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PC Plus Packs Windows and Android Into Same Machine

timothy posted about 9 months ago | from the or-splashtop-plus-if-you'd-prefer dept.

Operating Systems 319

jones_supa writes "At the mammoth Consumer Electronics Show (CES) in Las Vegas in early January, it is expected that multiple computer makers will unveil systems that simultaneously run two different operating systems, both Windows and Android, two different analysts said recently. The new devices will introduce a new marketing buzzword called PC Plus, explained Tim Bajarin of Creative Strategies. 'A PC Plus machine will run Windows 8.1 but will also run Android apps as well', Bajarin wrote recently for Time. 'They are doing this through software emulation. I'm not sure what kind of performance you can expect, but this is their way to try and bring more touch-based apps to the Windows ecosystem.' Patrick Moorhead, principal analyst at Moor Insights & Strategy, suggests that PC Plus could get millions of consumers more comfortable with Android on PCs. 'Just imagine for a second what happens when Android gets an improved large-screen experience. This should scare the heck out of Microsoft.'"

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Dupe Plus Packs Two Articles into Same Subject (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815237)

http://tech.slashdot.org/story/13/12/27/2027222/pc-makers-plan-rebellion-against-microsoft-at-ces?sbsrc=md

Re:Dupe Plus Packs Two Articles into Same Subject (1)

GoodNewsJimDotCom (2244874) | about 9 months ago | (#45815257)

Dual Posting Dual Booting, so meta.

I'll say the same thing as before,"If this goes over, they might throw in a Linux boot too." Say what you want about Windows, it still can get viruses easily, while Linux is a more secure browsing experience.

Re:Dupe Plus Packs Two Articles into Same Subject (1)

johnsie (1158363) | about 9 months ago | (#45815325)

RTFA

Re:Dupe Plus Packs Two Articles into Same Subject (5, Funny)

noh8rz10 (2716597) | about 9 months ago | (#45815749)

so if a computer just has android but no windows, is it a PC Minus?

Re:Dupe Plus Packs Two Articles into Same Subject (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815355)

Say what you want about Windows, it still can get viruses easily, while Linux is a more secure browsing experience.

Not true. Windows cannot get viruses easily anymore. Unless you are a clueless Homer Simpson which runs every spurious BirthdayCard.exe with admin privileges, Windows is perfectly safe to use.

Trojans (1)

tepples (727027) | about 9 months ago | (#45815527)

I agree that Windows can't get viruses very easily since 2007 when Windows Vista introduced UAC. But it can get trojans such as fake antivirus and CryptoLocker, which are at least as bad for an end user as viruses.

Re:Trojans (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815805)

Any OS can get malware that is installed by the user.

Re:Dupe Plus Packs Two Articles into Same Subject (1)

aliquis (678370) | about 9 months ago | (#45815829)

"If this goes over, they might throw in a Linux boot too."

PC++?

Re:Dupe Plus Packs Two Articles into Same Subject (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815847)

Amateur!

++PC

The ++operator can be more efficient for some implementations vs operator++.

Where does /. find these amateur fools.

Re:Dupe Plus Packs Two Articles into Same Subject (5, Funny)

ColdWetDog (752185) | about 9 months ago | (#45815315)

That story got 538 replies. Why not try for another heavy hitter? It's a good business strategy.

Help Dice out folks, copy your last comments into this story.

Re:Dupe Plus Packs Two Articles into Same Subject (1)

Deathlizard (115856) | about 9 months ago | (#45815579)

Sure why not. Here was my last comment minus the revolt stuff. Hopefully We get a few more of these articles. The .NET Firefox plugin [slashdot.org] dupes needs some competition.

Adding android on an OS that's already got a Tablet interface is akin of adding spinner rimmed wheels to the hood of a car because people don't like standard rims. It's Basically Splashtop OS for 2014. It doesn't solve any problem, hell it probably makes it worse since Android isn't exactly designed for desktop use either

Re:Dupe Plus Packs Two Articles into Same Subject (4, Insightful)

Anubis IV (1279820) | about 9 months ago | (#45815683)

Yeah, I'm kinda reading this as something along the lines of...

Exec: So, based on the Ouya's wild success since its launch...
*crickets*
Exec: ...we'e decided Android has proven it can work outside of mobile devices and that it's time to implement an entire PC around it. And since people love dual booting...
*crickets*
Exec: ...we expect it to be a smashing success!

This product idea is basically a shot across the bow to Microsoft from the hardware manufacturers, telling MS that they're actively looking for alternatives and that MS had better do something about it. But they're not as clueless as the executive I painted above. They know that this product will flop, because normal people don't want to deal with wondering why they can't use their app unless they reboot or why their data isn't accessible from where they are, and the decision makers know that Android is not ready to be run as a desktop OS.

I predict that we'll only see a handful, if even that, of these come to market, and that most will be killed before they ever get close to launching, since it isn't about selling them: it's about sending a message to Microsoft.

Re:Dupe Plus Packs Two Articles into Same Subject (1)

Deathlizard (115856) | about 9 months ago | (#45815793)

Staying with my original theme of copying my old post...

If they were serious about a revolt, or serious about sending a message to MS, they should go to CES with all of their PC's running Windows 7 / Full Featured Linux / ChromeOS, ETC... or nothing but Android Tablets.

Re:Dupe Plus Packs Two Articles into Same Subject (5, Funny)

sootman (158191) | about 9 months ago | (#45815795)

> copy your last comments into this story.

My comments? Fuck that. I'm stealing some +5s from that thread.

Re:Dupe Plus Packs Two Articles into Same Subject (1)

Chalnoth (1334923) | about 9 months ago | (#45815839)

Hey, at least it's a better description this time.

Screen resolution for laptops? (4, Insightful)

CockMonster (886033) | about 9 months ago | (#45815249)

1366x768 just doesn't cut it, no matter how many OSes you stick on it.

Re:Screen resolution for laptops? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815289)

My phone is higher res, and I can still see the pixels.

Re:Screen resolution for laptops? (1)

Luckyo (1726890) | about 9 months ago | (#45815663)

Time to visit a doctor to get on medication to stop these hallucinations!

Re:Screen resolution for laptops? (2)

Billly Gates (198444) | about 9 months ago | (#45815457)

1366x768 just doesn't cut it, no matter how many OSes you stick on it.

You know it is sad when a freaking phone has 2x - 3x the fucking DPI as your expensive computer.

Then these manufacturers act all shocked that the PC market is dying. Whoa how could that be?!

It is turning into the mainframe fast. Used for legacy as the cooler innovations are all going to the smaller and lower end devices. Mainframe admins were always thumbing their noses at the pc crowd until we had color screens and cdroms. Then their platform looked quite dated and the rest was history.

Re:Screen resolution for laptops? (2, Insightful)

dreamchaser (49529) | about 9 months ago | (#45815461)

The PC market is hardly dying. That's a tired old trope by now. They said the same thing about mainframes. Guess what? People still buy them. The landscape is changing for sure, but the PC market is not even close to 'dying'.

Re:Screen resolution for laptops? (2)

Billly Gates (198444) | about 9 months ago | (#45815531)

In the business world it is dying. 10% year after year of sales declines is the very definition of dying and something investors flee running from.

We still sell candles too and horses you know. Doesn't mean you want to invest in a candle startup either. It also does not give business customers the confidence of buying either. Sure they need their win32 craplets but in a few years of more declines they will wonder if it is wiser investment to go to a cloud and host them with Citrix via tablets instead as this is what everyone else is doing etc. A self fulfilling prophesy is created.

Workstation market is considered about dead too yet Apple created the $9,995 mac pro. However that market is only 15% of what it was 15 years ago when any finance guru, engineer, programmer, or artist just had to have that $20,000 irix or Sun system. Today these are niche as the pc is good enough now with higher end consumer components.

Re:Screen resolution for laptops? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815713)

Did you also predict the end of Apple during the 90's and early 2000's?

--

Re:Screen resolution for laptops? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815761)

Yes and I was right.

The mac classic was a dead platform and even MacOSX only had a slight revival. It is dead, but Apple invented iOS to keep them afloat. Without it you can bet Apple would be in big trouble and would be out of business as it went heavily in debt before the ipod.

Remote desktop while out of Wi-Fi range (2)

tepples (727027) | about 9 months ago | (#45815785)

Sure they need their win32 craplets but in a few years of more declines they will wonder if it is wiser investment to go to a cloud and host them with Citrix via tablets instead as this is what everyone else is doing etc.

Until they see the $500-$600 per year price tag for the mobile broadband plan needed to use an application while on the road. Running applications on a leased server can replace a desktop a lot more easily than a laptop.

Re:Remote desktop while out of Wi-Fi range (2)

Billly Gates (198444) | about 9 months ago | (#45815819)

Sure they need their win32 craplets but in a few years of more declines they will wonder if it is wiser investment to go to a cloud and host them with Citrix via tablets instead as this is what everyone else is doing etc.

Until they see the $500-$600 per year price tag for the mobile broadband plan needed to use an application while on the road. Running applications on a leased server can replace a desktop a lot more easily than a laptop.

You also got to figure out in accountants who look at short term costs only as well as IT expense.

You can save millions if you have no IT department and no CIO! Just turn it on and it works! Azure will grow into a managed active directory just like they do right now with outlook.com which is part of office 365. The market is heading this way as business people do not want to deal with technology. Do MBAs of factories want to deal with mechanics? After all without them how can they ship their products etc? Is there a chief mechanic officer? That is silly.

They do hire geeks for SEO and marketing ads but that is it and maybe a few programmers for things they need to help glue that they have lying around.

A tablet with a screen and keyboard where the person can work from home is the future. They will be managed and have business stores. Exchange 2013 offers enterprise stores where apps are uploaded via a group policy. No need for an annoying VPN.

Windows 8 was too imature but it is coming. Corps are 5 to 7years behind comsumers. This makes sense as they know are approving Iphones (not droids yet) and Windows 7 and IE 8 is the new rage of modern. So in 5 to 7 years Windows 7 will be going EOL and slashdotters will be whining about change and the corps will have to make a choice in 5 years when 2019 comes. To go with another expensive to maintain eco system that will need to be upgraded in 10 years or go with tablets and save $$$$ and not worry.

This is the nightmare OEMs are afraid of for good reason. Mainframes were the standard too you know before the PC. Banks did not open up to PC's as more than toys until the freaking early to mid 1990s!

Re:Screen resolution for laptops? (1)

tepples (727027) | about 9 months ago | (#45815533)

So where can I get a new 10" laptop to replace mine when it dies? Oh wait, the major PC makers killed that category a year ago [slashdot.org] in favor of higher-margin tablets.

Re:Screen resolution for laptops? (1)

Luckyo (1726890) | about 9 months ago | (#45815675)

Buy a chromebook, install windows xp/7 on it, you're good to go.

Re:Screen resolution for laptops? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815577)

Especially when you can easily get a fucking Android phone with a quarter of the screen size and a 1080p.

Re:Screen resolution for laptops? (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815649)

In my opinion it cuts it.

I used to get all excited when going to a higher resolution. I remember the first time I had a computer running at 800x600. Then later on I got 1024x768 and felt like that was as good as it could get. Eventually my machines started having better displays, but then I pretty much stopped caring. 1366x768 is better than 720p. I can barely tell the difference between 720p and 1080p movies. I certainly don't care about the difference when playing games or reading Slashdot or compiling packages.

I just went from a mobile phone with a modest display to one with a 1080p display. Honestly yeah, it does look a little better, but not enough for me to really feel like it makes a big difference.

Re:Screen resolution for laptops? (1)

jones_supa (887896) | about 9 months ago | (#45815771)

I agree, 1366x768 is still perfectly fine for most tasks.

Extending the Microsoft Tax .. (3)

codeusirae (3036835) | about 9 months ago | (#45815253)

'They are doing this through software emulation. I'm not sure what kind of performance you can expect, but this is their way to try and bring more touch-based apps to the Windows ecosystem.'

More likely a pretext to extend the Microsoft Tax [theverge.com] ..

Might be a way to solve a few issues... (4, Interesting)

mlts (1038732) | about 9 months ago | (#45815263)

One of the biggest causes of malware are attacks on the Web browser and its add-ons. Android is a lot more secure in this regard, so having the ability to browse the Web with the code executing well away from the Windows side will be a very useful security gain.

It won't stop Trojans, but it will help address one major vector for infections.

I'd buy one of these "PC Pluses" just because I do know that the Android side will almost always be usable. I won't be able to do the advanced workflow or run the usual applications and games as I do on Windows, but for a number of tasks, the Android side will be good enough. Plus, with root, it can serve as a way to offload some UNIX functions such as a caching DNS, squid cache, etc.

Re:Might be a way to solve a few issues... (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815299)

Be careful. If you say too much everyone might realize that you have no idea what you are talking about.

Re:Might be a way to solve a few issues... (1)

mlts (1038732) | about 9 months ago | (#45815373)

You might just be right. I overlooked the part about the "software emulation".

If it worked just like the Atrix phones where it ran Android and a Linux distro at the same time on different CPUs, that is one thing.

Running Android in a VM might be workable, but that isn't that much better than using VirtualBox or one's VM application of choice and running their favorite OS inside of that. A VM is better because when done with browsing and assuming one has a way to save bookmarks, a snapshot rollback is a good way (not 100%; nothing is) to ensure that any drive-by downloads picked up during a browsing session are ditched.

Since this is software emulation, does this means that the "PC Plus" machines have a built in hypervisor?

Re:Might be a way to solve a few issues... (0)

jones_supa (887896) | about 9 months ago | (#45815377)

It won't stop Trojans, but it will help address one major vector for infections.

I thought Trojans greatly help against infections...

Re:Might be a way to solve a few issues... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815797)

not the kind most people on /. get anyt how.

sorry couldn't help my self..lol

Re:Might be a way to solve a few issues... (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815517)

hahaha you think android is always usable. I've lost count of the number of times i've given up trying to do something on a phone or tablet, after spending far to long on it, then picked up a laptop and done it in seconds. I almost can't remember the last time i crashed a pc (but it probably involved trying to play a pirated game).

I'm slightly confused (1)

TubeSteak (669689) | about 9 months ago | (#45815267)

Is this going to require new hardware?
Or will this be purely software based?

Re:I'm slightly confused (3, Informative)

MrEricSir (398214) | about 9 months ago | (#45815459)

According to the more informative Time article [time.com] , it's entirely software-based, and the whole shebang has Intel's backing.

[ANN] Slashdot Plus (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815269)

It's slashdot with duplication.

Amazeballs!

One Operating System (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815293)

it is expected that multiple computer makers will unveil systems that simultaneously run two different operating systems, both Windows and Android, two different analysts said recently

they are doing it through emulation so they are running ONE operating system

Re:One Operating System (1)

jones_supa (887896) | about 9 months ago | (#45815393)

Are you suggesting that if Android is ran through emulation, it doesn't count as a running operating system?

Re:One Operating System (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815405)

Considering that Android has a NATIVE x86 core built-- YES. Windows is completely unnecessary to running android aps on an x86 PC,

Re:One Operating System (1)

Billly Gates (198444) | about 9 months ago | (#45815467)

But the apps are all ARM based.

Go download the free Android SDK and try emulating an ancient 2.3x gingerbread ROM? Wow it was beyond painful.

Odd as it is written with java the apps are only ARM with it.

Re:One Operating System (1)

Mr0bvious (968303) | about 9 months ago | (#45815555)

I'm no expert regarding ARM emulation but when using the AVD (Android Virtual Device) that comes shipped with their ADK (dev kit) and I have Hardware Acceleration enabled (for video performance mostly) my games run at blazing speeds compared to a real Android device (mobile).

Perhaps your issues were that the emulator you were using did not have the advantage of hardware acceleration? Perhaps this new setup their proposing will have this advantage. Let's hope :)

Re:One Operating System (1)

tepples (727027) | about 9 months ago | (#45815583)

But the apps are all ARM based.

Some don't use NDK. Some use ARM but also have an x86 edition. And some are free software; everything on F-Droid, for instance, is a recompile away from running on Android/x86. Only apps that use NDK, that are non-free, and whose developer refuses to recompile to x86 would need emulation.

Re:One Operating System (1)

Billly Gates (198444) | about 9 months ago | (#45815593)

So what you are telling me is I can get Weatherbug, Okcupid, Facebook, Angry Birds, and other apps on x86.

Developers use it because it loads in less than 1 minute and my fans do not sound like a jet engine taking off like it does when I select ARM in emulation. But 99% of users only use ARM so why compile it with anything else? ... or I have an old Phenom II 2.6 ghz with a crappy fan.

Re:One Operating System (1)

tepples (727027) | about 9 months ago | (#45815757)

But 99% of users only use ARM so why compile it with anything else?

If you're the first to sell your applications to the 1% of Android users who use x86, then you can be the medium size fish in a small pond.

Re:One Operating System (1)

Dr Max (1696200) | about 9 months ago | (#45815659)

Am i the only one here that thinks android apps are barely passable as software. If you manage to find one without insane access rights, it's either complete crap covered with adds, or they charge you $5 for something you could do on windows, mac, or linux for free in much better quality. The last thing i want is android apps on my laptop, But if the pc makers think this will save the industry, who am i to judge they are obviously very intune with the market (not like they needed intel a chip maker, to hold their hands and help them make ultrabooks). Screw android apps just give me a high res screen, very decent graphics, big battery, and relitivaly thin profile while leaving all my ports where they were.

Two (2)

LinuxIsGarbage (1658307) | about 9 months ago | (#45815581)

it is expected that multiple computer makers will unveil systems that simultaneously run two different operating systems, both Windows and Android, two different analysts said recently

they are doing it through emulation so they are running ONE operating system

Two articles in two days say two analysts say two computer makers will unveil systems that simultaneously run two different operating systems.

Re:Two (1)

MichaelSmith (789609) | about 9 months ago | (#45815809)

To be reposted by /.

Scare? (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815297)

This should scare the heck out of Microsoft.

Microsoft will just release patches that break the Android emulator.

And if accused of doing it just to break the Android emulator, they would just say it was coincidence and it wasn't their intention.

Think otherwise? Prove it.

Re:Scare? (2)

LinuxIsGarbage (1658307) | about 9 months ago | (#45815571)

This should scare the heck out of Microsoft.

Microsoft will just release patches that break the Android emulator.

And if accused of doing it just to break the Android emulator, they would just say it was coincidence and it wasn't their intention.

Think otherwise? Prove it.

You're probably thinking of Netscape vs. Microsoft. In that case, and I expect in this case, Microsoft will need no help to break the application, it will run like crap from the get-go. Netscape was crap, and ran like crap on all platforms. At the time MSIE actually was a better browser. It wasn't until ~2003 or so when Firefox raised from the Netscape ashes with a good alternative to MSIE.

Re:Scare? (1)

Billly Gates (198444) | about 9 months ago | (#45815629)

All MS has to do is release Windows 9 within a year or so with a full start menu.

If rumors are true that Windows 9 will have a touch-first, mouse-first, and voice-first UI with aero back hybrid then Android wont be needed.

I would not mind Metro apps if I can stack them like I can with Windows 7 apps in a taskbar/dock, have aero peak, and would not take up the damn whole screen, etc. I look at this as OEMs getting scared and this planned rebellion mentioned 2 days ago are OEMs trying to fight for the last straw to stay relevant.

Maybe not having crap screens with garbage quality stuff with bidders having a race to the bottom for the contract mixed with a decent OS would halt the pc decline?

Re:Scare? (2)

Luckyo (1726890) | about 9 months ago | (#45815693)

Not going to be enough. They'd have to axe all of the touch centric solutions like the sliding bars, hot corners and so on. Desktop functions well as a mouse driven interface, and mouse and touch interfaces are mutually exclusive in many of their requirements.

The main reason for 8's catastrophic failure is the fact that it pushed for touch centric desktop, leaving everyone using mouse/keyboard or mouse only with a crippled interface that simply didn't work properly. Start menu is just one of the most obvious examples of this design paradigm, but there are many others.

Re:Scare? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815751)

The rumors are here [neowin.net] .

Basically if you plug in a mouse it will revert to a Windows 7 UI with some metro applets behaving just like win32 ones with the familiar taskbar, aero, and start menu. Unplug hte mouse and the this goes away to a metro/modern style tablet UI.

I like this idea. You can have a somewhat familiar UI and teh sliding bars go away or pop up. I do wonder how Windows 8 mobile apps which depend on sliding horizontally will work though? So far I have not seen them in Windows 8 but then again I only use it to test IE 11 and do not do much with it as it is a VM.

Windows 7 meets my needs fine. But if enough apps are modernized by 2020 I can see myself using something like this. For now I will be an XP luddite of this decade with WIndows 7.

DOS ain't done till Lotus won't run (1)

tepples (727027) | about 9 months ago | (#45815605)

Microsoft will just release patches that break the Android emulator.

In other words, you claim that Microsoft's Windows division still has a "DOS ain't done till Lotus won't run" mentality. I thought that by now, Microsoft was bending over backwards to maintain compatibility with the past decade of Windows applications, using a different such as the compatibility modes and things like the separate memory allocator for SimCity.exe. Microsoft does this because it knows the big advantage of Windows over just shipping GNU/Linux on a PC was backward compatibility with existing applications. Case in point: Does Microsoft routinely release patches that break, say, NES emulators?

Dupe! (1)

bloodhawk (813939) | about 9 months ago | (#45815311)

really another dupe, and they still didn't fix the technical mistakes. i.e. it is one OS (windows) Android apps are being emulated in the OS. and same as last article, NO this isn't going to scare MS, probably more scary for Google as it removes the need to run android to use android apps.

Google cert.? (1)

Brit_in_the_USA (936704) | about 9 months ago | (#45815323)

Without Google certification and play services it will be an uphill battle for traction with a reduced pool of compatible apps. Even amazon has to work hard to make APIs that duplicate googles closed source ones.

Everything old is new again (3, Interesting)

50000BTU_barbecue (588132) | about 9 months ago | (#45815327)

Bridgeboard on my Amiga, 20 years ago.

Re:Everything old is new again (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815367)

SpectreGCR on my AtariST !

Re:Everything old is new again - Emplant (1)

gabrieltss (64078) | about 9 months ago | (#45815653)

Still have my Emplant board in my A2000 - runs Windows 3.x, DOS 6, MAC 7.1 - yeah they are old - but the concept of running multiple OS's simultaneously isn't anything new... Yawn.....

This is not new and not news, either. (4, Insightful)

kheldan (1460303) | about 9 months ago | (#45815339)

So you run Android in a VM inside Windows. So what? This isn't a new trick, and it's not newsworthy either. It smacks of shameless shilling. Seriously, nothing to see here, move along..

Re:This is not new and not news, either. (1)

Darinbob (1142669) | about 9 months ago | (#45815585)

Is it even useful? What sort of android apps exist that you'd want to have on a PC, that don't exist as a standalone web site? That's one fault with Windows 8, the "apps" are kind of pointless.

Games and check deposit (1)

tepples (727027) | about 9 months ago | (#45815719)

What sort of android apps exist that you'd want to have on a PC, that don't exist as a standalone web site?

Video games, for one. Several games are ported to Android but aren't available for desktop operating systems. Another is check deposit applications published by banks such as Chase that use the device's rear-facing camera to scan the front and back of a paper check. I called Chase and asked about a PC version of Chase QuickDeposit, but the representative told me there was no PC version.

Intel is behinf (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815341)

IMHO, the most important part is that Intel is involved in that stuff, not random PC assemblers unable to write a line of code.
Intel is stabbing Microsoft and tries to promote Android without ARM.

timothy!!! (1)

csumpi (2258986) | about 9 months ago | (#45815357)

Dude! You just posted this same thing yesterday!

Or they paid for two /vertisements?

Re:timothy!!! (1)

phayes (202222) | about 9 months ago | (#45815769)

What makes you think Timothy has any notion of what time is?

why would it... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815375)

Why would it scare microsoft ? You're still using Windows, they still got your money.
Android will not be replacing our desktop OS anytime soon, if ever.

Woohoo more experience (4, Insightful)

thegarbz (1787294) | about 9 months ago | (#45815379)

Has anyone else taken a skeptical view of the word "experience"? I don't want to "experience" a computer. I just want a functional computer that works.

'Just imagine for a second what happens when Android gets an improved large-screen experience.'

I don't need to imagine much. When you use any system for something its not designed for the only thing that it will experience is its own demise.

Re: Woohoo more experience (1)

GrahamJ (241784) | about 9 months ago | (#45815495)

God yes! The term is so overused by marketing droids these days, bugs the hell outta me.

Re: Woohoo more experience (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815681)

Heavy use of buzz words is fundamental to your Slashdot Beta 2.0 experience.

Role of the PC changing (3, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815381)

This wont really work. It tries oh so very hard to have the PC do what the market wants tablets and phones to do. This is not the direction the PC market needs to chase.

The role of the PC is changing; It has competition in the market, because tablets and phones are reasonably powerful, and ultraportable.
For casual data consumption and small-scale gameplay (casual games and such) the PC has basically lost out. It needs to remember what it actually is: a consumer version of big iron. (Like it or not, the differences between a small server and a desktop PC are academic for the most part.) You dont carry big iron in your pocket. Big iron is for storing large quantities of data on, Big iron is for doing grunt processing that smaller, more dedicated devices are not suited to. Big iron is intended to provide services to a small fleet of lesser connected devices.

What do people use their home PC for these days, exactly (ordinary people, mind)--? They use them to download and store large archives of digital music and movies. They use them to preserve their digital photo collections when their phones get too full. They use them to manipulate data and files that arent well suited to processing on a mobile device. (writing wordprocessing documents, managing spreadsheets, etc.)

What do people do on tablets and phones? Basically anything else.

With that in mind, what kind of crack are these people smoking, to think that they can make a device that requires 120vAC constant power, and weighs 10lbs, needs a seperate discrete viewing hardware appliance, and bulky keyboard and mouse inputs-- be in any way comparable or desirable for software that is intended to be used on devices that weigh less than a pound, run on a 300mAh battery for hours, and have everything all together conveniently, and portably?

PC makers should understand that there are now 2 very different markets. The tablet/phone space, and the home server market, where PCs still sell.

If the home server marketplace isnt lucrative enough, then instead of wasting precious resources on boondoggles like this, they should be encouraging app store gatekeepers like Apple and Google to allow apps that are basically a front end for a network service running on a home server in the user's home, over the public IP network. (Oh, but that would make the ISPs so very sad, wouldnt it?) That would allow the raw torque of a home PC to be better utilized, a home internet connection to be better utilized, bring functionality not realistically possible to the tablet/phone space, and keep everyone mostly happy.

Instead, you have gatekeepers like Apple and Google wanting to cement their exclusivity as gatekeepers by preventing competing server services from being run exclusively for and by the end user, since that would cut into services like google's cloud storage platform, Chrome OS paradigm, and pals. This is because if they remain the gatekeepers, they get to hoover up all the delicious user profile information and use pattern data about that user, and sell it to advertisers and market analysts. (If the end users ran their own instances of a service on their own platforms and hardware, it would make doing that basically impossible to guarantee.)

But, because this is just another attempt by a market segment who's business model has shriveled up in the winds of change at resisting that change, I fully expect it to fail like the boondoggle that it is.

PCs will always have their uses; Fancy touch interfaces and pretending to be a big bulky tablet simply isnt the use that the market has chosen for them. Given the availability of superior offerings in the ACTUAL tablet space, this is NOT going to win anyone over except perhaps corporate idiots who respond only to buzzwords.

Offline reading, platformers, and remote desktop (3, Insightful)

tepples (727027) | about 9 months ago | (#45815703)

For casual data consumption and small-scale gameplay (casual games and such) the PC has basically lost out [to tablets].

Both my Dell Inspiron mini 1012 laptop (running Xubuntu) and my first-generation Nexus 7 tablet (running Android) have 1 GB of RAM. The Firefox web browser on the laptop keeps a dozen tabs in memory at once without dipping into swap, partly thanks to my use of the Flashblock extension. I can load all of a day's Cracked articles in tabs, board the bus, and read them on the commute to and from work. Both Chrome and Firefox web browsers on the tablet, on the other hand, will forget a tab when I switch away from it and have to reload. Because I'm not willing to pay another $500-$600 per device per year for mobile broadband on top of what I already pay for Internet at home, the tablet will end up displaying an error message "You are offline" when I switch back to a tab.

And as for gameplay, point-and-click games work well, but other genres don't. I've tried to play platform games (similar to Super Mario Bros. and Mega Man) on a tablet's touch screen, and it's painful.

[Ordinary people] use [a home PC] to manipulate data and files that arent well suited to processing on a mobile device. (writing wordprocessing documents, managing spreadsheets, etc.)

Where "etc." could include running a compiler for a high school or college student's "introduction to computer science" homework. This is something that tablets have traditionally been lacking, even when docked to a Bluetooth keyboard.

[PC makers] should be encouraging app store gatekeepers like Apple and Google to allow apps that are basically a front end for a network service running on a home server in the user's home

There are already plenty of remote desktop viewer applications for mobile devices. SSH, X11, RDP, VNC, take your pick. One problem is that using them requires paying $500-$600 per device per year for mobile broadband on top of what the user already pays for Internet at home. The other is that for any service running on a home server, once you've added a Bluetooth keyboard and a stand to hold the tablet, you might as well be using a small laptop.

Ditch Windows (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815385)

I want a 21 inch touch screen, 8 core processor, 2gb ram, ANDROID pc please. Why on earth would I want Windows on that? I have a Windows box to run legacy software, and none of it works well on Windows 8 anyway!

Re:Ditch Windows (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815429)

You can already run android on such a system, if you have the appropriate drivers for your touch device.
http://www.android-x86.org/

There is precisely zero reason to dual boot with windows, if you dont need windows software.

Re:Ditch Windows (1)

jones_supa (887896) | about 9 months ago | (#45815505)

I've seen Android-x86 before and it looks interesting. Does it actually work, or is it some experimental flaky garbage?

Re:Ditch Windows (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815525)

x86? PC? Yuck. What I had in mind is something like a tablet that runs all the time, has the sort of screen res I see on ten inch tablets, e.g. 2500x1600, but no battery, solid stand, physical keyboard, flash based, low power, low energy yet able to scale to 8 core like the Galaxy Note 2014 and similar tablets.

Basically a large tablet for your desk.

X86? Too hot, I don't want a fan. Not ARM binary compatible.
Screen res too low.
No touch screen.
Not off the shelf, I want a consumer device with a 1 year guarantee and updates.

 

This is news? (2)

LoRdTAW (99712) | about 9 months ago | (#45815411)

One word: Bluestacks. Not open source but is freely available and already does what TFA is claiming major manufactures are going to do. I have owned my PCplus for about a year already. No touch screen though but the mouse works pretty good. If you have a touch screen laptop then you already own a PCplus.

CHRP all over again (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815431)

Great, this is the Common Hardware Reference Platform again. Way back in the dark age of 1995, Apple and IBM had the bright idea to make a computer that could run Mac OS and Windows NT on the same hardware. It was a futile effort that accomplished nothing. Back then, PowerPC and x86 were the commonly used incompatible platforms. Today, ARM and x86_64 are the commonly used incompatible platforms. Historically the x86 platform (and by extension x86_64) has buried the competition, so I believe I shall bet on PC Plus to fail miserably just like CHRP did.

Helping Microsoft too (1)

john_uy (187459) | about 9 months ago | (#45815453)

I think this might help Microsoft too. If they can pull it off with a great user experience, people will be getting Windows to run both Windows software that they use (such as MS Office, and other corporate software) and run parallel Android apps for their personal stuff. This will be great in sandboxing the work and personal stuff in a computer. People will appreciative of the Windows environment because it can run whatever apps they like. It might also increase the adaptation of Windows (especially ver 8 and above.)

Re:Helping Microsoft too (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815745)

I think this might help Microsoft too. If they can pull it off with a great user experience, people will be getting Windows to run both Windows software that they use (such as MS Office, and other corporate software) and run parallel Android apps for their personal stuff.

I really doubt that. Microsoft probably wants people to run Modern UI apps instead.

Cool... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815465)

Can i put win7 on it instead?

Re:Cool... (1)

tepples (727027) | about 9 months ago | (#45815613)

Windows 8/8.1 with Classic Shell should be close enough to Windows 7. Or what deal-breaking differences have you encountered?

Re:Cool... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815835)

I own windows 7 already.

And have it stripped down with rt7lite (nlite for 7) to under 2 gig installed with everything from adobe to winrar setup already.
Drop in hardware drivers and i'm done. 30 minutes or less from drive format to back to work.

So I have an OS i like. And already has all the garbage removed.
It runs every win program or game i have or want.
And does not need classic shell to be slightly less annoying.

Plus win8.1 improves nothing i could find when trying it out.
And actually a great deal of it slightly to hugely annoying. Or just plain broken.

Why should i pay the microsoft tax again? And not get anything i wanted?

W...Why not just Linux? (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815487)

If they're going through all this trouble to rebel and add in some emulated Android, which is already a sandboxed environment on top of a Linux kernel, why not just sell these PC's with Linux to begin with?

Re:W...Why not just Linux? (1)

pouar (2629833) | about 9 months ago | (#45815567)

+1
That's what I want to know.
That and why don't I ever have any mod points when I need them.

Re:W...Why not just Linux? (1)

linearz69 (3473163) | about 9 months ago | (#45815699)

You had me at "Why".

I can't figure out what problem this solves.

It's the apps (1)

tepples (727027) | about 9 months ago | (#45815711)

Simple: More desirable applications for home users are ported to Android/Linux than to GNU/Linux.

Bring start menu back with Windows 9 (1)

Billly Gates (198444) | about 9 months ago | (#45815503)

Then we can run Metro apps with classical win32 apps side by side.

Why is this so hard?

It doesn't make sense for OEMs to do this unless ... unless of course the Windows 8 ecosystem is so overly optimized for touch that it is painful for anything else.

MacOSX has the right idea of allowing some IOS apps inside MacOSX.

All this shows is how out of touch MS is and how desperate OEMs are afraid of the tablet. Windows 9 needs to come out quick.

the tablet UI does not work on big screens (1)

Joe_Dragon (2206452) | about 9 months ago | (#45815609)

When you have app full screen on 15"+ screens.

also app store lock in will not work in the desktop / pro market even apple does not lock down mac os that way. But MS is trying it with RT

Re:the tablet UI does not work on big screens (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815789)

You wont have full screen apps in Windows 9 if rumors are true [neowin.net] .

They will have the x button and can be minimized back under the dock just like Windows 7. They will run side by side if you have a mouse and a non touch screen which if MS did at first maybe just maybe people would leave XP and buy a new computer.

Hence why the decline. After seeing them you ask yourself maybe your phone is fine for browsing, facebooking, and checking weather and XP is still good enough when you need to type a resume or sales flyer at home. Why change to that abmoniation?

Windroy? (1)

Rinisari (521266) | about 9 months ago | (#45815575)

Windroy? [socketeq.com]

Microsoft Windows 8 is the cause (1)

mtthwbrnd (1608651) | about 9 months ago | (#45815603)

Microsoft Windows 8 is a piece of crap. There is no other word to use. Windows 7 was awesome - and so Microsoft ditched it! It is the same with Youtube. Youtube was very good, and then Google came along with its stupid Google+ that hardly anybody wants and even fewer understand, and they completely buggered it up. The reasons people are turning to Android are: 1. Apple is too expensive. 2. Windows 8 is a piece of crap. 3. Windows 7 is no longer installed on new machines. 4. Linux is still not easy enough to use for most people.

Double the OSs... (1)

Daniel Hoffmann (2902427) | about 9 months ago | (#45815631)

...double the crapware

davlik ported to windows? (4, Informative)

strstr (539330) | about 9 months ago | (#45815645)

Most Andriod apps are not native ARM apps, but Java / bytecode which run in a virtual machine called davlik. Port that to Windows / x64, and suddenly all the Android apps run in Windows. The Android environment itself could be emulated in Windows or tied to replacement functions like the Windows desktop in the new platform (instead of a phone/tablet interface).

Windows is POSIX compliant and supports Unix if they chose the route of emulating unix functions, or they could build their own environment like cygwin/etc. It doesn't need this, but some apps might need something like it if it exposed the underlying unix features. It depends on how they wanted to implment it, cause it could also just wrap over to the Windows environment..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dalvik_(software) [wikipedia.org]

laugh (1)

koan (80826) | about 9 months ago | (#45815743)

PC+ Twice the exploits twice the bugs.

Solutions Looking for Problems Usually Suck (1)

linearz69 (3473163) | about 9 months ago | (#45815775)

This makes no sense.

From everyone I've talked with, the biggest, most obvious failures of Windows 8 are:
1. Removal of the start menu
2. The misguided idea that a PC needs "apps".

So the idea is to go to a second operating system (VM, Dual Boot?) that doesn't have a start menu, with apps designed for mobile platform? This just seems like bad marketing

Assuming I'm using a Windows machine, If I want to run an Android app on a windows PC, I'll just install Android SDK.

Why scare MS? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#45815783)

Hell, I bet MS orchestrated this! Windows 8 PC/Tablets aren't selling.

MS:"Hey, buy this! It runs Windows 8 and Android!"
Consumer: "OK. I'll try it."
(a month later)
Consumer: "This is great! I can run all my Android apps without a hiccup! I didn't like Windows 8 before but now I'm getting used to it."
(a month later)
Consumer: "At first, the Windows 8 apps sucked and there weren't that many. It's starting to pick up now."
(six months later)
Consumer: "I rarely use Android apps now. I've replaced them all with Windows 8 equivalents."

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