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Notch Expands On 0x10c, Microsoft and Quantum Computing

timothy posted about 2 years ago | from the and-for-his-next-trick dept.

Microsoft 94

eldavojohn writes "Mojang's Marcus Persson (better known as 'Notch') has answered quite a few questions in an interview with PC Gamer about his new game 0x10c. Since its announcement, there's been very few details about game play aside from the DCPU-16 and art tests. But in this interview, Notch has revealed quite a bit about how the game will function and non-final ideas he has for either a monthly fee to play in a 'multiverse' or micropayments. He talks about a custom OS people are working on to load into the game's CPU as well as a an in-game 3D printer that will allow you to make virtual objects. When asked about Kickstarter and his Oculus dev kit, Notch said 'Definitely going to make it work in 0x10c no matter what' and his account of using the Oculus Rift sounds more than promising for the VR Device. When asked about Linux he said, '[Linux] is wonderful. I think we need to have it, and it's a shame that more people, including myself, don't use it. It's gotten easier and friendlier.' When asked about Microsoft he said, 'I use their OS – Windows 7 is an amazing operating system in my opinion and of course there's the Xbox, which I love. I'm sure Bing is going to take off and save them. [Editor's note: Notch is smiling mischievously as he says this.]'"

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Bing will save us all! (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42133031)

Bing will save us all!

Re:Bing will save us all! (0, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42133137)

That's if Notch's terrible programming skills don't kill us first. Minecraft has become so much more efficient since he let someone else do the programming.

Re:Bing will save us all! (4, Informative)

Dan667 (564390) | about 2 years ago | (#42133583)

being an innovator and a great programmer are not tied together. bing being a shadow of what Google is true though.

Re:Bing will save us all! (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42133627)

Oh yes: Another "armchair QB critic" - written a better game yourself, trolling "big talker" (but no doer)? Anyone can "talk a good game", but it's quite another thing to create it.

Re:Bing will save us all! (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42133977)

Ah, another 'you can't talk shit unless you can do better!'. You don't need to be a world renowned programmer to see that Notch is a bad programmer, just as you don't need a chain of restaurants to know when you're eating a shit sandwich.

Re:Bing will save us all! (2)

AwesomeMcgee (2437070) | about 2 years ago | (#42134719)

Sorry but there are a lot of good programmers out there who know how to write performant code and take one look at the resource requirements of Minecraft and it's general performance and can accurately say they could do better. That's called an expert opinion and it should be valued to an extent. I'm not saying anybody here has had their credentials checked at the door but there are more than enough people out there who have echoed this you have to assume some of them are experienced engineers. And if you need any more proof, I'm an experienced engineer and the resource requirements for what Minecraft is are a joke.

Re:Bing will save us all! (2)

Xest (935314) | about 2 years ago | (#42156867)

It doesn't matter, that doesn't make him a bad programmer - it just means he got something to market.

Believe it or not, writing the most immaculate, high performance code ever produced in the history of the universe can sometimes prevent you ever actually getting anything released.

A lot of programmers don't get this when they make such claims like "Notch is a bad programmer" - no he isn't, he delivered a product that many more people wanted and love than he could have possibly imagined - that's the only metric of the quality of a programmer that matters - that they can deliver a product that their target user base wants and loves. Any other metric is just a jealousy fuelled pissing contest.

I'm sure if Notch decided to enter a "Perfect code" contest, he could do just as well as most people.

Re:Bing will save us all! (1)

AwesomeMcgee (2437070) | about 2 years ago | (#42169327)

If you think "good at programming" means "Get's something to market" you must think there's no difference between a college grad and a 10 year vet and that the best programmer is in fact a marketing person. You sir apparently don't know what the act of "Programming" is, you appear to have it confused with marketing, or, "Bringing things to market which people want", that's basically the definition of marketing. Also why are you sure he could do as well as most people in a "Perfect code" contest when the only example we have is poorly written? Honestly, you have apparantly abandoned all logic in these statements, objectively with one example that is bad you would claim the source could do something great, and you appear to be lacking the definition of either good or programming.

Re:Bing will save us all! (1)

Xest (935314) | about 2 years ago | (#42170059)

So you're saying that someone who produces pristine code of a half-finished and non-working project is a better programmer than someone who produces a slightly rough round the edges bit of code that meets the client's expectations?

A programmer's job is to write some code that fulfils a specific requirement, it doesn't matter how good your code is if you spend all your time writing pretty, but never complete code, you're still worthless relative to the person who has produced not quite so pretty code but that at least fulfils the requirements of the user.

It doesn't matter that the one code example we have from him is bad because writing good code is actually a much easier task than getting something to market a lot of the time. It might even not be a coincidence that the code that we do have is the code that isn't a symbol of perfection because that's kind of the point - if you spend all your time writing perfect code, you may never get it to a point it can be released anyway. God only knows there are billions of started but unfinished projects out there that were never completed because people were too focussed on perfection, and not enough on actually releasing something of worth and indie game dev is absolutely the worst for this. I've seen so many engines abandoned that were designed to be beautiful marvelous architectural masterpieces but that never got finished. Notch got something finished, he got something delivered, that matters above all else, because projects that never get finished are no better than projects that never existed.

Re:Bing will save us all! (1)

AwesomeMcgee (2437070) | about 2 years ago | (#42170915)

I'm not speaking to the value of releasing product, you said he could write great code in a "perfect code" contest, I would say that's ignorant. A junior engineer fresh from college which whips up things quickly and gets them out the door may be a great asset but that doesn't make him a great _programmer_ and it definitely doesn't mean he could win any code competitions. As far as I'm concerned this is all we've seen from Notch as far as coding goes, yes he has a valuable skill; but that skill isn't programming, perhaps it's managing his time or expectations or whatever else, but writing code? Nope.

Re:Bing will save us all! (1)

Xest (935314) | about 2 years ago | (#42171379)

"I'm not speaking to the value of releasing product, you said he could write great code in a "perfect code" contest, I would say that's ignorant"

I didn't say he could, I said "I'm sure he could" which is a figure of speech meaning he probably could. I say he probably could because writing immaculate and optimised code isn't difficult, there's just often little benefit to doing so when compared against the disadvantage of the time lost in doing so. Do you actually have any or much real world programming experience? Getting something delivered is part of programming whether you like it or not.

Most people wouldn't call a plumber a good plumber no matter how immaculate his piping job if he never actually managed to get the job he's tasked with done leaving it half finished and programming should be treated no differently.

I suspect I know where you're coming from, many programmers have a tendancy towards perfectionism, and believe everything should be perfect. This is after all what programmers are taught during their education and so is enforced, but in the real world things aren't quite as simple, you have to balance quality against cost against time and a good programmer will get that balance right to deliver a good product. Notch has done this where many thousands of other indie games programmers failed and to a degree that only a handful of other indie games programmers have ever achieved such as the guys behind Popcap, Angry Birds and so forth.

The issue is that you're projecting your personal view that code quality/optimisation are the only measures of a programmer, that's not fact, that's merely your subjective opinion - you need to see past that and recognise that your view is merely your view. Whilst there are no doubt others that share your opinion, the absolute vast majority of the world's population only care that you deliver them what they want and the metrics you value most are only secondary to them, and that is why I believe it's the only metric that matters, because to most people, that's true. That was my point, and it still stands.

Re:Bing will save us all! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42206857)

Just look at the code. It's awful. It's not just a tradeoff, he's actually a legit terrible programmer.

Re:Bing will save us all! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42135069)

Look at the decompiled code you fucking idiot. It sucks. And it's not because of the decompiler. If you're too incompetent to do this yourself, then yes, let the "armchair QB critics" do it better than you.

Re:Bing will save us all! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42134665)

I agree; but unfortunately, I realize he can't hear our complaints over the sound of all that money funneling into his bank account... :(

Re:Bing will save us all! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42133339)

Is it true that every new MS hire is told to say "Hold on, let me bing that" twenty times in front of the bathroom mirror each morning?

Re:Bing will save us all! (3, Informative)

dj245 (732906) | about 2 years ago | (#42133411)

Everybody laughs at Bing, but their aerial maps and photos are sometimes very good. Better than Google in many cases. Here is an example-

google [google.com]
Bing [binged.it]

That said I only use them for their maps, and only if I need the aerial photo.

Re:Bing will save us all! (2)

CockMonster (886033) | about 2 years ago | (#42133607)

Bing's maps are provided by Nokia

Re:Bing will save us all! (2)

shutdown -p now (807394) | about 2 years ago | (#42134739)

Bing maps are sourced from several different sources, one of them being MapQuest (now a part of Nokia). However, the "bird's eye" view was there long before Nokia provided its data.

You can generally see where any given part of the map came from by observing the copyrights in the lower right corner.

Re:Bing will save us all! (1)

AwesomeMcgee (2437070) | about 2 years ago | (#42134793)

Wrong. I worked on Bing maps for a year. They've bought a couple different companies over the years which provide various services including one that actually made the cameras and does the data processing for what those cameras capture, that's why they have such high quality aerial data compared to google. That's all in-house Microsoft now, that said they still buy some of their mapping data from NavTeq, but not the majority of it.

Re:Bing will save us all! (1)

dunkelfalke (91624) | about 2 years ago | (#42134115)

Thanks, never tried these out before, just found out that the maps also render much faster than these of Google.

Re:Bing will save us all! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42134467)

You filthy terrorist. You're showing everyone where we hide our nukes!!

Re:Bing will save us all! (2)

Cinder6 (894572) | about 2 years ago | (#42134631)

Hey, wait, that's actually impressive. Last I used Bing Maps, the interface was terrible now it's actually good, and the link for getting your current location is much more obvious.

Re:Bing will save us all! (2)

shutdown -p now (807394) | about 2 years ago | (#42134777)

The other Bing service you might want to consider is Bing Shopping. Not because it's awesome, but because Google seriously screwed up by turning its own Shopping search feature into a walled garden, where people have to be specifically posting their products to be listed, for a pay. Bing Shopping still uses the old model of scrubbing various online stores and aggregating data. So if you want to find the place that sells something cheapest, it's usually a far better option.

Then there's also the issue of Google Shopping restricting certain types of products from being listed, e.g. guns and ammo - which doesn't really make sense, since it's just a listing, they don't sell them. One wonders what else might be eventually filtered out.

Re:Bing will save us all! (1)

cheater512 (783349) | about 2 years ago | (#42135911)

Yes that birds eye (45 degree) shot does look clearer than Google.

However Google kicks their butt by a big margin (IMHO) for top down view.
I have no clue how they have clear 45 degree footage but over sharpened rubbish for top down.

Re:Bing will save us all! (1)

dj245 (732906) | about 2 years ago | (#42136091)

Yes that birds eye (45 degree) shot does look clearer than Google.

However Google kicks their butt by a big margin (IMHO) for top down view. I have no clue how they have clear 45 degree footage but over sharpened rubbish for top down.

Some of their imagery is from airplanes. It is fairly obvious which are airplanes and which are satellite. They do some stupid and crude "give it some 3d depth!" processing which ruins the clarity of the sat photos. It can be turned off it you play with the settings.

Mojang? (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42133143)

Notch?
WTF?
BBQ?

Yes - I know I could google these but seriously WTF - TFA reads like some circle jerk post in 4 chan that you need years of inside knowledge just to understand.

Re:Mojang? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42133219)

The company name Mojang is probably from the swedish Mojäng which means "Thingy".

I agree with you on the other stuff though.

Re:Mojang? (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42133261)

Exactly. CPU, OS, VR? What is all this bullshit?

Re:Mojang? (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42133349)

Also, what is "TFA" "Circle Jerk" or a "4 chan".
Funny, you called out TFA for using "WTF" then used it yourself in the same sentence.

Re:Mojang? (3, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42134227)

Circle jerk is what you and your buddies do when you circle up, drop your pants, and jack off.

Re:Mojang? (2)

SleazyRidr (1563649) | about 2 years ago | (#42135033)

+1 Informative.

A Short Explanation (5, Informative)

eldavojohn (898314) | about 2 years ago | (#42133357)

Mojang [wikipedia.org] is a Swedish game company (mojäng is Swedish for gadget) founded by Markus Persson, Jakob Porsér, and Carl Manneh. Persson has embraced his public fame and is a very avid gamer who goes by the tag 'Notch.' Are you still with me here? Good. They made a fairly popular game that has a counter [minecraft.net] claiming 8,176,841 have purchased the game.

Mojang is working on two games: Scrolls and 0x10c. You may remember Scrolls from when Bethesda sued them for the name. This story happens to be about the sparse details on 0x10c. Inside this game there will be a central processing unit emulated called the DCPU-16. You can find more information about that in the link to it but the game will center heavily around the user accomplishing tasks with that.

I am the submitter of this story and didn't think it was necessary to clutter the summary with the above information.

Yes - I know I could google these but seriously WTF - TFA reads like some circle jerk post in 4 chan that you need years of inside knowledge just to understand.

I don't think you read either the summary or the fucking article. The very first thing I wrote in the summary establishes who Notch is. The article talks about all the above -- no reason to Google, just click on the links I embedded in the summary.

Re:A Short Explanation (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42133811)

I don't think you read either the summary or the fucking article. The very first thing I wrote in the summary establishes who Notch is. The article talks about all the above -- no reason to Google, just click on the links I embedded in the summary.

Now why would I want to read the fine article? - You must be new here..

Re:A Short Explanation (0, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42134147)

Thanks for the 'fucking' explanation eldavojohn - while you evidently know all about this just a little more detail in the summary would be appreciated.

For example you could have started with:

'Markus Persson (aka notch) co-founder of Swedish game company Mojang, creaters of minecraft, has answered a few....'

Instead you assume that the reader has as much knowledge in this as you. A short who / what / why would hardly be clutter.

Re:A Short Explanation (4, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42134193)

Or you could stop being thick headed and stop expecting the summary to contain the entire article in full. It's already 7 lines long, and it's obvious to anyone with a brain that Mojang is a game company while reading the summary. Does it really matter that they made Minecraft? It's not hard to figure that out from the article, and it changes nothing about the content of it either.

Eldavojohn assumes that you're been around this year, instead of hidden under a rock. He probably also assumes you're capable of clicking the article if you're so interested in it that you have to bash the fact that it didn't contain every detail about Notch.

Re:A Short Explanation (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42134489)

'Markus Persson (aka notch) co-founder of Swedish game company Mojang, creaters of minecraft, has answered a few....'

And this is how the summary started out:

Mojang's Marcus Persson (better known as 'Notch') has answered quite a few questions in an interview with PC Gamer about his new game 0x10c.

I am completely at a loss ...

Re:A Short Explanation (2)

SleazyRidr (1563649) | about 2 years ago | (#42135077)

Then you'd just get people asking what Minecraft is. There are comments asking what bitcoin is, so I don't think there's a level of prior knowledge you can assume people to have, you just need to accept that not everyone will get it and no one really cares.

Re:A Short Explanation (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42135279)

jesus christ shut the fuck up

Re:A Short Explanation (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42138759)

Oh good! Maybe you could explain to me what this sentence means:

When asked about Kickstarter and his Oculus dev kit, Notch said 'Definitely going to make it work in 0x10c no matter what' and his account of using the Oculus Rift sounds more than promising for the VR Device.

What is an Oculus Rift? And why has Notch written a dev kit for the Oculus? And can you link to Notch's kickstarter project that he created so that he could fund the the dev kit that he's creating?

Re:A Short Explanation (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42142061)

READ THE ARTICLE AND USE GOOGLE YOU FUCKING IDIOT.

aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

Re:Mojang? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42133477)

"Mojang's Marcus Persson (better known as 'Notch')

quit being a retard and maybe you'll understand you unintelligent fuck.

Re:Mojang? (1)

tibman (623933) | about 2 years ago | (#42135025)

You are probably the minority here.

Expounds (3, Insightful)

dywolf (2673597) | about 2 years ago | (#42133147)

The word is expounds. Not expands.

Re:Expounds (0)

The Mighty Buzzard (878441) | about 2 years ago | (#42133333)

Yeah, that's some truly shit editing. Never a mod point when I need one.

Re:Expounds (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42133389)

From the New Oxford English Dictionary:

"expand |ikspand|
verb
become or make larger or more extensive: [ no obj. ] : their business expanded into other hotels and properties | [ with obj. ] : baby birds cannot expand and contract their lungs.
  [ no obj. ] Physics (of the universe) undergo a continuous change whereby, according to theory based on observed redshifts, all the galaxies recede from one another.
  [ no obj. ] (expand on) give a fuller version or account of: Anne expanded on the theory."

Please at least look up the word before complaining about incorrect usage.

Re:Expounds (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42133433)

From the New Oxford American Dictionary:

"expand |ikspand|
verb
become or make larger or more extensive: [ no obj. ] : their business expanded into other hotels and properties | [ with obj. ] : baby birds cannot expand and contract their lungs.
  [ no obj. ] Physics (of the universe) undergo a continuous change whereby, according to theory based on observed redshifts, all the galaxies recede from one another.
  [ no obj. ] (expand on) give a fuller version or account of: Anne expanded on the theory."

At least look up the word before complaining about usage.

Re:Expounds (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42133451)

The word is expounds. Not expands.

Expands [wiktionary.org] :

To express (something) at length and/or in detail.

What, exactly, is the problem here?

Success Seems Unlikely (4, Insightful)

bencoder (1197139) | about 2 years ago | (#42133169)

0x10c sounds like a game that geeks (like me) would make if they didn't have financial constraints. I doubt it will reach any kind of mass market appeal and the hoards of minecraft fans hanging on Notch's every word will probably be dissapointed. But I'm looking forward to it.

Re:Success Seems Unlikely (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42133341)

I don't know, secondlife had a lot of fans for a good long while. And I'm sure the various OS's that people are building will abstract use of the ships computer.

And this looks a bit like the original Quake in appearance, but with some geekiness to offset the fps part. The multiplayer fps demos they did with the devs in the office looked a little iffy and very incomplete, but we'll see what happens... it's still early.

Re:Success Seems Unlikely (1)

hvm2hvm (1208954) | about 2 years ago | (#42136621)

I think it will be a great game. And if it's good enough that non-programmers will want to join it will get interesting because programmer will become the most important characters of the game. Everyone will need their help with programming and if something like trading programs for money/other stuff will be possible it might become really nice to play as a programmer.

Re:Success Seems Unlikely (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42133435)

Yeah, it is like the people who would play Tekkit, the ones who want more depth as opposed to those who just want to build their 79th craphouse.
It is a considerably smaller market than Minecraft is.

I co-run a Tekkit server just now and it is mostly just friends and around 5-6 randoms from minecraft forums on occasion.
I expect this game to be more or less the same in numbers, unless Notch makes it incredibly easy to actually get in to.
And considering how Minecraft had the ease of forcing a chicken up your left nostril to get in to without using the wiki, not so much.
An internal information system similar to the Guide in Terraria is what the game would really need. Or a crafting system similar to it or the xbox version.

Re:Success Seems Unlikely (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42135147)

0x10c sounds like a game that geeks (like me) would make if they didn't have financial constraints. I doubt it will reach any kind of mass market appeal and the hoards of minecraft fans hanging on Notch's every word will probably be dissapointed. But I'm looking forward to it.

Don't pat yourself on the back too hard, you smug elitist fuck.

Re:Success Seems Unlikely (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42136191)

It's a sad thing to be inferior, isn't it?

Re:Success Seems Unlikely (1)

ikaruga (2725453) | about 2 years ago | (#42138757)

I never really understand Notch games. First Minecraft: Why the hell people want to spend so much time build ugly and useless 3d objects using a horrible user interface and complex material collection/selection methods? Not only that minecraft is very expensive for a 4 year old "indie" game. I can download Blender(for free), build entire 3D worlds on it, they'll look much better, are interactive if you use the built in game engine, and depending on what you create you can actually sell for real money or use on other projects(CAD, game design, show off, etc). If you don't want to use blender then use Cryengine sandbox editor, Unity 4, etc. And then there is this new game 0x10c: If you just want to play with a CPU then program. Games should exist to provide experiences you just can't have in real life. Notch games are just crappy versions of thing you already can experience in real life.

Re:Success Seems Unlikely (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42139899)

I think this is similar to what I said originally when I first saw it while it was in Alpha stages. I've also heard roughly the same from reviews, YouTube Let's Play videos, etc. In the end all but a small handful admitted it was fun. Have you actually tried it?

Re:Success Seems Unlikely (1)

heefeneet (2709235) | about 2 years ago | (#42140441)

Games should exist to provide experiences you just can't have in real life. Notch games are just crappy versions of thing you already can experience in real life.

So Call of Duty sucks because you can just join the army?

Re:Success Seems Unlikely (1)

ikaruga (2725453) | about 2 years ago | (#42153377)

If the army experience was anything close to CoD then yes. But it's not. Minecraft you are in front of a screen building virtual stuff using a mouse and a keyboard. In Blender or anything else you are in front of a screen building virtual stuff using a mouse and a keyboard. Minecraft will waste a lot of time and will return crappy results no matter how much effort you put on it. Everything else you will get results much faster and the quality is up to you.

Driving a car in a video game is not the same as driving a car in real life. Building stuff inside a videogame is, however, the "same" experience as building stuff inside a real design computer software. And by "same" I mean far inferior, useless and frustrating.

Huh? (1)

systemidx (2708649) | about 2 years ago | (#42133203)

Didn't this topic have a few hundred comments just minutes ago? Or am I going crazy?

Re:Huh? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42133711)

Yeah, comments have been disappearing. Weird.

Re:Huh? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42133923)

Annnnnd now some of them are back.

PRINCESS KATE BOOBS !! AGAIN!! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42133221)

  .

Censored

Whew (1)

tgd (2822) | about 2 years ago | (#42133257)

I was worried it was going to have Quake-like graphics, but really the art form peaked with Doom.

What exactly is the game? (1)

AdamHaun (43173) | about 2 years ago | (#42133563)

I read the interview, the older Slashdot story, visited the 0x10^c web site, and skimmed through the DCPU-16 documentation, and I still have no idea what the actual game is. All of the details are about simulating embedded programming in assembly. I guess you can build onto your ship and add DCPU code to run it? Can anyone clarify this?

Re:What exactly is the game? (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42133629)

This appears to be the case. You can write in-game code to automate tasks like docking or running a defense turret. I expect this to have very narrow appeal, but a moron-free MMO would be pretty cool.

Re:What exactly is the game? (4, Interesting)

rasmusbr (2186518) | about 2 years ago | (#42134091)

Don't say that. I imagine there would eventually be an in game trade system which would allow anyone to buy ships and turrets with DCPU-16 software preinstalled.

The whole thing sounds to me like a scheme for transforming smart kids into proper nerds who write assembly and know their P from their I from their D. I like it.

Yeah, I'm Excited This Game Will Awaken Minds (3, Insightful)

eldavojohn (898314) | about 2 years ago | (#42134165)

Don't say that. I imagine there would eventually be an in game trade system which would allow anyone to buy ships and turrets with DCPU-16 software preinstalled.

The whole thing sounds to me like a scheme for transforming smart kids into proper nerds who write assembly and know their P from their I from their D. I like it.

Thank you. I was rather disheartened reading these comments. People are apparently planning on using this game to validate that they have holier than thou intellects over the general populace of gamers. My hope for this game is that it attracts the FPS gamers with its exploration mode and after a while they want to know more about how to program their DCPU-16 and awaken a thirst for knowledge inside them. Of course, that's a hope and may not be reality but I think Notch was alluding to that when he said:

It has a strange Quake-like quality to it: slightly too fast. I think it could be entertaining on LAN play but I don’t think you want to play it over the internet because with latency it’s going to become very unfair because it’s so fast. The goal still is to get it so that you can have a ship with the computer components in. Because then not only can you try the game but the people who want to build stuff for the computer can actually start doing that – it actually has some utility as well.

Basically I imagine the bullies in The Simpsons beating Notch up after they learn that he tricked them into learning.

Re:Yeah, I'm Excited This Game Will Awaken Minds (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42140239)

Thank you. I was rather disheartened reading these comments. People are apparently planning on using this game to validate that they have holier than thou intellects over the general populace of gamers.

It is not that black and white. People do not want another MMO experience ruined by other players chatting stuff like 'LOL PWNED NOOB'. Admit it: many multiplayer games suck only because their players suck at social skills and manners.

Re:What exactly is the game? (1)

Impy the Impiuos Imp (442658) | about 2 years ago | (#42135047)

For every one kid who programs, hundreds will just download stuff from web sites. There will always be lame nerds who freely give away their stuff.

(insert tongue in cheek and running away smiley faces here)

Re:What exactly is the game? (1)

angelbar (1823238) | about 2 years ago | (#42135481)

I will salivate for that... Thats what I was begging to be included on Eve online.. you can get so much information out of the game from their api but no way to utilize automatically from inside of the game.

What I Know About 0x10c (5, Insightful)

eldavojohn (898314) | about 2 years ago | (#42133799)

So first off, nothing is truly finalized yet. Mojang is not some big EA game maker that had a deadline and forces it to happen regardless of how ready the game is or isn't. Instead, according to the interview they have two developers working on 0x10c right now and it sounds like Notch and company are still playing around with a lot of cool ideas. The pricing and revenue streams aren't even cemented yet!

So from the story part of the page you said you skimmed [0x10c.com] there were sleep chambers that screwed up little endian with big endian and put everyone to sleep for 1 0000 0000 0000 years and now it's 281 474 976 712 644 AD and the first people are starting to wake up. You've got an extremely sparse universe with black holes and lots of empty space.

Now according to the interview the first release will consist only of "you can build a ship and you can play with the computer components in it." And you can design the ship, lay it out more efficiently, etc. However, "Each ship has a generator capable of producing a fixed wattage, and everything you connect to it drains wattage. A cloaking field, for example, might require almost all the power from the generator, forcing you to turn off all computers and dim all lights in order to successfully cloak. The computer in the game is a fully functioning emulated 16 bit CPU that can be used to control your entire ship, or just to play games on while waiting for a large mining operation to finish." So you're going to have to manage your resources and Notch mentions Faster Than Light (a game I kickstarted and enjoyed).

He also alludes to the possibility of your ship flying around and searching for things, a 3D printer, planetary exploration and that kind of stuff. They're not too clear on how multiplayer will work but it sounds like it's going to mostly be a crew on the same ship. Notch talks about 'launching all nukes at space stations' when he's leading and so it sounds like you'll interact with things outside your ship (probably through your DCPU-16).

It sounds like a lot of these ideas are half baked like the 3D printer that he described:

The idea is that, with things like turrets, you have a 3D printer to build the shell, like a computer case shell, but you still have to put components in there. Players in the game aren’t really engineers – they’re more like pilots, so they can’t build those parts. You have to scavenge for those parts, and find abandoned ships and try to find a working CPU or something. And those could have slightly different attributes: you might find a CPU running at 105% and try to trade that. But you can also mine for basic resources, like if you want a gold computer case – we’ll see if we actually have different materials, but that’s what I want – you have to mine for gold and put it in the 3D printer.

But I'm really excited for this game, even if it is just a Faster Than Light type game where you build a spaceship and outfit it and attack or aid outside ships. You would fight intruders that beam into your ship or repair holes left by attacks/asteroids. You know there's a lot that could still be added or modified in this game and anything with this setting and emulation embedded really excites me.

Re:What I Know About 0x10c (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42134069)

It sounds like a boring version of FTL so far...

Re:What I Know About 0x10c (1)

AdamHaun (43173) | about 2 years ago | (#42134523)

Notch talks about 'launching all nukes at space stations' when he's leading and so it sounds like you'll interact with things outside your ship (probably through your DCPU-16).

That was the part I was missing. From what you're saying, it sounds like they're going to start off with the ship building/programming stuff and then add on to that based on what players do. This makes more sense now. Thanks for the clarification.

Re:What I Know About 0x10c (1)

dissy (172727) | about 2 years ago | (#42135989)

I've been very curious for more details on this new game as well. From the video you linked, this is not what I was expecting at all. Not to imply that is a bad thing however.

Ironically, I've lately been spending most of my gaming time in Minecraft using the ComputerCraft and RedPower mods.

One provides computers in-game that run Lua, and can control redstone creations as well as newer items provided by other mods (such as Red Power, Industrial Craft, Rail Craft, etc.) Red Power itself provides computers that emulate a 6502 CPU and run Forth, which can provide the same type of control.

All of these things expand on Minecraft creations we have come to expect and love. There ends up being a shift from playing Minecraft, to automating everything one normally does in Minecraft, to new machines most vanilla players wouldn't think possible.

I was almost expecting 0x10c to be along these lines, but more "forced" into automating your game to play for you. Of course I assumed you wouldn't actually be forced to code every last detail yourself, and expected some sort of in-game trading of programs and resources. It's good to hear that is what he has in mind.

Part of the problems with the Minecraft in-game computer mods is that each have a relatively tiny community without much sharing of programs, mainly due to the fact that software and builds are tightly linked. You almost need to give your game world away with the code as a full package, which isn't nearly as fun (and makes little sense for multiplayer servers)

If this game provide for the creation/machine part as mostly standard (ships, weapons, mining gear, etc) with more-or-less standard APIs for the software, I could easily envision a massive trading scene for software. Allowing programmers to sell/trade their code to non-coders to gain more resources would be a huge plus.

I'm really hoping for a best-of-both-worlds sort of thing. I definitely can't wait for the alpha releases!

Re:What exactly is the game? (1)

Charliemopps (1157495) | about 2 years ago | (#42134447)

You're stuck in a ship.
Other players can join you in your ship.
The ship has a computer that you can program, in assembly.
You can install an operating system so you can use an easier language to get things done.
Your view out of the ship will be VIA this computer... imagine what a 16 bit CPU can show you.
Through this limited view, you can navigate, interact with other players etc...
Multiple ships can be networked together... given that, you could potentially build a much more powerful CPU by having a networked "fleet"
If something breaks on the ship, you have to physically run around the ship to fix it.
There are guns so I'm assuming you can be boarded, or board other peoples ships
When you log out, your ship is still active in the universe. Your computer can be programmed to do things while you're offline.
They want the graphics to have a low polygon count "feel" even if the counts not all that low. Think "Tron"

This is my understanding of the game so far. I could be wrong on some parts and they could change a lot before release.
I'm personally excited. It seems like it will have a very interesting 80s retro "lost in space" feel.

Re:What exactly is the game? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42137323)

A few things to add:

You can have a window to look out and see things going on... in addition to the computer monitors. There is also a 3D plotter for a display devices (aka like Death Star display device that Princess Leia in the pre-flight briefing as used in Star Wars Episode IV). I would imagine that you can use to 3D display device to plot the position of "enemy" and "friendly" ships nearby.

The network scheme hasn't been identified yet, but there have been several proposed ideas. No doubt it will eventually happen though, so the idea of networked computers is a good one.

There are a few things that were left out of the article that have been put into 0x10^c, but this is a pretty good summary of what not only was in the article but also what Notch has said about what he plans to put into the game.

Tagged Microsoft? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42133681)

I thought this was about Notch's new game, not a sarcastic comment about Microsoft.

I hope it works on my 14.4k modem (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42133709)

So it's Decent with the ability to play in-game Pong?

Re:I hope it works on my 14.4k modem (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42133773)

Commander Keen FPS, with in-game Pong.

B.A.T. Agent (2)

Khashishi (775369) | about 2 years ago | (#42134161)

Hmm, a game where you can program a computer within that game? Anybody remember that old adventure game called B.A.T. Agent? Weird game where, IIRC, you can program yourself with some crude scripting language. I don't think there's anything else like it.

Re:B.A.T. Agent (1)

Majutsushi (205979) | about 2 years ago | (#42139397)

And for the people who don't remember it I've recently recorded a longplay where you can see the computer programming in action:

http://youtu.be/MpQhiYzGVdo [youtu.be]

Re:B.A.T. Agent (1)

SuiteSisterMary (123932) | about 2 years ago | (#42141347)

Origin had a game called Omega, for the C64 amoung other platforms, to put it in historical perspective.

You built, then programmed, a cybertank. Basic procedural language with subroutines, conditionals, loops, and inputs from the tanks' devices.

Mindrover was similar, kinda, but used a visual metaphor of dragging lines from inputs to outputs. Not as cool.

Bing Saving Us? (0)

QuickBible (1143641) | about 2 years ago | (#42134403)

Microsoft would love to pop that cherry

Firs7 poSt... (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42134579)

and, 4fter Sinitial

endianness (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42134811)

CPU appears to be little-endian ("it's strongly suggested all multi-word operations use little endian in all DCPU-16 programs").

Sleep chamber peripheral appears to be big-endian ("Reads the B register, and reads a 64 bit number from memory address B in big endian, and sets the number of units to skip to that number.")

When reading a 64 bit value - indicating the number of units of time to travel forward through - there is mixed endianness.

What could possibly go wrong?

[an embedded programmer guy]

IHBT, IHL, DIAF, HAND (3, Informative)

Thud457 (234763) | about 2 years ago | (#42135167)

CPU appears to be little-endian ("it's strongly suggested all multi-word operations use little endian in all DCPU-16 programs").

Sleep chamber peripheral appears to be big-endian ("Reads the B register, and reads a 64 bit number from memory address B in big endian, and sets the number of units to skip to that number.")

When reading a 64 bit value - indicating the number of units of time to travel forward through - there is mixed endianness.

What could possibly go wrong?

[an embedded programmer guy]

THAT'S THE JOKE [0x10cwiki.com] /McBain

Backstory

In a parallel universe where the space race never ended, space travel was gaining popularity amongst corporations and rich individuals. In 1988, a brand new deep sleep cell was released, compatible with all popular 16 bit computers. Unfortunately, it used big endian, whereas the DCPU-16 specifications called for little endian. This led to a severe bug in the included drivers, causing a requested sleep of 0x0000 0000 0000 0001 years to last for 0x0001 0000 0000 0000 years.

It's now the year 281 474 976 712 644 AD, and the first lost people are starting to wake up to a universe on the brink of extinction, with all remote galaxies forever lost to red shift, star formation long since ended, and massive black holes dominating the galaxy.

Developers not using Linux (1)

loufoque (1400831) | about 2 years ago | (#42135811)

Every time I hear of developers not using Linux, I wonder why.

I've come up with two theories:
  - Microsoft is very influential in the USA, and somehow managed to trick teaching institutions to work with Windows. Since the US is the leader in software development, many other countries try to copy them, even if Microsoft is not as influential there.
  - People making mass-market software (like games) target Windows, and need to use Windows-specific toolchains. While cross-compiling for Windows is possible, they prefer to have the native experience with the Windows tools. In particular it is difficult to run the UI disaster that is Visual Studio (and that somehow some people actually like) on Linux.

Thankfully, with web services and mobile phones becoming more and more important everyday, Windows is becoming less and less relevant (at least until you do that javascript or flash crap that only works well on Windows for some reason).

Re:Developers not using Linux (1)

cwebster (100824) | about 2 years ago | (#42136123)

Neither of those theories work here

1) this guy and his company are in sweden, and Notch has openly refused to left Minecraft be certified to be sold in the windows store fwiw.

2) He writes horribly inefficient java that does actually run crossplatform (Minecraft runs in windows, linux and macos).

Re:Developers not using Linux (1)

loufoque (1400831) | about 2 years ago | (#42136217)

Both do, sorry.
1) irrelevant
2) irrelevant too. The game market is on windows, that is what matters.

Re:Developers not using Linux (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42136371)

Your theories suffer from a significant oversight: you're only thinking about external reasons, ignoring the possibility that there flaws in Linux and the surrounding ecosystem which keep many developers away.

One of them is that Linux is a terrible deployment target for anything which isn't both open source and popular enough for major distributions to package themselves. If they're not packaging for you, you have to do a lot of extra useless make-work, and much of that work has to be replicated for each distribution you want to support. As distros fragment themselves over political battles and pursue their individual flavors of the month in key system technologies, the problem only gets worse.

Even if you do release something as open source and get a distro to start packaging it, you then face the nightmare of how to manage the pain of pushing updates to distros, each of which has its own release schedule. And you may have to deal with bugs introduced by distros during "packaging" because someone thought it would be just great to patch your software to be slightly different on their distro without so much as pushing the patch upstream to you so you could check it out. (yes, this really happens; a few years ago it was responsible for a GIANT security hole in Debian)

Re:Developers not using Linux (1)

lister king of smeg (2481612) | about 2 years ago | (#42137049)

really? vmware player is closed source and not in the distros repos and it seems to have a high usage on linux

Re:Developers not using Linux (1)

BobbyWang (2785329) | about 2 years ago | (#42150537)

Unlike locked down systems (like xbox or iphone) Linux, OSX and Windows let users download and run whatever they want. It's true that Linux distros usually also has some kind of packaging system for distributing updates, managing dependencies and let users easily browse available software. How can NOT having that be considered a feature? It's not like Apple or Microsoft are willing to push updates for third party games through their official operating system updates any faster, or even at all. Instead games can, after being manually downloaded and installed, update themselves in exactly the same way on any Linux distribution, OSX or Windows. For example Minecraft does this and it works just fine.

Re:Developers not using Linux (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42137111)

> Every time I hear of developers not using Linux, I wonder why.

Which platform are most applications that are sold made for? If you're trying to appeal to a customer base, are you going to try and work within and sell to a Linux audience, or a Windows one?

When you're used to hacking your own solutions or finding open-sourced alternatives, it's easy to forget that most people just chase the almighty dollar ... but that's how it is.

Expands on Quantum Computing???? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 2 years ago | (#42140153)

"Cool stuff might happen if and when Quantum Computers hit the scene". -- wow how insightful !!!

268 what? (1)

technosaurus (1704630) | about 2 years ago | (#42141029)

Would that be the year 2238 in unix years?

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