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Is Daylight Saving Time Worth Saving?

Soulskill posted about a year and a half ago | from the either-that-or-it's-not dept.

United States 646

Daniel_Stuckey writes "In politics, health, and academia, there are plenty of detractors that say daylight saving might not be worth saving. One vocal opponent is Missouri State Representative Delus Johnson, who wants to end the watch and clock switchery altogether. In short, he says we should spring forward this one last time, without ever falling back. He wants Missouri – and other states willing to join a pact – to permanently adopt daylight saving time and call it Standard Time. He's sure that it'll increase economic development in the later part of the year; giving people a little more daylight to do their Black Friday shopping. Matthew J. Kotchen and Laura E. Grant at the National Bureau of Economic Research have argued that DST has had adverse effects on energy spending. They calculate some extra $10-16 million spent by Indiana due to time changes. Their research concluded it's probably a much bigger loss in other states. A year ago, Motherboard's Kelly Bourdet reported on a health study that concluded DST might actually kill you. Chances of heart-attack were stated to increase by 10 percent on the days following the spring change, and to decrease by 10% after gaining the hour in the fall." There's even a We The People petition about it.

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Morning sunlight is a waste (5, Insightful)

jimbolauski (882977) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120243)

Why is it so important to have sunlight in the morning, give me evening sunlight that I can enjoy after work. I don't need sunlight for my morning deuce.

Re:Morning sunlight is a waste (2, Insightful)

Overzeetop (214511) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120347)

Maybe you should either get to work earlier? Why should the rest of us plan our days around your idiosyncracies - or anyone's for that matter.

You do know that, effectively, that's what you're doing anyway with DST. Solar physics doesn't actually change.

Re: Morning sunlight is a waste (5, Informative)

Vanderhoth (1582661) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120487)

How about because companies decide what core hours are, which tend to be relative to whether DST is in affect or not. I Know very few people that decide What hours they'll work when working forsomeone else.

Re:Morning sunlight is a waste (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#43120567)

That was nonsense. You said nobody should plan around his day, which he didn't suggest, and then (rightly) pointed out that you're structuring your day around someone else's schedule by observing DST in the first place.

Re:Morning sunlight is a waste (2)

dpdjvan (2551774) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120459)

You do realize the by moving the clock ahead an hour you would have a percived notion of an extra hour of day after work. This is assuming you don't have flexiable hours.

Re:Morning sunlight is a waste (5, Informative)

fustakrakich (1673220) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120483)

If we do away with daylight savings, we should shift all the time zones about 7 or 8 degrees farther west longitude. The sun sets too early in the eastern half (near the 'leading edge') of each time zone.

sunsets, twilight, and stars (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#43120537)

Why is it so important to have sunlight in the morning, give me evening sunlight that I can enjoy after work. I don't need sunlight for my morning deuce.

And what about those of us who enjoy the evening? Who enjoy sunsets and dusk, and would like some time afterwards? There are those who have decent access to more (semi-)rural areas as well, who would like to enjoy the stars without it getting too late.

I live in the city primarily, and I don't see how urban folk would limit their activities only to daylight hours. There are enough street lamps around that it's never truly dark.

Personally I think we should simply move back to standard time. It is, after all, what it once was before we starting futzing with it.

Re:Morning sunlight is a waste (2)

SeaFox (739806) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120539)

Why is it so important to have sunlight in the morning, give me evening sunlight that I can enjoy after work. I don't need sunlight for my morning deuce.

Children walk to school early in the morning. The brighter outside it is, the better parents feel (how much this really impacts safety is debatable).
School ends long before the sub goes down, so having extra daylight at the end of the day is of less importance.

Re:Morning sunlight is a waste (2)

hedwards (940851) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120613)

You could solve that problem by scheduling school in a more reasonable way without effecting everybody else. Ultimately with only 8 hours or so of light at the winter solstice, the only way to avoid that problem is by centering the school day around noon.

Bottom line is that it makes more sense to just schedule things properly than to kludge things together.

Re:Morning sunlight is a waste (5, Informative)

arobatino (46791) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120587)

I remember walking to the school bus stop in the dark when Nixon implemented year-round daylight savings time as a result of the oil embargo. It was just starting to get light by the time the bus arrived. From 1973 oil crisis [wikipedia.org] :

Year-round daylight saving time was implemented from January 6, 1974, to February 23, 1975. The move spawned significant criticism because it forced many children to commute to school before sunrise. The pre-existing daylight saving rules, calling for the clocks to be advanced one hour on the last Sunday in April, were restored in 1976.

NO. (4, Insightful)

fyngyrz (762201) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120245)

No! It's a royal pain in the ass. Get rid of it!

Re:NO. (5, Insightful)

mattventura (1408229) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120327)

Lots of things are a pain in the ass. US measurement system, silly date notation systems, IPv4, the two party system, etc. Unfortunately none of those are going anywhere anytime soon.

Re:NO. (5, Insightful)

pixelpusher220 (529617) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120415)

Indeed, but there's literally about zero effort to just not fall back. This is low hanging fruit on the pain-in-the-ass fruit tree.

Re:NO. (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#43120455)

Except for all that software and firmware that expects a change.

Re:NO. (1)

Obfuscant (592200) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120603)

Indeed, but there's literally about zero effort to just not fall back. This is low hanging fruit on the pain-in-the-ass fruit tree.

Except for changes to every computer, embedded or otherwise, that would normally "fall back" and thus have the wrong time for half the year, there is zero effort involved. If you have zero responsibility for maintaining anything, yes, there's zero effort.

It would be somewhat less effort to fall back one more time and then stay there, since it is somewhat easier to set up systems to stay on standard time year-round than to stay on daylight saving time.

Re:NO. (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#43120485)

Must be rough having first world problems.

Re:NO. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#43120673)

Whats wrong with the date notation? It matches the exact way dates are spoken.

You say "March 8th 2013"
That exactly matches 3/8/2013

Re:NO. (2, Insightful)

hedwards (940851) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120675)

The imperial measures aren't a pain in the ass if you know how to use them. In fact they're easier in some way as you don't have to decimalize things. I can use a half, two thirds or a quarter when I'm doubling or halving recipes, something which is somewhat more convenient with non-metric measures.

The only people I see arguing against imperial measures for daily living are people who don't actually know how to use them. The contrived examples people use to prop up the metric system aren't ones that ever occur in real life. We don't compare the temperature to freezing and boiling to decide if we're hot, we rarely if ever think about both miles and inches at the same time as the precision wouldn't make sense.

And as for date, unless you're a proponent of year, month, date, you're day month year system is the worst one in common use as it ensures that the time dates are never in order with out kludge whether you care about sorting by month or year. People rarely if ever want to know what happened on a specific date in random years.

Re:NO. (5, Interesting)

Freshly Exhumed (105597) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120361)

UTC with NTP... that's the way to go. Goodbye local time forever!

Re:NO. (2)

lart2150 (724284) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120533)

Every time I have to deal with timezones I wish everyone was UTC I know for a lot of people including my self the next day would change part way through the day but it's so annoying to deal with as many time zones as we have today. While we are at it can we fix it so no month has less than 30 days or more then 31?

Re:NO. (0)

unixisc (2429386) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120543)

It's like cutting off your head and standing on it in order to look taller

Is daylight savings time worth saving? (3, Insightful)

DarthBling (1733038) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120249)

No.

Just in time (4, Informative)

mwvdlee (775178) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120257)

This article just in time for the yearly "Should we keep DST? No, but we'll keep it anyway" cycle.

Re:Just in time (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#43120301)

I don't particularly care about DST one way or the other.
But I really abominate these semiannual discussions.

Re:Just in time (1)

SuperRenaissanceMan (1027668) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120333)

Biennial cycle.

Re:Just in time (2)

Bacon Bits (926911) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120647)

No, it's just annual. Nobody complains in the fall when they get an extra hour on their weekend.

Re:Just in time (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#43120681)

I think you mean biannual meaning twice a year.
Biennial is every two years (or lasting two years).

Captcha: Flunked

Re:Just in time (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#43120391)

Yeah, real original, slashdot [slashdot.org] .
News for nerds, stuff that matters.

Ugh... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#43120259)

I know it's only twice a year, but here we go again. A discussion on DST.

Oh, and we need to adjust our clocks by an hour, big deal.

Re:Ugh... (1)

oh_my_080980980 (773867) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120585)

Because there is no point in doing this pointless exercise. What made it worse was the moving days we sent out clocks back and forward. That pissed off alot of software developers for absolutely no gain.

Electricty has made daylight savings obsolete (4, Informative)

MrEricSir (398214) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120271)

There was a time when it was very, very dark at night, and it made sense to adjust the schedule so you could actually see.

But with electric lighting, it's pretty much never dark in areas where people live and work. The benefit to daylight savings is much less than it was 100 years ago.

Re:Electricty has made daylight savings obsolete (1)

jxander (2605655) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120329)

I never understood this argument... turning our clocks back and forth doesn't actually change the amount of sunlight per day. Just moves the hour from morning to evening, and back.

If you have a job that requires sunlight late in the day, just wake up an hour earlier. Does a farmer get more daylight hours working from 7am - 8pm, as opposed to working 6am - 7pm?

Re:Electricty has made daylight savings obsolete (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#43120461)

When you're a farmer, this is easy. When you're an hourly worker in a corporation, or any modern office worker, this is impossible in most places. (unless you're lucky enough that yours allows flexible hours.)

I'm with the crowd to keep DST all year.

Re:Electricty has made daylight savings obsolete (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#43120481)

turning our clocks back and forth doesn't actually change the amount of sunlight per day.

It changes the schedule. If you wake up at 7 for a 8-5 shift, there's a difference if dawn was at 6 or 7 in how much sunlight is wasted during the day.

I am opposed to multiple clock schedules, but for a time it was a viable compromise and easier to handle than changing peoples' schedules by 5 minutes at a time to benefit from natural light.

Re:Electricty has made daylight savings obsolete (4, Informative)

pixelpusher220 (529617) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120535)

Since 'most' people work 9-5, significant daylight time after 5pm is a pretty attractive concept. The farmer works outside, so as you say it doesn't matter when it's light to him.

To the working stiffs, it does because if it's dark in the morning and on the way to work it doesn't affect them, but multiple hours of light after work is very beneficial.

Re:Electricty has made daylight savings obsolete (2)

bws111 (1216812) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120565)

Many people seem to enjoy doing things outdoors, in actual sunlight, after they get done with work. So, you say, just go to work an hour earlier. Well that is OK if your employer, customers, etc also agree to that shift. But then the customers also have the same problem with their employers and customers. But since most people are fine with having an extra hour of sunlight during the after work hours most people will agree to it. Now all we have to do is agree on when exactly this shift will happen. Hmm, maybe we could just pick a date when everybody will change to these earlier hours. Now all we have to do is change all references to times (printed materials, calendars, ads, signs, etc) to reflect this new time.

Of course, when winter rolls around again that going to work and school in the dark gets old real fast, so we can just reverse this process.

Or maybe, we could pick two days a year when we simply adjust the clock to reflect what most people would want anyway.

Re:Electricty has made daylight savings obsolete (1)

captaindomon (870655) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120639)

This. I have never understood either. We're not changing the amount of time each day. If you need more light, change your hours. There is a very good image here that helps to explain (the purple one): http://www.thefullwiki.org/DST [thefullwiki.org]

Re:Electricty has made daylight savings obsolete (1)

Hentes (2461350) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120397)

Electric lighting isn't free.

Re:Electricty has made daylight savings obsolete (2)

MrEricSir (398214) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120439)

Electric lighting isn't free.

Neither are clocks.

Re:Electricty has made daylight savings obsolete (1)

CanHasDIY (1672858) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120509)

Malarkey! [wikipedia.org]

Re:Electricty has made daylight savings obsolete (1)

oh_my_080980980 (773867) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120609)

Changing the clocks doesn't save you money on electricity...

Re:Electricty has made daylight savings obsolete (1)

pixelpusher220 (529617) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120507)

Close but not quite. Lighting was one of the most expensive household utilities. Back in the 1700s it cost significant money to make and transport candles everywhere. Today lighting is basically an after thought on the home expense charts.

That said, it would actually make more sense to leave it at EST rather than DST. On DST we're home earlier in the evening and thus usually will run the AC unit more, increasing energy usage.

In a future world where a majority of thermostats adjust based on household occupancy and time of day, it will cost 'more' to be on DST than not. On EST it could wait until the sun is lower before cooling down the house for people arriving home from work.

Re:Electricty has made daylight savings obsolete (1)

91degrees (207121) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120529)

The odd thing is, that DST didn't come about until after street lighting was quite common. By the time it was proposed (1890's) there were already several streets with electric lighting, and many cities had had gas lighting for several decades.

Re:Electricty has made daylight savings obsolete (1)

Cmdr-Absurd (780125) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120531)

But with electric lighting, it's pretty much never dark in areas where people live and work.

That argument works if you are indoors, but if you are outside gardening, cycling, etc, more hours of post-workday daylight are a real boon. Of course we could also solve the problem by adjusting the clock time start/end of work days or adopting more flex time working, but that seems to be just as controversial.

Re:Electricty has made daylight savings obsolete (1)

oh_my_080980980 (773867) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120629)

Out door lighting - it's a real boon.

We can also fast forward lunch. (1)

140Mandak262Jamuna (970587) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120279)

We should also call breakfast lunch, lunch dinner, and dinner breakfast when we do this. As it is, most high schools are so crowded the first lunch period starts as early as 10 AM. With permanent daylight saving time, it will still be dark or just breaking dawn in winter when this time rolls around.

Let's just do this... (1)

fuzzyfuzzyfungus (1223518) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120281)

Cut all the whiny human 'cry, cry, I'm all worked up about where the abnormally close star is right now' crap and just adopt TAI across the board. Now that is proper time.

They want permanent Day Light Saving Time! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#43120293)

>In short, he says we should spring forward this one last time, without ever falling back.
Since day light saving time starts this weekend, he is advocating of removing Standard Time and not Day Light Saving Time. So everybody move time zone by 1 hour.

>A year ago, Motherboard's Kelly Bourdet reported on a health study that concluded DST might actually kill you. Chances of heart-attack were stated to increase by 10 percent on the days following the spring change, and to decrease by 10% after gaining the hour in the fall."
So that's going to increase chances of heart attack for everybody.

Do we keep ?DT or ?ST (1)

Marc_Hawke (130338) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120303)

The summary says that we should 'spring forward' without 'falling back.' However the end of the summary says that 'springing forward' increases risk of heart attack, so wouldn't it be better to wait till we 'fall back?' Picking the wrong one would mean a 2-hour shift (or maybe an overlap) between zones (somewhere over an ocean.)

Re:Do we keep ?DT or ?ST (2)

SJHillman (1966756) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120521)

Presumably it's that springing forward makes people late more than falling back, which increases stress, thus the heart attacks. Falling back, likewise, makes people early and reduces stress. However, the effect is only for immediately after a clock change... so it makes no sense to "wait until we fall back". The only way that logic would make sense would be to fall back every year and never spring forward... of course that won't work for obvious reasons.

Personally, I'm in favor of abolishing time zones altogether. For most people, remembering "I'm in Britain, and it's noon so it must be 7am in New York" is no more or less difficult than remembering "I'm in Britain and it's lunchtime, so it's breakfast time in New York". I'd just have to get up at 11:30 and be to work by 13:00 instead of getting up at 6:30am EST and being to work by 8am EST.

Related to Yahoo cancelling remote work? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#43120313)

I want to relate this to Yahoo cancelling remote work. Is DST so that way 7am will always be a certain amount of brightness all year long? So that way we can get in our cars and drive to work and be there by 8am? Why not measure productivity in a different way instead of keeping seats warm from 8am to 5pm?
One more vote for no more DST.

Missouri (4, Interesting)

CanHasDIY (1672858) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120331)

It's nice to see a mention of one of my great state's reps that, for once, doesn't involve them doing/saying something unspeakably stupid...

Yea, I'm talking about you, Todd Akin [policymic.com] and Rory Ellinger. [ky3.com]

Re:Missouri (2)

codepigeon (1202896) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120447)

I would mod you up if I had points. Agreed, finally something sensible from a Missouri politician that doesn't make us the laughing stock of the country.

Re:Missouri (1)

geekoid (135745) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120465)

Yes, if you agree clearly it isn't stupid~

sheesh.

OTOH, you publicly display how ignorant you are about Capitalism and feudalism in your sig. So I guess I shouldn't be surprised by ignorant people thinking there opinion on the matters is valid.

Re:Missouri (1)

CanHasDIY (1672858) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120549)

Yes, if you agree clearly it isn't stupid~

sheesh.

Never knew you were a Todd Akin fan. What a piece of shit.

OTOH, you publicly display how ignorant you are about Capitalism and feudalism in your sig.

Yea, sure thing buddy... 'cause expecting you to have the capacity for critical thought is just going waaay too far...

So I guess I shouldn't be surprised by ignorant people thinking there opinion on the matters is valid.

Didn't your mother ever tell you, if you don't have anything constructive to add to the conversation, keep your self-aggrandizing, masturbatory petulance to yourself?

Unix Time (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#43120357)

We should use seconds since 1970. Why 1970 you ask? Its really easy to implement, and as its a Friday afternoon I feel lazy.

Re:Unix Time (0)

fustakrakich (1673220) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120515)

Why 1970 you ask?

Kent State... Never Forget...

Kill it (2, Interesting)

onyxruby (118189) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120367)

Kill it dead, bury it in the textbooks of history and let daylight saving stand as a testament of the folly of man that he thought he might outwit mother nature. Incredible amounts of money and aggravation are wasted every year on this leftover from the age of agriculture.

In a modern world where clocks are set by the atom this archaic throwback to the days of the steam locomotive has gone from quaint to foolish expense. No one will miss it and society has long since moved on with these wonders we call light bulbs and headlights. We'll be okay, just like we are every other single night when the sun sets.

Re:Kill it (5, Interesting)

geekoid (135745) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120577)

I will miss it, as well many people in the north.
Some things you should probably consider:
1) No one is trying to trick mother natures, if you think it's about that, then you are fucking stupid and STFU
2) There is no indicator that, overall, money is wasted
3) "In a modern world where clocks are set by the atom "
This underscores how ignorant you small minded you are. It has nothing to dodo the the accuracy of a clock.

More daylight in the evening is beneficial and enjoyable.

Yo do know we live on a globe, right? and that northern states are impacted more by the shifting about of daylight? And there aren't a lot of places that get an exact amount of day and night every year? and that not everyone gets to pick there work hours? and people do more outside in the evening then in the morning? People use more electricity for lighting in the evening then they do in the morning?

Most people get up just in times to shower, eat and then go to work. Not a lot of relaxing hang around tyime. and if there where it would be colder anyways
Bunch of short sighted morons.

GMT FTW!! (0)

AntEater (16627) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120369)

The time change is and always has been stupid. If we're going to "fix" this, then lets do it right and all jump directly to UTC/GMT. The number on the clock itself is arbitrary so we would be better off going with the true time standard once and for all.

Look at it historically... (1)

SirGeek (120712) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120381)

If I remember correctly from history classes, the original purpose of it was to preserve daylight for farming. Think about how light it is during the summer time (at night).

However in the current "Non Agrarian" society we live in, it make no sense. Having a 23 hour day and a 25 hour day makes certain companies have a nightmare for their computer systems. Was that hour ending 02 the first or second hour ending 02 (on the 25 hour day) or "what happened to 02 on 03/10/2013 ? Oh yeah DST.."

It really doesn't help ANYONE at this time.

Re:Look at it historically... (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#43120541)

"preserve daylight for farming" is simply not true. Historically farmers used nature as the 'clock'. A ticking box on the wall was not used to determine when to wake up, when to milk the cows, when to sleep, etc.

Re:Look at it historically... (1, Insightful)

pixelpusher220 (529617) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120575)

The farmer has the same amount of daylight to use regardless of what hour it is labelled...

Re:Look at it historically... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#43120657)

Not since we threatened to put out the Sun if it didn't respect DST!

Re:Look at it historically... (1)

Ol Biscuitbarrel (1859702) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120579)

Related to this, before time zones estimating what the time in another city was very hit-and-miss. Different municipalities simply set clocks according to the sun's position in the sky, resulting in utter chaos for railroads.

As railways and telecommunications improved, however, timekeeping became more baffling. Each railroad would use its own standard time, usually based on the local time of its headquarters, and their schedules were published in accord with their own time. Some railroad junctions even had a separate clock for each railroad. The main station in Pittsburgh, for example, kept six different clocks. In 1883, there were twenty-seven different local times in Illinois alone. Railroad users were inconvenienced and confused by the lack of uniformity. The difficulty came to an end in 1883 when U.S. and Canadian railroads adopted four standardized time zones which replaced the multiplicity of local times.

Daylight Saving Time: When, Where, and Why? [psu.edu] The adoption of DST was an outgrowth of the experiences with time zone adoption.

Re:Look at it historically... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#43120583)

I never understood this argument. Modern computers don't manipulate time in local time. Usually they manipulate time as seconds from an epoch, which never changes. And POSIX-compliant computers take it a step further and define exactly 86400 "seconds" per day, regardless of leap seconds. Ultimately, things like leap seconds or the hour of the day are merely reduced to display problems.

Obviously there are niche domains, like perhaps daily or weekly utility billing, where you have to deal with it. But removing DST will not change the complexity of these systems. And generally speaking, I think people overestimate the accuracy of these systems, anyhow. Dealing with a shift of an hour or two is the least of the problems that need to be dealt with. And in any event there's nothing preventing these systems from choosing to use UTC (or even TAI) if they really wanted to. Whether your Sprint bill shits an hour from one month to the next (not possible, anyhow, as these things happen mid-month) is going to effect the way that people travel to work or school.

Re:Look at it historically... (1)

oh_my_080980980 (773867) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120653)

Which is ironic since we are moving the clocks AHEAD which means you are losing an hour. So you do not have a longer day during the summer but rather a shorter day. If you left the clock in the fall back position, where you have the extra hour, you would then have a longer day during the summer.

Re:Look at it historically... (1)

captaindomon (870655) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120665)

But but... it didn't give us any extra light for farming. We have the same amount of light. It just made farmers feel better, I guess?

As an Arizona resident (3, Insightful)

NaCh0 (6124) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120387)

I can safely say moving your clocks is idiotic. If you want to work 8-4 or 9-5, it really don't matter at all. Just pick one and make it happen.

Re:As an Arizona resident (0)

geekoid (135745) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120445)

Yes, Arizona is just like northern states. Be sure to base you opinion on that..Idiot.

It's about having more daylight in the evening then in the morning; which can be significant in the Northern states.

And contrary to your sheltered insignificant life, Most people don't get to pick the time they have to be at work.

Take this week to contemplate that there are other places and people in the world, and how actions can effect them.

Re:As an Arizona resident (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#43120667)

I lived in a Northern state for 25 years. Yes, by adjusting the time, there's more light at a certain time. Who cares? The day is just as long as it has always been, just do things at the times that there is light. It's not really that hard.

Until I went into being a tech person, I found the idea annoying, but mostly harmless. Now, though, it's a gigantic pain in the ass that we have to code for and test against for no discernible reason. While I admit that this is due to shitty code (which I did not write), DST is actually postponing a deployment this weekend because DST causes problems every time in production. While we could fix, and will eventually fix that crap code, in a world without DST, we wouldn't even have to code for it to begin with. So, even if we did get it right the first time, we'd have had to spend money and time coding and testing DST.

DST needs to die. I don't even know who actually supports it any more. I'm hoping its simply because people have been too lazy to change it rather than people who actually want it.

Delus Johnson is an idiot. (1)

msauve (701917) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120393)

Just stop DST alltogether, don't go on it "permanently." That's just plain stupid. Businesses can have hours of 8-4 instead of 9-5, (or whatever) if they wish - but the government should just be out of it. DST doesn't save anything - it just screws with people's sleep patterns and causes missed appointments a couple of days each year

Re:Delus Johnson is an idiot. (1)

sjames (1099) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120599)

But inertia from PHBs inevitably gets in the way. It is actually easier to change every clock in the timezone than it is to get a sensible decision out of a PHB in time for it to still matter.

Re:Delus Johnson is an idiot. (1)

pixelpusher220 (529617) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120637)

DST doesn't save anything

When lighting was a major part of a house's energy draw, using less candles saved significant money. Likewise in the early days of electricity, it saved a significant portion of the electric bill, since lights were the main user of electricity.

Today though, the amount of electricity used in a home by lighting is a small fraction of the total energy used. So today, no it doesn't save us much.

Again (1)

geekoid (135745) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120395)

Yes, it
's worth saving.

There, never ask it again.

From Experience (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#43120399)

I have lived with DST and without it ... if you ever live without having to pointlessly change your external and internal clocks you will not want to go back.

Arizona laughs at your silliness (1)

Sycraft-fu (314770) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120403)

We should just use standard time as standard time. Seriously, it is nice living in a place that doesn't adjust. It is always UTC -7 here. Playing with the clocks is silly. If we want to get up earlier or later part of the year, just do that.

Also I really question if an hour either way makes any economic difference at all.

Re:Arizona laughs at your silliness (1)

Doug Otto (2821601) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120467)

"It is always UTC -7 here.' unless you drive 50 miles.......AZ is more confusing than states that change their time.

Get rid of the time zones already! (2)

Qubit (100461) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120411)

Seriously -- let's just all use GMT, and get rid of Daylight savings, and all use 24 hour time.

Want to schedule a meeting with your coworker 1 cubicle over? How about with your coworker over in the Paris office? Awesome: Let's meet on Monday the 22nd, at 17:34 via (insert voice/video chat system of choice).

Time zones?
Daily savings time?
AM/PM?

Ain't nobody got time for that!

Re:Get rid of the time zones already! (1)

fustakrakich (1673220) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120571)

Won't work. You would have to remember all sorts of different business hours for each section of the globe. !2 noon should be midday wherever you are. What should be done is to move the prime meridian to the International Date Line.

Re:Get rid of the time zones already! (1)

fustakrakich (1673220) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120627)

What should be done is to move the prime meridian to the International Date Line.

The reason to do that is get rid of the 'east-west' dividing line so that longitude is a full 360 instead of two 180s.

Re:Get rid of the time zones already! (1)

CanHasDIY (1672858) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120601)

Seriously -- let's just all use GMT, and get rid of Daylight savings, and all use 24 hour time.

Want to schedule a meeting with your coworker 1 cubicle over? How about with your coworker over in the Paris office? Awesome: Let's meet on Monday the 22nd, at 17:34 via (insert voice/video chat system of choice).

Time zones?
Daily savings time?
AM/PM?

Ain't nobody got time for that!

Obligatory Nationalist response:

FUCK GREENWICH!

lol

Ben Franklin vs. AZ (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#43120425)

I would go with Ben's advice. He seems more reasonable, even if he doesn't get around much anymore.

Screw DST (3, Insightful)

Tyler Durden (136036) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120431)

Twelve AM was set up to be defined as the middle of the night; 12 PM the middle of the day. (Or 00:00/12:00 if you prefer the 24 hour clock). Don't like how dark that makes the usual active hours during the Winter? Fine - switch the hours that businesses are active. But please stop arbitrarily changing time-keeping.

Re:Screw DST (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#43120633)

12 o'clock is either midnight or noon. It is not AM or PM. AM = ante meridian = before midday. PM = post meridian = after midday. 12 noon is midday.

Let's abolish timezones (1)

91degrees (207121) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120451)

Swatch internet time [wikipedia.org] . Divide the day into 1000 .beats. No timezones. @100 in Moscow is @100 in London, New York and Beijing. They just start and finish working at different times.

Slight downside here - the whole concept is disturbingly 1990's "information superhighway" with '.'s and '@'s all over the place.

Cure for the common heart attack! (2)

kms_one (1272174) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120497)

Chances of heart-attack were stated to increase by 10 percent on the days following the spring change, and to decrease by 10% "after gaining the hour in the fall" I've found a cure for all heart attacks! Set the clocks back an hour once a month! (I'll accept my Nobel Prize award in Bitcoins please).

White House Petition to Eliminate DST (1)

ZeroSerenity (923363) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120511)

For the interested. [whitehouse.gov]

Slashdot the Petition (1)

dancinfrandsen (1985362) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120545)

Let's slashdot the petition page! Well, not overload it, but get the signatures over 100,000.

a Native American Proverb (4, Insightful)

FudRucker (866063) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120553)

only the US Govt thinks you can cut one foot off the top of a blanket and sew it on to the bottom of a blanket will make the blanket longer

Health effects (4, Interesting)

jeffb (2.718) (1189693) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120555)

So, heart attacks go up by 10% in the wake of spring-forward, but fall by 10% in the wake of fall-back? The solution is clear, then -- we need to adopt an official 25-hour day.

The twice-yearly clock shift really is a silly, silly exercise. Not so silly as a uniform, one-size-fits-all, year-around schedule for work, school, and entertainment, but silly all the same.

stop change (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#43120607)

Someone thought it was a good reason and now we have it. Once we get rid of it someone will propose we adopt it again. Let's stop the nonsense of arbitrary change and stick with what we have.

No one cares (1)

Georules (655379) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120611)

The only time we talk about this is the few days around DST changing. No one actually cares enough to carry on the conversation longer than that. Replies to this are only allowed to include examples of people putting forth a real effort to get rid of it.

Petition!!!! (1)

p4ul13 (560810) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120617)

Sign it: Now! [whitehouse.gov]

Oh, no! I can't shop at night! (2)

SeaFox (739806) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120619)

One vocal opponent is Missouri State Representative Delus Johnson... He's sure that it'll increase economic development in the later part of the year; giving people a little more daylight to do their Black Friday shopping.

LMAO.

Ignoring the fact people shop indoors, where there's this marvelous invention called electric lights and they can't even tell how dark it is outside oftentimes, the real Black Friday Rush people are either at home on their computers buying online or had to go out and stand in line at the store all through the night to get the doorbuster deals anyway.

There's a million things to get rid of... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#43120621)

DST, English meassures, pennies, road signs telling you how far it is to the next road sign...

No need to change it... (4, Interesting)

coldmist (154493) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120623)

My wife looked into this, from a legal standpoint.

Daylight savings is simply a federal standard for which days of the year participating states will change their times.

Read that again.

It's really a state-by-state issue, where any state can voluntarily not participate.

Talk to your state reps if you want to make a difference.

Switching is awful. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#43120625)

As a parent I say "stop the switch!". My kids will be very cranky next week and I can almost guarantee that one will end up with a cold due to the additional stress. The extra sunlight is nice yadda-yadda, but it is time to pick one and go with it.

No one would even notice (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year and a half ago | (#43120631)

..If everyone just forgot to do it.
Seriously, it actually takes some effort and planning to make it work; we just stop and poof, gone.

Interestingly enough, if Microsoft and Apple would just remove the daylight savings option from the clock it would take care of 90% of the effort.

I'm fine with DST (0)

Pope (17780) | about a year and a half ago | (#43120663)

We just need to go back to the pre-Bush extension start and end times.

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