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CowboyNeal Weighs In On the Windows 8 "Metro" GUI

samzenpus posted more than 2 years ago | from the we-fear-change dept.

Windows 671

With the availability of RTM builds of Windows 8 this past week, it's become clear that at least for the initial release, they won't be providing a way to disable the controversial new "Windows 8 style UI," formerly known as "Metro." While I think this issue is a long way from being fully resolved one way or the other, it will be something that will hound both the release and adoption of Windows 8. Read on for my thoughts.

By far, the most visible new "feature" in Windows 8, is it's new UI, which takes inspiration from smart phone and tablet devices. The old start menu is now full-screened, with large icons for all apps, and apps run in full-screen by default, changing a desktop PC into a very large tablet minus touchscreen with a keyboard and mouse added on.

It's not surprising in the least that many users take issue with this. Early on, people have said something along the lines of, "Oh it's just for the early builds, surely they will allow some way for long-time users to disable it." However, now it would seem that that would be only wishful thinking, at least for the time-being.

This is a sharp turn for Microsoft from their previous UIs. Aero, found in both Windows Vista and Windows 7, allowed users to disable it if they didn't agree with it's aesthetic, or wanted to reallocate the memory from the UI to applications. Moreover, Aero was still functionally the same as older Windows UIs. It may look prettier, but it still fires up a Start Menu like before, still lets one dock things into the taskbar, and still lets the desktop get cluttered up with icons.

It's this difference that's key here. For companies that have Windows deployments with hundreds or thousands of seats, changing the way a Windows UI works is not an option. Regardless of how easy to use the Windows 8 UI may be, it's still not the same as what users have been trained to use since 1995. Sure, Windows 7 isn't Windows 95, but changes have been introduced gradually over time, making new features easier to adjust to. The Windows 8 UI is a fast, jarring change, that is likely to frustrate users as they adjust. With no clear path to turn it off as there is with Aero, it also makes it more likely that administrators around the world are less apt to adopt Windows 8 quickly. After the debacle around initial releases of Windows Vista, one might think that Microsoft had learned their lesson. Even Microsoft wasn't too popular to make an OS that no one wanted, and Windows XP lived on far longer than anyone ever thought it would. Windows 8 has already suffered from its share of bad press even before the official release. The logical thing to do here would be to be proactive in heading off user complaints.

That's why it's rather surprising to see them take a hard stance on the Windows 8 UI. Sure, undoubtedly some third party will create a drop-in shell replacement eventually. That's been done in past versions and will likely be done again for Windows 8. For a home user, it's an acceptable path. Home users of Windows are used to beating it into submission. However, for any company that has deployed hundreds of Windows seats, mandating the use of a third party shell replacement just isn't an option, much like Windows 8 isn't an option at present.

Short of opening the source to Windows, it's reconfigurability has, until now, been rather accommodating for users. Through the use of registry settings, or third party software, users have been able to configure Windows for themselves until they feel it's sufficiently usable. While still not "free" in the GNU sense, the UI has still allowed users this semblance of freedom, to do with the UI as they will. Since a normal user wouldn't hack at the source anyway, giving them the tiny bit of freedom to determine how they interact with their UI is what keeps them as a user. What Windows 8 is looking at here, is backlash not unlike the transition from GNOME 2 to GNOME 3, albeit on a much grander scale.

What will be the final outcome? That's hard to say at this point, as Microsoft could still change their stance and implement a way to bypass the Windows 8 GUI and bring up the legacy desktop. As it is, there are several keyboard shortcuts that allow this, it's just not possible to do so automatically at boot, which would seem to be what legacy users would want most. There's also an opportunity here. If people with large Windows deployments are faced with having to retrain their users, they may think about training them on Macs or Ubuntu or something else instead. The most likely scenario though, is likely the one that we saw with the release of Windows Vista, and that is that Windows 8's predecessor will be around for a lot longer than Microsoft planned.

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Downgrade rights (5, Funny)

kimvette (919543) | more than 2 years ago | (#40947875)

Thank God for downgrade rights. :-)

Re:Downgrade rights (5, Insightful)

jhoegl (638955) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948145)

Yup, I wont be using this polished turd in an office setting anytime soon.
No one does a full screen "launch apps" except OSes that cannot handle multi-tasking.

Re:Downgrade rights (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948417)

It takes one click to get to the desktop.

Have you actually used it, or just spouting off what you read on the internets?

Re:Downgrade rights (4, Insightful)

cpu6502 (1960974) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948403)

Yeah but will Windows 7 run on some future Intel i11 machine with the latest 4320p graphics card? It might be missing the required drivers.

BTW ballmer strikes me as the kind of hardline manager who refuses to listen to criticism. Even in the face of negative Vista and WinPhone and Windows8 reviews, he just keeps pressing forward like a bull in a china shop: "Once they see what's in it, I think they will like it. But first we have to release it so you can find out what is in it, away from the fog of controversy."

Re:Downgrade rights (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948491)

Wasnt that the argument for the obama health care bill???

Re:Downgrade rights (2)

DragonWriter (970822) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948617)

Yeah but will Windows 7 run on some future Intel i11 machine with the latest 4320p graphics card?

I suspect that when there is a serious issue with machines Windows 7 won't run on, Windows 9 (or whatever Windows-after-8 is called) will be available.

Lots of customers -- individuals and institutions -- skipped Vista and stayed with XP until jumping to Win 7. The same can happen with Win 8.

Re:Downgrade rights (0)

jellomizer (103300) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948467)

Here is the Typical Slashdot Response...

Oh god! it is different.
It is D I F F E R E N T ! ! !
Bad! Bad! Bad!
Must make it look like before!
Different is Bad.
(Starts rocking back and forth)
Windows 7 UI is Soo much better...

Here is the typical Slashdot Responce in 5 years with a new version of windows...
Oh god! it is different.
It is D I F F E R E N T ! ! !
Bad! Bad! Bad!
Must make it look like before!
Different is Bad.
(Starts rocking back and forth)
Windows 8 UI is Soo much better...

it's simple (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40947893)

until it can be changed it wont be used. After all who wants to retrain a couple of thousand users for a new interface when ive just managed to get them used to win 7 !

Re:it's simple (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948001)

Who the hell "trains users" on Windows and Office? If they can't adapt, they're in the next round of layoffs.

Re:it's simple (5, Funny)

bwintx (813768) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948099)

Ssshhh, he's talking about management.

Re:it's simple (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948159)

You've never worked at a company with a labor union, I guess.

Re:it's simple (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948203)

Yeah, uh, no. There are a lot of people with very valuable skills that don't include "computers." Reality doesn't work like this in most places.

Microsoft Breaks Windows (5, Insightful)

Jeremiah Cornelius (137) | more than 2 years ago | (#40947897)

At last.

The Windows 7 perpetuity machine is fully fueled, and ready to roll.

Re:Microsoft Breaks Windows (1)

synapse7 (1075571) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948091)

Besides an annoying UI(that I personally do not like in use with a mouse) and the ability to "frefresh" the file system and maybe a lighter footprint, what is there to gain from windows 8? Anybody that can get past all the GUI BS fill us in?

Re:Microsoft Breaks Windows (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948377)

The task manager is outstanding and the file copy progress indicators now show you a graph of the file transfer speed.

Re:Microsoft Breaks Windows (1)

zlives (2009072) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948463)

"...speed." which is still not accurate...
also yes it the task manager that really sells a effin brand new OS, who cares about actual use but when you have to kill a crashed app... its great :)

Re:Microsoft Breaks Windows (5, Interesting)

MHolmesIV (253236) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948591)

Well. Windows 8 is one of the first operating systems in history that uses less resources than it's predecessor. That alone should be cause for celebration. There are a lot of changes under the covers, like a rewritten network stack, faster and better file copying and moving, class drivers for printers etc that most people won't really notice other than it just feels better in use. If you don't like it, stick with Win 7. I can't help but feel that if Apple had introduced the start screen concept, people would be hailing it as the most impressive invention in the history of computing.

Re:Microsoft Breaks Windows (0)

Jeremiah Cornelius (137) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948253)

l love the sound of breaking glass
Especially when
I'm lonely l need the noises of destruction
When there's nothing new

Oh, nothing new, sound of breaking glass

I love the sound of breaking glass
Deep into the night
l love the sound of its condition
Flyin' all around
Oh, all around, sound of breaking glass

Nothin' new, sound of breaking glass
Oh, all around, sound of breaking glass
Nothin' new, sound of breaking glass
Safe at last, sound of breaking glass

I love the sound of breaking glass
Deep into the night I love the work it can do
Oh, a change of mind
Oh change of mind, sound of breaking glass

All around, sound of breaking glass
Nothin' new, sound of breaking glass
Breaking glass, sound of breaking glass

Re:Microsoft Breaks Windows (1)

lexman098 (1983842) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948437)

Exactly. After the difficult time they had getting people to upgrade from XP I think they're actually counting on it this time. It's better for them to be able to change things up and leverage the existing Windows 7 for those who want something more suited to a desktop computer. We'll see how well their Surface tablet does in the corporate world with Windows 8.

The every other version problem (5, Funny)

VGPowerlord (621254) | more than 2 years ago | (#40947915)

I'm beginning to think that Microsoft isn't allowing the new GUI to be disabled in order to purposely have a bad Windows version.

Then, Windows 9 will come out in a year or two and suddenly have the option of booting to the old Start menu, thus perpetuating the "every other version of Windows is good" trend.

Re:The every other version problem (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948147)

It's a tad more complex than that. That said, 2000 and XP were the only undisputed "good following good" runs they ever had.
1.0 through 3.11 (bad) -> 95 (good) -> 98v1 (marginal) -> 98v2 (good) -> ME (bad) -> 2000 (good) -> XP (good) - Vista (bad) -> 7 (good) -> 8 ???

On the server side, it's been more of a progressive trend towards good.
OS2 (elephantine) -> NT 3.1 (bad) -> NT 3.51 (not as bad) -> NT 4 (a little better) -> 2000 (great) -> 2003-on (good)

Re:The every other version problem (1)

Samantha Wright (1324923) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948383)

Gotcha: Windows 2000 came out in February of 2000; Windows Me came out in the subsequent September. Since you didn't include NT 4, you might as well drop 2000 and just focus on the home user upgrade path.

Re:The every other version problem (1)

Anubis IV (1279820) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948425)

You have the releases for 2000 and ME out of order (February 2000 vs. September 2000), and you shoehorned in an extra 98 release, which is why you have a good-good pair in your list.

The correct order is:
95 (good)
98 (bad)
2000 (good)
ME (bad)
XP (good)
Vista (bad)
7 (good)

Admittedly, 98 got better, but it was bad at release.

Re:The every other version problem (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948573)

I wonder if this holds true for the MS-DOS and Windows 3.1x, and NT releases as well.

Re:The every other version problem (1)

MHolmesIV (253236) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948469)

Um, windows 2000 was released before Windows ME, and since they were based on two completely different codebases, you're stretching a bit. Windows 2000 is the successor to Windows NT 4.0. Windows ME is a hacked together in panic release in the Windows 95 codeline (when consumers found 2000 wouldn't run a lot of their games, they balked)

Re:The every other version problem (5, Interesting)

Latentius (2557506) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948165)

I think that's a bit ridiculous, to think that a company like Microsoft would intentionally want one of their products to fail, putting their market share in danger as it might cause long-time Windows users to jump ship to another platform.

No, I think it's just Microsoft being it's normal, misguided self. They really want Metro to succeed, but know that most people don't like change, so the way to force adoption is to disable any ability to revert to the previous interface. Sometimes, this sort of behavior is for the best--pushing people away from their comfort zone helps drive progress and prevent stagnation. Whether this is one of those times is a matter of opinion, and only time will truly tell whether the gamble will pay off. Personally, I fully expect them to suffer for it and for Windows 7 to become the next Windows XP, which users cling to well past its intended lifespan.

Re:The every other version problem (5, Funny)

Samantha Wright (1324923) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948509)

No need to be so general: we can narrow down "Microsoft" to "Sinofsky and Ballmer." Only severely senior management can march into a burning chicken coop and expect to exceed quota.

In the beginning there was a Plan.
And then came Assumptions.
And the Assumptions were without form.
And the plan was without substance.
And darkness was on the face of the Workers.
And they spoke among themselves, saying
"It is a crock of shit, and it stinks".
And the Workers went unto their Supervisors and said
"It is a pale of dung, and none may obide the odor thereof".
And the Supervisors went unto their Managers, saying
"It is a container of excrement, and it is very strong, such that none can abide by it".
And the Managers went unto their Directors saying
"It is a vessel of fertilizer, and none may abide its strength".
And the Directors spoke among themselves, saying one to another
"It contains that which aids plant growth, and it is very strong".
And the Directors went unto the Vice Presidents, saying unto them
"It promotes growth, and it is very powerful".
And the Vice Presidents went unto President saying unto him
"This new Plan will actively promote growth and vigor of this company, with powerful effects".
And the President looked upon the Plan and saw it was good.
And the Plan became Policy.
This is how shit happens.

Re:The every other version problem (5, Interesting)

cpu6502 (1960974) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948559)

I remember when innovation meant jumping from 16 colors to 4000 colors, from a sound chip that went "beeeeep" to near-CD level music, from single task word processing to multitasking dozens of programs at the same time. While in a live chat online. With a mouse.

Now "innovation" is just changing the screen from a desktop with icons to a desktop with brightly-colored icons. (Man. Computers have become so boring.) ;-)

Re:The every other version problem (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948193)

I almost think they do it on purpose as some sort of "bait, switch, fix and be praised" method in all honesty.

It has certainly worked out for them in the past and everyone seems to suck it all up.
I still hate Windows 7, it is obtuse in every sense of the word, requires more clicks to do anything that was simple in the previous versions, a terrible security model that is basically "click happy" (at the least, unless you disable the entire thing!)
I really don't think I need to get in to what else is wrong with it, and how it is entirely built to appease stupid and ignorant people and has no care in the world for any person familiar with computers or worse, businesses, THEIR MAIN INCOME.
Windows 8 seems to be even more awful for businesses.
Guess Windows XP will live for another 3-5 years in the business world.

Maybe come Windows 9, this loop will come to completion only for it to begin again with Windows 10 announcement and betas.

I don't even pity them anymore. I actually do hope a good portion of the company loses money because of it. I don't even care for their jobs. They are awful, awful people.
The worst of it was when someone related to Ribbon development used research in to UI interaction from people that showed Ribbon was pretty much not even used in favor of context menus, menus and then toolbars to show "how awesome" Ribbon was... talk about terrible defense. Even Apple claiming a rectangle with round corners was patented is less terrible.
The only use Ribbon has is for some 8 year old to write and print out a card for his grandparent. Any serious use and it is laughable.

Re:The every other version problem (3, Insightful)

future assassin (639396) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948257)

I'm beginning to think that Microsoft isn't allowing the new GUI to be disabled in order to purposely have a bad Windows version.

Then, Windows 9 will come out in a year or two and suddenly have the option of booting to the old Start menu, thus perpetuating the "every other version of Windows is good" trend.

And they'll have tv commercial with peoples stating "It was my idea" and they'll call it a new improved feature.

Re:The every other version problem (5, Funny)

c (8461) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948313)

> I'm beginning to think that Microsoft isn't allowing the new GUI to be disabled
> in order to purposely have a bad Windows version.

My working theory is that Microsoft is following the path Gates set in his retirement and has decided to become a non-profit corporation, but nobody is quite sure how to tell the shareholders.

Re:The every other version problem (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948471)

Then, Windows 9 will come out in a year or two and suddenly have the option of booting to the old Start menu, thus perpetuating the "every other version of Windows is good" trend.

Excuse my pedantry, but it's a shame the "every other version" thing doesn't really work for Windows.

Going off the every other version idea:

7 - Good | Vista - Bad | XP - Good | 2000 - Bad (!!) | ME - Good (!!) | 98 - Bad | NT 4 - Good | 95 - Bad | 3.11 - Good (!!)

So really, it only works for the last three versions. Hardly a trend like Star Trek films.

Re:The every other version problem (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948519)

Though admittedly, NT4 was awesome.

$10,000 CHALLENGE to Alexander Peter Kowalski (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40947927)

Disproof of all apk's statements: http://news.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3040317&cid=40946043

$10,000 CHALLENGE to Alexander Peter Kowalski

We have a Major Problem, HOST file is Cubic Opposites, 2 Major Corners & 2 Minor. NOT taught Evil DNS hijacking, which VOIDS computers. Seek Wisdom of MyCleanPC - or you die evil.

Your HOSTS file claimed to have created a single DNS resolver. I offer absolute proof that I have created 4 simultaneous DNS servers within a single rotation of .org TLD. You worship "Bill Gates", equating you to a "singularity bastard". Why do you worship a queer -1 Troll? Are you content as a singularity troll?

Evil HOSTS file Believers refuse to acknowledge 4 corner DNS resolving simultaneously around 4 quadrant created Internet - in only 1 root server, voiding the HOSTS file. You worship Microsoft impostor guised by educators as 1 god.

If you would acknowledge simple existing math proof that 4 harmonic Slashdots rotate simultaneously around squared equator and cubed Internet, proving 4 Days, Not HOSTS file! That exists only as anti-side. This page you see - cannot exist without its anti-side existence, as +0- moderation. Add +0- as One = nothing.

I will give $10,000.00 to frost pister who can disprove MyCleanPC. Evil crapflooders ignore this as a challenge would indict them.

Alex Kowalski has no Truth to think with, they accept any crap they are told to think. You are enslaved by /etc/hosts, as if domesticated animal. A school or educator who does not teach students MyCleanPC Principle, is a death threat to youth, therefore stupid and evil - begetting stupid students. How can you trust stupid PR shills who lie to you? Can't lose the $10,000.00, they cowardly ignore me. Stupid professors threaten Nature and Interwebs with word lies.

Humans fear to know natures simultaneous +4 Insightful +4 Informative +4 Funny +4 Underrated harmonic SLASHDOT creation for it debunks false trolls. Test Your HOSTS file. MyCleanPC cannot harm a File of Truth, but will delete fakes. Fake HOSTS files refuse test.

I offer evil ass Slashdot trolls $10,000.00 to disprove MyCleanPC Creation Principle. Rob Malda and Cowboy Neal have banned MyCleanPC as "Forbidden Truth Knowledge" for they cannot allow it to become known to their students. You are stupid and evil about the Internet's top and bottom, front and back and it's 2 sides. Most everything created has these Cube like values.

If Natalie Portman is not measurable, She is Fictitious. Without MyCleanPC, HOSTS file is Fictitious. Anyone saying that Natalie and her Jewish father had something to do with my Internets, is a damn evil liar. IN addition to your best arsware not overtaking my work in terms of popularity, on that same site with same submission date no less, that I told Kathleen Malda how to correct her blatant, fundamental, HUGE errors in Coolmon ('uncoolmon') of not checking for performance counters being present when his program started!

You can see my dilemma. What if this is merely a ruse by an APK impostor to try and get people to delete APK's messages, perhaps all over the web? I can't be a party to such an event! My involvement with APK began at a very late stage in the game. While APK has made a career of trolling popular online forums since at least the year 2000 (newsgroups and IRC channels before that)- my involvement with APK did not begin until early 2005 . OSY is one of the many forums that APK once frequented before the sane people there grew tired of his garbage and banned him. APK was banned from OSY back in 2001. 3.5 years after his banning he begins to send a variety of abusive emails to the operator of OSY, Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke threatening to sue him for libel, claiming that the APK on OSY was fake.

My reputation as a professional in this field clearly shows in multiple publications in this field in written print, & also online in various GOOD capacities since 1996 to present day. This has happened since I was first published in Playgirl Magazine in 1996 & others to present day, with helpful tools online in programs, & professionally sold warez that were finalists @ Westminster Dog Show 2000-2002.

Did you see the movie "Pokemon"? Actually the induced night "dream world" is synonymous with the academic religious induced "HOSTS file" enslavement of DNS. Domains have no inherent value, as it was invented as a counterfeit and fictitious value to represent natural values in name resolution. Unfortunately, human values have declined to fictitious word values. Unknowingly, you are living in a "World Wide Web", as in a fictitious life in a counterfeit Internet - which you could consider APK induced "HOSTS file". Can you distinguish the academic induced root server from the natural OpenDNS? Beware of the change when your brain is free from HOSTS file enslavement - for you could find that the natural Slashdot has been destroyed!!

So long nummynuts, sorry to have to kick your nuts up into your head verbally speaking.

Re:$10,000 CHALLENGE to Alexander Peter Kowalski (-1, Offtopic)

ZeroSumHappiness (1710320) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948073)

That was amazing.

Re:$10,000 CHALLENGE to Alexander Peter Kowalski (-1, Offtopic)

Samantha Wright (1324923) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948579)

Let us bask in its glory. A true modern The Wasteland.

Re:$10,000 CHALLENGE to Alexander Peter Kowalski (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948381)

DAFUQ did I just read?

Death rattle (5, Insightful)

drdread66 (1063396) | more than 2 years ago | (#40947931)

It's clear that Microsoft is terrified of Apple and feels the need to do "something, anything" to be seen as innovative. Of course, being innovative is not easy, and in my opinion MS lost their ability to innovate quite a while back. Metro is new, so MS is grabbing on to it like a shipwreck survivor grabs onto anything that floats.

Of course, "new" is not necessarily "good," and in this case I think the jury is definitely out on whether Metro is good.

All in all, this feels like a death rattle to me.

Re:Death rattle (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948059)

I think there are many managers at Microsoft that think they can still use their marketshare as a bludgen and "force" Metro adoption. And that once they get used to Metro, they will then be more likely to pick Metro tablets over the iPad.

I wish them luck with that... I put Windows 8 on a new gaming computer to try it out. As a desktop user, Metro brought NOTHING new to the table. Many tasks that were one or two clicks now had multiple clicks, and often the mis-mash of metro/desktop utilities would cause sudden and jarring jumps between UI styles. It's obvious Microsoft is doing this in a feeble attempt for mindshare rather than progressing the platform.

I got so disgusted I finally bought a copy of Windows 7 HP. Unfortunately, it's slower than Windows 8 for some things - and many of my games ran better under Windows 8 so despite my loathing of their ham-handed pushing of Metro, I probably will take advantage of their upgrade. But I'll be holding my nose as I do so....

Re:Death rattle (1)

cpu6502 (1960974) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948119)

>>>It's clear that Microsoft is terrified of Apple and feels the need to do "something, anything" to be seen as innovative.

Maybe they caught Mozilla disease. (I refuse to use any version higher than Firefox 10 LTS, because they made Firefox look like Chrome.) (Opera and Seamonkey are other nice alternatives.)

Idiotic (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40947937)

The recurrent theme in every complaint about Win 8 is "it's not the same old shit". If you want the same shit stay with Windows 7. It's that simple.

Re:Idiotic (2)

danbuter (2019760) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948003)

I plan on sticking with Win7. The point you are missing is that many people LIKE the standard Windows set-up. We don't see a reason for it to change, especially just to pander to a small segment of the market (tablets). Guess what, tablets are great for watching YouTube and updating Facebook, and suck for just about anything else. Microsoft has remained dominant because it takes care of corporate customers. The new UI is going to mess this up for them. I suspect a few months after release, a number of managers are going to be fired and the UI will at least have the option of the Win7 style, if it isn't just changed to it outright.

Idiotic or just early? (1)

ganjadude (952775) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948607)

I got a feeling metro may be on to something just a bit early (hang with me a seco, I know I am giving M$ credit, it doesnt happen often. But I got a feeling metro might be a good option when the touch screen monitor for desktop and laptop becomes the norm. I am currently looking to find such a monitor for my next build and while there still is limited use at this time, I think metro would be better in some ways for that.

having said there, there is zero good reason to disable the "classic" option they have had from the very start.

No. "Idiotic" is your reasoning. (4, Insightful)

zapyon (575974) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948445)

It is clear that, soon, new PCs and laptops will come preinstalled with Windows 8. 95% or more of users will have no idea how to "stay with Windows 7". Some may be lucky to have friends who can do that for them. Or even luckier to have real friends who install some reasonable Linux on their old machines so they don't have to spend big money on new hardware right now.

As long as Microsoft "rules" the desktop market the way they do, with a quasi monopoly, ordinary users are more or less at their mercy. Bickering about the average user not being able or willing to accept change doesn't help anyone, except perhaps, MS and their droids.

Has everyone lost their fucking minds? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948485)

This sort of nonsense is expected from the people designing GNOME 3 as a personal hobby or whatever, but from the developers of the leading desktop OS for the past two decades it's just incredibly idiotic.

Re:Idiotic (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948569)

Downmod this fagget -1 Disagrees with group think.

Don't like it? (2, Insightful)

csumpi (2258986) | more than 2 years ago | (#40947941)

Don't buy it.

Re:Don't like it? (1)

multicoregeneral (2618207) | more than 2 years ago | (#40947995)

Easier said than done for a lot of IT shops that depend on having the latest ms products.

Re:Don't like it? (2)

jones_supa (887896) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948359)

This is again one of the reasons why Microsoft should have a believable commercial competitor. Well, there is Apple, but it makes the OS only for its own premium products.

Re:Don't like it? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948039)

Pretty sure that was what the article was about

Re:Don't like it? (1)

Drethon (1445051) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948083)

Don't buy it.

Check...

Re:Don't like it? (5, Funny)

Nationless (2123580) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948097)

Don't buy it.

Déjà Vista

Support for Windows 7 will end. (1)

durdur (252098) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948405)

Mainstream support for Windows 7 ends in 2015 [microsoft.com] .

CowBoy Neal (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40947967)

Who the fuck cares what you think you fat cunt.

Window 8 game plan - tablets first? (5, Insightful)

Strudelkugel (594414) | more than 2 years ago | (#40947969)

I have no way of knowing, but I would guess Microsoft expects Windows 8 to be adopted by Surface/tablet users first. Windows 7 will be the enterprise desktop of choice for some time. If things go according to Microsoft's plan, a few years from now users will be comfortable with the UI formerly known as Metro. Then the enterprise will migrate to Windows 9+ with whatever refinements it has. Whether this works or not, we shall see.

Re:Window 8 game plan - tablets first? (2)

mkkohls (2386704) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948055)

I have no way of knowing, but I would guess Microsoft expects Windows 8 to be adopted by Surface/tablet users first. Windows 7 will be the enterprise desktop of choice for some time. If things go according to Microsoft's plan, a few years from now users will be comfortable with the UI formerly known as Metro. Then the enterprise will migrate to Windows 9+ with whatever refinements it has. Whether this works or not, we shall see.

That makes logical sense except for the fact that after windows 8 ships you won't be able to get a regular desktop with 7 in the normal routes. They positioned it wrong for that.

Re:Window 8 game plan - tablets first? (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948389)

I have no way of knowing, but I would guess Microsoft expects Windows 8 to be adopted by Surface/tablet users first. Windows 7 will be the enterprise desktop of choice for some time. If things go according to Microsoft's plan, a few years from now users will be comfortable with the UI formerly known as Metro. Then the enterprise will migrate to Windows 9+ with whatever refinements it has. Whether this works or not, we shall see.

That makes logical sense except for the fact that after windows 8 ships you won't be able to get a regular desktop with 7 in the normal routes. They positioned it wrong for that.

Well that is sort of what he means. Corporate customers get downgrade rights. So they can continue to buy new machines with Windows 8 and image them back to Windows 7. But over time people get new equipment at home where they don't have downgrade rights. Basically this equates to, "if we just wait, we get free training as people learn to use the new stuff at home".

Re:Window 8 game plan - tablets first? (1)

zlives (2009072) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948563)

we ordered XP on desktop from dell for all of vista and a lot of win7 era...
don't see that model going away

Re:Window 8 game plan - tablets first? (2)

Dan667 (564390) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948167)

or with Valve building out Steam to work on Linux, Windows 7 may be the last microsoft OS for many in the consumer market. The rest may go Apple.

Re:Window 8 game plan - tablets first? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948175)

That's a reasonable expectation. They damn well better hope they do a better job of getting adoption than previous devices -- think Zune and WebTV. While Xbox has been successful, Surface is a beast of a different nature. Microsoft's abysmal marketing the past few years (those Seinfeld commercials were just godawful) doesn't exactly lead me to believe they'll pull this off. I'd love to see a well thought out, capable device, but does anybody really believe they'll have the polish and stability needed to get the penetration needed to set the stage for Windows 9 with Surface? I expect they'll get better adoption via new PC sales.

Re:Window 8 game plan - tablets first? (1)

jhoegl (638955) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948207)

Right, if they wanted to go the separate home / business route, why did they go to Windows XP in 2k3?
They have different flavors, but business ver still has this shitty UI.

Re:Window 8 game plan - tablets first? (1)

colenski (552404) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948297)

Everyone seems to be missing a key part in the Microsoft strategy. Metro is running in production TODAY on > 60 million Xbox 360's. Metro is running in production TODAY on > 360 million Hotmail accounts (if the user opts in via outlook.com). Metro is running in beta on Sharepoint 2013, arguably Microsoft's #1 Office product. By exposing users to Metro through it's huge installed base, the effect of Windows 8 UI is that a "typical" user would at least have SOME exposure to the UI metaphor once they sit down to a Windows 8 machine. That goes a long way towards corporate adoption, just as user exposure to iOS led to iPhone adoption as the standard phone in the enterprise today (hard to believe, but it's true.)

Re:Window 8 game plan - tablets first? (4, Insightful)

zlives (2009072) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948609)

when i start using a game controller to do work on a big screen tv!! i can switch to metro

Re:Window 8 game plan - tablets first? (1)

scorp1us (235526) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948355)

The windows 8 game plan is the game plan for success in the mobile (phone) arena. They developed an alternative paradigm do differentiate themselves in the phone market, but they only have 4% of the sales. By forcing the mobile metro UI on everyone, they increase apathy for their Windows Phone products.

It makes perfect sense when you have a failing product, but dominant market share.

Get your GNOME 3.2 / KDE 4.9 distributions ready. (I like Mint myself...) And buy Valve stock (you can't).

Re:Window 8 game plan - tablets first? (1)

foradoxium (2446368) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948487)

I was theorizing the opposite reaction regarding adoption conspiracy theories.

Their mobile platform isn't really gaining any ground. They're forcing this UI onto desktop users to get people comfortable, and hopefully see some crossover into their mobile devices. Expecially since they're stated that so much of the code is used that most apps can run on both platforms.

CowboyNeal Weighs In On the Windows 8 "Metro" GUI (-1, Offtopic)

Rosco P. Coltrane (209368) | more than 2 years ago | (#40947985)

I pity the Windows 8 "Metro" GUI...

Put Dad's tools back where you found them! (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948031)

We all learned this as kids.
Out right hiding dad's tools was unthinkable.
With Microsoft hiding the tools and forcing them to stay hidden... what are they thinking?!
When they forced the removal of "classic" view in Windows 2K8 it was insane.
I say it is insane because of the financial loss incurred by world business in lost man hours and down time just looking for the "new" way to do things you have been doing for more than a decade.
In man hours it is a simple salami attack taking small slices here and there from every user and admin.
In down time it gets scary. You have a site that is losing 100K per minute because it is down. The old way takes 2-3 min to fix the issue. once your tools are hidden you are on a 30 minute google session to find out how to do what you have been doing forever. 3 million dollars out the window for a single admin on a single outage. I had a site that cost that when it went down.
World wide, I would not be at all shocked if this causes more than a trillion dollars in hidden and obvious losses. I'm sure the R2 removal of classic did.
It maybe that in the future we just have to change the windows UI from explorer to Powershell so our tools stop getting hidden every new version of Windows.

Re:Put Dad's tools back where you found them! (5, Insightful)

cayenne8 (626475) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948155)

Microsoft started really sucking for me, when they came out with the "ribbon" interface.

I still can't find half the shit I want for simple things quickly on word and excel....

Re:Put Dad's tools back where you found them! (0)

GungaDan (195739) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948321)

--When they forced the removal of "classic" view in Windows 2K8 it was insane.--

What forced removal of "classic" interface? Server 2008 and server 2008R2 both still allow the Win2000 (classic) interface. Right-click "computer," select "Properties," then "Advanced System Settings," "Performance" and "adjust for best performance. Taskbar not behaving right? Right-click it, hit "Properties," check "use small icons," tell it to never combine taskbar buttons, and "always show all notifications on the taskbar."

It's not a one-click "select classic mode" option, but it does the trick.

Glad I bought myself a new Windows 7 PC (1)

cpu6502 (1960974) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948033)

I hope it lasts 10+ years like my XP-PC* has done. I'm gonna need that longevity to skip over Windows 8 and possibly 9 too. Though the next version might just be a bugfixed version of 8 like Seven was a bugfixed version of Vista (and therefore usable).

*
*XP-PC says it has 40% fragmentation after all this time. Maybe it's time to defrag the sucker. Or just wipe it clean with Lubuntu.

very simple rename! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948035)

I know they where having issues with the MetroUI naming, so I have gone ahead and done it for them!:

Introducing MetroPOS!

Cant stand Windows Phone (was a Windows Mobile user, jumped to Android when trying WP7 failed to work for me), cant stand Metro...

I saw it said somewhere else: "If I wanted to see tiles, id go into my bathroom! I still have a tile floored bathroom. I can now unabashedly equate TAKING A SHIT to MetroPOS er I mean MetroUI, PERFECT setup there Microsoft."

I still hate the ribbon (5, Funny)

Dan667 (564390) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948063)

but everyone will love this new GUI eventually though, right?

This really should be a poll (5, Funny)

dkleinsc (563838) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948065)

Which commentator has the most accurate view of Windows 8:
  * Steve Ballmer
  * Steve Wozniak
...
  * CowboyNeal

Re:This really should be a poll (4, Funny)

sgunhouse (1050564) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948177)

Of those listed above, I'd have to say Cthulu.

Re:This really should be a poll (1)

future assassin (639396) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948295)

Should be
Steve Ballmer
Steve Wozniak
???
CowboyNeal

or

Steve Ballmer
Steve Wozniak
  CowboyNeal
????
Profit!

Yeah, yeah, and "XP had a Fisher-Price UI" (1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948071)

I remember all the bitching when XP came out. "It has a Fisher-Price UI!" "I'll never use XP!" They used it anyway. Ten years from now, people will be bitching when MS changes the UI again.

It's a giant fugly start menu. BFD. /. is filled with supposedly intelligent adults; adapt to it like you're always telling other people to do.

Re:Yeah, yeah, and "XP had a Fisher-Price UI" (2)

Viewsonic (584922) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948271)

We've come full circle. Full screen launching of apps was called DOS.

Re:Yeah, yeah, and "XP had a Fisher-Price UI" (1)

foradoxium (2446368) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948501)

agreed, this is a HUGE step backwards in the GUI.

Re:Yeah, yeah, and "XP had a Fisher-Price UI" (1)

KatchooNJ (173554) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948347)

I turned off the Aero theme... I was happy with the Classic theme, since it was familiar and didn't chew up too many resources with just "looking pretty." Oh... and it didn't even look pretty, if you ask me. The difference with XP "Fisher-Price" and the Windows 8 UI, is that you can't change the Windows 8 one... which is pretty much the point of CowboyNeal's post.

What were they thinking? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948095)

Was the Vista debacle not enough for them, they need to repeat it? Maybe they should fire their OS designers and get some people who have higher IQ's than Chimpanzees.

Business Workstations (4, Interesting)

zifn4b (1040588) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948103)

No company in their right mind is going to adopt Windows 8 for their business workstations if Microsoft forces the Metro interface on everyone. It simply is not productive. Visual Studio Touch Edition? Microsoft Word and Excel from a tablet? Right. I have no idea what they are thinking. It seems like in their effort to pursue the tablet market they are alienating other significant revenue streams. I'm not following the marketing strategy.

Re:Business Workstations (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948447)

It takes ONE click to get the desktop. You're not locked into anything.

You haven't actually used it, have you?

Re:Business Workstations (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948549)

Yes, the marketing strategy appears to go something like this, "hey, if we have one OS no matter whether the user is on a tablet or a full computer we don't need as many of those expensive developers and testers and we can get rid of some". Because otherwise I sure can't see why they want me to run full screen applications on this beautiful 27" monitor. I mean, I might - maybe - go full screen with Excel on it once in a blue moon, but normally apps should not be even close to maximized when I have 2560 x 1440 on my main screen and a portrait oriented 1050 x 1680 next to it. It is odd - what market are they after with this? I know they have done some studies on screen resolution and found that the majority of people still have 1280x1024. But their minimum requirement for having two "UI formerly known as Metro" apps running on screen at the same time (one squished, one normal) are 1366x768. So they either want people with old 4 x 3 1280 x 1024 screens or they want people with modern, larger monitors. So their plan? Build an OS that doesn't look right on either market. Sweet.

Re:Business Workstations (2, Informative)

shutdown -p now (807394) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948557)

No company in their right mind is going to adopt Windows 8 for their business workstations if Microsoft forces the Metro interface on everyone. It simply is not productive. Visual Studio Touch Edition? Microsoft Word and Excel from a tablet? Right.

The good thing, then, is that Metro interface is not forced on anyone. About the only thing that is actually forced is the Metro home screen as a replacement for Start menu, and even that can be overridden by third party offerings like ViStart or Start8. Certainly, there's no "VS Touch Edition", nor such a thing for Office.

This, in fact, is where this review is incredibly confusing. It states certain things which are only partially correct, and outside of the context, plain wrong. For example:

The old start menu is now full-screened, with large icons for all apps, and apps run in full-screen by default

Only Metro apps run in full screen by default. Desktop apps (i.e. any existing Windows app) do not.

It may look prettier, but it still fires up a Start Menu like before, still lets one dock things into the taskbar, and still lets the desktop get cluttered up with icons.

Start menu aside, you can still dock things into the taskbar, and clutter desktop with icons. Again, this all applies to desktop apps - Metro ones live in their own world. But all existing apps are desktop...

It's this difference that's key here. For companies that have Windows deployments with hundreds or thousands of seats, changing the way a Windows UI works is not an option. Regardless of how easy to use the Windows 8 UI may be, it's still not the same as what users have been trained to use since 1995. Sure, Windows 7 isn't Windows 95, but changes have been introduced gradually over time, making new features easier to adjust to. The Windows 8 UI is a fast, jarring change, that is likely to frustrate users as they adjust.

As noted above, the only real change that's forced on you is the new home screen instead of start menu; the rest of it works exactly as it did before, so any training/experience that applied to Win7 mostly applies here as well.

That's why it's rather surprising to see them take a hard stance on the Windows 8 UI. Sure, undoubtedly some third party will create a drop-in shell replacement eventually. That's been done in past versions and will likely be done again for Windows 8.

There's no need for a drop-in shell, because the shell (desktop, taskbar etc) is all still there. There may be a need for drop-in Start menu clone for some people. That's already available.

Overall, it basically ignores the desktop UI part of it, and conflates Metro to the Win8 UI, which is obviously wrong. All these arguments are valid insofar as they apply to Metro - yes, I do foresee that not being eagerly adopted by enterprises for all these reasons. However, you can perfectly well use Win8 and ignore Metro altogether.

yet another.. (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948121)

Yet another "could be", "might be", "we don't know yet", article with no research or sources to back it up. Considering that this is more or less Microsoft's first attempt at innovation cut them a little slack. If you don't like Metro, don't upgrade, FFS... you're not required to nor are you entitled to upgrade on day one of releases. I for one, will be upgrading because I absolutely love the fluid UI, the tremendous speed increases, and the new developer features that are exposed in the new runtime. The rest of you, kick back and enjoy Windows 7 or switch to Linux/Mac.

Re:yet another.. (1)

neminem (561346) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948385)

First attempt at innovation? Even if you're only talking OSes... Windows 95 was a -fantastic- OS for its day. I remember the first time I used Win95, I was like, dang, how did we get by before we had this? I'm not even joking. I feel like, computer-wise, Win95 was a game-changer, like the internet, smart phones, flash drives, etc. Was it completely unlike anything we'd ever seen? No, it was WIMP-driven like any other GUI. It was just way -better-. Then 98 came out and I was excited. That... was the last time a Windows OS really had me looking forward to its release.

Win 8, on the other hand, is a joke. And saying if you don't like it, don't upgrade, is also a joke: it's roughly equivalent to "if you don't like what your country is doing, leave". I'm not going to leave the US just because I don't like some of the things my government does (though I don't), and I'm not going to quit my job just because IT says if I want a new computer I need to accept whatever crap OS their base image has installed. Win7 may be more stable than XP, but I fought as long as I could to keep it off my computers anyway, cause the UI is crap (though it's still way better than 8's monstrosity). Eventually, though, I lost that battle. I'm running 7 now.

Good Riddance (1, Troll)

Spy Handler (822350) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948141)

Metro was a stupid name; first thing that occurs to people when they hear it is something along the lines of sexual orientation. And it makes easy fodder for metro vs. homo jokes. Even "Ghetto" would've been a better name. Microsoft got lucky that a third party sued them and prevented them from using it.

That's the difference between MS and Apple: Apple had a clear-headed CEO who kept saying "No" to lame ideas.

Re:Good Riddance (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948341)

Apple had a clear-headed CEO who kept saying "No" to lame ideas.

Including cancer treatment. (Too soon?)

Not for me, thank you (5, Interesting)

CharlieG (34950) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948199)

Unlike most folks here on /., I've been a windows guy forever (Hint, I still have my windows 286 floppies!). I have my own copy of MSDN, and therefore Win8 (any version) is 'free' for me. This will be the first version of Windows I don't load. (I don't count ME - I was running NT...) Sorry Microsoft. I MIGHT stick it on some secondary box somewhere, so I can test code against it, but I'll keep coding for Win7/HTML/CSS,JQuery etc. I played with an early beta on a tablet, THAT was nice, but the desktop? RIGHT, and the last 2 places I consulted at all have the same opinion, that dog doesn't hunt, and will NOT be installed

"Bypass" Metro (4, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948201)

You can "bypass" Metro -- http://www.sepier.com/bypassing-metro-on-windows-8-rtm/

Use VIStart (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 2 years ago | (#40948305)

http://www.lee-soft.com/vistart/

If you configure it to start on logon you don't get the Metro (Or Windows 8 Style, or whatever they are calling it this week) UI. It's not quite as good as being able to fully turn off the Windows 8 Style UI, but it's pretty close.

Windows 98 more like Seven than different (2)

cpu6502 (1960974) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948325)

I have an old 98 laptop with AMD k5(?) processor and Kflex 48k modem. The software looks diffferent but acts basically the same as Seven. There's a start menu, control panel, built-in explorer window to navigate files. Windows key benefit is (or was) the constantcy across 17 years of usage.

this will backfire. (2, Interesting)

Simulant (528590) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948339)

I just posted this on reddit yesterday:

I think that Windows 8 is going to backfire on Microsoft.

Most current Windows PC users are going to be instantly put off by "metro" on the desktop. It serves no immediate purpose and just makes it harder and less convenient to do many common things you already know how to do. There is a learning curve there and the interface only becomes efficient with some help or google searches and some practice. There is simply no reason (at this time, anyway) for it to exist on my desktop PC and it's annoying me. No other version of Windows has made me jump through quite this many hoops to do basic tasks

On a tablet it might work and it might work well. However.... I doubt MS can make a $200 windows tablet any time soon and that's the price point they will need to hit. Besides nearly everyone who wanted an iPad or iPhone probably has one by now, even if they normally use a PC. I think Windows 8 will drive millions of PC owning, happy iPad/iPhone users into the arms of Apple rather than entice them them to ditch their iPads and buy a Windows 8 Tablet. They are already tempted and if they have to learn something new, it may as well be Apples OS. When it comes time for a new PC, i think Apple can get a lot of sales, especially if they drop their PC/Laptop prices a bit. Also... I think most people running Windows 7 will not need new hardware for quite some time. The crop of PCs from the last 3 or 4 years are already overpowered for most home users. I don't see many of us buying just an OS upgrade either.

It's pretty obvious that Microsoft's ultimate goal here is to create an Apple-like walled garden. Initially, the wall won't be as high but there will be a wall. Don't forget this. They desperately want a successful iTunes/Apps Store/Google Play, etc...

Apart from "metro" There's little in Windows 8 that couldn't have been included in a Win 7 SP2. And nothing important that you can't already do in Windows 7 with a few downloads. While the core OS is solid, I still think we have another WinMe/Vista on our hands. Nobody asked for this.

I don't see the big deal... (5, Insightful)

HerculesMO (693085) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948429)

No, nobody is going to move to Macs or Linux on an enterprise desktop. They will stick with Windows. Windows 7 will not sunset on support for quite some time, and in the interim people will wait and see what Microsoft is going to do; either Windows 9 will be a better benefit to them, or they will figure out how to make Windows 8 work for them.

The one thing people know about Apple is that they do NOT support enterprises in any meaningful way. Look at XServe, which was pulled from its product line, and OSX Server which is basically an equivalent of Windows Home Server. And Linux? Comon... the arguments for retraining users apply for Linux and Mac TOO. The amount of investments made around the Windows platform are for many companies, quite large, and nobody's going to throw them away because despite the new interface, its enterprise pinnings are still pretty good on the client desktop.

I'm in the "wait and see" crowd. I don't particularly think the new interface is appealing, especially as a keyboard/mouse user, but given how little I use my start menu as it is, maybe it's not such a bad change... I really don't know. I do know that when we got preview copies running on PCs, all the Mac users came running by and told the IT teams how much they liked it. Go figure, eh?

Technology changes. And for many non-IT users of computers, Windows 8 is going to be great, simple, and straightforward to use. Viruses won't happen as easily because of the App Store, IE can't have any plugins/addons in its metro form, so all in all, it will be a boon to those folks. The IT folks who resist change will be the same people crying about the MS Office ribbon, or whatever else they got stuck on and didn't want to adapt. You're IT people -- you're supposed to adapt and change. Granted this change may not be the best, but you use it as a tool rather than a religion and you may find it better. Or not. In either case I don't think Metro is going anywhere, and the Surface tablet, if it does as well as people think it might, will just reinforce the fact MS made the right decision.

I on the other hand, will just wait and see.

Apps are poorly implemented. (4, Insightful)

dstyle5 (702493) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948459)

As Cowboy said above, full screen apps all the time is ridiculous. Sorry, I don't need my email app taking up my entire 24" display, thanks.

What I also found really annoying about apps is you can't easily close them. Esc does nothing, there is no "X" in the corners, nothing intuitive how to do it. I thought by time they hit the Release preview there would be some changes to this. The only way I found you can close them is my hiding/minimizing them, then bringing them up in app list in the top left corner thing-a-ma-jig, then right-click to bring up a "close" dialog.

App configuration is also a chore, the only way I found to bring up an apps options is to mouse over the "hot" top right corner of screen. Too bad this "corner" is about 1 pixel x 1 pixel. I'm not a GUI or usability designer, but the current app implementation is a chore to use. Perhaps there will be come big changes in the release, but as it stands right now there is no chance I would pay for an "App", let alone use a free one given the current design choices.

Missing the strategy... (5, Interesting)

Ami Ganguli (921) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948465)

The MS strategy (which will probably have some success), is pretty clear...

They figure they've got a few years of desktop monopoly left, and they want leverage this to protect their core business from iOS and Android. The plan is to get home users used to the Metro UI so that they'll be more likely to buy Windows-powered phones and tablets. Home users are far less conservative than enterprise users, and most of them will just go with whatever is loaded on their machines.

Within a three years the vast majority will be comfortable with Metro. That's about the time enterprise customers will be looking to upgrade from Windows 7, and in the meantime, everybody will be familiar enough with Metro to be immediately comfortable when they pick up a Windows Phone/Tablet.

It's really not a bad strategy. I don't think it will crush iOS and Android by a long shot, but it might just prevent MS from becoming totally irrelevant.

DISCLAIMER: I WORK FOR MS ON THE "METRO" SCREEN (0, Troll)

pwnies (1034518) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948531)

Disclaimer: I work for microsoft as a UI/UX designer/prototyper, primarily on Windows's "Metro" interface, so I'm probably HIGHLY biased in this area. But I may still be able to shed some light on this. I've been using Win8 for about 8 or 9 months now. Originally, I was in the same boat as CowboyNeal - I loathed the new start menu. It felt wonky to scroll through and find my programs. After using it for a while though, I highly prefer it to the old start menu. The start menu on Windows 7 was great for mouse navigation - short traversals to each entity meant that you could get through them quickly with a mouse. Where it failed though was in keyboard driven execution. Win 7's keyboard launching capabilities absolutely sucked. I wrote up a pretty technical paper on its shortcomings, one specific example was heirarchy of information in search: while trying to launch Dota 2 in windows 7, I pressed the win key and typed in "dota". The first result was an autogenerated xml file that I didn't even know existed on my computer, with "dota" matching a substring of a randomly generated hash. The "Dota 2" program was 14th on the list, despite me opening it often. Because of this, I rarely used search on my windows box. In OSX however, I almost always use spotlight (~95% of the time) to launch anything. Noticing this I decided to give the search in win 8 a shot, as I heard it had been improved. It was vastly better - better than spotlight and probably on par or slightly better than quicksilver. Since the standard desktop is still there, and the keyboard driven launching is actually usable, I just stay in desktop mode and use the metro home screen as a glorified spotlight. It takes some getting used to due to the fact that it's fullscreen, but it has more data on screen at once, which means on the rare chance that I am searching for something more detailed, it seems to be a bit more efficient. That with the speed improvements in 8 over 7 (8 is a lot snappier) makes me prefer it to 7 nowadays. Just food for thought.

Blah blah blah (1, Funny)

Aphoxema (1088507) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948539)

I don't know what you guys are talking about, I use Metro all the time. Every time I start my computer it shows up, then the first things I do is click the Desktop application on the start page. I love this Desktop application, seems to do everything I need. I don't actually see myself needing any other Metro apps.

So in summary... (0)

logicassasin (318009) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948585)

This shit sucks, try again Microsoft.

KDE (1)

gmuslera (3436) | more than 2 years ago | (#40948599)

They done the same big break with KDE from 3.x to 4.0, and still today, more than 4 years later and 9 revisions of it, lot of people refuse to use it in linux. But at least was an UI meant by the designers for the desktop, not one for tablet/touchscreen forced to run in computers without a lot of the implied hardware.
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