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Rivalry Building Between Amazon and Google

Soulskill posted about a year and a half ago | from the bezos-to-fight-brin-in-single-combat dept.

Google 97

Amazon and Google, both giants in the online business world, started out as separate entities with two very different agendas. As each has grown into an empire, the overlapping areas of business between the two companies has grown as well. But with both companies moving strongly into the electronic device market, cloud services, and Amazon now building out its advertising network, they find themselves increasingly at odds, and 2013 may bring more direct battles."Amazon wants to be the one place where you buy everything. Google wants to be the one place where you find everything, of which buying things is a subset. So when you marry those facts I think you're going to see a natural collision," said VC partner Chi-hua Chien. Adds Reuters, "Not long after Bezos learned of Google's catalog plans, Amazon began scanning books and providing searchable digital excerpts. Its Kindle e-reader, launched a few years later, owes much of its inspiration to the catalog news, the executive said. Now, Amazon is pushing its online ad efforts, threatening to siphon revenue and users from Google's main search website."

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That's nice (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42390825)

Play Store and Amazon Appstore is the best thing to ever happen to Android. Fuck all that .apk crap.

Re:That's nice (2)

Niris (1443675) | about a year and a half ago | (#42390933)

I take it you don't have any apps on Amazon huh? Their sales, from everything I've seen, are drops in the bucket compared to the play store

Re:That's nice (0)

taxman_10m (41083) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391589)

What do I care about their sales? I'm happy with their free app of the day. Most are crap, but I did manage to get Tetris on a day when it was free.

Amazon (3, Informative)

BlkRb0t (1610449) | about a year and a half ago | (#42390847)

While everyone is more interested in the rivalry of Google, Apple and Microsoft, Amazon has steadily charted up year after year building a base that is more resilient than that of any other.

"Pack of Four" (3, Insightful)

tuppe666 (904118) | about a year and a half ago | (#42390879)

While everyone is more interested in the rivalry of Google, Apple and Microsoft, Amazon has steadily charted up year after year building a base that is more resilient than that of any other.

Nobody is interested in Microsoft. The "pack of four" includes *Facebook* over Microsoft.

Re:"Pack of Four" (4, Interesting)

DogDude (805747) | about a year and a half ago | (#42390975)

Speak for yourself. My business runs on Microsoft stuff. I couldn't give two shits about Facebook, Google, or Amazon.

Not my words (0, Troll)

tuppe666 (904118) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391007)

Speak for yourself. My business runs on Microsoft stuff. I couldn't give two shits about Facebook, Google, or Amazon.

The fact that your company runs what is seen as utility product, is the reason why Microsoft is considered irrelevant.

Re:Not my words (0)

DogDude (805747) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391019)

That makes no sense.

Re:Not my words (3, Insightful)

Mabhatter (126906) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391097)

Microsoft has a near monopoly on Business servers.... Swingline sells a lot of Red Staplers too. Smead sells a lot of hanging file folders. 3M sells a lot of stickie squares.... Lots of companies have very profitable, near monopolies... But they aren't interesting to Wall Street anymore.

Microsoft has sold just about as many copies of Windows as they can.. On every possible platform. The only place they GROW is in XBox living room machines... But that's a really crowded market that the players are just taking different sizes of pie.... There's NO NEW PIE being created. Apple and Google and Amazon are creating new KINDS of pie ... Microsoft isn't.

Re:Not my words (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42391181)

Microsoft has a near monopoly on Business servers.... Swingline sells a lot of Red Staplers too. Smead sells a lot of hanging file folders. 3M sells a lot of stickie squares.... Lots of companies have very profitable, near monopolies... But they aren't interesting to Wall Street anymore.

Microsoft has sold just about as many copies of Windows as they can.. On every possible platform. The only place they GROW is in XBox living room machines... But that's a really crowded market that the players are just taking different sizes of pie.... There's NO NEW PIE being created. Apple and Google and Amazon are creating new KINDS of pie ... Microsoft isn't.

Cow pies.

Re:Not my words (1)

symbolset (646467) | about a year and a half ago | (#42392159)

Microsoft has a near monopoly on Business servers

On what planet?

Jesus saves (0, Troll)

tuppe666 (904118) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391111)

That makes no sense.

Mircrosoft are simply the OS/Office Monopoly company that is a tax on every machine, you simply pay it as a business and get on with your life. Now compare and contrast with movers and shakers Amazon; Apple; Google; Facebook [the pack of four. Microsoft used to be a company that ate competitors for breakfast...now they are everyone bitch. People here often make reference to Ballmer throwing chairs..the sad reality is there is little wrong with throwing a chair we all lose our temper, what is wrong is after he threw the chair he then said "Fucking Eric Schmidt is a fucking pussy. I'm going to fucking bury that guy, I have done it before, and I will do it again. I'm going to fucking kill Google."...and then failed to deliver!

Re:"Pack of Four" (1)

Burning1 (204959) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391191)

Your business could be built on IBM and RedHat products. Doesn't change the fact that Facebook, Google, and Amazon are now the biggest players in the online services & marketing market.

Re:"Pack of Four" (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42391403)

The website in your sig uses Google APIs and links to G+ and Facebook. You can even login to the site using Facebook or Google. Can't seem to find the MS login on the site. In fact if I'm to assume the link in your sig is your business it's interesting that your web presence has nothing to do with Microsoft. You don't give two shits about your business if you didn't know that.

Re:"Pack of Four" (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42391451)

1) you run a tiny local mom and pop b&m pet store. Your opinion about anything on the Internet is irrelevant, about as useful as the milkman

2) ironic that you don't give two shits about Facebook yet have your facebook page promeniently linked on your website

Re:"Pack of Four" (0, Troll)

Lumpy (12016) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391471)

Look everyone it's one of those dinosaurs. Everyone take a photo before it dies.

Google Chromebook + Google services is what your most successful competitors are using. They are beating you hard in cost of IT because of it. I strongly suggest you hire some people in your business that are up to speed with modern business technology before you do something stupid like buy microsoft surfaces for your employees and waste yet more money on a dying business platform.

Chromebooks, Nexus 7, Nexus 4 and google business services is surprisingly effective setup for sales staff and office staff. Our programmers and engineers still need a Workstation class laptop and Windows or Linux OS. But everything else allowed us to get rid of 50% of the it staff. All we have to maintain is an in house group of 4 linux servers and the broadband into the building. Sales guy loses his laptop, we take a new one off the shelf and he is back up to speed on a new laptop in less than 30 minutes.

Honestly, this cloud crap works really well.

Re:"Pack of Four" (3, Insightful)

symbolset (646467) | about a year and a half ago | (#42392171)

Our programmers and engineers still need a Workstation class laptop and Windows or Linux OS.

In a VM, which is where desktop Windows belongs.

Re:"Pack of Four" (1)

gubon13 (2695335) | about a year and a half ago | (#42397045)

How do I "like" this comment and/or beg for more mod points to be given to it?

Re:"Pack of Four" (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42392239)

Google Chromebook + Google services is what your most successful competitors are using.

lol what? What planet are you from. Chromebook's are exceedingly rare in the business world. *exceedingly*

Honestly, this cloud crap works really well.

Cool story bro.

Re:"Pack of Four" (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42391917)

Hi Grandpa!

Re:"Pack of Four" (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42391009)

Really? I think you should pay attention to the actual world and quit listening to tech pundits who seem more concerned with shock value than fact. Facebook is in a fast decline and has been since before they went public. Microsoft is continuing to be fairly constant. My bet is that within 5 years (and I'm being liberal here with the time frame), Facebook is as relevant as myspace.

Microsoft failing everywhere. (0)

tuppe666 (904118) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391047)

Facebook is in a fast decline and has been since before they went public. Microsoft is continuing to be fairly constant.

Facebook is not in fast decline...its nearest competitor Google+ is still a ways of it threatening Facebook. Other than Facebook buying an Ad company. I have been astonished they have done *nothing*. As for Microsoft being constant, Google is getting serious about threatening their core product Office recently, while Microsoft failed in both search and mobile costing them Billions, and its new products Surface and Windows 8 have been disappointing they still print cash, but its for their undesirable utility products.

Re:Microsoft failing everywhere. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42391541)

Big Market Cap (0)

tuppe666 (904118) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391607)

Not really sure what your point is. In the context of this thread. Microsoft shares have been flat for years...and are down right now. Facebook raised a stack of cash from selling shares, overpriced at launch, nice! that is exactly what a company wants...its shares are up right now. I don't think they paint the picture you want them too. Personally I want facebook to do something interesting with the money its raised.

Re:Big Market Cap (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42403845)

its shares are up right now

Do you really think a random 1-day stock quote is indicative of a company's long-term prospects? That's a ridiculous metric to base anything on, about the same as rolling some dice or asking a gypsy. I guess they are "up" from completely bottoming out a few months ago? I'm not one of those doom & gloom people who say FB will be gone within a couple of years, but I also don't think FB is in great shape just because they have a "+" next to their stock ticker today

In the end it all comes down to money, and Facebook isn't even in the same league as the Apple/Google/Microsoft/etc when it comes to earnings. They have a HUGE user-base, but if they attempt to monetize those users too aggressively it may push people away, but if they don't then the company can't grow. Obviously Zuck isn't going to starve any time soon, but they are in a tricky position.

Re:"Pack of Four" (5, Informative)

Animats (122034) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391185)

Nobody is interested in Microsoft. The "pack of four" includes *Facebook* over Microsoft.

Facebook isn't in the same league as the big boys.

Revenue for most recent quarter:

  • Apple: $36 billion
  • Microsoft: $16 billion
  • Google: $14 billion
  • Amazon: $14 billion
  • Facebook: $1.2 billion

Facebook makes a lot of noise, but they're smaller than eBay, which had quarterly revenue around $4 billion, and about even with Yahoo.

Amazon is the company with room to expand. Amazon could potentially take over most of retail. Their real competitor is Wal-Mart.

The others are near the ceiling of their markets. Google has failed to make money with anything other than search ads. Microsoft probably has a long life ahead of it, like IBM, serving the needs of business. Apple has a price maintenance problem - their huge markups may not survive the flood of lower-priced devices. Facebook is in a bind; their user base has peaked, and shoving more ads at users didn't work out for Myspace.

Your kidding right (0, Troll)

tuppe666 (904118) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391359)

The others are near the ceiling of their markets.
Google has failed to make money with anything other than search ads. Microsoft probably has a long life ahead of it, like IBM, serving the needs of business. Apple has a price maintenance problem - their huge markups may not survive the flood of lower-priced devices. Facebook is in a bind; their user base has peaked, and shoving more ads at users didn't work out for Myspace.

I agree Apples pursuit of profit over marketshare has been seriously short sighted, yet there is nothing stopping them expanding their product range; entering new markets [social;money]; licensing their OS to third parties..Oh and AppleTV [whatever you think of that]. Google are already starting to make real money from their Store, sat at 710Million devices and growing at 1.5Million a day, and yes they will continue to expand their ads into the mobile space, but the two pieces of news that I find interesting is googles interest in becoming the new credit card, and it challenging Microsoft at its core offering an Office equivalent at $50 a year (a massive cost saving over Microsoft). Amazon is just well taking over shopping, but its tablets kick-started the 7" tablet revolution...and I suspect a Amazon [Google stripped] phone will do the same...did I mention the cloud. The only real question mark is over Facebook...and your right advertising is only part of the package. I hoped they would buy blackberry or something exciting, because they have so much potential. The reality is most of those rumours [and they are not comprehensive] are interchangeable simply because they are so much in each others space. [notice I don't mention IBM, or computing eyewear...or self driving cars for that matter.]

Re:"Pack of Four" (2)

ikaruga (2725453) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391821)

I agree with you are saying, but there is one small problem in your post: you're dealing with revenues. It's better, but no sufficient, to talk using net profits or losses. For example, in their latest report Sony post a revenue of $20 billion. Would you consider them part of the "Pack of Four"? As much as I like (parts of) them, I wouldn't.

What ever happened to IBM? (2)

symbolset (646467) | about a year and a half ago | (#42392193)

Oh, yeah. Nobody ever thinks about IBM anymore. Even though they're about to knock Microsoft off their perch as "third largest technology company by market capitalization." IBM probably likes it that way.

Re:"Pack of Four" (1)

jhol13 (1087781) | about a year and a half ago | (#42392511)

Amazon started spämming me heavily this Christmas - before that they sent me one email per month, now one every day or so.

I'll never ever buy anything from them.

Re:"Pack of Four" (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42393065)

They are probably very concerned about losing your business. I'm guessing you're not familiar with the whole concept of "opting out" of direct email marketing that you probably approved way back on your first Amazon purchase. It's perfectly rational that instead of just asking them to stop sending you emails by simply clicking the opt out link they add to the bottom of literally every single marketing email you get from them, you just decided you would show them by not ever ordering from Amazon again. I hope you at least wrote them a strongly worded letter so they will be completely aware of why the lost your loyal business over a mouse click or two...

Re:"Pack of Four" (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42403949)

Why didn't you just opt-out of their mailing list then? Their emails have a link in them to do so, not to mention the user account settings on amazon.com. There's always the "oldschool" method of using your local/cloud spam filter too.

If you think Amazon has aggressive advertising/mailing policies, you should probably avoid internet shopping altogether.

Re:"Pack of Four" (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42392627)

their huge markups may not survive the flood of lower-priced devices.

If they continue to pull game-changing tech (that's been around forever in shitty incarnations - see the iPod, laptops, iPhone, iPad) out of their arses, they'll maintain the first-to-bitchslap-some-sense-into-the-market momentum and continue to climb.

If they don't, well, Apple's not going to suddenly die and drop out of the race. They've already established themselves as the Mercedes/BMW of computing.

Re:"Pack of Four" (0)

fredprado (2569351) | about a year and a half ago | (#42394285)

Mercedes/BMW are brands that are not accessible for most people and as such are a symbol of status, not only because of their superior quality but because of the high price tag. Apple does not have neither superior quality not superior price tag, when compared to their main competitor Brands (Samsung, Google), and are not even very far from other slightly inferior brands.

Their market is therefore far from being as consolidated as you imply.

Re:"Pack of Four" (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42392957)

facebook owns the eyeballs of the internet masses, though... so their influence (as disheartening as it may be) is stronger than even amazon.

Re:"Pack of Four" (2)

thetoadwarrior (1268702) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391479)

Facebook is still small time imo. The fact they have to resort to pushing some pretty shit ads (gambling, betting, etc) just to get their money says they're not getting it because it appears they're just pushing any ad to anyone. There is no intelligence behind it otherwise they'd realise I'd never click on an ad for gambling. The only thing they have is a large audience and some claim they have a lock-in since people have put their lives into their system but the same thing could have been said about MySpace. Microsoft is losing some relevance but at least they still have products that people need and won't be as happy to replace.

Microsoft not so much of a force today. (0)

tuppe666 (904118) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391523)

Facebook is still small time imo. The fact they have to resort to pushing some pretty shit ads (gambling, betting, etc) just to get their money says they're not getting it because it appears they're just pushing any ad to anyone. There is no intelligence behind it otherwise they'd realise I'd never click on an ad for gambling. The only thing they have is a large audience and some claim they have a lock-in since people have put their lives into their system but the same thing could have been said about MySpace. Microsoft is losing some relevance but at least they still have products that people need and won't be as happy to replace.

...ask Google who threatens them more Microsoft or Facebook.

Re:Microsoft not so much of a force today. (1)

thetoadwarrior (1268702) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391649)

I'm still not sure that's the case. Google is in more trouble if Microsoft gets mobile devices right. The only thing outside of search/advertising that google have done well and can fall back on is mobile devices. Anyone who can take that away from them is a pretty big threat. They've just been lucky that Apple only cares about the high end of the market and Microsoft has largely been useless in portable computing.

Facebook does indeed do advertising but given how many complaints there have been to how useful it actually is, I just can't see it growing leaps and bounds outside of their own sites. If Facebook do a phone it'll probably be Android based making it easier for Google to cause them problems. I can't see FB making their own mobile OS or forking Android and maintaining their own seperate branch.

Re:Microsoft not so much of a force today. (1)

davester666 (731373) | about a year and a half ago | (#42392263)

"if Microsoft gets mobile devices right"

You speak as if Microsoft is a newcomer.
They have botched the job for 15 years now.
They would still be pushing WinCE 6.5 with minor tweaks if somebody else didn't show them how to make a real OS. And associated eco-system.

Re:Microsoft not so much of a force today. (0)

jan0278 (2026038) | about a year and a half ago | (#42392603)

Honestly, don't even bother to try anything Microsoft.. just from the fact that you quoted CE 6.5.. I am a big Nokia fan and boy after trying out Lumia 920 with WP8, I think Microsoft definitely had a wonderful OS with some future.. don't knoq if I like Nokia more or Windows Phone. haven't tried windows 8 to comment on it.. happy with Windows 7 and Linux at home and Windows 7 at work...

Re:Microsoft not so much of a force today. (1)

TheRaven64 (641858) | about a year and a half ago | (#42397177)

I've not used Windows Phone 7 for long enough to really know the UI, but I've played with enough devices to be impressed by the UI (Microsoft Research is the building behind me, so I see a lot of them). It's far from perfect, but then so are iOS and Android, and it's in the same ballpark. In contrast the old WinCE, was a usability disaster. I suspect that their biggest problem is that they only allow .NET code to run, which makes it hard to port code from other platforms to theirs.

Re:Microsoft not so much of a force today. (1)

thetoadwarrior (1268702) | about a year and a half ago | (#42397537)

I agree. The worst smart phone I ever owned was a Windows mobile phone. Trying to recreate windows on a phone was a dumb idea. Making it buggier than anything else was just retarded. That said they do appear to be getting better at it and as someone who owned a G1, android was a bit shit in the beginning too. If Microsoft keeps copying the right things and make it work well enough they could get lucky. Maybe they won't but Microsoft is still a compeitotor on office software too and they're very slowly getting into social media (too late imo but they're doing it) so all around they're making attempts at things that Google does where as Facebook just has Facebook.

Re:"Pack of Four" (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42393269)

"Nobody is interested in Microsoft. The "pack of four" includes *Facebook* over Microsoft."

In the slashdot world, maybe, but there is a huge place outside called "real world". You should check it sometime.

Re:"Pack of Four" (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42393815)

Linux Fanboi?

Re:"Pack of Four" (1)

Alarash (746254) | about a year and a half ago | (#42394385)

Anybody thinking Facebook is more relevant than Microsoft is really, really wrong. Market capitalization doesn't mean much either when investors are creating a bubble. If FB is still worth a few billions in 10 years, then I might change my opinion.

Re:Amazon (1)

Alwin Henseler (640539) | about a year and a half ago | (#42390965)

"more resilient than that of any other" ? Come on, let's face it: the only resilient businesses are family-run businesses that have been doing the same thing for a century or so.

In the .com field even the biggest players can go tits up (or more likely: taken over by another company) if they make a series of stupid decisions. As for Amazon, I'd guess they do fine because they're well.. actually selling stuff. Like, physical items. And many of them (duh). Unlike companies that deal in virtual goods / services whose value may evaporate when people lose interest or something better pops up.

Re:Amazon (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42391039)

Except amazon has much more of a vested interest in being even more invasive and pushy with their advertising, as they sell the products they are advertising whereas google is just serving ads for competitors, almost certainly will never use amazon for that reason.

Define base... (1)

SuperKendall (25149) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391941)

Amazon has steadily charted up year after year building a base that is more resilient than that of any other.

I'm not going to say Amazon does not have a good base, they obviously do (I'm a prime member myself and plan to keep being so for a long time).

But Amazon has "only" 40 billion of cash on hand (or cash + cash equiv anyway). Apple has lots more than that. I would also say both Apple and Amazon have bases that are just as strong, with Apple having the slight edge overall simply because of the larger financial base.

In theory building strong competition for Amazon would not be as hard as building strong competition to Apple - although no-one seems to have had much luck beating Amazon overall.

So I would agree Amazon has a resilient base, but not "stronger than any other". It's as strong as it needs to be to offer serious competition in devices though.

Re:Define base... (1)

EdIII (1114411) | about a year and a half ago | (#42392733)

Amazon has not been impressing me.

Netflix was down for over 24hrs due to a nationwide failure in the Amazon EC2 infrastructure. It came back up slowly in different places, but my area was dead last. Netflix even had their help page 404'd because of how many people were calling in.

Wasn't Netflix the one who came out with the platform to stress test your cloud infrastructure? ChaosMonkey? All that testing and disaster readiness did not seem to help all that much. Hard to make a difference when Amazon is down nationwide.

I might chalk it up to a one-off, but this is not the first time that regionally distributed cloud systems have failed with Amazon.

For a company charging that much money for cloud services that are supposed to be that reliable, meaning serious uptime and redundancy, especially when you are handing over serious cash for regional redundancy, this stuff is just plain embarrassing and not a good selling point.

I can't even begin to imagine the fallout for Netflix, which admittedly could be smoothed over by some credits and a letter.

However, in a serious business like insurance (GEICO, Progressive), finance, 12 hours of downtime during the day can mean millions of dollars in losses.

I seriously have to question if the savings of a cloud infrastructure are worth it when millions of dollars are on the line. It's not like you can't run your own "cloud" in a couple of data centers with open source stuff.

As far as those savings go, Amazon does not give you huge savings vs running it yourself. Not really.

Re:Define base... (1)

Bengie (1121981) | about a year and a half ago | (#42404299)

Netflix is 1/3 of the USA Internet traffic during peak. I don't think you understand the scale. No matter what Netflix does, they have to do it via "cloud". Be it a 3rd party like Amazon, or creating their own infrastructure, it will be almost identical in the end. The main benefit of using Amazon is Netflix doesn't have to re-create the whole wheel.

Amazon already has billions upon billions invested into infrastructure and Netflix would have to re-create that if they want any hope of handling 1/3 of the USA.

I know Netflix is building their own FreeBSD local cache servers that can be installed locally at the ISPs to help alleviate trunk traffic, so they are starting to branch out past just a media company.

Re:Amazon (1)

DragonWriter (970822) | about a year and a half ago | (#42395089)

While everyone is more interested in the rivalry of Google, Apple and Microsoft, Amazon has steadily charted up year after year building a base that is more resilient than that of any other.

Posted on a day where on of the biggest Amazon customers (Netflix) -- and all of their customers -- might have something to say about that "resilience".

Search or die (1)

justthinkit (954982) | about a year and a half ago | (#42396019)

Until Amazon fixes their search, Google has absolutely nothing to worry about.

Who the fuck cares? (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42390851)

Lunatics with guns are murdering our children and emergency workers every fucking day and you idiots want to blather on about this meaningless garbage? This is just pathetic. We need to focus on banning guns NOW, not be concerned about Google's new dickwaving contest with Amazon.

Re:Who the fuck cares? (0, Troll)

Niris (1443675) | about a year and a half ago | (#42390951)

Children are starving around the world NOW and you want to blather on about guns?

Re:Who the fuck cares? (4, Funny)

ColdWetDog (752185) | about a year and a half ago | (#42390977)

I think banning humans would go a long way to solving the world's problems.

Re:Who the fuck cares? (4, Funny)

rwyoder (759998) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391407)

I think banning humans would go a long way to solving the world's problems.

Skynet? Is that you?

Re:Who the fuck cares? (4, Funny)

Threni (635302) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391005)

In little more than a blink of an eye we're going to experience the heat-death of the universe, where there will never be anything - ever, anywhere - again. And you want to talk about kids?

Re:Who the fuck cares? (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42391051)

We are about to go over the fiscal cliff and you want to talk about starving children?

Re:Who the fuck cares? (2)

Lumpy (12016) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391487)

only a fucking moron says this.

Re:Who the fuck cares? (2)

jbonomi (1839286) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391897)

I'm drunk too, man. Merry Christmas!

The key is to keep the titans fighting... (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42390869)

For us, rather than working together to smash us down with their mighty clubs.

Keep at it boys, keep at it.

No news here... (1)

wbr1 (2538558) | about a year and a half ago | (#42390887)

I have to sideload the amazon app store on my android devices if I want it.
This does not take a rocket scientist to figure out.

Why not about the link? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42390897)

If Tim Worstall's Forbes article "Is Amazons Advertising A Threat To Google?" is not worth discussing on its own merits - as either reportage or a question - then why is it relevant or interesting as the putative substantiation of the headline "Rivalry Building Between Amazon and Google"?

I believe that had Tim been reporting on an actual increase in an actual rivalry between Amazon and Google, he would have managed to secure a slightly better title for his article.

I also believe that were there an actual increase in an actual rivalry between Amazon and Google for us to discuss, the OP would have found a more suitable article to cite.

Prove me wrong, but I think this item should be marked as being from the don't-bother-checking-your-Slashdot-feed-its-practically-spam department.

Lets call it competition (2, Interesting)

tuppe666 (904118) | about a year and a half ago | (#42390915)

The reality of the new world order, is the "pack of four" do have massive overlap in business, but that is just the way it should be. Its good old fashioned competition. Everyone has a store; Everyone had apps; Everyone owns an advertising company, Everyone has hardware [Ok Facebook only rumoured since forever, and Amazon new rumoured around a phone].

Personally I think the consumer needs to protected with cross platform; patent free formats, and the ability to move between devices as easily [and I mean Apps too] as possible to protect consumers from being locked into any one ecosystem.

Re:Lets call it competition (1)

ColdWetDog (752185) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391071)

I guess I'm not much blown away by this. Companies looking for the big money go wherever the big money is.

Soon banks will be into banking, stocks,derivatives, commodities, overthrowing small countries, buying out large countries. You know, business as usual.

Re:Lets call it competition (1)

gutnor (872759) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391169)

You do not really need patent free format. Just a guarantee that your stuff will be migrated, just like your phone number. While we are at it, that would be cool if we could have some service guarantee, like that your account will not be abruptly closed with no explanation (like you post some idiotic video on youtube and Google wipes everything you own with them - a few instances have made the news here with Google, but I'm sure that's a problem with Amazon, Apple, Facebook, ...)

Ownership of kitten Pictures (0)

tuppe666 (904118) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391265)

You do not really need patent free format. Just a guarantee that your stuff will be migrated,

...because I'm not happy replacing a Monopoly with a cartel! I really like your post, I was more focused on offline paid content [books; movies; Apps] forgetting that if anything there is as much content [yours and commercial] in the cloud, but I suspect caring Governments should be protecting "the people from themselves" as people do not seem to understand how much of their ownership over their lives they have given to these mega-corps.

Based on yesterday's Amazon AWS outage (4, Insightful)

gelfling (6534) | about a year and a half ago | (#42390931)

Amazon AWS hosts Netflix and it was done for hours yesterday. Based on that I'd say +1 Google in the systems reliability front.

Re:Based on yesterday's Amazon AWS outage (0)

symbolset (646467) | about a year and a half ago | (#42390995)

We don't know yet and likely won't know if this was the fault of AWS or a hamfisted Netflix engineer. Let's not leap to conclusions.

Re:Based on yesterday's Amazon AWS outage (2)

Skapare (16644) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391145)

Netflix has still not deployed any redundancy operations within AWS (e.g. multiple regions). AWS us-east-1 does seem to be less stable than others ... maybe because Netflix is soaking it dry? Or is it Netflix's doom to be using us-east-1.

Re:Based on yesterday's Amazon AWS outage (3, Informative)

rgbrenner (317308) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391249)

1 Netflix does use multiple zones:
http://techblog.netflix.com/2011/04/lessons-netflix-learned-from-aws-outage.html [netflix.com]

2 US-East-1 is the default zone, and it is the largest zone. It may even be larger than all of the others combined. It consists of more than 10 datacenters in the VA area. It is also the oldest, and it's where Amazon launches new services first.

Re:Based on yesterday's Amazon AWS outage (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42391559)

Well how come that didn't help Netflix survive the outage yesterday, hmm?

Re:Based on yesterday's Amazon AWS outage (2)

6ULDV8 (226100) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391155)

If you'll read Amazon's comments at http://status.aws.amazon.com/ [amazon.com] , you'll see that the problem was located and later resolved at Amazon. Netflix wasn't the only service affected.

Re:Based on yesterday's Amazon AWS outage (4, Informative)

rgbrenner (317308) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391139)

Right.. Google is NEVER down [techcrunch.com]

Re:Based on yesterday's Amazon AWS outage (1)

gelfling (6534) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391373)

No of course it is. Netflix though has a pretty terrible record. When it's down it's for a day.

Re:Based on yesterday's Amazon AWS outage (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42392119)

Right.. Google is NEVER down [techcrunch.com]

Well, considering that Google was partially down for 18 minutes [google.com] prompting comments like "Does the Earth stop turning on it's axis when Gmail is down?" (from your link), I think it's pretty safe to say that Google's reliability is excellent. Perfect, no. Perfection doesn't exist. But if you can't get to Google, odds are very good (~99.999%, to be precise) it's a problem on your end.

Re:Based on yesterday's Amazon AWS outage (1)

thetoadwarrior (1268702) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391491)

It's not like Google never has problems. They just had issues with Gmail and in terms of hosting given that the app engine doesn't have near the usage as AWS I'm not surprised that it would have less problems or at least fewer noticed problems.

Once again we are caught in the middle... (3, Interesting)

petscii (318753) | about a year and a half ago | (#42390955)

I don't torrent. I bought programs from amazon unbox service. I thought paying $1.99 for programs was fair... OK, I have to wait until the next day because the broadcast networks/cable people have an anti consumer bent towards people "buying" media from them. I'll spare you the rant about the the people who watch the shows being the product vs the shows themselves.

What is hugely obnoxious is that Amazon is using its position to punish people. You can't get the amazon player for android even though you can get it for the Kindle (which is based on android) and surprise you can get it for the iPad. So none of the content that I paid for will work on my Nexus 7.

Now I just wait for the DVD sets to hit the library.

Re:Once again we are caught in the middle... (1)

Lumpy (12016) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391495)

there is an apk of the player that is on kindle floating on the pirate bay. go grab it and install it.

Re:Once again we are caught in the middle... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42391577)

>there is an apk of the player that is on kindle floating on the pirate bay. go grab it and install it.

Putting a questionable .apk on a device does not solve the problem. Why not just advocate torrenting the media instead?

Re:Once again we are caught in the middle... (1)

Lumpy (12016) | about a year and a half ago | (#42398629)

I agree, any software from Amazon that is on their Kindle only, is certainly Questionable. and it does solve the problem, Do you not understand how computers work?

Re:Once again we are caught in the middle... (1, Interesting)

iamhassi (659463) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391569)

Apple took the smart approach and stuck with excellent software and hardware. Apple invented the modern smartphone and tablet market. Apple will sit back and watch everyone else destroy themselves while apple continues to integrate with whatever new service allows it. Google, Amazon or Facebook or all of them will eventually self implode, will Apple sits back and says WTF?

Smart move Apple, giving people what they want, instead of stuffing your own services down their face.

Re:Once again we are caught in the middle... (2)

shutdown -p now (807394) | about a year and a half ago | (#42393267)

Smart move Apple, giving people what they want, instead of stuffing your own services down their face.

That worked so well with Ping and Apple Maps ~

Re:Once again we are caught in the middle... (2)

shutdown -p now (807394) | about a year and a half ago | (#42393263)

So far, Amazon still has a better track record of providing access to content obtained from them on others' devices. Kindle and Amazon MP3 apps are both available on pretty much every mainstream desktop and mobile OS, and some more obscure ones (heck, they have a WP7 app!). Instant Video is available on iOS. Furthermore, both Instant Video and MP3 let you download your files in a non-DRM'd format, multiple times at that, so that they can be played in any regular player - compare it to Play Music and Play Video, which aren't even available on iOS.

Re:Once again we are caught in the middle... (1)

mu51c10rd (187182) | about a year and a half ago | (#42398073)

So none of the content that I paid for will work on my Nexus 7.

Funny, I watch Amazon Instant Video just fine on my Nook Tablet. Granted...I have to use the browser and no fancy app, but it does work. Have you tried watching Amazon through the web browser? Perhaps bookmark the page to make it one click away?

Re:Once again we are caught in the middle... (1)

Rysc (136391) | about a year and a half ago | (#42402917)

This is why I *do* torrent. I'm perfectly happy to buy when someone will sell me what I want, but when they won't *I'm going to get it anyway*, let the anti-consumer business beware. If what I want is a video I own and can watch whenever and wherever, and keep in my personal archive, then I'm going to get it no matter what laws they buy or technical restrictions they try to enforce. There's nothing immoral about having it your way and I'm going to continue to vote with my economic feet by not buying from those who won't sell me what I want. They can adapt and profit or go out of business, it's all the same to me.

Ironic (2, Insightful)

tuppe666 (904118) | about a year and a half ago | (#42390987)

Recently as part of Googles defence against Microsofts smear campaign against "Shopping search monopoly" Amzason where given as an example of where 40% of shoppers go first.

Cyberpunk (5, Funny)

Quakeulf (2650167) | about a year and a half ago | (#42390991)

I hope we will see the rise of cyberpunk with real competing technology businesses with their own secret task-forces and total disregard for human life in order to turn a profit and curb their competition!

I *think* you'd LOVE this flick then... apk (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42391345)

CYPHER -> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcPgyocJeF4&feature=related [youtube.com]

* It's a LOT like what you describe...

Probably isn't that 'far off the mark' or even going on already to SOME extent... & eventually, it probably WILL be done, with the means shown in that film in the near future for 'corporate espionage' purposes + more.

Especially given that corporations ARE already funding "Matrix-Like Learning" here via KickStarter -> http://nissannews.com/en-US/nissan/usa/releases/nissan-announces-winners-for-innovation-garage-social-media-campaign [nissannews.com]

You see it in films? It's only, imo @ least only around 10-40 yrs. away... if that.

APK

P.S.=> Good flick too - Jeremy Northam's impressing me more & more as a "thespian" (he has a LOT of 'range' - from playing the GREAT "Walter Hagen" in "Bobby Jones: Stroke of Genius" (lol, loved his part there, Walter Hagen's my kind of guy), then into this role too)...

... apk

Re:Cyberpunk (1)

epSos-de (2741969) | about a year and a half ago | (#42402995)

They could build a peer to peer marketplace, where users have ratings and very easy to create product pages. Take away the fees for transaction and you will beat Amazon and Google. Anyone can copy Amazon and ebay into one, make it with 3% commission rate and beat out the competition, while improving the shopping for the masses.

Ads don't cut into my bandwidth (or cash)... apk (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42391121)

So - IF you DON'T want to be:

A.) Tracked
B.) Spammed
C.) Speed/bandwidth hogged by ads (as well as electricity, CPU cycles, RAM, & other forms of I/O as well)
D.) Hit by malware or malicious scripts (for better "layered-security"/"defense-in-depth")
E.) Hit by DNS poisoning redirection (OR DNS servers being "downed") losing reliability
F.) Blocked out & have even more 'anonymity' (to an extent vs. DNS request logs) + being able to "blow by" what you may feel are unjust blocks (in DNSBL's)... ...& more? Use this:

---

APK Hosts File Engine 5.0++ 32-bit & 64-bit:

http://start64.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=5851:apk-hosts-file-engine-64bit-version&catid=26:64bit-security-software&Itemid=74 [start64.com]

---

Custom hosts files gain me the following benefits (A short summary of where custom hosts files can be extremely useful):

---

1.) Blocking out malware/malscripted sites.
2.) Blocking out Known sites-servers/hosts-domains that are known to serve up malware.
3.) Blocking out Bogus DNS servers malware makers use.
4.) Blocking out Botnet C&C servers.
5.) Blocking out Bogus adbanners that are full of malicious script content.
6.) Blocking out known spammers &/or phishers.
7.) Blocking out TRACKERS.
8.) Getting you back speed/bandwidth you paid for by blocking out adbanners + hardcoding in your favorite sites (faster than remote DNS server resolution).
9.) Added reliability (vs. downed or misdirect/poisoned DNS servers).
10.) Added "anonymity" (to an extent, vs. DNS request logs).
11.) The ability to bypass DNSBL's (DNS block lists you may not agree with).
12.) More screen "real estate" (since no more adbanners appear onscreen eating up CPU, Memory, & other forms of I/O too - bonus!).
13.) Truly UNIVERSAL PROTECTION (since any OS, even on smartphones, usually has a BSD drived IP stack).
14.) Faster & MORE EFFICIENT operation vs. browser plugins (which "layer on" ontop of Ring 3/RPL 3/usermode browsers & are generally written in slower INTERPRETED languages (e.g. AdBlock = python/perl/javascript)- Whereas by way of comparison, the hosts file operates @ the Ring 0/RPL 0/Kernelmode of operation (far faster) as a filter for the IP stack itself which is written in C & Assembly language...).
15.) Custom hosts files work on ANY & ALL webbound apps (browser plugins do not).
16.) Custom hosts files offer a better, faster, more efficient way, & safer way to surf the web & are COMPLETELY controlled by the end-user of them.

---

* There you go... & above all else IF you choose to try it for the enumerated list of benefits I extolled above?

Enjoy the program!

(However, more importantly, enjoy the results in better speed/bandwidth, privacy, reliability, "layered-security"/"defense-in-depth", & even anonymity to an extent (vs. DNS request logs & blowing past DNSBL's) + more, that custom hosts files can yield...)

Of course, THIS is NOT going to "go well" with 3 types of people out there online, profiting by advertising & nefarious exploits + more @ YOUR expense as the consumer:

---

A.) Malware makers & the like (botnet masters, etc./et al)
B.) ADVERTISERS - Offended ones since it's their "lifeblood" in psychological attack, tracking, & more, etc.!
C.) Webmasters (who profit by ad banners, but fail to realize that those SAME adbanners suck away the users' bandwidth/speed, electricity, CPU cycles, RAM, & other forms of I/O they PAY FOR, plus, adbanners DO get infested with malicious code, & if anyone wants many "examples thereof" from the past near-decade now? Ask!)

---

* There you are...

APK

P.S.=> So, let Amazon or others "build out their advertising infrastructure" ALL THEY WANT to... I can "snuff it out" here, & so could you using the same means shown above (using the end result, a custom hosts file)... why?

---

THE NEXT AD YOU CLICK MAY BE A VIRUS:

http://it.slashdot.org/story/09/06/15/2056219/The-Next-Ad-You-Click-May-Be-a-Virus [slashdot.org]

Yahoo, Microsoft's Bing display toxic ads:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/09/16/bing_yahoo_malware_ads/ [theregister.co.uk]

Malware torrent delivered over Google, Yahoo! ad services:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/09/24/malware_ads_google_yahoo/ [theregister.co.uk]

Rogue ads infiltrate Expedia and Rhapsody:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/01/30/excite_and_rhapsody_rogue_ads/ [theregister.co.uk]

Google sponsored links caught punting malware:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/12/16/google_sponsored_links/ [theregister.co.uk]

DoubleClick caught supplying malware-tainted ads:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/11/13/doubleclick_distributes_malware/ [theregister.co.uk]

Yahoo feeds Trojan-laced ads to MySpace and PhotoBucket users:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/09/11/yahoo_serves_12million_malware_ads/ [theregister.co.uk]

Real Media attacks real people via RealPlayer:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/10/23/real_media_serves_malware/ [theregister.co.uk]

Attacks Targeting Classified Ad Sites Surge:

http://it.slashdot.org/story/11/02/02/1433210/Attacks-Targeting-Classified-Ad-Sites-Surge [slashdot.org]

Hackers Respond To Help Wanted Ads With Malware:

http://it.slashdot.org/story/11/01/20/0228258/Hackers-Respond-To-Help-Wanted-Ads-With-Malware [slashdot.org]

Ruskie gang hijacks Microsoft network to push penis pills:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/10/12/microsoft_ips_hijacked/ [theregister.co.uk]

Major ISPs Injecting Ads, Vulnerabilities Into Web:

http://it.slashdot.org/story/08/04/19/2148215/major-isps-injecting-ads-vulnerabilities-into-web [slashdot.org]

Two Major Ad Networks Found Serving Malware:

http://tech.slashdot.org/story/10/12/13/0128249/Two-Major-Ad-Networks-Found-Serving-Malware [slashdot.org]

NY TIMES INFECTED WITH MALWARE ADBANNER:

http://news.slashdot.org/story/09/09/13/2346229/new-york-times-site-pop-up-says-your-computer-is-infected [slashdot.org]

MICROSOFT HIT BY MALWARES IN ADBANNERS:

http://apcmag.com/microsoft_apologises_for_serving_malware.htm [apcmag.com]

ADOBE FLASH ADS INJECTING MALWARE INTO THE NET:

http://it.slashdot.org/story/08/08/20/0029220/adobe-flash-ads-launching-clipboard-hijack-attacks [slashdot.org]

London Stock Exchange Web Site Serving Malware:

http://www.securityweek.com/london-stock-exchange-web-site-serving-malware [securityweek.com]

Spotify splattered with malware-tainted ads:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/03/25/spotify_malvertisement_attack/ [theregister.co.uk]

Demonoid Down For a Week, Serving Malware Laden Ads:

http://yro.slashdot.org/story/12/08/02/1427257/demonoid-down-for-a-week-serving-malware-laden-ads [slashdot.org]

Google's DoubleClick spreads malicious ads (again):

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/02/24/doubleclick_distributes_malware/ [theregister.co.uk]

Ad networks owned by Google, Microsoft serve malware:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/12/13/doubleclick_msn_malware_attacks/ [theregister.co.uk]

Hackers Use Banner Ads on Major Sites to Hijack Your PC:

http://www.wired.com/techbiz/media/news/2007/11/doubleclick [wired.com]

---

Plus, there IS this as well:

Adbanners slow you down & consume your bandwidth YOU pay for, as well as CPU cycles, RAM, & other forms of I/O that cost money in electricity:

ADBANNERS SLOW DOWN THE WEB: -> http://tech.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=09/11/30/166218 [slashdot.org]

---

And people do NOT LIKE ads on the web:

PEOPLE DISLIKE ADBANNERS: http://yro.slashdot.org/yro/08/04/02/0058247.shtml [slashdot.org]

---

As well as this:

Users Know Advertisers Watch Them, and Hate It:

http://yro.slashdot.org/yro/08/04/02/0058247.shtml [slashdot.org]

---

Advertising Network Caught History Stealing:

http://yro.slashdot.org/story/11/07/22/156225/Advertising-Network-Caught-History-Stealing [slashdot.org]

... apk

Advertising vs. personal info (1)

Skapare (16644) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391175)

Which is the more evil? Just advertising? Or stealing person info and selling it, or placing ads based on it?

Funny name (1)

CptPicard (680154) | about a year and a half ago | (#42391203)

If only it were Chihuahua... chien is "dog" in French :)

Slashdot...news for faggots (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42391481)

goatses that matter

Battle of the Monopolies (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42394025)

The Free Market and Capitalism at its best.

Books only at Amazon (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#42396599)

I only buy books at Amazon. Let's start a movement. Books only at Amazon. Buy nothing from Google, except maybe cloud storage. Keep the web free - free from giant monopolies.

Spread your data (1)

mu51c10rd (187182) | about a year and a half ago | (#42398123)

Better yet:
1. Buy books at Barnes and Noble.
2. Use a Kindle Tablet.
3. Listen to music on iTunes.
4. Search with Google.
5. Use Microsoft Xbox for gaming.
6. Use Linux for the desktop.
7. Watch movies on Netflix.
Let's see the advertisers figure that one out.

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