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Anonymous Helps Turn In Hacker Who Targeted Charity

samzenpus posted about 2 years ago | from the community-watch dept.

Twitter 234

netbuzz writes "A hacker who defaced and disabled the website of a New Zealand film company known for helping poor children could find himself in legal hot water in his home country of Spain after his attack spurred a Facebook/Twitter posse that included members of Anonymous, who the hacker may have been trying to impress. 'Apparently, one of the (Anonymous) rules is you don't hack charity sites, you don't hack sites of people trying to help kids,' says the owner of the damaged site. 'This guy was trying to impress them, to try and get into their group and boasting about what he'd done — but they turned on him, they chased him.'"

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LOL (0, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40851449)

What a bunch of moralfags.

"Anonymous"? Talks to the cops? (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40851723)

PFFFT! "Anonymous" IS the cops!

Re:"Anonymous"? Talks to the cops? (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40851951)

PFFFT! "Anonymous" IS the cops!

 
Anonymous is not the cops

They only think that they are cops
 

Re:"Anonymous"? Talks to the cops? (4, Insightful)

Johann Lau (1040920) | about 2 years ago | (#40852143)

who is a firefighter? anyone who fights fire, or anyone wearing the uniform?

Re:"Anonymous"? Talks to the cops? (3, Insightful)

kelemvor4 (1980226) | about 2 years ago | (#40852671)

The one wearing the uniform. Firefighter is a job.

Re:"Anonymous"? Talks to the cops? (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40851955)

Vigilantes != cops.

Re:"Anonymous"? Talks to the cops? (3, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40852053)

Vigilantes != cops.

Vigilantes ==Freelance Police [wikipedia.org]

Re:"Anonymous"? Talks to the cops? (0)

InspectorGadget1964 (2439148) | about 2 years ago | (#40852197)

Cops = abusive, uneducated, arrogant, incompetent, lazy and useless

Re:LOL (0)

couchslug (175151) | about 2 years ago | (#40852363)

Mods should note, Not a Troll.

Vandal found out Anons were not his Personal Army.

Not Anonymous? (3, Insightful)

Haxagon (2454432) | about 2 years ago | (#40851475)

Facebook/Twitter doesn't sound like Anonymous, it sounds like scriptkiddies and armchair activists who just want to look like the coolest kid in middle school.

Re:Not Anonymous? (5, Insightful)

cmwatford (2679257) | about 2 years ago | (#40851541)

Doesn't that make up a rather large portion of each anon movment? Also, every time I hear someone refer or imply to anon being a group or organization I cringe a little.

Re:Not Anonymous? (0)

Haxagon (2454432) | about 2 years ago | (#40851631)

Sure, but I think saying that they're "Anonymous" lends them some credibility in the eyes of the mainstream media or consumers, when it's really undue.

Re:Not Anonymous? (3)

Cl1mh4224rd (265427) | about 2 years ago | (#40852049)

Sure, but I think saying that they're "Anonymous" lends them some credibility in the eyes of the mainstream media or consumers, when it's really undue.

Anonymous isn't a group with a well- or even vaguely-defined membership. That's kind of the point. If you can easily identify who is a member of Anonymous and who is not, it's time for a name change.

Re:Not Anonymous? (4, Insightful)

Genda (560240) | about 2 years ago | (#40852235)

In much the same way a bunch of people at a bus stop are a group or loose affiliation... all going in the same direction... yeah.

Cringe (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40852407)

every time I hear someone refer or imply to anon being a group or organization I cringe a little

 
Watch out, for there will be more and more of those "everytime / cringe a little" events coming !!
 
Be forewarned !!
 

Re:Not Anonymous? (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40851801)

Scripkiddies and armchair activist? Sounds like anonymous to me.

Re:Not Anonymous? (2)

Tarlus (1000874) | about 2 years ago | (#40852141)

A 35 year old script kiddie, no less. Who lives with his mother.

That's actually true.

Re:Not Anonymous? (0)

Genda (560240) | about 2 years ago | (#40852257)

This guy needs his own Wikipedia page titled "LOOSER" including his current and high school pictures and an endlessly looping video of Jim Carey saying... [youtu.be]

All so future generations know how to spot one on sight.

Re:Not Anonymous? (2, Informative)

citizenr (871508) | about 2 years ago | (#40852519)

A 35 year old script kiddie, no less. Who lives with his mother.

That's actually true.

Its perfectly normal for guys to live with their parents that long in Europe. Its traditional in mediterranean (Greece, Spain, Italy. etc)

Re:Not Anonymous? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40852589)

I bet it was true in the agricultural days too - you help out on your dad's farm till you can find your own farmland somehow.

Re:Not Anonymous? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40852807)

I tried to move back to my mom but she wouldn't let me. :-(
I though I would use the $2000USD I have to pay in rent for my two room apartment in Stockholm for something better than feeding the landlord. (Yes I could move to a cheaper apartment; if there were ANY free in Stockholm!)

BTW. "Anonymous" is sooooo COOL!!!

Re:Not Anonymous? (1)

upsideDownPuma (2697083) | about 2 years ago | (#40852901)

I lived in Spain for 4 years, you'd be surprised how common that is :/

Re:Not Anonymous? (3, Funny)

upsideDownPuma (2697083) | about 2 years ago | (#40852927)

One of my friends works at a call center for an insurance group in Spain. He had a call one day from a frantic woman saying that her son who was studying in London had hurt himself playing soccer, when my friend asked for name, date of birth, etc. it turned out that the guy was 29. He then called the guy saying that he'd received a call from his mother on his behalf and needed an explanation of his injuries. It turns out instead of hurting himself playing soccer, he'd actually been doing handstands and fell over and hit his head on the dresser.

Re:Not Anonymous? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40852673)

Sounds like Anonymous to *me*.

Seizures (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40851481)

Remember when Anonymous trolled an epilepsy support forum with animated gifs designed to trigger seizures?
The Moralfags seem to have taken over.

Re:Seizures (5, Funny)

chromas (1085949) | about 2 years ago | (#40851523)

They're trying to get better; that's why they started Anonymous Anonymous.

Re:Seizures (0)

johnsnails (1715452) | about 2 years ago | (#40851675)

That is one of the funniest things I have read in a long time hahahahahaha

Re:Seizures (0, Redundant)

PopeRatzo (965947) | about 2 years ago | (#40851769)

That is one of the funniest things I have read in a long time hahahahahaha

No offense, but you have an insane laugh.

Either that or you're a super-villain.

Re:Seizures (1)

johnsnails (1715452) | about 2 years ago | (#40852099)

Shhh (its the later)

Re:Seizures (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40852217)

Damn, its been a long time since slashdot last had me spewing coffee/beer/random beverage on my monitor.

This one was totally worth the cleanup...just awesome

Re:Seizures (4, Insightful)

Anubis IV (1279820) | about 2 years ago | (#40851545)

Remember when anyone at all could join Anonymous, claim its name for themselves, and could probably find some others in the group interested in pursuing their idea for an attack, even if it wasn't sanctioned by the group as a whole?

Oh wait, that's how it still is.

Re:Seizures (0)

artor3 (1344997) | about 2 years ago | (#40851697)

The GP was pointing out the absurdity in the summary, and he was right. Anonymous doesn't have morals, and suggesting that they wouldn't attack charity sites is silly. Anonymous can and will attack anyone, because it's just a name people use when they want to do something without it coming back to them.

Re:Seizures (2)

Anubis IV (1279820) | about 2 years ago | (#40851755)

I would have agreed (and not posted at all), were it not for his last sentence.

Re:Seizures (4, Interesting)

PopeRatzo (965947) | about 2 years ago | (#40851781)

Anonymous doesn't have morals

In that way, they are very similar to a corporation. They are an aggregate of lulz.

Anonymous are people, my friend.

Re:Seizures (1)

Genda (560240) | about 2 years ago | (#40852297)

Like Soylent Green... like Soylent Green...

Re:Seizures (4, Informative)

Darkness404 (1287218) | about 2 years ago | (#40851617)

The idea that "Anonymous" is a single entity is false. There isn't some supergroup called "Anonymous" anyone can (and does) call themselves "Anonymous" simply because its the "cool" factor. In then end, I'm anonymous, you're anonymous, the guy down the street is anonymous. That's the big thing with "Anonymous" there is no leader, its just a bunch of people moving in roughly the same direction. There is no one philosophy either morally or politically, just a couple of common interests. Join the swarm and leave.

Re:Seizures (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40851689)

then they just post the target and bam they go after it?

Re:Seizures (1)

johnsnails (1715452) | about 2 years ago | (#40851703)

Anonymous is any hacker who hacks and doesnt get caught... If you get caught, you are no longer by definition anonymous (permanently safe much).

Re:Seizures (3, Insightful)

zbobet2012 (1025836) | about 2 years ago | (#40851773)

There is no one philosophy either morally or politically, just a couple of common interests. Join the swarm and leave.

Welcome to the future, a future where nations by common interests and some level of shared morality than national borders.

Re:Seizures (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40852229)

Taxation is legalized theft, no more, no less.

Darkness404 is a certified retard, no more, no less.

Re:Seizures (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40852595)

Your anonymous... im anonymous coward

I want to hate Anonymous (5, Interesting)

ancientt (569920) | about 2 years ago | (#40851495)

I want to hate them. I believe in following the law. I believe in following the rules of society and government. I believe that doing bad things in the name of good is still bad. Still, it is hard for me to hold Anonymous as evil when they are doing good like this, fighting the evil (of child porn) and injustice (Sony.)

If you are an Anonymous member reading this, then know this, I am against you. I hold wrong what you do and how you do it, but what you are accomplishing... you have torn my ethical code. So here's to you, I raise a glass, may you be punished for your wrongdoing, may you suffer the consequences of your misdeeds, but despite that, may you accomplish the good things you aim for. If you have the balls to be willing to take the just desserts of what you have done and still have the guts to do what you feel is right, then kudos to you.

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (5, Interesting)

Darkness404 (1287218) | about 2 years ago | (#40851569)

Laws do not equal morality. Immoral things are legal and moral things may be illegal. You are the one that has to live with your decisions, supporting the "law" blindly is foolish because it rarely leads to the correct (moral) decisions. There exists a law higher than the laws created by the thugs in power.

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40851705)

Then you change the law, you DO NOT make Justice with your own hand.
If that was right, everybody would be doing things to other according to what they think it's right.

People would shut drug addicts on sight, a store owner would shut a thieve, etc

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (5, Insightful)

Darkness404 (1287218) | about 2 years ago | (#40851765)

Change the law, how does one really do that? You can write to your senator or representative, only to get an automated response. I remember back in the early days of the DMCA, I wrote to my senator to urge him to oppose it, I got a prompt response assuring me that he was -supporting- the DMCA and not to worry because he would make sure that it would pass... You could try running for senate yourself, but unless you have the budget and the required charisma, you are likely to accomplish nothing but wasting a few thousand dollars. You can vote, but that doesn't do a whole lot, especially if you don't want the Republican or the Democrat challenger, and voting for the "lesser evil" never works out.

About the only thing you can do is disobey the unjust laws and do the right thing secretly or move to someplace more free.

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40852155)

I'm still looking for that more "free" place. At one point it sounded like Canada. There were some really good constitutional rulings. From what I recall they didn't last long. Sadly near 100% of the population would rather throw a minority in jail that they perceive to be a threat. Unfortunately the minorities aren't able to organise because- well- persecution.

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (4, Interesting)

phantomfive (622387) | about 2 years ago | (#40852181)

Change the law, how does one really do that?

In a democracy, your power is determined by your ability to convince other people. Obviously, if you can convince enough people to vote for you, then you win, but more importantly, if you can convince people of the correctness of your ideas, then the people in office will have no choice but to vote for you.

I look at Milton Friedman as an ideal example. The guy never ran for office, never had any political power, but the power of his ideas spread throughout the world, until politicians began implementing many of his ideas. He moved the Overton window without ever holding any managerial authority.

Williams Jennings Bryan is another example. He ran a poor campaign and lost the presidency, only to watch his opponent implement many of the changes he wanted to see. The changes got made because they were popular. His opponent didn't want to implement them, but he did because to not do that would mean losing the next election.

There are plenty of examples like this. Of course, if you're the average person, your influence is limited to posting on Facebook, and everyone else but your friends rolls their eyes. Your influence in that case is limited to a single vote, assuming you even vote. Churchill said, “The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter.” Don't be that person.

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (1)

Fred Ferrigno (122319) | about 2 years ago | (#40852537)

Form an organization. Raise money. Hire a lobbyist. Donate money to candidates who agree with you and run ads against candidates who disagree with you.

There is no actual mechanism to change the law (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40851873)

It's a deliberate deceit by the alleged "representative democracy" (which is no such thing) that you have a means to change the law. Your "representatives" certainly don't represent you, they only support legislation that they personally want to support, which more often than not is whatever their party gets paid to support.

Unless you are a mindless pawn and slave, fully indoctrinated into believing that you live in a democracy which is completely non-existent, then there is no actual alternative available to ignoring the law and living to your own standard. If you are a good person, your own standard will be more socially just and fair than what the law of the land says is "legal", as that is highly unjust and biased to favor those in power and with money.

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40851875)

People on here would shut you for not knowing how to spell too!

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40852161)

Then you change the law

Why didn't I think of that? I'll just assemble my army, march to the capitol, and change the law. Or maybe I'll wave my magic wand and the law will magically change.

If your idea is to change things by voting, learn a bit of statistics and you will understand that your vote is worthless. Just like buying lottery tickets is a waste of money (in fact the lottery ticket has a better chance of working out).

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (3, Insightful)

artor3 (1344997) | about 2 years ago | (#40851721)

Blindly disobeying the law is even worse. Most laws are pretty good. Vigilantism might feel good, but when adopted at a wide scale, it's terrible.

Disobeying the law just because you're a mental teenager wanting to "fight the man" is stupid and harmful.

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (4, Insightful)

Darkness404 (1287218) | about 2 years ago | (#40851867)

Blindly following the law is much worse than opposing it.

If you name the worst crimes, the worst tragedies to occur in human history, the Killing Fields, the genocide in Rwanda, the holocaust, etc. were all committed by people simply "following the law", soldiers just "following orders". If you name the biggest heroes in the world, chances are they were breaking the law.

But, its your life, you have to live with your own decisions. I for one will do what is moral, even if its not legal. I'm not going to break the law simply to, but I'm not going to blindly follow some law just because its the "law". When the current events today have become the textbooks of tomorrow and my children or grandchildren look at the tyranny that exists and asked if I opposed it, I can look at them in the eye and give an honest answer and not be ashamed.

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (4, Insightful)

artor3 (1344997) | about 2 years ago | (#40852221)

Bullshit. You immediately jump to the worst incidents in history, and point at them as though they're representative examples. They're not.

Insisting that you'll just follow your own code instead of the law works great as long as you have the "right" morals. Funny thing about that, everyone seems to think their morals are the right ones.

Maybe I think it's immoral for my daughter to have a kid out of wedlock, so I kill her and her boyfriend as an honor killing. After all, it's my morality, and how dare your laws condemn it? Maybe I think abortions are immoral, so I won't let my employees have them, and how dare the law say otherwise? Maybe I think it's moral to drive drunk so long as I'm super-duper careful. How dare you take away my right to drive? Maybe I think it's moral to lynch murderers, and whoops, turns out that guy was innocent. How dare you make me follow your "due process"? Maybe I see no problems with dumping toxic waste in your water supply. How dare you fine me for it?

You're a child. Anyone with the slightest idea how the world works would realize that if you tell people to ignore any law they don't like, you get chaos. Sure, if you ever find yourself working as a Nazi death camp guard, disobey those orders. But such disobedience is warranted as the exception, not the rule.

My kingdom for some mod points! (1)

jamrock (863246) | about 2 years ago | (#40852467)

Very very well said. Kudos to you.

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (3, Insightful)

Pubstar (2525396) | about 2 years ago | (#40852613)

You were doing really good until

Maybe I think it's moral to drive drunk so long as I'm super-duper careful. How dare you take away my right to drive?

At this point, I stopped reading. Actually, I should have stopped reading at the above example. I think you misunderstand what morality is and how you can impose it onto other parties. Your morals are a fine thing to live by and maybe even to break a law or two that goes against what you believe to be morally right, when it infringes on other peoples liberties then you are going to be in the wrong regardless of your morals. Pick better examples next time, yeah?

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (1)

dontbgay (682790) | about 2 years ago | (#40852699)

Man, that's some good righteous condemnation right there. Instead of wrapping your brain around the idea of depriving someone of life being immoral in itself, you lambast the guy as if he's taking part in "honor" killings himself. Then you proceed to call him a child. Do you get nosebleeds that high up on your horse?

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (1)

cyborg_zx (893396) | about 2 years ago | (#40852867)

I hate to point this out but even in this very thread there are people who would wish they were that Nazi guard so they could obey the orders with glee.

Genocide is a recurring fashion I'm afraid.

You can't make the "bad" social goals go away by constructing laws because ultimately laws are just things people agree to do that are written down. Just like anything else their meaning only arises from implementation, not from definition.

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40852887)

You seem to confuse morality and ethics with abject relativism.

Ethics is a well-defined discipline in philosophy. Sure there are different branches and ways to arrive at what is considered "good" in the different schools of ethics, but stuff like killing is pretty much universally reviled in all schools of ethics. Yes there's nihilism and solipsism in metaphysics, but you're a whackjob if you subscribe to the ethics it allows, and nobody would want to be your neighboor.

Second, religion is not morality. It's just another law that you follow "because god X says so". There is no logical reasoning behind why it is right to follow the law, well... there is...but it rests on the assumption that your chosen omni-potent sky-daddy is the right one.

Anyway, vigilantism = good when applied to people who actually give a fuck about WHY something is right and wrong, and not just go by their gut-feeling followed by the assumption of "I'm thinking this, so it must be right".

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (0, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40852361)

If the holocaust had succeeded then we wouldn't be having economic issues today.

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (1)

Genda (560240) | about 2 years ago | (#40852375)

But peaceful, civil disobedience, has a long and honorable history. From Gandhi, to King, to Mandela, to the Occupy Movement. When laws are unjust, it is the responsibility of the moral man to contest the law. When those in power oppress or thwart the will of the people, it is the prerogative of the people to let those in power know that what they have done will not stand.

Over the years I have seen people tried for attacking even killing child molesters. I'm not condoning taking the law into your own hands. I am saying when a person has a 20 year history of raping babies, and he get's caught doing it again, then one of his past victims comes along and get's a little payback with interest... I have a damn hard time getting up anything resembling moral indignation.

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (3)

chuckymonkey (1059244) | about 2 years ago | (#40851727)

I wish I had mod points for you. This statement is so very much the truth, I also believe in the rule of law, however I also believe in ethics and morality. It's a large reason I left the military after two war tours. Just because I was given an order didn't make that order right or just despite the lawfulness of it. It's also why I believe in civil disobedience and standing up for what's right.

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40851929)

And vandalism against morality is not effective lobbying, or guerrilla warfare. Anonymous traditionally chooses easy targets, so they can pat themselves on the back but not take risks exposing *real* crimes. I've yet to see their "l33t" skills applied to anything useful, such as the records of Guananamo Bay prisoner's names, IRS records, or actual cult of scientology fiscal records or their confessional folders. They spend too much time reading Ayn Rand and not enough actually doing anyone any good.

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (5, Insightful)

PopeRatzo (965947) | about 2 years ago | (#40851953)

Laws do not equal morality. Immoral things are legal and moral things may be illegal. You are the one that has to live with your decisions, supporting the "law" blindly is foolish because it rarely leads to the correct (moral) decisions. There exists a law higher than the laws created by the thugs in power.

I think this is very smart.

At a time when all social institutions are failing us, when all leaders - religious, political and business - are failing us, when the very rule of law has been perverted to turn all but a very few into slaves, one needs to give a "higher law" some serious thought. It needn't be a religious thing, as many philosophers and our very experience has shown, but if we're going to avert the inexorable march of dystopia, it's something to be considered.

The "rules of society" have been thoroughly turned on their head, and it's time to look very closely at oneself and decide what's right. The slogans of what's coming can be seen very clearly in advertising every few minutes on television. Unless they're recognized and carefully examined, and their wrongness discerned, we'll just end up going along with them.

One thing about anonymous: they make people talk about what's right and wrong outside of the usual framework of the corporate hegemony that passes for "the rules of society" in 2012. Laws are for more than just making things orderly so sheep can be slaughtered with minimum fuss.

In that regard, I'm glad anonymous exists. In a real way, they're kids, muddling through the confusing mess of what we are told is "right and wrong". They're figuring it out for themselves rather than just accepting the "work hard, don't rock the boat and pay the man" morals of today.

What's important about anonymous is not what they do, what they decide, but what we do - what we decide. They're sort of an unintentional crucible - a lab for how society forms and how it fails. There is a lesson there for those that care to see it.

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (2)

BeanThere (28381) | about 2 years ago | (#40852071)

The "rules of society" have been thoroughly turned on their head, and it's time to look very closely at oneself and decide what's right.

Agreed, though I think the path to do do so, is to use truth and reason, objectively, and at a high standard of clear and rational thought.

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (4, Informative)

Genda (560240) | about 2 years ago | (#40852457)

And when our founding fathers found these truths to be self evident, and the oppression of their native land unbearable, they did what they knew in their minds and hearts to be moral and just. The disobeyed the despots. They fought for that, which they knew was worth of living and dying. Our society has ceased to stand even for itself let alone its posterity. Is it not long passed time to say, enough, you may not rob me of another right or personal freedom, in fact I'm taking what's mine back and you cannot have it. Not now, not ever.

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (4, Informative)

SuricouRaven (1897204) | about 2 years ago | (#40852819)

Or you could dismiss the 'truths to be self-evident' thing as just some powerful rhetoric, because those things are *not* self-evident. There is no great trancendent book of rights. The only natural law on such matters is the law of the pointy stick in the ribcage: Whoever has the power to enforce their will by force is the natural ruler. America didn't win its independance because it was morally better, or because of the strength of their arguments: They won because they had the advantage of some good leadership and fighting on their own turf against an enemy with severely stretched supply lines and political infighting back in Europe.

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40852503)

The one thing that is really missing in our society today is tolerance. People need to agree to disagree on things and try to get along.

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (1)

SuricouRaven (1897204) | about 2 years ago | (#40852823)

That works only for minor disagreements. It doesn't so anything when factions have very different views about how society needs to run - when that happens, things turn political.

unfortunately (3, Insightful)

circletimessquare (444983) | about 2 years ago | (#40851983)

Not every individual has a Sterling moral code. plenty do, but sone believe they do, and in fact have a "morality" far more screwed up than the law. Therefore, the law is far better than individial judgments of morality, because the thugs in power have a lot more to be accountable for rhan a random thug on the street. Plus the law gets considered, refined, corrected. The "morality" of some random Joe comes from what exactly? You trust him more than a governmental system continually refined and corrected?

So its a nice fable, the righteous vigilante, it makes for great Clint Eastwood movies or Batman movie. But its a fantasy. In reality, its more often about a deranged fool doing a lot worse than any cop force and judiciary.

Re:unfortunately (2)

osu-neko (2604) | about 2 years ago | (#40852243)

Not every individual has a Sterling moral code. plenty do, but sone believe they do, and in fact have a "morality" far more screwed up than the law. Therefore, the law is far better than individial judgments of morality, because the thugs in power have a lot more to be accountable for rhan a random thug on the street. Plus the law gets considered, refined, corrected. The "morality" of some random Joe comes from what exactly? You trust him more than a governmental system continually refined and corrected?

You're basic mistake is to assume that law and morality have anything at all to do with one another. The rule of law is for preserving order and harmony in society. It's what's necessary for people to live, work, etc, and institutions to function, a set of rules make it all possible. It's not about determining and enforcing any idea of what's morally right and wrong. Often the law may make illegal what is also immoral, but that's not the reason it's making it illegal, that's just happy coincidence. Morality is an orthogonal concept. Someone who looks to the law for judgements of morality is avoiding thinking about morality entirely, and it's a very dangerous nation to live in where the government gets into its head that it should legislate morality, as unfortunately happens in some countries.

Re:unfortunately (3, Insightful)

Genda (560240) | about 2 years ago | (#40852585)

You look, and you listen. Are you telling me you can't tell the difference between Mussolini, Hitler, Stalin or Franco from Gandhi, Mandela or Lincoln? Start with the words. Then observe the actions. A despot is easy to spot. When Mandela became President, he invited one of the men who guarded him in prison as a VIP guest. He spoke to his nation reborn and said that we must forgive, that until these men are forgiven, none of us is free. That is how you tell bloody brutes from men of faith and dignity. If the men who run your nation are not among the great men of purpose and humanity, then you must stand up and face them. If the media is owned by despots then speak in the streets like King. If your words are wise, and deep, and resonate in the human heart, you will be heard. You don't fight for fighting's sake. You fight to preserve that which is good and just. If in your struggle you break bad laws, then you pay the consequence gladly. Gandhi was arrested, and beaten many times. It didn't stop him, it didn't even slow him down.

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (4, Interesting)

BeanThere (28381) | about 2 years ago | (#40852097)

“Never forget that everything Hitler did in Germany was legal.” - Martin Luther King

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40852129)

There exists a law higher than the laws created by the thugs in power.

This gives rise to the Founding Fathers. It also gives rise to suicide bombers. It's a double edged sword.

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (2)

Intropy (2009018) | about 2 years ago | (#40852153)

I agree with part of what you're saying. Law and morality are not the same thing. But I don't think you have a basis for the claim that "supporting the 'law' blindly is foolish because it rarely leads to the correct (moral) decisions." It certainly doesn't always lead to the correct moral decisions. It's not the best "moral algorithm." But I'd bet that blindly following the law does lead to moral decisions more often than not. Definitely more than, for example, blindly disobeying the law or behaving randomly.

In any case I don't think that's at issue here. Most of the things done in the name of 'Anonymous' whether such a group exists or not are both illegal and immoral.

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40852543)

Most of the things are illegal, and most of the things may be immoral in your standards but that doesn't make it immoral in the standards of Anonymous (or me for that matter). I haven't been following them properly but from what I have seen they have done more moral things than immoral things.

"It's the citizens duty to follow any law which has a moral higher than his, and it is also his duty to deny any law where his moral is higher than the law" (well a paraphrase but still)

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40851715)

Why are you supporting slavery, racism and rape?

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (1)

PopeRatzo (965947) | about 2 years ago | (#40851799)

If you are an Anonymous member reading this, then know this, I am against you. I hold wrong what you do and how you do it

And know this, Anonymous: my opinion offsets his, so it's a wash. Carry on.

We think you're an idiot. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40851829)

Raise your glass? Torn your ethical code? Good versus evil! Wow, it's like we're totally living in a Dragonlance novel here.

Sorry, you're retarded.

Stop spending so much time at renaissance festivals or quit drama school--you'll get laid more.

Re:We think you're an idiot. (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40851883)

I assume you have never been to a renaissance festival or to the drama school. I assure you, you are very very likely to get laid.

Society and government not always right (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40851833)

I believe in following the rules of society and government.

Tell that to the Syrian activists arrested, tortured and bombed by the Assad "government". Tell that to the victim of female circumcision practiced by some tribal "society". Go ahead. Be happy to follow their rules.

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40851845)

Obey!

It is folks like you who allow atrocities like the Nazi death camps, the genocide of the American Indians, the inquisitions and the multitude of other atrocities committed in the name of authority.

Do as you are told. It is the law, you need to burn those children alive-- they are witches.

I have nothing but the strongest contempt for people like you. You and your ilk, are the root of all that is evil in this world. I am certain you are a religious zealot too-- it is part and parcel with being an obedient tool of authority ^H^H^Hevil.

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (2)

mcrbids (148650) | about 2 years ago | (#40852063)

Doing things anonymously is a basic part of human history. The Boston Tea Party was an anonymous demonstration. I've performed acts of civil protest anonymously, in favor of what I feel was for the common good. I broke no laws, and was polite and careful.

By simply stating "If you are an Anonymous member" you demonstrate your utter failure at understanding what anonymous is. It's not a group any more than "upset girlfriend" is a group. (I'm aware of no formal organization of upset girl friends, if there is any kind of official or formal organization thereof, realize that this is not the point) One upset girlfriend says "no" to her boyfriend, another whacks off private parts, but we can be pretty sure that the former girlfriend probably doesn't endorse the actions of the latter.

Endorsement of any action by a group of anonymous persons is, in no way, endorsement of the other actions. I endorse some of the things done by anonymous people, I shake my head at others. That in no way discourages me from wearing the mask of anonymity when I feel the need arises.

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (1)

ctheme (2694307) | about 2 years ago | (#40852139)

I believe in following the rules of society and government. I believe that doing bad things in the name of good is still bad. Still, it is hard for me to hold Anonymous as evil when they are doing good like this, fighting the evil (of child porn) and injustice (Sony.)

Anonymous is not "evil", as we have seen them follow through with justice-doing where law forces have been inefficient. However, their willingness to damage individuals and organizations to prove a point is worrisome. Even if their activist agenda is laudable, the impulsiveness of their actions is irresponsible, and this has helped establish Anonymous as a label of chaos which de-emphasizes reason and democracy.

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40852385)

You are a fucking moron.

The government does it "for the kids" too, and idiots like you eat that shit up giving them a free pass to do whatever else they want.

Re:I want to hate Anonymous (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40852777)

Yeah, I'd like to believe in the law, too. I really would. But, it's not the virtuous sentiment you make it out to be and is certainly no moral authority.

When the DMCA can make it illegal to do certain types of math so that a group of businesses can profit, law is not moral.

When Sony can launch a digital attack on millions of its own customers without getting as much as a slap on the wrist, law is not moral.

When the RIAA can financially ruin you for life because you copied some bits, the law is not moral.

When bankers can thieve $700 billion from the public, the law is not moral.

You really think that deceitful men in suits are any more virtuous than Anonymous? What is law if not vigilantism on paper?

Shadows of MPAA. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40851531)

Maybe he saw the words,"film company", saw red, and went all vengeful on them. It's understandable, any red blooded MPAA hating citizen would.

Storm... (1)

GrahamCox (741991) | about 2 years ago | (#40851647)

...meet teacup.

Slashdot is such a sad place anymore (0, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40851729)

It's hardly even worth trolling.
 
If it weren't for articles about IP and bashfests for Apple and MS this place would be positively dead.
 
I'm gonna kinda miss it but I guess it's time to stick a fork in its ass.
 
  It's dead, Jim.

Oh FFS (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40851787)

Legal or not, the idiotic "vigilante justice" of 4chan morons has done more harm than good

I have a theory, and an ever better comparison (1)

slashmydots (2189826) | about 2 years ago | (#40851879)

I have a theory: this idiot couldn't find an insecure enough (for his skill level) website from a bank or a politician or something like that. So, his vulnerability scanner came up with that 1 site so he "hacked" it, and I use that term loosely. This is approximately the equivalent of walking into my work, saying you're a m@d skillz hacker, and finding that 1 person with their login password on a sticky note on their monitor and saying you hacked their login...and I guess it's like someone really nice or something lol. Absolutely pathetic.
Thankfully he did not have my personality or he'd have had the balls to hack a anonymous-controlled website or communication system instead. Or at least Rick Roll them lol. Trolling Anonymous would be HILARIOUS. Hacking charities, not so much.

Re:I have a theory, and an ever better comparison (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40852269)

If only there was a place or several where you could post anonymously and was dedicated to basically trolling "anonymous." Even better if it allowed you to attach images to your posts, you could do things like make them look at gore, tranny trap porn, read mundane crap with no ending, or the worst thing of them all disguise links to rick rolls!

Ohh well, one can dream, brother!

It's about humour (1)

Sasayaki (1096761) | about 2 years ago | (#40852151)

The main goal of Anonymous, if such a thing can be strictly defined, is to do things that are funny.

The reactions of offended people are often funny, in a warped way, especially when people display stunning illiteracy or are venerating someone just because they are dead (see tribute pages for utter douchebags like Lee Hotti). Sometimes they do things that cross the line into "Dude, not funny", but that's the nature of a group whose membership is so loosely defined.

For every successful raid or whatever, there are hundreds more that are suggested and shouted down ("No we won't raid your ex-girlfriend's Facebook page, because we're not your personal army").

The only things that most observers can determine about the moral compass of Anonymous is that they really, really hate anyone hurting cats.

Re:It's about humour (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40852435)

Yeah, it was hilarious watching them back down when they fucked with the Zetas and realized there might be real-world consequences. It was even funnier when they put seizure-inducing graphics on an epilepsy website. They go exclusively after people that can't strike back. Wonderful people that thrive on striking soft targets, then strutting around telling everyone to "expect them".

Tor Discussion Forums | We Will Not Be Silenced! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40852263)


mature adults should visit and post at one or both of these unofficial tor discussion forums, these tinyurl's will take you to:

** HackBB:
http://www.tinyurl.com/hackbbonion [tinyurl.com]

** Onion Forum 2.0
http://www.tinyurl.com/onionforum2 [tinyurl.com]

Each tinyurl link will take you to a hidden service discussion forum. Tor is required to visit these links, even though they appear to be on the open web, they will lead you to .onion sites.

I know the Tor developers can do better, but how many years are we to wait?

Caution: some topics may be disturbing. You should be eighteen years or older. I recommend you disable images in your browser when viewing these two forums[1] and only enabling them if you are posting a message, but still be careful! Disable javascript and cookies, too.

If you prefer to visit the hidden services directly, bypassing the tinyurl service:

HackBB: (directly)
http://clsvtzwzdgzkjda7.onion/ [clsvtzwzdgzkjda7.onion]

Onion Forum 2.0: (directly)
http://65bgvta7yos3sce5.onion/ [65bgvta7yos3sce5.onion]

The tinyurl links are provided as a simple means of memorizing the hidden services via a link shortening service (tinyurl.com).

[1]: Because any content can be posted! Think 4chan, for example. onionforum2 doesn't appear to be heavily moderated so be aware and take precautions.

And here I was ... (1)

MartinSchou (1360093) | about 2 years ago | (#40852271)

Thinking back to the "good old days", when Anonymous members would be sending nice letters like "snitches get stitches" to people who informed on them.

anonymous still exists? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40852689)

I thought the majority of the leaders were in federal "pound me in the ass" prisons...

Impress Anonymous? A. should be impressive first. (1)

Opportunist (166417) | about 2 years ago | (#40852841)

'scuse me, but impress Anonymous? While I have to admit they are great at PR, so far their "hacking" skills are not too impressive. Judging from the data I could gather so far, their targets were so far sites whose admin should be shot. Not fired. Shot. For gross negligence. How did he want to impress them? By showing them he could fire more "or 1=1" sql requests per second?

Don't get me wrong, I don't question that they might be able to bring out more sophisticated attacks, just so far they have only shown that in the kingdom of the blind, even someone who opens an eye from time to time can become king...

Rules (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#40852899)

"Anonymous" doesn't have rules. Their decisions to turn on their own are arbitrary.

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