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You Can't Bypass the UI Formerly Known As Metro On Windows 8

timothy posted about a year and a half ago | from the should-you-choose-to-accept-it dept.

GUI 444

colinneagle writes with this excerpt from Network World: "The final build of Windows 8 has already leaked to torrent sites, which is giving the propellerheads a chance to dig through the code. One revelation will probably not sit well with enterprise customers: you can't bypass the don't-call-it-Metro UI. Normally, you have to boot Windows 8 and when the tiled desktop UI (formerly known as Metro) came up, you had to click on one of the boxes to launch Explorer. Prior builds of Windows 8 allowed the user to create a shortcut so you bypass Metro and go straight to the Explorer desktop. Rafael Rivera, co-author of the forthcoming Windows 8 Secrets, confirmed to Mary Jo Foley at ZDNet that Microsoft does indeed block the boot bypass routine from prior builds. He also believes that Microsoft has blocked the ability for administrators to use Group Policy to allow users to bypass the tiled startup screen. There had been hope that Microsoft would at least relent and let corporate users have a bypass, if only for compatibility's sake."

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444 comments

phirstz0r (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956261)

phirst

That's fine because I plan to bypass... (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956263)

...Windows 8.

Re:That's fine because I plan to bypass... (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956299)

...Windows 8.

There's UEFI for that! I mean, err, it's for your security. Of course.

Re:That's fine because I plan to bypass... (-1, Redundant)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956529)

...Windows 8.

There's UEFI for that! I mean, err, it's for your security. Of course.

Looks like this was modded down by an editor. Editors never specify a reason, they are above reason you know. They just use "-1 Overrated" for everything because they are more cowardly than any AC. I think also they recognize certain IP blocks and are biased against them.

So why was this modded down? There is legitimate fear the UEFI will restrict or at least limit users' ability to install whatever they want. Maybe it won't and I am sure lots of assurances are being made that it won't but you realize that's like gov't saying "no we won't abuse these shiny new surveillance and search powers we just received, trust us!"

Re:That's fine because I plan to bypass... (0, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956365)

YEEEEAAAAAHHHHHH!!!!

windows ate... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956413)

windows hate.....

Re:That's fine because I plan to bypass... (4, Insightful)

hairyfeet (841228) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956509)

Everyone marked it funny but it should have been insightful. After playing with it a couple of months and talking with my customers....what does it offer REALLY? what does win 8 bring to the table except being a "LOL I iz a cellphone LOL" PITA UI?

Its "faster boot time" is nothing but a classic MSFT cheat, in this case its more like a wake from hibernate than an actual boot, the UI is frankly crap on a cracker if you're not using touch which means a good 90%+ of machines out there are gonna suck with it, the "easy reinstall" is kinda pointless since I haven't found a reason to actually NEED to reinstall Win 7 with my customers, hell the only real positive I could find was the overhaul of Windows services but honestly that was such a "WTF are they thinking?" that should have been done years ago and certainly isn't worth putting up with "LOL I can haz touch?" MS Bob UI!

If you use Windows for work or play there really isn't a point in having Windows 8 unless you are going for a touchscreen device, there really isn't. You look at the reviews [zdnet.com] and they all say the same thing "Windows 8 is pointless" and I have to agree. I have gone through every MSFT OS since Win 3.x, including clunkers like WinME and WinVista but I can say without a doubt that Win 8 has to be the worst Windows I've ever been forced to use. At least with Vista you could kill UAC and tweak it into a halfway usable OS, with ME if you had a Win98SE disc you could build a frankenstein of the two and actually have a decent OS, whereas unless you are buying it on a tablet or cellphone Win 8 is a boat anchor on your workflow.

So just skip it, no point in dealing with Metro or Tiles or whatever they call it next week, unless you just really desire having your PC feel like it is a supergigantic smartphone [youtube.com]

Re:That's fine because I plan to bypass... (5, Insightful)

Nerdfest (867930) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956631)

I'm fairly sure the reason they're pushing it is because they get a cut of all software sold for the 'Metro' UI. The better the uptake is, the sooner their profits and level of control goes up. I posted this same thought on another article relating to this and got modded 'Troll', so I may be more accurate than some would like.

Re:That's fine because I plan to bypass... (2)

jayhawk88 (160512) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956517)

Yeah, let's see this for what it really is: a memo to enterprise admins saying "You don't want this, keep using 7". 90% of us already knew this, but let's face it, there are always Irish Setters in the group who go all "Oh boy, new OS, oh boy, new OS" and start pushing it out two weeks after release.

You CAN Bypass Windows 8. (-1, Redundant)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956265)

HELL YEAH!

Has anyone bothered trying these? (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956267)

What's this, Apple Propaganda Day? I've seen this on so many sites now I'm starting to froth at the mouth.

THE FINAL BUILD OF WIN8 HAS NO SUCH RESTRICTIONS.

IT WORKS AS BEFORE

END OF STORY.

God, some people will try ANYTHING to kick down MS a peg or two. They're not fucking idiots, but if you believe this shit then YOU definately are.

MOD PARENT DOWN (5, Informative)

rsmith-mac (639075) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956325)

As someone who actually has a copy of Windows 8, TFA and TFS are correct and the OP is wrong. Microsoft has removed the previous methods of booting straight to the desktop.

Prediction (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956337)

The parent post will modded up to +5, informative, by Slashdot geniuses.

Then when Windows 8 is generally available, it will turn out that the final build of Windows 8 does have such restrictions.

And nobody will care that the smug Slashdotters modded this post up, because accuracy doesn't count around here.

Re:Prediction (0, Flamebait)

akboss (823334) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956377)

oh come on AC. Show us your true feelings. Even M$ shows everyone that yes you cant boot to a legacy desktop but using KB shortcuts you can remove the new desk for the legacy one. My guess is that your to afraid to let people really know who you are so you hide and pick away. Personally I hate /. decision to allow AC postings. Go look at the M$ link in Cowboy Neal's post on this same subject strangely on slashdot. http://tech.slashdot.org/story/12/08/09/1417210/cowboyneal-weighs-in-on-the-windows-8-metro-gui [slashdot.org] You blowing smoke like a good liberal should.

Re:Prediction (-1, Offtopic)

mwvdlee (775178) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956393)

I don't have AC postings. I hate people replying to AC postings.

AC postings itself are easily blocked from view, but replies to them requires me to open them if I want to read the context (usually I just skip the entire thread, but it takes up valuable screen space).

Ignoring AC's starts by ignoring AC's.

Re:Prediction (0, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956459)

I don't have AC postings. I hate people replying to AC postings.

AC postings itself are easily blocked from view, but replies to them requires me to open them if I want to read the context (usually I just skip the entire thread, but it takes up valuable screen space).

Ignoring AC's starts by ignoring AC's.

In other words... "dammit ACs never post anything of value that's worth reading ... except for all those times that they do. Shit, why won't the whole world help me pretend this never ever happens?!"

Fucking people, not doing exactly what you'd like them to do with their own personal preferences. The nerve!

By the way your sig is hilariously ironic. ACs contributing useful posts at least once in a while is a "shade of gray" you don't seem to recognize. Maybe a logged-in user will reply to this and quote it so you can see the hypocrisy. Would that interfere with your cozy black-and-white world of "AC bad, pseudonym good"?

Re:Prediction (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956417)

oh come on AC. Show us your true feelings. Even M$ shows everyone that yes you cant boot to a legacy desktop but using KB shortcuts you can remove the new desk for the legacy one.

That's a nice double standard. If that were Linux people would say "yes but if you have to follow cryptic steps from the knowledge base then clearly Linux isn't ready for the desktop. Users just want to get their work done not relearn a new interface!".

Maybe next year will be the Year of the Windows Desktop?

Re:Prediction (4, Funny)

Dunbal (464142) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956379)

it will turn out that the final build of Windows 8 does have such restrictions.

But you will be able to remove said restrictions if you buy the Pro Gold Game of the Year Ultimate edition for $389 instead of the regular $89 "Vanilla" edition.

Re:Has anyone bothered trying these? (1)

K. S. Kyosuke (729550) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956685)

Congratulartions, you've been nominated for the False Dichotomy Slashdot Comment of the Month Award. We'll contact you shortly with more information.

and now we watch the titan burn... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956271)

forcing a horrid (tablet/phone) UI on everyone!

DOING IT THE WINDOWS ME WAY!

Re:and now we watch the titan burn... (3, Insightful)

ThunderBird89 (1293256) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956319)

It's not horrid on a touch-enabled device. The problem comes when you try to use an interface obviously designed for touch with no touch input. Sure, you can use it with a mouse, but that just feels awkward and weird.
Windows 8 is probably going to be amazing on tablets, but i don't see why Microsoft tries to force it on desktop users. In their stead, I would just keep the Windows 7 UI, and put that on top of the upgraded codebase. Or if they want to tie the platforms together so badly, make the OS detect the type of device it is installed on, and use the appropriate interface (Not-Metro for touch-based devices, regular for non-touch-based ones).

Re:and now we watch the titan burn... (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956339)

It's not horrid

A sentiment I find often associated with various versions of Windows. Just yesterday I was speaking with a former Vietnam POW who'd had his fingernails pulled out with pliers, and he commented that the time he bought a mid-range laptop in the early days of Vista was 'pretty fucking awful but not the worst thing that has ever happened to me'.

So good job Microsoft!

CowboyNeal déjà vu (5, Insightful)

rjejr (921275) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956283)

Didnt we just cover this very thoroughly yesterday?

Re:CowboyNeal deja vu (1)

TaoPhoenix (980487) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956483)

Yep, I was waiting for someone to notice that.

It's not even tagged Dupe on the main set of tags.

The way to become wealthy is to.... (5, Insightful)

3seas (184403) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956287)

....Make people need you. - bill gates

And the way you make people need you is to not teach them to fish, but limit what they can do for themselves and make the rest so difficult that they have to need you.

Re:The way to become wealthy is to.... (3, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956659)

This. It is basically working for the government and having to pay them almost all you earn to eat and live. Then you are left with an absolutely minor amount of money with which you might be able to use, if you don't die first.

But now people are waking up. Even the odd casual system user is realizing that Windows is actually really awful and limiting.
God forbid the mess they will cause with the release of Win8. It is going to be hated more than Facebook changes.

Besides, I think Microsoft are actually living up to the "every other windows is crap" rule on purpose.
The "bait, switch, fix and be praised" method, the bastard of all children.
In this case, make a really promising speech on the new Windows. "oh we have been listening to you, blah blah bullshit"
Release a few shiny fancy pictures.
Beta comes out, remove features as it ages.
Release. It is absolutely terrible. Even the most avid fans hate it.
Spread some FUD about articles. (yes, against their own company)
But then come service pack, fix a few issues, but still leave a horrible amount unfixed.
Same with SP2.
Then start talking about the next OS, "oh we listened to you, we fixed all that mess, hurray for us!"
Show them a really good OS.
Release it on the same base as the previous OS but with all the bugs fixed and just slap a new name on it. BAM, Windows 7 in a nutshell.
Same is going to happen with Win8 and Win9, I guarantee it! If not, I will eat my hat. Oh wait, I have no hat. Then I will get a hat. Then eat it. On air.

Screwed Again (1)

FlyingGuy (989135) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956289)

There had been hope that Microsoft would at least relent and let corporate users have a bypass, if only for compatibility's sake.

Balmer! Its the guy that is wrong, yet again!

Re:Screwed Again (4, Funny)

Dunbal (464142) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956383)

Your first hint should have been his reaction when asked "take a seat over there" and threw a chair across a stage.

microsoft fanbois will still buy it (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956291)

they have no choice, too poor for mac, too stupid for linux, i guess all your low class no taste retards are going to have to learn to love Metro!

Re:microsoft fanbois will still buy it (3, Interesting)

ThunderBird89 (1293256) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956329)

Or they can just ... not install Windows 8, and stick with Windows 7, which'll be even faster on the new, more powerful hardware.

There's always another way, you know.

Re:microsoft fanbois will still buy it (1, Insightful)

mysidia (191772) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956431)

That only works for a limited period of time. Eventually, they stop selling Windows 7, and eventually they drop support for it.

Re:microsoft fanbois will still buy it (5, Informative)

Chris Mattern (191822) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956465)

Yeah. After all, we were forced to go to Vista because support for XP was discontinued. Oh, wait. That's not what happened at all.

Re:microsoft fanbois will still buy it (2, Insightful)

mysidia (191772) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956539)

Oh, wait. That's not what happened at all.

It kind of did. Windows 7 is really Vista Service Pack 3. Which Enterprises are moving to. Windows XP has two years of support left.

If you hate the UI changes in Windows Vista, which Windows 7 kept, and you don't like Metro, then you are kind of screwed.

Re:microsoft fanbois will still buy it (1)

jd2112 (1535857) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956563)

That only works for a limited period of time. Eventually, they stop selling Windows 7, and eventually they drop support for it.

But by then Windows 9 will be out fixing the Metro problem and/or Mac and/or Linux migrations will be viable options.

Re:microsoft fanbois will still buy it (-1, Redundant)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956343)

they have no choice, too poor for mac, too stupid for linux, i guess all your low class no taste retards are going to have to learn to love Metro!

You'll mod him down and probably quickly since the Slashdot userbase seems to have grown up very sheltered, so they have difficulty handling any kind of contention and anything more strongly worded than "no sir, I find it mildly distasteful, in my personal opinion, if that doesn't offend anyone, of course anyone else might like it and that would be perfectly valid". This crowd has difficulty seeing the meaning behind something that is not phrased in a 100% delicate manner and tend to knee-jerk and down-mod it.

That's too bad. Because there are lots and LOTS of users who fit the description of "too poor for mac, too stupid for linux". If a user is knowledgable enough to use Linux on his/her own without assistance, but they still prefer Windows, then and only then do they have a genuine preference. If they say they really like Windows but they don't know anything about Linux or how to use it, then their opinion is not valid because they have no basis for comparison. Now, to review, proudly touting an opinion that isn't actually valid at all is colloquially referred to as "stupid" with reason. It's just that simple.

IFKAM as bad as the Ribbon? (3, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956301)

I hope it won't be that bad. If the Interface Formerly Known As Metro is as bad as the Ribbon, I'll struggle for a while to adapt, and then probably go back to the previous version or install Classic Shell. I don't mind experimentation with something new. Maybe it really is better. But I don't understand why Microsoft doesn't provide a "classic" mode for people who are willing to try, but eventually decide they like the previous arrangement better. How many of you stuck with the default theme for Windows XP? Anyone? Can you imagine if there was no way to change it?

And to not allow it or make it easy for enterprise users. That's just cruel. Is Microsoft *trying* to increase training costs for companies?

Shell replacements (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956303)

Even if this is true, how about Shell replacements? Will they block those too? If they do, this might indeed be a dark age for windows.

Re:Shell replacements (2)

gl4ss (559668) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956423)

well, things like http://www.stardock.com/products/start8/ [stardock.com] still work. not sure about something like litestep though.

there's a limit how much they can limit on the PC consumer version of 8. on some versions sideloading metro apps is kind of a bitch from what it seems.

the thing that confuses me (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956307)

is why MS is so determined to force this issue. What's their payoff?

Re:the thing that confuses me (5, Insightful)

Tridus (79566) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956327)

They want people to make what was formerly known as Metro apps to play in the new UI, because they'll also work on the tablet & phone version. The goal is to have a unified platform to boost the amount of applications on the tablet and help it sell.

Of course, making Metroized apps means they don't work in Windows 7, which now that XP is gradually going away will be the dominant enterprise OS. And of course Metro is so unpopular with desktop users that the tablets are going to get a bad name just due to bad name recognition. So it's a risky strategy at best.

Re:the thing that confuses me (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956435)

Pretty much that. The Metro team has created such an epic fail that now they see the need to force it on everybody since nobody seems to actually want to use it. My first reaction to Windows 8 was "if I get it I'll just turn that crap off". Now it seems I can't, so I'll just ignore Windows 8.

Re:the thing that confuses me (3, Interesting)

shentino (1139071) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956599)

Kinda suspicious since they are also banning open source applications from their moble app store.

Re:the thing that confuses me (1)

gl4ss (559668) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956511)

is why MS is so determined to force this issue. What's their payoff?

ownership/domination of sw supply chain.
+getting apps made for their tablet and phone OS.

it's like they looked at what they're lacking 1.5 years ago.. and then just ran with this strategy. the payoff for microsoft is getting statistics on all metro sw installed on consumer devices, getting a hundred bucks from all developers and getting a piece of every sw sale made. and oh yeah killing os sw that doesn't have a license compatible with being sold through such a system.

only thing they've done in corporate pr all year has been to get people to make metro apps to be distributed over metro store... if it's a good fit for said developers product hasn't bothered them at all.

Beginning of the end! (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956317)

It's ridiculous to even think that Microsoft is following Apple by locking stuff down just because they think 'That Which Should Not Be Named' is the most efficient way to do things. Hell, even Apple only started to just merge iOS and Mac OS X and that too very subtly and slowly. MSFT has absolutely jumped right into it. It is going to be a disaster, no matter what.

Re:Beginning of the end! (2)

Nerdfest (867930) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956711)

Well, sort of. You can still install any OS X apps yourself, but only apps that go through Apple can go in the OS X market. Windows will be only slightly worse. You can still install any software yourself as long as it doesn't use the new interface. That all has to go through the Microsoft market and they get a cut.

Of course, Linux still has the best approach, with its central update mechanism for installing software from multiple sources in its 'store' (Ubuntu's 'Software Centre' for example.). The advantages for keeping things up to date and ease of use are huge, but alas, no lock-down and reduces profits.

I understand the choice, but I disagree (5, Insightful)

assertation (1255714) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956333)

I can understand why Microsoft decided to remove that option, though I disagree.

They want to the users to give Metro a fair try by living with it for a while. It is different enough where most people only see it once until they set an option to get rid of it. I've been using Windows since 3.0 and the first thing I do at a new job is get rid of the XP theme and set things up to look classic.

I think this is a mistake for Microsoft. Forced changes without easy options to go back angers users. Ubuntu and Unity are in a similar situation. Between Microsoft and Canonical trying to promote a tablet desktop on non-tablet PCs I think Apple and the KDE will be the winners.

On my formerly Ubuntu box at home the change motivated me to give the KDE and Kubuntu a look for the first time in years. Luckily I really like it and am now unlikely to go back to Ubuntu and Unity(or GNOME )

Re:I understand the choice, but I disagree (2)

mwvdlee (775178) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956441)

Between Microsoft and Canonical trying to promote a tablet desktop on non-tablet PCs I think Apple and the KDE will be the winners.

It's kind of strange, both of them are desperately trying to immitate Apple, yet neither looks anything like OS-X's desktop.

I hate Apple as much as the next guy, possibly more so, but atleast they know how to make a good UI.

Re:I understand the choice, but I disagree (2, Informative)

bluescrn (2120492) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956589)

Apple have been making some fairly bad decisions with OSX recently. Not quite on the scale of Win8, but they're trying to make it more like iOS, before turning OSX into a similarly locked-down code-signed App Store client.

Re:I understand the choice, but I disagree (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956457)

True enough. Forcing changes on people is bad.

But you make the mistake of putting Apple, Microsoft and all that is Linux in a single pot. First of all, you get Apple, who always had it's way of doing things, and honestly never made any radical changes (like the gnome shell or metro), what ever prompted that decision, is irrelevant, it was a good one. Linux on the other hand, is represented by various distros and their desktop environments. Gnome 3, you either love it or hate it. Same goes for Unity, just like KDE plasma once was. The major difference is, with Ubuntu, you can install KDE, or gnome3 shell, or Unity, or XFCE or gnome 3 with extensions to make it look like 2. The gist of it: you HAVE options.
Microsoft is trying to change, but it isn't easing people into it, but rather forcing them, how that works for them ... we'll see when SP1 comes out.

There is one last thing that needs mentioning. Not all new ideas are completely bad, but just in need of a little polishing.

Corporate bypass is easy (5, Insightful)

Tridus (79566) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956335)

It's called Windows 7. You can expect it to be a lot more popular in the enterprise then 8.

Re:Corporate bypass is easy (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956369)

There will be an enterprise version of windows 8. This is soho/home version.

Re:Corporate bypass is easy (5, Interesting)

mysidia (191772) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956449)

Corporations also have IT departments, who will demand Microsoft support provide them a bypass, OR it will be a condition that has to be met, before they will purchase Windows 8.

Mark my words.... Microsoft will provide Enterprises a bypass of some kind, if not at release, then via a patch, special tool, registry hack, or script that can be deployed for domain-joined computers via group policy.

Re:Corporate bypass is easy (4, Insightful)

Zocalo (252965) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956525)

This.

You think Microsoft gives a damn which version of their desktop OS corporates use? Get real! All they care about it that they do use a version of their OS, hopefully in order to run MS Office and other MS applications as well, and not someone else's OS. Since pretty much any corporate with an MS desktop deployment that matters is now on MS's Software Assurance scheme they essentially have the revenue guaranteed already, no matter what version of Windows they decide to deploy.

Factor in what happened with XP/Vista on the corporate desktop and there might even be a little bit of sense here. Forcing the new UI down home user's throats, whether they want it on the desktop or not, increases market penetration and user awareness, plus it helps drive sales of Windows 8 tablets and phones, although to what extent remains to be seen. By the time Windows 9 comes along, touch screens on the desktop should be fairly commonplace, users will be familiar with the new UI, and there will hopefully be plenty of business apps available to run on it. Anyone care to bet whether Windows 7 will get EOL'd not too long after Windows 9 SP1 ships?

Are you idiots aware there is some news? (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956345)

happening right now?

Romney/Ryan. A great pair to kick Obama's ass.

And you leftist free software hippies and still asleep after a long night playing D&D I guess.

Wake up and smell the budget cuts, losers. You might all have to go out and get jobs. Ooes Noes! Understand this people, Ryan and the conservatives have a plan - a good plan and a real plan with a proven track record of success.

What does the Obama have? Failure. He cannot run on his plan - if he could have he would not be playing up BAIN and BUSH and blame and on and on and on. He has no plan and he cannot run on success, becausse all he has is failure. Welcome to the real world hippies.

Ryan will energize the right - both the Tea Party and the House, leaves the Senate in easier reach and is a damn good pick. You leftists are sooooo predictable.

See you in November.

We will keep the House, take the Senate and the executive.

Learn the Constitution chumps because it's going to be re-instituted starting in 162 days.

Re:Are you idiots aware there is some news? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956375)

I'm going to print this out, and after the election I'll fap to it over a soundtrack of bitter Republictears.

Re:Are you idiots aware there is some news? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956507)

Anything of substance to add moron?

No? Thought not.

http://www.businessinsider.com/obama-unemployment-rate-2012-6

Re:Are you idiots aware there is some news? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956579)

You need to get a little more angry, I can't fap just yet.

Re:Are you idiots aware there is some news? (-1, Offtopic)

mwvdlee (775178) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956591)

Are you idiot aware that this is a site for technology news?

<offtopic>
Speaking as a non-USian, I hope Romney wins. Obama is intelligent, charismatic and social (it's not a bad word; it's the opposite of asocial)... we haven't had any good schadenfreude since mini-Bush.
Besides, Romney will do great things for our economy. You see, wealth is a relative thing; the poorer your average citizen is, the richer we feel. We can accept the 1% ultrarich; it's no different from current dictatorships.
</offtopic>

If it ain't broke (5, Insightful)

Dunbal (464142) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956353)

While I admire the desire to be really creative and shit and try to come up with a cool "new" interface, functionality still remains one of the key desirable attributes for a user interface. We can thank Apple and all the Apple wannabe copycats for useless, ridiculous new ways of doing things that are less accurate and more time consuming by design. Who said that dragging page after page of stacked thumbnails as if they were pages from a book is an improvement over a plain old list? Especially when the constraints are so narrow that you often end up "dragging" two at a time. Want an example? Here, go look for a specific [nasa.gov] picture on this site. Have fun. Oh it looks cute. It's not functional. You will waste time waving your mouse back and forth trying to get the picture you wanted. A UI is supposed to be something that helps you, not something you have to fight with.

Now I'm not saying this is how (formerly known as) Metro is going to work, I haven't used the beta, and I've only seen a couple screen-shots. But I understand that Microsoft is going for the "smart phone" look and feel, and that means lots of big colorful buttons you have to drag everywhere, and crap like this. And considering what they've done with "Ribbons" when they obfuscated their "Office" suite - and I'm talking about the 2007 version, I refuse to "upgrade" and see what else they managed to fuck up, I can't imagine this UI will be better. I remember an argument in the late 80's about how computers hadn't really lived up to their promise of greater productivity in the office. Well Microsoft, I guess we'll have to congratulate you for lowering the bar even more...

Re:If it ain't broke (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956473)

We can thank Apple and all the Apple wannabe copycats for useless, ridiculous new ways of doing things that are less accurate and more time consuming by design.

Actually, !Metro is the continuation of a push that first appeared as MS Bob which predates Apple's vanity interfaces.

Re:If it ain't broke (4, Insightful)

wbr1 (2538558) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956499)

First, let me say I am not a MS fanboy. I despise the 'metro' interface. I have the release preview loaded on a few VM's so I can learn it as I will have to support it.
That aside, I disagree with your assessment of the ribbons in office. I have used MS office products since Word 2.0, and I trained people basic and advanced techniques in all office apps for 7 years, starting with 2000, then 2003, then 2007.
When 2007 came out, I despised it. I remember hunting for 7 minutes just for 'Change Case' or 'Insert Date'. I have to say however, that was because of my familiarity with the older versions. Since I was teaching the software, mostly to adults who had little if any computer experience, it amazed me how much faster and easier they learned with ribbons than with the old UI.
Once I trained my brain on both UI's I could do pretty much what I wanted in either with a minimum of fuss, and the ribbons did start to make a sort of logical sense to me as well.

Regardless, I do not see the benefit of the 'metro' style interface at all. It feels like I am losing flexibility and I hate that. So for my customers and friends, I will recommend that if they require MS, Windows 7 is where you should stay. Otherwise I have a nice kubuntu or Linux mint DVD for you.

How about Android (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956363)

Given that there's already apps out there to let you run Android apps on desktop OSes, why not switch corporate systems to Android? (and yeah, I know this is a fruitless hope. blah blah installed base blah blah open source blah blah IT support blah blah).

Re:How about Android (2)

Gaygirlie (1657131) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956515)

Given that there's already apps out there to let you run Android apps on desktop OSes, why not switch corporate systems to Android?

What benefit would that give them? They'd still need the underlying OS, plus there's hardly any desktop-oriented corporate-friendly software for Android. Not only that, but there is no way of remotely managing all the Android-software with proper security settings and all.

Windows 8 destined to become Zune of the Desktop (4, Funny)

CuteSteveJobs (1343851) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956403)

I feel like a police negotiator desperately trying to talk a man out of shooting his foot off.

Repeat after me Microsoft: The desktop market is not the smartphone market, and any attempt to ram it down reluctant consumers throats will turn it destroy what is still your biggest cash cow. http://waysofteaandfailure.blogspot.com.au/2012/08/the-many-problems-of-windows-8.html [blogspot.com.au]

Re:Windows 8 destined to become Zune of the Deskto (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956575)

I feel like a police negotiator desperately trying to talk a man out of shooting his foot off.

Why would we ever waste police resources on this kind of person?

If he wants to shoot somebody ELSE'S foot then by all means, send in the police. That would be a crime after all. But as long as it's his own foot he's shooting, the only response should be "bad call, bro".

The Vista failure wasn't spectacular enough? (1)

schizz69 (1239560) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956407)

This seems to me that it is going to be another massively under-adopted operating system. You'd think they would have learned their lesson from Vista. Don't force unnecessary restrictions on usability.

Re:The Vista failure wasn't spectacular enough? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956621)

They didn't actually lose any money on Vista though, I doubt they consider it a failure.

Maybe it finally will be... (4, Insightful)

epp_b (944299) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956415)

...the year of the Linux desktop, because if this doesn't turn people away from Windows in droves, I don't know what will.

What a marketing tool (1)

TVmisGuided (151197) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956421)

This is going to be a fantastic sales point...

...for Apple. It may also be what drives several former Windows-centric corporations into Linux.

Re:What a marketing tool (2, Interesting)

bluescrn (2120492) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956609)

Apple isn't much better these days. It almost feels like Microsoft and Apple have some secret agreement to simultaneously lock down their desktop OSs and turn them into content-consumption-only devices, that only run signed code that's been filtered, censored, and taxed by the App Store gatekeepers

There will be hacks (3, Interesting)

Karmashock (2415832) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956443)

I use windows 7 and there are a lot of things you can't do on windows 7 that you could do in windows XP or Vista. For example, you could manually organize folders in windows in those operating systems. I mean, literally pick up folders and move them from one side of a window to the other. This is something I've gotten used to doing since windows 3.1. So I was deeply annoyed when window 7 disallowed it. Finally I found some registry hacks that would re-enable the feature.

Beyond that, there are full shell replacements for windows. I expect that using shell replacements might become more and more the thing to do on windows systems. On top of everything else, some of the shell replacements are much more configurable then windows shell meaning that if you want to hide features from users you can literally remove them from the GUI entirely.

A combination of those two factor should make more then a few companies look at shell replacements.

Who cares? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956447)

Why do people care?
As Windows is a proprietary operating system it's clear that users are not in control over it. So why don't you just switch to a Free operating system, which you can control, instead of being subjugated by it?

Re:Who cares? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956611)

Why do people care? As Windows is a proprietary operating system it's clear that users are not in control over it. So why don't you just switch to a Free operating system, which you can control, instead of being subjugated by it?

Because that might require two things users, especially Americans, really passionately hate doing no matter how great the payoff: 1) A little reading, and 2) learning new things.

The people who can handle these things already switched to Linux. For the rest, you might as well ask them to build a spaceship. After all they're still struggling with basic, easily understood things like "don't consistently eat more calories than you burn".

Xindows 8 (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956463)

How long before something like XFCE is ported to Windows? I know KDE was almost able to run as the Windows shell a few years ago, maybe there's enough reason to make it happen now.

What a load of crap... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956471)

Windows 2012 doesn't boot to 'Metro' how hard can it be to change 8?

Re:What a load of crap... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956489)

That is the fix will most likely be a reg-key

Not quite true - Classic Shell allows it (4, Interesting)

Nimey (114278) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956479)

Well, almost. I've got Classic Shell [sourceforge.net] installed on the leaked version of Win8 Enterprise N. What happens is that it'll load Metro for a fraction of a second and then CS takes me back to the old "desktop" environment complete with start menu.

So it's not a complete bypass but it's close enough for my purposes.

If, like me, you prefer the Win7 start menu's look to the default Win98/2000 look Classic Shell provides, there's a skin [askvg.com] to make that possible.

Re:Not quite true - Classic Shell allows it (2)

bluescrn (2120492) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956617)

Well, it's a step forwards... but ideally, we don't want Metro hogging memory or disk space either :)

Re:Not quite true - Classic Shell allows it (1)

ljw1004 (764174) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956655)

Start8 [stardock.com] by Stardock Systems will take you directly to the desktop, without any fraction of a second in Metro. It too includes a Start orb.

Really Pisses Me Off (4, Insightful)

p0p0 (1841106) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956501)

This is the most ignorant, useless release of Windows 8 ever made. Change for change sakes it seems.

I recently tried installing it on my netbook with a resolution of 1024x600 (the typical netbok resolution) and I cannot run a SINGLE metro apps because my resolution is not at least 1024x768. What is that bullshit? The apps can scale at all? They expected this to be on some older devices that supported it, so why the limitation? I know future Surface devices will have to meet a certain standard, but why throw compatibility out the window? Why not an 800x600 resolution minimum? That way you'll know everyone within a reasonable time period (not the short time period of 2 years ago where my netbook sits) can use the full features.

There reasoning I think is so app developers don't have to cater to tons of resolutions, which is fine. FOR A MOBILE DEVICE.
They expect Windows 8 to be used on Desktops but completely cripple usability.

It's true I only really use the start menu for searching programs and rarely go straight to the icon itself. But the search is even worse in Windows 8! I hit the WinKey and start typing. I type in "device" looking for the Device Manager. Nothing. There are some metro quicklinks for installing hardware and whatnot, but not the Device Manager. Not until I search "device m" does it show up. Meanwhile in Wndows 7, I type just "d" and there it is, as well as everything else that starts with "d".

Now the sad part is, I would use it if it still had the start menu. It runs wonderfully on my netbook. It scrolls smooth and everything is snappy.
But it's useless. The XP I ran before worked better.
And all this crap they're giving to corporate users is hopefully gonna hurt them. It'll run terrible, it'll *feel* terrible. Maybe they've just decided to give this area to linux like Apple has and just focus on consumers. Well that's fine and dandy but the Apple user experience on a laptop or desktop is not in any way horrendous, while Metro leaves me feeling frustrated.

Can't wait for Windows 9 now. Its sure to be good.

Re:Really Pisses Me Off (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956513)

Why do you keep expecting a Windows release to be good? It's never happened before.

Re:Really Pisses Me Off (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956673)

Why do you keep expecting a Windows release to be good? It's never happened before.

Isn't Win7 OK?

Re:Really Pisses Me Off (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956643)

Can't wait for Windows 9 now. Its sure to be good.

You mean like with Windows 7 when Microsoft put out Vista with a new name and smoothed the way with millions in PR and astroturfing? Good like that?

Re:Really Pisses Me Off (1)

brokeninside (34168) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956723)

Windows 7 is a very different, and far better, product than Vista. In my day job, I support a vertical software app on versions of Windows ranging from XP to Windows Server 2008. Given a choice, I would much rather walk someone through troubleshooting on Windows 7 than Vista.

Re:Really Pisses Me Off (1, Informative)

Guppy06 (410832) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956663)

I recently tried installing it on my netbook with a resolution of 1024x600 (the typical netbok resolution)

The official system requirements for both 7 and Vista call for at least 768 horizontal lines. The last version of Windows intended for such low resolutions is XP, and the last version of Office is 2003.

This isn't news.

Re:Really Pisses Me Off (1)

ljw1004 (764174) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956677)

Incidentally, you can right-click on the bottom left corner of the screen (where you used to right-click to get the device manager in Win7), and the popup menu offers you the device-manager.

You can easily get back the start menu by installing third-party software, e.g. Start8 by Stardock Systems.

here's an idea: get a job and (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956535)

buy a mac, you basement dwelling dorks.

Awesome! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956559)

The year of the linux desktop comes closer with the lock down of proprietary systems.

Just part of their usual 2 product plan (2)

Xacid (560407) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956565)

Yeah yeah, I'm primarily a Windows guy and have actually been damned pleased with Win 7.

But this does appear to be in their usual cycle of releasing garbage first (ME, Vista) just to make some fairly decent release soon following (XP, Win 7).

As a Windows admin I don't even bother with the first releases of their seemingly usual 2 part deal. Not even worth it.

Time to short Microsoft stock (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956573)

Not that they're going anywhere, but 2013 is going to be a bad year for MSFT.

Can't the EU force microsoft to provide a bypass? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956601)

If they can force a version without media player (N versions) and browser choice screen, then they should be able to force an interface choice option.

I guess they can afford an experiment (1)

Lord Lode (1290856) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956649)

I think they just try an experiment. Who cares that one version is disliked by users, this has happened so many times already anyway. They still sell the previous version and they'll make a next one after that in which they'll do what the users want again, like Windows 7 was (disclaimer: posted by someone who has not actually used Windows since the XP version so may have no idea what he's talking about).

Kind of Like It (3)

cryptizard (2629853) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956653)

Am I alone here? I think it is pretty cool. I hear a lot of "change for the sake of change" being bad around here, but why is staying the same for the sake of staying the same a good thing? One of the biggest draws (for me) to Linux was that it was something new and different. Why are people suddenly so set in their ways that anything remotely different from their crufty old UI is instantly the worst thing ever? What happened to the spirit of "new and cool"? Maybe Metro isn't for everybody, and maybe it won't last, but it is certainly different and, dare I say it, kind of fun.

First it's called.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#40956683)

First it's called Metro. Now its the UI formerly known as Metro. I hope they don't change it again to a symbol that doesn't exist on the keyboard.

Shell Game (2)

guttentag (313541) | about a year and a half ago | (#40956691)

It's a shell game [wikipedia.org].

"Like the look of the Metro Interface? Well it's right here in one of these shiny boxes! That's right, ooh shiny. Sick and tired of the Metro Interface? Well one of these boxes here has the NotMetro Interface! That's right, just what you asked for. No, no sir, no shell game here, just good fun. What's that? Oh, you wanted an actual shell? That's right here inside one of these boxes, inside the NotMetro Interface, inside the NotDOS prompt! Something for everyone! Step right up!"
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