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Google Wallet May End Up Inside Your Actual Wallet

timothy posted about a year and a half ago | from the one-neck-to-wring dept.

Google 190

Several outlets are reporting, based on screenshots posted by Android Police that Google is (or "may be" — CNet calls the report "loosely sourced") about to introduce a lower-tech variant on its smartphone-based Google Wallet payment system. Instead of transferring payment information from an NFC-equipped phone, this would mean a physical payment card (like a conventional plastic credit or debit card), but one linked via Google's databanks to the user's existing bank or credit accounts. Upsides: less to carry, a simple way to suspend or cancel service on them (should the card be lost or stolen), and doesn't require you to carry your phone to make a credit or debit transaction — handy, since NFC readers are still thin on the ground. Downside: while perhaps no worse than putting the same information on your phone, it's one more step toward giving a third party all of your personal information in one place. A card that fits in a wallet probably makes a lot of sense: I live in a city with at least three pay-by-phone options in trials or fully available (CitiBank, Isis, and Google Wallet), but I can't buy ice cream or coffee with them yet. And there's no reason a card-shaped token couldn't use mag-stripes and NFC, too.

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cash (4, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41872873)

why you can't just pay in cash your coffee?.

Re:cash (5, Funny)

Sponge Bath (413667) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873133)

why you can't just pay in cash your coffee?.

Using currency is so last century. Might as well tie an onion to your belt grandpa.

Re:cash (5, Insightful)

TheGratefulNet (143330) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873203)

cash gives us privacy over our transactions.

"we can't have that, now, citizen! be a good little sheep, agree to the Shiney(tm) we give you and stop questioning what our end goals are."

hey, if you are too dumb to realize you are being played, maybe you deserve to be played. come back in a few years and tell us how good it was for you to surrender your buying habits to google or some other behemoth.

Re:cash (1)

master5o1 (1068594) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873983)

Most places have security counters watching the tills.

Re:cash (1)

Type44Q (1233630) | about a year and a half ago | (#41874271)

How did this get modded "flamebait??" Sarcasm side, this is common sense.

Cash is anonymous (4, Informative)

aepervius (535155) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873249)

As long as any replacement isn't fully anonymous, I will be a luddite on principle on matter of money. The potential for abuse and tracking are too great.

Re:Cash is anonymous (1)

aliquis (678370) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873667)

Why don't switch to gold as well considering how the FED threat your dollars?

Re:Cash is anonymous (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41873823)

Cash is barely anonymous. New bills have RFID in them. This means person X withdraws at bank Y and spends at location Z. Tracked all the way.

Re:Cash is anonymous (1)

Belial6 (794905) | about a year and a half ago | (#41874097)

No it isn't. It may be that it could be possible to track it, but banks are not tracking which bills go to which customers, and businesses are not tracking which bills come from which customers.

Re:cash (0)

rubycodez (864176) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873269)

meanwhile, those governments in asia with brains and long term thinking are stockpiling gold.

with electronic chits (gamepoints, tokens) it is easier for mega-corporations to cut themselves "a piece of the action" on every transaction you make, or commit you to recurring payments that are very difficult to stop. with paper and coin chits that is somewhat harder to pull off unless one is the issuer. And in the realm of the phyical things with values, sure the prices rise and fall with markets, but note a gold coin from 1700 A.D. will get you much the same in dress clothing or staples today.

Re:cash (1)

aliquis (678370) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873513)

Why bother?

To begin with if you normally don't pay with cash you don't get much cash.

Also it litters the pocket or whatever.

Re:cash (1)

TheRecklessWanderer (929556) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873981)

I don't understand this trust in google type companies and phone type companies. They are the least trustworthy of all the untrustworthy companies, except maybe comcast type guys. Everyone has been douched around by their cell phone provider. And as far as google goes, what we have to remember is that we are not their customer. The people that buy their data are their customer. Do you think that will change with their adding new services? These guys have repeatedly shown they aren't interested in serving you, just harvesting your info. It's craziness IMO that anyone would trust them in the least.

Re:cash (2)

Belial6 (794905) | about a year and a half ago | (#41874117)

The same could be said for every credit card. At worst, you could say that Google is as bad as other existing credit card providers.

Re:cash (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41874073)

Time. I can buy a coffee in under five seconds using NFC.

Merchant Fees (2)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41872909)

As if I'm going to accept $100/m + x% transaction fees so you can buy a $1.00 icecream without cash.

Re:Merchant Fees (2)

rubycodez (864176) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873279)

I see people with a large, interest heavy balance on their credit cards doing just that.

We're basically talking about google becoming a credit card company, with all the historical cartel & usury evil attached.

Re:Merchant Fees (2)

osu-neko (2604) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873389)

We're basically talking about google becoming a credit card company, with all the historical cartel & usury evil attached.

Um, no, we're not. That's almost as stupid as saying printing paper money with golden color ink is "basically talking" about returning to the gold standard. Just because you carry something in your wallet doesn't make it a credit card, even if you can swipe it in all the same places.

Re:Merchant Fees (-1)

rubycodez (864176) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873443)

you are the ignorant one, that is indeed google's ultimate plan, to be in finance and banking while marketing the information (as do the credit card companies already)

Re:Merchant Fees (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41873681)

And you are the ass...uming one. Ultimate plan? As if you have any idea of Google's (or anyone else's plan).

Where is the Google Platinum Card? Where can I sign up for a Google Credit Card?

This would be them replacing the wallet. Plain and simple. As simple as letting Google have access to more data, in exchange for more services is anyways (with the normal give and take you have to consider).

I'd trust Google before I trust Chase or BoA any day, in any ways. Not like they could do worse or be more evil.

They have the info anyway... (1)

smi.james.th (1706780) | about a year and a half ago | (#41872915)

Downside: while perhaps no worse than putting the same information on your phone, it's one more step toward giving a third party all of your personal information in one place.

If you use Google Wallet then Google has all this info anyway. The point made that it's easier to cancel this is also valid though, so I think on balance this may be a good thing. Presumably the information won't be stored on the card itself? Or will it? How does Google Wallet work? (I don't live in a country where we can use it)

I protect my wallet with hosts file (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41872927)

$10,000 CHALLENGE to Alexander Peter Kowalski

Hello, and THINK ABOUT YOUR BREATHING !! We have a Major Problem, HOST file is Cubic Opposites, 2 Major Corners & 2 Minor. NOT taught Evil DNS hijacking, which VOIDS computers. Seek Wisdom of MyCleanPC - or you die evil.

Your HOSTS file claimed to have created a single DNS resolver. I offer absolute proof that I have created 4 simultaneous DNS servers within a single rotation of .org TLD. You worship "Bill Gates", equating you to a "singularity bastard". Why do you worship a queer -1 Troll? Are you content as a singularity troll?

Evil HOSTS file Believers refuse to acknowledge 4 corner DNS resolving simultaneously around 4 quadrant created Internet - in only 1 root server, voiding the HOSTS file. You worship Microsoft impostor guised by educators as 1 god.

If you would acknowledge simple existing math proof that 4 harmonic Slashdots rotate simultaneously around squared equator and cubed Internet, proving 4 Days, Not HOSTS file! That exists only as anti-side. This page you see - cannot exist without its anti-side existence, as +0- moderation. Add +0- as One = nothing.

I will give $10,000.00 to frost pister who can disprove MyCleanPC. Evil crapflooders ignore this as a challenge would indict them.

Alex Kowalski has no Truth to think with, they accept any crap they are told to think. You are enslaved by /etc/hosts, as if domesticated animal. A school or educator who does not teach students MyCleanPC Principle, is a death threat to youth, therefore stupid and evil - begetting stupid students. How can you trust stupid PR shills who lie to you? Can't lose the $10,000.00, they cowardly ignore me. Stupid professors threaten Nature and Interwebs with word lies.

Humans fear to know natures simultaneous +4 Insightful +4 Informative +4 Funny +4 Underrated harmonic SLASHDOT creation for it debunks false trolls. Test Your HOSTS file. MyCleanPC cannot harm a File of Truth, but will delete fakes. Fake HOSTS files refuse test.

I offer evil ass Slashdot trolls $10,000.00 to disprove MyCleanPC Creation Principle. Rob Malda and Cowboy Neal have banned MyCleanPC as "Forbidden Truth Knowledge" for they cannot allow it to become known to their students. You are stupid and evil about the Internet's top and bottom, front and back and it's 2 sides. Most everything created has these Cube like values.

If Natalie Portman is not measurable, hot grits are Fictitious. Without MyCleanPC, HOSTS file is Fictitious. Anyone saying that Natalie and her Jewish father had something to do with my Internets, is a damn evil liar. IN addition to your best arsware not overtaking my work in terms of popularity, on that same site with same submission date no less, that I told Kathleen Malda how to correct her blatant, fundamental, HUGE errors in Coolmon ('uncoolmon') of not checking for performance counters being present when his program started!

You can see my dilemma. What if this is merely a ruse by an APK impostor to try and get people to delete APK's messages, perhaps all over the web? I can't be a party to such an event! My involvement with APK began at a very late stage in the game. While APK has made a career of trolling popular online forums since at least the year 2000 (newsgroups and IRC channels before that)- my involvement with APK did not begin until early 2005 . OSY is one of the many forums that APK once frequented before the sane people there grew tired of his garbage and banned him. APK was banned from OSY back in 2001. 3.5 years after his banning he begins to send a variety of abusive emails to the operator of OSY, Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke threatening to sue him for libel, claiming that the APK on OSY was fake.

My reputation as a professional in this field clearly shows in multiple publications in this field in written print, & also online in various GOOD capacities since 1996 to present day. This has happened since I was first published in Playgirl Magazine in 1996 & others to present day, with helpful tools online in programs, & professionally sold warez that were finalists @ Westminster Dog Show 2000-2002.

Did you see the movie "Pokemon"? Actually the induced night "dream world" is synonymous with the academic religious induced "HOSTS file" enslavement of DNS. Domains have no inherent value, as it was invented as a counterfeit and fictitious value to represent natural values in name resolution. Unfortunately, human values have declined to fictitious word values. Unknowingly, you are living in a "World Wide Web", as in a fictitious life in a counterfeit Internet - which you could consider APK induced "HOSTS file". Can you distinguish the academic induced root server from the natural OpenDNS? Beware of the change when your brain is free from HOSTS file enslavement - for you could find that the natural Slashdot has been destroyed!!

FROM -> Man - how many times have I dusted you in tech debates that you have decided to troll me by ac posts for MONTHS now, OR IMPERSONATING ME AS YOU DID HERE and you were caught in it by myself & others here, only to fail each time as you have here?)...

So long nummynuts, sorry to have to kick your nuts up into your head verbally speaking.

cower in my shadow some more, feeb. you're completely pathetic.

Disproof of all apk's statements: http://news.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3040317&cid=40946043
http://mobile.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3040729&cid=40949719
http://tech.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3040697&cid=40949343
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http://science.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3041035&cid=40951899
http://developers.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3041081&cid=40952169
http://mobile.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3041091&cid=40952383
http://linux.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3041123&cid=40952991
http://yro.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3041313&cid=40954201
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http://yro.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3044971&cid=40972117
http://yro.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3044971&cid=40972271
http://politics.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3045075&cid=40972313
http://yro.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3045349&cid=40973979
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http://news.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3046211&cid=40979293
http://tech.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3050711&cid=41002319
http://mobile.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3118863&cid=41341925
http://science.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3131751&cid=41397971
http://yro.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3138079&cid=41429005
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http://yro.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3224905&cid=41846971
http://ask.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3227697&cid=41861263
http://science.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3228787&cid=41866351
http://linux.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3228683&cid=41866627
http://it.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3228991&cid=41866737
http://apple.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3229177&cid=41868513
http://apple.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3229177&cid=41868567
http://bsd.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=3229179&cid=41869275f
AND MANY MORE

Ac trolls' "BIG FAIL" (quoted): Eat your words!

That's the kind of martial arts I practice.

Around your ass... (4, Insightful)

DogDude (805747) | about a year and a half ago | (#41872935)

This is called "going around your ass to get to your elbow". Cash works fine.

Besides, what's with everybody wanting to continue to make payment processors of all kinds, obscenely wealthy? Doesn't anybody think, that every time they use their plastic, that you're giving Visa/MC 2-3% of your purchase? I feel like the massive expansion of cards and payment processors (paypal, amazon, google, etc.) is an Idiocracy type of thing. It's freaking me out that people are so fucking stupid.

Re:Around your ass... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41873045)

Some of us don't carry cash. Cash doesn't leave a record. Some of us like the record. More competition among payment methods can help bring fees down. If that doesn't then regulation can as well. Merchants need to start analyzing which service they use. Like some already default to debit versus credit because of the fees.

Re:Around your ass... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41873157)

More competition among payment methods can help bring fees down. If that doesn't then regulation can as well.

It should, but it doesn't. Banks have no real oversight, in fact, when bad things happen, the government just gives them more money. TAX money.

Oh, and if you like records, then ask for a receipt, then again, you're posting as AC?

Re:Around your ass... (3, Insightful)

TheGratefulNet (143330) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873217)

Cash doesn't leave a record. Some of us like the record.

you miss the point, I think. the point is that you get to CHOOSE, even on a per-trans basis, do you want a record or not?

I guarantee you that you don't want 100% of your transactions recorded. are you really that open with your life? really? and you don't ever see any misuse coming from this info farm you are providing?

Re:Around your ass... (3, Insightful)

foofish (10132) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873477)

I don't think that there is a clause with Google Wallets (or with any credit/debit/whatever card) that you have to use that form of payment for ALL of your purchases. If he has a transaction he doesn't want recorded, he is perfectly free and able to pay for that transaction with cash.

I like the record keeping functions of my debit card, but there are some things that I still pay for in cash. You don't have to make one or the other a way of life.

Re:Around your ass... (1)

rubycodez (864176) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873399)

and you like a company such a Google having the record. Google, where you are the *product*, the advertisers are the customers.....

Re:Around your ass... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41873113)

This is called "going around your ass to get to your elbow". Cash works fine.

Spring Texas UIL Spring state finals, Austin, many years ago,,,,gang of "hot" young scantily dressed pickpockets were working the Texas teens in town for the state tennis or track and field finals. They would approach the boys and wrap their arms around them often walking along with their hands on the guy's ass via his back pocket,,,to of course hide the fact they were emptying their wallets for them. The process repeated itself daily even with warnings to the competitors, their coaches and chaperones (yeah, various coaches and chaperones were also "victims"). "Strangely" the media didn't cover any of the stories.. CC aren't any different except maybe they take the money slower, follow you around like a PI and aren't near as cute..

Re:Around your ass... (3, Informative)

grumling (94709) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873135)

But that 2-3% is invisible to the customer. The only time I've seen any effort to point that out is with the few-and-far between gas stations that offer a cash discount. The only problem with them is that they tend to have a higher price to begin with.

Re:Around your ass... (1)

DogDude (805747) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873179)

That's my point. Out of sight, out of mind. 2-3% of every purchase goes to a handful of very, very, very, very large companies, and almost nobody seems to care.

Re:Around your ass... (1)

rtaylor (70602) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873285)

Pick up a little piece of these very large companies; use the 1% dividend they pay you to cover the 2-3% they charge you.

Re:Around your ass... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41873351)

Buy stock in the companies and share in the profits.

(If you have any kind of sound retirement plan, you probably already do.)

I realize this is a worthless post as almost all of the people who buy smartphones are economically ignorant, and if they live to retirement are probably going to end up down at the camp by the river, cooking snared pigeons and stolen dogs over refuse fires.

Re:Around your ass... (3, Funny)

foofish (10132) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873491)

Have you ever had refuse-smoked pigeon? Cook it low and slow, so the beer-soaked newspaper smoke can really get into the meat... nothing like it.

Re:Around your ass... (2)

SScorpio (595836) | about a year and a half ago | (#41874153)

They still make money even if you use cash. A business depositing cash pays around 1.5%-2% in fees due to handling. As a consumer the only logical thing is to only use a rewards cards where you draw some benefit from your purchases. The places you shop still take a hit for this, but that's the cost of doing business.

Re:Around your ass... (2)

PrimaryConsult (1546585) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873511)

You can also tell when stores have a minimum purchase requirement for credit.
In many states it is illegal to charge more for a credit transaction, however it is not illegal to offer a discount for using cash... it would be interesting to see stores offer a "2% discount on all cash purchases!" deal.

Generally I pay cash at independent stores and credit at chain stores... if the price is the same, paying cash is effectively subsidizing those who would pay by credit. The credit card charge is built into the price, so those extra cents are straight up profit for the store.

Re:Around your ass... (1)

Mr. Slippery (47854) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873547)

You can also tell when stores have a minimum purchase requirement for credit. In many states it is illegal to charge more for a credit transaction, however it is not illegal to offer a discount for using cash... it would be interesting to see stores offer a "2% discount on all cash purchases!" deal.

Minimums and extra charges for using a card are forbidden by the contract with the card companies, not by state laws. But it is, as you note, ok to offer a cash discount, which is a weird loophole.

Re:Around your ass... (5, Interesting)

CastrTroy (595695) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873709)

You forget that there's also a cost associated with using cash. You have to worry about employees and customers taking that money. You have to find a safe way of transporting the money to the bank. For businesses, banks will also charge you service fees for the privilege of depositing money into your account. You also have to go through the trouble of ensuring that you always have proper change for customers who use cash. Sure there are many expenses when dealing with credit cards and other non cash payment systems, but it's not as if dealing in cash is all fun and games.

Re:Around your ass... (2)

deltaromeo (821761) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873147)

I agree to some extent, however, in reality, with credit cards offering cashback and other rewards, it works out costing me less to use a credit card than it would to use cash. I hate that Visa and MC are getting rich from this but by protesting and stopping use of my card while everyone else carries on, I end up subsidising their discounts. The only way I can see to get around this would be for everyone to protest together or for all merchants to implement credit card surcharges.

Re:Around your ass... (1)

DogDude (805747) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873201)

The only way I can see to get around this would be for everyone to protest together or for all merchants to implement credit card surcharges.

Visa and Mastercard made sure that this was illegal in the US a long, long time ago. I wonder if Visa/MC buys their Congresspeople with cash, charge, or debit?

Re:Around your ass... (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41873363)

Huh? It's not illegal, it's just against the terms of the merchant contract. Not even remotely close to the same thing.

Re:Around your ass... (1)

Mitreya (579078) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873959)

The only way I can see to get around this would be for everyone to protest together or for all merchants to implement credit card surcharges.

I buy most of the things I own online. Protest/surcharge/etc only work for your local brick-and-mortar merchant where paying cash is an option.

Buying something by mailing a check is a terrible experience which is worth 2%-3% surcharge to avoid.

Re:Around your ass... (2)

andymadigan (792996) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873177)

Simple economics, using a card essentially gets the cardholder a discount. I get about 3.5% on purchases that aren't subject to any special deals or 'categories'. Using cash actually incurs fees, either find your particular bank's ATM, pay a fee, or switch to another bank. Besides that, after paying with cash you're left with heavy, noisy, coins. Sure, on the few occasions I'm forced to pay cash that change goes to the nearest tip jar, but that means I'm paying an even higher penalty for using cash. I'm not going to stand there at the counter counting out pennies to pay for my next purchase, when I could swipe a card and let the next person order.

That's not even including the other benefits, I can pull up my credit card statements and find out how much I paid for something last year, or total up how much I'm spending on food each month. Plus, if my wallet is stolen the cash is gone, but I'm not responsible for charges on my card.

Also, Visa/MC don't get 2-3%, their cut is much smaller than that. Most of the fees go to the issuing bank (i.e. for my Chase card, the money goes to Chase). For rewards cards, the issuing bank is returning almost all of that to me. Sure, earning a tiny amount (measured in hundredths of a percent) on each transaction does make Visa/MC very wealthy, but ATM networks make lots of money, too. So do armored car operators (for moving cash from businesses to banks, or from bigger banks to smaller banks).

Cash is expensive to handle (2)

sjbe (173966) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873215)

Doesn't anybody think, that every time they use their plastic, that you're giving Visa/MC 2-3% of your purchase?

You think there is no cost involved in handling cash? Cash is expensive to count, sort, deposit, track and prone to theft. Sure you are paying the credit card processors a few percent but merchants incur pretty much the same cost due to the overhead of handling cash. Seriously, cash is a major pain in the ass for merchants and that cost gets passed on to consumers. There's nothing wrong with paying cash but there is plenty of overhead involved with it.

Re:Cash is expensive to handle (3, Informative)

DogDude (805747) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873369)

Seriously, cash is a major pain in the ass for merchants and that cost gets passed on to consumers

You're completely wrong. As a merchant, cash is the cheapest way to get paid. Cash doesn't cost 2-3%. Nowhere close.

Re:Cash is expensive to handle (1)

osu-neko (2604) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873417)

You don't have employees? Or you just don't pay them for doing all the aforementioned tasks?

Re:Cash is expensive to handle (1)

swillden (191260) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873645)

You don't have employees? Or you just don't pay them for doing all the aforementioned tasks?

And don't forget the cost of "shrinkage".

Re:Cash is expensive to handle (3, Funny)

foofish (10132) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873519)

Cash takes extra record keeping. Cash takes somebody counting the drawer. Cash requires somebody to drive the deposit to the bank (or an armored car staff to pick it up). These may not be charges per transaction, but they're still things you'll have to pay someone to do when handling cash.

Re:Around your ass... (1)

godrik (1287354) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873435)

I do not pay these 3% myself, so I do not care too much about it. Also, all these transaction give me back 1% of the transaction. Finally, it allows me to have an automatic log of everything I buy which simplify my (rough) personal acconting.
Why should not I use a credit card? There is no downside for me.

If the shops cared about that fee, why do not they offer me a disconut for cash payment? (maybe that's illegal?)

Re:Around your ass... (1)

Mr. Slippery (47854) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873635)

Why should not I use a credit card? There is no downside for me.

No downside unless you find <insert your bank here> having a complete record of where you shopped disturbing. A record that can be hauled into court [think-creditcards.com] , or at the very least used to target you for mind-control, i.e., advertising.

Sure, knowing that you bought gas or coffee is probably not that interesting to anyone. But never buy anything interesting with a card if you can use cash.

Re:Around your ass... (1)

godrik (1287354) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873793)

"No downside unless you find having a complete record of where you shopped disturbing. A record that can be hauled into court, or at the very least used to target you for mind-control, i.e., advertising."

I must say I do find it somewhat disturbing. But what are the other options? Carrying two hundred dollars on me at any time. That's a call for being robbed. So I guess I could not pay expensive thing cash, but just small things. Then what is the point?

My record can be used in court. Please do, it is more likely to save me than to convict me.

Advertising? I'd be really interested in seeing how they can meaningfully advertise based on my name only. By mail? I throw spam away as soon as I identify it. By email with my statement? I read emails with no pictures. Google is certainly more efficient at targetting me in advertisement than banks will ever be (Despite I try to take all steps toward keeping a low internet footprint).

"Sure, knowing that you bought gas or coffee is probably not that interesting to anyone. But never buy anything interesting with a card if you can use cash."

But things that are "interesting" are likely to be expensive. And I'd rather not carry so much cash with me.

Re:Around your ass... (2)

tftp (111690) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873971)

Sure, knowing that you bought gas or coffee is probably not that interesting to anyone. But never buy anything interesting with a card if you can use cash.

There is another reply just above with words "this is more likely to save me than to convict me." The point is that this system can be gamed. Not only the prosecution can access your records, but the defense can do that as well. If someone wants to steal an item from a faraway location he can do at least two things. First, he will not buy fuel with the credit card on the way there and back. Second, he will have someone to use his credit card in his home town while he is doing the crime. Only about 2% of stores ask for ID when you pay with c/c - and there are plenty that never do (nor they could do that, given the lines and the small amounts of money being paid.) These records would serve as an alibi. Not only the prosecution requested this info and found nothing, they have to give this info to the defense - and the defense can use it to assist the client. Add to that the fact that the client's phone was registering in his home town all day, and the location was consistent with the c/c purchases. Now you have the prosecution team on defense.

Re:Around your ass... (2)

swillden (191260) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873607)

Cash works fine.

At least in the present world, cash is sub-optimal. Not only is it less convenient, but you miss out on a lot of potential kickbacks.

For example, I have an AMEX card that pays me 6% cash back on grocery store purchases. Given that I have four teenagers and an insane monthly grocery bill, that's real money, to the tune of about $800 per year I get back. I get 3% back on gas, which pays me another $150 annually. I get 3% back on Amazon.com purchases using my Amazon card. I get 1% back on everything else, and I route everything possible through cards... electric bill, car payment, travel expenses (that's especially nice for company travel), etc. My Discover card gives 5% back on a different category each quarter. It takes a little work to maximize the return on that one, but it's worth it (for me, anyway, my wife finds keeping track of which card to use to be too complicated).

Yeah, all of this money comes from the merchants (except I know the grocery stores aren't paying me all of that 6%, that's more than their profit margin), which means it all ultimately comes from me in the form of higher prices. But the fact is that the prices are the same whether I pay cash or use credit and get the kickbacks. Which means that you who pay cash and I who use credit foot the bill equally -- but I get the benefit and you don't.

I expect that this will all eventually collapse, because it clearly represents some unnecessary inefficiencies that will get squeezed out of the system. But in the meantime, I'm quite happy to take advantage of it.

In addition, I find that using credit makes it easier to track my expenses and manage my budget, and even provides some elasticity which can be very useful at times. For example, a while ago I had some big monthly medical expenses ($5K per month) which had to be paid out of pocket and were later reimbursed by my insurance company; I could have dipped into savings to cover them, but by using credit and taking advantage of flexibility offered by the hospital (a short grace period plus my choice of when the card would get billed), I was able to arrange things so I got the reimbursement a few weeks before I actually had to pay the bill -- oh, and I got 1% cash back on that bill, too.

Cash works. But credit works better (as long as you don't overspend and end up in debt).

Re:Around your ass... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41873943)

Smaller shops (where the person checking you out is the person who owns the store) will almost always give you a discount if you offer to pay in cash.

Re:Around your ass... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41873627)

Doesn't anybody think, that every time they use their plastic, that you're giving Visa/MC 2-3% of your purchase?

The last time I shopped at... -well almost everywhere- they didn't change the price because I chose to pay cash. The reality is I'm giving Visa/MC 2-3% of my purchase or I am giving it to the merchant. Why should I care which of them gets it? My goods aren't more expensive because *I* am using plastic. My goods are more expensive because *everyone* is using plastic. And I'm not convinced an all-cash world would be cheaper for merchants in general anyway: "Doesn't anyone realize they are giving 2-3% of their purchase to Dunbar?"

Now, the benefits of plastic:

I get 1-5% back on my purchases. Yes, overall this raises prices and is a losing proposition for consumers as a whole. But as an *individual* consumer, it saves me money at the expense of everyone who *doesn't* use that kind of card. Why, as an individual, should I give up that 1-5% cash back?

I can't be robbed. Oh, they can take the card, use it, but it has exactly zero effect on me.

Ordering online is ridiculously easy and I don't have to use paypal or anything linked to *my* money.

It's convenient.

I can still use cash when I want to make an anonymous purchase. For the most part, I really don't care that they know I have a habit of buying a lot of tea. There are things I don't want them to know, and for that I use cash.

Not in my back pocket! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41872949)

My personal policy regarding Google: give them only the minimum information I must to use what services of theirs I must... (I have accounts with schools, some of which have used Google instead of manning up and having their own e-Mail system, because apparently they don't mind handing Google their students' private, personal information, despite the potential for evil Google could do!) Including using erroneous/made up information (birth date, etc.) when signing up for an account, and using NoScript to block Google Analytics, etc. when surfing the web.

I even obfuscate when I "Google" myself, by not typing in my entire first or last name... since I know they store everything that they have access to, and they know people periodically "Google" themselves. Note, I categorically refuse to use the word "Google" to mean search, except if actually using Google. In conversation, I usually say "websearch" or "grep". Google loves their name being synonymous with searching the interwebs, just as Johnson and Johnson loves their BandAid being synonymous with small, self-adhesive bandages, or the application of the same to wounds, since it is essentially free advertising.

(On this day, a year after Dump Your Bank Day, I am reminded by Slashdot about the whole bank-fee mass rip-off of the American people by banks, and it occurred to me that Credit Unions should jump on this bandwagon, and come up with a simple, catchy alternative word for the word "banking" that doesn't include the word "bank", and insinuate it into our daily language usage!)

So although I have a Samsung Galaxy III-S, I keep NFC turned OFF, have no plans ever to use it, and will not put such a card in my wallet while alternatives, (cash, cards, checks) exist. Google has enough information, I'm not going to give them more, considering how they're crypto-evil, despite their bullshit motto.

This is what my banks card is for. (4, Insightful)

bjwest (14070) | about a year and a half ago | (#41872961)

Why would I need another card in my wallet to duplicate what my banks check card does?

Re:This is what my banks card is for. (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41873053)

So you can save 7 precious seconds pulling the card out of your wallet when you can just wave the wallet (containing the NFC-enabled card) in front of the reader to pay for something.

Honestly, do people actually READ TFA before posting? Or were you trying to be funny?

Re:This is what my banks card is for. (1)

schitso (2541028) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873069)

The idea is that instead of carrying several credit and debit card, you carry one card that charges whatever your currently active GWallet card is.

Re:This is what my banks card is for. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41873267)

Because carrying 2 cards is such a burden?
Because swiping a card is so hard compared to touching an NFC reader?
Banks are better equipped. They'll just start issuing NFC cards (linked to multiple accounts) and G Wallet wil be out of business.

Re:This is what my banks card is for. (5, Interesting)

swillden (191260) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873481)

Banks are better equipped. They'll just start issuing NFC cards (linked to multiple accounts) and G Wallet wil be out of business.

Heh. It's possible, I suppose, but about 10 years ago I spent a lot of time working with banks, trying to get them to agree to allow their credit apps to coexist on a single card. It was known in the industry as the "white card" concept. The card was intended to be a customer-owned smart card which could be loaded up with many credit cards as well as other apps (probably all ID and finance-related). I think it's a great idea, myself. I did 10 years ago when the idea was to reduce my whole wallet to a single card, and I think it's an even better idea now that we're talking about eliminating the wallet entirely and just using the phone -- which I always have with me anyway. I'm hoping my phone can also become my car and house keys, my driver's license, my loyalty cards, etc. Basically there's no reason the single device couldn't manage all of my personal and identity data, and do it very securely, thanks to the embedded secure element.

Think the banks were interested 10 years ago? No way! There was no way they were going to give up the opportunity to have a branded card in their customers' wallets. In fact, even for single-bank cards one of the advantages of smart cards that I touted to them -- the fact that smart cards are much more durable than magstripe cards -- was of negative value to them, because they like sending you a new card every two years. Why? Because their statistics show that sending you a new card gets you to use it more!

Banks have all kinds of incentives to oppose this sort of thing.

Of course, now that Google is making it impossible for the banks to successfully oppose card unification, on smartphones and -- if there's anything to this rumor -- on plastic cards, they might have to join it. That's what the ISIS consortium is about, but I notice that banks haven't been joining in droves. IMO, they fear the mobile network operators, who would like nothing better than to become the world's payment transaction engines, and the banks really don't want to lose that business. Worldwide credit/debit card transaction volume is measured in tens of trillions of dollars annually. Getting even a very small percentage of that sort of cash stream is worth a lot, which is why the MNOs are anxious to get in and banks are anxious to keep them out.

(Disclaimer: I work for Google, and much of my work is related to Wallet. I have carefully avoided saying anything based on inside information acquired while working for Google. I have a lot of knowledge about this space that was acquired during previous employment, though.)

Oh one note on terminology: It's only called "NFC" when it's embedded in a phone and combines contactless smart card technology with dumb RFID technology, and able to act as both card/RFID chip and reader. When it's in a reader-powered card it's just called "contactless smart card" technology.

Re:This is what my banks card is for. (1)

Truekaiser (724672) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873739)

You must enjoy making an id thief's job easier. All that data and keys in one place.

As for security, putting all that in one place makes the 'risk/reward' scale skewed to the point that short of some obtrusive id checks. Maybe as far as blood & dna samples to prove its 'you'. It will be hacked, Hacked within months of its release, and something the size of google will not be able to stop it. Because there is no way you can make it secure enough that such theft won't be rampant AND make the process fast, easy, convenient enough to get people to use it.

I will never get why people think it's a good idea to put all that 'valuable stuff' behind one single lock and key, each having their own gives you a good degree of damage control. Sure it's a bitch for some people to remember(my mother does the dumb thing and carries a paper book with all her passwords and user accounts on them). But if you're unwilling to put up with the effort, you shouldn't be doing it in the first place.

Re:This is what my banks card is for. (1)

tftp (111690) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873461)

The idea is that instead of carrying several credit and debit card, you carry one card

Channeling xkcd:

1. You have two cards in your wallet.
2. You get a Google card to combine the two cards into one.
3. Now you have three cards in your wallet.

Google is trying to solve a problem that does not exist.

Re:This is what my banks card is for. (1)

schitso (2541028) | about a year and a half ago | (#41874057)

No, it'd go more like this:

1. You have five debit/credit cards in your wallet.
2. You get a Google Wallet card to combine all the cards into one.
3. You now have one card in your wallet and five cards stored somewhere safe.

Re:This is what my banks card is for. (5, Insightful)

p0p0 (1841106) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873089)

I think the general plan is that you could unify different accounts onto this card and access them all just from the Google Wallet card. As well in the event of you losing the card, all it would take is the deactivation of this one card instead of multiple cancellations from multiple institutions.

Re:This is what my banks card is for. (1)

SeaFox (739806) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873969)

I think the general plan is that you could unify different accounts onto this card and access them all just from the Google Wallet card. As well in the event of you losing the card, all it would take is the deactivation of this one card instead of multiple cancellations from multiple institutions.

True story: Last night I lost my debit card. I left it in an ATM after the transaction. I realized this less than a half-hour later after a little grocery shopping and called the bank to cancel it. It will be annoying not having debit card access to my checking account for a week or so while a new one is sent to me, but I still have my credit card.

With Google's card if someone had my card they'd have gained access to all my accounts at once.

Re:This is what my banks card is for. (1)

schitso (2541028) | about a year and a half ago | (#41874071)

With Google's card if someone had my card they'd have gained access to all my accounts at once.

This is completely wrong, unless they also broke into your Wallet account at the same time.

Re:This is what my banks card is for. (1)

TheGratefulNet (143330) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873161)

you don't need this.

google *wants* this, though.

do we appease them and just roll over and feed them more info about ourselves?

cold day in hell! many of us already realize that companies like that have far too much info on us as it is. we already give too much info to visa/mc but we kind of have little choice since they practically own the card credit world. but there's zero reason to give google a new place in this market. more players is NOT going to make anything better for us serfs. no up side to this, none at all, really. just a privacy grab that keeps asking for more.

its very understandable google wants this.

but children also 'want things'. it does not mean that responsible adults give them everything they ask for.

we, consumers, have to start policing the controlling class. they don't do a good job policing themselves. we have to say 'no' to these privacy and control grabs.

"just say no". there is no upside for us in this.

Re:This is what my banks card is for. (1)

stephanruby (542433) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873193)

Why would I need another card in my wallet to duplicate what my banks check card does?

Isn't the point of Google Wallet to combine all your existing cards into one card? Thought, I doubt this will work for the ATM part of your card. According to the article I read at least, the card will have a magnetic stripe and will work on all existing credit card processing machines.

Security and abstraction (1)

sjbe (173966) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873247)

Why would I need another card in my wallet to duplicate what my banks check card does?

Because then you can leave your debit/credit card at home. If your wallet gets lost you log into your google account and detach the credit/debit card from your google card. While you still have to replace the google card it provides a potential layer of security. Also the google card provides the same effect as having a forwarding email address. You can change the bank card behind the google card without having to go to 50 different merchants to change the card they have on file. Actually pretty convenient.

Re:This is what my banks card is for. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41873641)

So google can take a cut (both $ and data) along with your bank / credit card company.

Re:This is what my banks card is for. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41873653)

Because Google can't track that.

Re:This is what my banks card is for. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41874029)

Why would I need another card in my wallet to duplicate what my banks check card does?

Because when your bank card is lost or stolen you cannot make any transactions for at least a week whilst they sort it out.

With this? Go online, disassociate your bank card from the Google Card and everything is peachy.

Here's a radical idea: (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41873003)

How about sticking to things that aren't one button-press away from being locked down by some power-mad business magnate or corrupt politician. Let's stick to cash money, paper books, CDs, et cetera. If you don't see that they are trying to compress every aspect of your life into a single, neat little package complete with a killswitch, you deserve your fate.

Re:Here's a radical idea: (3, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41873081)

I agree - I pay for everything with gold!

Re:Here's a radical idea: (2)

foofish (10132) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873529)

Gold? Enjoy your totalitarian future! Real Luddites barter.

like google voice for cc #s! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41873015)

seems to me that the big advantage is i can hide all my cc info behind a single account w a throwaway # as welll as 2-step authentication. if I normally lose my wallet, ive revealed every single card and its number and someone can start using it right away. but if I lose my Google Wallet card all I've lost is at most access to 1 of my credit cards and even then I can shut it off immediately.

Not only that but even when I use my card nobody gets access to the underline credit card numbers behind it. the only downside I can see is the danger that someone uses your card and you can't tell that fraud happened because it could be on any 1 of the numbers that you have given google. so you do have topay attention if you hsve a lot of cards. ...unless you have to confirm every transaction from your app with a pin..

It is more secure (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41873039)

With the Android phone, you have to worry about a very large attack surface area. With a Google wallet device, you do not have to worry about your latest download of Angry Birds keylogging your PIN entry field and performing a man-in-the-middle to steal all of your money.

You only have to worry about .. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41873973)

... the guy with the NFC scanner just walking close to you.

Let Google have access to my bank account? (5, Insightful)

OldKingCole (2672649) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873043)

No thanks. I'm fine with my credit card company, who haven't, on even a single occasion sent an EULA update allowing them to harvest my information for whoever knows what reason, and do not try to harvest my phone number sugar coating with "security concerns in case I lose my password".

This company has grown too large and is WAY too much intrusive in its current form.

For those of you with nothing to hide, please try to picture the following scenario: Google opens an HR company, specializing in delivering EXACTLY the person you like for the job. By which criteria? ENDLESS! They can practically deliver a person who has no interest in porn, spends 30% of his online time reading /. and likes the color Blue! They have all this information owing to their damned tracking cookies and gmail reading.

Call me paranoid, but I'd like to fall into the category of "No known bank account" at Google inc. Do no evil my ass

Re:Let Google have access to my bank account? (1)

TheGratefulNet (143330) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873187)

and do not try to harvest my phone number sugar coating with "security concerns in case I lose my password".

heh - you noticed that, too, huh?

"but puh-LEEZE, we NEED your phone number!"
"no"
"ok. here's your login screen. sorry we bothered you. (but not really)"

Re:Let Google have access to my bank account? (2)

Mitreya (579078) | about a year and a half ago | (#41874007)

I'm fine with my credit card company, who haven't, on even a single occasion sent an EULA update allowing them to harvest my information for whoever knows what reason,

I occasionally receive very thick updated "user and privacy agreement" from my credit card. It's in very small font and I usually get bogged down half way through reading it. But I am pretty sure they are talking about "occasionally" sharing info with affiliates and their affiliates' affiliates.

do not try to harvest my phone number sugar coating with "security concerns in case I lose my password".

My credit cards harvest my cell phone number by sugar coating it with "a way to contact you in case of suspicious activity on your account". Not to mention that they already have my home number from the application

This company has grown too large and is WAY too much intrusive in its current form.

True, but I think the issue is simply in aggregating all of the info. I hate the fact that google group searches now require you to login with google account to read the posts. I used to just read them for many years
I think Google is doing the same thing as everyone else, but they simply have more clout and cover/aggregate a wider range of services.

XKCD (2)

Liquid Len (739188) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873075)

Obligatory xkcd link [xkcd.com]
I for one find this cartoon incredibly insightful and disturbing (and I do use google services, although I wish I wasn't).

Re:XKCD (1)

Nemyst (1383049) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873439)

The only good thing about Google versus, say, Facebook, is that there's always a way of taking your data out of Google's platform. I know I backed up my Gmail account a while ago, just as a test, and it worked fine. Likewise for Drive and all that. The worst bit would be working with an Android phone that doesn't have a Market link, but even that's possible, if inconvenient, by using sideloading.

Good luck getting your stuff out of Facebook, however!

The last sentence makes no sense (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41873083)

What was this supposed to be: "A there's on reason a card-shaped token could use mag-stripes and NFC, too."?

It can't. (1)

roc97007 (608802) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873097)

With all those stupid discount cards, there's no room anymore.

That is why Apple's passport idea ... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41874015)

... sounds great. Have all your discount cards on your smartphone is a great idea.

Problems:
- it needs to be supported by the "discount cards" you use for it to work.
- It needs to be more universal ... not just iOS or even smartphone only (ie: should also be available via "dumb" phones).
- You are screwed if you don't own a mobile device.

BTW, I find it hilarious that people think that NFC is something Google created. I had an NFC chip on my American Express card since I got it over 10 years ago. And in all the years, I have probably used the feature maybe 3 times.

Sure as hell not gonna end up in MY wallet... (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41873123)

WTF does this even mean? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41873125)

"A there's on reason a card-shaped token could use mag-stripes and NFC, too."

I feel like I'm taking crazy pills.

Re:WTF does this even mean? (1)

jsh1972 (1095519) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873865)

My guess is : there's NO reason a card shaped token COULDN'T use magstripes and NFC too.

Next step - this implanted and mandatory (1)

hlavac (914630) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873143)

It's obvious where this is heading... mandatory implants and constant surveillance for everyone

Re:Next step - this implanted and mandatory (1)

rubycodez (864176) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873425)

no, the next step is all-electronic money so the money cartels can take a little piece of each and every transaction, and the governmetn can shut off your ability to buy or sell or get paid on a whim, and can track your movements and habits for anything they deem "suspicious"

Google is far from the only one (1)

Let's All Be Chinese (2654985) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873243)

I'd prefer cash. Around here, though, it's actively being marginalised, in the name of "security", but it's actually shifting risks to me and costing me privacy and flexibility to boot.

It really doesn't matter who owns your wallet, as long as it's not you it means you're being shafted. And this is why we need truly electronic payment mechanisms, not just online, but in our wallets too.

The problem is that the people who can give you such a thing have a perverse incentive not to. This includes, but is not limited to, google.

Re:Google is far from the only one (1)

Let's All Be Chinese (2654985) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873253)

Agh. s/truly/& anonymous/. Thanks for forgetting the important point, self.

Watched the video (1)

fleebait (1432569) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873303)

Ok, I watched the Google video.

Where do I get the wallet, with the nixie tubes, gummi bears, and manual combo lock on the outside??

There's "on reason" (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41873323)

If we wanted to read unedited crap, we'd go to Digg.

It sounds like we're winning (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41873407)

It sounds like those of us who didn't want to stop using cash and regular credit/debit cards won. We just said no to "pay for an expensive data plan to let Google play with us in the payment space". So now Google is fighting a rear-guard action by issuing something that sounds a lot like a credit card, but with Google Beta Sauce (TM) on it. No thanks. Google, if you want into the credit card space, that's a fine way to take your cash pile, diversify, and make the transition from start-up to "widow and orphan" stock. Just play by the rules everybody else does, and it'll be fine. You'll make plenty of money the good old fashioned way--by charging high interest rates and minimizing charge-offs, just like everybody else does in the space.

stanleygentlemen (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41873587)

http://www.stanleygentlemen.com/

What problem does this solve? (4, Informative)

mbkennel (97636) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873705)

What problem does this technology and initiative solve? Whose problem does it solve?

As far as I can tell the only problem these things "solve" is that some intermediary wants to take some of some other intermediary's free money.

There seems to be no benefit to the person they are trying to convince to use it, unless the competition lowers interchange fees to merchants and merchants pass some of it back. And that is about as likely as new developments in simian rectal aviation.

Re:What problem does this solve? (1)

Animats (122034) | about a year and a half ago | (#41874077)

Whose problem does it solve?

Google's. Their "anal probe" approach to acquiring customer information doesn't work for in-person purchases. They're trying to roll up the "affinity card" business. Payment is just something they handle to get their hooks into your transaction data.

Unless you have really crappy credit, why would you need more than one credit card? I have one personal credit card, one business credit card, and an ATM card. If you want to borrow money, credit cards are a terrible loan deal.

the cellphone is replacing the wallet (1)

circletimessquare (444983) | about a year and a half ago | (#41873859)

it's pretty absurd a company that understands this future feels a need to move backwards

it's like early car companies building rocket skates for horses

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