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Pakistan Lifts YouTube Ban For 3 Minutes, Finds More Blasphemy

timothy posted about a year ago | from the reality-preempts-the-onion dept.

Censorship 275

On Saturday, Pakistan briefly lifted the months-old ban on YouTube, spurred by the widely distributed U.S.-made video presented as a trailer for a film titled "Innocence of Muslims" and decried in many places around the world as blasphemous toward Islam. "After months of criticism of the ban, the government decided to allow Pakistanis to have access to YouTube again, saying steps had been taken to ensure that offensive content would not be visible. But those efforts apparently failed, and the authorities quickly backtracked," writes the New York Times. "Quickly" is right: access to YouTube was apparently open for just three minutes, which seems about right; it shouldn't take longer than that to discover things on the site to which adherents of any particular religion might take umbrage. What's surprising is that this took lifting the censorship on a wide scale, rather than just taking a smaller peek through tunneling software.

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275 comments

summary (1, Offtopic)

Ultra64 (318705) | about a year ago | (#42428391)

I think you accidentally a word.

Re:summary (0)

timothy (36799) | about a year ago | (#42428425)

Thanks -- you're right, I.

Blasphemy in whose term ? (5, Insightful)

Taco Cowboy (5327) | about a year ago | (#42428811)

While the majority of the Pakis are Muslims, the Pakistan population is *NOT* 100% Islamic.

There are Hindus and Christians living in Pakistan.

Just because something is viewed as "blaspheme" to _some_ of the Muslims that doesn't mean it is blasphemic to the Hindus or the Christians.

To ban Internet just because of the "Islamic blaspheme" is to exercise the "Tyranny of the Majority" rule.

Imagine if America set up a law banning open prayer due to "noise pollution" - that would certainly makes the lives of many Muslims that bit tougher, wouldn't it?

Re:Blasphemy in whose term ? (2)

Belial6 (794905) | about a year ago | (#42428879)

Actually, what would be more similar would be if the US banned buying booze on Sundays or after 2am. While not universal, it is the law in many parts of the US.

Re:Blasphemy in whose term ? (2)

Shavano (2541114) | about a year ago | (#42429109)

Doesn't matter. The fact that they shut it down after 3 minutes means that there was a large number of people queued up to complain / issue threats before they even brought YouTube back on line. They crossed the censorship agency's threshold immediately and they began shutting back down immediately.

Only 3 minutes!? (4, Funny)

PPH (736903) | about a year ago | (#42428419)

Even Pakistan has better broadband than we do.

[Sigh]

Re:Only 3 minutes!? (4, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42428429)

That's because they don't have to deal with the bandwidth of people downloading youtube videos.

Boo hoo (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42428421)

My god doesn't give a rip if you call her a bitch.

Re:Boo hoo (4, Insightful)

MysteriousPreacher (702266) | about a year ago | (#42428615)

It's no the sensibilities of your god that worries me. It's the sensibilities of the primates that have appointed themselves as his/her/it's guardians and spokesmen.

If there really is a wise and loving god, he must surely be sitting there wondering firstly, why the fuck people are dying over cartoons and silly videos, and secondly, why he doesn't do something to stop it? It'd save use some hassle if he could ditch this vague communication through personally revealed and contradictory revelation to some yahoo in a cave. I remember back in the old days when, if God was pissed, he'd be personally smiting your arse. None of this vague tossing of tornadoes in to areas already known for naturally occurring tornadoes - with churches and brothels alike being smashed. Of course personal appearances would fuck with free will, while tornadoes and allowing nut jobs to run wild is free will for the poor victims. I'm not even sure how free will is any different whether the information is provided via divinely revealed texts, or a simple one-one-one communication with every single person? Either way, free will is impacted by external interference. I'm not even convinced that free will is necessary, if the angels who rebelled lived in Heaven and still had the free will to rebel. Fuck it. Tell us the deal and let us decided. Unless that happens, we'll continue to live on a ball of rock infested with people who hurt and confuse people by claiming to speak on behalf of a god that no-one seems to understand.

Re:Boo hoo (4, Insightful)

X0563511 (793323) | about a year ago | (#42428671)

Or they could stop claiming to speak on behalf of a God that they do not actually speak for.

God told us to kill the infidels! God told us homosexuality is evil! Bullshit. You decided that on your own, and you're sticking divinity on it for the power.

Re:Boo hoo (2)

Austerity Empowers (669817) | about a year ago | (#42428699)

If so, he could hardly blame us for not believing in him, as he hasn't exactly left an abundance of evidence proving that he exists. Free will still exists, I frequently disobey almost everything I'm told, sometimes for no reason at all. I'm fairly sure if God proved himself and said "thou shalt sex for procreation only", I, and quite a lot of others, would go straight to hell.

Re:Boo hoo (3, Interesting)

shentino (1139071) | about a year ago | (#42428749)

Is God the only supernatural force capable of slinging tornadoes around?

Sometimes I wonder how many people believe in God without believing in the devil.

Re:Boo hoo (1)

MysteriousPreacher (702266) | about a year ago | (#42429167)

From experience (mostly Catholic and CoE) most would believe the devil exists. From that point it gets muddy because scripturally the devil is kind of vaguely described, and he makes no sense.

The notion that "the adversary" could challenge God is to imagine that Chevy Chase could in unarmed combat defeat and kill the entire US Marine Corps. Satan is a really strange character, with his role in Christianity being pretty inconsistent with the Jewish understanding. Although popular depictions aren't hard theology, they do hint at how people see these characters. God is the father, with a beard and living up in a cloudy place. Satan is a being, with horns and a tail, and he loves tempting good people and punishing the bad ones. Jesus was a blue-eyed bearded guy who was well groomed and dressed sharply. That's not far off the unsophisticated views that I've found common among Christians.

Re:Boo hoo (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42429053)

Chimps get a bad wrap. It's been downhill ever since Roddy McDowel started listening to Charlton Heston.

Heston ended up with a horse, a girl, a gun, an Oedipal complex and a paid position fronting for the NRA, and all we got was a war to mask 7 years of USGS surveys in the most God forsaken area of the Hindu Kush. Then, even with the most highly trained, best equipped military in the world, complete with satellites and drones, the U.S. military couldn't successfully fight a war on drugs there, let alone find Osama bin Laden without the help of his doctor.

Blashphemy is in the eye of the beholder.

Re:Boo hoo (4, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42429277)

Free will is generally used to explain why God doesn't protect children from rapists, not why He keeps His presence a secret. That is what faith is for. Faith is believing when there is no (or at least not sufficient) evidence. Of course, there is nothing inherently virtuous about faith...if someone chooses to believe (on faith) every con artist out to get his money, we don't consider that person virtuous. So why does God value faith so highly? That is where the "mysterious ways" justification comes in.

The bottom line is simple: a priest cannot give you compelling reasons to believe, nor can a priest explain why a divine and powerful being would abide such evil. So the priest must rely on these concepts to explain away the lack of compelling warrant for belief. But, any hypothesis that justifies its own lack of evidence remains a hypotheses with no evidence, and any model that explains why it makes no sense remains a model that makes no sense.

Who cares? (1)

singingjim1 (1070652) | about a year ago | (#42428423)

I'm surprised it was up for a full 3 minutes. Let's just cut them off from the Internet completely since they are in the dark ages anyway.

Re:Who cares? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42428483)

Cutting them off would cut them off from civilization, you know, porn and stuff.
That they had to open the entire broadband just to take a peek speaks loudly about their own incompetence as well. Let's not make it any easier for them to raise and train terrorists. It's enough that US (not "we"), dronestrike their families from afar.

Re:Who cares? (3, Informative)

Grishnakh (216268) | about a year ago | (#42428505)

If you're a US Citizen, "we" is the correct term, like it or not. The US Citizens elect the US government.

Re:Who cares? (1)

Cinder6 (894572) | about a year ago | (#42428521)

Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos!

Re:Who cares? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42428717)

Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos!

Don't blame me, *I* don't vote.

Because it's a fucking stupid waste of time in my country (The United States of America).

I've been telling people for years that enough people stop voting and paying the IRS things will actually change.

Re:Who cares? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42428769)

Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos!

Don't blame me, *I* don't vote.

Because it's a fucking stupid waste of time in my country (The United States of America).

I've been telling people for years that enough people stop voting and paying the IRS things will actually change.

How the hell can you stop paying the IRS? If you get a job, they take your taxes out before you even see them.

I sure wish the US citizens would ban withholding taxes - make people actually have to PAY their own taxes. No little bit of sales tax added to all sales, either.

That was we'd have a real discussion about the cost of government and how much We The People are REALLY willing to pay for.

Oh, and no corporate taxes either - ALL taxes have to be ACTUALLY PAID by the INDIVIDUAL responsible for paying them. That would eliminate all the crap lobbying that corporations do to get special tax treatment.

Re:Who cares? (1)

TFAFalcon (1839122) | about a year ago | (#42428883)

So how would you tax corporations giving loans to their owners, then 'forgetting' to demand repayment? Or just charging 0.1% interest for 100 years.

There are plenty of ways to move money from a corporation into private hands, and most of them are not easily taxable. There is also the problem of the location of owners. Suddenly every major stockholder will be a citizen of the cayman islands, paying no taxes (aside from a small bribe to the local government). So corporations will be free to exploit US infrastructure and services, but give back even less then they do now.

Re:Who cares? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42428951)

So how would you tax corporations giving loans to their owners, then 'forgetting' to demand repayment? Or just charging 0.1% interest for 100 years.

There are plenty of ways to move money from a corporation into private hands, and most of them are not easily taxable. There is also the problem of the location of owners. Suddenly every major stockholder will be a citizen of the cayman islands, paying no taxes (aside from a small bribe to the local government). So corporations will be free to exploit US infrastructure and services, but give back even less then they do now.

WTF?

The location of an individual is a hell of a lot easier problem to solve than the location of some amorphous ethereal paper creation like a corporation.

Re:Who cares? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42428987)

How the hell can you stop paying the IRS? If you get a job, they take your taxes out before you even see them.

There are quite a few legal ways. The first obvious one is to choose to live in poverty. If you make less than a certain amount of income, you don't pay income tax.

I sure wish the US citizens would ban withholding taxes - make people actually have to PAY their own taxes. No little bit of sales tax added to all sales, either.

I sure wish the US repealed the income tax laws and we revert to pre-Civil War revenue streams for the Federal Government. Oh you didn't know? Income taxes were imposed during the Civil War to fund the war. The Federal Government ran on import tariffs. Either we are the biggest consumer market on the planet or we aren't, and if we are, you foreign cock suckers have been bleeding us dry for too long now. Time to make you fuckers pay YOUR tariffs to peddle your crappy wares.

That was we'd have a real discussion about the cost of government and how much We The People are REALLY willing to pay for.

Oh, and no corporate taxes either - ALL taxes have to be ACTUALLY PAID by the INDIVIDUAL responsible for paying them. That would eliminate all the crap lobbying that corporations do to get special tax treatment.

Nonsense. First you can't say "the US citizens" and then switch to "We The People". Pick a fucking side and stick to it. It's multi-national corporations that are bleeding We The People (I'm a US citizen, and proud of it) by skirting import tariffs and taxes.

I'm fine with them not paying taxes, but when they try to peddle their multi-national wares back "home" on US soil they should be paying tariffs high enough to fund the entire Federal Government. As it once was. As it rightfully should be.

You also wouldn't have a military (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42429037)

You didnt have a military.

You didn't have a national road network.

You didn't have free education, heathcare or things like that for ANYONE.

Hell, you didn't even have emergency services or telephones.

So go back to those bygone eras of no taxes and instead go to your draft office and sign up for your tour of duty in Afghanistan for no pay (there's no tax to pay for your salary and you're not working for your boss, so no payment for YOU).

Re:Who cares? (1)

LocalH (28506) | about a year ago | (#42428771)

Funny, if everyone who felt the way you did actually voted out these corrupt Republicrats, maybe something would change?

Nah, much easier to be a lazy ass and let others determine the future of the nation. Then you can smugly point a finger at everyone else while being ignorant that [b]you[/b] are part of the problem.

Re:Who cares? (4, Insightful)

amiga3D (567632) | about a year ago | (#42428531)

Hey! I voted for Ron Paul!

Re:Who cares? (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42428591)

Hey! I voted for Ron Paul!

So, essentially, you voted for Romney.

Re:Who cares? (2, Insightful)

Grishnakh (216268) | about a year ago | (#42428631)

No, not really. It depends on which state he was in. If he was in a Red state, he effectively voted for Obama; in a Blue state, he effectively voted for Romney. In either state, if it wasn't close to being a swing state, it really didn't matter, his vote wouldn't have affected the results anyway.

Regardless, it's the fault of US Citizens that this ridiculous election scheme persists.

Re:Who cares? (2)

Threni (635302) | about a year ago | (#42428901)

> Regardless, it's the fault of US Citizens that this ridiculous election scheme persists.

Democracy?

Re:Who cares? (2, Interesting)

Grishnakh (216268) | about a year ago | (#42429197)

In case you weren't paying attention, no, I'm referring to the election scheme where voters in any given US state only elect the Electors who elect the President, and worse, it's a simple majority, so that if Obama wins California by 51%, for instance, he gets all the Electoral votes for that whole state, rather than a proportion of them. Even better would be to just eliminate the Electoral College altogether, so that any US Citizens' vote counts the same as any other, rather than people from Rhode Island and Wyoming getting a bigger vote than people from California or Texas.

Re:Who cares? (1)

Belial6 (794905) | about a year ago | (#42428913)

That is the lie that helps keep corruption alive.

Re:Who cares? (1)

Grishnakh (216268) | about a year ago | (#42429213)

What lie? There's no lie there, that's exactly how the Electoral College system works (in conjunction with first-past-the-post or Plurality voting systems).

Re:Who cares? (5, Insightful)

fustakrakich (1673220) | about a year ago | (#42428705)

That's bullshit. Only the people that voted for Romney voted for Romney. People who voted for Ron Paul voted for Ron Paul. Don't try to lay the guilt trip on those who didn't vote for your favorite candidate.

Re:Who cares? (1)

Jawnn (445279) | about a year ago | (#42428943)

That's bullshit. Only the people that voted for Romney voted for Romney. People who voted for Ron Paul voted for Ron Paul. Don't try to lay the guilt trip on those who didn't vote for your favorite candidate.

To believe this is to ignore reality, that reality being that Ron Paul never had a chance at being elected. You may honestly say that, on principle, you deliberately threw away your vote, but you may not ignore the fact that such an act didn't have at least the potential to affect the outcome between the two viable candidates.

Re:Who cares? (0)

michael_rendier (2601249) | about a year ago | (#42428551)

Some US Citizens elect the government...some refuse to play that game and be a part of the problem...*points finger at self*

Re:Who cares? (3, Insightful)

Grishnakh (216268) | about a year ago | (#42428637)

It doesn't matter if you vote or not; you're a Citizen, so the government is your responsibility, just like Arab countries' governments are those citizens' responsibilities, and when they got sick enough of them, they rose up and overthrew them. If you don't like your government, it's your responsibility to overthrow it.

Re:Who cares? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42428569)

I thought that was an old wives tale?

Re:Who cares? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42428545)

The reality is, the Taliban probably has their own internet access points and its jury rigged pretty good I bet. Probably better then some rural ISP's.

The Pakistan government does not control Pakistan. They just make laws and police small territorial areas. The rest of Pakistan is divided between a bunch of other tribal leaders. This is probably just an excuse so that if some young pakistani tribal kid goes to the city with their iPhone they can bust em.

Re:Who cares? (5, Funny)

arielCo (995647) | about a year ago | (#42428575)

I'm surprised it was up for a full 3 minutes.

Must... resist...

That's what SHE said!

Sorry, had to.

Something needs to be done about these Governments (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42428449)

Something needs to be done about these Governments. It seems that these religiously motivated governments are rampaging badly out of control. There needs to be a way to prevent this, and undermine the legitimacy of these governments. I don't know what to do, but this can't go on. The Internet is about the free exchange of ideas. Islamic governments around the world are like this.

Re:Something needs to be done about these Governme (3, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42428471)

There are millions of people in these countries that support this. You will have to change their minds first.

Re:Something needs to be done about these Governme (1)

Grishnakh (216268) | about a year ago | (#42428515)

So you want to what? Invade and install puppet governments? Yeah, that really embodies the ideals of freedom and self-determination, doesn't it?

The governments in these countries exist because they have popular support. Very few governments exist without popular support from their people; usually, the only ones that don't are ones which have military and/or financial support from outside powers. For those without outside nations propping them up (like the Shah in Iran), they usually don't last very long, as the people get sick of things and overthrow that government and install their own (just as the Shah was overthrown and replaced with Iran's current theocratic government).

Re:Something needs to be done about these Governme (1)

clarkkent09 (1104833) | about a year ago | (#42428605)

The governments in these countries exist because they have popular support
 
Popular support is overrated. It does not make it ok for a government to deny citizens the rights that in my humble opinion and in the opinion of the signatories of the UN charter are universal. If 51% votes that the other 49% should be enslaved (as in the case of women in Islamic countries) or killed (as in the case of gays or Jews), that does not make it right or legal. Yes perhaps we (the civilized world) should in that case invade and protect the oppressed minorities.

Re:Something needs to be done about these Governme (1)

Grishnakh (216268) | about a year ago | (#42428657)

The "civilized world" has far fewer people than the rest of the world. Are you saying that your opinion on things is more valid than everyone else's? Who made you god? If the "civilized world" decided to invade every country where some minority was being oppressed (even if that means all females in that country), they'd end up having to kill most of humanity. How else are you going to enforce your new minority-protecting laws anyway? You'd have to have a policeman for every two people out there; that's clearly impractical, so the only way to enforce your laws is to kill all the oppressors, which probably means killing all men. Plus, what are you going to do in the many cases where the oppressed minorities are themselves oppressors of some other minority (e.g. oppressed Muslim groups themselves oppress the women in their ranks)? Finally, what are you going to do about all the oppressed minorities in the "civilized world" nations? These nations haven't cleaned their own houses yet; how can they tell others how to run theirs?

Re:Something needs to be done about these Governme (4, Insightful)

clarkkent09 (1104833) | about a year ago | (#42428677)

Several things are wrong with your post but let me just point out three things:
1) you do not have to be perfect in order to pass judgment on evil (otherwise evil will always get a free pass)
2) we may not be perfect but we don't have laws requiring a raped woman to provide 4 male witnesses or else whip her for adultery and we do not hang gay people off cranes in public squares, so there are degrees of perfection you may wish to explore
3) Not being able to right every wrong does not mean you should not right at least some wrongs

Re:Something needs to be done about these Governme (1)

Grishnakh (216268) | about a year ago | (#42428713)

You still haven't answered how you're going to enforce these laws. In a country where the laws require a raped woman to have 4 male witnesses, how do you think you're going to enforce your new Western laws? The locals will not stand for it, and will not help you. We have similar problems here in our inner cities where the minorities will never talk to the cops; it's basically anarchy in those places as a result. You can't have effective policing without help from the community unless you erect a totalitarian police state, and that requires enormous resources. And where are we going to get people to be police in all these countries that we now have to conquer? It's not like we're going to have tons of Westerners lining up to go live in Saudi Arabia and Iran and be policemen there, living among the locals, learning their language, and enforcing unpopular Western laws. This is the same problem every occupying power has: it takes a LOT of resources to occupy a country and force its people to the occupier's will. Or are you one of those morons who really believed the Iraqi people would greet the American invaders as liberators?

The fundamental problem with your reasoning is that you don't seem to understand that things are like this in those countries because the people in those countries like it that way.

Re:Something needs to be done about these Governme (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42428817)

You still haven't answered how you're going to enforce these laws. In a country where the laws require a raped woman to have 4 male witnesses, how do you think you're going to enforce your new Western laws? The locals will not stand for it, and will not help you. We have similar problems here in our inner cities where the minorities will never talk to the cops; it's basically anarchy in those places as a result. You can't have effective policing without help from the community unless you erect a totalitarian police state, and that requires enormous resources. And where are we going to get people to be police in all these countries that we now have to conquer? It's not like we're going to have tons of Westerners lining up to go live in Saudi Arabia and Iran and be policemen there, living among the locals, learning their language, and enforcing unpopular Western laws. This is the same problem every occupying power has: it takes a LOT of resources to occupy a country and force its people to the occupier's will. Or are you one of those morons who really believed the Iraqi people would greet the American invaders as liberators?

The fundamental problem with your reasoning is that you don't seem to understand that things are like this in those countries because the people in those countries like it that way.

I seriously doubt that the 50% of the population that's female really likes it.

If we could somehow reach THEM, things would change FAST.

"Oh, you really think you're going to go run around with the Taliban tonight, wearing a turban and shooting that AK47? You do that, you ain't getting any for a month! And shave that damned beard, too! It looks like you've grown a squirrel's tail on your chin!"

Women. They've got half the money and all the pussy.

Re:Something needs to be done about these Governme (2, Insightful)

Grishnakh (216268) | about a year ago | (#42428887)

You're really naive if you believe that shit.

For one thing, many women do like it this way. They're taught this shit from the time they're born, so a lot of them believe it. It's sorta like Stockholm Syndrome, except worse when you're taught that you're good for nothing besides making babies from the time you're old enough to talk.

And of those who are smart enough to realize it's all bullshit, what are they going to do? Women are smaller and weaker than men. If they refuse to let their men have sex with them, they're going to be beaten to a pulp or worse. We used to do that here in America too, and the police were complicit. In some areas (Arizona City), they still are.

Women have zero power in those regions of the world. Women only have the power they do here in the West because society at large allows them to have that power, thanks to laws and a society that believes (more or less) in gender equality and equal rights for all. It took us centuries to achieve this; you can't force societal values like this on another society by force, they have to evolve it themselves. We've been trying to push our values on many places in the world like this for decades, and it's only made things worse. Iran used to be a very progressive place, probably the most progressive in the entire Middle East. Then their democratically-elected leaders did something to piss off the US government (didn't want to give them the best prices on oil), so the CIA overthrew them and installed the Shah, who was a brutal dictator. So much for Western values of equality and justice, huh? Well the Iranians got pissed off at this, overthrew the Shah (which the US is still mad about), and installed a fundamentalist Islamic theocracy. This is what happens when people react to outside interference: they become extremists. The exact same thing happened in Afghanistan, which also was a rather progressive place with pretty advanced women's rights (for the region, compared to now), until the Soviets invaded. The Islamic extremism in that region of the world is entirely the fault of the USA and the USSR.

Re:Something needs to be done about these Governme (1)

TFAFalcon (1839122) | about a year ago | (#42428995)

Saying something like that would likely get her beaten and maybe even maimed/killed. It's hard for a woman to assert power in a culture where she is little more then property of her husband. I guess she could kill him while he slept, but unless she managed to coordinate her actions with all the other women in the village/city, that would still get her killed.

Re:Something needs to be done about these Governme (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42429043)

"Oh, you really think you're going to go run around with the Taliban tonight, wearing a turban and shooting that AK47? You do that, you ain't getting any for a month! And shave that damned beard, too! It looks like you've grown a squirrel's tail on your chin!"

Women. They've got half the money and all the pussy.

They accept this because that's the way things work. Look at blacks in the Mormon church, and women who oppose the ordination of female clerics. Why do mothers participate in the mutilation of their daughters' genitals? These Uncle Toms are not commonly stepping outside of the roles they've accepted.

Re:Something needs to be done about these Governme (3, Insightful)

clarkkent09 (1104833) | about a year ago | (#42428841)

The fundamental problem with your reasoning is that you don't seem to understand that things are like this in those countries because the people in those countries like it that way.
 
The fundamental problem with your reasoning is that you don't seem to understand that not ALL the people in those countries like it that way. And no, I am not one of the morons who through Iraqi people would welcome us as liberators but I am one of the morons who thinks that Iraqis will be much better off in the long run as a result of the invasion and that other countries in the region will be better off as well as a knock off effects of the invasion, already visible in the "Arab spring" and protests in Iran. Yes "those people" are really just like us, they like freedom too. People act in accordance with cultural memes of the their time and place not by rational thinking. 500 years ego in Europe you would have probably said that people like the iron rule of the Church and burning of witches and if you had a poll they would have probably voted that way too, and yet that was changed. And no I do not support invading country after country, but I do support rejection of the prevailing chickenshit cultural relativism in the Western countries and for standing up for better and more human ways of organizing a society. Islamic countries are a black hole in the modern world when it comes to basic human rights and we are not doing them any favors by saying that that's ok.

Re:Something needs to be done about these Governme (1)

Grishnakh (216268) | about a year ago | (#42429171)

The only part of your "they like freedom too" idea is that if you look, the governments these people have set up after Arab Spring are largely even more fundamentalist and anti-equal rights than the ones they replaced. So no, they don't like freedom, at least not for everyone. They simply set up governments which more accurately reflected the cultural mores of their people.

500 years ago in Europe, people did like the iron rule of the Church and the burning of witches. That was changed because the attitudes of European people changed over time, not because a bunch of invaders came and forced their own values on them. In fact, a bunch of invaders did come; they were called Moors, and they took over the Iberian peninsula for a while, but were eventually thrown out. Their culture and values were mostly not adopted by the locals.

No one's (at least I'm not) saying that Islamic countries' human rights records are OK. I'm disagreeing with the ridiculous notion that invading them, slaughtering them by the thousands, and then forcing puppet governments on them is going to somehow turn them into believers of Western values. We've been trying that for decades, and it hasn't worked. Iraq is still an extremely violent country right now, far worse than it was under Saddam (who again, the US installed into power).

Fuck You Woman Worshiper. Marry Little Girls. (-1, Troll)

Mike3USA (2805061) | about a year ago | (#42428759)

Why should every man in the world, bar none, have to obey your religion (pro-women's rights, anti-male supremacy, etc belief system (no pedophile marriage with adorable sweet young girls)? Why can't other areas of the world hold fast to other religious belief systems? (And yes, the law system of the United States of America and the cultural beliefs (freedom for women, jprison for men who don't obey, prison or rape and death for men who try to have sweet little girls as their wives) is a belief system same as any other religion)?

Why can't Men rule in one area of the world, marry adorable little girls and keep them? Why does YOUR fucking religion which exalts womanhood and has use only for servile or supporting males (either on the passive side: working, the aggressive side: killing males who do not respect women all around the globe (and men who like little girls) or the serice to women side: hunks for dey bitches... untill she feels he should be in jail).

Fuck YOUR religion. I hope it is destroyed. If you don't stop the domination of the earth, every inch of it, for the female than what you need is a nuke up your ass

Deuteronomy 22 28-29 (in the hebrew): Rape a little girl who lives in her fathers house and has not yet been given to another man: you keep her forever and pay her father. AKA Pedophile rape. AKA Philip Garrado.

2 Samual 12 (a companion history book to deuteronomy): little lamb. The girl uriah married (bathsheba) was a young girl when he took her in and had her in his bed. God cursed david for killing him. Pedophile adoption and marraige (to use an english word)

There is no word for wife in hebrew (not in deuteronomy anyway). Only woman and girl. The man is called man or master (ba'al) (something the woman worshiping christians fumate against).

Fuck your pro-woman religion, your proclaimations. You need a nuke up your ass if you do not let males be free and enjoy as they wish and take young girls as their own.

Better the world be destroyed than it serve the women.

FUCK YOU.

Marry Little girls, they are nice, unlike women. (Which is why they are banned for marrying by the women and their supplicant male servants in any Anglo-conqured nation (whole world now).

Hope you get a nuke, since you won't let men be free. Paki has nukes.

Re:Fuck You Woman Worshiper. Marry Little Girls. (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42428885)

(insane Dark Ages barbaric rant deleted)

I sure hope that's satire.

Is there no such thing as equality, no such thing as natural rights?

And if that's not satire...

Pakistan has what? 10 nukes? Maybe a bit more? The US has what? TEN FUCKING THOUSAND?

Bring it, you FUCKING BARBARIANS

I've seen the Pakistani military in action. It's a fucking JOKE. Helo hangers on "naval" vessels are used as chicken coops. Illiterate Pakistani "techs" have to be taught that "magic" makes the radar work.

That the Pakistanis have nukes is more threatening to themselves. They're like a Thalidomide baby playing with a hand grenade.

The world would have been a better place if the near-war India and Pakistan had in late 2001 had happened, and India had cleaned out that cesspool with some blinding white flashes of their own.

Re:Fuck You Woman Worshiper. Marry Little Girls. (0)

Mike3USA (2805061) | about a year ago | (#42429089)

You will not leave any man in any part of the globe alone. There is nowhere else to run to. Men must either kuckle under or fight you. It is better to fight and die and do some damage to your woman's empire than to live under it's rules and then eventually die anyway. Fuck Your Woman's Religion. Since you won't let any man be free I HOPE you get a fucking NUKE. Marry little girls. Kill those who restrict men from this.

Re:Something needs to be done about these Governme (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42428623)

Why bother with Pakistan? You have people in the US that want to ban free speech [newsmax.com] or remove the right to protect yourself [senate.gov] while their kids are well protected [godfatherpolitics.com].

Sounds to me like they just run a more progressive liberal government than the US currently does. I'm sure their leadership has full access to You Tube but its not right for their people to have the same freedom. Just like in the US, the leaders have freedom of speech and armed guards, but you the lowely citizen have no need for such things and they are trying to correct it. Pakistan just doesn't have that pesky Constitution to deal with so they can do it easier.

Re:Something needs to be done about these Governme (0)

Exitar (809068) | about a year ago | (#42428681)

Sure, and something should be done about Governments without a decent welfare and unregulated sales of firearms.

Re:Something needs to be done about these Governme (1)

Jawnn (445279) | about a year ago | (#42428981)

Something needs to be done about these Governments. It seems that these religiously motivated governments are rampaging badly out of control. There needs to be a way to prevent this, and undermine the legitimacy of these governments. I don't know what to do, but this can't go on. The Internet is about the free exchange of ideas. Islamic governments around the world are like this.

Surely you aren't suggesting that Islam is the only religion that exerts an undesirable influence on government? Surely you grasp the fact that invoking any religion as the authority in law and government is, well..., stupid. Right?

Ban the Transistor! (4, Funny)

MarkvW (1037596) | about a year ago | (#42428453)

The darn transistor is the root of all blasphemy. It should be banned from the nation-states of the faithful!

Re:Ban the Transistor! (3, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42428503)

I say the transistor is the will of God. We are now enemies.

Re:Ban the Transistor! (5, Funny)

Cinder6 (894572) | about a year ago | (#42428543)

My (likely--hopefully--erroneous) understanding of Islam is that everything is the will of Allah. If that's the case, then Allah wills blasphemy. Thus, it stands to reason that blasphemy doesn't exist, because (presumably) anything Allah does is holy.

I hope my understanding is wrong, because that's more insanity than I'm comfortable with.

Re:Ban the Transistor! (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42428725)

My (likely--hopefully--erroneous) understanding of Islam is that everything is the will of Allah. If that's the case, then Allah wills blasphemy. Thus, it stands to reason that blasphemy doesn't exist, because (presumably) anything Allah does is holy.

I hope my understanding is wrong, because that's more insanity than I'm comfortable with.

Yeah, pretty much.

You just left out the part where it's your DUTY to kill blasphemers.

And all other non-Muslims along the way.

Lovely religion, ain't it? You'd almost think it was thought up by some Dark Ages pedophile L. Ron Hubbard bandit from East Bum Fuck Egypt, wouldn't you? And that he designed his "religion" specifically in order to make his followers willing to die for him.

Oh, wait. That's exactly what happened.

History didn't need to repeat itself for it to be a farce that time around.

Re:Ban the Transistor! (2, Insightful)

MysteriousPreacher (702266) | about a year ago | (#42428753)

My (likely--hopefully--erroneous) understanding of Islam is that everything is the will of Allah. If that's the case, then Allah wills blasphemy. Thus, it stands to reason that blasphemy doesn't exist, because (presumably) anything Allah does is holy.

I hope my understanding is wrong, because that's more insanity than I'm comfortable with.

Nope, you're obviously working from a very unsophisticated theology. The joy of sophisticated theology is that it can take the sentence "I love you and I hate you" and turn it in to something coherent. Anyone thinking that sentence negative is clearly taking it out of context. Anyone thinking the sentence is about love is clearly taking it out of context.

The problem is in men confabulating impossible ideas, and not having the slightest clue as to how they would make the shit work. Imagine a 2nd century stonemason attempting to describe the design and purpose of a lunar landing module. That's way simpler than an infinitely powerful being, yet we know it'd result in nonsense. He'd probably slap-on bird-like wings and other goofy stuff. It's no-wonder they failed miserably in building a coherent description of something that probably doesn't even exist.

I had a recent discussion along these lines, where a Christian and myself discussed Revelation. If that book is taken to be prophetic, then can the devil screw it up by spending Armageddon day in bed? If he can't then why? Is he so dumb that he forgot that his boss can destroy everything on a whim? Has he not read that far in the Bible? Is he God's marionette, in which case, how can we blame him when he's nothing more than an character in God's story? Why did he rebel, in the full knowledge that God could smite him on the spot, and why did God not kill him? Can I really exercise free will while this incredibly powerful fallen angel is tempting me, and God himself is to all intents and purposes absent? It can't be about giving us free will because that's a requirement of salvation. How about the angels, who must presumably have some kind of free will to have rebelled - unless they're just automatons being used in God's odd plan to condemn to Hell the majority of all humans who've ever lived. It's a complete mess.

The Bible and the Koran have plot holes and continuity errors that would make a b-movie screenwriter blush.

Stone-age morons. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42428473)

Pakistan will be a basket case for as long as they let themselves be ruled by these fucking head-chopping savages. India was lucky to get rid of them in the 1940s.

Taking a Peek (1)

wisnoskij (1206448) | about a year ago | (#42428481)

I am sure officials took many a peek, I am sure they had some idea what they were unbanning. But 5 million people browsing for 3 minutes can uncover a lot more than 1 guy browsing for days.

Censorship backfire (3, Insightful)

EmperorOfCanada (1332175) | about a year ago | (#42428513)

I suspect that the average Pakistani thinks little of their government; thus anything the government blocks must be good and should be checked out. I suspect that the total amount of blasphemy watched is higher in the end as the population end runs any poorly implemented systems the same way Canadians end run the whole "This content not available in your region."

Go, blasphemy, go (2)

Animats (122034) | about a year ago | (#42428565)

Keep that blasphemy going out. The nuttier religions need criticism, ridicule, and opposition. As soon as a religion gets temporal power, like the power to put people in jail, it's in the politics business. Leaders of such religions have to take all the heat politicians do.

If the only way to tame out of control religions is war, that's worse for everybody, including the leaders of the religions. Historically, leaders of militant religions don't do well when they lose a war. See most of European history prior to 1800 or so.

Re:Go, blasphemy, go (4, Insightful)

pwizard2 (920421) | about a year ago | (#42428597)

The way to kill religion is to laugh and ridicule it to death. Violence just strengthens it.

Re:Go, blasphemy, go (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42428661)

The way to kill religion is to laugh and ridicule it to death. Violence just strengthens it.

Not just religion - any entrenched form of power.
We need more ridicule of the MAFIAA, the TSA, DHS, the 1%, etc.
You can't win against any of them in a fair fight, so hit them in ways they can't understand.

this sounds like a country that (1)

nimbius (983462) | about a year ago | (#42428571)

enacts its censorship roughly the same way i direct my gaze in the locker room at the gym. Although I say elderly instead of blashphemy.

The average Pakistani (2)

Bizzeh (851225) | about a year ago | (#42428579)

The average Pakistani probably has no idea about any blasphemy on youtube, the people who are viewing the most blasphemy on youtube in pakistan are the people looking for it within the government so that they can block it.

Re:The average Pakistani (1)

Shavano (2541114) | about a year ago | (#42429207)

The average Pakistani probably has no idea about any blasphemy on youtube, the people who are viewing the most blasphemy on youtube in pakistan are the people looking for it within the government so that they can block it.

I think so. In America, the internet is for porn [youtube.com]. In Pakistan, it's for blasphemy.

LOL...'widely distributed'... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42428621)

Yea, *tons* of people were watching that crappy video until it was censored....

Nobody saw or cared about that video until it was used as a scapegoat.

Re:LOL...'widely distributed'... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42428797)

I can't believe Slashdot (and the media, in general) is still frequently perpetuating this whole "Innocence of Muslims" thing. We've even seen people still claiming that it caused the deaths in Benghazi, when even our own government has said that is not the case. It was used as a scapegoat and a cover-up for weeks, until the truth (that we all pushed for) finally came out. Nobody was actually up in arms or rioting over this stupid trailer or film and idiots on websites need to stop posting news about it as if that is real. If you say "Innocence of Muslims caused (INSERT ABSOLUTELY ANYTHING HERE)", it only serves to prove you haven't read the news in three months.

Blashpemy Laws (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42428643)

FU sums my thought on it.

What about immigrant muslims... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42428665)

... I'm sure you idiots would mod down anybody who dared suggest that ALL muslims should live in muslim countries (all of which used to be NON-muslim before muslims took them by mass murder...). You brainwashed idiots.

Non-whites are destroying every white country on Earth. Who are these people? Why don't they want to live around their own kind?

Re:What about immigrant muslims... (1)

Bizzeh (851225) | about a year ago | (#42428691)

Although this is completely off topic....You say Muslims spread to countries by just going there and settling there. Unlike the Christians, who originally spread with "be christian or we will kill you, your family, and everyone in the village...." and did that across pretty much all of Europe spreading out from Rome...

There are bigger concerns than shitty troll videos (2)

sg_oneill (159032) | about a year ago | (#42428731)

"Innocence of muslims" has to be one of the worst pieces of film I've ever watched. It was quite clearly created to insult and enrage muslims.

However I would suggest to the Pakistani authorities that if they REALLY want to stop their sensitive southerners from getting enraged at the west, perhaps they need to have a word to their american friends about those drone bombers. I figure if I was in a targetted village it would be the drones, not some silly infantile troll video, that would be my major beef.

Re:There are bigger concerns than shitty troll vid (0)

Shavano (2541114) | about a year ago | (#42429187)

"Innocence of muslims" has to be one of the worst pieces of film I've ever watched. It was quite clearly created to insult and enrage muslims.

However I would suggest to the Pakistani authorities that if they REALLY want to stop their sensitive southerners from getting enraged at the west, perhaps they need to have a word to their american friends about those drone bombers. I figure if I was in a targetted village it would be the drones, not some silly infantile troll video, that would be my major beef.

Bombing people is a Pakistani tradition. Especially if they're in hotels in India. Americans doing it is just joining in on the fun, isn't it?

cultural learnings for great justice (1)

verbatim (18390) | about a year ago | (#42428751)

So, today we learned that it takes the Internet 3 minutes to offend.

My friends, I am ashamed. Three minutes? We must try harder!

No surprise there... (1)

geogob (569250) | about a year ago | (#42428819)

The lift of the ban for 3 minutes on a global scale followed by a new global ban rather than first peek through the software is no surprise. Of course they took a peek through the firewalls first!

This looks much more a well planed statement as a botched trial.

Re:No surprise there... (1)

Shavano (2541114) | about a year ago | (#42429163)

This looks much more a well planed statement as a botched trial.

So it's exceptionally flat?

Pakistan is somewhat a good land. Marry little gir (-1, Troll)

Mike3USA (2805061) | about a year ago | (#42428825)

In some areas of pakistan the man is king, master, over the woman (As in Deuteronomy (ba'al)). In some areas men still marry little girls (not many areas though, sadly).

Afghan tribes, it is reported, were better. They married little girls who were pretty and sweet. The man was master, and if a man raped a little girl he just kept her and payed the father a girl from his family. This is similar to Deuteronomy 22 28-29 which talks of what to do if a man rapes a young girl (not woman) (hebrew).

The world is almost totally conqured for women and their obedient males.

It is good atleast that one peoples is fighting against the woman culture and belief system. I don't think the women will back down untill their civilizations get nuked away however. They want domination of men around the planet and the banning of pedophile marraige everywhere. Their god is either a female goddes, or Jesus (who told men to become enuniches, said if anyone "offends" a child he should be killed, said to leave your parents and family, exaulted the woman above the man saying she could commit adultery against her husband without consequence but if a man so much as looked at a woman that was an offense... etc) Jesus opposed the pro-male beliefs of Deuteronomy and told the Jews that their god was the d a liar and a murderer from the beginning.

Worship the God of Deuteronomy, and if you can't do that, than worship the ideas therein.

Marry little girls. Man is BA'AL (GOOD CHRISTIANS YOU HATE THAT WORD DONT YOU?): MASTER (of the woman) in Deuteronomy.

Solution for them (2)

Progman3K (515744) | about a year ago | (#42428867)

Go live in a cave!

It came to me in a dream; God spoke to me, she said "those that are offended should go live in a cave, ascetic lifestyle, ftw"

"But lord, are you saying they're righteous?" I countered

"Not at all," she replied "this way those who won't do as I wish won't screw it up for the rest of you living in the 21st century."

I know you don't believe me, but may God smite the earth and destroy it, RIGHT NOW, if I am wrong!

See? Nothing happened, therefore I am God's messenger!

Shocked, Shocked I tell you ... (1)

redelm (54142) | about a year ago | (#42428953)

I'm shocked there is blasphemy on this Institution! (Where are my winnings?)

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