×

Welcome to the Slashdot Beta site -- learn more here. Use the link in the footer or click here to return to the Classic version of Slashdot.

Thank you!

Before you choose to head back to the Classic look of the site, we'd appreciate it if you share your thoughts on the Beta; your feedback is what drives our ongoing development.

Beta is different and we value you taking the time to try it out. Please take a look at the changes we've made in Beta and  learn more about it. Thanks for reading, and for making the site better!

cancel ×
This is a preview of your comment

No Comment Title Entered

Anonymous Coward 1 minute ago

No Comment Entered

378 comments

And that will also mark (4, Insightful)

Ian Alexander (997430) | about a year and a half ago | (#41940595)

my permanent move away from GNOME. I am learning to like XFCE!

Re:And that will also mark (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940605)

Same...

I hear Linus had a few nice things to say about KDE...

Re:And that will also mark (2)

skiminki (1546281) | about a year and a half ago | (#41940651)

Seems to be a trend. I too moved to XFCE ~1-2 years ago

Re:And that will also mark (5, Interesting)

pepeperes (731972) | about a year and a half ago | (#41940751)

Same here, switched to XFCE (about the time Unity was released, as most of you, I guess) and was also considering looking again at KDE, since it made the news again :) I used SuSE for some years, some 10 years ago, and KDE was quite good, even more compared to GNOME which at the time was still very very under-developed.

I may try KDE again, though the last time i tried it, it was a bit "too much"... such HUGE menus were just uncomfortable... For me, it was an overall impression of a bit too much of everything, everywhere.

Now, I can say the only thing I really don't like in XFCE is Thunar... for me it lacks lots of functionality (like, ffs, copy-paste with right button!). But even so, i cant even think of trying to use unity or gnome shell again.

So no, it's not like we have really advanced much. With XFCE sometimes I feel a bit like 1999 again, suffering here and there with stuff that doesn't exactly work as I would like, but also feeling confident and comfortable with it.

Probably KDE will be the desktop of choice for most of the "normal" linux desktop users... until they decide it's time to move to tablet interfaces too!!

Re:And that will also mark (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940779)

Hey! I'm a raging butthole slammer! Nice to meet you!

Re:And that will also mark (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940979)

I take it KDE/Plasma Active is news to you then?

That aside, accusing KDE of having HUGE menus is rather ironic, considering that the average GTK application occupies far more screen space, by featuring slightly larger fonts and lots of padding... Oh god... so much padding...
A lot of them won't even fit on my netbook's 1024x600 display, but at least there's Alt+left click to move them!

Re:And that will also mark (1)

jones_supa (887896) | about a year and a half ago | (#41941049)

By my experience, KDE4 is too heavy to be run on a netbook.

Re:And that will also mark (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41941099)

Eh, KDE's not so bad. I ran it just fine on a netbook for a while, before I got fed up with it for other reasons (relating to its habit of scattering its configuration across dozens of completely undocumented files in several different hidden locations) and went back to basics with a mixture of xfce and fvwm.

Re:And that will also mark (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41941151)

Works perfectly well for me, and this 3 year old hunk of crap can't even do OpenGL 2.0, sports a measly 1 GB of RAM, and a 1.8 GHz dual core; It was practically rubbish the day I got it.

To be honest, how few resources KDE uses and how efficient it is with them really surprises me.
It's much lighter than GNOME, resource wise, and it's far more gentle than XFCE is on my battery life.

Re:And that will also mark (1)

gmack (197796) | about a year and a half ago | (#41941223)

Now, I can say the only thing I really don't like in XFCE is Thunar... for me it lacks lots of functionality (like, ffs, copy-paste with right button!). But even so, i cant even think of trying to use unity or gnome shell again.

Thunar 1.2.3 here and I can copy and paste files and text(when renaming) with the right mouse button. Or am I missing something?

Re:And that will also mark (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940793)

I've been trying to use xfce for a little while, but I'm about ready to give kde another try. There are just some simple features I've gotten too used to in a window manager that still don't exist in xfce. And without going on with a list of admittedly small things I'd just say that these various little things start to add up and make the whole thing feel aggravatingly primitive. I mean c'mon... no serious option should leave you arranging each desktop icon manually.

That said, Gnome was driving me nuts, and xfce is (barely) more usable than that mess.

Re:And that will also mark (3, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940717)

Same...

I hear Linus had a few nice things to say about KDE...

You should enjoy that while it lasts, apparently Linus saying anything nice a rare event. I hear he moved to the US mainly because his mom kept washing his mouth out with soap.

Re:And that will also mark (3, Interesting)

kthreadd (1558445) | about a year and a half ago | (#41940695)

my permanent move away from GNOME. I am learning to like XFCE!

I tried GNOME a few times in the 2.x series but found that it was going downhill.
In the meantime my old fvwm configuration still works.

Re:And that will also mark (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940727)

You might be interested in this GNOME 2 fork [mate-desktop.org]

Re:And that will also mark (1)

Ambiguous Puzuma (1134017) | about a year and a half ago | (#41941097)

Grr...meant "Informative", cursor moved to "Funny" just as I released the mouse button. I've been satisfied with MATE, having been introduced to it by Linux Mint.

Re:And that will also mark (1)

Dahamma (304068) | about a year and a half ago | (#41940773)

Ironically I updated my FC17 install today on a VM and it wouldn't boot. Which was ok, but it caused Gnome 3 to enable fallback mode when I booted the old kernel. Which also would have been ok, if the system settings didn't segfault when run so I couldn't switch it back.

(and yes, I tried screwing with dconf manually to enable it - holy hell another Gnome disaster of an idea! - but ended up restoring the VM image... upgrades are overrated...)

Re:And that will also mark (5, Interesting)

Phics (934282) | about a year and a half ago | (#41940863)

Man, there are a lot of bitter people on /. If you don't like Gnome, you'll be using XFCE or KDE or Mate or Cinnamon or something - we already know. Quit complaining about something you don't even use anymore. Every time 'Gnome' is in a post topic, we get all the same people rambling on about the same stuff, and Gnome users like myself barely bother reading anymore.

Linux has a lot of choice for a reason. Just grab the desktop you like and roll with it. If you don't like it anymore, grab a different one.

I actually like the 3.x interface and I've never used it on a touch device. Yes, it is a bold departure, but I find it makes me more productive all in all. I dislike nested menus - always have. I can't think of a bigger waste of time than browsing a nested menu system looking for an app, and if you're using the 'Applications' view in Gnome 3.x, you're definitely doing things the hard way. Hitting the 'Windows' key, typing the first few characters of my target software, and then the 'Enter' key to launch apps makes a lot of sense. The quick gesture of ramming my mouse into the corner to arrange work-spaces works great.

Re:And that will also mark (1)

martin-boundary (547041) | about a year and a half ago | (#41940921)

You're about half way there. At some point, you'll realize that you can set up a hotkey to launch a terminal. From there, if you type the first few characters of an app followed by TAB and ENTER, you get the same outcome. But since the terminal loads a shell automatically, you can IN ADDITION do all sorts of file management, get system information through /proc, and specify extra one off command line parameters for any script you care to run...

Re:And that will also mark (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940993)

er... Just use Alt-F2
You can enter the random commands to run and some DEs like KDE have embedded a tonne of search functionality into it.

Re:And that will also mark (4, Funny)

drooling-dog (189103) | about a year and a half ago | (#41941053)

Aaaaaaaand... we've come full-circle. Look how much more productive you can be with this amazing new thing!

Re:And that will also mark (5, Insightful)

jonadab (583620) | about a year and a half ago | (#41941067)

> Quit complaining about something you don't even use anymore.

The complaining stems from the fact that something really genuinely good has been deliberately taken away from us. Gnome 1.x was much better than any of the other options. It did everything we wanted a desktop environment to do. It had all the features we wanted, and every single one of them was fully configurable.

Then someone decided "options are bad" and started taking it all away. At first we thought it was just because of the rewrite (when they rewrote 2.0 to use the new GTK), so we hung in there, thinking we'd eventually get our features back... but then they started taking away more and more and more. By the time we realized what was going on, it was too late to fork 1.x, because it would no longer compile against contemporary libraries. (Gnome has always had eleventy bajillion dependencies.)

Then in the 3.x series they started inserting more and more *unwanted* features. I don't just mean unnecessary features that I personally don't have any need for; it goes beyond that. I'm talking about features that are actively intrusive and cannot be turned off, like the way it now insists on popping up extra windows you don't want while you're in the middle of trying to work on other things, and this behavior cannot be disabled. Gnome has become so horrible, it beggars the imagination to realize that every release they still manage somehow to find a way to make it yet worse.

It's really sad. Gnome used to be something I could not just use but also happily recommend. Now it's so awful, I can't imagine anyone actually liking it.

Re:And that will also mark (4, Insightful)

Taco Cowboy (5327) | about a year and a half ago | (#41941079)

Quit complaining about something you don't even use anymore.

You sound very much like someone from the central politburo committee of the Chinese Communist Party.
 
Luckily the CCP has no say in the Linux Scene, or I would be starting to re-learning to use Microsoft Windoze.

Re:And that will also mark (1)

wolverine1999 (126497) | about a year and a half ago | (#41940973)

My laptop's GNOME just broke... couldn't type anything, it just was beeping. Had to login as root to be able to do anything.
Then I traced the problem to my configuration files and solved it by creating a new account. Way to go, GNOME.
I'll switch to XFCE too as I like it on another machine.

Re:And that will also mark (1)

aliquis (678370) | about a year and a half ago | (#41941035)

You may also like to check Enlightenment and Razor-Qt. ... or if you have unlimited RAM KDE.

Re:And that will also mark (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41941237)

Year of the million desktop configurations.

idiots (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940603)

Gnome seems hell bent on alienating what little user-base they have left

Re:idiots (4, Interesting)

Alex Belits (437) | about a year and a half ago | (#41940619)

Actually this is an improvement. Fallback mode was mostly a non-functional imitation of a Gnome 2 interface in the minimal default configuration that no one used.

Re:idiots (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940737)

It's fully functional and the most usable GUI on my laptop running Ubuntu 12.04 you insensitive clod! I even tweaked the properties to have fully transparent panels, it looks pretty neat.

Re:idiots (1)

Alex Belits (437) | about a year and a half ago | (#41940769)

It's fully functional and the most usable GUI on my laptop running Ubuntu 12.04 you insensitive clod! I even tweaked the properties to have fully transparent panels, it looks pretty neat.

Yeah?

Half of applets gone. Panel height does not adjust beyond the size of some arbitrary icon in the theme. Speaking of themes, total of three GTK+ themes actually work consistently, and not ones that anyone likes.

Re:idiots (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940747)

As vino is only working in fallback mode due to graphic acceleration issues, removing it would be a very bad idea!

Re:idiots (1)

hcs_$reboot (1536101) | about a year and a half ago | (#41940763)

Fallback mode was mostly a non-functional imitation of a Gnome 2 interface in the minimal default configuration that no one used

Not no one. Ok, have to admit Unity made some progress since v1. But as long as it requires us the pain to do that [geekyboy.com] to add a simple icon to the launcher, I'll stick to Classic (where a alt-right-click Add to Panel suffices...)

Re:idiots (1)

fa2k (881632) | about a year and a half ago | (#41941157)

Actually this is an improvement. Fallback mode was mostly a non-functional imitation of a Gnome 2 interface in the minimal default configuration that no one used.

Fallback mode was in some sense a logical successor to Gnome 2. I'm a happy user of Fallback mode at work, I was delighted that the GPU of the new computer wasn't compatible with Gnome Shell. So it's *not* an improvement to drop it. Aslo, many computers which don't have proper GPU drivers are going to be old ones or not well maintained. Thus Gnome Shell is going to work like crap [Gnome 3 uses a shitload of GPU resources; I had to run my Radeon 6660 in "performance" mode to prevent the sound from stuttering, while I always use "low" in KDE except when gaming]

The good thing. Fallback wasn't similar to Gnome Shell anyway, so it didn't make sense as a product. There are other DEs / WMs which are designed for low end HW, and others that imitate the Gnome 2 look. People using Fallback should really be switching to those.

[ My only problem with Fallback was that it's near impossible to see which window you're switching to when using Alt-Tab (which BTW works just as you'd expect). Good WMs highlight the window that's selected in the switcher, but Fallback only showed a nearly invisible border. I always wondered if this was a bug or a passive-aggressive move from the devs ]

Re:idiots (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41941185)

I had to run my Radeon 6660 in "performance" mode to

Just realised it's a 6770. Same difference, posting as anon, it's not important.

Re:idiots (3, Informative)

Dahamma (304068) | about a year and a half ago | (#41940669)

And Fedora is their biggest supporter. For christsakes I just found with Fedora 17 they don't even include the Unix man pages in the default installation. Sigh.

Re:idiots (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940725)

Fortunately all the other DEs work perfectly fine on Fedora too. It looks like the majority of Fedora users run XFCE.

Re:idiots (0, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41941121)

For christsakes I just found with Fedora 17 they don't even include the Unix man pages in the default installation.

For all intents and purposes, Fedora and Ubuntu are no longer Unix-like operating systems. They've both boarded the fast train to OS X city, where a vaguely UNIX-like base is combined with a completely unrelated userland that's incompatible with any other OS.

Fedora and Ubuntu are trying to package Linux for people who don't want Linux.

If you actually want to use Linux, consider switching to a distro that cares about you. I chose Debian, which is great if you can handle their rather odd release cycle. There are plenty of others.

Re:idiots (4, Informative)

OolimPhon (1120895) | about a year and a half ago | (#41941169)

Er, except that Debian is moving to Gnome 3 with Wheezy.

Tried a test installation prior to planning a site upgrade. WTF? DO NOT LIKE.

Looked around the Debian forums. Replies to "Can we have Gnome 2 back?" are met with "Why don't you help make Gnome 3 better instead?"

DO NOT WANT.

Tried Mate but it isn't ready for prime time yet, too many holes. Ended up with LXDE instead, adequate.

Then allow for a blacklist override (4, Interesting)

sethstorm (512897) | about a year and a half ago | (#41940613)

That way, recompilation/patching isn't needed when a GNOME developer arbitrarily blacklists a chipset and goes out of their way to avoid fixing it (such as with the ATI R100 series).

It's one thing to have llvmpipe, it's another when the developer puts large amounts of effort to keep something broken.

Switched a long time ago (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940615)

When GNOME Shell began to sneak in to Debian testing I gave up on GNOME and switched to XFCE. Good riddance.

If they drop non-accelerated support... (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940621)

...does this mean they think GPU support on Linux is great?

Re:If they drop non-accelerated support... (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41941033)

It's GNOME, they're retarded; They intend to use llvmpipe, a software rasteriser, as a fallback.
Martin of KDE's kwin wrote a pretty good blog post about it.
http://blog.martin-graesslin.com/blog/2012/10/to-llvmpipe-or-not/

Re:If they drop non-accelerated support... (1)

zdzichu (100333) | about a year and a half ago | (#41941165)

It's adequate for big-three (Intel, nVidia, AMD) which solves 95% desktop problems. It's passable for ARM-based platforms. So fallback is needed for 1% of real hardware and some percent of virtual machines. Most virtualisation platforms support 3D accel for Linux.
Besides, how much power do you need to display few textured rectangles?

Ubuntu and classic mode (5, Insightful)

Weaselmancer (533834) | about a year and a half ago | (#41940623)

Will they fork, or will they stick with the dippy new interface? Because I have to say I tried the new interface. And I find it doesn't help me much. First thing I do on a new system is to "sudo apt-get install gnome-session-fallback" and login under the old system.

Oh, and don't think I'm in curmudgeon mode and simply don't like new things. I really tried to like the new system, I really did. But having to right click on Terminal and select "open new session" to get a second shell up is ANNOYING AS FUCK. Come on guys! You know that's not how we work. If you don't have half a dozen command prompts up you're not busy. Why make it harder to do that?

So for me, this is the end of Gnome. I need something that helps me work, not gets in the way of work. I like the system but if you ditch the "classic" aka "useful" mode, well sorry. Gotta go find something else.

Re:Ubuntu and classic mode (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940653)

The classic mode is gone in Ubuntu since 11.10.

Re:Ubuntu and classic mode (1)

Toba82 (871257) | about a year and a half ago | (#41940655)

I cannot like the new interface either. I can barely like classic mode since it seems to have removed a lot of shit. The new config system is awful and doesn't expose as many options. Sigh. Has anyone forked it wholesale yet?

Re:Ubuntu and classic mode (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940723)

It's Ctrl-Click to open a new window. Or type, ctrl-enter.

This is the end..... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940635)

They tried to shake, but not to stire. This will be their Skyfall.

Couldn't believe it, had to RTFA (4, Insightful)

blind biker (1066130) | about a year and a half ago | (#41940657)

At first I thought it was creative editing on the part of the submitter, so I did the unthinkable, and RTFA - and it's fucking there, right smack at the beginning:

Matthias Clasen on the behalf of the GNOME Release Team has announced that they have decided to eliminate GNOME's "fallback mode" with the upcoming 3.8 release

Ya know? KDE is looking better every day, thanks to the Gnome developers.

This sounds familiar... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940661)

This is preposterous! I am going to Windows 8! Year of Microsoft! etc.

After 5 years' Linux usage, I'm switching to Mac (3, Interesting)

mfearby (1653) | about a year and a half ago | (#41940691)

I've been using KDE for about six months now since the Unity fiasco drove me away from Ubuntu (with a year's Debian use on the way, with GNOME 2.3x before the more-recent KDE/openSUSE install).

However, I've reached that point in my life where I just want things to work, and since the Mac OS is not hostile to most of the open-source tools I use every day (and will continue using), switching to a desktop that "just works" means I should get the best of both worlds. I won't have to hunt down special repositories to get essential things installed any more, and I won't have to read lengthy HOWTOs to get some basic things working. I've been using my brother's Late 2011 Mac Mini for a day now and I'm very happy with the polish, the smoothness, the speed, and the complete lack of fuss. I doubt I'll ever really love the Finder, and the Dock has never impressed me much, but everything else will be a joy to use.

Sorry, Linux, but after more than a decade of "Is this the year of Linux on the desktop?" predictions, the old adage about doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results applies. Linux is still Balkanised and I still have to fight to get simple things to work. I'll still keep Linux for a LAMP server (bare metal or VM, haven't decided) and you'll have to pry Mythbuntu from my cold, dead, hands in the lounge room, but sadly there is no longer a place for Linux as my main desktop operating system. And now that Microsoft are doing their best to drive away their loyal user base, I see an even brighter future ahead for the Mac ecosystem. I may as well stop fighting it.

Re:After 5 years' Linux usage, I'm switching to Ma (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940741)

Maybe it "just works" for you, but every time I've tried to use MacOS X, I had to give up in a short time and go back to KDE. This thing is just too infuriatingly dumbed down. For example I need focus follows mouse and absolutely detest the "active window is top window" mode. It always amazes me how "power users" can actually stand the MacOS X desktop, but I guess everybody is different.

Re:After 5 years' Linux usage, I'm switching to Ma (3, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940783)

Some users (especially shortcut-heavy users) just want to get the cursor out of the way and focus follows mouse effectively wrecks that.

Re:After 5 years' Linux usage, I'm switching to Ma (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940937)

Which is why real OSes allow the user to choose how their UI works, rather than forcing the "best" configuration on them.

Re:After 5 years' Linux usage, I'm switching to Ma (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940997)

This is why the KDE Terminal and other programs make the mouse pointer disappear once you press a key - no need to push it around. Correctly implemented focus-follows-mouse works perfectly with shortcut-heavy usage: It only changes focus if you cross the borders of windows. If, on the other hand, you open a window with a shortcut, the new window is active, whether the mouse pointer is over it or not. This saves many many mouse clicks and makes work smoother. Though I have to admit that Windows and Mac users get quickly infuriated when working on my desktop. Which doesn't bother me too much, because I configured it to my tastes.

Re:After 5 years' Linux usage, I'm switching to Ma (2)

jones_supa (887896) | about a year and a half ago | (#41941085)

Some users (especially shortcut-heavy users) just want to get the cursor out of the way and focus follows mouse effectively wrecks that.

You know, KDE allows you to turn it back off, too.

Re:After 5 years' Linux usage, I'm switching to Ma (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940865)

Focus follows mouse does actually work with Terminals (even when another application is on top), you have to enable this though. I believe someone also made a utility that implements this for the whole os, but I haven't bothered with it.

Re:After 5 years' Linux usage, I'm switching to Ma (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41941109)

Maybe it "just works" for you, but every time I've tried to use MacOS X, I had to give up in a short time and go back to KDE. This thing is just too infuriatingly dumbed down.

So much so that Mac users don't even get a proper delete key that goes forwards or a right click on the trackpad (without holding down function). The idea that this is a professional OS is laughable (doesn't even have highlight, middle-click copy).

Re:After 5 years' Linux usage, I'm switching to Ma (1)

cristiroma (606375) | about a year and a half ago | (#41941257)

This thing is just too infuriatingly dumbed down

That's so cliché that I really wonder if you really got your hands on a Mac aside from a shop demo. Also, I am trying to imagine what kind of "power user" are you, 'cause usually power users are command line freaks. While programmers that I know usually use vim or some kind of IDE like Eclipse/Netbeans.

FYI, I moved to Mac a month ago and I'm very happy. Laptop was from the company so I switched first thing on monday, being back on track after a couple of days.

I use the Mac both home and at work place and IT FUCKING WORKS. I was sick of my Dell that I have to carefully shutdown because it NEVER WAKES FROM HIBERNATION. Did I mention that ATI drivers overheat and wireless are major PITA to set-up and works only g? Then came the freaking Gnome ... and that was the last draw. It was the last nail in the coffin.

On desktop Linux and Gnome 2 was a VERY DECENT workstation. Used it for several years. On laptop SUCKS BIG TIME. Anyway, it's free and I am still using CentOS on our servers, cannot complain in that department.

Re:After 5 years' Linux usage, I'm switching to Ma (4, Interesting)

unapersson (38207) | about a year and a half ago | (#41940785)

After 15+ years Linux usage I'm sticking with GNOME3 because I also want things to just work, and it gives me what I want, a clean desktop which stays out of my way most of the time. I simply did the GNOME2 to GNOME3 transition without stopping at Unity in between.

If I didn't like GNOME3 then there are so many alternatives that are simply an apt-get install away that I simply can't understand all the whining. I'd likely go back to WindowMaker or fluxbox.

Re:After 5 years' Linux usage, I'm switching to Ma (1)

gox (1595435) | about a year and a half ago | (#41941111)

The purist's desktop always "just works" in Linux. Instead of drowning in all the clutter, you could just switch to evilwm or something similar. Typing commands instead of selecting them from a menu is faster anyway (and you can install a pop-up menu for that if you're into that sort of thing). I've been using XMonad for years now and I'm happier and more productive than before. What is it with people's work that requires a "desktop" or "windows that are smaller than the screen that block the others so that you can't exactly see them" or "menu bars"? I don't seem to get what all the fuss is about, even though I've used those sort of systems for years. I have my status bar though, and a little command prompt with nifty completion that I use to run programs. I will be using the same system 5 years later too and it will not introduce any disadvantages.

Re:After 5 years' Linux usage, I'm switching to Ma (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41941119)

define polish, smoothness and 'complete lack of fuss.' every single desktop I've used I've had to customize, including osx. they're all annoying.

Re:After 5 years' Linux usage, I'm switching to Ma (1)

aaaaaaargh! (1150173) | about a year and a half ago | (#41941243)

While I respect your decision I can't help noticing that you must have done something wrong.

I switched from the Mac to Ubuntu 5 years ago and I'm definitely not going to switch back. The only problems that I have ever encountered were solely caused by my own tinkering. If you don't start hacking it, Ubuntu works perfectly fine out of the box. (And by 'hacking' I don't mean changing the window manager; I'm using Xubuntu anyway.) Are you sure you haven't just played around with your distro too much? Like when people start to learn LaTeX and write papers with too many symbols in them because they can? You can just as easily run into problems with OS X when you start messing around with the underlying Unix, you know.

GNOME 3 rules, you totally owe them an apology (-1, Troll)

JohnnyCache1 (2771581) | about a year and a half ago | (#41940781)

I personally find GNOME 3 very slick and modern, and have grown to love it. Seriously, try it with Cairo Dock-gl, you won't miss anything about GNOME 2. If I were the developers, I'd be angry. They built something awesome, even did it for free. And then there's all these nasty little ingrates on Slashdot, typing nasty little comments, whining and complaining. STFU!

Re:GNOME 3 rules, you totally owe them an apology (2)

Kagetsuki (1620613) | about a year and a half ago | (#41940833)

I completely agree with you. Personally I'm not a fan of docks so I used the frippery bottom pannel extension but at the moment I'm not even bothering. Honestly if people would take the week or so to get used to Gnome Shell they'd realize how efficient it is and how great it is at keeping things you don't need out of the way and putting them right where you need them when you do. I find the windows I need faster, I lauch applications faster, and I spend much less time in general dealing with the window manager itself. As a bonus it never fails to impress people when I give demos - for someone who's only seen Windows and OSX it's looks like magic.

Re:GNOME 3 rules, you totally owe them an apology (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940835)

Direct proof that users are creating multiple accounts and modding themselves up.

Re:GNOME 3 rules, you totally owe them an apology (1)

ikaruga (2725453) | about a year and a half ago | (#41940957)

Good luck buddy. Some people are just afraid of change. In my case I actually love Unity and consider it one of the best things to happen to Linux as well as the perfect display of a desktop that is compatible with both standard mouse+keyboard interfaces and touch and it actually increased my productivity. Sure there are things to improve but the same can be said to all other GUIs in the planet. Just ignore them and support the devs.

Re:GNOME 3 rules, you totally owe them an apology (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41941215)

>> Some people are just afraid of change.

And some people assume that change always represent progress, and accuse the people who aren't fooled by the hype of being "afraid of change".

Also, to your point about Unity being a perfect unification of the mouse+keyboard UI and the touch interface, I think the "one size fits all" religion in the Windows 8/Unity design subculture is a tremendous waste of billions of user-hours that will end with the realization that it is better for a UI to adapt (to some extent) to the context in which it will be used! Wow, what an advanced concept!

Really, the drive to "unify" desktop and tablet is entirely ECONOMIC, not ergometric! Microsoft (with Windows 8) and Canonical (with Unity) want to cash in on the walled-garden model that proved to be such a huge success for Apple's iPhone/iPad. The end. Getting the public to think of the PC/laptop as a "tablet" -- where the tablet (like game consoles of yesteryear) has an established and familiar closed market model, with limited side-loading ability -- is just a marketing strategy to herd people in one of the few huge app-store corrals.

You might think the inability to move the "task bar" from the left edge of the screen in Unity to some other location on the desktop represents some sort of "progress", or that the ridiculous way Unity cycles through open windows on the desktop represents an "improvement" in efficiency, etc. The devs have "tablet fever" because of the CEO writing the Canonical/Microsoft paychecks, and are willfully ignoring the utterly stupid usability blunders made by UI designers pursuing their stupid aesthetic ideas (that "make sense" at a *superficial*/theoretical level, but prove to be horrible in practice).

But, good for you: Unity allegedly increased your productivity somehow. What you install on your computer is your choice.

Re:GNOME 3 rules, you totally owe them an apology (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940963)

What a hoot! Dude, it's not only your nose that is brown, it's all over your face.

Re:GNOME 3 rules, you totally owe them an apology (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41941113)

... you won't miss anything about GNOME 2 ...

What I miss from Gnome 2 is its ability to run smoothly on my chosen hardware. Seriously, I do not want to have to buy a faster machine just to draw some fucking window borders.

Re:GNOME 3 rules, you totally owe them an apology (3, Insightful)

epyT-R (613989) | about a year and a half ago | (#41941127)

1. it's ok to have an opinion
2. it's ok to express that opinion regardless how it impacts others' feelings.
3. free doesn't exempt something from critique

Re:GNOME 3 rules, you totally owe them an apology (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41941159)

History: GNOME 2 was usable (like KDE 3.5). In the past GNOME developers said that they were going to continue on to version 2.32 and then that would become GNOME 3. Then KDE 4 came out, after Windows 7, which was a response to Macintosh getting higher profits and being seen as popular.

Problem is that they are all copying Macintosh because it is highly profitable at the moment, discounting that relatively few people actually use it to get stuff done (due to high profit margins and cool factor for showing off instead of use). If you like it fine, but to most people a usable desktop environment should not have been abandoned (at the whim of developers who do not listen to their users) just because it was "popular" to become more like Macintosh.

Gnome 3 is great (1)

MM-tng (585125) | about a year and a half ago | (#41940803)

I very much like the gnome 3 shell. When I run windows7 because of Autodesk Inventor I continue to press the os key. Which is the awsome feature of gnome 3, zoom out and you see all programs you are running. Why all you people are so negative, I dont get it.

Re:Gnome 3 is great (1)

Kagetsuki (1620613) | about a year and a half ago | (#41940839)

The "official" name of the key is the "Super Key". And yeah the whole multi-mode thing and shell view is awesome.

Re:Gnome 3 is great (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940855)

I've not being paying much attention myself but one central gripe seems to be that Gnome 3 are beginning to require "hardware acceleration" when such support on Linux is poor. If there were several decent graphics hardware manufacturers all providing high quality fully FOSS drivers in a bid to get more sales then there'd be much less of a problem but, as things stand right now, most Linux users that care about the FOSS ideal enough to avoid Nvidia and ATI are having to find another window manager (this typically causes enough upheaval to generate a few bitter comments).

Don't get me wrong, Gnome are fully within their rights to give up on "comprehensive stable desktop environment" and focus instead on visual appeal, but you can see why actively cutting out a large chunk of the long-term loyal user base generates bad feeling.

Re:Gnome 3 is great (1)

epyT-R (613989) | about a year and a half ago | (#41941197)

people like you are common these days. I don't get that. by 'like you' I mean people who define differing opinions or even critical thinking as 'negative' when you don't agree with it and disregard them on that basis. Not only that, but your only defense of gnome3 is a preference for one tiny specific feature? It's sloppy thinking.

Ubuntu GNOME Remix (1)

collet (2632725) | about a year and a half ago | (#41940811)

Really loving the Ubuntu GNOME Remix. I'm still using Gnome fallback with Compiz (the irony) every now and then, but Shell and it's extensions are really catching up to the level of tweak-ablity(?) I like.

World switches from Gnome 3 to anything else. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940831)

Like many others, I switched from KDE to Gnome 2 as soon as it actually became usable several years back.

I still hate KDE for the stupid controls and weird menu things, I still have no idea what they are for.

XFCE is certainly looking good but I am hoping Enlightenment starts to gain traction, all they need to do is include a handful of good themes built in from the get go and Enlightenment would become my primary desktop.

Anything but Unity or Gnome3 their devs must be on another planet to think those are progress.

with this.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940843)

Gnome just announced its dell knell. The developers have now decided that they, not the users, are the ones who are more important when it comes to what goes intp the desktop environment. Sadly this is an issue with most opensource projects that get big. Either the devs get cocky and arrogant and start acting like primadonnas towards the very people that made their project popular, or the attention whores/control freaks jump on board and weasel their way into a project and force their views and visions into the project, and will override everyone else's ideas and ignore complaints, drive their own ideologies, etc. Knowing DAMN FULL WELL that no one is interested in said ideas in the first place, just to foist them upon others.

Re:with this.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41941095)

just rung its death knell. holy hell am I tired.

XFCE (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940847)

I dont know why everyone keeps complaining about gnome. The move they made to develop for tablets has made XFCE awesome. I've seen more progress in XFCE since gnome 3. So I say keep on making a a tablet OS, XFCE will use the apps you create and we will still have a usable desktop.

3d desktop is a waste (4, Insightful)

aglider (2435074) | about a year and a half ago | (#41940891)

Not just of CPU/GPU/WPU cycles.
It's a waste of user attention to the things that matter!
How often in a day do you "enjoy" your 3D desktop with 3D rotating/rolling/whatevering windows and gadgets?
Maybe I'm an outsider, but a have no more than 3 windows on the screen: 1 is the web browser, 1 is a local terminal, 1 is a remote terminal on the development server.
I don't see any need for 3D stuff here.
How many windows do you have in use at the same time? How often you switch among them? How much fun you have in waiting for the fancy 3D stuff to complete?

Re:3d desktop is a waste (1)

jones_supa (887896) | about a year and a half ago | (#41941183)

I think the developers understand this. The craziest eye candy plugins are not usually enabled by default. What you are saying is, like, why use nice-looking clothes when basic utilitarian ones would perform the same task. And even if you had no special effects enabled, it's just nice to do compositing on the GPU.

Re:3d desktop is a waste (1)

aglider (2435074) | about a year and a half ago | (#41941201)

Nope, what I say is: why creating fancy distractions when you struggle to keep the focus on your job? And why doing this while wasting resources?

ill say...fork those dicks (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41940953)

i havent used it because heard everyone bitching about it , then i read about the developers attitudes toward the users from several places with many different examples shown. so it seems to me that the developers are just setting this thing up for themselves, the way they want it. are not supporting even the slightest deviation from thier MASTER PLAN in any way. have removed a lot of the functionality that people used it for, and kinda sorta acted a little bit "dickish" toward anyone questioning their project. i use gnome 2.2 on lucid for work and with a lot of configuration i can get it just like i like it, i have always found fedora much too bloated for daily usage . at home i run slack with xfce or puppy . its sad when a group of developers takes the tools you use and "improves" them to the point where they are unusabe . but to also remove the function to revert back to previous versions, its like they are saying "fuck you, all of you, do it our way or GTFO" now we know how well that is going to fly dont we?maybe they just need to be forked.

Re:ill say...fork those dicks (1)

jonadab (583620) | about a year and a half ago | (#41941087)

It's too late for that. At this point, trying to get Gnome 1.x to compile against modern system libraries would be an exercise in frustration.

Gnome: I never got the hype or the recent rage (4, Interesting)

Qbertino (265505) | about a year and a half ago | (#41940999)

I've never understood the Gnome hype to begin with.

I did like the fact that FOSS has two large desktop kits competing each other - that is a neat luxury - but the hype about Gnome I couldn't understand. The only thing Gnome really had going for it, compared to KDE or generic custom WM setups like a WindowMaker environment, in my opinion, was that you could, back then in 2001, with a litte work, get your desktop look totally different and awesome compared to anything else on the planet. But that was a large part to the relatively hassle-free GTK theming, and not on behalf of Gnome. And the people who did that usually did it using Enlightenment as their main environment as the way better choice anyway. And even without E, in my opinion WM or some default Fluxbox setup allways looks better than a bland and somewhat half-assed Gnome UI.

For the better part of the last decade Nautilus was flaky software in beta stage compared to KDEs Konqueror. Konqueror would kick Nautiluses ass up and down the street in terms of features and usability. It was the best FM on the entire plantet, and probably still is ... although I haven't been keeping up with all the details, changes and redos in the FOSS Desktop world since about 2006 so I couldn't really say. FOSS developers have a tendency to break things just to redo entire core-pieces of code or come up with new projects. ... What was that FM thing for KDE a few years back? Dolphin or something? ... Dunno, didn't care. I just remember thinking: "Oh, great, some guy fucking up Konqueror and thinking he can do better than about a decade of FM projekt work. Great." ...
Anyway, I am now using Gnome (2.something) on debian stable because it is the default and it's still way better than windows, but it does bug me with shit I'd expect not to have to put up with in 2012. The Filemanager (still nautilus? couldn't tell) wets its pants when accessing a dir across samba with the svn extension blocking the FM for minutes. Firefox has rendering errors in the tabs, and while the desktop pager works as expected, as far as I can tell it looks very much the same as it did eleven years ago in 2001. And even then E and WM had pagers at least as good, and you could run and customize them with a few lines of easy configging.

With KDE its a simular thing, althoug I'd say they did (and do) way better with the integrated desktop thing. KDE allways had Windows-style performance hog qualities, but they *did* offer the full Desktop experience. I'd bet that to this very day a well configured KDE is the best GUI on the planet, on a machine that can handle the workload. And yes, I know the Mac, I'm typing this on an MB Air with Snow Leopard. However, it wasn't that the KDE team hadn't also been smoking their share of crack while coding. Some dimwhit back in the 90ies had the brilliant Idea to copy the entire Windows KB shortcuts and make them KDE default, thus fucking with the entire userbase of opinion leaders that actually cared about them: The core FOSS unix crowd. As far as I know it has been that way since then. Granted, rare things are as easy to config as KB shortcuts in KDE, but come on! That's, in my book, at least as bad a markting move as Gnome is doing now with v3. Allthough I have to say that ever since Gnome v3 came about posts about gnome on slashdot have at least trippled. ... Maybe not so bad marketing after all. Gnome is refreshing its mindshare with its moves, that's for sure.

Whatever way you put it, the real anoyances with Linux on the desktop are still the same they were 15 years ago when I started using it, and they have nothing to do with wether the Gnome (or any other desktop or WM) crew has decided to make a paradigm shift or not.

I've seen the screens of Gnome 3, I've installed the newest Ubuntu with Unity on a netbook for my daughter (yes, yes, odd and dumbed down, but it's not the end of the world there are some neat ideas in Unity and the Terminal works as expected. Imagine: I've used Unity and live!) and while there is quite a few things I'd fix before fiddling with new UI concepts, if Gnome thinks they'd rather redo their boring old stacked window UI, power to them.

If I in the future should set up a private Linux workstation I'll probably give E17 a shot. After all, it's been about a decade of work on it, that has to be worth something. Aside from that WM and Fluxbox are still very neat WMs and awesome WM looks very interesting aswell.

Its FOSS people, it's not that there aren't enough choices.

My 2 cents.

Gnome 3.8 (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41941075)

scraps its last users.

Nooo!!! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41941091)

Why?

people still use GNOME? (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41941101)

What is this? 2001?

Free Bitching Loaders (0)

zakeria (1031430) | about a year and a half ago | (#41941153)

I have to laugh out load when I see so many people bitching about getting something for free, and expecting it no matter what, then complaining endlessly when it's taken away from them... I have to wonder how many people on here contributed anything to Gnome over the years or even ANY free software for that matter.

Reworking and maintaining the fallback mode (2)

sl4shd0rk (755837) | about a year and a half ago | (#41941161)

FTFA: "too much of a burden"

Because adding completely new features and redesigning the entire system is so much easier not to mention alienating what little user base you have left. Not to mention this is the exact same reason that drives people to hate proprietary software.

Seriously; thanks go out to all the Gnome developers for their efforts over the years but you guys have really been making some boneheaded decisions.

The most ridiculous Slashdot posting ever? (0)

ajedgar (67399) | about a year and a half ago | (#41941173)

"Star Wars is adolescent nonsense; Close Encounters is obscurantist drivel; Star Trek can turn your brains to puree of bat guano; and the greatest science fiction series of all time is Doctor Who! And I'll take you all on, one-by-one or all in a bunch to back it up!"

As Birdy said:
"It means context sensitive. It's sensitive to context. Try it over there."

Any respectable Linux user (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#41941219)

...has already stopped using GNOME.

Load More Comments
Slashdot Account

Need an Account?

Forgot your password?

Don't worry, we never post anything without your permission.

Submission Text Formatting Tips

We support a small subset of HTML, namely these tags:

  • b
  • i
  • p
  • br
  • a
  • ol
  • ul
  • li
  • dl
  • dt
  • dd
  • em
  • strong
  • tt
  • blockquote
  • div
  • quote
  • ecode

"ecode" can be used for code snippets, for example:

<ecode>    while(1) { do_something(); } </ecode>
Sign up for Slashdot Newsletters
Create a Slashdot Account

Loading...