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Google Doubts Apple Will Approve Its New Maps Application

Unknown Lamer posted about a year and a half ago | from the anti-trust-suit-anyone? dept.

IOS 347

redletterdave writes "Even though Apple's App Store has also been friendly enough to offer alternative mapping applications to ameliorate customers upset with Apple's new default Maps app, the Cupertino, Calif.-based company may not be so friendly as to approve a Maps app submission from Google, which used to be responsible for the Maps experience in iOS until the iPhone 5. On Monday, sources at Google familiar with its mapping plans said the chances of Apple approving a dedicated Google Maps app on iOS 6 are 'not optimistic.' Specifically, they pointed to the lack of any mapping app in the 'Find maps for your iPhone' section of the App Store — accessible only via iPhones or iPads — that use the Google Maps APIs to call wirelessly for location, routing or point-of-interest (POI) data."

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complain (5, Insightful)

irving47 (73147) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890459)

loudly and often.

Re:complain (-1, Flamebait)

Moblaster (521614) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890501)

Save your breath. Why would Apple give Google any face on this? The #1 reason they dumped Google Maps was Google's withholding turn-by-turn voice navigation from the iOS version in order to give their Android platform a competitive advantage. Google wanted to play hardball, and they got it. No TBT, no dice. Plain and simple.

Re:complain (5, Informative)

cheater512 (783349) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890521)

Err wrong. Google was more than happy to provide navigation. All they wanted was a little more credit for it and Apple wasn't going to have any of that.

Re:complain (1, Interesting)

Paradise Pete (33184) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890587)

Really? I have seen any evidence of that. Do you have a link? (I'm not doubting you, just genuinely surprised.)

Re:complain (5, Informative)

mjwx (966435) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890663)

Really? I have seen any evidence of that. Do you have a link? (I'm not doubting you, just genuinely surprised.)

So you've been ignoring this: www.businessinsider.com/why-apple-no-longer-has-google-based-maps-on-the-iphone-2012-9 [businessinsider.com]

Apple tried to negotiate with Google to get turn-by-turn navigation, but Google wouldn't give up that data without some concessions from Apple. Google wanted more Google branding in the maps as well as the inclusion of Lattitude, Google's Foursquare-esque social network that tracks people if they opt-in. Apple didn't want to include either of those things in its maps.

In the end, Apple walked away from the table, the Google offer remained but Apple didn't want to agree to it.

As much as Apple fan sites tried to spin it, Apple chose not to have Google's turn by turn navigation.

Re:complain (0)

kthreadd (1558445) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890963)

So basically Google wanted to have tight control over the branding (look and feel?) and add a feature which let Google keep track of where every iOS user is. I can understand why Apple wants to make their own maps in the long run.

Re:complain (5, Insightful)

mjwx (966435) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890993)

So basically Google wanted to have tight control over the branding (look and feel?) and add a feature which let Google keep track of where every iOS user is. I can understand why Apple wants to make their own maps in the long run.

As I said, as much as Apple fans try to spin it, Apple still walked away.

Apple wont get the chance to make it work in the long term, they ruined it in the short term. For Apple to get a similar dataset to Google would take the better part of a decade.

First off, Latitude would be opt-in the same as it is on Android, but it gives users the option to use the service if they want.
Secondly, I'd sooner trust Google who are open about what is being collected and who gets it than Apple, who allow thrid party developers to collect information on you without even notifiying you (also it's automatically enabled and there's no opt out). Seeing as I never opted in to Latitude on Android, I don't have to worry.

But nice try to spin it. In the end, Apple shot themselves in the foot.

Re:complain (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41891053)

So basically Google wanted to have tight control over the branding (look and feel?)

They wanted to have branding so people would see that app X was pulling google data. Doesn't seem to be all that unreasonable of a request.

and add a feature which let Google keep track of where every iOS user is

Uh, no that's fanboy spin. Lattitude, IF you chose to use it, and IF you chose to opt IN (not opt-out), would track you. There are plenty of apps which track "every user's location", for example a weather application, but since that's not Google I guess tracking is OK.

I can understand why Apple wants to make their own maps in the long run.

Well, me too. They don't want people to use a product put out by one of their main competitors, but frankly this is starting to get into the "unfair business practices" area (at least in my opinion). But Apple isn't concerned about users being tracked- far from it; they just want to be the ones with the tracking data.

Re:complain (1)

Cinder6 (894572) | about a year and a half ago | (#41891069)

Yes, Apple chose to reject Google's terms for using their turn-by-turn. Is that really surprising? Why should they be expected to help their biggest competitor? It's not just the Apple fans that like to spin this story.

Re:complain (1)

Paradise Pete (33184) | about a year and a half ago | (#41891091)

Ignoring? I asked a reasonable question. Why would you imply I read that but somehow chose to ignore it?

However, I can see why Apple would not accept those terms. I think long term it was the right decision, and maps have been quietly getting better.
Turn by turn was not even available in Thailand, where I live. Last week I had to drive to some place I'd never been. For several years (long before I ever had a smart phone) I've used a dedicated Garmin box for that. I wasn't able to find the location in it, so I decided to settle for getting driving directions ahead of time using the iPhone. I found the place, got a choice of reasonable routes, selected one and jumped in my car. To my surprise the phone started giving me spoken directions, and the display tracked my driving.

I later learned that Apple had quietly added turn by turn for many countries that were not initially supported. They've got a long way to go, of course, but they're getting it done.

As a bonus, the entire trip consumed no cellular data. Because the maps are vector-based the mapping for the entire trip was loaded before I left.

Re:complain (1)

irving47 (73147) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890599)

I'll trade the turn-by-turn for an app that can find a restaurant I'm 100 yards from. I didn't capitalize Ruby or Tuesday, so only the other ones in town showed up... Nice job, Team Map.

While I'm at it, I still want an app that will display the other networks and the signal strength in db... Like Mac OS X can do.. built-in if you know where to look. NO, it's a HACKING TOOL. Thanks, Steve. (and Tim)

Re:complain (1)

Balthisar (649688) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890617)

I'd settle for something that shows maps outside of China. I hate having to go into airplane mode, turning wifi back on, turning off location services, and connecting to a VPN just so I can see maps in English (on my US localized phone) and shows sat imagery outside of China.

Re:complain (4, Interesting)

shentino (1139071) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890687)

This is a case of apple exercising their reserved right to be an asshole.

Part of owning a walled garden is that you get to decide what is a weed and what is not.

Re:complain (5, Insightful)

Vintermann (400722) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890919)

One of the things you're not allowed to do with a monopoly, is using the power of it to gain a monopoly in a different market. Apple is stepping dangerously close to this any time they disallow an app for competing with iOS built in services/Apple apps. Especially if they didn't offer that app/service before. It's just like Microsoft's Internet Explorer bundling, except MS at least allowed you to install competing products (if not removing their own).

(And yes, I know the standard argument, that Apple doesn't have a monopoly because other touchscreen phones sell better in aggregate. But this doesn't hold because it's not clear that the touchscreen phone should be the relevant unit for monopoly. If I control the world's fish supply, I can't just claim it's not a monopoly because people eat things other than fish. A monopoly in a limited sphere is still a monopoly.)

Re:complain (1)

shentino (1139071) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890955)

What you are legally allowed to do, and what you can actually get away with, are often not the same thing, especially if you have a beefy legal department.

Re:complain (5, Informative)

rtfa-troll (1340807) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890645)

Google's withholding turn-by-turn voice navigation from the iOS version in order to give their Android platform a competitive advantage.

Since you are obviously intimately familiar with the negotiations, perhaps you could correct my misapprehension. I had heard that Apple didn't want iOS users to have Latitude access or Google branding [businessinsider.com] . Sort of like they do on all other versions of Google map I have ever seen. That would kind of suggest it was more about locking in Apple customers to Apple's own map app and friend finder service than about Google refusing to provide features.

Is protecting your privacy a reason to hate Apple? (-1, Troll)

SuperKendall (25149) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890717)

I had heard that Apple didn't want iOS users to have Latitude access or Google branding

Are Apple users really worse off not having Lattitude track them as they use the map app? I don't think so. Apple having to make concessions so Google could continue to expand on the location of personalized geo-based data does not seem like a good idea to me.

As for the branding thing, Google Maps on iOS *already* had Google branding, a logo in the corner that an application was forbidden to cover (or it would get rejected). Google wanted to make that even more prominent - how is losing even more map display area to a logo any kind of benefit to the user?

Between all that and the hard time Google was giving Apple about getting map vector data, users of iOS products were better off with Apple saying no. In around a year the two maps will be equivalent for searches and iOS users will have a more readable map with less user tracking that Apple abandoning Google brought them. Already in a number of cities (especially the U.S.) the searches are on par with Google's searches. I have used the navigation feature quite often and never had an issue, in fact when going to my house it chooses a route that is one I have been using for years, instead of a somewhat more roundabout path Google Maps always chose.

Re:Is protecting your privacy a reason to hate App (1)

rtfa-troll (1340807) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890889)

Are Apple users really worse off not having Lattitude track them as they use the map app?

I'd imagine that the ones that choose to use Latitude are worse off since the features of Latitude they use won't work. I've seen Latitude used for finding when friends are nearby; it looks like a useful feature that I miss because I want to reduce the amount I'm tracked. The other users could choose to have it switched off as I do on my Android phone. What's the problem with extra choice? Overall, Google's tracking is the reason their map app gives the best times for routing. I guess that overall the users are better off.

What you are hinting at is a real privacy problem. Apple, Microsoft, Nokia, Verizon, AT&T and Google all get user's location data and then use that for commercial reasons other than the user's direct benefit. With Google, at least we can have the belief that they know how to do data filtering and anonymization. That's not enough though; there should definitely be laws, as there are in Europe for mobile operators, which protect the subscriber's privacy. That's an independent issue however.

Re:Is protecting your privacy a reason to hate App (2, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41891121)

Are Apple users really worse off not having Lattitude track them as they use the map app? I don't think so

You don't have to use Lattitude at all to use the maps, and even if you do the tracking is opt-IN so it's only gathering data if you tell it to. While I object to having Lattitude force-bundled, frankly speaking the only concern is that it's bloatware.

In around a year the two maps will be equivalent for searches and iOS users will have a more readable map

That remains to be seen, Nostradamus. So far they don't seem to be doing a very good job fulfilling your prophecy.

with less user tracking

Uh, what? You mean less user tracking by Google, there's absolutely NO reason to assume that Apple won't track you.

I have used the navigation feature quite often and never had an issue, in fact when going to my house it chooses a route that is one I have been using for years, instead of a somewhat more roundabout path Google Maps always chose.

That's because the Google app is basing it's recommendation from data for the roads, traffic conditions, and travel times. The Apple app is using your own phone's location history in addition to road statistics and info. So it's not showing you the "best" route, it's showing you the route you've already told them you prefer to take. Do that same route lookup from a different iPhone which has never traveled that area, and you'll find the route it gives you is closer to the one Google and other navigation software provides.

Re:complain (4, Informative)

mjwx (966435) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890647)

Save your breath. Why would Apple give Google any face on this? The #1 reason they dumped Google Maps was because Apple didn't want to pay Google's for turn-by-turn voice navigation from the iOS version.

Fixed that for you.

Apple wanted access to Google's data for free. Google didn't want that, so Google asked for money and barring that asked wanted other concessions such as branding or the inclusion of more google services (such as Latitude) but Apple steadfastly refused.

As much as they tried to paint Google as the bad guy, it was Apple who refused to negotiate.

http://www.businessinsider.com/why-apple-no-longer-has-google-based-maps-on-the-iphone-2012-9 [businessinsider.com]

Apple tried to negotiate with Google to get turn-by-turn navigation, but Google wouldn't give up that data without some concessions from Apple. Google wanted more Google branding in the maps as well as the inclusion of Lattitude, Google's Foursquare-esque social network that tracks people if they opt-in.

Apple didn't want to include either of those things in its maps.

As much as All Things D tried to spin it, they couldn't get around the fact that Apple refused to give the concessions Google wanted and Google had every right to ask for those concessions as they spent the money developing the service.

Re:complain (1)

mark-t (151149) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890681)

That so-called "number 1 reason" they dumped google maps in favor of their own application is a feature that isn't even available on the iPhone 4. Their 3-d flyover view isn't available on it either.

It seems strange that they would have bothered to even make iOS6 compatible with older phones at all when what was evidently a key factor in their decision to change the OS mapping application will not work on such devices.

Re:complain (4, Insightful)

ozmanjusri (601766) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890691)

Why would Apple give Google any face on this?

Because they care about their customers and want them to be able to choose the best map application for their own use?

Nah, just kidding.

Fanboism can only go so far ... (2)

Taco Cowboy (5327) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890699)

... before the truth hits, that is.

You've done a very good job as the self-appointed Apple fanboy, so much so that you are telling a flat out lie.

Google never withhold its turn-by-turn voice navigation.

It was Apple which walked away from the discussion - Google's offer still on the table.

I believe another poster has provided the link - please do us all a favor, read TFA and stop lying !

Re:Fanboism can only go so far ... (1)

BitZtream (692029) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890775)

Exposing uses to Latitude is pretty much a 'go fuck yourself' response from Apple any anyone else with half a brain. Its not exactly considered a 'fair' offer, so its as good as saying no.

Re:Fanboism can only go so far ... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41891141)

Exposing uses to Latitude is pretty much a 'go fuck yourself' response from Apple any anyone else with half a brain. Its not exactly considered a 'fair' offer, so its as good as saying no.

Take the parent's advice and try reading before spouting off your bullshit. That was only one part of one of several offers Google tried to make. Apple did not actually try to negotiate at all- they told Google to either deliver the app exactly as Apple wanted it or they'd take their ball and go home. Which is what they ended up doing.

Re:complain (5, Insightful)

dracocat (554744) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890583)

Yes. Complain once the app is rejected.

Then we can have a good dialog about how Apple did not do the right thing. About how it is unfair, and anti-competetive. I can't wait to have that discussion after it gets rejected.

Only problem is, it hasn't been rejected. How can we have this discussion when so far the only story is that someone at Google doesn't THINK it will be accepted?

Re:complain (3, Interesting)

irving47 (73147) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890809)

I honestly don't know HOW to complain to these companies. Their surveys and scripted responses make it impossible to talk to someone that can answer a question or respond intelligently. Exactly how they want it, I'm sure.
I tried to get people up in arms about the Lightning connectors for the new iphones and the authentication needed merely to charge... Several months ago. But slashdot, nor reddit would bother to help get the word out.

Re:complain (4, Insightful)

Serious Callers Only (1022605) | about a year and a half ago | (#41891131)

This is Google doing a few things at once:

Leaking this story makes sure the press will notice if Apple does delay or reject the app
Leaking this story helps to explain to users that Google is not the only one deciding to keep Google Maps off iOS.
Leaking this story helps users pressure Apple to provide the Google Maps app
Leaking this story puts pressure on Apple and encourages customers to look at Android

It's perfectly reasonable for them to talk up in advance the fact they are developing this app and will submit soon, given the opaque review process, and Apple's blatant abuse of their control over the ecosystem in the past (banning previous google apps like latitude and google voice for example), which has led to other apps from their competitors languishing in 'review' limbo for months, or having important features yanked (like buying books in the kindle app) because Apple wants a cut of every transaction.

Re:complain (1)

ohnocitizen (1951674) | about a year and a half ago | (#41891145)

Perhaps in complaining Google hopes to swing enough public opinion their way to alter the expected decision?

Either way, if there is a perception of unfairness, or a delay in the process, either could be worth discussing. Its like talking about an election before the election takes place - there are insights to be found for those who care to look.

Re:complain (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41890643)

Google is almost done and over with. Notice how many more are using Bing search, Bing maps, Microsoft Windows? That is why Google has to promote their own products. Except for Google search and Android, they are nothing, they are irrelevant.

IT IS LIKE SAYING GOD HATES YOU !! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41890461)

And if it is true, God !! look out !!

Company doesn't approve of competitor's product (0)

MrEricSir (398214) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890471)

Two companies competing with another don't see eye to eye on one another's products? What a surprise!

Re:Company doesn't approve of competitor's product (5, Insightful)

siddesu (698447) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890493)

well, it is an app market. if you cut off competition just because your product isn't good enough, it smacks of childish spite, mostly. although most of what transpires between apple and the rest of the world recently has been more than a little stupid.

Re:Company doesn't approve of competitor's product (1)

thesupraman (179040) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890543)

I would suggest it risks more than that.
It risks being labeled anti-competitive...

I suspect there will be quite some discussion about that at Apple,
They dont want another bit PR hit right now, as they are somewhat low
in the good news stakes anyway.

Then again, if they think they can get away with it..

Re:Company doesn't approve of competitor's product (1)

Nerdfest (867930) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890613)

Isn't their whole "can't replicate existing functionality" think anti-competitive, especially when retroactively applied to apps that they added built-in apps for later?

Re:Company doesn't approve of competitor's product (1)

siddesu (698447) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890727)

It is anti-customer. Since most of us have diverging usage patterns, it is very hard to argue that there is one app that fits all bills, especially on a piece of hardware that goes around with you, as you can potentially find new usage patterns every hour. Usually a set of two or three apps is a better match, and sometimes even that isn't enough.

Putting brakes on the choice of apps, and the ability of user to mix and match for best results just because you can't check up if all of the apps fit your business model strikes me as pretty condescending.

Re:Company doesn't approve of competitor's product (1)

Cinder6 (894572) | about a year and a half ago | (#41891037)

Is that even a thing, really? I know it was the stated reason behind the whole Google Voice debacle--but look: Google Voice is there. I have it, Sparrow (email) Chrome, Evernote, etc. on my iPhone.

You don't need Google Maps... (3, Insightful)

ZipK (1051658) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890477)

... to find your way from iOS to Android. Goodbye Apple.

Re:You don't need Google Maps... (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41890491)

Yep, you just need to ask where cheap plastic junk is sold. Then you know it's an Android device.

Re:You don't need Google Maps... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41890619)

made in the same factory as the cheap "metal" junk

Re:You don't need Google Maps... (4, Interesting)

ozmanjusri (601766) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890773)

Good point, though I've just picked up one of the early Yuando N90FHD tablets, and it has an aluminium frame and back, not plastic.

It also has a 9.7" 2048x1152 screen, 1GB DDR3 RAM, 32GB Nand Flash, 10000mAh battery, runs Android 4.1, weighs just 674g and costs just over $220.

So yeah, you're partly right. It's not plastic, and it's not junk, but compared to Apple, it IS cheap.

Re:You don't need Google Maps... (3, Insightful)

psiclops (1011105) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890879)

just because metal is more expensive than plastic, doesn't mean it is better for all purposes.
what advantage does a metal housing for a phone have over a plastic one?

in my opinion, plastic is a superior material for the job due to being lighter, non-conductive(not interfering with NFC or other antennas inside the device) and not requiring an outer layer of paint - which is more susceptible to scratches, which are more obvious.

Re:You don't need Google Maps... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41891107)

You have never used a Nexus.

Re:You don't need Google Maps... (1)

hendridm (302246) | about a year and a half ago | (#41891143)

Yep, you just need to ask where cheap plastic junk is sold. Then you know it's an Android device.

Look, I'm a huge Apple fanboy on the desk/laptop. I love my MBP. I love my Air. I love my 27" Thunderbolt monitor. You can pry them from my cold, dead hands.

For my portable devices, however, I am not a fan of iOS. Android on the phone and the Nexus 7. IMO, OS X is king of desktop productivity, Android is king of mobile productivity. Android is available on some excellent devices.

(Admittedly, though, if I could only choose one ecosystem, it would be Apple. It would be very difficult to give up my Nexus 7, but I just couldn't like without my Air + Thunderbolt display.)

Why can't Apple... (1)

unixisc (2429386) | about a year and a half ago | (#41891057)

...just team up w/ AAA and use their maps? And make similar deals w/ auto associations in other countries that they care about? Rest they can try and fill up w/ OpenStreetMaps, and hope that it fills in the difference.

Buh bye! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41890479)

Good riddance. Haven't missed Google Maps even once.

Buh bye!

Re:Buh bye! (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41890903)

Yes, I'm sure someone who doesn't use the mapping features in the first place wouldn't mind losing them.

welcome to Nazi computing (1, Flamebait)

Joe_Dragon (2206452) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890487)

welcome to Nazi computing where we control your software and can lock out any one we don't like.

Re:welcome to Nazi computing (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41890657)

Bingo!!!

BURRREEEE BURRREEEEE BURRREEEEE

You win the Godwin's Law of the Day award!

This seems to be the only comment worth viewing (1)

Burz (138833) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890821)

so far.

'Nuff said...

Re:welcome to Nazi computing (0)

Vitriol+Angst (458300) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890835)

A lot of slashdot people seem to leave their brains at the door when it comes to Apple. Just really irrational hatred going on.

Google was already dumbing down their Map app on the iPhone before Apple got into the mapping business. They wanted to charge for "turn by turn" -- which makes business sense for Google. However -- it's a big feature for people with smart phones, so Apple had to do something.

Just from a business standpoint, why would Apple let someone do the "Microsoft thing" to them again? MS had a sub-par Office app experience on the Mac and Apple had to beg for that.

Apple probably will approve the Google App -- but only after they've established their own a bit more. Having users become dependent on an app that is a strategic trojan horse for the competitor is never a smart move. They've spent billions acquiring and developing their own mapping solution and it's REALLY UNLIKELY they'll even break even on that investment.

If any competitor makes the major app and features on your platform -- you become vulnerable.

I think a lot of these comments about Apple -- on so many topics, ignore normal business practices. It's as if they invented Lawsuits, using Chinese manufacturing plants, and defensive policies towards major competitors. Grow up Slashdot, and stop talking like the ignoramuses you like to make fun of.

Re:welcome to Nazi computing (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41890941)

Google was already dumbing down their Map app on the iPhone before Apple got into the mapping business. They wanted to charge for "turn by turn" -- which makes business sense for Google. However -- it's a big feature for people with smart phones, so Apple had to do something.

Dumbing down? The iOS version never had turn-by-turn. Apple wanted the feature and Google was willing to sell it to them but Apple didn't like the terms. If Apple "had to do something" they could have accepted Google's offer which was hardly world shattering in the first place. Instead they come out wish a rushed, sub par mapping application that is still many versions off before it's ready for prime time.

Equating Google Maps to a subpar solution ala Office on Mac, considering what Apple themselves put out is a complete joke.

Re:welcome to Nazi computing (3, Informative)

ThatsMyNick (2004126) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890987)

A lot of slashdot people seem to leave their brains at the door when it comes to Apple. Just really irrational hatred going on.

Touche. s/hated/fanboism/

Google was already dumbing down their Map app on the iPhone before Apple got into the mapping business. They wanted to charge for "turn by turn" -- which makes business sense for Google. However -- it's a big feature for people with smart phones, so Apple had to do something.

Google was dumbing down? Just be happy that Google even allowed Apple to use any of their Maps data, let alone Navigation data. Google got nothing in return for the data. No ads, no ad revenue, no fresh data, nothing, zilch. And then Apple wanted turn-by-turn navigation. Google wanted more prominent display of their name, and inclusion of Google Latitude. Apple refused. Google then offered it for a fee. Apple refused and went crying to their fanbois.

Just from a business standpoint, why would Apple let someone do the "Microsoft thing" to them again? MS had a sub-par Office app experience on the Mac and Apple had to beg for that.

Apple probably will approve the Google App -- but only after they've established their own a bit more. Having users become dependent on an app that is a strategic trojan horse for the competitor is never a smart move. They've spent billions acquiring and developing their own mapping solution and it's REALLY UNLIKELY they'll even break even on that investment.

It is not good business to degrade your main cash cow by showing down an inferior experience on your users, either. But what do I know, I am just an irrational slashdotter.

If any competitor makes the major app and features on your platform -- you become vulnerable.

I think a lot of these comments about Apple -- on so many topics, ignore normal business practices. It's as if they invented Lawsuits, using Chinese manufacturing plants, and defensive policies towards major competitors. Grow up Slashdot, and stop talking like the ignoramuses you like to make fun of.

Actually, they pretty much did invent it. Grow up fanbois.

Re:welcome to Nazi computing (1)

AlphaWolf_HK (692722) | about a year and a half ago | (#41891001)

You know what I think is funny, is that before Apple was as big as it is now (pre-2004'ish?) slashdot had a mostly pro-Apple slant, especially given the *nix at the heart of OS X. I always maintained my position that if Apple had the same leverage that Microsoft has, they would be much worse.

so sue them with guerrilla lawyers (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41890489)

Remember United States v. Microsoft? Google has billions of dollars. Why not use a microscopic part of that money to donate to certain political causes that might possibly lead to the DOJ suing Microsoft on your behalf?

You know what's weird about that case in hindsight is that everyone would think an OS without a bundled browser is archaic today.

Re:so sue them with guerrilla lawyers (2)

infernalC (51228) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890505)

I can't believe there isn't a cesspool of litigation between these companies yet.

Re:so sue them with guerrilla lawyers (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41890655)

I can't believe there isn't a cesspool of litigation between these companies yet.

You know that they're already suing the fuck out of each other around the world and have been for some time now, right?

Re:so sue them with guerrilla lawyers (1)

Majkow (604785) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890629)

there is enough shit being thrown about with the human lawyers and you want to bring in the monkey lawyers!

Re:so sue them with guerrilla lawyers (1)

BitZtream (692029) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890791)

And Microsoft bundling IE with Windows had absolutely jack shit to do with the reasons the DOJ went after them.

They were preventing OTHER browsers from being bundled with Windows, and thats what the problem was.

It was never a problem to bundle IE.

You guys really have no idea how the law works or what actually happened in that case, you really should stop bringing it up.

Stupid apple (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41890503)

One of the first things Jobs did when he came back was stop the stupid and destructive fight with Microsoft. Now they're doing all they can to pick a fight with Google. My guess: in 10 years, when Apple is on its knees, they'll come crawling back to Google.

Re:Stupid apple (1)

thesupraman (179040) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890553)

Ummm... that was Steve 'go nuclear on android' Jobs, I think you will find.

Cannot disagree on the rest, we are starting to see the tablet transition as we saw
on the phones a couple of years ago. If Apple doesnt find a new 'wonder' product in
the next 12 months, its going to get mighty difficult for them.

Re:Stupid apple (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41890603)

Yes, mighty difficult to spend all the money they make hand over fist. You realize that despute having "only" 15% marketshare that Apple still makes 60% of all smartphone profits, right? Samsung makes most of the rest.

Re:Stupid apple (1)

BitZtream (692029) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890803)

Regardless of which you think is better, I'd be right beside Steve Jobs on this one.

One of Googles board members was sitting on Apples board ... watched the iPhone come to market and take it by storm and then decided to go into direct competition with it having inside knowledge of the entire plan.

I'm not arguing who is better or anything else, simply that if I was in Jobs's place, I'd take that shit personal and like a knife in the back as well, with repeated stabbings. If I thought I had a chance I'd try to wipe Google out for that shit as well.

I don't think they'll really stop them, the two products fill different rolls, but I completely understand that need for Jobs to beat the shit out of Google, what they did was pretty fucking douchebagish.

Re:Stupid apple (5, Interesting)

Dahamma (304068) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890911)

Oh bullshit. Without Google Maps and Search on day one, the iPhone would have been a tiny fraction as effective a device as it was. Google Maps was the killer app, and STILL is as everyone has learned with the Apple Maps fiasco.

And Google didn't even *create* Android, they just bought a startup once it seemed obvious that mobile devices would be the dominant form of social interaction. What, was Google supposed to ignore that whole market just because *Apple* elected its CEO to their board? I'm pretty sure a CEO's responsibilities to his company trump a board member's, and if they were paying attention they should have asked Schmidt to leave a lot sooner.

There are other Google based App Store apps (3, Informative)

SuperKendall (25149) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890509)

The thought that Google will not be accepted just because Apple is not featuring any Google based mapping apps is rediculous. There are a number of Google based mapping apps in the app store, from a Street View app to something called Sparkling Maps [leimobile.com] which is meant to be something of a Google maps clone.

Apple does not feature every app on the App store; there are too many. But that does not mean anything in terms of what they will approve, and the myth that Apple will not allow publishing anything that "duplicates functionality" is long dead at this point.

This whole story is nothing more than Apple Hater bait, and I can see by the first few replies the trolls are hungrily feasting upon it.

Re:There are other Google based App Store apps (1)

dontbemad (2683011) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890537)

Yeah. Or they could reject it. Apple has done far more childish things that cause harm to its increasingly disenfranchised user-base.

Re:There are other Google based App Store apps (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41890641)

Yeah.

Or they could reject it. Apple has done far more childish things that cause harm to its increasingly disenfranchised user-base.

Yeah just like they rejected Google Voice because it competed with Siri....Oh wait... no they didnt.

Re:There are other Google based App Store apps (1)

andymadigan (792996) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890849)

How in the hell does Google Voice compete with Siri? Google Voice is a call management application with SMS functionality. The only possible overlap is the voicemail transcription feature, which isn't capable of interpreting voice in realtime and doesn't perform any kind of query. It was actually rejected for a while, though I think Apple eventually approved it.

Re:There are other Google based App Store apps (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41890869)

Do you even know what Google Voice is? Clearly not...

Re:There are other Google based App Store apps (0)

tlhIngan (30335) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890841)

Actually, Apple will reject the new maps app.

Because the first submitted version will never make it through the review process. Very FEW apps have made it through the review process without initial rejection.

It also doesn't help that Google's iOS team is hopelessly incompetent - Google's apps aren't exactly super stable and many have been withdrawn so they could be fixed up. It's almost as if Apple rubber-stamps Google's apps just to show off how "bad" they are.

Re:There are other Google based App Store apps (4, Informative)

stephanruby (542433) | about a year and a half ago | (#41891139)

...and the myth that Apple will not allow publishing anything that "duplicates functionality" is long dead at this point.

A myth? Are you kidding me? The last time Apple removed existing applications, because it "duplicated" (new) iPhone functionality, was just last week. And I'm talking about removing existing applications, not just banning new applications. Granted, those apps were for adding emoji icons, it's probably no big loss to anyone, but it at least proves that this clause in their developer EULA hasn't gone away.

Besides, no one is saying that Apple "will not allow publishing anything that 'duplicates functionality'". That's a straw man argument. From the very beginning, Apple hasn't been consistent in enforcing its rules anyway. For instance, it allowed some apps that duplicated functionality, while it rejected other applications that duplicated that same functionality.

The thing is. You don't really know. And Apple won't tell you of course. So you have to invest all this money and manpower in building your app for the iPhone platform and take the risk that the person reviewing your app is in a good mood that day, and/or that Apple won't go back on its decision six months from now (when they feel their mapping application has finally passed QA).

Browser (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41890539)

Don't be stupid....

I say.... (0)

PortHaven (242123) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890555)

FUCK them over with a nice anti-trust lawsuit. Seems like a clear cut case if I've ever seen one.

I liked Apple... (4, Insightful)

fullback (968784) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890559)

I have used Apple and Windows products for over 20 years. I liked my Apple Macbook and use iPads in one of my businesses. We deliver using the iPad maps app and maintained a history using the previous app.

Imagine losing all that data? That's what Apple did to me with this unannounced change. They put their own selfish agenda above their customers. They could have easily brought back the old app.

Bastards. I'm tired of both Apple and Windows forcing me to use devices and applications only the way they decide I should use them.

Re:I liked Apple... (3, Informative)

Osgeld (1900440) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890565)

" They put their own selfish agenda above their customers"

well no shit, they have done nothing but that since the 1980's, what did you expect?

Re:I liked Apple... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41890633)

Why didn't you just downgrade to IOS5?

Re:I liked Apple... (1)

mark-t (151149) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890697)

How do you downgrade back to iOS5, exactly? I mean, post-beta.

Re:I liked Apple... (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41890715)

Why did you upgrade in the first place? I haven't yet, and Google Maps still works perfectly.

Re:I liked Apple... (0, Troll)

HockeyPuck (141947) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890735)

I have used Apple and Windows products for over 20 years. I liked my Apple Macbook and use iPads in one of my businesses. We deliver using the iPad maps app and maintained a history using the previous app.

Imagine losing all that data? That's what Apple did to me with this unannounced change. They put their own selfish agenda above their customers. They could have easily brought back the old app.

Bastards. I'm tired of both Apple and Windows forcing me to use devices and applications only the way they decide I should use them.

Translation:
I didn't do my due diligence by verifying that the upgrade would allow me to run my business in the way that I've been running it. While it is a mission critical application in my business, I decided to not follow solid business practices and take a leap of faith by assuming that everything would work exactly like it did before.

I also ignored all the online reports nor did any research into what the impact would be off switching to a new map application. I am now trying to blame apple for forcing me to upgrade, as I'm too proud to take the blame on myself.

Re:I liked Apple... (3, Insightful)

maugle (1369813) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890789)

Translation: I didn't do my due diligence by verifying that the upgrade would allow me to run my business in the way that I've been running it.

Huh. I typically expect new versions of programs to add functionality, not arbitrarily remove it. Or is it considered common practice now before updating to go over a checklist of every feature of every app you use, to make sure it hasn't disappeared?

Do you check to make sure each update to the iPhone still lets you make calls?

Re:I liked Apple... (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41890865)

Or is it considered common practice now before updating to go over a checklist of every feature of every app you use, to make sure it hasn't disappeared?

Yes. Yes it is.

Have you seen what Sony has done to the PS3?

History is still there (2)

SuperKendall (25149) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890747)

We deliver using the iPad maps app and maintained a history using the previous app.

If you kept a history in Bookmarks in the map app, they are still there. I have years worth of different map bookmarks I can still use just fine.

A history kept any other way would have been lost in any major OS upgrade, regardless of changing from Apple Maps or not.

Re:I liked Apple... (0)

BitZtream (692029) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890815)

That's what Apple did to me with this unannounced change.

You're a shitty developer then. I was using the new maps app for months before it went live, it was hardly unannounced if you bothered to test your apps on the betas.

Re:I liked Apple... (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41891127)

Wait, why are people modding down critiques of this post down?

Do we understand what OP is saying? They actually relied on the history in the maps app for their business - that's like relying on your web browser history to run a business. That's insanity.

Re:I liked Apple... (0)

symes (835608) | about a year and a half ago | (#41891149)

Personally, I'm pretty tired of both Google and Apple. Google for trying to track everything I do on the internet and, in some cases, everywhere I go. And Apple, mostly because of the maps issue. I've switched to Bing as my search engine of choice and I will not upgrade iOS on my iPhone and iPad until the maps facility is improved or, ironically, Google maps is back in there. I am liking Win7 however and generally finding MS to have improved as a company, something I find hard to say. But I'm pretty tired of the lot of them tbh and this is effecting my choices. I'll probably switch to Samsung for phones, I'll continue to use Ubuntu where I can.

In other news (2, Funny)

wbr1 (2538558) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890577)

Samsung doubts apple will purchase its LCD panels. Oh, wait.

Everyone is jumping to conclusions. (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41890635)

How about we wait until they submit it and see what Apple does before calling Apple nazis.....

If they reject Google.... (1)

mark-t (151149) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890713)

Wouldn't they then be in the position of being somewhat obligated to, for similar reasons, also discontinue (at least for iOS6 and later) any of the other mapping and navigations programs that are available on the app store?

Maybe Only in the US Store (2)

MidnightBrewer (97195) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890723)

So the International Business Times quotes the Guardian, who cites "sources at Google familiar with its mapping plans" - in other words, nobody at all. As others have pointed out, there are many Google-API based applications on the App Store; some of them are even in the "featured" category in certain stores, such as the Japanese App Store. Whoever they're quoting doesn't know much, and their knowledge appears to be limited to whatever country they happen to be in. This doesn't amount to more than water-cooler gossip and conspiracy theory. Nothing to see here.

Is the web not good enough? (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41890783)

Can't Google's maps.google.com web site do all that they need? Why the need for a native app? Not being a smart ass here. I'm just genuinely curious. I don't have a smartphone, so I don't know about all of their capabilities, but I know they come with modern web browsers. After all the hoopla that companies like Google have made to sell us on "the could" it seem disingenuous for them to make a native app rather than eat their own dogfood. I thought that all of these new features added to web browsers in the last few years were to make native app replacement possible.

No turn by turn audio and manual location input (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41890799)

If you use the google maps website, you don't get turn by turn audio meaning you have to constantly look at the screen. Also, you would have to manually input your location and the map would not be updated as your location changes so while yes you could get maps and directions it would be no different than using your laptop to do so.

Google should keep its maps to itself (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41890805)

If I was Google I wouldn't build a map app for aple IOS. This would make android a much more desirable alternative. In fact I would probably remove the rest of my apps, gmail etc, from the Apple app store also.

Re:Google should keep its maps to itself (1)

mark-t (151149) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890943)

I really like Google maps, and I own an iPhone, but if Google chose to do that, it wouldn't inspire me to buy Android. I would see such a choice by Google to be extremely petty.

Not that Apple rejecting Google likely wouldn't also be petty, but if Google is smart about this, they'd be wiser to let Apple take fall for being so. if Google tries to play by the same rules as anybody else and Apple just doesn't let them in, then only one of two things must happen:

Either Apple must also discontinue all the other map applications on the same grounds as they reject Google's. This will be almost certain to be the cause of numerous lawsuits... both against apple and against developers of such applications, and will result in a lot of bad PR for Apple; or else Apple will decide to treat Google differently, excluding it while allowing the other mapping applications, which would in no uncertain terms publicly paint Apple as the bad guy in all of this, which will still result in a lot of bad PR for Apple.

If Apple does let Google develop an iOS app, then everybody wins.

Bullshit (1)

JoeyRox (2711699) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890827)

Does Google really think Apple would reject Google Maps, with all the negative publicity it would cause for Apple?

APPLE is like TALIBAN (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41890847)

They want to control eveything to follow their ways.

Google Support in 50% of apps (1)

Tarpan Horses (2076166) | about a year and a half ago | (#41890915)

Wait a second... I use TomTom and it has google search support. Navigon, Sygic, Garmin all list google search support. So basically half the apps showing up in my "Find maps for you iPhone/iPad" claim to have google search support. Something doesn't add up here.

Dunno, don't care. Easy solution - ditch Apple and (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41890991)

get an Android phone.

Am I the only one? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41891003)

Who read this and thought that "it's" meant Apple's?
I thought it meant that Apple wouldn't bother to improve their own crappy maps app.

No way will this get rejected (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41891135)

This is clearly just Google trying to stir controversy for their advantage. They want to create enough groundswell of opinion amongst dissatisfied iOS customers to pressure Apple into making sure it DOESN'T reject the app.

I'll wager there's not one iPhone or iPad user that wouldn't welcome a Google Maps app back to the platform. Google and Apple both know this. It also makes Apple seem even more unreasonable when they are painted as wanting to deny users a superior maps product. Google wins the PR fight there.

There's no way it'll be rejected. Apple want to save face over this whole debacle, but not enough to piss off the majority of their users.

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