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Polish MP Returns iPad Citing Lack of Control

Unknown Lamer posted about a year and a half ago | from the cloud-is-watching-you dept.

Cloud 148

rysiek writes "Polish MP and spokesperson for one of Polish political parties Dariusz Joski returned his state-issued iPad, citing lack of control (Google-translated). Polish Free and Open Source Software Foundation (of Anti-ACTA fame) offered (free of charge, of course) to help him choose, install and configure Linux on his laptop, including setting-up disk encryption. We are still waiting for an answer from the MP." Another concern of his appears to have been a lack of security regarding communications with other government officials.

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148 comments

I like Apple bashing as much as the next man... (4, Insightful)

FalconZero (607567) | about a year and a half ago | (#41080719)

...but this story to me reads as a "Man does not like thing." fluff piece.

Can anyone enlighten me?

Re:I like Apple bashing as much as the next man... (5, Insightful)

PCK (4192) | about a year and a half ago | (#41080965)

Well as a politician I'm pretty sure he had one eye on the free publicity for him this would cause, seems to have worked I'd say.

Re:I like Apple bashing as much as the next man... (1, Informative)

blind biker (1066130) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081253)

...but this story to me reads as a "Man does not like thing." fluff piece.

Maybe there's more to it. Let me try: even a politician (who, on average, seem to be utterly clueless on technology) realizes that Apples walled garden is a bad thing.

Re:I like Apple bashing as much as the next man... (1)

FalconZero (607567) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081831)

The thing is that the even though some regard the walled garden thing to be a problem, it's a problem that most consumers are ok with, or indifferent to.

It is acknowledged that there are many things you can't do with an iPad, but the same is true of a hammer - I can't inflate a baloon with a hammer, but that doesn't stop it from being perfectly good at driving nails.

To me this story is a comparable story to "Polititian retuns government car because he can't change the paint colour."

Re:I like Apple bashing as much as the next man... (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41082675)

More like "Politician returns government car because he can't change the radio station, play his cd of choice, drive on certain roads or use particular fuel providers."

Re:I like Apple bashing as much as the next man... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41082987)

You can play any music you want on an iPad, you can connect to any Wi-Fi hotspot and recharge it via any electrical source.

Re:I like Apple bashing as much as the next man... (2)

rtkluttz (244325) | about a year and a half ago | (#41083601)

The hammer analogy has been used before and is completely irrelevant. Hammers have always been designed for a single task. Computing devices are general tools that have traditionally been open to the owner to work with and change as he pleases. The only limits have traditionally been limits in imagination and coding skill. The last 10 years has seen a new breed of computing devices that ARTIFICIALLY limited, broken by design, so that you work within limits set by the overlord errr Apple and/or have those restrictions removed one by one to generate a revenue stream.

Kudos to ANYONE with enough brains to say no, even if this motive might be secondary in this case.

Re:I like Apple bashing as much as the next man... (4, Insightful)

bhagwad (1426855) | about a year and a half ago | (#41083829)

A hammer is a clearly specialized instrument. A computer is not. Moroever, there's nothing stopping you from using a hammer for anything you care to find a use for. With computing devices these days, customers are ARTIFICIALLY restricted from doing stuff. And that is what I find offensive because the open culture of general purpose computing is one of the greatest achievements of mankind.

Re:I like Apple bashing as much as the next man... (1)

rtkluttz (244325) | about a year and a half ago | (#41084081)

Wow. Are you me or am I you? Our posts were almost identical (the post just above yours). Let me guess, you're about 6'3 with Sean Connery level good looks, great brain on your shoulders and absolutely DOES NOT live in your moms basement?

Re:I like Apple bashing as much as the next man... (2)

oakgrove (845019) | about a year and a half ago | (#41084073)

The thing is that the even though some regard the walled garden thing to be a problem, it's a problem that most consumers are ok with, or indifferent to.

You're responding to an easily assailable strawman and chopping it down. If I were more cynical, I'd think you wrote the AC comment you're replying to.

The politician gave very clear reasons why he didn't want to use the iPad and it wasn't some vague notion of "walled garden = do not want". He rejected it because in his opinion he lacked control over data stored on the device. He wondered if the data is backed up and the back-up service gets breeched then the public will be severely harmed. My Polish is non-existent and Google translate isn't much better but I'm pretty sure that's the jist of his complaint and deserves more credence than the condescending and vague "walled garden" presumption. As far as what "consumers" want, I don't think this MP was making a general statement on iPad suitability and the consequences of his data falling into the wrong hands would effect many more people than the typical consumer's data would.

Re:I like Apple bashing as much as the next man... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41081657)

He tried to train his falcon with an iPad app and it wrecked the touchscreen.
Also the screen gets messy too fast when you're eating caviar by the handfull.

Re:I like Apple bashing as much as the next man... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41082107)

...but this story to me reads as a "Man does not like thing." fluff piece.

It's more than that, it is "Govt issues ipad to legislator claiming that it is secure and can be used for confidential govt business."

Re:I like Apple bashing as much as the next man... (2)

FalconZero (607567) | about a year and a half ago | (#41082719)

Well, Google Translate didn't do a great job in this instance, so I'll have to take that as an assumption, (unless you read Polish or have a better source and can tell me definitively) .

What I did get from the article is what I assumed to be the principle objection - a quote stating "Admin has access to everything." - which holds true for any organisation which uses email.

Re:I like Apple bashing as much as the next man... (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41082245)

I think the big story is that there still exist people who don't know about the lack of control. On Slashdot we all know; in the mainstream most people don't.

Obviously the guy cares about being The master of his computer, knowing who has access to his imap password, etc. Had he known how bad this particular personal computer would be about such things, he would have avoided it from the beginning. But he didn't.

This suggests to me that more educating of the public, could help everyone a lot. People ought to know about iOS' problems before, not after. Finding out after is why Apple is doing so well (as Microsoft before them), and at the public's expense since control issues are zero-sum games.

This guy should never have been put into this situation where he has to get rid of the already-paid-for junk. But unlike many problems, we actually have the power to prevent this one, simply by spreading the word.

Apple-bashing isn't sufficient; you have to say why you're Apple-bashing. Explain the problem enough, and eventually people won't need things bashed anymore, because the products' defects will scream at the prospective customers for themselves. They'll see that some products aren't advertised as serving their users or as being secure, and realize "oh right, that stuff matters, and it's suspicious when the manufacturer weasels about it."

There's no reason we can't get the state of the art in security (who has access to your email?) at least back to as well as it was 20 years ago (which was pretty bad, but I'm only comparing it to 2012 so the bar is absurdly low). All it takes it getting the public to think that way.

Re:I like Apple bashing as much as the next man... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41082929)

Did the buyer of Slashdot front for MS or is it caused by shill posters, mods, and submitters from outside? Why is Apple no-longer showing as a choice at the left side of the page, and there's no access to the option to enable it? I miss the old days.

Besides not being "stuff that matters", there's been a lot of industry propaganda, bashing/flamebait, and junk science in stories. This should be investigated as it is a crime if some are attempting to manipulate stock to advantage. And if its general bad behavior we should know what companies or agencies. It's also illegal for the government to use propaganda on its own citizens.

Lack of control? (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41080723)

The MP probably doesn't realize that Apple has plenty of control over all iPads.

Re:Lack of control? (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41080819)

On the contrary. He seems to have realized exactly that - and so he returned the thing. Ipads are fine for surfing and "family use", but I wouldn't trust one to keep state secrets. For that, you use a machine where you can inspect all the software - and you preferably have some trusted experts to set it up. The man is just being sensible.

Re:Lack of control? (-1, Troll)

falcon5768 (629591) | about a year and a half ago | (#41080959)

And you and him are being a idiot if you think you cant do all of that on a iPad. For one thing the iOS encryption has been ruled as uncrackable (meaning it would take way more time and effort to crack the encryption than it would be worth not that it is impossible to crack). http://www.neowin.net/news/ios-encryption-is-impossible-to-crack-by-nsas-standards [neowin.net] For another you can inspect all communications off the iPad no problem and even block what apps are allowed on it with any of the number of MDM solutions out there including the one Apple provides with OS X Server. So no he is not being sensible and you are being a FUD loving fucktard.

Re:Lack of control? (4, Insightful)

LordLimecat (1103839) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081151)

It does not look from that article that it has been "ruled uncrackable", except by NeoWin. They seem to assume that because AES is "uncrackable", and because Apple claims that they do not store the key, their implementation must therefore be uncrackable / without flaws.

Anyone who has watched security for any length of time knows that "hypothetically uncrackable" is a lot different than "practically secure". Maybe they leak key details; maybe they dont properly santize RAM before the iPad powers down (and therefore it may be susceptable to a cold boot attack).

Until some respected crypto expert looks at the thing, any declarations about security on the IOS are worthless marketing tools.

Re:Lack of control? (1)

Krneki (1192201) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081203)

Exactly, we have to thread pads or mobile phones as a computer, and as a computer you don't buy is from the shop and use it straight away. If you have a serious business you wipe it and have the OS installed by a professional who understands security.

Re:Lack of control? (2)

sl4shd0rk (755837) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081219)

but I wouldn't trust one to keep state secrets...The man is just being sensible.

Obviously in the minority, in the US anyway.

not the first story (2, Insightful)

slashmydots (2189826) | about a year and a half ago | (#41080777)

This is not by any means they first story I've read about people getting an ipad for work and then finding it they can't make it do everything they want because Apple controls everything. It's not even mods or SD cards or custom software, it's that there's no mouse and keyboard or printing support (as far as I know) or apps to do things you need in the one and only app store. I've had several customers tell me that as they're buying a laptop from me. I've had vendors use an ipad to send me a PDF form to fill out and it's all screwed up with finger-checkmarks in the wrong place, wrong dates because the font was too small to read in that section, etc.
If you want to do real work, get a real computer. It's kinda sad that Apple hates on Linux then actually released a product that's less functional, less flexible, and less compatible with other software than Linux. Hey, whatever helps lol.

Re:not the first story (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41080975)

This is not by any means they first story I've read about people getting an ipad for work and then finding it they can't make it do everything they want because Apple controls everything.

Everybody should define their requirements and compare them to a product's features before making a purchase rather than buying something and then realizing it doesn't do what they wanted it to do. Does Apple restrict an iPad's features and usability by hardware and software designs? Yes. Does that absolve a consumer from not doing their homework before making a purchase? No.

captcha: retract

Re:not the first story (1)

History's Coming To (1059484) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081723)

Absolutely spot on. I've seen umpteen businesses using iPads simply because they're the Next Big Thing, not realising that they're far better off with the dowdy, sad, old-fashioned netbooks they had previously been using.

Sure, if you just need to browse the odd website, go with an iPad, but they're designed for consuming, not producing.

Re:not the first story (2)

jellomizer (103300) | about a year and a half ago | (#41082671)

I never saw too much business adoption of netbooks. But I saw a lot of people going from normal notebook to the iPad. Not always because it is cool. But more to the fact that they are smaller and lighter and run longer without a battery. The biggest use I have seen for them is for email, and keeping notes, most have an external keyboard attached to the case.

Netbooks were a little bulkier, They needed to be wall charged, not USB charged with the PC next to them, or the USB port modern cars seem to have now. And their PC OS is slow and bulky compared to the more optimized portable OS.

The people who do well with an iPad are the same people who never really needed a full PC to begin with.

Re:not the first story (5, Insightful)

jedrek (79264) | about a year and a half ago | (#41080991)

it's that there's no mouse and keyboard or printing support (as far as I know)

You... don't know. Here's a list of a couple hundred printers [apple.com] that work with the iPad, here is a roundup of keyboard/case solutions for the iPad [theverge.com] from The Verge. I'm not going to search for mouse setups for a multi-touch device for various reasons.

You know what really bugs me about your post? Since the first time I logged into slashdot, I've been reading about cases of FUD working against Linux and Open Source Software. Now I'm seeing Linux and Android fanboys with their heads up their asses, spreading the same kind of FUD. "Oh, as far as I know, it doesn't work with external keyboards." sure brings me back to the times of, "It seems to me that if it was good, they'd charge money for it."

It's kinda sad that Apple hates on Linux then actually released a product that's less functional, less flexible, and less compatible with other software than Linux.

Apple hates on Linux? Linux isn't even on Apple's radar. What they've made is a product that's more functional and flexible than a phone, while being considerably more portable than a laptop. They weren't trying to create a new laptop, they were aiming for a product between laptops and phones. Most people have extremely low demands of their computers. Email, Skype, a browser and a photo editing application. Hell, my girlfriend is technical enough to fix her own router, but I haven't seen her do anything on her laptop that she couldn't do on a tablet in the four months we've been living together.

Re:not the first story (2)

Infernal Device (865066) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081091)

You should probably also mention that we're still in early iterations of tablet design and functionality - just as the laptop today is a supercomputer compared to early laptops, the tablets of the future will resemble nothing we use today (except maybe form factor).

Re:not the first story (4, Informative)

LordLimecat (1103839) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081205)

You... don't know. Here's a list of a couple hundred printers [apple.com] that work with the iPad

The vast vast majority do NOT, unless you do some crazy hacks to set up an AirPrint service on your laptop to make it act like a print server for IOS. There are literally thousands of printers out there, and most are not AirPrint compatible.

Re:not the first story (2)

Stewie241 (1035724) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081345)

Sure, but the refuted claim was "it's that there's no mouse and keyboard or printing support (as far as I know)". At least two of those three have been rebutted here.

Re:not the first story (2)

jedidiah (1196) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081615)

What the iPad offers is not "printing support" as it has come to be defined by common practice over the last 30 years of consumer computing.

Some hack bolted on as an afterthought? Someone could be forgiven for not considering that "printing support".

Re:not the first story (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41082343)

This is similar to rooting to get tethering working.

Also, learn the importance of never calling setup unhackable and encryption unbreakable, especially given physical access, insider leakers and reverse engineers.

There is a difference between "not supported" and not possible.

Re:not the first story (1)

toriver (11308) | about a year and a half ago | (#41083883)

You mean rooting to bypass the limitations you had agreed to when you signed up with the cellular service provider?

Tethering works fine on any un-rooted iOs device where the service provider includes it in your contract.

Re:not the first story (1)

jellomizer (103300) | about a year and a half ago | (#41082697)

There is printing support... However I havn't seen a printer that a business uses that supports it though.

Re:not the first story (2)

_xeno_ (155264) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081535)

Not to mention that, at least in my experience, the iPad only "works" with printers. The last time I tried to print something off an iPad using AirPrint, I had to reboot the iPad to even get it to see the printer. After which it did print - eventually. I'm not sure why it's so ungodly slow, but it is.

But, hey, it "worked." After finding out the brain-dead way you turn off an iPad. (Yep, that's intuitive - hold the "lock" button.)

Re:not the first story (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41082555)

So... wait. You own an iPad, but you never actually learned how to turn it off?!

Re:not the first story (1)

_xeno_ (155264) | about a year and a half ago | (#41083097)

I know it's hard to do, but try and think of a common scenario where someone who does not own an iPad may be asked to help figure out why it can't print to the printer it's next to. Hint: it involves other people, possibly related.

I also happen to be working on an iPad app for my job, so there's that too, but so far all I've ever done involves the iPad simulator and not the actual device. And Squiggle-Q doesn't work to reboot the actual hardware. (But don't worry about the app - you'll never see it, because there's no reason for it to even exist, let alone be an iOS app, let alone be an iPad-only iOS app.)

Re:not the first story (1)

filthpickle (1199927) | about a year and a half ago | (#41083523)

I have an iPad and I really enjoy it for what I use it for....but if I hadn't already known how to turn it off because it probably worked like the iphone did I am not sure I would have immediately gone for the lock button either. Here's another handy one....double click the home button, touch and hold an app, the red dash that appears on the icon will kill that app.

you'll never see it, because there's no reason for it to even exist, let alone be an iOS app, let alone be an iPad-only iOS app

Hehe, the company I work for did the exact same thing and were all excited about it (and it never went anywhere because nobody used it). I am working with a client of ours now who also doing this exact thing. At least we will make some money on it this time.

Re:not the first story (1)

jedrek (79264) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081963)

You... don't know. Here's a list of a couple hundred printers [apple.com] that work with the iPad

The vast vast majority do NOT, unless you do some crazy hacks to set up an AirPrint service on your laptop to make it act like a print server for IOS. There are literally thousands of printers out there, and most are not AirPrint compatible.

Oh man, this is like an echo chamber from 10-15 years ago. The vast majority of printers were not supported by Linux for years and years, now most of them are due to CUPS. You know, that system created by Apple. Anyway, I had to google printer support for iPads (although I had heard they have it) because in 2012... I don't print documents. I've had to print 2 sheets of paper since summer 2011, I just emailed them to the print shop and had them printed out for me.

Re:not the first story (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41082609)

That's an interesting recollection of the genesis of CUPS.

Re:not the first story (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41082875)

Pay attention guys, we're seeing Apple history-rewriting methods first-handed! In a few months, all Apple users will call you a stupid liar if you tell them Apple BOUGHT Cups, instead of creating it. This is the beginning of the same process that happened to the smartphone, touchscreen, WebKit/KHTML, GUI, mobile applications, usable mobile browsers...

Re:not the first story (1)

StuartHankins (1020819) | about a year and a half ago | (#41082941)

I use Printopia for Mac, which allows me to print to any printer I have shared on my Mac, including network printers. It's a $20 app I think. Dunno if there is a Windows utility that does the same.

Re:not the first story (1)

slashmydots (2189826) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081365)

What planet are you from? Seriously? Alternatives to Windows are in direct, close competition since there's not a whole lot of them and since Apple is ungodly expensive and Linux is free, LINUX IS ON APPLE'S RADAR! Can the admins just start deleting the accounts of Apple fanboys so we can actually have a discussion here instead of one-sided whining and biased bullshit?

Re:not the first story (2)

jedrek (79264) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081863)

What planet are you from? Seriously? Alternatives to Windows are in direct, close competition since there's not a whole lot of them and since Apple is ungodly expensive and Linux is free

Can we stop with the FUD again? If Linux is free then Apple is damn cheap since Mountain Lion clocks in at a whopping $20. Windows is extremely expensive, with Win 7 Pro Upgrade coming in at $170.

If we're talking about hardware then realize that Linux does not compete with Apple as pretty much nobody no major retailer offers ready-to-go desktop products with Linux installed. Now, I have no qualms about calling Apple PC hardware a premium priced product. Please do realize that they have a total of 7 product lines, two of which don't actually exist among any other manufacturers - I'm referring to the MBP Retina and Mac Mini. Their ultrabooks are priced between Asus ($900) and Sony ($1800) for the $1100 MBA I bought last year. That's not 'ungodly expensive', it's middle of the road and it came with a Unix installed.

You know what, prove me wrong. Show me the market where Apple is working against Linux on the desktop. The marketing strategies they've used to go after it, to combat it.

Re:not the first story (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41083817)

the market where Apple is working against Linux on the desktop

Scientific computing - aka the reason Apple bothers to get certified as UNIX. Look at this [brainmapping.org] advertisement and tell me it's not intentionally competing against people who would otherwise be attracted to Linux.

Re:not the first story (1)

Xest (935314) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081593)

"Hell, my girlfriend is technical enough to fix her own router, but I haven't seen her do anything on her laptop that she couldn't do on a tablet in the four months we've been living together."

Well, let's just hope that she doesn't have to download a firmware update from her router and upload it to the device through a standard HTML file upload form element on her iPad then.

Yes, that's right, because of iOS' restrictions, it can't even perform this sort of basic task.

Re:not the first story (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41081077)

Don't talk about things you don't know about. My iPad works great with my HP printer, my bluetooth keyboard, and a number of other third party peripherals. There's also plenty of HTML5-based apps out there to do anything that apps on the iTunes store don't do.

The only thing it lacks that Linux alternatives have is you can't get the source code (beyond anything that might be on MacOSForge, http://www.macosforge.org/, like the Darwin kernel and WebKit). Guess what? You can't get the source code used for most Android phone apps, either, beyond the source for Android itself.

Re:not the first story (3, Informative)

Desler (1608317) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081191)

http://www.apple.com/ipad/accessories/ [apple.com]

Apple Wireless Keyboard
The incredibly thin Apple Wireless Keyboard uses Bluetooth technology, which makes it compatible with iPad. And you’re free to type wherever you like — with the keyboard in front of your iPad or on your lap.

AirPrint [apple.com]

This took 2 seconds to find. It's amazing how low the bar for 'insightful' and 'nformative' mods is these days. Apparently all you have to do is make ignorant anti-Apple statements.

Re:not the first story (-1)

slashmydots (2189826) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081411)

Oh good, another Apple fanboy. Yes, because the ipad is so portable and convenient when you have 2 things to carry and 2 batteries to worry about. I bet I could find a mouse too.
As for the other comment by the person above you, you don't buy a printer based on your tablets. Oh no, we have an ipad! Let's get rid of our $27,000 laser printer and get an Apple-approved one. Once again, ipads are not for business environments. They're too small, slow, don't work with Windows software, are gigantic security nightmares, are too easy to break, and cost too much. That's reality. All the Apple fanboy posts in the world will not change reality.

Re:not the first story (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41082665)

Once again, ipads [...] don't work with Windows software

Wait, wait, wait, wait wait.

This is a bad thing?!

Re:not the first story (1)

Geeky (90998) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081977)

From what I've seen AirPrint will only work if the router supports something Apple call "bonjour". It seems that very few do.

I only know this based on trying to get a wifi HP printer working with a Macbook for a friend and failing miserably.

Re:not the first story (1)

toriver (11308) | about a year and a half ago | (#41083959)

Bonjour is Apple's implementation of the principles of zeroconf [wikipedia.org] . Other implementations exist too.

But I guess you will want to wait for a public standard before you commit to anything.

Re:not the first story (1)

jareth-0205 (525594) | about a year and a half ago | (#41082847)

AirPrint [apple.com]

This took 2 seconds to find. It's amazing how low the bar for 'insightful' and 'nformative' mods is these days. Apparently all you have to do is make ignorant anti-Apple statements.

Which is ofcourse fine if you are buying a printer *after* you have bought your iPad. If you already own one then you are almost certainly screwed.

Re:not the first story (1)

Noughmad (1044096) | about a year and a half ago | (#41082995)

From your link, the Apple Wireless keyboard costs $69. In Europe that apparently translates to around €75. For that money, you get something you can't carry around, has no other uses except for Apple devices, and will kill your wrists and/or fingers.

Re:not the first story (1)

toriver (11308) | about a year and a half ago | (#41083985)

Eh, it's a fucking Bluetooth keyboard. It works with everything that uses Bluetooth keyboards. What the fuck made you think it only works with Apple devices? FUDster.

Re:not the first story (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41081801)

Yes, tablets are not laptops.

You little geeks keep saying that like its some sort of divine revelation. Get over it already. People are allowed to *not* want to tinker with computers and wank over pony tentacle porn. Computing is not the be all end all of human knowledge and endeavor. For some it's a tool to do other (and far more interesting and fascinating) things.

Seriously, I did all that tinkering shit with Linux installs for a few years before I realized what an absolute fucking bore it was. Got a Mac, switched to photography, computer art and writing musical software. Much more interesting. Meet a lot of people that way, too.

Re:not the first story (1)

Quiet_Desperation (858215) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081901)

(as far as I know)

[mythbuster]Well, now, *there's* your problem.[/mythbuster]

Does it occur to you people that the very existence of separate laptop and tablet markets means there's different use cases?

I can put together a gaming rig in my sleep, and have designed computing systems that have gone into space, and yet I have my little iPad for relaxing at home after work and I just want to watch a video or get some news. Why is that such an offensive and horrible thing to some folks?

Walls? It's loaded with ripped DVDs and torrented stuff.

Re:not the first story (1)

jellomizer (103300) | about a year and a half ago | (#41082747)

"Why is that such an offensive and horrible thing to some folks?"
Because They didn't invent it, and it isn't RMS Gold Stamp Certified Not Evil!

Ridiculous idea in the first place (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41080845)

Sorry, but to give an MP an ipad seems like a ridiculous idea in the first place. Surely, an MP, who almost certainly has access to classified information at one occasion or another, ought to have a laptop with some full-disk encrypted, hardened Linux or Unix on it, an OS that has been audited and approved by experts?

Or were these ipads just a private "gift" from Apple, a standard lobbyist bribe and never intended for official use?

Re:Ridiculous idea in the first place (5, Informative)

falcon5768 (629591) | about a year and a half ago | (#41080977)

Re:Ridiculous idea in the first place (1)

_xeno_ (155264) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081389)

It is? What's the magic incantation to turn that on?

I ask because of tools like iExplorer [macroplant.com] , which let you access the entire iOS device's file system and download files unencrypted.

Which means that if it's on by default, it's trivial to bypass. I've used the tool I linked before to try and debug a broken iPad - you just plug it in, and it can pull files off the device, just like that. It's also not the only solution [google.com] .

And that's not mentioning things like iCloud backup, which is turned on by default last I checked. And, sure, Apple says it's encrypted (except your email and notes - those aren't). I'll let someone else download the source to the iCloud server software and see if they're telling the truth...

Re:Ridiculous idea in the first place (2)

iluvcapra (782887) | about a year and a half ago | (#41082167)

These apps don't work unless the iDevice is unlocked when you plug it in, or you have the backup password.

Re:Ridiculous idea in the first place (1)

DeeEff (2370332) | about a year and a half ago | (#41083141)

"backup password."

There should never be a backup password to a secure system. You lost the password? Too bad, not even you can get your data.

Re:Ridiculous idea in the first place (1)

falcon5768 (629591) | about a year and a half ago | (#41083309)

It isnt the backup password to the device, its a password to the BACKUPS if you perform them. If you are in a environment that restricts connecting your iPad for backups which is the case in any well run Enterprise, then there are no backups.

Re:Ridiculous idea in the first place (1)

falcon5768 (629591) | about a year and a half ago | (#41083367)

iExplore only works if you can unlock the iPad which if it is a business iPad would have a forced password on it requiring you to swipe and type in the 4+ character passcode or password depending on the policy you set. The swiping to unlock actually un-encrypts your data.

Re:Ridiculous idea in the first place (1)

aaaaaaargh! (1150173) | about a year and a half ago | (#41082283)

You've missed the bit about security auditing that the OP mentioned. I hope you remember the Apple file vault debacle, which allowed users to recover the file vault password by a simple one-line grep statement that you could copy & paste in terminal? It took Apple several years to close this hole.

It would be pretty naive to believe that iOS can be considered good enough for confidential information. But I guess the other poster has a point that it's pretty hard to use an iPad for anything useful anyway...

Re:Ridiculous idea in the first place (1)

jeremyp (130771) | about a year and a half ago | (#41083191)

You've missed the bit about security auditing that the OP mentioned. I hope you remember the Apple file vault debacle, which allowed users to recover the file vault password by a simple one-line grep statement that you could copy & paste in terminal? It took Apple several years to close this hole.

It would be pretty naive to believe that iOS can be considered good enough for confidential information. But I guess the other poster has a point that it's pretty hard to use an iPad for anything useful anyway...

Things have moved on...

http://www.technologyreview.com/news/428477/the-iphone-has-passed-a-key-security-threshold/ [technologyreview.com]

Re:Ridiculous idea in the first place (0)

Joce640k (829181) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081063)

Not at all. No meaningful data can be stored in an iPad so it seems ideal for the sort of people who handle state secrets and keep leaving laptops in taxis.

Re:Ridiculous idea in the first place (1)

Desler (1608317) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081213)

It's trivially easy to use full disk encryption with an iPad and for your iTunes backups. Welcome to 2 years ago.

Hmmmph. (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41080889)

Well, he is Polish...
<ducks>

sounds like he might've had a sentient tablet (5, Funny)

Trepidity (597) | about a year and a half ago | (#41080957)

From the Google-translated story, a quotation:

"Admin has access to everything. Tablet I am"

Sounds ominous indeed.

Re:sounds like he might've had a sentient tablet (1)

in10d (555219) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081243)

Blame Google Translate... Actually he said "I am turning in the tablet".

Really? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41080969)

He just was unable to download illegal torrents

Q: How many Poles does it take to return an iPad? (0, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41081015)

A: Sod off, bigot.

Apple is the biggest prize (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41081029)

Wait till Apple are hacked,
its the grand prize of Anon and they love a good SPOF

full access to politicians, celebs, friends, mail, files (iCloud), images, exact GPS location at anytime, read/write access on a billion devices is just too good an opportunity to let up.
tick tock

Ah yes, Poland (5, Interesting)

Xtense (1075847) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081037)

The land I was born in, the land that I grew up in, the land that I live in and the land that I love... ...with some of the worst (or best, depending on your definition of the word) politicians I've ever seen. You have to understand - they don't use those iPads for anything other than browsing porn ( http://www.komputerswiat.pl/media/2012/187/2456339/porno-tablety-sejm-1.jpg [komputerswiat.pl] ) or funnyjunk-like equivalents. They're wasting money - and they're wasting our money, because the iPads were state-funded. We're letting them do that - and there is nothing we can do to change that.

This isn't just some generic "politics == stupid" sentiment - this is a matter of analyzing at least the major decisions of the last 100 years and coming to the conclusion that the decisionmakers are idiots. It would be at least comforting to know that the voters are aware of it, but no dice - politics in Poland are either a taboo subject or restricted entirely to the Internet - and we all know how debating on the Internet works. I can honestly tell you that no camp currently registered for voting into the Sejm (the Senate 2.0) is worth voting for. The two major parties, PO (centrist/right) and PiS (right/national) are so deep in shitslinging between them that they lost focus on running the country, which breeds tons of discontent and lots of potential for corruption, both internal and external - they were both caught in the act, too. The alternative parties aren't much better: SLD (left/social) are basically repurposed commies from the last system and notorious for their mob connections, Ruch Palikota (liberal) is led by a huge idiot who changes his views like a goddamn flag, and UPR (left social/right economy) is helmed by a guy who is first to rip off "working" solutions from other countries with no regard for both current possibilities or needs of Poland.

This situation is perfect for PR however, since voting usually is not between "the best candidates" but "the least evil", so it just takes the right amount of spin to completely ruin a party's chances.

But it starts to show. Voter participation is dropping with each term - which in the short term is very bad since it leads to fringe voting, but in the long run demonstrates that we're starting to get tired of this shit.

It crossed my mind to post this anonymously to be honest, since Polish politics are a matter of very heated (and very vulgar) debate on the Polish-speaking Internet, but, ah well.

Re:Ah yes, Poland (1)

isorox (205688) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081263)

The land I was born in, the land that I grew up in, the land that I live in and the land that I love... ...with some of the worst (or best, depending on your definition of the word) politicians I've ever seen. You have to understand - they don't use those iPads for anything other than browsing porn ( http://www.komputerswiat.pl/media/2012/187/2456339/porno-tablety-sejm-1.jpg [komputerswiat.pl] ) or funnyjunk-like equivalents.

That's Facebook isn't it?

On the whole I agree with your sentiments about politics. Ultimately everything we read is PR, there's hardly any news any more, and even the excellent journalists I work with are limited to 30 second sound bites outside closed offices. You get occasional great reports - mostly in papers, but sometimes on the bbc.

You get great live coverage on tv too, skys coverage of te fall of tripoli was a masterpiece.

But the bulk of news is generated by pr companies, and until the public realise that and actively fight against it, politics is doomed.

Re:Ah yes, Poland (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41081275)

I could have said the same for my country (France).
I guess it's time to sharpen the guillotines since nothing less than revolution will make them understand.

Re:Ah yes, Poland (2)

fustakrakich (1673220) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081709)

Your post indicates how much alike we all are, no matter where we are from. Corruption, like pollution, does not respect political or cultural boundaries.

Re:Ah yes, Poland (2)

Hatta (162192) | about a year and a half ago | (#41083227)

This isn't just some generic "politics == stupid" sentiment - this is a matter of analyzing at least the major decisions of the last 100 years and coming to the conclusion that the decisionmakers are idiots.

Sounds just like America.

It would be at least comforting to know that the voters are aware of it, but no dice - politics in Poland are either a taboo subject or restricted entirely to the Internet - and we all know how debating on the Internet works

Same here. They've made political discourse so unpleasant, you can't talk politics with family or friends if you want them to remain on good terms.

I can honestly tell you that no camp currently registered for voting into the Sejm (the Senate 2.0) is worth voting for.

Again, just like America.

The two major parties, PO (centrist/right) and PiS (right/national) are so deep in shitslinging between them that they lost focus on running the country, which breeds tons of discontent and lots of potential for corruption, both internal and external - they were both caught in the act, too.

Damnit, quit copying America!

The alternative parties aren't much better: SLD (left/social) are basically repurposed commies from the last system and notorious for their mob connections, Ruch Palikota (liberal) is led by a huge idiot who changes his views like a goddamn flag, and UPR (left social/right economy) is helmed by a guy who is first to rip off "working" solutions from other countries with no regard for both current possibilities or needs of Poland.

At least you actually have alternative parties. I bet they are on the ballot across the country too. Here we have exactly one third party candidate that's on the ballot in all 50 states, a "libertarian" candidate whose major accomplishment is privatizing the prison system when he was governor.

But hey, at least you guys have a parliamentary system where voting for the guy you want will at least get you proportional representation in parliament. With our winner take all system, if you're not in the majority you have no voice at all.

This situation is perfect for PR however, since voting usually is not between "the best candidates" but "the least evil", so it just takes the right amount of spin to completely ruin a party's chances.

Which is exactly what has happened to US politics. The biggest dog and pony show on earth, and not one shred of legitimate debate.

But it starts to show. Voter participation is dropping with each term - which in the short term is very bad since it leads to fringe voting, but in the long run demonstrates that we're starting to get tired of this shit.

Same here. Few people vote because there are no choices worth voting for. But the media spins this as apathy about political outcomes, not frustration at lack of choice. We're going to have to get down to single digit voter turnout before people start realizing the people no longer support this system

Re:Ah yes, Poland (1)

oakgrove (845019) | about a year and a half ago | (#41083493)

At least you actually have alternative parties. I bet they are on the ballot across the country too. Here we have exactly one third party candidate that's on the ballot in all 50 states.

In my opinion, this is one of the greatest failings of the political system in the United States. If we had a system whereby third party candidates could get a seat even if they didn't "win" it all then people would actually get some exposure to alternative non-Republicrat party line debate on the issues. Things would have a chance to "click" which is very difficult on a campaign trail as the main preoccupation is getting votes not deep reflection on solving difficult problems. What happens now is the 2 major parties suck all the oxygen out of the room and the other guys end up just preaching to their respective choirs. That will be very hard to change but I think the real catalyst is people are so caught up in the Democrat/Republican us vs. them trope that they don't even see a problem.

Re:Ah yes, Poland (1)

Hatta (162192) | about a year and a half ago | (#41083555)

In the opinions of any Democratic or Republican candidate it's one of the greatest strengths. This is why the most important vote you can cast is for a third party. Any third party.

Re:Ah yes, Poland (1)

phantomfive (622387) | about a year and a half ago | (#41083467)

this is a matter of analyzing at least the major decisions of the last 100 years and coming to the conclusion that the decisionmakers are idiots.

Not to be rude, but weren't most of the major Polish decisions of the last 100 years made by Russians or Germans?

Local IT control, _not_ Apple. (4, Informative)

Moskit (32486) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081171)

Guy lost his gov-issued iPad.
Local IT admin said he can recover all his data and burn on CD, so MP doesn't need to worry it's lost. Data including his _private_ emails that was on iPad.

This is what set him off to return the iPad. Not Apple control.

Original iPad wasn't found he bought a replacement one from private money and returned it. Good guy!

As a form of protest he posted "Admins have access to everything!" on his Facebook before returning device. 300 of government officials (out of 460) use such iPads for work.

Re:Local IT control, _not_ Apple. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41081225)

Does anyone see the irony of him posting that message to facebook?

Re:Local IT control, _not_ Apple. (1)

M. Baranczak (726671) | about a year and a half ago | (#41081943)

Does anyone see the irony of him posting that message to facebook?

Not really. He intended the message to be public. For things like that, Facefuck is actually a legitimate choice.

Re:Local IT control, _not_ Apple. (1)

aristotle-dude (626586) | about a year and a half ago | (#41082049)

Guy lost his gov-issued iPad.
Local IT admin said he can recover all his data and burn on CD, so MP doesn't need to worry it's lost. Data including his _private_ emails that was on iPad.

This is what set him off to return the iPad. Not Apple control.

Original iPad wasn't found he bought a replacement one from private money and returned it. Good guy!

As a form of protest he posted "Admins have access to everything!" on his Facebook before returning device. 300 of government officials (out of 460) use such iPads for work.

Private emails on the device? Do they not use Exchange for government email? Why can't he use an IMAP service like iCloud or a myriad of other providers for his email? Why not setup a free iCloud account so that he could have remotely wiped his iPad after he lost it? Why didn't he have a strong passcode on the iPad?

Re:Local IT control, _not_ Apple. (1)

M. Baranczak (726671) | about a year and a half ago | (#41082171)

Exactly. Thanks for the summary. I'd tell people to read the damn article, but most of them can't read Polish, and the translation is gibberish.

The issue here is that the admins were keeping backups of the data, and the owner of the data wasn't aware of it. (We don't really know whose fault that is; maybe the guy just didn't read the memo from IT.) Are they encrypting the data so that only the owner can decode it? Is the backup process opt-in or opt-out? The article doesn't say.

Re:Local IT control, _not_ Apple. (1)

StankAsPoe (2713223) | about a year and a half ago | (#41082443)

I think this is the most important part about the whole thing. Original article doesn't mention MP going on about anything related to control as we would understand it. It is a spin put on by the FWiOO. Fact that he is suppose to be baffled by IT's access to his emails just proves how tech savvy he is.

Re:Local IT control, _not_ Apple. (1)

zerosomething (1353609) | about a year and a half ago | (#41082605)

OOH so I guess I misread the badly translated article? I didn't get that he lost the iPad. humm

Re:Local IT control, _not_ Apple. (1)

CAIMLAS (41445) | about a year and a half ago | (#41083659)

What a surprise: administrators can read your email.

This is not a surprise. So can managers. They can do a lot more than that, too, like send email from you. We're trained to not do this, of course - just as users are trained to not use work resources for personal use to avoid the possibility of a personal privacy breech. This is not a very big request, and it's violation has obvious consequences brought on by your own actions.

People have two basic choices: use work things which can be monitored, or use personal things which can not be (by work) - and deal with the consequences of having your data lost and devices hacked, and us not caring.

Um.. What "Lack of control"??? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41081181)

What "Lack of control"???

Plenty of MDMs support iOS - For network policies, app policies, email, password policies [length, complexity, duration between changes, etc], etc. iOS also supports whole device encryption.

Too many stupid people, not 'nuf saber-tooth tigers to EAT them all.

Politician doesn't understand technology (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41081227)

No news here - just another clueless politician.

Poland? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41081639)

A polish guy wins a brand new sports car in a contest. Hedrives around all the time waving at the rednecks. One day therednecks stop him, they draw a circle in the dirt and say "If you stepout of that circle, we will kick your ass." They pick up hammers andstart busting up his new car. They look back and the is smiling. Theyhit the car some more, and he is laughing. They walk over to him andask "Why are you laughing, we just busted up your car."He says "I know, but I stepped out of the circle 9 times."

Frankly any country where this kind of joke about its people is VERY common is not the kind of country where Apple needs to worry about politicians complaining about their products.

Think different.
Think BETTER.
Think Apple!

There's only two types of Polish people... (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41081907)

He's Polish 'nuf said.

Sloppy IT Security Practices? (1)

zerosomething (1353609) | about a year and a half ago | (#41082557)

I read this as the IT department just dumped a bunch of unmanaged iPads on these guys! Security on iOS devices can be very very good if you actually set it up. Alternately maybe the IT department did set it up securely and he's just miffed he has to use an alpha numeric passphrase and can't use his gmail email account for his "secure communications"?

In otherwords too hard to pirate (1)

thetoadwarrior (1268702) | about a year and a half ago | (#41083321)

Polish people don't pay for software and movies. He wants something that's more friendly towards sharing with your vast community of friends online.
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