's which add to the world immersion.

Re:Really? (4, Interesting)

stiggle (649614) | more than 2 years ago | (#40478689)

Thats one of the things I liked about the original GuildWars - I could fill my party up with NPC and not have to deal with other people if I wanted to be anti-social. At other times I could get all my friends along too (before they left for LOTRO)

Re:Really? (2)

TheLink (130905) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479143)

I quite like the first Guild Wars (GW1) and I'm not sure I'd like GW2 (based on what I see of the game). I really do like the GW1 game mechanics - primary+secondary classes, lots of different very interesting skills. And with the 7 heroes in a team thing, it allows you to try lots of strange team builds - so in PvE you're not playing one player, but playing a "team". So unless I can do that in GW2, to me GW2 will be more similar to WoW and WoWlike games than GW1.

I believe a lot of people who like WoW will also like GW2. Those who temporarily left WoW to try Warhammer Online should probably try GW2. Same for the SWTOR players (unless they are real Star Wars fans).

Re:Really? (4, Interesting)

Creepy (93888) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479809)

They had to drop the secondary classes because it was too hard to play balance. In fact, now your weapon dictates your first 5 skills (out of, eventually, 10) and the skills on the weapons have to be unlocked first. This was, IMO, the only grind in the game though - I'd go back to a noob area, kill 40 weak monsters (10 for each skill on the weapon), and then return to harder areas. I did unlock quite a few weapons (and shields and offhands) - my goal for the betas was more to fiddle with play styles, classes, races, etc and see what I liked best, so I went more "broad than long" (highest level I attained in 3 betas was 22/80, and I played a LOT - probably would be 50 if I stuck to a single character).

That said, I like combat in GW2 MUCH better than WoW and its wall of skills you never use. Elementalists don't really become fun until about level 12, however, but then are really fun, especially with a fully unlocked staff or wand/offhand and three skills (haven't gotten slots 4 or elite unlocked yet), or even daggers. They do look like they are wearing trashy bridal dresses, though (some people say hooker, but no hooker I've ever seen dressed like that - and yes, I used to see lots of hookers in one shitty neighborhood I lived in - I also was a working musician paying about $197/mo in rent). I had a blast playing an Engineer in the stress test yesterday and I didn't think I would like that class at all (level 1-9 with no deaths or fight for life was a first for me in any of the betas). Mesmer I still love, but it was last added and worst balanced, so haven't played much since the first beta. Created and deleted a ranger because pet AI was dumb and wanted to try other classes - rangers were favored by my guild yesterday and seem to be well liked now. Guardian was broken by a major change in the last beta, but wasn't too bad from L1-L5 (I deleted a bunch of characters since I only have 5 slots and wanted to try all 8 classes). Warrior can hit really hard, though I've played that least (level 3 - this is my TODO for beta 3), leaving that up to a guildie that loves warrior. Thief... well, I loved leveling from 1-7, but 8-12 was really hard, as neither pistols nor daggers seemed to cut it. My Engineer was dual pistol and rifle swap and that seemed ok yesterday, though. Necromancer was fun, but I decided at level 5 to save that one to focus on after release, though I may play him some more next beta.

Re:Really? (1)

Shados (741919) | more than 2 years ago | (#40481623)

GW1 is much closer to WoW (not saying its close. Nowhere close, but "closer") than GW2. GW1 has the party mechanic with healers/support, the guy in front taking the hits, and the constant running of areas for loot.

GW2, aside for a select few dungeons, is all open, all the classes can do all of the roles to most extent (just with totally unique skills), the classes are different to a fundamental level (often with totally different engine mechanics, as opposed to just different numbers and variations of summon/heal/nuke/attack).

Generally so far, diehard stereotypical WoW players -hate- the way GW2 is going.

Re:Really? (2)

TheLink (130905) | more than 2 years ago | (#40484327)

My point was in GW1 you can play the _whole_ party. As far as I know in WoW or GW2 you can't - you just control one character (with the exception of pets).

In many popular GW1 PvE team builds you don't have someone in front taking the hits.You could have minions in front taking the hits, or pets, or spirits. In PvP anyone could be taking hits - there's no taunt mechanic. Just because you could have tank+healer+DPS doesn't mean it's closer to WoW otherwise TF2 would be closer to WoW too.

And there are very powerful skills like protective spirit ( damage limited to 10%), spirit bond, shield of absorption. Which makes the way you survive/kill enemies/players very different compared to most other MMOs. With such skills you could unload high DPS on a player for an entire match and the target will not die, even if it's only one or two keeping the target alive. Whereas for the other games if you unload high enough DPS for long enough, the target will die unless you have many coordinated healers.

With the way things work in WoW, you can have RvR. But with GW1 even if it wasn't instanced, I doubt you could have RvR unless you overhaul the skills and classes.

And GW1 is also instanced for everything. The way you play with other people is different - you can't wander around and randomly help someone and then wander off and help someone else.

So to me GW1 is more different from WoW than GW2.

Re:Really? (4, Interesting)

Nemyst (1383049) | more than 2 years ago | (#40478867)

I know you were going for a funny mod, but while they didn't actually remove everyone, they made them at least much less painful. You can mute chat and just about ignore everyone if you so desire, but even then they're more helpful than harmful. There's basically no way for an idiot to troll or block you from progressing. Anything they do at the very least helps them, in almost all cases also helps you.

It's a brilliant system and one which removes much of the pain out of MMOs.

Those things that annoy us in other games are simp (1)

fluffythedestroyer (2586259) | more than 2 years ago | (#40478523)

Those things that annoy us in other games are simply banished here..

What are they to you ? that wasn't mentioned and I'm curious to know what they are

Re:Those things that annoy us in other games are s (1)

BradleyUffner (103496) | more than 2 years ago | (#40478599)

Those things that annoy us in other games are simply banished here..

What are they to you ? that wasn't mentioned and I'm curious to know what they are

I stopped reading after he mentioned that there was no concept of a Mana pool for spells, just cooldown timers. I was actually looking forward to this game, but not any more.

Re:Those things that annoy us in other games are s (3, Informative)

Kalendraf (830012) | more than 2 years ago | (#40478883)

You should try it before judging.

From a game design stand-point, a mana system is fundamentally a way to prevent players from activating too many skills too quickly...which is the same thing that cooldown timers do. However, cooldown timers don't force players to channel funds into a gold sink like mana potions, or waste inventory slots to carry them. Having played many games with mana pools, I find the cooldown system in GW2 to be vastly superior.

Obviously, those players that really enjoy buying, carrying and quaffing mana potions may disagree.

Re:Those things that annoy us in other games are s (2)

SuricouRaven (1897204) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479193)

It also renders fireball-spam a less viable strategy, forcing players to really think strategically about their spell choices and combinations.

Re:Those things that annoy us in other games are s (2)

Creepy (93888) | more than 2 years ago | (#40480121)

You also have the serious problem of, say, one ele causing constant AoE knockdown (aka knocklock) and another doing constant AoE damage. Without a timer, the first ele can dedicate their mana to just doing AoE knockdowns and counting for casting time. The only fix for this would be to increase casting time to be greater than knockdown time, and then you get 2 or 3 people working together over Vent or TS (or Skype or whatever) doing the exact same thing and just counting out loud and knowing the order. This is ruinous for PvP and breaks PvE. So the enemy player takes and anti-knockdown skill? Well gee, Meteor took 1 skill on the bar, so the rest of the bar can be dedicated to spiking that one player down. And I'm talking about a single tactic - there are hundreds more.

Guild Wars 1 realized that and added a cooldown timer in addition to mana; Guild Wars 2 did away with the mana as superfluous.

Re:Those things that annoy us in other games are s (0)

SuricouRaven (1897204) | more than 2 years ago | (#40480911)

Good. A well-coordinated team should be rewarded.

Re:Those things that annoy us in other games are s (1)

BlackSnake112 (912158) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479331)

Try the ele with air (lightning) magic. That first skill once fires keeps on firing constantly until you move out of range or what you are fighting dies. Or you die. You can also fire other skills while the first one fire is still going. I really thought it was cheating it was that simple and fun.

*note they may have changed this. I have not tried the beta in a few months

Re:Those things that annoy us in other games are s (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40479459)

Ooh improved force lightning...

Re:Those things that annoy us in other games are s (2)

realityimpaired (1668397) | more than 2 years ago | (#40478891)

I stopped reading after he mentioned that there was no concept of a Mana pool for spells, just cooldown timers. I was actually looking forward to this game, but not any more.

Why? I played casters in most MMO's since the original Everquest, and the mana pool was simply another form of cooldown timer. You needed to manage your casting rate, your regen rate, your meditation (when it was a factor), etc. against the size of your mana pool. The only thing that a mana pool actually allows that this wouldn't is the quick burn and I'd be surprised if they didn't put some kind of special ability or skill that would allow that, too.

Re:Those things that annoy us in other games are s (0)

BradleyUffner (103496) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479067)

Lack of mana pool removes some of the complexity and resource management. Without the mana pool it just becomes "click this button as soon as your cooldown timer clears." Combine that with some of the other things they mentioned, like every class getting a healing spell, makes ever character feel the same. If everyone has the same basic abilities that just differ in the animation they play, whats the point? There is also GW's signature skill system where skills can be swapped out at any time, which always left me without a feeling of progression, and makes every character feel even more alike. Taken individually these aren't a big deal, but combine them all and it just leaves me feeling all "meh" about the game.

I'll certainly take another look at the game once it's actually released, but reading this guys story just destroyed a lot of my interest.

Re:Those things that annoy us in other games are s (3, Interesting)

Kalendraf (830012) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479183)

If you activate skills the moment they cooldown, you will fail hard in this game. If anything, the cooldown system in GW2 actually requires more resource management to know when to best activate skills. Of all the RPGs I've played, I think GW2's skill system might be one of the easier ones to begin learning, but one of the hardest to master. In other words, it manages to appeal to both casual and hardcore gamers, which is no small feat.

Also, each class plays distinctly differently. Abilities and play styles are very different between them. The fact each one has a heal skill doesn't alter this. Most heal skills have long cool downs, so you need to really stay alert and use them when you need them the most.

As for the original GW's skill system, GW2's version is significantly different. You can still respec your character in GW2, but there are some costs to do certain kinds of changes.

Re:Those things that annoy us in other games are s (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40479997)

Lack of mana pool removes some of the complexity and resource management. Without the mana pool it just becomes "click this button as soon as your cooldown timer clears."

Maybe if you're playing a mana-pool-oriented game onto which some misguided developer shoddily stapled a cooldown-timer-oriented magic system, sure. But as soon as the fights become more involved than just "DPS this thing to death before it DPSes you to death, oh and sometimes cast a buff so you can DPS more or so that the thing DPSes less, and maybe bring more people in to increase DPS so your DPS can DPS and DPS DPS DPS DPS", things change QUITE a bit.

Re:Those things that annoy us in other games are s (4, Interesting)

BinarySolo (1951210) | more than 2 years ago | (#40481843)

The difference in GW2 is that there are very few spells that just do pure damage. Most have secondary and sometimes very powerful effects attached to them, which means you will want to use them wisely and not just "as soon as your cooldown timer clears".

For example, one spell may have a blind effect which causes your enemy's next attack to miss. Another may have a knockdown effect. Another might launch you forward while leaving a trail of fire in your wake. Hopefully it's obvious how this forces smart use of skills and not just whack-a-mole whatever's off cooldown.

As a side note, I find mana to be a very bad resource system (large pool, slow/cumbersome to regenerate) and it seems to have stuck around only because it's "traditional". It is essentially unlimited in the short-term, and has a hard limit in the long-term, which means that in the heat of battle, you might as well not have a resource unless you are engaged in very long fights. And if you do run out of mana, it's a very unfun mechanic since there's basically nothing you can do except sit there and reflect on your character's poor life decisions that led to this point.

Energy (small pool, fast-regenerating resource) seems like a much more interesting resource for forcing resource management, as it forces smart, controlled skill usage and heavily prohibits button mashing. However, a purely cooldown based system like GW2 basically creates the same thing.

Re:Those things that annoy us in other games are s (1)

Creepy (93888) | more than 2 years ago | (#40480481)

Yes there is a quick burn for elementalists and thieves (initiative, which actually works pretty much exactly like mana). Mesmer isn't fully realized, so we'll have to wait and see, but you may be able to do it with a weapon swap, which I haven't unlocked yet on my mesmer. For elementalists, you can burn your entire fire bar, then switch elements to, say air (F3 key) and burn that bar, switch back to fire (F1 key), etc. For defense with less offense or snaring use the Earth and Water bars (these are all tied to weapon - you also get some skills to use, but most of these have long cooldowns on ele). Usually by the time you've spammed a bar from a different element, you can switch back to the original (there is a timer on switching back, but it is like 10-15 seconds) and it is mostly or fully filled. Effectively, an ele has 25 elemental skills available to spam and up to 5 extra skills without a weapon swap (and once you unlock that, you have 20 more). I didn't really get into weapon swapping yet on ele, but I do it all the time on thief (pistol the enemy until they're close, then switch to daggers, but the initiative bar can hamper there).

Re:Those things that annoy us in other games are s (4, Interesting)

BinarySolo (1951210) | more than 2 years ago | (#40481197)

Elementalists do not have a weapon swap, due to their attunement mechanic. 4 attunements with 5 skills apiece = 20 skills, compared to standard classes who just have a weapon swap with 5 skills apiece for 10 skills. If eles also had a weapon swap, they'd have 40 weapon skills which would be obviously overpowered.

WoW - Mists Of Pandaria release date (2)

yodleboy (982200) | more than 2 years ago | (#40478631)

What do you want to bet the long awaited release date for WoW: Mists Of Pandaria is announced in the next week? Wouldn't be surprised if it ends up being pretty close to the GW2 date.

Re:WoW - Mists Of Pandaria release date (1)

splutty (43475) | more than 2 years ago | (#40478715)

Most pre-order companies put it middle of September, so that seems a fairly reasonable bet.

Re:WoW - Mists Of Pandaria release date (1)

Sir_Sri (199544) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479271)

They're just starting into raid testing. So probably september/october range. They probably want to get it out before the christmas rush (which would cannibalize other activision product sales). Which sounds out of place in the games business, but WoW lives in its own ecosystem within the games business.

Fun and polished game (4, Informative)

Necroman (61604) | more than 2 years ago | (#40478687)

I started seeing excitement about this late 2011, as Guild Wars 2 started to do its road show, demoing it at various conferences. There was a lot of hype behind GW2, but when they did their first Beta Weekend Event, it really blew me away.

ArenaNet was smart and didn't show the game off to people (in beta form) until they felt it was really ready to show to the public. Their beta wasn't a place to test it while it was still alpha quality. Their beta events were there for people to experience the game, stress the servers, and test some of the more detailed mechanics that needed work.

Even in the beta events, it's a well polished game with very few rough edges. All the classes feel unique, and have a lot of different play styles available to them (depending on how you equip/spec your character). It's really hard to describe a large MMO in just a few words (as there is so much content), but it is really worth giving it a try if you like MMOs.

The biggest selling point that I've been using with friends is how they split up PvP. In the PvE (player vs environment/enemies), there is no fighting other players (pvp, player vs player). When I run around the PvE world, it is really one of the first games where I will help out random people. They did a great job to guide you into helping others. It really helps build a feeling of community within the PvE adventure.

For PvP, it's all in an instanced area. So you never fight against people in the PvE world. They have 2 PvP modes. One is a battleground style PvP (much like they have in World of Warcraft with battlegrounds). These are quite fun. But then they have a persistant PvP zone (a massive zone at that), where 3 servers fight against each other for control of the areas. For people that played DAoC (dark age of Camelot), it feels much like the RvR in that.

The story and lore of the universe is quite fun (I started reading up on GW1 lore, it's a pretty decent fantasy story). But it doesn't get too much in the way for people that don't want to take part in it.

Re:Fun and polished game (3, Interesting)

samazon (2601193) | more than 2 years ago | (#40478943)

I agree with all of the above except... the biggest selling point for me was the free-to-play.

I was/am in the Secret World's closed beta (NDA was just lifted this week :D) and had waited for the game for months, practically peed on myself when I got into CB, and really enjoy the game. But I only JUST this week actually ordered the game, while I ordered GW2 before playing it at all (played the last beta weekend, found it more than a little enjoyable) - and it was because I'm happy to pay $60 to get a game that I might play for 10 hours (I suspect GW2 will surpass Civ by the end of the year in hours played, and I've got a little over 300 into that) but I'm less likely to BUY a game and also pay another $15 a month for access (as with TSW) even if it's a game I KNOW I enjoy and have waited for. Maybe that's a little silly, but the monthly fee (which, granted, is only equivalent to an hour in my paycheck) is still a sticking point, less because of the payment and more because it's yet another thing to worry/think/check my bank account over.

Re:Fun and polished game (1)

kungfugleek (1314949) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479385)

the biggest selling point for me was the free-to-play.

This. Especially considering the huge amount of money and talent they put into it. You would not expect this level of quality out of a free-to-play game.

Re:Fun and polished game (2)

Rilian (137677) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479705)

I've had preorders of both Guild Wars 2 and Secret World, and have just cancelled the TSW order and will be buying more family copies of Guild Wars.

The world, story and especially fantastic writing for NPCs seem to put TSW ahead, but the gameplay mechanics are so frustrating that I had no enthusiasm for logging on any more. It would work well as a single-player RPG but the game mechanics and monthly fee limit its appeal in its current form.

Re:Fun and polished game (1)

VGPowerlord (621254) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479135)

When I run around the PvE world, it is really one of the first games where I will help out random people.

So, they got rid of the instanced world in Guild Wars 2? Or by "run around the PvE world" did you actually mean "when I stop back at town for some reason"?

Re:Fun and polished game (1)

SuricouRaven (1897204) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479217)

GW1 keeps getting mislabeled as an MMORPG. I think it deserves the G, but none of the other letters. It isn't massive, multiplayer is optional, online is barely noticed, the RP doesn't really exist... but it is, if nothing else, at least a game.

Re:Fun and polished game (1)

0123456 (636235) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479351)

GW1 isn't massive? I've played on and off since the Beta and I still haven't visited all the zones.

Re:Fun and polished game (1)

SuricouRaven (1897204) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479483)

While it may be big, it can't be big concurrently. You don't get a continuous world with tens of thousands of players. You get little instanced pockets with maybe five friends, but no chance of running into anyone else unexpectedly. At most you might get a little arena level with people on for an agreed upon fight - but where's the real run of the MM in MMORPG? The part where you can get ambushed while traveling by a player you didn't even realise was there, or lay in ambush yourself for some unsuspecting victim? There is no player-on-player interaction anywhere in GW1 except via mutual consent, so you just don't get the same big-community social dynamic.

Re:Fun and polished game (1)

0123456 (636235) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479587)

That's because only twelve year olds think that ambushing and massacring players twenty levels lower than you is fun.

Re:Fun and polished game (1)

Rolgar (556636) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479555)

The MM in the acronym MMORPG refers to Massively Multiplayer. The massively refers not to the size of the world, but the size of multiplayer, as opposed to a game like those in the Battlefield series, where a battle has a limit of fewer than a couple hundred players in a battle. The size of the world only needs to be massive in order to fit the number players.

Re:Fun and polished game (1)

0123456 (636235) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479797)

So Everquest isn't 'Massively Multiplayer' because I've never seen more than about 250 people in a zone?

Re:Fun and polished game (1)

0123456 (636235) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479417)

So, they got rid of the instanced world in Guild Wars 2?

I believe it's still instanced, but most instances hold far more people and you don't need to be grouped. In the Beta I was certainly in events with 30-40 other players in one small location in a zone when the event started as I was randomly running around.

Re:Fun and polished game (1)

tycoex (1832784) | more than 2 years ago | (#40481029)

Sort of. It's an actual persistent world now, just like other mmos.

The world is broken up into zones, like the continents in WoW (only not quite as big); but for pretty much all purposes you will actually notice in playing, it's fully persistent.

Re:Fun and polished game (2)

jabelli (1144769) | more than 2 years ago | (#40481997)

Instances are limited to some dungeons, personal story, and overflow. "Overflow" means that when there are too many people in the area, instead of making everyone else that wants to go there on that server sit in a queue watching a timer, a new copy of the zone is spawned, they're put in the overflow, and can move to the "real" zone as space is available, or just stay in the overflow.

Now we know why the world ends in 2012 (1)

Kalendraf (830012) | more than 2 years ago | (#40478757)

After Guild Wars 2 releases, the fun and addictive gameplay will lead people to quit working, eating and sleeping in order to play it.

At least we'll die having fun.

shadow boxing didn't annoy them? (2)

Shivetya (243324) | more than 2 years ago | (#40478817)

Perhaps my biggest annoyance with the game so far is combat. In so much as your attacks will execute, animations and all, even when your not in range of your target. This leads to it looking like shadow boxing.

Shadow boxing is that old nemesis of immersion, it is when your and your opponents moves do not synch up. When neither seems to respond to the other. WOW for all its faults does not suffer this.

Another combat issue is their world and event bosses then to be zerg fests. Its fun once or twice but after awhile your buried under rendered effects without any real organization. I am sure groups will eventually organize for these but with the come one come all its not bound to be anything but the zerg fest.

The abilities system where each weapon provides different abilities will lose its luster once the players settle on whats best and there is always a whats best is such flexible games.

So a very pretty world with a great new take on cut scenes art and distance drawing. The voice acted dialog is very stiff and cheesy for the most part, again the actors don't seem to be talking to each other - they instead are talking to a fixed point in the distance. Gee, just like combat.

I haven't found an open world with this ease of traveling that looked fun to just explore since Asheron's Call.

Re:shadow boxing didn't annoy them? (5, Informative)

RivenAleem (1590553) | more than 2 years ago | (#40478999)

Shadow boxing is that old nemesis of immersion, it is when your and your opponents moves do not synch up. When neither seems to respond to the other. WOW for all its faults does not suffer this.

I'm sorry, but WHAT?

The amount of times I've fought a dragon, or Ragnaros, in WoW and been hitting some piece of space between a circle drawn on the gound and the polygons of the creature I'm fighting are too numerous to count. How often have you heard "The boss has a huge hitbox" in WoW?

Have a look at This Youtube video I made [youtube.com] and you can see the 2 most annoying things I ever faced in the game. 1) My character being INSIDE the boss and 2) My character hitting the boss from a distance greater than the length of my weapons.

WoW doesn't have shadowboxing? Don't make me laugh.

Re:shadow boxing didn't annoy them? (1)

neminem (561346) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479259)

Mod parent up a lot. Back when I used to play WoW (and such a great feeling, being able to say that), and more precisely, back pre-Cataclysm when my main was a rogue, that was often the toughest part of boss fights, figuring out where the enormous boss's hitboxen were, so I could melee it appropriately. It wasn't always where you would expect it to be. Stabbing the air a couple feet in front of a dragon in order to hit it was always fun.

Now I'm free! Free from MMOs! (Every once in a while I feel a momentary desire to try Eve, but so not doing it. Freedom!)

Re:shadow boxing didn't annoy them? (1)

kcbnac (854015) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479729)

Want EVE, but single player? Check out the X-Series. Very similar, AND moddable. Some of them available for Linux too - check the developer's site's store for those.

http://store.steampowered.com/search/?developer=Egosoft [steampowered.com]
http://www.egosoft.com/ [egosoft.com]

Re:shadow boxing didn't annoy them? (1)

neminem (561346) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479967)

Heh. While neat to know, most of the draw of Eve for me is that I hear frequently about how it implements massively-pvp mechanics particularly well. I'm not usually into pvp, so it would be a novel thing for me. Can't really get that in a single-player game.

Re:shadow boxing didn't annoy them? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40479073)

+1 for mentioning Asheron's Call (not the defunct sequel)! I was a diehard PK-Only player (Darktide was/is AC's 'dedicated' PvP server).

If anyone is looking for a good PvP MMORPG they might consider trying DarkFall Online. It was designed and programmed by former members of the Black Rose Noble guild from AC's Darktide server.

Re:shadow boxing didn't annoy them? (1)

tycoex (1832784) | more than 2 years ago | (#40481095)

The fact that you can activate skills without a target is actually one of the biggest selling points. It makes the game feature more "action-like" combat rather than standard fare turn-based mmo combat.

And honestly, I don't see how this would affect immersion negatively. What's less realistic, being able to shoot your gun, regardless of whether it hits anyone or not, or your gun telling you that you're out of range if you try to shoot it from too far away?

Endgame (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40478869)

Ok, GW2 is innovative, everyone says its fun and shine. But what do I have to do once I am level 80?

Can someone explain that to me? Once you hit 80 it becames WoW/SWTOR/RIFT/Whatever that the only thing you can do is PvP/PvE?

Re:Endgame (1)

Moonrazor (897598) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479181)

One word: Titles. It's not about the character level in GW2, it's about getting all the titles. Of course once you've done that, then yeah, it's just like any other game you've ever completed. Everything comes to an end at some point.

Re:Endgame (3, Interesting)

michal (94596) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479301)

Endgame starts at level 1. You are scaled down to whatever content level you are doing so it is always challenging. Unlike other mmo's where people rushing to end level to start playing, gw2 level 1-80 content is not designed as a filler.

Re:Endgame (1)

Shados (741919) | more than 2 years ago | (#40482045)

The one thing i'm scared of is that the content that is similar-ish to what more typical MMOs in the last few years offered (the dungeons) are designed for specific levels. You can overlevel them and get scaled down, but you don't get scaled up and can't really participate until you are of that level. And when you hear that the big bad Elder Dragon boss that will be available at launch is in the highest level dungeon, that will require you to be 70+, a lot of people will get the wrong idea, rush to max level, do the dungeon, and whine "Ok now what?", having missed all the earlier content.

And while the game is designed so you can just go back, they won't, and the forums will be filled with whiners. Hopefully Arenanet doesn't cave in after that.

Re:Endgame (1)

0123456 (636235) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479339)

I don't know about Guild Wars 2, but in Guild Wars 1 about 75% of the content was designed for max level players; leveling there was just a tutorial, not a grind.

As someone else mentioned, in GW2 you also effectively 'delevel' when going to low-level zones so you can still go back and do old stuff that you missed while leveling without it being too easy. They do still need to fine-tune that code though as I sometimes found I was fighting mobs several levels higher than my effective level even though my real level was much higher than the mobs.

Re:Endgame (2)

Tarkhein (2007710) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479723)

They do still need to fine-tune that code though as I sometimes found I was fighting mobs several levels higher than my effective level even though my real level was much higher than the mobs.

They really don't. Most enemies are at or higher than your effective level and it's supposed to be like that. This becomes an issue when you are soloing and can't kill them fast enough before respawning becomes an issue. But if you want to solo, you really need to pick a damage class instead of a support class. That said, what they need to do is prevent enemies from 'crossing' their intended zone.

Downscaled to level 5, I faced a level 7 veteran which is possible, with some difficulty. Retreating to get more ground and give time to recharge skills, I crossed a region boundary, downscaling me to level 3, and the veteran one-shotted me when it caught up. To add insult to injury, the enemy was a pig.

Re:Endgame (1)

0123456 (636235) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479771)

In my case, I think I was down-leveled to 5, was fighting level 7 mobs, then as soon as I went past them I leveled up to 7 and started fighting their level 7 friends. That's silly.

Ummm...no (0)

Impy the Impiuos Imp (442658) | more than 2 years ago | (#40478995)

He writes, "Here's what would have gone through your mind if you were a monster in my way..."

No. Here's what: "Why am I so weak, slow, and stupid? Why do I attack once per 10 seconds? Why am I attacking a guy with metal armor who stuck out his tongue but holds a wiffle bat when there's this naked guy who holds a flamethrower right there burning me? And why did I put a lizard gizzard in my pocker?"

Well, Damn. (1)

CanHasDIY (1672858) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479001)

Not usually an MMO kind of guy, but the more I read about GW2, the more I think I actually have cause to finally upgrade/replace my 4 year old gaming rig... funding, however, is a different matter.

Speaking of which, anybody want to buy some blood? Like, lots of it?

Re:Well, Damn. (1)

0123456 (636235) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479033)

It's quite fun and plays fine on my two year old laptop so a four year old desktop would probably handle it. The minimum requirements aren't particularly high.

Fortunately it now looks like it will be released when I'm not on a business trip so I can actually get my old character names :).

Re:Well, Damn. (1)

CanHasDIY (1672858) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479525)

System req's, per GW2 FAQ:

Windows® XP Service Pack 2 or better Intel® Core 2 Duo 2.0 GHz, Core i3, AMD Athlon 64 X2, or better 2 GB RAM NVIDIA® GeForce® 7800, ATI X1800, Intel HD 3000, or better (256MB of video RAM and shader model 3.0 or better) 25 GB available HDD space Broadband Internet connection Keyboard and mouse Note: Due to potential changes, system requirements may change over time and you may be required to upgrade your current system (or obtain a new system) to continue to play the game.

Emphasis mine. So, at the outset it should easily play on my older rig (and my antiquated lappy too, hooray!), but judging from the note at the end, I may not be able to play it forever without upgrading my equipment...

Not really sure how I feel about that statement... Buy a game today, have to spend boo-koo bucks rebuilding my machine just to keep playing it? Something tells me that dog won't hunt.

Re:Well, Damn. (1)

0123456 (636235) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479563)

That's the norm with MMOGs. Graphics engines get upgraded and old machines won't play it.

Everquest, for example, is on its second or third graphics engine. I believe they also dropped Win 9x support a few years ago.

Re:Well, Damn. (1)

CanHasDIY (1672858) | more than 2 years ago | (#40484845)

That's the norm with MMOGs. Graphics engines get upgraded and old machines won't play it.

Everquest, for example, is on its second or third graphics engine. I believe they also dropped Win 9x support a few years ago.

Explains why I'm not an MMO kind of guy... well, that and monthly subscription fees, endless grinding, repetitive gameplay, hobbies that involve sunlight...

Re:Well, Damn. (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40485223)

Then you'll like GW2, as there's no monthly fee and therefore there's no incentive to force people to grind.

Re:Well, Damn. (3, Informative)

Kalendraf (830012) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479085)

A 4-year-old gaming rig should be able to handle it, but maybe not on the highest graphical settings. It plays pretty well on my 5-year-old laptop with the graphics set on low to medium.

Best game ever! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40479017)

I hope it breaks every sales record.

Another awesome ARPG (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40479019)

Another awesome ARPG game that blows Diablo 3 out of the water and is about to come out to open beta in 2 months is Path of Exile.
It's a dark ARPG that's going to be F2P. Check it out it's the best game I've played since I was addicted to Diablo 2 years ago.
www.pathofexile.com

It's going to have dueling, cut throat mode and it's actually HARD! unlike most games that cater to the masses now.

Good primer for Guild Wars 2 (4, Informative)

michal (94596) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479059)

If you want read good primer on Guild Wars 2, I would recommend checking this page: http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/1058358-Guild-Wars-2-Mass-info-for-the-uninitiated-READ-ME [mmo-champion.com] !

Re:Good primer for Guild Wars 2 (1)

beerdragoon (1142579) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479207)

...or just play the original Guild Wars. It's only 30 bucks for the 3 games (Original, Factions, Nightfall) and the Expansion (Eye of the North). Of course the second game plays nothing like the first, but it will give you a good background of the story and background of Tyria.

SWTOR spoiled me rotten (2)

rodrigoandrade (713371) | more than 2 years ago | (#40479757)

Does GW2 have 100% spoken dialogs?

Ever since I played SWTOR, I no longer care for a story that's presented in text form (like most current MMOs and computer RPGs from the 80s/90s. Between countless hours of Mass Effect 3 (when my wifi didn't wanna play nice) and SWTOR, no matter how good the story is, I just don't care if it isn't 100% spoken dialog (hello, Dragon Age).

If I want to read a great story, I'll grab a book. I own over 20 dead-tree books that I man to start reading eventually (not to mention over 100 e-books), and my eyes can definitely use some time away from the PC screen after a full workday.

So, unless an MMO wants to become the next Korean fetching grindfest (hello, Tera Online) my next MMO will need to have spoken dialog to draw me in. Sorry, SWTOR may have been a lame WoW clone after all is said and done, but it pushed the envelope in MMO storytelling, a new bechmark by which all future MMOs will be measured.

Re:SWTOR spoiled me rotten (2)

McDee (105077) | more than 2 years ago | (#40480609)

Does GW2 have 100% spoken dialogs?

Nope, although in general there is a lot less speaking going on as you don't need the lengthy exposition to understand what's going on. You *see* what's happening, and so it all flows a lot more naturally than the "Here's my problem: go solve it for me by picking up 10 items/killing 10 creatures" that most MMORPGs provide.

Oh, and if you managed to reach end-game in SWTOR then GW2 will be a revelation. Big world Vs. world battles with 100+ players on-screen and no noticeable lag during the last beta event. If PvP is your thing, especially large-scale PvP, then GW2 is definitely worth a look.

Re:SWTOR spoiled me rotten (3, Informative)

Gaygirlie (1657131) | more than 2 years ago | (#40480671)

Does GW2 have 100% spoken dialogs?

No. The usual NPC chatter is mostly text-only, but all the story-mode chatter on the other hand is fully voiced. Ergo, you probably wouldn't be entirely satisfied, if you really are as picky about it as you claim. I hope this answers your question to your satisfaction.

Re:SWTOR spoiled me rotten (4, Informative)

Shados (741919) | more than 2 years ago | (#40481329)

GW2's story telling is far better, with choices during your story quest that actually change the quest in a meaningful way (so 2 people of the same class/race who made the same choices during character creation, can still end up with a different main quest).

As for the dialogue? GW2 has about the same percentage of REAL spoken dialog as SWTOR did. SWTOR just "cheated", and reused a ton of lines, and used alien dialog for the rest. That ended up being pretty annoying after the 15th time in a row you hear "The jedi way is to serve!" and "Dying wasn't in my agenda for today!" (the further in the game you got, the worse it got). In GW2 that stuff is text based. Still, the majority of the story driven content is spoken dialog, in about the same ratio.

Re:SWTOR spoiled me rotten (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40483377)

There's an absolute ton of voices though. Especially random characters in cities etc and enemies will say their lines but if you do chat with an npc they'll generally have mostly text. All the story stuff is voiced, but note every line of every random npc.

Re:SWTOR spoiled me rotten (1)

Greyfox (87712) | more than 2 years ago | (#40483589)

Grinding in Tera actually seems pretty fun, due to its combat system. Minions were actually trying to flank me the other day. The writing is atrocious, though.

They just need to put THAT combat system in SWTOR. Well that and arms flying off when you hit a guy with a light saber. We learned how light sabers should work in the first movie, and it's not how they work in SWTOR.

Open beta? (1)

antdude (79039) | more than 2 years ago | (#40483793)

Will there be an open beta for us to try it?

Just another... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40483853)

company not listening to advice from gamers who test their game. All the problems with GW2 are things that gamers would WANT in the game.

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