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Egyptian President Overthrown, Constitution Suspended

Soulskill posted about 9 months ago | from the if-you're-there,-stay-safe dept.

Government 413

Al Jazeera and other publications are reporting that Egyptian President Mohamed Morsi has been overthrown by the country's army. General Abdel Fattah al-Sisi, head of the Egyptian armed forces, said in a televised announcement that Morsi had been removed from power, the Constitution had been suspended, and Adli al-Mansour, leader of Egypt's Supreme Constitutional Court, had been appointed to lead the country until elections can be held. "Sisi called for presidential and parliamentary elections, a panel to review the constitution and a national reconciliation committee that would include youth movements. He said the roadmap had been agreed by a range of political groups." According to the BBC's report, "General Sisi said on state TV that the armed forces could not stay silent and blind to the call of the Egyptian masses," and "The army is currently involved in a show of force, fanning out across Cairo and taking control of the capital."

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413 comments

Overthrowing the NSA. (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#44181983)

So when is our armed forces going to do the same here?

Re:Overthrowing the NSA. (1)

gmuslera (3436) | about 9 months ago | (#44182217)

They don't need to, the armed forces and the president are controlled by the same people. And maybe is the same people that controls the Egypt army too.

Re:Overthrowing the NSA. (5, Interesting)

lgw (121541) | about 9 months ago | (#44182385)

The Egyptian army does seem to be reflecting the will of the Egyptian people in this case. Seems the recent theocracy wasn't actually any good at the nuts and bolts of running a country - and people to expect the government of a fairly modern country to provide basic services. Or at least that's how I interpret the army's statement that a "technocrat, capable national government will be formed" (quoting Al-Jaz).

Re:Overthrowing the NSA. (5, Interesting)

jfengel (409917) | about 9 months ago | (#44182525)

Question for me is, will they replace it with something more effective? Technocratic benevolent dictatorships are a lot more attractive on paper than they turn out to be in real life.

And if the military intends to (again) establish a democracy, will the people just vote the Muslim Brotherhood back into power? I may not like Morsi but he was the democratically elected leader, with no more than the usual level of shenanigans in the election. (And given the shenanigans that show up in the US, I'm not going to throw too many stones. They're different, in both kind and degree, but we're hardly beyond reproach.)

Re:Overthrowing the NSA. (1)

gl4ss (559668) | about 9 months ago | (#44182431)

why would the armed forces throw themselves out? NSA is a military operation after all in it's roots and your president is the head of the armed forces.

Bring back the Pharoahs (3, Insightful)

Spy Handler (822350) | about 9 months ago | (#44181995)

Egypt was a better place back then, center of culture and learning in the world.

Now it's just shit.

Re:Bring back the Pharoahs (2, Insightful)

Stormwatch (703920) | about 9 months ago | (#44182039)

That'd mean getting rid of Islam... and I can't see a downside here.

Re:Bring back the Pharoahs (2)

plover (150551) | about 9 months ago | (#44182235)

I think the whole conquering / slavery thing was kind of a negative. You're probably not going to get a lot of support for that approach.

Re:Bring back the Pharoahs (3, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#44182447)

I think the whole conquering / slavery thing was kind of a negative. You're probably not going to get a lot of support for that approach.

It worked just fine for the USA. And now they're the moral and benevolent world police.

Re:Bring back the Pharoahs (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#44182083)

Don't forget Sam the Sham either...
http://www.recordsale.de/cdpix/s/sam_the_sham_and_the_pharaohs-red_hot_a_long._long_way.jpg

Re:Bring back the Pharoahs (1, Insightful)

clarkkent09 (1104833) | about 9 months ago | (#44182157)

North Korea is better than Egypt was under the Pharaohs. Different time, different standards.

Re:Bring back the Pharoahs (1)

Chas (5144) | about 9 months ago | (#44182517)

And, having never actually experience the problems in North Korea or having lived in Pharonic Egypt, you know this...how?

Re:Bring back the Pharoahs (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#44182621)

Maybe because "and then we killed all the slaves" didn't get edited out of the histories back then as much get a whole scroll.

Re:Bring back the Pharoahs (4, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#44182173)

They also danced better.

Re:Bring back the Pharoahs (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#44182245)

Same with America. Give the land back to the aboriginals. :P

Re:Bring back the Pharoahs (1)

rsborg (111459) | about 9 months ago | (#44182335)

Same with America. Give the land back to the aboriginals. :P

The polite term is "Native americans" because, they're a bit different from aboriginals in modern-day Australia.

Re: Bring back the Pharoahs (1)

AvitarX (172628) | about 9 months ago | (#44182511)

In Canada they call them north American aboriginals if memory serves correctly. Native American being ambiguous and offensive to those of us that are more native to America than anywhere else, but not aboriginal.

Re:Bring back the Pharoahs (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#44182553)

Same with America. Give the land back to the aboriginals. :P

The polite term is "Native americans" because, they're a bit different from aboriginals in modern-day Australia.

"Aboriginal" or "Aboriginal Australians" refers to aboriginals in Australia, while "aboriginal" means something that existed from the beginning. "Native Americans" is not used in all of America because a certain country has misappropriated the term "American" to refer to only its citizens.

Re:Bring back the Pharoahs (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#44182409)

Hella Yeah, because everything gets better the more pyramids you build.

regarding constitutions (4, Insightful)

dnaumov (453672) | about 9 months ago | (#44182005)

Why is it that it's precisely in times where upholding the constitution is at it's most important (in times of turmoil), that so many countries do away with the constitution entirely and suspend it?!

Re:regarding constitutions (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#44182057)

Because constitutions are often flawed, often very flawed. They are not some perfect piece of paper that is immune to error and corruption. I take it that they intend to draft a new one.

Plus, any coup is a de-facto suspension of the constitution, even one like this where it is done with the support of the populace of the country.

Re:regarding constitutions (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#44182417)

I think one of the flaws in the Egyptian constitution as of July 2nd is that it didn't provide a method to recall the president democratically.

Re: regarding constitutions (4, Insightful)

DarkOx (621550) | about 9 months ago | (#44182559)

Flawed they may be but the poit is to set the ground rules so people know what to do and have something to look to when things get crazy and emotion runs high. Frankly I agree with the parent, the fact that Egypt can't ride it out until the next election and then replace Morsi having learned a lesson about electing theocrats, suggests to me the nation is unlikely to develop the spine it takes to have a democracy and keep it.

This does not bode well for a free Egypt. Whenever things get wierd form now on the military will just take over.

our state department is doing nothing because they in their usual sort sightedness jus don't want anyone unpredictable near Isreal.

Re:regarding constitutions (5, Informative)

Pumpkin Tuna (1033058) | about 9 months ago | (#44182121)

In this case I'm guessing it's because in 2012 Morsi granted himself pretty much unlimited power and then used it to ram through a crappy constitution that most Egyptians didn't really like. Just spitballing though.

Re:regarding constitutions (5, Informative)

shutdown -p now (807394) | about 9 months ago | (#44182159)

Because the constitution in question was hastily approved less than a year ago with a lot of controversy and meager support among the populace (64% of people voted yes on the referendum, but the turnout was only 33%). It defines Islam and "principles of Shariah" as "the main source of legislation", which is precisely what many protesters were up in arms against. In short, it's the brainchild of the Islamists, and so any popular revolution against them is going to disregard it as well.

Re:regarding constitutions (2)

siride (974284) | about 9 months ago | (#44182313)

How is that different from our constitution, which was controversial at the time and had to be initially drafted in secret and defended publicly by anonymous letters to the editor? The people didn't get to vote on it either, as the state government's ratified it after long struggles between supporters and detractors.

Re:regarding constitutions (5, Funny)

MozeeToby (1163751) | about 9 months ago | (#44182361)

Yeah, I can't imagine what would have happened if the founding fathers' first attempt [wikipedia.org] at a constitution had been deemed a failure and replaced. The world would be a totally different place.

Re:regarding constitutions (4, Insightful)

shutdown -p now (807394) | about 9 months ago | (#44182393)

It's different in that tens of millions of people were sufficiently angry about their constitution to go to the streets.

Constitutions are not magical self-contained documents that work by virtue of their very existence. They do not hold any meaning or weight if they are rejected by the citizens en masse.

Re:regarding constitutions (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#44182161)

Your concerns are misguided. This constitution wasn't *worth* upholding. It's a mishmash concocted by Islamist and other enemies of democracy. They are probably better off if they scrap it and go back to the old one.

Re:regarding constitutions (1)

gmuslera (3436) | about 9 months ago | (#44182263)

Other countries just ignore it (and/or their amendments). Don't sound as bad as suspending it, but in practice is more or less the same. And don't see a lot of people upholding it.

Re:regarding constitutions (5, Interesting)

plover (150551) | about 9 months ago | (#44182377)

If you're not starting with a good constitution, preserving it isn't going to help. Egypt's most recent constitution was drafted entirely by Islamists after the secularists and Christians walked out when it was clear it was going to embody Sharia law and other Islamist practices at the expense of human rights.

Re:regarding constitutions (1)

Pop69 (700500) | about 9 months ago | (#44182451)

Why have a constitution ?

Why not just make it up as you go along same as the United Kingdom ?

Re:regarding constitutions (5, Interesting)

Mt._Honkey (514673) | about 9 months ago | (#44182577)

Because the act of removing the president in this way is itself a violation of the constitution (I assume). The constitution has to be suspended in order for this extraordinary act to occur.

To give a hypothetical US example: let's say the people elect a President who turns out to be Literally Hitler, and has gotten Congress to back him (just like Hitler). So President Hitler and company prepare to conquer the world by force, much to the horror of the American people and the military. The people take to the streets, and the military leadership does not want to invade Mexico and Canada as ordered.

So, what do we do? The Constitution would have us wait for the next election cycle and vote these people out, but if we obey the constitution millions could be killed. Someone needs to do something, and the military is in the position to do it. The Joint Chiefs, with popular support, declare the Hitler government and congress to be disolved, and charges the Supreme Court with overseeing the creation and installation of a new government, because the Court is the only federal civil authority with any integrity.

None of that is even remotely authorized by the constitution, therefore the military tells us that "the constitution is suspended" in order to cary out this plan. That doesn't mean they go out and start violating every tenant of it, but they do have to violate parts (those which organize the government) in order to make it work.

How to not be overthrown (3, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#44182007)

Step 1) Spy on your citizens
Step 2) ....
Step 3) Profit!

US top secret mission again? (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#44182011)

I will blame all bad news on you guys for the next 10 years. Sorry, but you have sort of earned it...

I heard Egypt wants to borrow our constitution (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#44182021)

since we don't seem to be using right now I don't see any problem.

I would laugh... (2)

Grog6 (85859) | about 9 months ago | (#44182465)

but it's really not funny.

If I were the Assholes in charge of the US Government, I would be worrying about all that ammo flying off the shelves for the last 7 years or so.

1% of the Taxpayers is not 1% of the population, lol.

I remember when the Constitution was a real Badge of Honor, not something Our Government Wipes its collective Ass on whenever they want.

.

Re:I would laugh... (4, Insightful)

Valdrax (32670) | about 9 months ago | (#44182619)

I remember when the Constitution was a real Badge of Honor, not something Our Government Wipes its collective Ass on whenever they want.

I don't. I just remember when I was more ignorant of history.

Re:I would laugh... (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#44182643)

If I were the Assholes in charge of the US Government, I would be worrying about all that ammo flying off the shelves for the last 7 years or so.

You would quit worrying when you remembered that the US military has been practicing counterinsurgency
techniques for quite a while now, and that those techniques can ( and sadly, probably will ) be used against
any sort of revolt in the US. Don't get me wrong, I detest the conduct of the US government as much as
anyone, but a few thousand hillbillies with deer rifles won't stand a chance against weaponized drones
and attack helicopters.

The best way to resist the US government is to leave the US, and renounce your citizenship, and never
pay taxes to the US ever again.

Oh, and Obama ? He is a lying nigger sack of shit, and I voted for the cocksucker so I feel
I am entitled to say that.

news for nerds (-1, Troll)

equex (747231) | about 9 months ago | (#44182023)

yeah thats right baby

Re:news for nerds (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#44182247)

If it happened in america slashdot would be called crazy if they didn't support it. Remember we have a Your rights online section, well, egypt certainly managed to fit in there a few times, its worth following up on what happens there and I personally am glad that revolution is happening.

If you happen to be american, I can only suggest doing the same. Its not as if your government has been acting very nice lately.

Re:news for nerds (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#44182255)

"News for nerds" does not mean, and at no point in Slashdot's history ever has meant "exclusively news that is exclusively for nerds".

Re:news for nerds (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#44182319)

Go look at the masthead. It doesnt say that anymore.
NOT "news for nerds"
NOT "stuff that matters"

Re:news for nerds (4, Interesting)

Wookact (2804191) | about 9 months ago | (#44182363)

I consider myself a nerd, and I find this news interesting. I support this article being here. If you do not, then please choose not to read that article. If you feel that there are too many such articles for you to enjoy the site, then please find another site.

Re:news for nerds (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#44182375)

I'll have you know that many of us are fans of Stargate.

Re:news for nerds (5, Insightful)

rsborg (111459) | about 9 months ago | (#44182421)

yeah thats right baby

You do realize that the protests leading up to this overthrow were the most massive in human history?
The numbers bandied about were anywhere from 20-35 million in the streets. At least 22 million signed a petition denouncing Morsi.

With a population of 82M, that's anywhere from 25-40% of the country's populace. If even 1/10 of that number (much less %) got out on the streets in the USA, there'd be dozens of /. posts as it impacted the largest block of slashdotters on a daily basis.

Furthermore, Egypt is keyholder of the Suez canal. Instability in this country would be like instability in Panama - and impact world trade.

I'd say this is news for nerds.

D'oh! (3, Interesting)

clarkn0va (807617) | about 9 months ago | (#44182047)

So if the constitution was suspended and the leader of the constitutional court appointed leader, does the first action cancel the potency of the second?

Under the circumstances I'm guessing not, but the irony is at least a little bit tasty.

Re: D'oh! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#44182543)

Funny the places I find you... Have you read the book I sent you yet?

Constitution Suspended? (2)

Steve_Ussler (2941703) | about 9 months ago | (#44182117)

Funny is says the Constitution was Suspended. Like it was ever a democracy in the first place.

Re: Constitution Suspended? (2)

fuzzyfuzzyfungus (1223518) | about 9 months ago | (#44182181)

Funny is says the Constitution was Suspended.

Like it was ever a democracy in the first place.

Is there something requiring you to be a democracy in order to have a constitution?

Re: Constitution Suspended? (3, Insightful)

Cederic (9623) | about 9 months ago | (#44182195)

You mean the recent free and fair elections weren't democratic?

They voted in a religious fuckwit but that's an unfortunate flaw with democracy.

Re: Constitution Suspended? (1)

gmuslera (3436) | about 9 months ago | (#44182299)

At least the president was elected by most of the people and not by the Lesters only [ted.com]. Qualifies as democracy better than others that claim to be.

Re: Constitution Suspended? (2)

Mashiki (184564) | about 9 months ago | (#44182331)

One can only hope that their consitution that was drafted a year ago was suspended. Being that Morsi basically gave himself "el presedente" type powers, and imposed islam as the backbone of the country, and sharia law as the "founding law of the land." Yep, I shit you not on that one.

Go ahead and see how well that's worked out in the last year oki? With open attacks on copts, who don't pay the jizya tax. And of course their value only being worth half of that of a muslim. Or the massive upswing in attacks against women, you know because they're worth less than that of a man. And with other things that were being brought up in the courts such as requiring male witnesses for rape and other sexual assaults, morality police, "virtue" police to ensure women were pure(aka haven't had sex). I'm sure that it was turning into a great place...which is why they're having another revolution.

US credibility overthrown too (0, Troll)

clarkkent09 (1104833) | about 9 months ago | (#44182129)

So Obama throws Mubarak under the bus so Egypt can have democracy, now he supports a military coup to remove a democratically elected leader by the same military that used to keep Mubarak in power. Way to have a consistent foreign policy, chief.

Re:US credibility overthrown too (0)

iggymanz (596061) | about 9 months ago | (#44182165)

when did the federal government have any credibiliy, they lost it before I was born (I'm 50).

Obama is just a dancing circus bear, the agenda of Bush/Cheney's masters continue

Re:US credibility overthrown too (1)

fuzzyfuzzyfungus (1223518) | about 9 months ago | (#44182203)

Is "We don't really want to get dragged into bringing Peace And Democracy to yet another sandbox hellhole" not a consistent policy?

Re:US credibility overthrown too (2, Interesting)

clarkkent09 (1104833) | about 9 months ago | (#44182243)

Don't be naive. Short of installing Obama as the ruler of Egypt, we can hardly get any less involved in what's going on there.

Re:US credibility overthrown too (2)

clarkkent09 (1104833) | about 9 months ago | (#44182281)

That didn't make sense. Short of installing Obama as the ruler of Egypt, we can hardly get any more involved in what's going on there.

Re:US credibility overthrown too (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#44182237)

He wasn't Islamic enough for Obummer's taste.

Didn't they just elect this guy? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#44182211)

Didn't the Egyptians just elect this guy a year ago?

Re:Didn't they just elect this guy? (2)

MozeeToby (1163751) | about 9 months ago | (#44182383)

Yes, but since then he has made more power grabs and less reforms than people are comfortable with. On the one hand, I don't see that not producing enough jobs is cause to overthrow the government, on the other, there has been real concern of a significant shift towards institutionalized Islam in Egypt.

Failed State? (1)

jfz (917930) | about 9 months ago | (#44182221)

So who is running Egypt? Is it the international bankers, the west, islamic nutjobs, or military officials on power trips? At-least in the US we know it's the first group in conjunction with corporations. But with Egypt I'm confused.

Re:Failed State? (1)

fuzzyfuzzyfungus (1223518) | about 9 months ago | (#44182371)

Islamist nutjobs are probably out of the running, for the moment, since Morsi was much closer to their camp than the army is. The US used to pay fairly handsomely for the friendship of Mubarak, and a lot of the sugar trickled down to the military; but I haven't heard any good conspiracy theories to the effect that the US is calling in its chits(and even if we were, we'd still have to magic those days of massive popular discontent into existence somehow, after years and years of paying the guy who just stopped oppressing the people recently, which would take some doing...)

It wouldn't totally surprise me if the (banal; but crushing) effect of substantial unemployment [ahram.org.eg], especially among young urbanites, even educated ones, would have made any government's job difficult, and a government that drew its support more heavily from conservative hicks-in-the-sticks was especially vulnerable.

Sanity May Yet Prevail (5, Interesting)

some old guy (674482) | about 9 months ago | (#44182233)

While the Egyptian Army is certainly no paragon of freedom (or battle prowess, but that's another story...), at least there is a formidable power in Egypt that leans toward secular sanity and against Islamist lunacy. Egypt could again one day stand with Turkey (for all its troubles) and Jordan as examples of modern, stable states among the insane theocracies that surround them.

Re:Sanity May Yet Prevail (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#44182303)

"Egypt could again one day stand with Turkey (for all its troubles) and Jordan as examples of modern, stable states among the insane theocracies that surround them."

Man, I sure hope North Carolina can do this too.

Re:Sanity May Yet Prevail (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#44182479)

Does North Carolina wrap up its women in rags so they have only slits to see through? Do they stone their wives and children to death for bringing the family dishonor? Can females drive in North Carolina? Do the men gibber about holy crusades and wiping out nations with other religions? Deny rights to people of other faiths? All this codified in law?

There is no moral or other equivalency there.

Twit.

Re:Sanity May Yet Prevail (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#44182507)

"Egypt could again one day stand with Turkey (for all its troubles) and Jordan as examples of modern, stable states among the insane theocracies that surround them."

Man, I sure hope North Carolina can do this too.

Awesome!

Re:Sanity May Yet Prevail (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#44182529)

You HAD your chance with Steven Colbert's sister. Instead you voted in a crook, liar, cheater and general asshole AKA GOP politician.

Re:Sanity May Yet Prevail (1)

CohibaVancouver (864662) | about 9 months ago | (#44182419)

at least there is a formidable power in Egypt that leans toward secular sanity and against Islamist lunacy

Yep. Same deal with the army in Turkey. Any time a leader drifts too far from secularism they slap them down.

Re:Sanity May Yet Prevail (2)

cold fjord (826450) | about 9 months ago | (#44182443)

Unfortunately Turkey is heading in the opposite direction, towards becoming an Islamic state. The Islamists in power have seriously weakened the Turkish army so there is little likelihood that it will be able to step in again to restore secular government. This might be a more or less permanent change.

Re:Sanity May Yet Prevail (1)

rsborg (111459) | about 9 months ago | (#44182457)

While the Egyptian Army is certainly no paragon of freedom (or battle prowess, but that's another story...), at least there is a formidable power in Egypt that leans toward secular sanity and against Islamist lunacy. Egypt could again one day stand with Turkey (for all its troubles) and Jordan as examples of modern, stable states among the insane theocracies that surround them.

The Egyptian military has very strong ties with the Egyptian economy. What's bad for Egypt's economy impacts the Egyptian military's bottom line. Making sure the Suez keeps traffic flowing, making sure tourists aren't killed/taken hostage are very high priorities for the military. Also the US spends $1bn/year propping up the military.

It's not all about secular vs. islamist either. Mubarak wasn't exactly an islamist, but still managed to steal billions from the country over his 30 year reign: http://theweek.com/article/index/212105/hosni-mubaraks-stolen-70-billion-fortune [theweek.com]

Re:Sanity May Yet Prevail (2)

I_say (2654869) | about 9 months ago | (#44182575)

I don't think the lunacy is strictly Islamic. It seems to be born more from Fundamentalism. It's true that Christians are the minority in that corner of the world, but that doesn't mean they are more "right" than the region's Muslims. I've visited Kuwait, Iraq, Syria, Jordan and Isreal while studying for Cultural Anthro and I can tell you, first hand, that there is no shortage of fundies from every religion.

When is someone going to make an AP for that (1)

GoodNewsJimDotCom (2244874) | about 9 months ago | (#44182279)

You'd think there'd be an open sourced project for hyperdemocracy. That you can just install in new governments that lets every person vote and petition the government more actively than they do now. It might take a specialized security nationalized Internet that is less susceptible to be hacked. But the code to allow people to petition the government, check how the president is acting vs what the people want, etc etc etc, could be reasonably done with an Open Source Hyperdemocracy ap. So when dictactors are removed, new governments by the people could be set up just by installing software. It might not be the best plan, but it could work. And if it does work, more places would adopt it.

Re:When is someone going to make an AP for that (1)

jader3rd (2222716) | about 9 months ago | (#44182591)

That kind of requires a population with a certain degree of literacy, which a lot of these Arab Spring democracies don't have.

Take your shariah... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#44182283)

and stuff it, islamists!

Be ye not too hasty (1)

fnj (64210) | about 9 months ago | (#44182515)

Take you shariah and stuff it, islamists!

Not arguing with the thought, but we don't yet have the faintest idea who is pulling the strings in the apparently successful insurrection against those lately in power.

Social media cuts both ways (2)

vivaoporto (1064484) | about 9 months ago | (#44182341)

Social media cuts both ways. The military took control of State TV (as in all coups), closed the three pro-Morsi TV Stations (arresting some journalists in the process) but could not take both the Twitter and the Facebook official accounts from the reluctant future deposed president.

The next post will contain verbatim of the deposed president probable last communication via an official channel: the "Office of Assistant to President of Egypt on Foreign Relations" Facebook account.

Here is the link to the communicate [facebook.com] for those who still have a FB account.

Below is the full text for analysis and comment.

Re:Social media cuts both ways (1)

vivaoporto (1064484) | about 9 months ago | (#44182495)

For some reason ./ is dying with Error 503 while trying to post the ginormous wall of text. But it accepts this short text just fine.

Is Slashdot becoming more "twitter like" and preventing long texts?

Re:Social media cuts both ways (1)

vivaoporto (1064484) | about 9 months ago | (#44182545)

[Part 1/4]

The Egyptian Presidency

Office of the Assistant to the President on Foreign Relations & International Cooperation

___________________________________________________________

For Immediate Release, July 3, 2013

As I write these lines I am fully aware that these may be the last lines I get to post on this page.

For the sake of Egypt and for historical accuracy, letâ(TM)s call what is happening by its real name: Military coup.

It has been two and a half years after a popular revolution against a dictatorship that had strangled and drained Egypt for 30 years.

That revolution restored a sense of hope and fired up Egyptiansâ(TM) dreams of a future in which they could claim for themselves the same dignity that is every human beingâ(TM)s birthright.

On Januray 25 I stood in Tahrir square. My children stood in protest in Cairo and Alexandria. We stood ready to sacrifice for this revolution. When we did that, we did not support a revolution of elites. And we did not support a conditional democracy. We stood, and we still stand, for a very simple idea: given freedom, we Egyptians can build institutions that allow us to promote and choose among all the different visions for the country. We quickly discovered that almost none of the other actors were willing to extend that idea to include us.

You have heard much during the past 30 months about ikhwan excluding all others. I will not try to convince you otherwise today. Perhaps there will come a day when honest academics have the courage to examine the record.

Re:Social media cuts both ways (1)

vivaoporto (1064484) | about 9 months ago | (#44182581)

[Part 2/4]

Today only one thing matters. In this day and age no military coup can succeed in the face of sizeable popular force without considerable bloodshed. Who among you is ready to shoulder that blame?

I am fully aware of the Egyptian media that has already attempted to frame ikhwan for every act of violence that has taken place in Egypt since January 2011. I am sure that you are tempted to believe this. But it will not be easy.

There are still people in Egypt who believe in their right to make a democratic choice. Hundreds of thousands of them have gathered in support of democracy and the Presidency. And they will not leave in the face of this attack. To move them, there will have to be violence. It will either come from the army, the police, or the hired mercenaries. Either way there will be considerable bloodshed. And the message will resonate throughout the Muslim World loud and clear: democracy is not for Muslims.

I do not need to explain in detail the worldwide catastrophic ramifications of this message. In the last week there has been every attempt to issue a counter narrative that this is just scaremongering and that the crushing of Egyptâ(TM)s nascent democracy can be managed. We no longer have the time to engage in frivolous academic back and forth. The audience that reads this page understands the price that the world continues to pay for the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq. Egypt is neither Afghanistan nor Iraq. Its symbolic weight and resulting impact is far more significant. Last night, demonstrators at Cairo University supporting the President were fired upon using automatic weapons. Twenty people died and hunderds were injured.
There are people in Egypt and around the world that continue to try to justify the calls for early presidential elections because of the large numbers of demonstrators and the validity of their grievances.

Re:Social media cuts both ways (1)

vivaoporto (1064484) | about 9 months ago | (#44182611)

[Part 3/4]

Let me be very clear. The protesters represent a wide spectrum of Egyptians and many of them have genuine, valid grievances. President Morsyâ(TM)s approval rating is down.

Now let me be equally clear. Since January and again in the last couple of weeks the President has repeatedly called for national dialog. Equally repeatedly, the opposition refused to participate. Increasingly, the so-called liberals of Egypt escalated a rhetoric inviting the military to become the custodians of government in Egypt. The opposition has steadfastly declined every option that entails a return to the ballot box.

Yesterday, the President received an initiative from an alliance of parties supporting constitutional legitimacy. He discussed it with the Prime Minister and the Minister of Defense and all three of them agreed that it presented an excellent path for Egypt out of its current impasse. The initiative called for a full change of cabinet, a prime minister acceptable to all, changing the public prosecutor, agreement on constitutional amendments, and a reconciliation commission.

And let us also be clear. The President did not have to offer all these concessions. In a democracy, there are simple consequences for the situation we see in Egypt: the President loses the next election or his party gets penalized in the upcoming parliamentary elections. Anything else is mob rule.

Re:Social media cuts both ways (1)

vivaoporto (1064484) | about 9 months ago | (#44182627)

[Part 4/4]

In the last year we have been castigated by foreign governments, foreign media, and rights groups whenever our reforms in the areas of rights and freedoms did not keep pace with the ambitions of some or adhere exactly to the forms used in other cultures. The silence of all of those voices with an impending military coup is hypocritical and that hypocrisy will not be lost on a large swathe of Egyptians, Arabs and Muslims.

Many have seen fit in these last months to lecture us on how democracy is more than just the ballot box. That may indeed be true. But what is definitely true is that there is no democracy without the ballot box.

-ENDS-

Egypt doesn't have a formal "impeachment" process (3, Informative)

steveha (103154) | about 9 months ago | (#44182487)

So this is a rather informal one.

It's a coup, but rather a strange one. The people want Morsi gone, the military is moving against him and then handing off power to the people.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2013/07/03/egypt-morsi-protests-army-deadline/2485355/ [usatoday.com]

Here's a summary of the situation from the point of view of one of the protesters.

Why President Morsi is in Trouble:
A youth leader of the June 30th demonstrations gives us an insider's view of why ordinary Egyptians are in revolt.

http://pjmedia.com/blog/why-president-morsi-is-in-trouble/?singlepage=true [pjmedia.com]

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