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Valve Reveals First Month of Steam Linux Gains

Soulskill posted about a year ago | from the year-of-linux-on-the-steambox dept.

Operating Systems 295

An anonymous reader writes with news that Valve has updated its Hardware & Software Survey for December 2012, which reflects the first month of the platform being available for Linux. Even though the project is still in a beta test, players on Ubuntu already account for 0.8% of Steam usage. The 64-bit clients for Ubuntu 12.10 and 12.04.1 showed about double the share of the 32-bit versions. MacOS use also showed growth, rising to about 3.7%. Windows 7's usage share dropped by over 2%, but balanced by the growth of Windows 8, which is now at just under 7%. The total share for Windows is still about 95%.

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295 comments

DRM (0, Troll)

kthreadd (1558445) | about a year ago | (#42488163)

Games on Linux is good, but DRM is not. Hopefully Steam will stop using DRM one day.

Re:DRM (3, Informative)

hduff (570443) | about a year ago | (#42488305)

Lot sof playable-on-Linux-DRM-free games at gog.com.

Re:DRM (5, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488501)

Well not really. You can only filter Windows vs Mac. No Linux specific support at all.

AC

Re:DRM (2, Informative)

Sir_Sri (199544) | about a year ago | (#42488315)

Steam IS DRM.

Re:DRM (5, Informative)

cigawoot (1242378) | about a year ago | (#42488383)

Yes, Steam is DRM. However, Steam is DRM that gives something back in return.

Being able to download your games as you please, store your saves (on supported games) in the cloud, automatic updates, and the ability to easily download mods for games (when supported), makes Steam more palatable when it comes to DRM. Most DRM schemes just take away from the user without giving anything back in return, Steam is different.

Re:DRM (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488665)

So much bullshit in one post. Typical paytard.

Being able to download your games as you please

Which can be done with free software. None free software all that needs to be done to prevent you from downloading is change a few bits and you no longer hae access to it and you no longer can play that game.

store your saves (on supported games) in the cloud

To which the data is at the mercy of someone else. One screwup and millions of saved games are gone forever. No internet access? No access to save data.

automatic updates

until they block your account for any reason.

and the ability to easily download mods for games (when supported),

Free software is better for mods than non free software.

makes Steam more palatable when it comes to DRM. Most DRM schemes just take away from the user without giving anything back in return, Steam is different.

Astroturfing for $team is not going to help your position. Richard Stallman and the FSF has advised us against using non free software and the implications of using non free software. He even suggested to expand your tastes to include games that are already free. $team is no different than M$ as they both use digital restrictions management to control the sheep.

--
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk
Friends do assist M$ addicted friends in committing suicide.

Re:DRM (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488791)

You are the most retarded AC I've seen on /. in the past few weeks. Congrats! So much wrong in so little text.

Also I loved the word "paytard", it tells us exactly the type of person you are.

Re:DRM (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42489047)

Just because it offers something doesn't mean the DRM part is offering it. DRM offers the content industry something. It is the delusion that they're going to make more money. In reality it detracts from people who dislike DRM and from those who end up not pirating it (because fewer people who pirate means less publicity which means fewer sales). There are a lot of shitty movies that have sold well. It has to do with publicty and piracy fuels that.

Re:DRM (5, Insightful)

kthreadd (1558445) | about a year ago | (#42488417)

Steam IS DRM.

Steam is a distribution system that uses DRM. They could choose to stop using it and still be a distribution system.

Troll? (3, Informative)

drinkypoo (153816) | about a year ago | (#42488489)

Moderators, please explain which part of "Steam is a distribution system that uses DRM. They could choose to stop using it and still be a distribution system" is a troll. Steam is a distribution system. Steam uses DRM. The DRM is not an integral part of Steam; some titles on Steam don't actually use it.

Re:Troll? (3, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488515)

I don't know why I read this site any more, there are a few reasonable posters left but it seems the majority has left, leaving us with these childish dumbfuck moderators and mediocre comments.

Re:Troll? (4, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488949)

Is there an alternative? Personally I think the internet is just becoming more ignorant in general. It's not just Slashdot. It's the downside of making the internet accessible to all.

Re:Troll? (4, Funny)

abe ferlman (205607) | about a year ago | (#42488973)

Yes, we all pine for the days when posters could disagree reasonably about how hot the grits should be that Natalie Portman should be slathered in.

Re:Troll? (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488709)

Of course the DRM is an integral part of Steam you fuckwit. Just having an account tied to your username is a form of DRM. Jesus Christ you're an idiot.

Re:Troll? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488827)

this thread is shilled. don't pay attention to troll mods.

Re:Troll? (1)

sponse (1468283) | about a year ago | (#42489121)

  1. 1) I think you wasn't trolling at all.
  2. 2) As far as I know, you can moderate post in the same story. I don't think you get reasons from anyone.

Re:DRM (5, Informative)

Nemyst (1383049) | about a year ago | (#42488581)

No. Steam is a distribution system. Steamworks is a DRM, community and cloud integration API which is provided through Steam, but which is entirely optional. There's a fair number of games available on Steam that already do not use Steamworks DRM, or any sort of DRM.

Re:DRM (5, Insightful)

AlphaWolf_HK (692722) | about a year ago | (#42488903)

The thing with steam DRM though is that you don't really even notice it is there. Contrast to that of CD's of yore where if you forgot to put the right disc in the drive, your game won't start even though it doesn't actually need it. Or when you had those challenge response code books. Or worse, the ones where you had to read the damn manual with a red filter.

Also offline mode is an option with steam too, unlike say diablo 3.

One thing about older DRM was that the pirated version offered better value than the legit version because you didn't have to bother with that crap. Steam on the other hand the legit version offers many benefits that you don't get with a pirated version, like cloud save data and no need to hunt down the game discs if you re-format your PC.

Re:DRM (3, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488319)

I'm against DRM when it's a problem, but I've never had a problem with Steam.

If the only reason I'd ever even notice your DRM is trying to do something illegal, I really don't have a reason to take issue with it.

Re:DRM (2)

MysteriousPreacher (702266) | about a year ago | (#42488525)

I'm generally fine with the DRM encountered with Steam. Only issue has been the Steam client frequently crashing on quit, which in the past meant it won't allow offline mode when I relaunch it. That's been a pain when I'm travelling and would fancy a quick bout of zombie hunting before my battery dies, and have no Internet access.

Overall the balance between usability and DRM has been pretty good.

Re:DRM (3, Insightful)

u17 (1730558) | about a year ago | (#42488545)

It's about control. You give up control over your own games and your own computer and hand it to a third party. Regardless if you're doing anything illegal, they have the power you your property. Normally they're kept in check because abusing that power would lend them fewer sales, but occasionally, due to greed or a bug or a conflict of interest, you can be sure that they will.

Re:DRM (1, Troll)

RCL (891376) | about a year ago | (#42489035)

There's no "your property" involved. You never "buy" games, you always license them, be it digital distribution or not. Read the EULA on boxed games that you have. I think technically they can revoke a license for boxed game and make it illegal for you to play it, although you will still own the box/disc itself.

Re:DRM (3, Interesting)

fredprado (2569351) | about a year ago | (#42489173)

In most countries they can't revoke, and most countries consider this "licensing" as buying. Only in US law allows absurd contracts like this where end users end not owning games they paid for.

Re:DRM (5, Informative)

Riddler Sensei (979333) | about a year ago | (#42488357)

You know, I often find myself forgetting that Steam is essentially DRM. This struck me most lately last night as I started thinking about the new SimCity that's coming out this year and how it's suppose to be "always online" for DRM purposes. I started to think, "Well, hell, I have SC4 on Steam I could just fire that u....waaaaaait".

I don't know if I can really pinpoint why I don't consider Steam to be the kick to the dick that almost all other DRM is. Is it the constant sales and love that get chucked my way? The ability to move game folders/files anywhere and everywhere and have it work as long the signed in account owns the game (my old apartment would frequently dump our Steam games on our NAS to save everyone else who bought it the trouble of downloading it, all legit)? The relatively good server uptime (compared to other game companies)? The ability to add non-Steam games to my library? I don't know, but I just feel like I'm using a service instead of being locked up.

Is it pure? Hell, no. Is it good? I'd certainly say so. If the balance of the two don't balance to your favor I'd certainly see why you'd avoid it. I don't, personally, and my big wish is that the Linux/Mac Steam clients get some sort of built in VM in order to easily play the huge back catalog of Windows only games. This could either increase Linux/Mac growth by easing the pain of transition or it could stymie development by giving developers a lazy out. Either way...VIDYO GAMES!

Re:DRM (5, Insightful)

Rockoon (1252108) | about a year ago | (#42488503)

I don't know if I can really pinpoint why I don't consider Steam to be the kick to the dick that almost all other DRM is.

Two reasons.

1) It continues to just work.
2) You get at least the game-play value out of it that you spent.

I've picked up a lot of sub-$5 games on steam. You know how much I will care if at some point I can no longer play them? About as much as a care that I let $5 worth of cheese spoil in my refrigerator this week. I wish it didn't happen, but it doesnt pain me.

Re:DRM (2)

Microlith (54737) | about a year ago | (#42488759)

And at the very least, with the games on your system you can always crack them. This is an advantage over streamed games like onlive/gaikai and consoles.

Re:DRM (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488907)

>1) It continues to just work

For now.

Re:DRM (2)

fredprado (2569351) | about a year ago | (#42489197)

It works for as long as it is advantageous for the company and not for the user. That is the problem. For now Steam DRM is mostly harmless, but that can change tomorrow, or next month, or next year, at their own discretion. And this change would affect everything you already paid for.

Bottom line is, no DRM is acceptable. Accepting DRM is signing a blank check and giving control over your property to someone else.

Re:DRM (0, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488389)

Jesus christ.

Steam is the DRM, but it's acceptable in it's methods. You buy the game, the game and install key are authenticated with Steam servers and once it's installed you DON'T have to be online at all times to play the game. You can back up your game install and then move those files elsewhere should you want/need to.

That, quite frankly, is the happy line that ought to exist. You prove you bought the game and then you're left alone. If you want to play online multiplayer, well.... ONLINE MULTIPLAYER.

What's the problem.

Re:DRM (2)

jedidiah (1196) | about a year ago | (#42488873)

Steam is less annoying DRM.

The problem with most DRM on PC games is that it breaks and prevents yo u from doing things that seem obvious. This includes simple things like playing the game without the CD or an Internet connection.

There's actually a tradeoff going on with Steam. It's not just some misguided suit deciding to add extra fail to a product that doesn't really benefit from it.

Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly written (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488173)

At least on a Mac, I've found the client to be slow, frequently, unresponsive, and unintuitive.
Maybe Mac and Linux users just have higher standards, and won't put up with such poorly written software?

Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488235)

That was my impression. I've tried the Linux Steam beta and it is terrible. It's slow, clunky and navigating it is a pain. it doesn't integrate into the desktop either, so the app looks out of place. At the moment there is only one demo (free) game for testing purposes and it doesn't run. While it is just a beta, this isn't a very good first impression.

Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (0)

hduff (570443) | about a year ago | (#42488341)

That was my impression. I've tried the Linux Steam beta and it is terrible. It's slow, clunky and navigating it is a pain. it doesn't integrate into the desktop either, so the app looks out of place.

Which is surprising since the Windows client runs pretty well using WINE.

Perhaps the sluggishness is the result of additional DRM enforcement in the client?

Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (4, Informative)

drinkypoo (153816) | about a year ago | (#42488507)

That was my impression. I've tried the Linux Steam beta and it is terrible. It's slow, clunky and navigating it is a pain. it doesn't integrate into the desktop either, so the app looks out of place.

Which is surprising since the Windows client runs pretty well using WINE.

I have both installed, and you are full of crap. Steam is slow, clunky and navigating it is a pain on both Windows and Linux. I suppose you could laud Valve for providing the same experience on both platforms, but that's really not much of an accolade considering how crap Steam on Windows is. Regardless, it takes just about as long for either Steam to connect, but it actually takes longer for Steam for Windows on Wine to display its interface after the nigh-interminable login process.

Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (4, Insightful)

Cinder6 (894572) | about a year ago | (#42488695)

Are we running the same Steam? I've been using it for years, and never encountered anything just described. It's quick and gets out of the way as soon as I tell it I want to play a game. In fact, my only irritation is that it has to install the DirectX runtime or VC RED (whichever it is) for each new game, but I sort of understand why it's doing that, and it only happens once.

Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488531)

That was my impression. I've tried the Linux Steam beta and it is terrible. It's slow, clunky and navigating it is a pain. it doesn't integrate into the desktop either, so the app looks out of place.

Sounds exactly like Steam on Windows, and people seem happy with that.

Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (1)

jedidiah (1196) | about a year ago | (#42488883)

That's funny because I have been playing that free demo that doesn't run.

I have been also been playing other games. I bought them because they were cheap and thus represented little risk even in the worst case.

Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (1)

RCL (891376) | about a year ago | (#42489081)

I don't know what you meant with Steam not integrating "into the desktop", but Steam runs perfectly on my KDE. It minimizes to system tray and otherwise it is a good, well-behaved windowed app, not different from Firefox or Chromium.

Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (1)

MoonFog (586818) | about a year ago | (#42488243)

Did you even read the summary? Linux is "debuting" at 0.8% and Mac use rises, so what exactly are you replying to?

Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (1)

ArcadeMan (2766669) | about a year ago | (#42488339)

Even if the number of Mac users is growing it doesn't mean the client doesn't suck. Steam on Mac is worst than iTunes+Quicktime+Safari on Windows.

Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (4, Insightful)

Uhyve (2143088) | about a year ago | (#42488493)

Nothing is worse than iTunes on Windows. It's literally the worst program in the entire world.

Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488527)

You've gone to far. RealPlayer is literally the worst program in the entire world.

Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488539)

Nothing is worse than Steam on anything. It's literally the worst program in the entire world.

Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (4, Insightful)

MysteriousPreacher (702266) | about a year ago | (#42488741)

You obviously haven't used Excel for Mac.

1) No multi-threading, which is a problem when the application pretty easily maxes out a core.
2) Bizarre keyboard shortcuts that don't match the standard ones used in most applications
3) Piss poor support for multiple displays, with a resizing bug that's been around for way too long
4) Excel documents don't show up in recent items in Finder
5) Excel addresses files using a path - not a reference to the file, meaning that it doesn't notice when open files are renamed or moved. It also gets confused if you have two mounted volumes (including the home folder) with the same name.
6) Very buggy AppleScript support. I know of no other application that so easily crashes while scripted to do fairly mundane things.
7) Uses its own internal clipboard, meaning that copying and pasting can be pretty bizarre. Copying something, and then closing a document alters the contents of the clipboard. It's also slow as hell. It's not unusual for me to sit there waiting 5 seconds to put a value from a cell in to the clipboard. I could understand this if it's pasting in to a cell that is referenced in heavy calculations, but for just copying a value?

iMovie 3.0 was pretty bad. I'd take Steam of that any day.

Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (2)

jedidiah (1196) | about a year ago | (#42488897)

> 3) Piss poor support for multiple displays, with a resizing bug that's been around for way too long

Why would this ever be a problem? This is something that should be transparent to applications.

What happened to this great multi-monitor support in Macs and Windows that's supposed to make Linux look so shameful?

Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (1)

BitZtream (692029) | about a year ago | (#42489147)

The person you're replying too is trolling.

I can't speak to #1 as I don't have any spreadsheets complex enough to max out the processor long enough for me to notice.
#2 is false.
#3 is false.
#4 is false, his system is fucked if thats the case as its not up to excel to support the feature, its built into the OS.
#5 may be true, I've not yet noticed, but I wouldn't call that a bug, I'd call it a feature. Nothing is more annoying that moving a document to the trash, replacing a backup at the old location, then opening an app and having it edit the document in the trash rather than the one you restored, only to discover the problem after you delete the trash.
#6 not sure of.
#7 So do a lot of apps that provide functionality that the built in clipboard doesn't provide. Closing the app gets you a prompt that asks if you want to store the actual data on the clip board or clear it. If you tell it to store on the clipboard it renders to a more generic format and places it there, which is the same thing that happens when you copy from an office app to a non-office app anyway. While office apps are open, they don't store ALL the data from a copy on the clipboard, just the required reference to the data so it can be pulled up as needed. This is the EXACT SAME WAY it works on Windows.

Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (3, Informative)

Cruciform (42896) | about a year ago | (#42488335)

The Mac version tends to lose windows quite often as well. The news, library, game windows, etc. will be active (including the odd duplicate) and not appear on screen. Sometimes it just takes an extra five minutes for the news to load to tell you the latest deal.
Hopefully that's not the case for the Linux users as well.

Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488579)

But that's how all "apps" on mac behave. Be it Safari, Photoshop or fucking Adium. Slow and unresponsive.
Mac OS is shit you don't realize until you install Windows on your mac.

Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (1)

MysteriousPreacher (702266) | about a year ago | (#42488661)

The quality of the Steam client is the biggest issue I'd have with Valve. On the Mac I've found the following:

1) It's not uncommon for it to crash on quit.
2) Online/offline mode is flakey. On most launches it fails first time to go online, but on second try will. No other games or applications have issues here.
3) Initially the UI was buggy as hell. I think it's improved, or I just got used to a UI that appears to have been modelled on tacky MP3 player software from the 90s, or a game mods website. Another example is in how it does weird things when flicking between sections. I go to Greenlight and begin playing a trailer. If I switch to Library the audio continues, and if I return to Greenlight I see the trailer playing away. If I click on News, and then go to Greenlight it returns to the main Greenlight page. That's typical of the odd quirks of Steam.

In all, I find the benefits outweighing the issues.

Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (2)

smartr (1035324) | about a year ago | (#42488931)

It's definitely a bit on the clunky side with a Mac... Never mind that half the games they advertise to you don't run on your current system. Look at all these games on sale! XCOM: Enemy Unknown is on sale. You click it. Oh look, this doesn't work on your system. Want to discover a RPG or strategy game? Well you can't filter by OS X client and RPG. I'm sure you'd get less windows users if you treated them the same way. 342 games supporting OS X, unsortable... 1859 PC games, 38 Linux games.

Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (1)

Psyborgue (699890) | about a year ago | (#42488987)

Agreed. And at least on my 2.6ghz Core 2 duo MBP, it uses up half a core idle with all windows closed. I have steam running on my Windows box idle with all windows closed and it's not even cracking 0%. Why should I play games on steam when the client eats up a full quarter of my CPU while it's supposed to be doing nothing. No downloading. Nothing. I haven't tested out the Linux client yet (I use Windows for games), but I hope there aren't the same issues. I would expect a more technically minded Linux audience to be less tolerant of such inefficiency.

Re:Doesn't help that Steam client is poorly writte (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42489133)

Works great on my MBA

RMS doesn't proprieatry games (0, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488189)

... and neither should you. Many of the games available via Steam are proprietary software. Proprietary software, as Richard Stallman (peace be upon him) has reminded us time and time again, is immoral and thus wrong for society. Who knows what games could by spying on you and subverting your freedom? Why would any right-minded GNU/Linux user defile themselves with such filth? Protect your freedom. Boycott Steam!

Re:RMS doesn't proprieatry games (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488245)

Well, Steam is boycotting Richard Stallman (Ubuntu is not GNU approved) so I guess they are even.

:RMS doesn't spelling (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488277)

And this is why we look like retards -- spelling and grammar mistakes in both the title and text.

Re:RMS doesn't proprieatry games (0, Troll)

moronoxyd (1000371) | about a year ago | (#42489137)

RMS is against Steam?
Then I will install Steam imitatively on all my machines.

I've made the experience that NOT following what RMS says usually is the way to go for a fuller, more meaningful life.

Re:RMS doesn't proprieatry games (1, Insightful)

BitZtream (692029) | about a year ago | (#42489189)

RMS doesnt' fucking bath or shave and tends to eat his own toe jam. Following RMS's example is one of the more retarded things you do in your life.

Wine (3, Interesting)

simonbp (412489) | about a year ago | (#42488197)

I wonder how many of the "Windows" users are actually just Linux users using Wine. Despite the Beta, I still do that for games (e.g. Civ 5) that don't have a Linux version.

Re:Wine (2)

Nerdfest (867930) | about a year ago | (#42488229)

There are likely a fair number like me that don't have a machine with a decent graphics card because of the lack of games in general. My primary laptop just won't cut it for Steam. Now that Steam is out for Linux, my next one will.

Re:Wine (3, Interesting)

MoonFog (586818) | about a year ago | (#42488267)

This is what I find to the gold mine in Steam; the small, non-resource hungry, indie games. They are often far more interesting to play than the latest CoD++, and Steam makes them easy to find and play.

Re:Wine (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488609)

> They are often far more interesting to play than the latest CoD++

Maybe you need to get with the times. CoD games run actually on pretty low level hardware.

Re:Wine (1)

realityimpaired (1668397) | about a year ago | (#42488633)

They tend to be a lot better value than the high end games, too. I don't really feel all that bad if I spent $10 on an indie title and it turns out to be a dud, but if I spent $60 on a top tier title and it ends up sucking, there'll be hell to pay. And for *most* of the indie games on Steam, $10 is on the high end of pricing. A lot of the indie games on Steam are well worth the price they're charging, and then some.

Re:Wine (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488345)

Wine usage can be somewhat reliably determined from their statistics by, for example, looking at the audio driver reported, and Wine has usually been excluded from the windows statistics.

Beware the "Windows Users" statistics (3, Interesting)

Morgaine (4316) | about a year ago | (#42488351)

That's a very good point made by the parent, and it has plenty of precedent outside of the Valve/Steam games space. I appear in the statistics as a "Windows User" for Guild Wars 2 (and for many years previously for Guild Wars 1), yet there hasn't been a Windows box at home for years and years. This is sure to be happening for Steam "Windows" games as well.

Wine works perfectly for gaming these days. Beware the "Windows User" statistics!

Re:Beware the "Windows Users" statistics (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488505)

And Beware of assuming "Windows Users" is not Windows Users.

Anecdotal, I know. But let's take example of Eve Online. It runs very well with Wine, and it has for at least more than 5 years. So, one of my characters was in some largish alliance where we used Team Speak. Team Speak has a nice feature that will report where someone is from (GeoIP), and what OS they are using. It has a native port to Linux and runs very well with Alsa so using native TS + Wine for game kind of makes more sense.

Anyways, long story short, during one of the Alliance "meetings" there was about 800 peple on TS. Out of those 800, there were TWO (2) others that were using Linux. There were maybe 8 or 9 Mac people too. The rest - Windows! Now, 2 or 3 years later, there is a few people using Eve with Linux. But I would not expect it to be any significant number.

So the bottom line is, running Steam under Wine is probably not common. Don't expect it to account for significant amount of users. There is probably far more people running Steam under Ubuntu natively than under Wine. I will probably install it too. I will use a nice chroot for it.

Re:Beware the "Windows Users" statistics (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488693)

Wine works perfectly for gaming these days.

Oh, really? Having bought the Humble THQ Bundle, I can readily say:

  • Darksiders - Even after installing d3dx9_36--as without it Darksiders simply crashes--it still doesn't work quite right and still will crash at times
  • Metro 2033 - Doesn't work at all--ie, always crashes when trying to run
  • Red Faction: Armageddon - Doesn't work at all--ie, always crashes when trying to run
  • Company of Heroes - Works fine, AFAICT
  • Company of Heroes: Opposing Fronts - Works fine, AFAICT
  • Company of Heroes: Tales of Valor - Works fine, AFAICT
  • Saints Row: The Third - Doesn't work at all--ie, always crashes when trying to run
  • Titan Quest - Works fine, AFAICT
  • Warhammer 40,000: Dawn of War - Works fine, AFAICT

So, ~55% work (although if you consider 2 are addons of presumably the same game engine, it's closer to ~42%). Further, considering the game play aspects, it'd seem heavily the point that it's really the underlying game engines that provide/hinder for whether a game works (RTS and third-person ARPGs work, but FPS and TPS don't). Now, perhaps that has something to do with my setup or hardware, but even under the worst of circumstances I'd expect that the game/wine *tell me* that's the problem instead of crashing or simply experience visible glitches/slowdowns--and I really don't think it's my hardware that's the problem as it's relatively new and pretty medium line.

In short, I really have to disagree with you. :/

Re:Beware the "Windows Users" statistics (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488893)

DoW is also an older version of that engine...

Re:Beware the "Windows Users" statistics (4, Interesting)

ifiwereasculptor (1870574) | about a year ago | (#42489093)

It's funny because Steam knows it's being run in Wine (it checks for Wine version, look in Help -> System Information). They don't know anything about your Linux system, though, and I don't know how they use that information.

Re:Wine (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488395)

they already account for Linux Installs by checking for wine being installed and wine3d

Re:Wine (1)

RichMan (8097) | about a year ago | (#42488499)

> they already account for Linux Installs by checking for wine being installed and wine3d

I don't know about that. I did a Steam survey about a year ago. It prompted me with the "Information to send to Valve". There was nothing about linux in what I saw when I pushed the send button.

Re:Wine (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488875)

Perhaps not through individual surveys, but they do actually check for wine. This kind of an important metric.

Re:Wine (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488529)

I think Wine would show up either as XP or I vaguely remember Steam reporting something somewhere about me actually running the client under Wine. It's possible to create a Window 7 bottle (at least under Crossover) but XP seems to be the choice for compatibility and lightweight reasons.

However, your point is very valid as I still use Wine to play the games that don't have Linux variants on Steam (even the ones that have native Linux versions from the Humble Bundle I will occasionally play via Steam/Wine because they're not out for Steam/Linux yet).

Re:Wine (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488583)

Probably not that many. Most people actually just use Windows.

Re:Wine (1)

xaoslaad (590527) | about a year ago | (#42488667)

Certainly I count for at least one. Even though I have the Steam Linux client installed to play a few games I have the Windows client installed under WINE to play the rest that aren't available. The only thing that might help them account for it is that I do see a reference to wine in the hardware information I submit when it randomly asks for it, so it is entirely possible they are able to account for this... whether they do or not is another story.

Re:Wine (1)

laffer1 (701823) | about a year ago | (#42489043)

I'm planning on setting up a linux install once the steam port matures a bit more. I have a Mac and PC and use the latter mostly for gaming and BSD development. Being able to game without windows would be great. I recently went from a Mac Pro to a Mac mini because I gave up on Mac gaming after trying to get it to work for years. It's just much better and cheaper on a PC. Without having to buy a windows license in the future, I can save even more money on my PC. Windows is $100.. that could go to a faster CPU instead.

By installing steam on ubuntu, I can show valve that I want this future.

Re:Wine (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42489045)

I wonder how many of the "Windows" users are actually just Linux users using Wine. Despite the Beta, I still do that for games (e.g. Civ 5) that don't have a Linux version.

Yes, this was the big hope that was supposed to be revealed with the release of a native Linux Steam client. But when it comes down to it, native linux just barely scrapes by the "Other" category. Meanwhile, the mega clossal failure Windows 8, portrayed by Steam's own Gabe Newell as a "catastrophe," is rising on Steam meteorically, passing all of OSX last month, and matching Vista this month. By the spring it will be the second most popular desktop gaming platform. You can bet Newell will be supporting this "catastrophe" much better than Linux, because when it comes down to it, that's where the users are. Meanwhile, keep holding onto that dream of the impending Windows Gaming Exodus brought on by Windows 8 and a native Linux steam client. I'm sure all you need is more games.

Library (1)

Tribaal_ch (1192815) | about a year ago | (#42488247)

I would add that the library of games currently available is very small, so I guess this figure is really quite impressive. Annecdata: most Linux gamers I know still use stream on wine because of whatever their current addiction is (dota2, counterstrike, skyrim, whatever)

Re:Library (1)

Bert64 (520050) | about a year ago | (#42488677)

Well you could have both the windows version (under wine or natively) and the native linux version installed, and use the native version whenever possible with wine as a fallback. The more linux users there are, the more incentive there will be to produce linux versions of games.

There are plenty of people who would prefer to play games on linux if they could, but they play games on windows out of necessity and thus show up as a windows user in the stats.

Re:Library (1)

TuxThePenguin2205 (1031140) | about a year ago | (#42489059)

I like the parent posters have both the native and (several) wine installations. As games get ported I remove them from the wine installs and add them to the native client. At the moment I'm actively playing (thanks to the recent sales) Native: TF2, World of Goo, SS3:BFE Emulated: Skyrim , Deux Ex:HE, CS:GO, XCOM When the rest of the Source games get released I'm sure I'll be playing through HL2 again and possibly killing some more zombies with friends ( LFD 1+2 ) Also I'm running on Gentoo and the native client wasn't difficult to install though I'll certainly appreciate it once there are a selection of distro specific packages or some logic to simplify installs inside the main steam installer. Other family members have Mint installed and steam was trivial to install there.

Runs well, just lacking games (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488301)

I have been using Steam with wine for years and looking forward to the native client.

I DO have it running and it runs great on my machine: fast and bug-free on a Linux Mint 14 (KDE) system. (Mint 14 is based on Ubuntu.)
Of course I had to migrate from another distribution that is not yet well supported, but that is not a thing to expect sympathy about, nor do I ask for any.

The only thing I look forward to at this point is more games being ported over: I made one purchase of a supported linux-native game but have an OLD library that will still not work unless I go back to wine.

I think Valve has done a great job so far and hope for more improvements in the future.
I think getting the older stuff running as well will be critical for adoption- many of us have games we already paid for and want to be able to play natively.

It Could Be More (0)

hduff (570443) | about a year ago | (#42488313)

They might show even better results if their client were designed to run on _any_ modern Linux. Perhaps their engineers are not that skilled?

Re:It Could Be More (1)

Microlith (54737) | about a year ago | (#42488465)

Given that the client was packaged rapidly for other Linux distributions, I don't think they have that problem. I suspect, rather, that non-Ubuntu installs fall into the "Other" category (a full 0.71%.)

Re:It Could Be More (5, Insightful)

darkHanzz (2579493) | about a year ago | (#42488495)

Perhaps their engineers are not that skilled?

They started with getting it to work on one distribution (on of the more popular ones), they will get it to work on others.

The articles describing how the worked with graphics card manufacturers to improve performance on linux suggests that their engineers are quite skilled, but only human, so they cannot do everything at once.

Re:It Could Be More (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488551)

If you can't install a .deb on your distro, you are the Ubuntu target market and should probably switch.

Re:It Could Be More (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42489105)

If you can't install a .deb on your distro, you are the Ubuntu target market and should probably switch.

If you seriously consider installing packages for another distro, you are the Windows target market and should probably switch.

Re:It Could Be More (1)

pshuke (845050) | about a year ago | (#42488567)

Works fine on arch (yaourt -S steam), and I haven't heard anyone else complain. Just because valve packages steam for ubuntu, doesn't mean it doesn't work on other distros. It's unreasonable to expect valve to package its software specific to each and every distro, version and architecture. I don't know if your last comment was supposed to be funny, but repackaging hardly requires a software engineer.

ComplainersThe world is passing you by... (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488625)

You can spend all your time fighting extraordinarily un-restraining DRM, or you can play games.
Stop looking a gift horse in the mouth. From the numbers, having Steam support linux games at all is pretty silly from the business perspective.
It's an act of good will that it exists at all.

So, keep complaining, if you think that's getting you anywhere. I'm going back to playing games

What margins are you expecting. (1, Insightful)

tuppe666 (904118) | about a year ago | (#42488881)

From the numbers, having Steam support linux games at all is pretty silly from the business perspective.

Steam is supporting games *from* a business perspective. Its very existence is being threatened. In future steam may only exist OS X and Linux. Its mistake was not expecting this sooner, and not supporting Linux earlier. The reality is Windows is going to be overtaken by Android this year...it actually makes sense to produce games for Linux first, and cross platform is a must in today's new world.

I buy a large number of games, most are cross-platform; DRM free and pretty cheap. I don't use steam because of DRM.

Re:What margins are you expecting. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42489101)

Is their Office for Android in the works? Sounds to me like you're greatly overestimating the potential demise of Windows, just like Linux users have been doing for the decade I've been on /..

Re:What margins are you expecting. (1, Troll)

JakeBurn (2731457) | about a year ago | (#42489143)

This entire debate is exactly the same as PC gamers demanding that Activision support COD on PC the same way they do on consoles. PC gamers were around 5% of all players of COD and still get pissed on. You would still need a seven fold increase in market share on your platform to reach that level and would still be getting handed crap. Cross platform is not a must its a goodwill gesture that may or may not break even for the company. You are so far in the minority of gamers your dollars are practically irrelevant. I feel sorry for any company bothering to try their hand in linux because of the PITA of dealing with whiny customers who expect their crappy port to work better than a crappy port who should just be grateful that it exists at all. Add to that the fact that every other linux guy has a different distro with different needs and there is zero reason to believe any major player in PC gaming will ever go wholly into the Linux market. "In future steam may only exist OS X and Linux." Considering the amount of stupid things a person can read here I don't lightly say this, but this is one of the dumbest things I've read in quite a long time. Second only to some asshat spewing racist remarks in a different thread I read a couple days ago.

No one has Java installed? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488647)

The survey contains a list of commonly installed software. How come the Java isn't on that list? Microsoft Office FrontPage is at the bottom of the list at 0.69%. Could it be that even fewer than that have Java installed?

It's 'ok' (3, Informative)

Jaktar (975138) | about a year ago | (#42488707)

The Steam client itself works just fine. The problem is Valve's distribution system. I had 4 games that were listed as supported. Of those, two of them would not install (as in you can click the install button and it would give a message that it was installed but there would be nothing downloaded). One of them installed but would not launch. The last is TF2, and I really don't care to play that.

I'm not faulting them, it's still beta after all. I'm just not excited about a new platform to play games that are mostly available outside of Steam already with the added bonus of more TF2.

Interesting statistic (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488727)

30% of Steam users have uTorrent.

Love these statistics (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42488963)

a few things that hit me (with a grain of salt) :
more of the users (at least the gamers) are using microsoft works than openoffice!
very few like the 1200 horizontal resolution, 1080 is much prefered.
powerpoint is more popular than word :D
only 19% have internet explorer installed??
gimp is more popular than paint.net

all things that amaze me, bring the popcorn (to the salt) !

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