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Hello, I'm a Mac. And I'm a $248 Win8 PC.

Unknown Lamer posted about a year and a half ago | from the boosting-sales-numbers dept.

Microsoft 642

theodp writes "A little birdie told me which Windows 8 machines would sell out fast. 'Cheep' ones! While no official sales figures have emerged, anecdotal evidence suggests that cheap Windows 8 laptops were a big hit with Black Friday shoppers, leaving some Walmart and Best Buy bargain hunters disappointed at missing out on the sub-$250 deals. So, was the Doctor-Desktop-and-Mister-Metro dual nature of Windows 8 and lack of a touchscreen no big deal to these bargain basement 'Laptop Hunters', or did they not realize what they were buying? Or, as a GeekWire commenter suggests, perhaps they were really just looking to score an ultra-cheap Linux laptop!"

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642 comments

I can assure you... (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42103633)

They have no idea what they purchased, it was a cheap buy and they will be sorely disappointed when it runs like crap a year from now.

Re:I can assure you... (5, Insightful)

deniable (76198) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103699)

At that price, toss it a year from now and buy another.

Re:I can assure you... (5, Insightful)

serviscope_minor (664417) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103703)

it was a cheap buy and they will be sorely disappointed when it runs like crap a year from now.

I know several people who bought very cheap netbooks and were very happy with them for a number of years. Heck, I still use my ageing eee 900 daily.

Cheap doesn't mean bad or badly built. Not everyone needs a 64 processor monster to surf the web.

Re:I can assure you... (5, Funny)

wisty (1335733) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103843)

What Moore giveth, HTML5 taketh away.

Re:I can assure you... (5, Funny)

symbolset (646467) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103925)

The phrase is: "What Intel giveth, Microsoft taketh away."

Re:I can assure you... (5, Insightful)

mystikkman (1487801) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103967)

Not true since Vista. Slashdot is full of folks who've last used Windows more than 10 years ago and thus complain of things like bluescreens, bloat etc. which makes them look like idiots.

Get with the times and at least update your hate machine.

Re:I can assure you... (-1)

symbolset (646467) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104001)

Microsoft is still peopled mostly by people who don't know how to write good code, and managers who don't know good code when they see it. Not only has that not changed: it is not going to change. The organization is not, and has never been about getting the code right. It's about pushing the product, making it standard, preventing people from choosing something else through various traps. Some few 'softies are proud of their work and should be: but they are the exception, not the rule.

Your objection can't take away the fact that this really is the rule: "What Intel giveth, Microsoft taketh away." The rule is not just about performance - it's also about freedom to use your own data.

Re:I can assure you... (3, Interesting)

mystikkman (1487801) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104071)

Your objection can't take away the fact that this really is the rule: "What Intel giveth, Microsoft taketh away." The rule is not just about performance - it's also about freedom to use your own data.

Even with all your rant about your deep knowledge of MS, the fact remains that my 6 year old AMD Dell HTPC(a hand me down from work) that originally came with Vista speeded up quite a bit with Windows 7 and then even more with Windows 8. All this only one 1 gig of RAM but I upgraded it to 2 after getting a stick free from work. It boots faster, plays 1080p videos out of the box, even Divx/Xvid avi files and mp4 files, so I don't see the point about taking away the freedom to use my own data.

As I said, get real with your criticisms and perhaps actually use a Vista era machine with Windows 8 before spouting some armchair speculation nonsense about people/managers at Microsoft or whatever as if you're an insider. Which kind of own data is Microsoft preventing you from using or locking you out from on Windows?

Re:I can assure you... (2, Interesting)

hairyfeet (841228) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104145)

Oh lord, did you REALLY just do the Braveheart "They can't take away our FREEDUM!" bit? Seriously?

And frankly Win 7 runs great even on low power devices, I have an E350 netbook and it is pretty damned snappy with win 7, I can even plug it into an HDTV and watch full 1080P. And while I fricking HATE the Metro UI even I'll admit they have made the underlying OS faster, it boots faster, uses less memory (thanks to killing Aero, which is the first thing i do on a Win 7 build) its just a damned shame that they had to wrap it up in a "LOL I Iz A Cellphone LOL" UI.

But to say that MSFT can't write a good OS is just the height of arrogance, its elitist horseshit to make little nerds feel good about themselves by ignoring the fact that there are literally hundreds of millions of Windows installs out there and you know what? people are happy with them, it does what they want it to do.

Re:I can assure you... (2)

ByOhTek (1181381) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104011)

s/vista/2000/

Actually in the upgrade list from Windows 2000 to 7, Vista is the one I'd exclude (I'm tempted to exclude Windows 8 due to the added UI fuckups as well, but 3rd party apps seem to fix those).

Re: I can assure you... (3, Insightful)

PixetaledPikachu (1007305) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104003)

More like symantec/McAfee/Avira take away. Windows on it's own is fine. But combined with antivirus software, it's crap.Worse, you can't leave windows box without antivirus, so you're screwed

Re: I can assure you... (-1)

symbolset (646467) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104049)

By providing the sugar that the malware yeast feasts upon, Microsoft is responsible. You cannot run Windows without antivirus/antimalware now - and yet the devices we buy ship with software horrors beyond imagining: Both Norton and McAffee. If you give birth to the monster and suckle it, and feed it until it grows into Grendel, then Grendel is your fault. By providing ample opportunities for exploits Microsoft is responsible for the multibillion dollar malware industry that exploits users of their ware.

Re: I can assure you... (4, Informative)

LordLimecat (1103839) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104123)

For the last 4 years or so, the viruses have been exploiting browser plugins. That would be the collective faults of Sun, Oracle, and Adobe.

Re: I can assure you... (-1, Flamebait)

zephvark (1812804) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104147)

> You cannot run Windows without antivirus/antimalware now

News to me. Have you been surfing deviant porn sites again? You pretty much have to be a moron to need AV code on your machine. I recommend it for my step-mom, of course, the old darling is barely qualified to run a toaster. It's just lucky that she can't fit her head into one. But for most of us, AV software is more dangerous than getting a virus. You can be pretty sure you won't get a virus. You can be fairly sure the AV software will slow down your machine drastically, and occasionally decide to delete the operating system.

Re: I can assure you... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42104103)

That's not true. I haven't run a virus scanner in years and I've done just fine.

The trick is to stop them at the source: adblock, flashblock, noscript. Combine that with not downloading stupid stuff and you are reasonably safe.

Re: I can assure you... (0)

LordLimecat (1103839) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104109)

The idea that Windows HAS to have AV and Macs are fine without is an idea I find, frankly, hillarious. Why, do tell, is OSX immune to zero-days?

Re:I can assure you... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42103853)

Just wait a few years. The way websites are being designed, you just know you'll need that kind of processing power. (Semi-joking.)

What operating system do you use with your Eee PC 900? Space is a limitation for someone I know, and without buying a new internal drive, do you have any recommendations on a good OS choice?

Re:I can assure you... (1)

serviscope_minor (664417) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103999)

What operating system do you use with your Eee PC 900?

I use Arch. I've started using it more and more, slowly replacing my ubuntu machines.

Funny thing is that it's quite an old install and I've avoided switching to systemd or any of that bullshit. Because the boot scripts aren't written by monkeys on crack, my eee 900 boots way faster to the desktop than my quad core i7 (with faster SSD) laptop.

People keep inventing technical ways to get around the fact that they suck at writing boot scripts. The trouble is that they tend to write equally sucky ones under systemd/upstart as they did under sysvinit.

Anyway, it's decently usable. I run firefox happily, it can compile code just fine and even do some editing in the gimp of even quite large photos.

My nine year old P4 (3, Interesting)

rvw (755107) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103893)

it was a cheap buy and they will be sorely disappointed when it runs like crap a year from now.

I know several people who bought very cheap netbooks and were very happy with them for a number of years. Heck, I still use my ageing eee 900 daily.

Cheap doesn't mean bad or badly built. Not everyone needs a 64 processor monster to surf the web.

At home I have a nine year old Dell P4 that was average at the time. It runs Ubuntu 12.04 now, serves as backup host and for my scanning project, batch scanning my slide collection. Browsing the internet is not a problem. Yes it's a lot slower, but still acceptable. Converting a 500 MB DNG image to JPEG takes 5 minutes, but who cares if it's a batch job. I added 3GB RAM and a new videocard four years ago, and just added a 4TB drive. If necessary I can start Virtualbox with XP and run Photoshop and Illustrator CS4 inside. For not too extreme images, it's OK, although that can be sluggish.

Re:I can assure you... (0)

hairyfeet (841228) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104095)

Except they are NOT selling "cheap but good" like the EEE (I have one myself, a 1215B that is a couple of years old now, runs great) but instead "cheap and shit" like jamming desktop chips into laptops, garbage fans, just total crap.

In fact if you kept up with the BF sales there wasn't a SINGLE netbook in the bunch, they were all crap 15 inchers. The one I had to laugh the hardest at was the one where they stuffed an AMD C series (a VERY weak chip that is designed for 10-12 inchers) into a fricking 15.6 inch laptop, complete with DVD burner! Yeah like you are gonna be making DVD movies on a Bobcat with a top speed of 1.3Ghz.

So I would agree completely if they had been selling netbooks, when you have a 10-12 inch screen at 1366x768 frankly you can have a weak chip and still do decently, heck my EEE even does 1080P over HDMI as long as that is ALL its doing, but the chips they were stuffing into these full sized laptops just were just not made to do what they have them doing..

Re:I can assure you... (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42103747)

They have no idea what they purchased, it was a cheap buy and they will be sorely disappointed when it runs like crap a year from now.

Well, Win8 is more effective than Win7 on low-end hardware (lower memory and process footprint, optimized performance), and supposedly much better at keeping system fresh, not degrading (but let's wait and see on that one). But regardless, some of these "cheap" PCs are actually impressingly powerful, compared to what a more mid-priced PC would be just a year ago. Just look at the specs linked. To get that much for that low price is impressive. It seems that the main drawback going this low on price isn't as much performance and specs, as it is bulk and weight.

Re:I can assure you... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42103773)

I can assure you that you're an idiot. I need neither the newest nor the best, which means I rarely buy either. But if I saw a good offer for something cheap which does the job, I'd get it.

Sitting here on a Samsung NC10 netbook which I bought second hand from a friend for ~$100 and which is my main walkabout machine.

Re:I can assure you... (1)

beelsebob (529313) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104159)

I can assure you, that when you bought something that was cheap and did the job, you wouldn't be buying the machines talked about here.

We're talking about crappy 15" laptops made out of cheese and string, with 1366x768 displays and 1.3Ghz bobcat CPUs. The typical lifespan of these machines is:
1) OEM installs 50-100 bits of crapware.
2) Person with no computer knowledge sees $249 price tag.
3) The machine is margionally faster than their last $249 craptop with 100 bits of crapware on it, because it's not got crapware *and* IE toolbars and shit on it yet.
4) Slowly but surely the user puts junk on it.
5) 3 months later, the battery now lasts 43 minutes, or 12 if you do anything on it.
6) 6 months to 1 year later, the user decides they want to play a very basic game like WoW on lowest detail settings
7) The CPU overheats and cooks it due to inadequate cooling setup.
8) User goes out and buys another $249 craptop, rather than actually consulting on what's worth buying.

Re:I can assure you... (4, Insightful)

slim (1652) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103975)

Every couple of years, my parents ask for help buying a laptop. I tell them to just go to a PC World-type shop and pick out one with a screen size they're comfortable with, that feels solid enough from a build quality perspective. They don't want to compile kernels or play Crysis; they want to run Word and a browser. So I know anything in the shop will do what they need for a couple of years at least.

A comment on Geekwire? (3, Insightful)

mystikkman (1487801) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103987)

WTF? Slashdot is referencing a comment on Geekwire as a basis for people installing Linux? How low can it go? Idiot submitters like theodp and symbolset are turning Slashdot into a anti-Microsoft tabloid rather than any place for serious discussion. Not surprising that people with half a brain are ditching Slashdot in droves in disgust.

Re:I can assure you... (0)

hairyfeet (841228) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104037)

No shit, you know how many of those damned things i have thrown in the garbage over the years at the shop? its ALWAYS the same, either they put a desktop chip in a laptop (no shit, I've seen DESKTOP Athlons and Celerons stuffed into a crap laptop) or they put a shit fan, but either way the POS cooks so i end up having to convert the drive into an external and pick them up something that is actually usable.

So please warn those around you to stay FAR away from these piles of shit. If they truly have NO money and want something cheap? get an off lease or a refurb, hell you can get a netbook for less than $150 at Cowboom [cowboom.com] and at least they won't roast and fall apart in a month.

I got one! (0, Troll)

artisan1 (2782565) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103635)

There was so many people around but I managed to get one! Wohoo! It's great!

Re:I got one! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42103673)

New user, first and only post is pro MS = Shill

We're not stupid you know

Re:I got one! (0, Troll)

artisan1 (2782565) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103681)

There was so many people around but I managed to troll one! Wohoo! It's great!

Re:I got one! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42103685)

As opposed to the rest of you Apple loving trolls who will back the person up just fine if their first post happens to be about how great the latest Mac/iShit is. Get real, not everyone is out to ruin your thread.

Re:I got one! (1)

sosume (680416) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103971)

Paranoid much? Watch out, they're probably all out to get you!
On a related note, TFA is extremely biased and anti-Windows.
Conclusion, you are the actual pro-Apple shill. We're not stupid you know.

Re:I got one! (0)

ByOhTek (1181381) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104083)

Reads more like Sarcasm.

Get over your paranoid delusions. The only thing I could see using Windows 8 for is an x86 tablet (which, lets face it, have been horribly expensive and underpowered since their inception in the WinXP years - so not really worth it even then). The effort to get a good desktop setup is annoying, and you don't really gain anything over Windows 7, and with RT you have the worst tablet on the market. Microsoft's only hope with Windows 8 is to reintroduce some of the useful things they took away for 'not-metro'-ui, and, more importantly, find some way to get a decent sub $1000 x86 tablet on the market.

Cheap windows 8... (-1, Redundant)

ruir (2709173) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103641)

A turd is a turd, I wouldnt touch it even for free. Think about TCO and ROI. I used my Mac for more than a year at my job until they actually bought one "for me".

Re:Cheap windows 8... (4, Insightful)

serviscope_minor (664417) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103723)

A turd is a turd, I wouldnt touch it even for free. Think about TCO and ROI. I used my Mac for more than a year at my job until they actually bought one "for me".

Well yeah, but the underlying hardware might be decent enough. If that's the case then you can put Linux have the best of both worlds: cheap hardware and an excellent OS.

Re:Cheap windows 8... (5, Insightful)

ruir (2709173) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103831)

If it worth the effort dealing with hardware, UEFI, lack of support for Linux, hacking and the overall inconsistency (yet), of the several Linux desktops /: I use and hack Linux servers/and in virtual infra-structures (aka cloud for PHBs), but cant bother to have Linux for my desktop. Time is money.

Re:Cheap windows 8... (1)

wisty (1335733) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103855)

A Linux VM can be a wonderful dev "box". Lots of tools just an apt-get away. But yes, it can be torture trying to get it to on (say) an old Atom netbook with Intel graphics. For some reason, I couldn't get it to recognise the graphics chip as legit :/

Re:Cheap windows 8... (4, Informative)

r1348 (2567295) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103913)

That's because Atoms use a licenced PowerVR graphic core from Imagination Technology that provided a binary-only linux driver, and it sucked hard.
Later kernels have the gma500 driver that provides at least basic functionality on those turds.

Re:Cheap windows 8... (2)

Rufty (37223) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104133)

Just spent a weekend linuxing one of these - a Samsung NC110p with (I think) GMA3600. Linux Mint 13, after updates and reboots, now goes quite nicely. Uses the cedarview packages, fwiw.

Re:Cheap windows 8... (1)

serviscope_minor (664417) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103981)

But yes, it can be torture trying to get it to on (say) an old Atom netbook with Intel graphics.

On Intel's own graphics, Linux works fantastically well.

That netbook must have had one of those wretched PowerVR derived ones.

Intel releaed them then basically shat on all the users with poor drivers. The Windows drivers were terrible and badly supported, the Linux ones were even worse.

I had a project a while back which involved using a Toughbook CF-U1 (a super hardened macine for which there is basically no substitute). My team (Linux) had terrible trouble. The other team (Windows) didn't fare much better. Intel's OEM customers must have been furious after developing products based on that chipset and essentially being handed a huge, steaming turd for their troubles.

Eventually the Windows drivers stabilised and stopped crashing at the slightest provocation. They were still flakey, but one could ifnd a subset of things to avoid to prevent hard locks or reboots. But the performance went way down with the lack of crashing and it didn't come any where near the performance that it was supposed to, or the crash happy performance.

Its not the 1990's (1)

tuppe666 (904118) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104017)

A Linux VM can be a wonderful dev "box". Lots of tools just an apt-get away. But yes, it can be torture trying to get it to on (say) an old Atom netbook with Intel graphics. For some reason, I couldn't get it to recognise the graphics chip as legit :/

I'm quite surprised that someone would be brave enough to make this comment today. What your saying is not just untrue, Linux has dedicated distributions just for Netbooks, and light Linux ones too. If for some reason you still need to force the "intel" driver. There are many ways to achieve this (forcing the intel driver with an /etc/X11/xorg.conf, removing the xserver-xorg-video-modesetting and/or xserver-xorg-video-fbdev, but if your capable of running a VM you are more than capable of these solutions. I have a slew of expensive hardware that won't work with Windows7 including scanners and wireless adapters...and several computers. Linux has a whole host of problems...hardware support isn't one of them.

Re:Cheap windows 8... (4, Insightful)

serviscope_minor (664417) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103959)

, but cant bother to have Linux for my desktop. Time is money.

When it comes to installing all the programs I need, keeping security up to date, making sure all the tools run well together, making sure my development environment has access to the libraries I need etc, I can't be bothered with anything but Linux for the desktop. Time is money.

and the overall inconsistency (yet), of the several Linux desktops /

Overall inconsistency? Surely you jest? My window manager config is not much changed from the late 90's. I've not had to adapt to new and more poorly functioning (I've tried, but always revert) desktop environment in a decade and a half.

Linux is the only system that has provided any degree consistency over all these years. Heck, the Window decorations bear much more similarity to pre Window-95 than to 95 and after.

Oh and because of the flexibility of X11, I can configure my window manager to beat poorly behaving applications into submission so thay they behave consistently with the rest of the system. This is some not generally possible on the less good operating systems: if an application programmer thinks they know better you have to put up with their poor decisions. (And now the Wayland folks are trying to bring that to Linux. But that's another rant.)

I haven't even had to give up compositing support. FVWM works side by side with any of the xcompmgr derivatives. I played with drop shadows and transparency and animations a bit for fun, then disabled them because I found they intefere with work.

So actually, if you look at it from another point of view, Linux, or specifically X11, offers a far more consistent user interface than the other operating systems.

Time is money.

Yes and no. I use Linux for two reasons. Firstly it's much more efficient. Secondly it's much, much more pleasant to use. I avoid jobs where I have to use Windows for the same reason I avoid jobs which involve being repeatedly jabbed with pointy sticks. Sure the jobs might pay well, but why do something I disklike?

Time is more than money. You only get time once.

Re:Cheap windows 8... (2)

LordLimecat (1103839) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104143)

I love seeing posts like these where someone explains how great, easy, and trouble free their custom config of Linux is, but not where said distro can be downloaded on ISO.

Yes, I know Linux is wonderful if you spend 50 hours getting everything just right (I had to do it many times in the course of upgrading through the Ubuntu line), I just dont have that kind of time anymore.

Re:what?? (1)

miknix (1047580) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104039)

but cant bother to have Linux for my desktop. Time is money.

Are you kidding? Tell that to my windows 7 installation that spends more than 20 minutes in endless updates and reboots, every single time I turn it on.

Re:what?? (1)

LordLimecat (1103839) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104165)

Endless reboots=youre doing it wrong.

Also, IIRC, with Windows it only interrupts the process (cleanly) if you do a reboot as its downloading / applying updates. As I remember, doing so on Linux tends to mess things up. (dont you have to run dpkg-clean or some such after interrupting the apt process?)

Re:Cheap windows 8... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42104055)

All normal hardware I need when working has been working out of the box with Ubuntu on almost all computers we've installed the last couple of years.

A quick install of the ION3 (now NotION) WM and putting the configuration files in place, and I have a heavily customised workstation which doesn't change in respect to how I have to work with it. That saves me a lot of time, and up productivity quite a bit since my environment doesn't change.

Yes, time is money, so I can't be bothered with Windows, where I would have to change a lot of settings and preferences manually, having to find drivers after reinstallation (too much crapware in any installation these days to be usable), etc. We have quite a few at work which still prefers WinXP, as they're too busy to learn to work fluently in Win7 and Win8.

Re:Cheap windows 8... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42104073)

Hmm... exactly because time is money, you should use Linux. I don't have any problems here at work. Everyone around me is using Windows and much of the time is gone because they spend it on their operating system weirdness.

And me... I have so much time left, I can even comment on Slashdot... while waiting for lunch time. :)

Re:Cheap windows 8... (3, Funny)

sosume (680416) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103989)

Same for me. I've had to use my own Porsche for months on the job now, my boss just refuses to buy me a decent car! I just won't touch that Prius they bought me, a turd is a turd and I wouldn't feel safe driving it. SO I have requested all employees to recieve only Porsche company cars from now on, that will increase speed, efficiency and therefore save a lot of money.

Re:Cheap windows 8... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42104091)

So... You'd rather have an expensive, well-marketed turd focused on keeping customers through cognitive dissonance than a cheap turd... Got it.

My counter-anecdotal would be that I have A Windows PC, a FreeBSD PC and a Mac at home. The first two are up almost 24/7 (the FreeBSD machine is a server, but I still log into it a couple times a month to do my banking). After the first few months of using the Mac instead of the PC, it only gets booted a few times a year.

I really hope.... (2)

metalmaster (1005171) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103645)

I haven't played with Windows 8 out of the box, but I really hope there aren't first boot tutorials that showcase touch capabilities

Re:I really hope.... (5, Informative)

mdsharpe (1051460) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103739)

The first boot tutorial shows mouse gestures or touch gestures or both, depending on the machine's capabilities.

Re:I really hope.... (5, Insightful)

rikkards (98006) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103753)

There isn't (well not a normal desktop). There is a tutorial about Metro when you first log in.

I was hugely skeptical about 8 and installed it on a spare machine the wife will be using. I have probably put about 5 hours in of just playing around and to be honest it is surprisingly easy to get used to and not bad to work with. The Windows key is definitely your friend. I was thinking you would need touch as well before but it works fine without. There is still a couple areas where I question but I wouldn't necessarily reimage a machine back to 7 if it had 8 at this point.

Re:I really hope.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42103791)

+1

The system is pretty good also without touch. I like the smartphone -styled live tiles you can jump into and see everything useful with a first glance. Then just switch back to oldskool -style windows and continue working.

I bought it just for fun because update was 29€ and now I am considering updating my main pc too. It doesn't help at all that I have wacom connected to it....

Re:I really hope.... (1)

LordLimecat (1103839) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104169)

I take the leap on Weds. I hope youre right, but till then Im saving up a healthy supply of loathing to last me the next several months with Metro.

Re:I really hope.... (2)

Balthisar (649688) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103757)

In installed Windows 8 on three machines this past weekend. There's no tutorial, but while it's finishing its install there are instructions that tell you to move the mouse to any of the four corners of the screen. In all three cases, it seemed to know it was running on a non-touch device.

Re:I really hope.... (-1, Troll)

Joce640k (829181) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103823)

In installed Windows 8 on three machines this past weekend.

Why?

Re:I really hope.... (2)

mr_gorkajuice (1347383) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103845)

Why not?

Re:I really hope.... (4, Interesting)

Balthisar (649688) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103903)

Two were HTPC front-ends for Plex (a Zotac MAG and a Zotac ZBox). Win8 is reportedly less resource hungry than Win7, so on those little Atom nettops, it seemed like a good way to get a performance boost. Although given that all they do is run Plex, performance wasn't really an issue anyway. Chalk these up to "new toy," then. (No Windows key over VNC kind of sucks, though.)

The third was a VM install, which I mostly need for EveMon, OneNote, and Access (no Mac versions). Given my use, Win8 isn't as bad as a lot of other people seem to indicate; it doesn't take too long to get used to. I've always been a keyboard shortcutter anyway, and the stupid menus are only stupid if you have to use a mouse. I miss alt-v-d in the "File Explorer" (né "Windows Explorer") though.

Maybe (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42103657)

People aren't buying "Windows 8" PCs, they are buying "cheap" PCs that, as an amazing coincidence, come preinstalled with the latest version of Windows (which is... Windows 8)

What's the point of this article, and why the comparison with Apple?

Re:Maybe (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42103687)

What's the point of 99% of the complete shit that theodp submits?

Re:Maybe (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42103705)

Truer words never spoken.

Re:Maybe (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42103745)

what is the point of you commenting on such skite whilst also being an anonymous coward? I figure you a fan boi of crapple otherwise your mouth would not have opined! And if not a fan boi you would have included your name. Yes opined is spelled correctly as i meant it as its definition. Look it up as i know you crapple users are simpletons. I am a linux and bsd user btw.

I also love windows xp and no other windows.

Re:Maybe (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42103793)

*opens box marked "TROLL FOOD"*

what is the point of you commenting on such skite whilst also being an anonymous coward? I figure you a fan boi of crapple otherwise your mouth would not have opined! And if not a fan boi you would have included your name. Yes opined is spelled correctly as i meant it as its definition. Look it up as i know you crapple users are simpletons. I am a linux and bsd user btw.

I also love windows xp and no other windows.

Win2k is the shit; Windows XP was a superfluous and mildly sucky revamp (remember they brought in the godsawful fisherprice theme "luna" and fragmented the network config stuff between "home" and "professional" versions) that gets remembered over-fondly by losers who cheaped out and used 95, 98, and ME instead of NT and 2K, just because it was their first taste of a real OS (i.e. NT), not DOS with a strap-on.

Re:Maybe (1)

somersault (912633) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103859)

Actually I used 2K for a while and still thought XP was decent. Of course, I've always used XP Pro at home and work. If you don't like the theme, you can switch back to boxy windows if you want. I actually use the Zune theme on my XP VM. It's a nice grey and orange style. Reminds me of Half-Life I guess.

Now I use Windows 7 Pro at work. Think I have Home Premium at home, it does the job fine.

Re:Maybe (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42103839)

>what is the point of you commenting on such skite whilst also being an anonymous coward?

You tell me, you piece of shit anonymous coward.

Re:Maybe (1)

ipquickly (1562169) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103691)

Sarcasm in the title?

Re:Maybe (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42103733)

The perfect story for slashdot. A bit of MS bashing that can be followed up by how great a cheap pc is once you put linux on it and a chance to slag off apple for their cost. It's Click bait pure and simple

Re:Maybe (3, Interesting)

captainpanic (1173915) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103781)

I did just that: bought a cheap laptop which had windows. Then I created a bootable linux mint usb, and installed it. It runs like a charm. :)
So, my purchase was just the PC, and definitely not windows 8.

I have to say that Microsoft have a pretty sweet deal that they get paid for that. I would have bought the laptop if it came pre-installed with DOS 5.0 too - as I would have installed Linux anyway. It seems that the only way not to pay for windows is when you build your own desktop computer.

Re:Maybe (1)

mwvdlee (775178) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103923)

Offtopic, but having only just switched from Vista to Ubuntu 12.04 for the simple reason that MS seems to be abandoning professional users and I'd rather switch now than be forced to in a few years. What are the major differences between Mint over Ubuntu other than the obvious benefit of having a classic desktop GUI. Changes in the directory structure? Driver support? Packages available? etc? And would it be easy to switch to Mint (and possibly back) without having to reinstall anything? I just can't seem to find any practical comparison between the two distro's.

Re:Maybe (1)

scarlac (768893) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103841)

What's the point of this article, and why the comparison with Apple?

The answer is quite simply: http://adage.com/article/digital/mac-pc-battle-microsoft-winning-perception/136731/ [adage.com] (as linked in the summary) Title being: "In Mac vs. PC Battle, Microsoft Winning in Value Perception" which pretty much sums up the comparison to Apple.

TFA basically claims that Microsoft is winning ground in the popularity contest which makes the price tag seem more appealing.

I personally don't agree, as many others point out in here, (the majority of) people look at the price tag first and don't understand the difference from Windows 7 to 8. They just need something that works, and all they know is that others buy PCs.

Re:Maybe (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42103955)

Stop making sense! it's slashot ... the ravenous MS hating Apple loving one-eyed hangout spot for the geek that isn't really a geek because they thrive on the simplicity of using machines contrived by idiots for idiots.

http://www.valuewalk.com/2012/11/apple-inc-aapl-may-have-climbed-to-the-top-of-the-tree/ [valuewalk.com] = First it was 1T then it was 700B and now ... now its 675B :)

There is only one way now for this company and it's down.... BTW I keep seeing people on the street with iPhone 4GS. Did anyone actually manage to pick up a 5 yet? Not that I could tell the difference between the two devices I actually had to ask them what they had because at a glance you can't tell the two apart (unless you're a gay Apple loser).

Boot from usb. (4, Insightful)

ipquickly (1562169) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103683)

They work fine, once you put an operating system on them.

Re:Boot from usb. (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42103805)

What a fucking surprise. Linux troll gets modded up.

Re:Boot from usb. (3, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42104019)

Put the chair down.

Re:Boot from usb. (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42103849)

They work fine, once you put an operating system on them.

Exactly how I see it.

Perhaps they're so cheap because they come with windows 8, and the cheap price is compensation for the end user having to install a real operating system?

No news here (1)

BumpyCarrot (775949) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103761)

The summary ascribes far more intelligence than is present in people who buy "rock bottom" priced computers. They're only more intelligent than the person they sell it on to.

Windows 8 is a fail (5, Interesting)

ShakaUVM (157947) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103829)

Earlier today, the entire chess club surrounded one of these new $250 Windows 8 machines. They were all poking at the screen, but while it was changing colors on them, it wasn't responding. (Guess what guys? That's not a touchscreen. Those colors are what you get when you poke a normal LCD display.) They were convinced that all Windows 8 machines had touchscreens, though, and so they never used the touchpad.

And then they tried shutting it down. I was mocking them for a while, as an entire chess club couldn't figure it out, so then they passed it to me and I couldn't figure it out either. Turns out the option to shut it down is hidden behind an invisible menu, hidden behind two other submenus unrelated to shutting things down.

We eventually had to look it up online, as I expect many people will have to do.

It was an interesting case study though, in how fucked up Microsoft made the Metro UI.

Re:Windows 8 is a fail (4, Interesting)

wisty (1335733) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103867)

It's alike an OSX 10.3 (or later) Mac - you don't have to shut it down. Just let it sleep. It'll run rock solid for months. A restart is an advanced trouble-shooting technique.

Re:Windows 8 is a fail (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42104081)

It's alike an OSX 10.3 (or later) Mac - you don't have to shut it down. Just let it sleep. It'll run rock solid for months. A restart is an advanced trouble-shooting technique.

That's nice but it sounds as if he wanted to shut it down. That doesn't seem like an extravagant desire, even if he doesn't "have to".

Re:Windows 8 is a fail (1)

jbeaupre (752124) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104097)

Ok, this is going to be even more off topic, but here goes: Is sleep mode acceptable on an airplane during take offs and landings? Searching the internet, I can't find any answers. I really don't care one way or another, but travel quite a bit and am curious.

Re:Windows 8 is a fail (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42104161)

For you: no, you must shutdown your laptop. Everyone else can just put their laptop to sleep mode like they've been doing for over ten years.

Re:Windows 8 is a fail (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42103899)

alt+f4 works fine when shutting windows 8 ;)

Re:Windows 8 is a fail (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42104051)

Now how would you expect an entire chess club to know about something that has been around for ages?

Re:Windows 8 is a fail (1)

staltz (2782655) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104043)

The problems come from the fact that Microsoft is introducing too radical changes too suddenly. They should have more iterations and many small updates to Windows, rather than big leaps. Facebook is constantly changing their layout, and some UI could be considered "hidden". But its fine because they teach it to users in small iterations, while simultaneously learning what went wrong.

Windows 8 is actually a proof of how failed the Waterfall style of software engineering is. The ideas in Windows 8 are not so bad, but every innovation must be first tested with people. I mean, long ago with the Consumer Preview they should have learned the obvious and fixed all the shit. But they decided to ship it instead.

This could be their new motto: "shit it then ship it".

Comes Boxing Day (0)

some old guy (674482) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103873)

You're likely to see a rush of returns and exchanges, for an anything-but-this-thing alternative. Which, of course, will not against total Win8 sales/installs for marketing fodder. Such is the Windows Experience.

Cheap? (4, Informative)

symbolset (646467) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103875)

If they wanted a cheap netbook to put Linux on, Google is selling Acer's Intel-based dual-core 64bit VT-enabled chromebook with 2GB RAM and a 320GB HDD for $200.

Great Value (4, Interesting)

tuppe666 (904118) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103969)

If they wanted a cheap netbook to put Linux on, Google is selling Acer's Intel-based dual-core 64bit VT-enabled chromebook with 2GB RAM and a 320GB HDD for $200.

I noticed this too. They do seem incredibly good value. I have no idea why Google are not pushing them more. The deal is also unfortunately US centric. I did notice that Google is planning on launching a touchscreen version, which hopefully would bring me Ubuntu with Androids in a virtual machine.

Re:Great Value (1)

symbolset (646467) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104013)

This late in the season for a launch it's likely there is not a lot of this product in the pipeline. Advertising products you can't deliver is stupid - a waste of effort.

Re:Cheap? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42104023)

Chromebooks are a total fail. They sold about as much as the Kin.

http://www.zdnet.com/chromebook-looks-like-another-googleflop-4010024772/ [zdnet.com]

Re:Cheap? (1)

symbolset (646467) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104141)

The Kin sold at last report 300 units globally in six weeks. And Microsoft bought most of those back. That's for both models of the KIN. I wish I had thought to buy one for the collectible value.

I was recommending the Acer Chromebook for certain folk who might want to put Linux on it - and it's great for that. It might be interesting on its own. The thing is only released a few days ago, and hasn't had enough time to achieve KIN levels of fail. Regardless, specifically referencing my post, the hardware is well worth the price and amenable to considerable utility beyond the manufacturers intent. Maybe it's nice as the manufacturer intended too, but I wasn't pushing that. Certainly Acer is going to have to step up the build quality to get my business.

You guys from Microsoft's marketing team probably shouldn't bring up the KIN with me since I was actually the guy [slashdot.org] who took the story of its failure viral. [reddit.com] Pushing this issue with me is not how you succeed in your mission and it has certain extreme risks.

I should think that there would be something on your corkboard that says: "symbolset: Do NOT engage with this person even AC! Termination offense!" Certainly if I was leading your effort I would post that there given the history of how these efforts have worked out over the last ten years.

Bought a $298 Gateway A8. Windows 8 lasted 15mins (2)

zonyln (2782609) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103941)

I bought a $298 Gateway nV series with Windows 8 preinstalled. I played with it painfully for 15 minutes then put Ubuntu 12.10 (KDE) on it. I was amazed to see all of the bloatware still there in tile form. The charm interface is incredibly painful with a touchpad and even more so cause it was a Gateway touchpad which is painful to use in any regular desktop OS.

Re:Bought a $298 Gateway A8. Windows 8 lasted 15mi (-1, Troll)

mystikkman (1487801) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104027)

Thanks for the standard, karmawhoring typical Slashdot drivel.

Let's nip this one in the bud (5, Informative)

Flipao (903929) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103973)

The Laptop Hunters campaign is almost 4 years old, and completely irrelevant in this day and age when we're talking about perception of value, it costs just over $300 to buy into Apple's ecosystem and even less to buy into Google's..

I find it interesting that this tidbit was glossed over.

However, the scene wasn’t so rosy for Microsoft at the Mall of America in Minneapolis, where analyst Gene Munster of Piper Jaffray and team observed and tabulated traffic and sales at Microsoft and Apple stores. Microsoft saw 47 percent less foot traffic than the Apple Store did, and far fewer sales — 3.5 items per hour, compared with 17.2 items per hour at the Apple Store, as reported by Fortune’s Philip Elmer-Dewitt. Most of the items purchased from the Microsoft Store were Xbox 360 games. During the two hours that the Piper Jaffray team observed the Microsoft Store, they didn’t see any Microsoft Surface tablets being purchased.

cleanroom supplies (-1, Offtopic)

xmnewstar (2782631) | about a year and a half ago | (#42103977)

we specialized in this field of cleanroom wipers,cleanroom consumable for laptop. www.xmnewstar.com

I will pay (0, Flamebait)

surfcow (169572) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104021)

I will pay an extra $500+
for a well-designed & configured machine.
For a robust, stable OS.
For cheap OS upgrades.
For useful free apps - pages, numbers, etc.
For standards compliance.
For better than average HW, w/ excellent, reliable support.
For a good OBE.
For drivers that work the first time.
For a decent user interface.
For free, professional, in person help in every major city in the world.
For not wasting 200 hrs on configuration.
For a good API & Xcode.
For a useful command-line.
For smart standards & consistently.
For fighting entropy.
For letting me get stuff done quickly.
For a free HW swap within warranty.
For useful online documentation.
For a ridiculous resale value.
For BSD / Unix.
For superior security.

Re:I will pay (2)

mystikkman (1487801) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104031)

I am pretty sure making a few tens of thousands of machines(lets be real about demand for such a device) with the all the above features will cost much much more than the $500+ per each machine you're offering.

Re:I will pay (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42104127)

1. (S)he said $500 extra, so in addition to the $250 that the summary mentions for the shitboxes that TFA is talking about
2. (S)he wouldn't even have to pay $500 more. Only $349 more. [apple.com]

You didn't catch the reference the GP poster was making.

Re:I will pay (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42104085)

So, in short, you'd readily pay for a Mac.

You were robbed :) (0)

tuppe666 (904118) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104155)

I will pay an extra $500+
for a well-designed & configured machine.
For a robust, stable OS.
For cheap OS upgrades.
For useful free apps - pages, numbers, etc.
For standards compliance.
For better than average HW, w/ excellent, reliable support.
For a good OBE.
For drivers that work the first time.
For a decent user interface.
For free, professional, in person help in every major city in the world.
For not wasting 200 hrs on configuration.
For a good API & Xcode.
For a useful command-line.
For smart standards & consistently.
For fighting entropy.
For letting me get stuff done quickly.
For a free HW swap within warranty.
For useful online documentation.
For a ridiculous resale value.
For BSD / Unix.
For superior security.

The irony of having al this by just installed Linux. Seriously what a waste of money.

Simple. Cheap Christmas shopping. (3, Insightful)

mattr (78516) | about a year and a half ago | (#42104119)

SImple. They were buying what they thought was a great deal and the cheapest computer around, as this is the only computer christmas present they could buy while thinking it is a real computer.

So who buys the MS Surface? (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42104157)

People who can afford real laptops buy them, and the rest buy cheap netbooks. So who is the buyer MS has in mind for the $800 Surface with a netbook-size screen? If I have $800, I can get a primo Asus laptop with a big screen and nice specs. If I can't afford a laptop, I can't afford a Surface. I can't figure out Microsoft's target audience, who they think is going to buy the Surface. If I want a status gadget, I'll get a $600 iPad.

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