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Australian Police Move To Make 3D Printed Guns Illegal

samzenpus posted about a year ago | from the no-way-mate dept.

Australia 551

lukehopewell1 writes "'Untraceable, undetectable, cheap and freely available.' That's how Australian police have described the 3D-printable gun known as The Liberator today as they announce that they will be seeking to make the download, construction and possession of these weapons illegal. In their tests, Police printed the 15 parts required to assemble The Liberator in 27 hours and assembled it within 60 seconds with a firing pin fashioned out of a steel nail. The two guns were test fired into a block of resin designed to simulate human muscle, and the first bullet penetrated the resin block up to 17 centimeters. NSW Police Ballistics division confirm that it would be a fatal wound if pointed at someone."

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Make metal ilegal too... (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809479)

It's also used to make guns...

Re:Make metal ilegal too... (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809515)

Most of the tools built by Black&Decker should be made illegal too for they can be used to injure or kill.

Re:Make metal ilegal too... (4, Insightful)

ozmanjusri (601766) | about a year ago | (#43809845)

My Black and Decker drill has never exploded, which is what the NSW police are warning people about.

As you'd expect from today's Slashdot, the title and summary of TFA are deceptive.

Re: Make metal ilegal too... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809921)

B&w's are not home made eithet. You build, you assume liability.

Re:Make metal ilegal too... (5, Insightful)

batwingTM (202524) | about a year ago | (#43809533)

A creative enough person could kill another without a weapon, and a weapon could be made from many ordinary household objects.

But this gun is only a gun, an unliscenced, unregulated gun that has proven to be less safe than an actual gun.
I see no problem which what the police are saying here, but it is a very difficult thing to regulate.

Re:Make metal ilegal too... (5, Informative)

c0lo (1497653) | about a year ago | (#43809661)

I see no problem which what the police are saying here, but it is a very difficult thing to regulate.

No need of additional regulation, in Australia is already forbidden to make/assemble guns without a license. The actual point they were trying to get across:

“My greater concern is that someone would do this, make one, and then suffer the consequences and kill themselves [after a catastrophic failure]. They don’t want to shoot someone, they’re just fascinated [by 3D printing]. If we didn’t alert someone to what happened to us, we would be considered negligent.

Re:Make metal ilegal too... (4, Insightful)

Nerdfest (867930) | about a year ago | (#43809749)

I see a problem with making the downloading of plans illegal.

Re:Make metal ilegal too... (5, Insightful)

Squiddie (1942230) | about a year ago | (#43809897)

You're talking about the country that tried to ban small breasts and looks to China as an example of sound internet policy.

Re:Make metal ilegal too... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809815)

Doesn't the whole expelling a projectile with enough force to penetrate a human being to a depth of 17 centimeters" make the object in question an "actual gun"? Zip Guns are actual guns, but often fail after one round. Also, all guns are "only guns" with the exception that they are modded to include a knife, sword, etc... or if they are left unloaded, which makes them a piss poor club. Actual guns don't need a stamp of approval, they need only obey the laws of physics ( otherwise we call them hand grenades) to deliver a projectile with potentially lethal force. Ask the Gorn if Captain Kirk had a gun...

Re:Make metal ilegal too... (3, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809927)

"Expelling a projectile with enough force to penetrate a human being to the depth of 17 centimeters"


I hate to point this out, but my *cock* does that....and talk about unforeseen consequences.....Hope it's not the next thing they want to make illegal.

Re:Make metal ilegal too... (0, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809951)

That was 17, not 7, so you've nothing to worry about.

Logic Fail (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809545)

[Make metal ilegal too..] It's also used to make guns...

They aren't proposing to make the material illegal.

Re:Make metal ilegal too... (2)

multiben (1916126) | about a year ago | (#43809547)

Ok, so not only did you not RTFA, but you misunderstood the summary. The police aren't banning 3D printing. They're not banning the material used in 3D printing. They are banning 3D printed guns. That's it.

Re:Make metal ilegal too... (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809587)

No, they're also looking to make the Download of the plans illegal too. they want to ban knowledge. that's the primary material used in 3d printing, the plans. all the metal and plastic and composites in the world wont' do you any good if you dont' know how to put them together.

Re:Make metal ilegal too... (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809631)

They are banning the download of files which contain descriptions of 15 shapes. Australia is a vile pit of censorship and anti knowledge. They already ban guns in Australia, no new laws are needed.

Re:Make metal ilegal too... (0, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809685)

A firearm is a firearm whether or not it is 3D printed. The existing laws should be more than sufficient. But then again, this is Australia, number 2 on the world's list of police states (with number one being there parent, the UK).

I don't understand why anyone would want to live there voluntarily. Oh, wait...

Re:Make metal ilegal too... (1)

drsmithy (35869) | about a year ago | (#43809887)

In other news, "the world" recently found to consist of only the UK and Australia.

Re:Make metal ilegal too... (4, Insightful)

kasperd (592156) | about a year ago | (#43809923)

The police aren't banning 3D printing. They're not banning the material used in 3D printing. They are banning 3D printed guns.

I see a problem with the police banning anything in the first place. That decision should be made by democratically elected lawmakers, not the police.

Re:Make metal ilegal too... (1)

Cenan (1892902) | about a year ago | (#43809801)

Hands carry weapons, hands are weapons --- we should outlaw the use of hands. There is a line, and I think they chose a pretty good starting point for their line with this.

Oh, well... (1)

c0lo (1497653) | about a year ago | (#43809487)

...at least they didn't move to make 3D printing illegal.

Re:Oh, well... (2, Insightful)

gandhi_2 (1108023) | about a year ago | (#43809523)

It's a sad situation when the law enforcers decide what the laws are.

Re:Oh, well... (1)

jimmetry (1801872) | about a year ago | (#43809555)

....why have I never noticed how wrong that is? :\ Why the hell didn't we, the internet community, say 'hey guys, we need a law here'....

We are such a disorganised society....

Re:Oh, well... (1)

jimmetry (1801872) | about a year ago | (#43809569)

Though, considering the frivolity of it all.... .....those 2D computer games, where you always had the big 'boss' at the end.... that seems like what law enforcement will be like in the future >_>

Re:Oh, well... (4, Insightful)

Capsaicin (412918) | about a year ago | (#43809573)

It's a sad situation when the law enforcers decide what the laws are.

They don't and they can't, they are only suggesting. Deciding what the laws actually are is the job of the Murdoch press.

Re:Oh, well... (4, Informative)

multiben (1916126) | about a year ago | (#43809581)

In Australia, where this article is about, the police *don't* decide the laws. But as enforcers of the law they are an important part of the consultation process for developing laws - they are often the ones who encounter these things first hand in their day to day work.

Re:Oh, well... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809583)

But they can't in NSW, evidently.

The police will need to petition the federal government for the law; I'm sure the US police petition the state for new laws to combat emerging threats, and I know the UK police do. But in the case of the UK, the laws go through the usual process of development; I'd be surprised if it was any different in that far flung corner of the realm.

Re:Oh, well... (3, Informative)

Capsaicin (412918) | about a year ago | (#43809653)

But they can't in NSW, evidently .... The police will need to petition the federal government for the law

Bzzzzt. Wrong.

Subject only to s109 of the C'th Constitution, the NSW Parliament is a legislature of plenary power, meaning it can pass laws about anything and everything (in contradistinction with the Federal parliament which is a legislature of enumerated power). If the NSW parliament enacts a law saying it is illegal for people born in Botswana to walk down the Champs-Élysées wearing purple underpants, that would be a valid law of NSW (good luck enforcing it though) providing that it does not conflict with any C'th law (s109).

Re:Oh, well... (1)

Wolfling1 (1808594) | about a year ago | (#43809821)

You may well be right (I don't know the constitution well enough), but I suspect that the previous poster's sentiment may still be valid.

The NSW police would have to petition the State Government to get the laws changed.

Having said all of that, the laws in Australia that relate to firearms give the police quite broad powers. And IMHO, the appropriate steps for police/governments around the world is to legislate 3D printable weapons regulations that relate to the other laws in their jurisdictions.

We cynical folks in /. know that those laws won't stop all the 3D guns from being printed. However, that is the way things are done in our modern society. The government legislates, the police (attempt to) enforce. If and when the problem starts to get out of control, the police are granted heavier powers and they go on a 'blitz'.

I'm quietly pleased to see the police dotting their i's and crossing their t's on this one. The first thing any good scientist would do to validate the stories on the internet is 'build one and test it to see what happens'. Let's hope that no-one publishes a 3D printable nuke, eh?

Re:Oh, well... (4, Informative)

Capsaicin (412918) | about a year ago | (#43809913)

You may well be right

Well it's kinda what we were taught at Law School. And btw that should be "plenary power vs enumerated powers", sorry for the inaccuracy.

I don't know the constitution well enough

The (federal) Constitution would not tell you this anyway.

The NSW police would have to petition the State Government to get the laws changed.

Exactly. However previous poster's "sentiment" was, "they can't in NSW ... they would need to petition the federal government," which is simply wrong.

IMHO, the appropriate steps for police/governments around the world is to legislate 3D printable weapons regulations that relate to the other laws in their jurisdictions.

In NSW the manufacture and possession of firearms is already governed by the Firearms Act 1996 (NSW) [austlii.edu.au] . Both unlicensed manufacture and possession are offences. The definition of "firearm" under section 4, to wit,

... a gun, or other weapon, that is (or at any time was) capable of propelling a projectile by means of an explosive, and includes a blank fire firearm, or an air gun, but does not include anything declared by the regulations not to be a firearm.

would seem wide enough to capture this weapon. The only thing new is the downloading of the "design" (actually machine instructions).

The Police are not seriously seeking substantial legislative change here (though they may get some "we are doing something about this" no-effect amendment). This is a consciousness raising exercise.

Re:Oh, well... (1)

Kkloe (2751395) | about a year ago | (#43809599)

Yes it is too bad that the police can ask the government/politician to make a law, now if ordinary an citizen could do that...

Re:Oh, well... (1)

ozmanjusri (601766) | about a year ago | (#43809827)

The right to petition Federal Parliament has been one of the rights of citizens since federation, and it is the only way an individual can directly place grievances before the Parliament.

http://www.aph.gov.au/Parliamentary_Business/Petitions [aph.gov.au]

Re:Oh, well... (5, Informative)

c0lo (1497653) | about a year ago | (#43809611)

It's a sad situation when the law enforcers decide what the laws are.

Nothing special about the 3D printed plastic gun: unauthorized manufacturing (or even assembling) a firearm of any kind in Australia is already prohibited (so no, this is not a case in which the police would decide what the laws are. As they aren't in control of the downloads, they can't have a say in banning the download either).

What the TFS fails to mention: the NSW police guys seems genuinely more worried about someone hurting oneself in an attempt to fire one (the first gun printed by the NSW police exploded during tests) :

“My greater concern is that someone would do this, make one, and then suffer the consequences and kill themselves [after a catastrophic failure]. They don’t want to shoot someone, they’re just fascinated [by 3D printing]. If we didn’t alert someone to what happened to us, we would be considered negligent.

“Don’t try it, no matter what end of this gun you can be on, you could die. Do not download, do not manufacture The Liberator,” the Commissioner concluded.

Re:Oh, well... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809623)

Trusting the police. Fashionable up until the 1960s or so.

Since then, perhaps not so much.

Re:Oh, well... (1)

c0lo (1497653) | about a year ago | (#43809647)

Trusting the police. Fashionable up until the 1960s or so.

Please note that this world is quite large. Depending on your place of residence, your mileage will vary: in some places, trusting the police may have never been in fashion, while in others it's still a safe bet.

Re:Oh, well... (1)

AHuxley (892839) | about a year ago | (#43809799)

Re "As they aren't in control of the downloads, they can't have a say in banning the download either)"
Recall http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australian_Transaction_Reports_and_Analysis_Centre [wikipedia.org] that looks at all bank/cash transactions in Australia.
Its a room with a few racks of computers given the population size of Australia.
How many submarine cable landing sites in Australia? In theory every request via BT could be looked at for that ~file "checksum".
That would get around average file renaming or the need to join any active torrents or logs from direct download sites.
A few days after your IP/"interest in file" is logged you would get a knock on the door and get searched 1980's "bank robber" style. Fines, jail, all computer confiscation, storage destruction could be options.
Seeing a raid in the early am beyond a few uniformed/plainclothes asking questions would make suburbia/your street aware of your 'downloads'.
Gossip that a 'large' raid took place - gossip about "a file was downloaded" spreads - what kind of file could get a bit lost in conversation......
Long term you would be on some crime registry - no gov security clearence, no clean background check to work in a charity, with the public.
The ip to home address chain could also be very short in Australia soon, your ip is noted, your isp links back your details and a cleared bureaucrat/LEO self signs the warrant after confirming the file - no courts needed until after the raid and and a nice long 'chat'.

Re:Oh, well... (1)

c0lo (1497653) | about a year ago | (#43809889)

Re "As they aren't in control of the downloads, they can't have a say in banning the download either)" ...
How many submarine cable landing sites in Australia? In theory every request via BT could be looked at for that ~file "checksum".

In practice, you didn't hear of Tor and/or proxy SSL/HTTPS services, did you?

Re:Oh, well... (1)

AHuxley (892839) | about a year ago | (#43809935)

Re "In practice, you didn't hear of Tor and/or proxy SSL/HTTPS services, did you?" Lets hope all the 'bugs' have been fixed :)
http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2010/12/flaws-in-tor-anonymity-network-spotlighted/ [arstechnica.com]
As for "proxy SSL/HTTPS services" how many average users would use one if reading a US news site and clicking on a file download link?

Re:Oh, well... (1)

operagost (62405) | about a year ago | (#43809837)

Because cops never lie, amirite? BTW, I'm pretty sure Oz already has various departments for consumer protection and safety. It's not their job.

Re:Oh, well... (2, Insightful)

c0lo (1497653) | about a year ago | (#43809957)

Because cops never lie, amirite?

In the context of this very issue, what exactly would be the point of lying? Making/owning a gun in Australia without license is already illegal.

BTW, I'm pretty sure Oz already has various departments for consumer protection and safety. It's not their job.

Yeah, sure, the NSW police would better keep their mouth shut, their test and the risks they discovered are not at all relevant... after all, the police isn't meant to protect anyone, much less for protecting a consumer, they'll lie to you most of the time and they only have in mind how to bust you and spend the taxes you pay... Clearly, nothing more than a band of thugs.
The consumer protection agencies are in charge of testing everything that can cause harm, even when it's already illegal, amirite?

What planet are you living on? "Planet America" perchance?

Re:Oh, well... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809855)

Not really. It is, in fact, the cornerstone of Rousseau's division of power principle.

The legislature creates the laws and thus post-facto regulates the courts.

The executive prioritize which laws they enforce and how and thus pre-facto regulate the legislature.

The courts are the arbiter of disputes between the enforcers and those being accused of something and thus regulate the enforcers.

This way we combine the good sides of an elected leguslature (and in some places a directly or indirectly elected executive) with the good sides of a trained and professional bureaucracy. Why is this a problem?

Re:Oh, well... (1)

Dr Max (1696200) | about a year ago | (#43809601)

i wouldn't speak too soon, this is australia after all (it's still illigal to change your own light bulb in victoria).

Re:Oh, well... (1)

c0lo (1497653) | about a year ago | (#43809621)

Wha...? In short: [Citation needed] (not saying that's not so, but I'd like to see it).

Re:Oh, well... (2)

quenda (644621) | about a year ago | (#43809659)

(it's still illigal to change your own light bulb in victoria).

Maybe I missed a joke, but it is illegal to change you own light socket or switch in Australia, instead of calling a licensed electrician.
But there is nothing to stop you buying the parts from the local hardware store, and I never heard of anyone being prosecuted.

Re:Oh, well... (1)

Dr Max (1696200) | about a year ago | (#43809885)

True it would be very hard to enforce, but that dosn't stop it being true. Good luck stopping people downloading stuff from the internet either though.

Re:Oh, well... (1)

drsmithy (35869) | about a year ago | (#43809905)

But there is nothing to stop you buying the parts from the local hardware store, and I never heard of anyone being prosecuted.

Of course, if the insurance company finds out your house burned down because of your dodgy electrical work, good luck making a claim.
If someone died in the fire, good luck in gaol.

Re:Oh, well... (1)

Pseudonym (62607) | about a year ago | (#43809789)

(it's still illigal to change your own light bulb in victoria)

Thankfully, changing your own light globe is perfectly legal.

Re:Oh, well... (4, Informative)

Samantha Wright (1324923) | about a year ago | (#43809717)

Shamelessly omitted from the summary:

What’s interesting about the second device they tested, however, was the “catastrophic failure” of the weapon. Translation? It exploded. The plastic gave way to the brutal force of an exploding .38 caliber bullet and the barrel exploded.

[...]

The NSW Commissioner said that the realist in him believes that you can never stop the spread of The Liberator — and he’s right — but at least they can tell people how dangerous they are.

“My greater concern is that someone would do this, make one, and then suffer the consequences and kill themselves [after a catastrophic failure]. They don’t want to shoot someone, they’re just fascinated [by 3D printing]. If we didn’t alert someone to what happened to us, we would be considered negligent.

It (1)

JustOK (667959) | about a year ago | (#43809497)

You could poke an eye out with that

It's not illegal already? (4, Informative)

Capsaicin (412918) | about a year ago | (#43809503)

OK maybe the downloading part is not yet covered, but I'm pretty sure in NSW unlicensed manufacture is already an offence, as is possession obviously.

Re:It's not illegal already? (1)

Dr Max (1696200) | about a year ago | (#43809591)

I'm sure the NSW police department dosn't have a gun manufacturing licence; But since when do police obey the rules any way.

Re:It's not illegal already? (4, Interesting)

Capsaicin (412918) | about a year ago | (#43809703)

I'm sure the NSW police department dosn't have a gun manufacturing licence; But since when do police obey the rules any way.

Yup a license is required [austlii.edu.au] and yes it's possible (probable?) they forgot to procure one first (mind they probably would get one if they asked nicely). Shame you were not a journo at the press conference.

Re:It's not illegal already? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809709)

Sigh - Yes they do. They also have experience GunSmiths on staff.

Re:It's not illegal already? (1)

operagost (62405) | about a year ago | (#43809847)

Where the heck did I leave my mod points?

Re:It's not illegal already? (2)

Seumas (6865) | about a year ago | (#43809853)

I like how it's phrased as "downloading of the weapon".

Until it can fire a bullet, it's not a fucking weapon. When it's a series of scribbles on a piece of paper, it's not a fucking weapon.

Re:It's not illegal already? (1)

Capsaicin (412918) | about a year ago | (#43809933)

When it's a series of scribbles on a piece of paper, it's not a fucking weapon.

Well it's not a weapon, but it's a bit more than mere scribbles or even a mere design. Given the existence of 3d-printers it's a set of machine instructions for an illegal activity (ie manufacturing). I doubt they'll get this anyway ... unless someone gets hurt first and the Tele/Ch9 start frothing at the mouth of course.

I-5 bridge in WA state collapses (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809511)

Cars in the water. Thanks, austerity.

Re:I-5 bridge in WA state collapses (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809713)

Cars in the water. Thanks, austerity.

Uh... for a moment, you scared me to death... I thought is about a bridge in Western Australia.

Foist! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809513)

Foist!

Obvious much? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809517)

Ballistics division confirm that it would be a fatal wound if pointed at someone

Well, ya. It's a gun you morons.

Re:Obvious much? (1)

neo8750 (566137) | about a year ago | (#43809607)

Rubber band guns are not fatal but they are guns... Water guns (loaded with water) are not fatal but are guns... So tell me again what was your point?

Re:Obvious much? (1)

c0lo (1497653) | about a year ago | (#43809741)

Rubber band guns are not fatal but they are guns... Water guns (loaded with water) are not fatal but are guns... So tell me again what was your point?

Errr... I bet he's shitless scared about photo-shooting as well... you know? One may be killed by having a bullet ricocheting from a photo.

Re:Obvious much? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809773)

Rubber band guns are not fatal but they are guns... Water guns (loaded with water) are not fatal but are guns... So tell me again what was your point?

They are not firearms, which is what's regulated. In Canada and the US firearms are defined as something that shoots projectiles at over 300 feet per second.

Just like with porn. (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809525)

I remember the old days of people hosting bulletin boards on their Commodore 64's. If the sys op was kind ... or if you had something to share, you'd get to download the stash of dirty pictures in glorious 8 bit color. Then they passed laws against it and now you can't find porn on line anymore.

Re:Just like with porn. (1)

jimmetry (1801872) | about a year ago | (#43809725)

Damn you, Slashdot. I wish to give this anonymous coward my upvote!

sigh (1)

khallow (566160) | about a year ago | (#43809535)

If they were smart, they'd make a lot of noise about these things, but not actually make them illegal. As a police officer, what would you rather be facing? A handgun that is competently made or a fad which barely fires? Or for that matter, a semiautomatic rifle that has been modified to shoot automatic?

You'd want the "Liberator" in the hands of any crazies you happened to face. It's still dangerous, but the odds are better.

Re:sigh (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809603)

you'd rather be facing the modified rifle.

Because chances are:
A. the modifications made the thing more likely to jam than to fire.
B. controlling a rifle in full auto fire is a sonofabitch. that thing's pointing in the sky after a few shots, not at the police. full magazine in the ceiling after 6 seconds.

while the person with the homemade liberator knows exactly what it is capable of and is trying to actually aim it.

Re:sigh (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809679)

I don't think your argument is valid.
You're assuming the person would either have a liberator or a 'real' firearm. it is not so easy to acquire a real firearm in many countries, and then there is also the cost..
I would assume the liberator is also disposable and untraceable.
It is only a matter of time until both 3D printing is wide spread and the technology improves greatly - as will the firearms it is capable of producing.

       

Re:sigh (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809729)

Wait wait wait. Did you just call 3D printing a fad????? You of all people?

Re:sigh (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809873)

no, he called printing 3d guns a fad.

Ammunition (1)

MichaelSmith (789609) | about a year ago | (#43809539)

...is harder to get in Australia so improvised weapons are not going to be as much use as in the US.

Re:Ammunition (1)

c0lo (1497653) | about a year ago | (#43809825)

Ammunition ... is harder to get in Australia

I wouldn't [ebay.com.au] bet [gizmodo.com] (second link to show that the charges may be powerful enough).

Re:Ammunition (1)

MichaelSmith (789609) | about a year ago | (#43809901)

My all means use a nail gun. Anaconda sell spear guns too.

They're doing it right anyway (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809559)

Bless the Australian police for actually performing an objective experiment on the machine before moving to ban it!

Death by pointing? (4, Funny)

Nkwe (604125) | about a year ago | (#43809565)

NSW Police Ballistics division confirm that it would be a fatal wound if pointed at someone.

I hope you would have to actually shoot someone for it to be fatal.

Re:Death by pointing? (1)

evil_aaronm (671521) | about a year ago | (#43809731)

No, no - because it's a 3D printed gun, it's in a super class of gun, like a laser on fricken' shark's head. You just point it, and zammo!, instant death! That's why the mere download, construction or possession of these guns must be outlawed.

Re:Death by pointing? (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809755)

They implied:
pointed at someone = pointed at a police officer
fatal wound = fatal wound you would get doing so

counterproductive (2)

buback (144189) | about a year ago | (#43809567)

3d-printing of guns: the quickest way to create legislation regulating the sale of bullets.

Re:counterproductive (1)

quenda (644621) | about a year ago | (#43809695)

3d-printing of guns: the quickest way to create legislation regulating the sale of bullets.

Yeah, so quick it happened decades ago.

Shoot the people proposing this (1)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809575)

With a gun from a 3d printer

I hope the criminal take up 3d printed guns- (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809617)

The reason being is the law has no right to take away my freedom. I don't care if it is a freedom of speech issue or the possession, manufacture, or distribution of dangerous goods. This is not the same thing as saying there should be no regulation of public entities. Personal manufacture though is your right and the government should not be given the power to force changes in these weapons just so that there job becomes easier.

Re:I hope the criminal take up 3d printed guns- (1)

jamesh (87723) | about a year ago | (#43809675)

The reason being is the law has no right to take away my freedom.

The law does this all the time - there's a huge list of things you aren't allowed to do. I hear you can get away with a whole load of things in some countries though... maybe you should move there?

Re:I hope the criminal take up 3d printed guns- (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809735)

Yes- I agree they do take away freedom and have been doing so since the social structures started. It doesn't make ti right.

Re:I hope the criminal take up 3d printed guns- (1)

batwingTM (202524) | about a year ago | (#43809721)

Personal manufacture though is your right and the government should not be given the power to force changes in these weapons just so that there job becomes easier.

Personal Manufacture is your right, ah, unless that is stated in the laws of the land (and it isn't in Australia) then I call bullshine on that.

This may come as a surprise but we have fairly good gun control in Australia, people who hunt are allowed to own guns, all gun owners are licensed (except for illegal guns of course) and gun violence is fairly uncommon (it has flared up a bit of late, a few drive bys and shootings, but every time someone gets shot that is a national news item so yeah, not at all common) so I have no issue with what the police are suggesting here, but as I have said, very difficult to regulate.

Your freedoms are defined by law, and as such will always be at the whim of politics. You do not have "Freedoms" just because you think you should.

Re:I hope the criminal take up 3d printed guns- (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809861)

Lol. Kill yourself, enslaved Australian scum.

They will need to make hardware stores illegal (5, Informative)

Satanboy (253169) | about a year ago | (#43809651)

It sounds like the police have never heard of PA Luty. http://thehomegunsmith.com/ [thehomegunsmith.com] check out some of the designs folks. You could make a MACHINE GUN that would be fully functional from nothing more than parts you bought at a hardware store. It would cost you about 200 bucks or so in tools and parts.

Re:They will need to make hardware stores illegal (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809761)

Again they are not proposing to make 3D printers illegal. To keep your analogy in the realms of reason, what they would have to do is to make downloading the designs you link to illegal. Realising them already carries a 10 year prison sentence.

OH NO, don't let the criminals blow themselves up. (1)

Dr Max (1696200) | about a year ago | (#43809655)

So this clown of a police commissioner says his greatest fear is of criminals blowing themselves up with it. Are you serious? Are you not just a little bit more worried of people with a grudge against police using it against them, or even innocent people?

I wish them (1)

Mantrid42 (972953) | about a year ago | (#43809665)

Good fucking luck.

The more they squeeze... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809687)

You know the rest, be honest with yourself, this is the INTERNET, since when is ill eagle anything but a catalyst?

smart (1)

houbou (1097327) | about a year ago | (#43809739)

I believe the australians are correct in making it illegal.

Re:smart (1)

twistofsin (718250) | about a year ago | (#43809893)

I can understand why it is desirable for the actual construction or possession to be illegal, but when I'm told that the knowledge and ability to do so should be banned as well, I don't agree.

Even if someone comes up with a reliable design using consumer grade 3d printers, they will still be crap compared to what we create with metal. If someone wanted to create an effective home made arsenal they'd be better off building a machine shop. Are we to start restricting lathes, drill presses, and the like as well?

I get the bogeyman of easily obtainable guns in any society with strict gun control but the reality is:

$20 + A "home improvement" store + (Optional, helps for reference) internet access = gun.

Sleep tight.

The stupidity of Cody Wilson (1)

Neo-Rio-101 (700494) | about a year ago | (#43809759)

Cody Wilson thinks that he's enforcing his 1st and 2nd amenment rights, but the truth is... the US is already awash with guns... and if the US government wanted to take them away, they have plenty of firepower to wield over people armed with a piece of plastic. The rise of the 3D printed gun is moot in the US because REAL guns are easy to get and cheap as well.

No...., all that 3D printed guns are going to do is introduce gun culture to countries that have decided to do away with guns.
Only the criminals will have them because most people don't want one and won't get one to defend themselves with.

Thanks a lot, you redneck jingoistic patriotic bastard.
Freedom of information is one thing, but this information in the wrong hands can kill. It's why we don't hand out uranium and bomb-making plans to just anyone.

Re:The stupidity of Cody Wilson (1)

operagost (62405) | about a year ago | (#43809865)

What would you say if I called you a pencil-necked, paranoid geek for encrypting your communications? After all, you have nothing to hide, right? The police don't even know you exist.

It's about discovery, invention, and planning for the future. And people who ridicule those who are forward-thinking disgust me.

BTW, a single-shot pistol is not a weapon of war, Captain Jingo. Buy a dictionary, you tool.

Re:The stupidity of Cody Wilson (1)

furball (2853) | about a year ago | (#43809909)

The purpose is not US-centric. The real value of the Liberator is in places where guns are illegal. The fact that Liberators are being printed in China is of significant value.

27 Hours? Waste of time. (2)

Bob9113 (14996) | about a year ago | (#43809851)

Police printed the 15 parts required to assemble The Liberator in 27 hours and assembled it within 60 seconds with a firing pin fashioned out of a steel nail.

27 hours for a .38? You could make a dozen 12 gauges [youtube.com] in that time, and really get your rampage on. Let me know when they start regulating black pipe and twine.

Fuckum (1)

Ralph Ostrander (2846785) | about a year ago | (#43809877)

Now they dont know if my guns are in the closet safe or stored in cyber space and now that I have the code I can create many more kinds. And combinations of real and made parts. The world will soon be awash in them. The up side is in 10 15 years the big name manufactures will be nearly out of business.

If all else fails... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about a year ago | (#43809919)

Of course the way around bullet regulation is to simply 3D print yourself a coilgun.
These can be made with very little hassle using off the shelf recycled parts ie from old TVs and the files adjusted to take the components you have.
Then the multi coil setup allows firing of ball bearings, nails, and other "Fun Stuff" (tm) at about the same speed as a handgun for dispatching annoying vermin which is the main reason most people have guns in rural areas.

Heh heh.

Guns don't kill people (1)

xenobyte (446878) | about a year ago | (#43809937)

People kill people.

Seriously - if you want to kill someone there's both cheaper and more readily available weapons than 3D-printed guns. It's a huge non-problem.

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