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Microsoft Blames PC Makers For Windows Failure

timothy posted about a year ago | from the touch-makes-life-more-bearable dept.

Android 913

rtfa-troll writes "The Register tells us that Microsoft has begun squabbling with PC manufacturers over the reasons behind the failure of Windows 8. Microsoft is 'frustrated with major OEMs who didn't build nearly enough touch systems.' PC manufacturers have hit back, saying that they 'would have been saddled with the costs of a huge pile of unsold units,' claiming that customers actually avoided higher-end touch products which were available and instead bought lower-end, cheaper laptops while 'Microsoft is not blaming itself for' the failure of its own touch device, the Surface RT. The PC manufacturers' claims that touch is the problem seem to be backed by reviews, and some educational rants from users and opinions from user interface design experts. However, Microsoft sees this differently. Microsoft is planning to strike back at the PC vendors in February with Surface Pro; with a shorter battery life and much heavier than a normal tablet, this is being seen as a direct competitor to traditional laptops. By using its desktop operating system franchise as a lever, Microsoft will be able to enter the lower-specification end of the laptop market with a cost advantage which make make life difficult for former partners such as HP and Dell. We've discussed previously how some PC manufactures such as Dell have failed in generational change whilst others have diversified to survive market changes; Samsung with Android and the (still) bestselling Chromebook. ASUS with their successful Nexus tablets. We also discussed the ergonomic problems which are claimed to make touch screens unsuitable for PC use."

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Former partners? (5, Insightful)

dreamchaser (49529) | about a year ago | (#42706763)

Last I checked Dell and HP are both very much still MS partners. This is more akin to a lover's spat than a breakup.

Re:Former partners? (5, Insightful)

kurt555gs (309278) | about a year ago | (#42707145)

Ford blamed dealers for poor Edsel sales.

Dear Microsoft (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42706781)

I flip out when people touch my screen. How do you think I'll react when *I* have to touch my screen.

Knock it off with the touch screen crap, already.

Re:Dear Microsoft (5, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42706951)

Just make sure you don't get a high reflective shiny touch screen. The matte touch screen of my Thinkpad doesn't display greasy finger smears (unless you have just been digging into the potato chips I guess).

Touch is a nice extra, but as the main input for a system that needs to be productive it doesn't justify the costs.

Waste of money (5, Insightful)

linebackn (131821) | about a year ago | (#42707055)

> Touch is a nice extra, but as the main input for a system that needs to be productive it doesn't justify the costs.

And that is the big problem with touch. It is a waste of money. Why should I spend extra on a desktop monitor or laptop that has touch? I have no use for it, and it does not help get work done any faster/easier. It even gets nasty when finger prints are all over it! It looks cool? So what? The economy is still in the shitter and most people have to watch every dollar they spend.

I've Seen Touch Screens For Years (5, Interesting)

johnkoer (163434) | about a year ago | (#42706787)

I see touch screen computers all the time at best buy, so the PC manufacturers are definitely making them. The problem is, they don't market them very well. All of the PCs and laptops are lined up in a row and you could walk right by one and not know it is a touch screen.

I think Microsoft is trying to create a market of PCs that act like tablets, when that market doesn't really exist. If people wanted touch screens, they could get them today. Most users either want a tablet or a traditional computer. The users who want both usually want them as separate devices.

Microsoft screwed the pooch on this one and it will probably mean the end for Ballmer. Hopefully the next OS corrects the issues and slashdot can find something else M$ to bash.

Re:I've Seen Touch Screens For Years (5, Insightful)

Rakhar (2731433) | about a year ago | (#42706803)

Yes, it feels like soon they'll devolve to blaming the consumers for daring to not consume their products. "This would have been a success if only more consumers jumped on board!" No shit, Sherlock. They took a chance in going in a new direction, and the lost the bet. Now they're just trying to use their size to muscle the change in anyway instead of backtracking, because that would be admitting failure.

Re:I've Seen Touch Screens For Years (5, Insightful)

RabidReindeer (2625839) | about a year ago | (#42707035)

This reminds me a lot of another group of people who have recently been claiming their failures on the need to "educate" their target audience. And fail to realize that, for better or worse, their respective audiences feel that they have all the "education" they need.

Sometimes, when you Build It, they Don't Come. Sometimes you can't get a "great idea" to trickle down if you ram it with a plunger. Sometimes, in short, it's worth considering a different approach, rather than simply doubling down.

It would be ironic if the Year of the Linux Desktop finally arrived courtesy - not of improvements in Linux - but because Microsoft pushed its primary drug dealers, er, hardware manufacturers, into the waiting arms of the Penguin. Fortunately for the folks in Redmond, whatever disease this is seems to be widespread these days, as Linux has developed its own ways to fend of new arrivals in the form of Unity and Gnome3.

Re:I've Seen Touch Screens For Years (1)

jones_supa (887896) | about a year ago | (#42706805)

The problem is, they don't market them very well. All of the PCs and laptops are lined up in a row and you could walk right by one and not know it is a touch screen.

That could be easily mitigated by putting an inch by inch sticker on the wrist rest which reads "With Touch!"

Re:I've Seen Touch Screens For Years (2)

Sponge Bath (413667) | about a year ago | (#42706987)

...reads "With Touch!"

Consumers are tired of Ballmer talking about touching and squirting. No means no!

Re:I've Seen Touch Screens For Years (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42706843)

The problem is, they don't market them very well.

No. The problem is that they are useless, can't do shit, and cost way too much for that. They are the SUVs of pseudo-computing. They only have disadvantages. Zero advantages. They only serve as e-penis/breast enlargement for the same type of loser that runs behind "fashion trends".

That's why, when you wipe away the bullshit hype, they are actually a completely failing product in all aspects.

Re:I've Seen Touch Screens For Years (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42706949)

The problem is, they don't market them very well.

No. The problem is that they are useless, can't do shit, and cost way too much for that. They are the SUVs of pseudo-computing. They only have disadvantages. Zero advantages. They only serve as e-penis/breast enlargement for the same type of loser that runs behind "fashion trends".

That's why, when you wipe away the bullshit hype, they are actually a completely failing product in all aspects.

I agree.

I am a big-time nerd, I love geek toys and I want new things just bcause they are shiny.

But even I don't want a windows 8 device. Why would I want it? It's not shiny like the apple toys. It's not functioning well for my geek self. It's expensive, and it hsa poor functionality and an uncertain future. And I usually am an early adopter.

Microsoft are with these changes pushing me towards switching to apple OS X, and this is an unprecedented bad move by MS.

I would not touch MS stock with a 10 inch pole.

Re: I've Seen Touch Screens For Years (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42707099)

I would not touch MS stock with a 10 foot pole.

FTFY, metric already hey...

Re:I've Seen Touch Screens For Years (5, Insightful)

peragrin (659227) | about a year ago | (#42706847)

I hope this isn't the end for Ballmer, He is doing a great job running Microsoft into the ground

Creating new markets isn't bad. It is truly the only way to grow.

However while you can use touch for everything. Making it the default interface is the bad part.
Having a fairly consistent interface across platforms isn't a horrible idea.

Desktop should have touch as an user Interface OPTION. I can see uses for touch on the desktop just not all the time.

Re:I've Seen Touch Screens For Years (5, Informative)

RabidReindeer (2625839) | about a year ago | (#42707091)

Desktop should have touch as an user Interface OPTION. I can see uses for touch on the desktop just not all the time.

Bingo!

One of the things that helped Windows in its early days was that a mouse was optional. You could do a lot of GUI-based work without buying a mouse at all, just by using the helpful command keys and tabs. Something, that, alas, pretty well went out the window (no pun intended) with the advent of pixel-graphic web browser applications.

You can get much better traction when a new feature is an enhancement to what people are used to than when you force them to start all over.

Re:I've Seen Touch Screens For Years (1)

DavidClarkeHR (2769805) | about a year ago | (#42706877)

Microsoft screwed the pooch on this one and it will probably mean the end for Ballmer. Hopefully the next OS corrects the issues and slashdot can find something else M$ to bash.

I have two relevant observations. The first, is that Microsoft may be correct - they made a tablet OS, and their hardware partners made traditional laptops. Instead of putting a touchscreen on some of the lower-end models, the manufacturers decided that more ram (really? What home user needs more than 64k, I mean, 4gb), a variety of colours (pink? what, do girls use computers now?), bigger hard drives (you can store ALL the things in the cloud), and french-language keyboards are a better use of their money (It's not like there is some sort of law that requires language labels) ...But in all seriousness, Microsoft has a point - their vision for selling an operating system did not fit with the current batch of manufactured devices. Fault? That's a different question.

Second point: Screwing the pooch means you're making puppies, or sitting in the back room, doing nothing. Probably not the most fitting euphamism for this 800lb gorilla in the room (which looks like a duck, quacks like a lame duck, and walks like a dumb duck).

Re:I've Seen Touch Screens For Years (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42706885)

Hopefully it'll be the end of the group that bullied the Windows Phone interface onto the desktop too.

Hey, guys: after further review: that idea sucks far worse than I had feared, and I feared a lot when I heard about this mind boggingly stupid concept. "Hey, let's piss off consumers, developers, everybody at Microsoft who knows what they're doing, AND hardware manufacturers. That'll work.".

At least Vista was salvageable after turning off unneeded crap and a couple of service packs and they STILL got Windows 7 out the door fast. People liked it. They didn't like Vista and Microsoft responded fairly quickly, for them. People hate Windows 8 with a passion, and their response is to double down on it. Must be something in the air these days. Not abandoning a bad idea seems to be a corporate disease these days.

Re:I've Seen Touch Screens For Years (3, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42707143)

According to MS, people love Win8 and their sales are terrific. This begs the question as to why they are complaining about their PC vendors though (????).

Re:I've Seen Touch Screens For Years (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42706903)

I have been trying to get my hands on one of the new Lenovo carbons or the Asus zenbook touches, they are simply impossible to find in my country and if any store or online site manages to get ahold of a few they are instantly soldout. yeah there are plenty of craptastic machines with touch monitors, but I would not touch most of them with a 40 foot pole.

Re:I've Seen Touch Screens For Years (0, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42706981)

I want a 10" fanless & no moving parts sub-100$ netbook, not 2nd hand and preferably x86. I'll run GNU/Linux on it of course.

An "Intel" RaspberryPi (different processor, different pcb layout, real memory, tiny SSD, battery, keyboard and screen) in a netbook format should be doable in volumes for less than 100$ right? Think of it as a portable modern pseudo-terminal.

It was almost doable (except no fan cooling) at 4x the price a computer generation ago, i.e. 2 years ago.

Fail traps: pushing it with Windows or Android. Not interested in garbage like that.

Re:I've Seen Touch Screens For Years (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42707059)

I looked through the rest of the comments too . . . I mean maybe I missed it, but there isn't actually any quotes. What did MS say that blasted anyone? Are we just taking the Register's word for it? Why aren't any slashdotters pointing this out like they would with other stories. I refuse to believe slashdotters are THAT biased.

Re:I've Seen Touch Screens For Years (4, Insightful)

zifn4b (1040588) | about a year ago | (#42707083)

I think Microsoft is trying to create a market of PCs that act like tablets, when that market doesn't really exist. If people wanted touch screens, they could get them today. Most users either want a tablet or a traditional computer. The users who want both usually want them as separate devices.

I don't think that last bit is necessarily true. I would buy a laptop with a touch screen built-in but I'm certainly not going to pay a premium price for it. I think consumers like me are looking at it like "that's cool but it isn't worth the price." Give it to me for free and more discounted and I may adopt it.

The other thing is Windows 8 pretty much kicked the mouse/keyboard user in the balls when there are a plethora of tasks that can be done with a mouse and keyboard but not realistically with a touch screen. Maybe I could do some graphic design with a stylus but who does that with the screen tilted up? Graphic tablets are different.

In a nut shell, Microsoft doesn't understand the market, doesn't understand its customers and doesn't understand its partners. That is why they are failing to capitalize.

Re:I've Seen Touch Screens For Years (1)

luther349 (645380) | about a year ago | (#42707115)

touch screen have been around sense the 80s the apple 2 had one as a add-on. but in the pc world they are just useless the mouse does the job. even in android tablets more and more games are supporting pc addons like game-pads and keyborad and mouse becouse in any sort of real game or heavy texting the touch screen is not as good of a interface.

The problem is Windows 8 (5, Insightful)

asicsolutions (1481269) | about a year ago | (#42706789)

My ten year old daughter was in tears because she couldn't figure out her new windows 8 laptop.
Now the laptop was underpowered, but it couldn't play DVDs out of the box and she couldn't figure out how to run her software on it thanks to the removal of the start button. Also, Toshiba added its bonus software which seemed to take over the whole computer periodically since pop ups now take the whole screen.
I was frustrated trying to use it until I found a start menu hack and added it back.

I installed VLC so she can play DVDs and she has a start menu and now is very happy. Perhaps MS shouldn't have tried to do too much too soon?

Re:The problem is Windows 8 (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42706849)

My ten year old daughter was in tears because she couldn't figure out her new windows 8 laptop. Now the laptop was underpowered, but it couldn't play DVDs out of the box and she couldn't figure out how to run her software on it thanks to the removal of the start button. Also, Toshiba added its bonus software which seemed to take over the whole computer periodically since pop ups now take the whole screen. I was frustrated trying to use it until I found a start menu hack and added it back.

I installed VLC so she can play DVDs and she has a start menu and now is very happy. Perhaps MS shouldn't have tried to do too much too soon?

Sounds like you've got a PEBKAC problem ...

Re:The problem is Windows 8 (0)

DavidClarkeHR (2769805) | about a year ago | (#42706925)

My ten year old daughter was in tears because she couldn't figure out her new windows 8 laptop. Perhaps MS shouldn't have tried to do too much too soon?

Sounds like you've got a PEBKAC problem ...

I'm sorry, I read your story as a failure on behalf of microsoft to communicate instructions, and a failure on behalf of toshiba to sell you a high quality, low price laptop.

Maybe there is some way for microsoft to provide a "how to" video the first time the computer turns on, and for toshiba to subsidize the price of the laptop with easily uninstalled software.

Re:The problem is Windows 8 (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42707137)

Sounds like you've got a PEBKAC problem ...

If the user is within your target audience then "PEBAK" is a euphemism for "user interface bug".

Re:The problem is Windows 8 (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42706889)

Why suffer through all that shit? Just install Ubuntu/Mint. It's way easier because it's not that simple (read: dumbed down). Problem solved.

Seriously... some people just seem to love to suffer, as long as they don't have to actually lift their asses off the chair and change something.

Re:The problem is Windows 8 (5, Interesting)

transporter_ii (986545) | about a year ago | (#42706891)

I don't like Windows 8, but I wouldn't mind it so much if they just made a classic mode setting in it that allowed you to go straight to the desktop without having to jump through hoops (or hacks).

We were doing work at a Sheriff's office and the PC they purchased for us to use had Windows 8 on it. No problem, I thought. It is just Windows 7 underneath. Yeah, it was a problem. They ended up using the PC for something else, and we had to have someone drive us a Windows 7 machine from three hours away.

So what happens in the business world when you can't get Windows 7 machines anymore. Ahhhhhhhhhh.

Microsoft has *got* to come out with a "business edition" of Windows that doesn't change as rapidly as the consumer versions.

Re:The problem is Windows 8 (4, Informative)

petermgreen (876956) | about a year ago | (#42707063)

So what happens in the business world when you can't get Windows 7 machines anymore. Ahhhhhhhhhh.

OEM versions of windows 8 pro come with downgrade rights to windows 7 and vista. If you want to downgrade further then volume licenses let you do that. I would expect the OEMs to offer buisness machines with Windows 7 drivers for as long as a significant proprortion of customers want windows 7 (just like they did for XP)

Re:The problem is Windows 8 (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42706899)

My ten year old daughter was in tears because she couldn't figure out her new windows 8 laptop. Now the laptop was underpowered, but it couldn't play DVDs out of the box and she couldn't figure out how to run her software on it thanks to the removal of the start button. Also, Toshiba added its bonus software which seemed to take over the whole computer periodically since pop ups now take the whole screen. I was frustrated trying to use it until I found a start menu hack and added it back.

I installed VLC so she can play DVDs and she has a start menu and now is very happy. Perhaps MS shouldn't have tried to do too much too soon?

To be fair to Microsoft, they weren't marketing the OS as a replacement for Stories2Learn.

Re:The problem is Windows 8 (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42707043)

What a condescending prick. You know half the people on Slashdot have been using computers since they were younger than this guy's daughter? I was using DOS and Novell systems at eight years old, writing simple game programs in BASIC. We used to encourage kids to become interested in computers at a young age, but I guess now we bully ten year olds who are frustrated with Microsoft's latest pile of shit.

Re:The problem is Windows 8 (5, Interesting)

isorox (205688) | about a year ago | (#42706919)

My ten year old daughter was in tears because she couldn't figure out her new windows 8 laptop.
Now the laptop was underpowered, but it couldn't play DVDs out of the box and she couldn't figure out how to run her software on it thanks to the removal of the start button. Also, Toshiba added its bonus software which seemed to take over the whole computer periodically since pop ups now take the whole screen.
I was frustrated trying to use it until I found a start menu hack and added it back.

I installed VLC so she can play DVDs and she has a start menu and now is very happy. Perhaps MS shouldn't have tried to do too much too soon?

No, we've had 2 years of microsoft fanboys on slashdot telling us how great windows 8 is. They can't be wrong. It's the people (bot) buying their product that're wrong!

Apple provided an integrated ecosystem. It sold brilliantly. itunes, ipod, iphone, ipad, all hanging off your imac. No OEM spyware slowing everything down, no HP printer drivers clogging up your screen, no dire warnings from mcafee when your anti-virus ran out. Even flinging your screen to your apple tv was trivial.
Then Jobs died.
Then ios5 wiped out the maps application off your phone.
Then the iphone5 came out which didn't work with any of your existing power cables and docks.
The high end market where you'd get an iphone as it just worked well now had stumbling blocks. It wasn't an obvious choice any more.
Then apple's share price fell.

Microsoft should have been there to take the lead. The android ecosystem just doesn't work well -- too many disparate devices, too much choice. People like uniformity and simplicity. They weren't.

Re:The problem is Windows 8 (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42707051)

They should have listened to the users. They didn't. It failed.

PEBKAC (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42707131)

May be the problem is that your daughter is a moron.

Re:The problem is Windows 8 (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42707157)

Making children cry? That's what Microsoft is all about!

Blame it on the others (5, Insightful)

gweihir (88907) | about a year ago | (#42706809)

The hallmark of those truly incompetent. To be found on the very left side in the diagram showing the distribution for the Dunning-Kruger effect.

How MS could mess this up so badly is quite astonishing. The only reasonable explanation is really, really bad leadership.

Re:Blame it on the others (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42706881)

Chair incoming, duuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck....

Re:Blame it on the others (3, Interesting)

jones_supa (887896) | about a year ago | (#42706895)

The only reasonable explanation is really, really bad leadership.

Why would that be the only reasonable explanation? Windows 8 is the result of choices made by several engineers and designers. I bet there are lots of people inside Microsoft who have had their say on it, not only Ballmer or Sinofsky.

Re:Blame it on the others (2)

grumling (94709) | about a year ago | (#42707151)

What about "That vision thing"? Ballmer never really struck me as a creative type (but I've never met the man, so I can't say), and successful companies need someone at the top who can telegraph their vision to the rest of the company. Not just talking about Steve Jobs here, but anyone who builds great companies. Howard Hughes, Alfred Sloan (who created the design group of GM, and was smart enough to put Harley Earl in charge of it), William Levitt (everyone should own a home), Akio Morita... you get the idea. Like it or not, Gates was able to get his vision of the future out to the employees (or at least see a good idea when it crossed his desk).

Re:Blame it on the others (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42707071)

I'm in agreement, but incompetence isn't just in large corporations like Microsoft, there's also been poor leadership at the highest level of US government:
Richard Nixon blamed the media for Watergate.
Barack Obama blames his opponents for the national debt.
Jimmy Carter blamed the 'crisis of American spirit' on the American people themselves.

This is good news. Because: (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42706813)

The more they are in denial, the less they see the abyss coming that they are heading for and the more they will accelerate towards it. So it will be a nice big bang, and something will finally change.

Let's just hope it will be the tablet disease and they will pull Jobs-lacking Apple down with them.

Re:This is good news. Because: (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42707011)

That would be awesome.

Microsoft is right (0)

N8F8 (4562) | about a year ago | (#42706815)

Vendors had a long time to move production to devices with a touch interface and for the most pat they did nothing. A few crappy all-in-ones and overly expensive laptops. Even bigger touch pads with faster interfaces would have made a world of difference. Meanwhile the market is proving MS correct and sales of tablets and small devices is booming. I track deal websites all the rime and every time someone posts a sub $500 touch notebook they sell out in short order . external touch pad devices seen real popular too. Face it, but Win 8 Sucks on a traditional notebook or PC.

Re:Microsoft is right (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42706911)

Like fuck they are.

"We've built a nice maglev car, it's all roads' fault they don't get much adoption. Everyone had a plenty of time to build some maglev roads, but they didn't".

Touch screens are useless for 90% of Windows users. MS thought it's a good idea to make touchscreen interface the center piece of the software most people use on a _desktop_, and they wonder why OEMs wouldn't care too much about spending time and money on developing a gimmick-enabled devices.

It's a shame because (3, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42706821)

Windows 8 is one of the best consumer products Microsoft has ever made. I've introduced 4 low level users to it, and after a couple months, without fail, they all love it.

Win8 is one of those things people will look back at after the fact and recognize that it was much better than everyone thought.

Re:It's a shame because (5, Insightful)

smash (1351) | about a year ago | (#42706893)

Try introducing it to 4 people who know what they're doing and see how you go. It's a crippled piece of shit.

Re:It's a shame because (3, Insightful)

transporter_ii (986545) | about a year ago | (#42707019)

It is, however, one of the shittiest business products it has ever made. There are people still trying to do work with real PCs. I'm happy they have a good consumer product, finally. But the business world and the consumer world have different needs. For the love of everything holy, WHY CAN'T THEY BRING OUT TWO PRODUCT LINES, ONE FOR BUSINESS AND ONE FOR CONSUMERS.

I like Windows 8 (-1)

patchouly (1755506) | about a year ago | (#42706823)

I know. I'm probably the only one. It really is simple and I have no idea why everyone is having a hard time. The system is identical to Windows 7 only the boring "Start Menu" has been replaced by the "Start Screen" with "Live tiles". It's turned one of the drab features into something cool. Other than that (without having a touch screen), it is the same as Windows 7. It starts up on the "Start Screen". You can either click on a tile to choose an activity or you can click on the "Desk Top" tile to go to your usual desk top. If folks are having a hard time understanding that, they probably should not be using a computer.

Re:I like Windows 8 (5, Insightful)

skeib (630324) | about a year ago | (#42706867)

You have obviously never used multiple windows at once. At work, I have two 24" screens and regularly have lots of open windows at once. If even one of the programs I use are a "metro" program, I am not able to use regular windows programs at the same time. This problem will only get worse with time, and is a showstopper for me.

Windows 8 is the solution to Microsofts problems, not the users' problems. That kind of disrespect for your customers never pays off.

Re:I like Windows 8 (1)

ProfanityHead (198878) | about a year ago | (#42706897)

Windows 8 is the solution to Microsofts problems, not the users' problems.

Bingo! We have a winner here. The guy several posts up that compared Ballmer and MS to Republicans was spot on.

If it hurts when you do that... (1)

tepples (727027) | about a year ago | (#42706905)

If even one of the programs I use are a "metro" program

You say it hurts when you use programs from the Windows Store. So stay out of the Windows Store and stick to Windows 7 applications, and you'll still be able to put windows side by side.

Re:If it hurts when you do that... (5, Insightful)

ericloewe (2129490) | about a year ago | (#42706955)

That's nice, but there's a problem:

Metro is being shoved in our faces, even on the desktop. Metro apps are supposed to be the new de facto standard for Windows.

Yet, it seems that nobody ever thought about keeping the desktop working as it always did, but better. No, they needed gratuitous changes, like removing the start button (Why? It's still there, serves a similar purpose and doesn't bother anyone), replacing the network pop-ups with a metro panel, moving the power options to the same stupid metro panel...

Metro isn't the problem. The fact that it bleeds into the desktop is.

Re:If it hurts when you do that... (1)

skeib (630324) | about a year ago | (#42706963)

Yes, that's correct, but I am not willing to jump through hoops just because MS has made bad choices for me.

At work, I use Win7 (and I will for as long as possible), at home I use Macs. Problem solved.

Re:If it hurts when you do that... (1)

robsku (1381635) | about a year ago | (#42706985)

I'm sure everyone can figure out that it's good idea to "avoid using anything that breaks the system for what you need" by themselves so what's your point?

Re:If it hurts when you do that... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42707003)

Or, you know, just stick with Windows 7.

PCs with Windows 8-only onboard peripherals (1)

tepples (727027) | about a year ago | (#42707117)

I was in a Staples store a few days ago. When I asked about sticking with Windows 7, a sales associate told me that a lot of other people had asked about downgrading, but several of the laptops on display had no Windows 7 driver for their Wi-Fi chipset, which means no Internet access.

Re:I like Windows 8 (3, Insightful)

smash (1351) | about a year ago | (#42706901)

Because is broke search. Because the start screen breaks workflow. Because it has 2 horribly disjointed user interfaces.

Re:I like Windows 8 (1)

Iceykitsune (1059892) | about a year ago | (#42706929)

Why are my IE favorites different on the desktop and metro?

Re:I like Windows 8 (4, Insightful)

jones_supa (887896) | about a year ago | (#42706937)

It's just so painful to flip back and forth between the classic desktop and Modern UI.

Also, the integration is half-baked: you have two Control Panels, two places to pin apps (taskbar and start screen), two Internet Explorers, and it ships with a mishmash of desktop/modern apps. It just feels more like running two virtual machines instead of one OS.

The live tiles are a fun toy to watch social media, that's all there is for me.

Re:I like Windows 8 (3)

KiloByte (825081) | about a year ago | (#42707067)

Please don't use the word "Modern". It's an intentional trick to sow confusion, akin to "Office Open XML" when their biggest competitor was OpenOffice. We need a proper name, and with the lack of something official, "Metro" is the best candidate (as it was official).

This is Microsoft, remember that they act opposite to Hanlon's razor.

Is Balmer a Republican? (1, Troll)

cjsm (804001) | about a year ago | (#42706829)

This is compelling evidence that Steve Balmer is a Republican. Does he also believe the President was born in Kenya? You'd have to be Republican wacko to believe the failure of Windows 8 is due to the OEM manufacturers. The PC manufacturers are the ones who should be suing Microsoft for tanking their sales with the insanity of Windows 8 as a PC operating system.. But what Microsoft is doing is another Republican tactic. Accuse others of what you've actually caused.

No he's actually being a Democrat... (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42706907)

...and trying to shove some unwanted, huge, expensive thing down America's throat (just like Obamacare) when America does not want it, and it changes everything to be a worse quality of experience, and costs way too much, and will ruin what everyone is already accustomed too. It's big, intrusive, and nobody still knows exactly "what's in it" yet, even after it's passed.... probably has secret "blue screen of death" panels in it too

Content and Presentation has always plagued MS (5, Interesting)

140Mandak262Jamuna (970587) | about a year ago | (#42706833)

This goes deep in time. Most of the computer users in the early 1990s who were reared in character terminals and Unix have always had a clear separation in their mind, between content and presentation. Clear enough for them to create documents that post script pinters print at 300 dpi, using plain VT100 terminals. HTML files created in ASCII editors. Graceful degradation of the presentation quality etc etc. But Microsoft pushed WYSIWYG and came up with heavily dumbed down word processors.

This time is content creation vs content consumption. Everything from typing a quick memo to video editing falls under the content creation. They usually need a full complement of input devices, a full keyboard, a good mouse, larger the screen it is better. But content consumption does not need all these user input devices. Oftentimes, a tap, a touch, a click is all that is required to passively consume content. Ch+ , Ch-, Vol+ and Vol- buttons cover 99% of the usage in a TV remote!

Microsoft first missed the boat in creating a simpler device for content consumption. It had been shipping WindowsCE and other such "simpler" devices for ages. But its idea of simple was less functional PC. It never understood the split was content creation vs content consumption. Eventually Apple got on to that divide, with at least some of its managers who came from deep unix background.

Then it decides to attach OS with two completely different goals (consumption vs creation) with some band-aid and baling wire to create a rickety contraption and call it Win8. Consumers of one do not want to pay for the other. I would not touch, literally, a touchscreen and smudge it up if I am also typing a doc or code on it.

The hardware makers also remember the days when 90% of their revenue came from WinTel boxes and how Microsoft walked roughshod all over them. They eviscerated the hardware vendors and danced on their entrails with hob-nailed boots, to conjure up a vision from PGWodehouse. Now WinTel accounts for a much smaller percentage of their sales and even lower percentage of their profits. Now it is payback time for Microsoft from these vendors. What went around is coming around to Microsoft.

"Consumption" devices hinder upward mobility (5, Insightful)

tepples (727027) | about a year ago | (#42707093)

Calling viewing works created by others "consumption" makes me think of tuberculosis [wikipedia.org] . Anyway:

Consider three kinds of users: people who only view works, hobbyists who create works, and professionals who create works for a living. A dichotomy between devices for viewing works created by others and devices for creating works makes it harder for people to start creating for at least three reasons:

Having to re-buy
If a viewer device is not suitable for creating, then someone who wants to step up from viewing to creating will have to buy a separate device.
Lack of economies of scale
Because fewer people will be buying devices capable of creating, they won't be able to take advantage of the intense price competition in viewer devices, causing a general-purpose device to climb far out of the price range of a Christmas present or something on which to spend an income tax refund.
Gatekeepers
Finally, once the sticker shock has scared away most hobbyists, certain gatekeeper entities will gain control over who is and isn't allowed to possess a device for creating. This gatekeeping has been seen since the mid-1980s in the video game market, with a dichotomy between "retail consoles" for home use and "devkits" for use only by professionals who have already proven their "relevant video game industry experience" and "financial stability" by moving to Austin, Boston, or Seattle for an apprenticeship of several years. Initially, this was needed to reassure brick-and-mortar retailers of the value of inventory and shelf space in the wake of a 1984 recession in the North American video game market, but as I wrote elsewhere [slashdot.org] , the constraints of retail aren't so important since the fourth quarter of 2006.

Each of these three hurdles deters people from creating as a hobby in the first place, which tends to turn people into "sheep that passively graze on what others make available to them," as free software advocate Richard Stallman put it when he decried the word "consumer" [gnu.org] .

[Devices for creating works] usually need a full complement of input devices, a full keyboard, a good mouse, larger the screen it is better. But [viewing them] does not need all these user input devices. Oftentimes, a tap, a touch, a click is all that is required to passively consume content. Ch+ , Ch-, Vol+ and Vol- buttons cover 99% of the usage in a TV remote!

If a viewer device isn't artificially restricted, it's a doddle to upgrade the latter into the former by buying a $15 keyboard and a $15 mouse. But if market-segmenting cryptography is in play, people who want to step up from viewing to creating might not be able to afford dropping $700 on a Mac.

Microsoft first missed the boat in creating a simpler device for [viewing].

Then what's the Xbox 360 console? In countries where the law allows, Microsoft even established a public "Indie Games" route to market using the XNA framework so that anyone with a $300 PC can create games for the platform.

Touch PCs are reckless (5, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42706835)

There is a NPRM coming out Monday from OSHA proposing the nationwide ban of non-handheld touch screens in the workplace while their ergonomic issues can be investigated.

A coalition of insurers that includes Aetna, Cigna, and others, plans to file the request with OSHA over concerns of the potential for repetitive stress injuries from use of full-sized touch PCs. The document will list several potential RSIs along with reports of injuries by touch PC owners that include:

- Torn or irritated rotator cuff injuries
- Back pain from disproportional development of upper arm musculature (gorilla arm syndrome)
- Elbow tendonitis
- Fatigue

Apparently this is a much larger problem than we all thought.

"He died and said just the one thing, 'MS Basic'." (1)

Impy the Impiuos Imp (442658) | about a year ago | (#42706851)

Citizen Microsoft: There's only one person in the world to decide what I'm going to do, and that's me. And if you think - if any of you think -

EMILY: You decided what you were going to do, MS, some time ago. (she looks at Susan) You can't always have it your own way, regardless of anything else that may have happened. (she sighs) Come on, MS.

Citizen Microsoft: Go on! Get out! I can fight this thing all alone!

PC Partners: You're making a bigger fool of yourself than I thought you would, Mr. Microsoft. You're licked. Why don't you -

Citizen Microsoft: (turning on him) Get out! I've got nothing to talk to you about. If you want to see me, have Best Buy write me a letter.

PC Partners: I see! (he starts toward the door)

SUSAN: (starting to cry) MS, you're just excited. You don't realize -

Citizen Microsoft: I know exactly what I'm doing. (he is screaming) Get out!

EMILY: (quietly) MS, if you don't listen to reason, it may be too late -

Citizen Microsoft: Too late for what? Too late for you and this - (he can't find the adjective) this public thief to take the love of the people of this planet away from me? Well, you won't do it, I tell you. You won't do it!

SUSAN: MS, there are other things to think of. (a sly look comes into her eyes) Your stockholders - you don't want them to read in the papers -

EMILY: It is too late now, William.

Citizen Microsoft: (rushes to the door and opens it) Get out, both of you!

SUSAN: (rushes to him) MS, please don't -

Citizen Microsoft: What are you waiting here for? Why don't you go?

EMILY: Goodnight, MS.

She walks out. PC Partners stops as he gets directly in front of Citizen Microsoft.

PC Partners: You're the greatest fool I've ever known, Microsoft. If it was anybody else, I'd say what's going to happen to you would be a lesson to you. Only you're going to need more than one lesson. And you're going to get more than one lesson.

(he walks past Microsoft)

Citizen Microsoft: Don't you worry about me. I'm William Foster Microsoft!

(screams louder)
I'm going to send you to Chapter 11, PC Partners. Chapter 11!

Quality of PCs and customer service (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42706855)

If Microsoft can solve Dell's problem of crappy, short-lifespan business PCs and abhorrent levels of customer service, then maybe perhaps that can effect a substantial change.

Businesses can no longer tolerate the forced premature obsolescence of PCs that have to be replaced in a "forklift-upgrade" manner every couple years. That is completely unsustainable. They can also no longer tolerate the shitty customer support, (getting the "Dell Dance") when brand new machines they've just bought break down and you call for support or warranty repairs, all you get is the runaround and the "blame the customer" treatment.

This is the era of "It isn't my fault" (4, Funny)

kgroombr (608645) | about a year ago | (#42706859)

Why not just blame this on Bush too.

Re:This is the era of "It isn't my fault" (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42706939)

Well, the rise of the Idiocracy definitely was part Cheney and his neocon gang's fault. Look at all the money that did flow from education to warfare, greed and religious extremism, and still does, because of them.
And Bush was Cheney's sock-puppet. So there you go.

"Failed"? (2)

Grashnak (1003791) | about a year ago | (#42706861)

The Register article talks about squabbles over "underwhelming Windows 8 sales over Christmas", which isn't exactly the same thing as "the failure of Windows 8".

Words. They actually mean things.

Windows 8 has a simple problem (5, Insightful)

drolli (522659) | about a year ago | (#42706863)

Windows 7 is stable, usable, and a sufficient progress over windows XP. WIndows XP dominated the last 10 years, and my prediction is that 7 will dominate on PCs in businesses the next 10 years. The company where i work has finished the Tests and adoption of windows 7 last year and is now rolling it out as the new standard system. And no - i dont belive that they will consider Windows 8. Reducating the employees to the Ribbon interface in office was already something they liked so little that they have their own solution for adding the old menus temporarily.

There is no visible advantage of touch in the office, and that is where MS truely domiates. The idea of touch-pcs is somthing which MS dreams about since at least the mid - 90s. Then they had an epic fail, now they hope they can ride in the waves of the ipad and android.

Re:Windows 8 has a simple problem (1)

burni2 (1643061) | about a year ago | (#42707119)

When I'm using my win xp box I can relax my mind, my eyes, I calm down.

I actually want to disagree that windows 7 is a sufficient progress over WinXP(fully updated) I got back running xp32 on my revo3600(64bit ready atom1.6ghz,2gb,320gb), it's fully encrypted:

And well what can I tell, boot times even with encryption not like win7(with faster hdd), and jbidwatcher(java/browser plugins all off) runs smoothly
I use this machine to do important work on, like personal administration(banking, paypal, ebay, shopping) using opera it all runs well,

to say the least when I use my XP-box and turn back to my corei7-Q720/8gb/1tb elitebook workstation laptop, I can only say the games+3dapps have more power, but having deactivated all fancy graphics and so on it looses to xp.

(winxp == config: looks like win2k)
WindowsXP seems to be cleaner, quicker to respond

Windows 8 does have some elegance w/ touch (1, Interesting)

tomboy17 (696672) | about a year ago | (#42706865)

So my wife just got a Windows 8 touch machine from Asus, and I have to say that two weeks in, it is very nice.

The problem was in the first week. The first night of using the machine it seemed incredible how many usability problems there were. There's no real "how to use this machine" intro when we booted up and the key things you need to do are not intuitive enough that you can just "learn" them right away. Now you might think that's an immediate strike against the UI, but the principle of discoverability is routinely violated by Apple, and there UI's are universally loved (there are tons of secret tricks on Macs that you have to read about to learn and the most radical thing about the iPod was that it had no on button, meaning it wasn't even clear how to start it when you first saw one). Anyway, the lack of an intro was compounded with some software problems -- specifically, there was a bug with the app store so we couldn't download anything at first and had to drop into a windows troubleshooter to clear it up (thanks Google!).

Now that we've got the app store thing ironed out and we've learned the swipey commands, the machine feels really graceful and fast to use. At least as simple to use as my Gnome shell, which I dearly dearly love. It actually has many of the same goals -- apps are always full screen, which is usually what you want, typing to search works nearly *everywhere*, etc. And the touch screen is fun. And if there are apps that haven't been app-ified, you have the old school Windows desktop mode to fall back on.

In short, Windows 8 manages to merge many of the conveniences of iOS devices with many of the conveniences with a full operating system. It's quick and easy to use once you know what you're doing. Slick packaging and attention to detail seem essential, however, and this is where Windows is at a disadvantage compared to Apple, since they don't in fact control the whole user experience. Do we blame Asus or Microsoft for the fact that our machine shipped with a buggy OS and a broken App store? Is Asus or Apple to blame for the fact that the one "intro" video Asus included was just advertising for the machine that showed us how beautiful it could look, and not anything that showed how to use the touch screen interface? It's not entirely clear to me.

Wide screens are for side-by-side windows (4, Insightful)

tepples (727027) | about a year ago | (#42706953)

apps are always full screen, which is usually what you want

Even if it's what you want, it isn't what I want, or what people who use a computer to do actual work [slashdot.org] want. I bought a 1920x1080 pixel monitor for my desktop PC so that I could view two 960px wide windows side by side using the Snap feature of Windows 7. Even my laptop with its 1024x600 pixel screen is wide enough for two 80-column windows (a source code editor and an output terminal).

Re:Wide screens are for side-by-side windows (1)

tomboy17 (696672) | about a year ago | (#42707103)

Windows 8 still supports the snappy window mode in the old-style desktop, and it has a way to look at two "apps" side-by-side in the new-world desktop (metro or whatever).

The only obvious problem I've seen is that if you like your browser in the new-world mode, they don't seem set up to let you have *two* browser instances side-by-side, which is obnoxious. You could just go use your browser in the old-world desktop mode, but then you lose all the elegance of the full-screen task-bar-less experience.

As to real coding work -- just use emacs fullscreen and divide your window as many times as you like, all from the keyboard. Why would you bother dragging windows around when you've got buffers!

3 factors caused it... apk (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42706875)

1.) Bad Economic Times, 2.) Everyone has a fast system already (mostly - so NO NEED TO "RE-BUY" (especially in economic hard times)), & 3.) Trying to put a smartphone interface onto a device folks are 18++ yrs. or so used to using with the Win9x shell, alienating them.

* Were I to speculate WHY Windows 8 hasn't done well? It's those 3 things, with HEAVY EMPHASIS on #3... especially THAT one!

That's ME, practically the "poster child for 'Windows fanboy @ /.'", which makes me a minority player around here actually, but @ least I can be honest & state WHY I don't & WON'T use Windows 8!

Does it have good things in it? Yes, beneath the 'covers', ala:

---

1.) Self-Terminating Services (which I've been doing for decades now since Windows NT 3.51, albeit manually)

2.) Heap "chunk randomization"

---

However - that interface? Stinks... pointless on a PC Desktop or Laptop even imo!

Microsoft's coding time would've been BETTER SPENT producing Service Pack #2 for Windows 7 instead of just issuing hundreds of patches!

(Which SP#2 won't be produced, due to MS WASTING TIME ON BUILDING A SMARTPHONE INTERFACE ON A PC DESKTOP - without the option during install to use the 'classic desktop shell' we've all become accustomed to over decades now!)

APK

P.S.=> Mr. Ballmer - Face it: You screwed up, own up to it, & move on... you'd be best-served doing that much, rather than railing against facts & attempting to "argue with the numbers" passing the buck/placing the blame on others, projecting your own faults onto them, when it's YOU & YOUR DECISIONS that are part of the problem!

... apk

I'm part of the problem (5, Interesting)

MasterOfGoingFaster (922862) | about a year ago | (#42706933)

Hey Microsoft - I'm part of the problem. I've used Win 8, hate the interface and I'm avoiding it. I'm also telling people to stick with Windows 7 because 8 looks like a massive tech support problem for me. So I flat out tell people that I won't support Win 8. Use Win 7, Ubuntu, or buy a Mac. Life is better for me, and it sucks for you.

Your mistake is FORCING the new interface onto users, rather than making it an option. Had you produced Win 8 with a start button, and made Metro (or whatever you call it) something users could grow into, it would have been something I'd support. But you made it a Take-It-Or-Leave-It deal and what do you see users doing? Yeah - we chose to leave it.

I'd suggest you guys quickly come out with Windows 8.1 and add an option to put the old Win 7 interface on it. In my opinion, Metro feels unrefined, inconsistent and not ready for prime time. Make it an option and all will be forgiven.

And stop blaming others. Everyone else saw this coming a mile away. You make a bad decision - own up to it. Blaming others makes you look stupid and totally clueless. This is causing us to question your ability to deliver in the future, as it indicates you are not listening to your customers.

Re:I'm part of the problem (1)

flyingfsck (986395) | about a year ago | (#42706957)

Ive been telling people for years that I dont do windows. Works like a charm.

Blame (5, Interesting)

Tx (96709) | about a year ago | (#42706943)

The telling thing about Windows 8 is that even the most rabidly pro-Microsoft people, when you look at their comments on Windows 8 as a desktop OS, they're basically saying "You can ignore Metro, and it's almost as good as Windows 7". I really haven't seen anybody try to claim that Windows 8 is a step forward over Windows 7 on the desktop. Since it was pretty obvious the Suface RT and it's expensive RT friends were going to be pretty niche, and not trouble the mainstream, affordable tablet market, it's a lose on the desktop and a lose on tablets, so I don't see how Microsoft can blame anyone but itself.

" By using its desktop operating system franchise as a lever, Microsoft will be able to enter the lower-specification end of the laptop market with a cost advantage which make make life difficult for former partners such as HP and Dell."

Yes, Microsoft won't have to pay for a Windows license. However since the Surface RT with keyboard is already more expensive than a low-end Ultrabook, and Microsoft will have to either keep a decent price differential between the RT and Pro, or withdraw the Surface RT from the market, I don't expect that the Surface Pro is going to be keenly priced enough to worry anybody. It will be priced up there with the mid-range 13" ultrabooks, but with worse battery life and a screen that's too small if you plan to use it primarily in laptop mode, it will be a niche purchase.

Re:Blame (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42707097)

The task manager and file copy capability are better in 8. Copying/Moving groups of large files was completely broken in 7, and required a 3rd party app to complete the copy/move.

That said, large file copies across a network are still somewhat unreliable and can hang the copy dialog in Win 8.

Metro IS to be ignored. I hope they fire Ballmer and drop Metro in Windows 9.

The empire strikes back (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42706947)

"Microsoft is planning to strike back ... with Surface Pro ... shorter battery life ... much heavier ..."

Yeah! That'll show 'em!

I'm waiting for Windows 9 (1)

Spacejock (727523) | about a year ago | (#42706961)

And I don't want a bloody touchscreen, either on my laptop OR my desktop, thanks very much.

Re:I'm waiting for Windows 9 (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42707047)

Bingo!

We need to start making and wearing t-shirts that say, "Windows 9 can't get here soon enough."

I predict that Win8 will continue to be a millstone around the neck of MS and the HW companies and generate huge volumes of complaints from business customers until MS capitulates and fairly quickly (for them) brings out Win9 that undoes some/most/all of the horrors of Win8. In other words, Win8 will be Vistaed/MEd, Bobbed.

The premise is the news! (1)

Mister Liberty (769145) | about a year ago | (#42706967)

Windows 8 fails. Sez M$.

Warning : incoming chair (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42706969)

Man, Ballmer must be getting more pissed off by the month, he might actually explode in to chairs at this rate.

If Windows 8 is a failure, strange to blame them (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42706971)

"The Register tells us that Microsoft has begun squabbling with PC manufacturers over the reasons behind the failure of Windows 8."

I'm sure there's lots of reasons. But last I checked, Windows 8 has only one manufacturer.

I wasn't even aware that it was officially acknowledged as a "failure" any more than, say, Windows Vista was.

Re:If Windows 8 is a failure, strange to blame the (1)

luther349 (645380) | about a year ago | (#42707079)

i think it has more to do with windows 8 machines shipping with broken drivers and some that are touch screen the touch lacks the driver and does not work had a buddy literary take back 3 laptops each one had some sort of out of the box driver issue. and of course the os its self is just a pile of garbage i had him go get a system 76 Ubuntu pc and after ripping out unity or xfce hes happy with it and everything works.

Microsoft right to do so (1)

elabs (2539572) | about a year ago | (#42706991)

A PC is half software and half hardware. OEMs need to make hardware that people want to own. At work many people request a mac, then wipe it and put Windows on it (or run Parallels). They want the nice hardware but they want the Windows 8 OS. They don't want some piece of plastic.

This is something to worry about (5, Insightful)

linebackn (131821) | about a year ago | (#42706997)

If you have big investments in Microsoft or Microsoft products, you should be worried. The inability to recognize their failure means they will keep trying to ram themselves in to the ground.

This reminds me so much of the 98 Internet Explorer "Integration" fiasco. You WILL install it and you WILL use it regardless if you want it or not. The only reason they did it was to crush their competitor. But eventually they realized that even this was a mistake and somewhat backed down from it.

They even canned Microsoft BOB fairly quickly, and you don't see much of Clippy any more either.

But if they really don't realize they made a mistake here, then you will see no improvements in Windows 9/10/11 etc and further product degradation in to an even worse mess of useless crap.

Build HW products like Apple, but with Windows 8? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42706999)

Abandon the low-end? Yeah, right. Thanks for the advice, Microsoft, but your cut is the same whether the hardware manufacturers sell cheap laptops or higher-end ones, so I think the response from them would be something like "Shut up and take our money."

It's simple, really. (4, Insightful)

Dcnjoe60 (682885) | about a year ago | (#42707017)

It's simple really. Consumers are moving towards tablet like devices. Businesses are sticking with traditional desktop/laptop. Windows 8 targets tablet like devices, which could be good for consumers, but that isn't where most desktop/laptop sales are occuring, which is the business market. Desktop/laptop sales in the consumer market are are very price conscious. Desktop/laptop sales in the business market are directed at productivity, which equate to lowering costs of duing business.

Windows 8 may be the next best thing since sliced bread as a technology (although I doubt that). However, it appears that it misses the mark in both the consumer and business markets for traditional desktop/laptop computing. Maybe Microsoft needs to go back and take a Marketing 101 course or two, because Microsoft has nobody to blame but themself. The hardware manufacturers are producing what the market will buy. It is simple supply and demand and there isn't a lot of demand for Windows 8.

Win8 drove me to Ubuntu (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42707039)

After 20 years of MS dev (C++ MFC, ATL, DirectX / C# NET), Win8 screwup has driven me to Ubuntu.

Say what you want about Sinofsky, he did manage to kill Windows on time!
They haven't blamed the consumers ... yet.

dear microsoft (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42707065)

when you point your finger at pc makers.... three fingers are pointing right back at you.

it's your own fucking fault that windows 8 sucks. the whole project should've been.....

captcha: aborted

Blame Canada (1)

gmuslera (3436) | about a year ago | (#42707075)

We must blame them and cause a fuss
Before somebody thinks of blaming us!

"which make make life difficult" (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42707077)

Oh rly?

Good they've officially admitted Windows 8 failed. (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42707081)

Good they've officially admitted Windows 8 failed.

Windows 8 Sucks? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42707101)

Wouldn't be that important fact? That people do not like change especially when it comes to computers. A phone redesign is different as long as they can text and make phone calls, but a system like a desktop where they are accustomed to find things exactly where they always were is infuriating. I spend twenty minutes trying to assign the desktop a static IP and I work as network engineer.

What a surprise, another Windows 8 failure screed! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#42707125)

Thanks Slashdot, but it seems you spend more time talking about the supposed failure of Windows 8 than you do about Linux doing anything.

What does that tell the observant reader?

That Linux once again, fails to be important enough to talk about, so you have to distract yourself with yet another illusory fantasy about Microsoft being doomed.

Keep telling yourself that.

wow (1)

drankr (2796221) | about a year ago | (#42707129)

I have lived to see it, the downfall of Microsoft.
Thanks, Steve.

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