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BitTorrent Usage Increases In Europe, Following the Pirate Bay Blockade

samzenpus posted more than 2 years ago | from the I-didn't-want-to-until-you-told-me-I-couldn't dept.

Piracy 272

MrSeb writes "In a twist that will surprise no one except the RIAA, MPAA, BREIN, and other anti-piracy lobbies, the amount of BitTorrent traffic has stayed the same or increased in Europe following the blockade of The Pirate Bay in the UK, Netherlands, and other countries. This news comes from XS4All, one of the largest European ISPs, which has published a graph of the network traffic associated with the BitTorrent protocol — and sure enough, since the Dutch Pirate Bay blockade began in February 2012, traffic has stayed the same or increased slightly. There are probably a few reasons for this: a) The European blockades created a lot of publicity (and no publicity is bad publicity); b) TPB isn't the only torrent site out there, and many of its torrents are available elsewhere; and c) Internet denizens are a lot more savvy (proxies, VPNs, etc.) than the MPAA and co give them credit for."

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first (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40561573)

Well duh!

CUZ MOTHERFUCKERS WILL STEAL NO MATTER WHAT !! (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40561587)

It's true !!

Because some people will copy data no matter what. (4, Insightful)

rainmouse (1784278) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561615)

There I fixed it for you.

Re:CUZ MOTHERFUCKERS WILL STEAL NO MATTER WHAT !! (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40561641)

I am not stealing, I am downloading. I have ZERO intention of purchasing most of the products I download but I do purchase some of the good ones.
IF they ever come up with the perfect DRM then I will stop downloading BUT I will not start purchasing their shit. I'll simply look for other forms of entertainment.

So have I have not stolen anything.

Re:CUZ MOTHERFUCKERS WILL STEAL NO MATTER WHAT !! (-1, Troll)

beelsebob (529313) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561717)

I wish there was a score -1: Idiot, rating.

Your argument is akin to "I had no intention of every paying for that Ferrari, therefore I didn't steal it when I drove it flat out through the window of the show room and parked it in my garage, if they ever come up with the perfect engine immobiliser, I would stop taking the cars out of the show rooms, but I wouldn't start paying for them"

Re:CUZ MOTHERFUCKERS WILL STEAL NO MATTER WHAT !! (4, Insightful)

KiloByte (825081) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561763)

Not sure if you're trolling or indeed buy that "piracy=theft" argument. Let me explain it to you again: for theft to happen, the original owner would need to be deprived of the object stolen.

It's like in that "would you download a loaf of bread" argument. Of course I would, and if replicating bread would be cheaper than baking it (and kept the quality, like copying does), the society as a whole wins big time. Arguing that "but the bakers lose" is precisely glasser's fallacy.

Re:CUZ MOTHERFUCKERS WILL STEAL NO MATTER WHAT !! (-1, Troll)

jones_supa (887896) | more than 2 years ago | (#40562191)

But just to take that argument a little further, next you have to remember that each copy still has some kind of value. Even if you steal an album from the record store, only small amount of it's price is in making the physical disc, while the lion's share comes from paying the artists, record companies, music producers, etc.

If most copies of the disc are warezed, I believe the actual value of that piece of art suffers of some kind of inflation and, ultimately it's something not worth investing in anymore by the producers. The actual $ price of the album is just some value that tries to match that "virtual" value of the album.

Re:CUZ MOTHERFUCKERS WILL STEAL NO MATTER WHAT !! (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40562225)

Noone argues that. Point is that THEFT Has a fixed definition. Talk of Fraud, betraying someone for his gain. Point is - he still has the original, and THEFT is defined as removing property from someone.

Re:CUZ MOTHERFUCKERS WILL STEAL NO MATTER WHAT !! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40562197)

for theft to happen, the original owner would need to be deprived of the object stolen

So you cannot steal ideas?
You cannot steal GPL'd code either?

Re:CUZ MOTHERFUCKERS WILL STEAL NO MATTER WHAT !! (0)

Gaygirlie (1657131) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561769)

Your analogy is really poor. If you take a Ferrari then the person who owns the Ferrari doesn't have it anymore. If you on the other hand take a digital copy of software then the original creator still has it, too. With that in mind: if a person downloads a copy of something and never has any intention for paying for it, even if it was unavailable via piracy, then how has anything been lost?

Re:CUZ MOTHERFUCKERS WILL STEAL NO MATTER WHAT !! (4, Insightful)

tofarr (2467788) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561875)

Something has been lost because the value of the original has been reduced. Much of the value of real world items is based on the perception that they have value. My first boss used to say "If you give something away for free, people will esteem it as worthless". Most people who say "I do not pay because it is not worth it", merely say that because they are used to getting it for free.

Re:CUZ MOTHERFUCKERS WILL STEAL NO MATTER WHAT !! (2)

Gaygirlie (1657131) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561915)

Something has been lost because the value of the original has been reduced.

If the person wouldn't be paying for it anyways then that person views its monetary value already at zero, therefore its value cannot be reduced any further anyways.

Re:CUZ MOTHERFUCKERS WILL STEAL NO MATTER WHAT !! (2, Insightful)

heathen_01 (1191043) | more than 2 years ago | (#40562015)

If something you own now has less value because somebody else now has the same item, I would suggest that your initial calculation of value is flawed and of no use to society.

Re:CUZ MOTHERFUCKERS WILL STEAL NO MATTER WHAT !! (2)

realityimpaired (1668397) | more than 2 years ago | (#40562067)

Most people who say "I do not pay because it is not worth it", merely say that because they are used to getting it for free.

No.... I do not pay for modern recordings, because they really aren't worth it. [wikipedia.org] Modern recordings sound like shit. If I can't get 'em for free, I'll stick with radio. Until the recording industry pulls their heads out of their collective asses, however, I'm not going to spend money on a recording that was engineered at the behest of a moron. As they're "remastering" old recordings and rereleasing them with this crap, it means that I have probably already bought my last CD ever from mainstream producers. (there are still indy producers who know what music is supposed to sound like, and I do still buy discs from them).

Re:CUZ MOTHERFUCKERS WILL STEAL NO MATTER WHAT !! (1)

jones_supa (887896) | more than 2 years ago | (#40562205)

This one of the main reasons I have mostly stopped both buying and pirating music.

Re:CUZ MOTHERFUCKERS WILL STEAL NO MATTER WHAT !! (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40562165)

Most people don't want free. Research has already been done on this topic. People want "fair". When given the choice between free and fair, most people choose fair.

Re:CUZ MOTHERFUCKERS WILL STEAL NO MATTER WHAT !! (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40561795)

Copying copyrighted data is not theft but counterfeiting.
So your metaphor would be exact if you build a car in your garage, using the same design and colors than a ferrari.

Re:CUZ MOTHERFUCKERS WILL STEAL NO MATTER WHAT !! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40562203)

Counterfeiting only applies if you try to sell said item or use it as part of a transaction. It's not counterfeiting if it's for personal use.

Re:CUZ MOTHERFUCKERS WILL STEAL NO MATTER WHAT !! (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40561799)

You should apply the rating to yourself - copyright infringement and theft are fundamentally different. A theft deprives the original owner of the item being stolen. Copyright infringement duplicates it.

The RIAA, MPAA et al. have been trying to redefine copyright infringement as theft (and even respelling it as copyright theft, which is something else entirely again) for years - those pre-show bits on DVDs covered in "You wouldn't steal a bag/car/phone" messages - but the plain fact of the matter is, it's not stealing and never will be. By definition, copyright infringement is a far less serious crime than theft. End of argument.

Re:CUZ MOTHERFUCKERS WILL STEAL NO MATTER WHAT !! (1, Flamebait)

TapeCutter (624760) | more than 2 years ago | (#40562037)

There's nothing illegal about DOWNLOADING a copyrighted file, if there was then the intenet itself would be illegal since every html, video, audio, etc, file ever created is automatically copyrighted at the time of creation. How it wound up being avaiable for download on the internet is not the downloader's problem, legally or morally.

OTOH: From your id and the use of a combination car / broken window analogy, I suspect you already know this and are just another unimaginative troll.

Re:CUZ MOTHERFUCKERS WILL STEAL NO MATTER WHAT !! (4, Insightful)

ZeroSumHappiness (1710320) | more than 2 years ago | (#40562097)

Not quite. There's nothing illegal about downloading a copyrighted file that is being distributed according to whatever terms the author has set. In the vast majority of cases the author is allowing distribution for consumption through a web browser. The author is not, however, giving up all rights to the copyrighted work. The most common case where this is fought is when images are illegally used. Furthermore, in US law, at least, it /is/ the downloader's problem if he downloads copyrighted works outside of legitimate distribution.

I am not endorsing the current state of affairs, just reporting them.

Re:CUZ MOTHERFUCKERS WILL STEAL NO MATTER WHAT !! (1)

Sique (173459) | more than 2 years ago | (#40562101)

One could go and really define copyright priviledges as property. But then all the property rules arise. If the sale of a copy does not move the property rights to the buyer, then it's a rent with the payment upfront. It means that the owner of said copy, the copyright holder, has the full responsibility to make and keep the rented out property intact, including repair, replacement and administration, such as a landlord has. The renter then could even go and reduce the rent because of a reduced usability, if the copyright landlord doesn't fix the rented property. Imagine a world with no software maintenance contracts and an explicit right of software users to program fixes and updates!
I doubt many copyright holders would agree to those conditions.

Re:CUZ MOTHERFUCKERS WILL STEAL NO MATTER WHAT !! (0, Troll)

znrt (2424692) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561735)

so what?
i download everything i want (which is not much, but is just what i happen to want).

i will never, ever, buy another book, game, dvd, whatever. it's years already since i haven't, and i will not do it again until this retarded, obnoxious swindle and mass idiocy about IP is out of the picture. not a single dime.

got it?
now you may keep calling it stealing if you so wish. you can also suck my dick. enjoy :-)

Re:CUZ MOTHERFUCKERS WILL STEAL NO MATTER WHAT !! (4, Insightful)

Sneeka2 (782894) | more than 2 years ago | (#40562019)

Only on Slashdot can such a comment be modded Insightful.

We get that the current system is not perfect. But publicly declaring that you're not going to pay for anything anymore while obviously still expecting to get all the latest new stuff... how is that fair to anyone, especially the creators of the stuff you're consuming?

I for my part am simply more selective about who I'm giving my money. And if I decide I do not want to fork over money for something, I may simply not consume it. If you want something to change, vote with your attention. Otherwise it's no wonder this is turning into a war.

Re:CUZ MOTHERFUCKERS WILL STEAL NO MATTER WHAT !! (2)

Krneki (1192201) | more than 2 years ago | (#40562073)

No, it's right that we see what happens, rather then closing our eye and screaming hopping that the problem* will go away. The whole IP scene must evolve, the money is there if the service provide more to the user. *I don't think this is a problem at all, it's just a problem for distribution companies, and I hope they all die in pain.

Re:CUZ MOTHERFUCKERS WILL STEAL NO MATTER WHAT !! (2)

TapeCutter (624760) | more than 2 years ago | (#40562099)

Meh - I'm happy to fork out $80 for Attenbourough's "Planet Earth" box set, it's much more effective to use your dollar to change the market rather than pretend it doesn't exist.

Re:CUZ MOTHERFUCKERS WILL STEAL NO MATTER WHAT !! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40562151)

I think we'll just call you an asshole.

Re:CUZ MOTHERFUCKERS WILL STEAL NO MATTER WHAT !! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40561779)

Not if you cut off their hands. Works for the Taliban. What'll they jerk off with then?

Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (5, Insightful)

Idimmu Xul (204345) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561599)

An equal hypothesis could be, everyone has stopped downloading files from the pirate bay and with all the free time they have now they are unable to watch movies, the are now committed WoW or D3 players, or whatever other games use Bittorrent as a patch delivery mechanism.

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40561613)

Maybe if the story was - Tuesday BitTorrent Usage Increases In Europe, Following the Pirate Bay Blockade

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (1, Troll)

Serious Sandwich (2678177) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561631)

An equal hypothesis could be, everyone has stopped downloading files from the pirate bay and with all the free time they have now they are unable to watch movies, the are now committed WoW or D3 players, or whatever other games use Bittorrent as a patch delivery mechanism.

This really sounds like you think sitting at computer is the only thing to do in the world.

But yesterday I went out and there was lots of beautiful and cute girls and people spending time outside in the summer. Amazing, I know. But the best thing - and let me tell she was so cute - was one girl who sat down to draw what she saw when people walked past her. I smiled at her. Should had said hello. Amazing.

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40561643)

Do you have a link for that torrent, it sounds amazing

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40561873)

Where can I get crack? Reply soon, or i report whole thing as dead link.

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40561955)

An equal hypothesis could be, everyone has stopped downloading files from the pirate bay and with all the free time they have now they are unable to watch movies, the are now committed WoW or D3 players, or whatever other games use Bittorrent as a patch delivery mechanism.

This really sounds like you think sitting at computer is the only thing to do in the world.

But yesterday I went out and there was lots of beautiful and cute girls and people spending time outside in the summer. Amazing, I know. But the best thing - and let me tell she was so cute - was one girl who sat down to draw what she saw when people walked past her. I smiled at her. Should had said hello. Amazing

Do you have a link for that torrent, it sounds amazing

So... You have just discovered that there are two disinct types of human, males AND females. Congratulations! You should read this article before downloading that torrent:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woman [wikipedia.org]

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40561691)

> This really sounds like you think sitting at computer is the only thing to do in the world.

No, it does not.
"with all the free time they have now they are unable to watch movies" != "with all the free time they have"
Let's suppose he has 6 hours a day free, spends 3 hours out and 3 hours watching movies. Now when he can't watch movies, he spends the free 3 hours to play games. This is what his post says.

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (4, Funny)

DangerFace (1315417) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561695)

Yup, grinning at cute girls will really make that BitTorrent traffic spike, let me tell you. This one time I managed to max out my download cap, just from a few gigs of porn, and I'm pretty sure they don't count it if it turns out the chick's a fuggnaut. And since we're just spouting random offtopic anecdotes, yesterday I went past this bakery and they had these donuts - let me tell you they smelled amazing - I smiled at them. Should have bought one. Amazing.

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (2)

Serious Sandwich (2678177) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561803)

yesterday I went past this bakery and they had these donuts - let me tell you they smelled amazing - I smiled at them. Should have bought one. Amazing.

You went to bakery and bought donuts? Why in the world? There's tons of nice stuff in bakeries - and you buy donuts!

Have a look:
http://www.swedishbakery.com/site/epage/133153_222.htm [swedishbakery.com]
http://www.swedishbakery.com/site/largepics/222/133153/443788/608708/Cherry_Boat.JPG [swedishbakery.com]
http://www.swedishbakery.com/site/largepics/222/133153/443788/608709/Apple_Turnover.JPG [swedishbakery.com]
http://www.swedishbakery.com/site/largepics/222/27316/336857/527255/Biskvier.jpg [swedishbakery.com]
http://www.swedishbakery.com/site/largepics/222/27316/336857/527281/Chocolate_Almond_Truffle.jpg [swedishbakery.com]

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (4, Insightful)

hairyfeet (841228) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561931)

As hot as its been across most of the USA you are looking at...pastries? Bah, get you a nice ice cold watermelon! Its sweet and good for you as well, and nothing helps beat the heat like a nice cold slice of watermelon!

As for TFA? sigh, *.A.As are clueless greedy douchebags, film at 11. Seriously there was piracy since the days of the BBS, trying to win with the stick will NEVER work because the geeks are all smarter than the greedy douchebags. No the way you "beat" piracy is to give them MORE for their money so pirated frankly becomes not worth the effort.

Take Valve for example, they have crazy sales, take care of all the updates and MP, built in chat, I used to know tons of guys pirating games, now they are all on Steam. With Steam its just so damned easy and cheap there really isn't much of a point to pirate, not when there are literally hundreds of games on any day for under $10 a pop, I mean why bother? We humans are naturally lazy creatures, you make something cheap and easy enough we will take the easy path.

There is no damned reason why the movie and TV companies couldn't do the same damned thing except they are just too fucking greedy for their own good. What I want is bog standard DivX or H.264 MKVs so they'll play anywhere and be hardware accelerated on my netbook or run on my dad's Nbox and I want them at a decent price with specials just like you get on Steam.

Instead we get the choice of 1.-Buy DVD which depending on the show can be insane (anybody looked at what some of the Star trek series go for? Jesus tap dancing Christ!), 2.-wait for the discs to get here and hope the UPS monkeys don't use them for a tire chuck, 3.-Take the time and tie up our PCs ripping them into a format we can actually use, 4.- watch them. Or alternatively we can 1.-Go to TPB and download in the format we want, 2.-watch them.

Now which one of those sounds easier to you? Piracy is simply the market telling you UR DOIN IT WRONG and your prices are too high, you're not providing what the customer considers a good value, or you aren't offering the product the customer wants to buy, that's all. While they will never wipe out piracy they could sure as hell cut down a lot of it if they made things cheap and easy for the customers but their never ending greed and desire to squeeze every single penny they can get per sale simply won't let that happen, kinda like EA with Origin which is nothing but EA trying to force PC games to keep the higher prices of console games for as long as possible. Never underestimate the ability for corps to shoot themselves in the foot i suppose, as it does seem to be what they are good at.

They're talking about Europe not the USA. (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40561709)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-18722054

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (4, Insightful)

rufty_tufty (888596) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561727)

Speak for yourself.
Clearly you're not suffering an English summer. Unless you like your girls in wellies and somewhat damp - wait what did I just say - then inside watching movies is probably the best place to be.

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (0)

Serious Sandwich (2678177) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561809)

You're right, it's actually really nice and amazing here. It's so beautiful and hot now. And the girls don't wear those long black trousers anymore, they all wear so short jean shorts it's amazing. Everywhere and everybody. There's so many beautiful legs around. Amazing.

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (1)

ls671 (1122017) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561953)

Were you born or did you just get here on planet Earth somehow yesterday ?

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (4, Insightful)

ocularsinister (774024) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561771)

Summer? What is this 'summer' that you speak of?

We know of no such things in England!

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40561951)

Ha. To a Canadian, every day in England is like summer. And when you do have an occasional winter day, half the cars spin off the road and Heathrow shuts down for a few days due to a light snowfall that Canadian grandmothers still drive through to get to their evening bingo game. You guys don't know what winter really is, so don't try to tell me you don't have summer.

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (1)

miketheanimal (914328) | more than 2 years ago | (#40562207)

Met a Canadian once, he came over on Autumn (Fall) "You guys don't know what winter is", left in Spring "that was the coldest winter I've ever experienced". Because our weather is not as cold, we can manage with crappy houses with crappy insulation and crappy heating .... as he discovered!

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (4, Funny)

Xest (935314) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561995)

Pfft, this is summer.

Real Englishmen like me are stood outside right now having a BBQ in my shorts and t-shirt.

Sure it may be raining, sure we may even be currently having a months worth of rain in a day here quite literally.

But it's 18C out for crying out loud, that makes it summer in England, it's fucking BBQ weather. It's not that we don't get summer, it's just that they're rather wet.

Get your wellies on and get the barbie out because there's only one other type of weather we get in the UK than this not-quite-cold and rainy weather, and that's cold and rainy weather, so enjoy the not-quite-cold and rainy weather whilst it lasts!

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (1)

Muad'Dave (255648) | more than 2 years ago | (#40562107)

Please. Our high for today is forecast to be 103 F / 39.4 C with high humidity. Lately (here in Richmond VA) our LOWS have been higher than the highs in Portland, OR where my brother lives. He loves rubbing that in. At least I don't have moss growing on me.

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (1)

Xest (935314) | more than 2 years ago | (#40562219)

To be fair we do have places like that in the UK, but we have to pay for the privalage and call them saunas.

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (4, Funny)

Walterk (124748) | more than 2 years ago | (#40562081)

Don't be silly, we do have summer in England. Remember that hot and sunny day in May?

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (1)

Gaygirlie (1657131) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561823)

This really sounds like you think sitting at computer is the only thing to do in the world.

I don't understand what you're trying to insinuate. Could you elaborate?

But yesterday I went out and there was lots of beautiful and cute girls and people spending time outside in the summer. Amazing, I know. But the best thing - and let me tell she was so cute - was one girl who sat down to draw what she saw when people walked past her. I smiled at her. Should had said hello. Amazing.

Girls on a computer screen are so much better: they'll never start bitching over something ridiculous, they don't smell sweaty, they don't spend your money, they're accessible whenever you want them but they also won't ever bother you when you don't want to. This "summer" and "outside" thing really sounds very much an inferior experience.

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (1)

Serious Sandwich (2678177) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561833)

Girls on a computer screen are so much better: they'll never start bitching over something ridiculous, they don't smell sweaty, they don't spend your money, they're accessible whenever you want them but they also won't ever bother you when you don't want to. This "summer" and "outside" thing really sounds very much an inferior experience.

Said by a girl with an username 'gaygirlie'.

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (4, Funny)

Gaygirlie (1657131) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561871)

Girls on a computer screen are so much better: they'll never start bitching over something ridiculous, they don't smell sweaty, they don't spend your money, they're accessible whenever you want them but they also won't ever bother you when you don't want to. This "summer" and "outside" thing really sounds very much an inferior experience.

Said by a girl with an username 'gaygirlie'.

I don't see the problem.

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (1)

ls671 (1122017) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561961)

Me neither.

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40562095)

But yesterday I went out and there was lots of beautiful and cute girls and people spending time outside in the summer.

I would but it has been raining for most of the summer so far and there are virtually no cute girls. I guess that is another drawback of living in the UK.

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (1)

isorox (205688) | more than 2 years ago | (#40562105)

But yesterday I went out and there was lots of beautiful and cute girls and people spending time outside in the summer.

You obviously don't live in the southern hemisphere.

Or the UK.

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (4, Insightful)

sticks_us (150624) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561633)

Exactly.

bittorrent != 'piracy' [sic] ...but that's difficult to explain to some people.

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40562061)

To be honest, about 99% of bittorrent traffic is piracy.

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40562071)

But I bittorrent via satellite uplink from my commandeered oil tanker, you insensitive clod!

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (1)

Tastecicles (1153671) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561647)

World of Tanks (I forget who the publishers are) also uses BitTorrent as a PDM. It's arguably quicker than relying on one server for delivery of patches to several hundred or thousands of players at the same time, particularly given that more and more games these days are persistent worlds. A ban on the protocol will hurt the gaming industry more than any of us know - and it won't be a case of simply falling back to optical media, since persistent worlds demand several tens of Gigabytes of data. One-disc install-and-go games are a memory.

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (3, Insightful)

SuricouRaven (1897204) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561787)

It'd hurt the independant and small game publishers. Blizzard could afford to set up an international-scale CDN for their patches, WoT couldn't. The effect of banning bittorrent would be to once again tilt the industry in favor of the Big Players, where you can't compete without the resources of a developed studio or a large pile of money. Rather like how major toy manufacturers in the US lobbied for a tightening of health-and-safety certification requirements (Following the China lead paint scandal) - they knew the cost of having all their product lines tested would cost them, but they could afford ten thousand dollars or so per toy line. Their smaller competitors couldn't.

Re:Blizzard distributes patches via Bittorrent (1)

CastrTroy (595695) | more than 2 years ago | (#40562083)

If bittorrent was blocked, we'd all just go back to mirroring on smaller sites. For legal content such as Linux ISOs and game patches this would work just fine. I'm sure there's systems already in place to ensure that mirrors get new files promptly and that mirrors can add/remove themselves from the pool depending on how much bandwidth they want to donate. Wouldn't be as good as bittorrent, but a pretty good system could easily be built up around using HTTP as the main protocol. Taken to the next level, it wouldn't be that hard to implement bittorrent style downloading over http.

Piracy will never go away. (4, Interesting)

David_The_Expert (2563031) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561605)

Piracy will never go away. It's literally part of the market itself. No matter what kind of laws or restrictions they impose, people always find a way to share information. So it's not a force that's hurting the market, it's simply part of it. And if the copyright holders can just learn to use it to their advantage, it can be one of the most powerful forms of advertising online. It doesn't cost them any customers or money, it only provides new opportunities.

Re:Piracy will never go away. (4, Insightful)

Rik Sweeney (471717) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561811)

I agree with this completely. No matter how little you charge for something, some people will always pirate it. Hell, even if you give it away for free they'll still pirate it (if that makes sense).

What the MIAA needs to understand is that I want to be able to watch Game of Thrones at the same time as the US, without having to subscribe to 3 sports channels and 8 movie channels and I want to be able to download it from NetFlix, PSN, Love Film, Xbox etc.

I'm happy to rent the episode (as in, it expires after 24 hours), as long as it's reasonably priced (e.g. 1GBP for the SD version, 2GBP for the HD version.

They should just try it one day with something fairly popular just to see what happens.

Re:Piracy will never go away. (1)

heathen_01 (1191043) | more than 2 years ago | (#40562057)

How about being able to watch it on the device of my choice and without requiring a network connection (at least not at the time of viewing). Also 24 hours is probably not long enough.

Re:Piracy will never go away. (1)

LourensV (856614) | more than 2 years ago | (#40562131)

This same ISP offers HBO for €15 per month [xs4all.nl] as an add-on to their TV subscription, no other pay-TV channels required. There does appear to be a delay, but they're claiming it's often no more than a day.

Optimistic Statement (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40561619)

From TFA:

If it was easy to create an official, legal version of The Pirate Bay, then the entertainment industry would’ve done it already - they’re not that stupid.

What was it again that Einstein said?

Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former.

yep (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40561621)

Ever since they blocked The Pirate Bay I started using it. XS4ALL is my ISP and they will fight for my freedom to use it or not use it. So I stick with them. And lo and behold setting up a proxy is easy enough(Block google is probably much more effective) and yep of we go downloading stuff. Just to give a big fuck you to BREIN and Tim Kuik(leader of that bunch of nitwits).

The irony is is that I never downloaded anything that wasnt free(as in beer) over bittorent.

Well... duh (5, Insightful)

Opportunist (166417) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561667)

Let's ponder for a moment what happened most likely. Take Joe Randomcopier. He doesn't know jack about getting around DRM or how to "crack" software, all he actually does know is how to use a torrent program. And that he knows 'cause it's point-and-click, and no harder to use than any other user space program out there.

His access to torrents gets blocked in some way. Be it that the tracker becomes unreachable, be it that his ISP filters, be it whatever it may. What will Joe do? He doesn't have the tech knowledge to figure out a way around. What Joe does have, though, is the internet and access to its knowledge. Joe might not know much, but he does know that someone knows more than he does and that someone will publish the information he needs. And he knows how to use Google, Bing or whatever other search engine there might be out there. Even if Google, Bing or most other engines start blocking "such" information, Joe will by then have found a new engine that doesn't. How? By using the same venue of information gathering he uses now. No matter what information you try to block, it's a bit like fighting malware: You can only start fighting it once it is out there somewhere. And playing whack-a-mole has never really been a very efficient way to curb information distribution.

So Joe gets pointed to some board, some blog, some podcast, some youtube video that shows him in terms even Joe can reproduce how to get around this blockage. If everything fails, someone clever enough will come up with a new kind of torrent client that ignores said blocks, be it by redirecting the blocked accesses to trackers through proxies or by disguising the blocked protocols as HTTPS traffic. Joe doesn't and needn't know how it works. Joe just needs a pointer to the place where he can download that program or configuration. And those pointers he will get, no matter what you try to do.

So yes, the "average copyright infringer" doesn't know how to work around those blocks. But he doesn't have to. Just like the average game copier doesn't need to know how to crack copy protection. All it takes is one person smart enough to do it, the others can just copy his work.

Re:Well... duh (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40561701)

you forgot Joe's slightly geeky but knowledgeable friend/cousin/workmate, who "knows computers". regardless your point is valid, the information is out there and Joe has access to it.

Re:Well... duh (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40561731)

(...) others can just copy his work.

Isn't that, unless specified otherwise, copyright infringement on the way to infringe copyrights? Infringeception?

Re:Well... duh (1)

Gaygirlie (1657131) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561813)

Not necessarily. The definition for what is actually copyright and if e.g. a simple comment on a forum can even be copyrighted at all varies. Then there is the intent that must be taken into account, ie. the poster that made the comment on a public forum with no disclaimer did very likely mean for it to be publicly accessible and non-restricted, and similarly you must fair use - rights into account, not to mention the whole fact that facts cannot be copyrighted at all.

Re:Well... duh (2)

Svippy (876087) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561965)

Nice story. But this is Europe, I think it is rather far-fetched that his name is Joe.

Re:Well... duh (1)

Opportunist (166417) | more than 2 years ago | (#40562093)

Works great with Johann, Jan, Jean and Ivan, too.

Re:Well... duh (3, Informative)

hairyfeet (841228) | more than 2 years ago | (#40562175)

While you wrote a nice post and nailed it right on the money, in the future you might want to know there is actually a name for what you are describing and its the smart cow problem [wikipedia.org] which frankly I see all the time at the shop. All it takes is ONE guy, be it a "smart buddy that knows computers" or even just somebody that knows how to use a search engine effectively to make all their little roadblocks completely fricking worthless.

No savvyness required (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40561683)

In the Netherlands, if one googles the pirate bay (which is what many users do instead of typing in the URL, especially those that aren't particularly computer-savvy) the second and third hits both provide a list of proxies. It is just a matter of clicking a different link. Circumvention is very easy even for the most clueless.

If the anti-pircay organizations want to achieve something, they should probably sue Google to have them censor searches for the Pirate Bay. Given that ISPs can be forced to block it, there is a fair chance judges will require Google to censor such searches.

Is it really all piracy? (5, Insightful)

cbope (130292) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561741)

Since when does all BitTorrent traffic = piracy? I download 10's of gigabytes/year using BT and none of it is pirated content. All of my BT traffic is legitimate and legal.

In my opinion, this association of "all" BT traffic with illegal downloading is preventing BT from being more widely utilized for legitimate uses. It is nothing more than a distributed file-transfer protocol; the fact that some amount of BT traffic is used for illegal activities is really irrelevant. We should be driving more legitimate usage of BT to tilt the traffic patterns more towards legal use of the protocol and drown out the "noise" of illegal usage. This is the only way to ensure widespread use of the protocol in a way that survives any legal attempts to block it. The more BT is used for illegal activity the more likely it will be blocked or filtered at some point.

Just imagine if someone "discovers" that TCP/IP is being used to transfer these illegal BT packets all over the internets...

Re:Is it really all piracy? (2)

Gaygirlie (1657131) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561791)

Since when does all BitTorrent traffic = piracy? I download 10's of gigabytes/year using BT and none of it is pirated content. All of my BT traffic is legitimate and legal.

In my opinion, this association of "all" BT traffic with illegal downloading is preventing BT from being more widely utilized for legitimate uses. It is nothing more than a distributed file-transfer protocol; the fact that some amount of BT traffic is used for illegal activities is really irrelevant. We should be driving more legitimate usage of BT to tilt the traffic patterns more towards legal use of the protocol and drown out the "noise" of illegal usage. This is the only way to ensure widespread use of the protocol in a way that survives any legal attempts to block it. The more BT is used for illegal activity the more likely it will be blocked or filtered at some point.

Indeed. One of the most-well-known examples is World of Warcraft which uses BitTorrent for distribution. Just wait till Mists of Pandaria is released and you'll again see quite a large jump in BitTorrent traffic. Then of course there are the usual candidates like any larger F/OSS application or distribution that almost invariably offer BitTorrent downloads, many commercial applications do that these days, too, Indie movies are often accessible via BitTorrent and so on.

Re:Is it really all piracy? (1)

Chucky_M (1708842) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561807)

Just imagine if someone "discovers" that TCP/IP is being used to transfer these illegal BT packets all over the internets...

Jesus don't give them ideas, these people do think that way and are silly enough to try it.

Re:Is it really all piracy? (1)

Ginger Unicorn (952287) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561867)

this association of "all" BT traffic with illegal downloading is preventing BT from being more widely utilized for legitimate uses

I don't see how that follows.

Re:Is it really all piracy? (1)

blackest_k (761565) | more than 2 years ago | (#40562223)

Really if Bit-torrent has a reputation of use by people pirating content then legal users fear being tarred with the same brush.

Or how about a simple example say photoshop has a 200 MB patch it wants to distribute they could use bit torrent. However the user who wants the photoshop patch types in photoshop and finds photoshop with all bells and whistles available to download as well as the 200MB patch they were looking for. Any search on pirate bay for example will return legal torrents and illegal torrents as there is no difference as far as the search engine is concerned.

You might choose to distribute a film trailer by bit-torrent but instead of just links for the trailer links to the whole film are returned as well so while distributing the trailer by bit-torrent would be cheaper for the film company at the same time they would be making it easy to get the whole film too. This may eat in to sales or turn the film into a blockbuster depending on how good the film is, kind of an issue that people will not pay to see lousy films if they know they are lousy.

Re:Is it really all piracy? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40561935)

Considering there are also commercial products based sold to do bit torrent, I think the company should sue all the news outlets for their use of the protocol in this light. I would think libel/slander would come into play. As companies are people in the US, shouldn't be a problem.

I think it's every geek's job to create legit bit torrent traffic just to mess with the RIAA and friends. The more legit traffic there is, the less they can do about it. Share your favorite open source operating system, etc.

Re:Is it really all piracy? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40562025)

I think it's every geek's job to create legit bit torrent traffic just to mess with the RIAA and friends. The more legit traffic there is, the less they can do about it. Share your favorite open source operating system, etc.

Brilliant idea!

Re:Is it really all piracy? (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40562009)

Since when does all BitTorrent traffic = piracy? I download 10's of gigabytes/year using BT and none of it is pirated content. All of my BT traffic is legitimate and legal.

In my opinion, this association of "all" BT traffic with illegal downloading is preventing BT from being more widely utilized for legitimate uses. It is nothing more than a distributed file-transfer protocol; the fact that some amount of BT traffic is used for illegal activities is really irrelevant. We should be driving more legitimate usage of BT to tilt the traffic patterns more towards legal use of the protocol and drown out the "noise" of illegal usage. This is the only way to ensure widespread use of the protocol in a way that survives any legal attempts to block it. The more BT is used for illegal activity the more likely it will be blocked or filtered at some point.

Just imagine if someone "discovers" that TCP/IP is being used to transfer these illegal BT packets all over the internets...

Since when does all BitTorrent traffic = piracy? I download 10's of gigabytes/year using BT and none of it is pirated content. All of my BT traffic is legitimate and legal.

In my opinion, this association of "all" BT traffic with illegal downloading is preventing BT from being more widely utilized for legitimate uses. It is nothing more than a distributed file-transfer protocol; the fact that some amount of BT traffic is used for illegal activities is really irrelevant. We should be driving more legitimate usage of BT to tilt the traffic patterns more towards legal use of the protocol and drown out the "noise" of illegal usage. This is the only way to ensure widespread use of the protocol in a way that survives any legal attempts to block it. The more BT is used for illegal activity the more likely it will be blocked or filtered at some point.

Just imagine if someone "discovers" that TCP/IP is being used to transfer these illegal BT packets all over the internets...

Since when does all BitTorrent traffic = piracy? I download 10's of gigabytes/year using BT and none of it is pirated content. All of my BT traffic is legitimate and legal.

In my opinion, this association of "all" BT traffic with illegal downloading is preventing BT from being more widely utilized for legitimate uses. It is nothing more than a distributed file-transfer protocol; the fact that some amount of BT traffic is used for illegal activities is really irrelevant. We should be driving more legitimate usage of BT to tilt the traffic patterns more towards legal use of the protocol and drown out the "noise" of illegal usage. This is the only way to ensure widespread use of the protocol in a way that survives any legal attempts to block it. The more BT is used for illegal activity the more likely it will be blocked or filtered at some point.

Just imagine if someone "discovers" that TCP/IP is being used to transfer these illegal BT packets all over the internets...

Since when does all BitTorrent traffic = piracy? I download 10's of gigabytes/year using BT and none of it is pirated content. All of my BT traffic is legitimate and legal.

In my opinion, this association of "all" BT traffic with illegal downloading is preventing BT from being more widely utilized for legitimate uses. It is nothing more than a distributed file-transfer protocol; the fact that some amount of BT traffic is used for illegal activities is really irrelevant. We should be driving more legitimate usage of BT to tilt the traffic patterns more towards legal use of the protocol and drown out the "noise" of illegal usage. This is the only way to ensure widespread use of the protocol in a way that survives any legal attempts to block it. The more BT is used for illegal activity the more likely it will be blocked or filtered at some point.

Just imagine if someone "discovers" that TCP/IP is being used to transfer these illegal BT packets all over the internets...

Since when does all BitTorrent traffic = piracy? I download 10's of gigabytes/year using BT and none of it is pirated content. All of my BT traffic is legitimate and legal.

In my opinion, this association of "all" BT traffic with illegal downloading is preventing BT from being more widely utilized for legitimate uses. It is nothing more than a distributed file-transfer protocol; the fact that some amount of BT traffic is used for illegal activities is really irrelevant. We should be driving more legitimate usage of BT to tilt the traffic patterns more towards legal use of the protocol and drown out the "noise" of illegal usage. This is the only way to ensure widespread use of the protocol in a way that survives any legal attempts to block it. The more BT is used for illegal activity the more likely it will be blocked or filtered at some point.

Just imagine if someone "discovers" that TCP/IP is being used to transfer these illegal BT packets all over the internets...

Since when does all BitTorrent traffic = piracy? I download 10's of gigabytes/year using BT and none of it is pirated content. All of my BT traffic is legitimate and legal.

In my opinion, this association of "all" BT traffic with illegal downloading is preventing BT from being more widely utilized for legitimate uses. It is nothing more than a distributed file-transfer protocol; the fact that some amount of BT traffic is used for illegal activities is really irrelevant. We should be driving more legitimate usage of BT to tilt the traffic patterns more towards legal use of the protocol and drown out the "noise" of illegal usage. This is the only way to ensure widespread use of the protocol in a way that survives any legal attempts to block it. The more BT is used for illegal activity the more likely it will be blocked or filtered at some point.

Just imagine if someone "discovers" that TCP/IP is being used to transfer these illegal BT packets all over the internets...

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"if it was easy..." (4, Interesting)

Jafafa Hots (580169) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561759)

"If it was easy to create an official, legal version of The Pirate Bay, then the entertainment industry wouldâ(TM)ve done it already - theyâ(TM)re not that stupid."

It took almost 20 years of hard work at RCA to develop the CED video disc format. You know, the discs where a needle in a groove picks up the video. Hit the market a few years after the laser disc.

What, you mean you've never heard of it? Not too surprising, actually.

But yeah, they're SMART, they are.

TBP is overrated (1)

babthooka (1578891) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561773)

TPB has been banned in my country for a few years already. I did use it sometimes, but I never thought much of it. I found other torrent sites to be so much better... Its ban has never bothered me too much. I keep wandering what these people who banned it have been thinking. Did greed really rot their brains so bad?

Re:TBP is overrated (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40561989)

Brainrot? No i think the politicians made a smart move, with respect to their own agenda that is. Remember that the AA* oufits have to work thru politicians, those don't have a real incentive to provide a final & airtight solution to pirating. If they did provide a final solution, the kickbacks will stop flowing. They just need to produce something that convinces the AA long enough to pay up, but that will eventually show that it doesn't really fix the "problem". To keep the carousel turning...
recurring piracy => recurring AA kickbacks

Bet most of our neighbors have never used torrents (1)

cboslin (1532787) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561815)

I am not surprised that activity is the same or has increased.

its absurd to assume / assert / suggest / claim that on every street of every block, of every neighborhood, of every community, of every city, of every county of every state, of every country there is even ONE much less more torrent users. That's crazy talk.

I doubt I have one neighbor who has used a torrent.

The idea of compressing data to save bandwidth seems like something providers would promote...unless they are trying to force you to use more bandwidth (by spreading FUD to deter torrent usage), exceed your caps and thus be able to charge you more money.

My bandwidth is throttled to less than BROADBAND speeds (768Kbps) both upstream and downstream, yet I do not use torrents...guess I will have to start using them. Why are Cable providers allowed to fraudulently say their service is broadband when they throttle bandwidth to less than 768Kbps, especially upstream, 24 X 7. The only time I see 768Kbps or greater upstream is during the Speed Test.

The DRM / DCMA pro industry wants us to believe that torrents are widely used. This is NOT true. They want us to believe that ONLY thieves use torrents, which based on comments (not that I need them) to this post we KNOW NOT TO BE TRUE.

So what is their game? Pathetic.

How can they identify BitTorrent traffic? (1)

loufoque (1400831) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561899)

How can they identify BitTorrent traffic, since virtually all such traffic is encrypted and all the ISP can see is that it is SSL?

Are some people still silly enough not to encrypt their transfers?

Re:How can they identify BitTorrent traffic? (3, Insightful)

Gaygirlie (1657131) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561927)

How can they identify BitTorrent traffic, since virtually all such traffic is encrypted and all the ISP can see is that it is SSL?

Are some people still silly enough not to encrypt their transfers?

First of all, it is very easy to identify BitTorrent traffic even if it is encrypted, you just cannot identify the contents of said traffic. Secondly, e.g. uTorrent by default does not use encryption and quite obviously Joe Blow doesn't even come to think of that, let alone know how to enable it.

Re:How can they identify BitTorrent traffic? (1)

loufoque (1400831) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561949)

With all the media talking of the dangers of BitTorrent and how you can easily get fines or your internet connection suspended, I'm pretty sure people that do use BitTorrent were careful to take measures to ensure they wouldn't be caught.

Re:How can they identify BitTorrent traffic? (1)

Gaygirlie (1657131) | more than 2 years ago | (#40562007)

You really do not have any experience of Joe Blows then. Of all the people I know even most geeks didn't know about turning on encyption.

Re:How can they identify BitTorrent traffic? (1)

loufoque (1400831) | more than 2 years ago | (#40562119)

Or rather I live in a different country than you do, where three strikes law has been implemented for a while

Re:How can they identify BitTorrent traffic? (1)

Gaygirlie (1657131) | more than 2 years ago | (#40562241)

Hm, true enough, I admit my failure. We have no such silliness here and thus almost no one knows about encrypting one's traffic.

As an aside, even though encrypting traffic is quite a good measure an even better measure would be to use combine that with IP block-lists, too. Unfortunately uTorrent doesn't have such a feature. I don't know of any Windows-based BT-client that does, actually, only Linux-ones.

Re:How can they identify BitTorrent traffic? (4, Interesting)

koekebakker (1296563) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561943)

I'm guessing that clients that make hundreds of encrypted connections per minute to different IP adresses are easy to track down..

Re:How can they identify BitTorrent traffic? (1)

laffer1 (701823) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561945)

That's easy. The traffic has a unique signature. It's very easy to do this and many ISPs throttle it. Even with encryption, it's still possible to take a guess at the protocol by the size and flow of packets.

Proxy Site can help to bypass this problem easily (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40561939)

There is lots of Proxy sites avilable in the internet..which can download torrent files easily... i'm using http://publicproxy.in/ [publicproxy.in] ..in my country lots of sites blocked... also if you want you can download movies directly from http://sceneunited.com/ [sceneunited.com] I also found a Proxy network..where lots of proxy sites working fine http://proxybite.org/ [proxybite.org]

Make the european market a priority (4, Insightful)

erik.martino (997000) | more than 2 years ago | (#40561969)

In europe we hear a lot about like video and books in services like Google Play, ITunes, Amazon, Netflix. But the reality is that these services has done a very poor job in supporting the european market. I don't know who is to blame, the EU for not creating a single european content market, rights holders for making it too cumbersome to add their content to these services. Or maybe Google, Apple, Amazon, Netflix and others are just too lazy or too inept. Who do you think is to blame?

fences (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40562001)

a friend of mine always says: every fance has a hole...

XS4ALL not the largest (5, Informative)

swinferno (1212408) | more than 2 years ago | (#40562045)

"This news comes from XS4All, one of the largest European ISPs..."

XS4All is a big provider in the Netherlands, but not the largest. They are definitely not one of the largest in Europe.
They do however have a long history of standing up for the rights and privacy of their customers.

What if with the 1:1 Traffic (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40562047)

how it could matter with the 1:1 traffic? i never try one to compare.. please tell me about the different.

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