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Valve Offers Free Subscription To Debian Developers: Paying It Forward

samzenpus posted about 8 months ago | from the a-little-something-for-you dept.

Debian 205

sfcrazy writes "Valve Software, the makers of Steam OS, is already winning praise from the larger free and open source community – mainly because of their pro-community approach. Now the company is 'giving back' to Debian by offering free subscription to Debian developers. This subscription will offer full access to current and future games produced by Valve. Since Steam OS is based on Debian GNU/Linux it's a nice way for Valve to say 'thank you' to Debian developers."

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OK... (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46052649)

and now nothing will get done.
This is obviously effort to thwart Debian.

Re:OK... (-1)

Pav (4298) | about 8 months ago | (#46053539)

Yeah, you're being facetious, but Debian is the one distro that is still strong on open source principles. This is an uncomfortable development, and it's a step too far IMHO. The non-free repo has been contentious, but it has been argued that it's required eg. unfree firmware to get uncooperative hardware working. Gradually other software has been creeping in, and now this proposition to ship DRM! Games are just psychological cotton candy - addictive empty calories : pay us money, solve this lab-rat maze, and we'll say how awesome you are. There are other distros (Ubuntu, Mint etc...) which were built for this kind of thing so people can still get their cotton candy. Debian has a purpose though, and this compromises that purpose.

Re:OK... (5, Insightful)

bug1 (96678) | about 8 months ago | (#46053637)

Games are one of the oldest and most powerful learning systems we have. Computer games obviously lose the physical benefit of RL game,s but they still have mental benefits.

They can teach Logic, promote social skills (as compared to TV), and can be good emotionally just ot blow of some steam.

I understand the drama with debian and non-free games, but surely you can seperate the two concepts.

Re:OK... (4, Insightful)

hairyfeet (841228) | about 8 months ago | (#46053687)

This is something that personally bugs the shit out of me.....tell me EXACTLY how YOUR freedom is being blocked by having CHOICE in the matter? Nobody is holding a gun to your head, nobody is making you use non free anything, so why should those that want it have to jump through flaming fucking hoops just because it doesn't follow YOUR personal feelings on the subject?

Why is those that are supposedly "for" freedom damned near ALWAYS translate to "free to be like me and do what I like?".

Re:OK... (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46053865)

The FOSS nutjobs don't want to allow you the freedom to give up a particular freedom of your choice for a particular time in exchange for something. They are selfish, they want to propagate their ideology of "freedom" by restricting your freedom of choice.

Here we go again. (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46053987)

Well, you are welcome not to participate in our 'freedom'.

We own what we write. We license what we own as we see fit.

So ya. Fuck you very much. Feel free to ask for your money back, you selfish, mother fucking, father sucking asshole.

Re:Here we go again. (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46054007)

Well, you are welcome not to participate in our 'freedom'.

I dont.

We own what we write. We license what we own as we see fit.

Do whatever you want, unlike you I dont feel the need to impose my ideology on other people. I use free software intertwined with proprietary software and there aint a thing you can do about it. My freedom to make my own choices, not yours so you can stop your bitching :P

Re:OK... (4, Interesting)

Pav (4298) | about 8 months ago | (#46053903)

There are plenty of non-free choices... not so many free. I'd like to keep my little free sandbox thanks. Why do you want to take it from me? Obviously many feel the same way or else Debian wouldn't have such a vital community, and perhaps it follows that one of the historical reasons for this vital community is its philosophy and relatively uncompromising attitude (though too compromising for RMS apparently). I have contributed to Debian, though granted in very small ways, and frankly I'd be less motivated with the community soured and schitzophrenic with concerns completely unrelated to the Debian core mission [debian.org] . I have a friend who has abandoned desktop BSD because the community around it as collapsed after Apples involvement... I really don't want to see RMS being right AGAIN, this time about Debian not being strict enough.

Agreed. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46053995)

I once had the idea that adding money to Debian would be a good thing. I had an argument with someone that argued that it will only corrupt and destroy the project.

You are correct. RMS is correct. The person I argued with was correct.

I was wrong. Freedom and commerce do not mix.

Re:OK... (0, Flamebait)

chmod a+x mojo (965286) | about 8 months ago | (#46054023)

Yeah, because steam et al. are right there forcing you to install them on your system aren't they.

By the way, Debian, at it's core, strives to be the "Universal OS"- kind of hard to be that when your users aren't so much as "allowed" to install those "horribad" non-free things.
Even if the Debian team removed the self hosted non-free repos and let developers host it off site, how do you trust the packages? Who do you think would get the blame if any unsavory packages made it into the repos?
There would be egg on Debians face no matter what, after all Debian devs where hosting the site.

FOSS stuff is cool, it's awesome that if you want you can release your stuff for others to work on. But RMS can design an open sourced spoon to eat my ass when it comes to his rabid idealism that that is how the world absolutely has to be.

Re:OK... (1)

bzipitidoo (647217) | about 8 months ago | (#46054019)

Freedom is not an absolute. Your freedoms end where others' begin. You are not free to enslave people, deny education to women as the Taliban wants to do, recklessly endanger property and lives, litter, trespass, and so on.

In this case, should vendors have the "freedom" to keep customers and users in the dark? That's why we still don't have good open source drivers for some vendors' products. Nice DRM is no better than nice slavery.

Giving up our natural right and ability to share knowledge with one another is far too high a price to pay in order to restrict transfers of knowledge to approved pay channels. If we did that, we might as well abandon democracy, as one of its requirements, public education, is a huge sharing of knowledge that is being done to the detriment of commercial interests' opportunity to profit. The money they make off of textbooks in no way matches the value of an education. Children should pay more, and should be taught not to steal! The alphabet itself is a subversive tool that allows people to write letters and steal from phone companies!

Re:OK... (3, Interesting)

mwvdlee (775178) | about 8 months ago | (#46054163)

In this case, should vendors have the "freedom" to keep customers and users in the dark?

Yes. They do.
I don't like it, but that's what "freedom" means; not being able to force others to do as you'd like.
The problem here isn't vendors being evil, it's customers paying them to be evil then complaining about it.

Re:OK... (3, Informative)

tlhIngan (30335) | about 8 months ago | (#46054031)

This is something that personally bugs the shit out of me.....tell me EXACTLY how YOUR freedom is being blocked by having CHOICE in the matter? Nobody is holding a gun to your head, nobody is making you use non free anything, so why should those that want it have to jump through flaming fucking hoops just because it doesn't follow YOUR personal feelings on the subject?

Why is those that are supposedly "for" freedom damned near ALWAYS translate to "free to be like me and do what I like?".

Except Debian tends to be one of the more Free distributions out there - turning down a LOT of stuff.

In fact, it's why Ubuntu was created - Debian is a great distribution with very powerful open and free beliefs. Even when they get in the way of users. Ubuntu forked Debian, trying to apply a more "user-centric" view by adding appropriate non-free stuff to create something that users expect - including stuff like non-free codecs and such that users expect, and Debian lacks on purpose.

Hell, the non-free repos are barely tolerated.

Re:OK... (4, Informative)

Sun (104778) | about 8 months ago | (#46054161)

I'll just add that Debian split the non-free stuff into a separate repository, not enabled by default. Not only are you free not to install non-free software, you get an easy way of making sure that non-free doesn't creep in by mistake.

Shachar

Re:OK... (2)

Sun (104778) | about 8 months ago | (#46054157)

and now this proposition to ship DRM!

No one is talking about shipping DRM as part of Debian (or even in non-free). Valve isn't talking about shipping its games inside Debian. Their games are proprietary, cost money, and contain DRM, and at least the last two make them technically incompatible with the Debian distribution system.

What Valve is offering is for Debian developers to get, free of charge, a Steam subscription to play (almost) all of Valve games. Assuming you are not a Debian developer, you will not see any actual difference in Debian.

Personally, I'm a bit ambivalent on whether to take them up on that offer. All of my proprietary games have come from The Humble Bundle [humblebundle.com] and are DRM free. I do not even have Steam installed, and am not eager to install it. I am, however, curious to see what games are available. Add to that the original commenter's comment, humorous though it was meant to be: I'm not taking a good enough care of my FOSS projects as it is.

Either way, however, this is something for Debian developers to use, not something that affects Debian itself.

Shachar

This is a Triumph (5, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46052653)

I'm making a note here: HUGE SUCCESS

Re:This is a Triumph (3, Interesting)

AlphaWolf_HK (692722) | about 8 months ago | (#46053031)

Could be...for Valve, though that's not a bad thing. I'm not even angry; I'm being so sincere right now.

If the debian developers were more interested in something consumer focused like games, then Linux could have a better chance at entering the consumer space (whereas right now it is mostly enterprise focused.) Free games that work with the thing you created isn't a bad way to attract that.

Re: This is a Triumph (4, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46053087)

instead of free games, THEy should offer free food, something like CAKE. this IS A great way to attract linux coders, not gonna LIE.

Re:This is a Triumph (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46054079)

Listen, Valve, we're supposed to be finding reasons to HATE you! We've got STANDARDS here at Slashdot, damnit! You're not making this easy on us!

Nothing to say, just... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46052655)

*Applause*

5 years later ... (5, Funny)

TrollstonButterbeans (2914995) | about 8 months ago | (#46052657)

Q: Why did Debian development stop?
A: The entire development team was given dozens of free video games.

Re:5 years later ... (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46052947)

Anon: Man, that joke is funny!

Crowd: HOW FUNNY IS IT?

Anon: So funny that its reddit points spilled over to slashdot a day after it was posted!

Now all we need is rolling release (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46052671)

Unstable is just another word for "typical software update schedule"

Re:Now all we need is rolling release (4, Informative)

Trepidity (597) | about 8 months ago | (#46052687)

Debian unstable is the rolling release. Debian testing is a slightly more conservative rolling release, with updates screened mostly automatically. Stable is for people who want a manually "release-managed" approach with multi-year support lifetime.

Typo in list.debian.org link (5, Informative)

Oliver_Etchebarne (647762) | about 8 months ago | (#46052697)

There is a extra 'v' in the link. The real link is https://lists.debian.org/debia... [debian.org]

Too late (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46053123)

Beaten by one minute [slashdot.org] Thou shalt be awarded no points. May god have mercy on your soul.

last straw (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46052707)

auto-playing ads with audio? I'm out of here.

Re:last straw (1)

tepples (727027) | about 8 months ago | (#46052779)

I didn't see or hear an auto-playing ad. But then I use the Flashblock extension for Firefox, so advertisers have to keep it static to reach me.

Re:last straw (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46052887)

I seemed to get two audio tracks playing at once (with only one tab open in the browser).

Re:last straw (0)

monkeyhybrid (1677192) | about 8 months ago | (#46052923)

You say you're out of here but I bet I see you, Anonymous Coward, posting here again.

The amount of BS here is legendary: (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46052769)

"Valve Software, the makers of Steam OS, is already winning praise from the larger free and open source community â" mainly because of their pro-community approach"

Love to see how the new SlashAds is going...

Re:The amount of BS here is legendary: (3, Insightful)

dcooper_db9 (1044858) | about 8 months ago | (#46053019)

Somehow I lost my rating points between loading the page and reading your post. Sorry I couldn't mod you up.

In the future we're going to have locked down devices running proprietary drivers, with proprietary apps and DRM'd content. But it'll run on open-source software. And the community is happy because "we finally got the manufacturers to write drivers for Linux".

And the free game was nice too.

So only a small subset of people get this (-1, Flamebait)

Khyber (864651) | about 8 months ago | (#46052793)

Why should we give a fuck?

This applies to *almost* nobody on this site. Why should we care? The rest of us don't exactly gain from it, we don't get negatively impacted by it, there are more important things that could possibly be more interesting and relevant news for us.

But no, Slashdot has gone full sellout, Malda has gone full Reddit.

Fucking useless.

Re: So only a small subset of people get this (1)

SpectreBlofeld (886224) | about 8 months ago | (#46052813)

It means the state of gaming on Linux will improve.

Re:So only a small subset of people get this (4, Insightful)

Anonymous Freak (16973) | about 8 months ago | (#46052853)

WHINE WHINE WHINE I DIDN'T GET ANY WHINE WHINE WHINE

This is news because it is someone giving free stuff to open source developers!

Solely as a thank you for being developers that helped them succeed.

Re:So only a small subset of people get this (1)

Pav (4298) | about 8 months ago | (#46053413)

It's still worth being uncomfortable about though. Closed is not what Debian is about... it's the ONLY major distro that makes a central point of keeping strong to its open source principles.

Re:So only a small subset of people get this (1)

tepples (727027) | about 8 months ago | (#46053447)

Debian [is] the ONLY major distro that makes a central point of keeping strong to its open source principles.

Richard Stallman disagrees, primarily because non-free exists. Besides, how does Fedora compromise free software principles?

Re:So only a small subset of people get this (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46053709)

Stallman isn't the only one who defines what Open source principles are.

Re:So only a small subset of people get this (1)

exomondo (1725132) | about 8 months ago | (#46053907)

open source != free software

Re:So only a small subset of people get this (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46053771)

You think Valve is giving the Debian dudes a shitload of free proprietary software out of the goodness of their heart? Obviously they want Debian to be more "Valve Friendly" i.e. closed source crapola friendly. If you want to play video games buy a fuckin' xbox.

Re:So only a small subset of people get this (1)

ButchDeLoria (2772751) | about 8 months ago | (#46054159)

Buying an Xbox Telescreen is worse for freedom than proprietary software.

Re:Switch to Debian Distro, The (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46053235)

Incentive to become Debian Developers...

A wise move.... (4, Insightful)

Dega704 (1454673) | about 8 months ago | (#46052797)

Not just because this builds rapport with the community, but also because debian developers playing lots of Valve games will be debian developers with lots of firsthand exposure to any bugs or areas that could be improved; and the best work often comes from someone scratching a personal itch. Valve plays the game well (no pun intended).

Developer approval (4, Interesting)

tepples (727027) | about 8 months ago | (#46052823)

But Debian's approval process for developers [debian.org] might get swamped by people trying to gain Debian Developer status just for the free games.

Re:Developer approval (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46052869)

Look at it from the bright side - they might actually get some qualified applications as well. Maybe..

Re:Developer approval (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46053119)

which begs the question: Who is considered a developer?

I have contributed hundreds of thousands of lines of code to debian but I'm not officially a Debian "developer"... Fuck me I guess. It's us wall-flowers doing all the actual work that get shafted.

Re:Developer approval (1, Informative)

tepples (727027) | about 8 months ago | (#46053217)

which begs the question: Who is considered a developer?

1. Raises. 2. The page I linked answers your question. It appears that first you must get on an airplane and meet an existing Debian developer in person to get your key signed.

Re:Developer approval (2)

petermgreen (876956) | about 8 months ago | (#46053883)

It appears that first you must get on an airplane

Whether an airplane is needed rather depends on where you live. In your case it looks like a car would suffice.

https://wiki.debian.org/Keysig... [debian.org]

wrong premise (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46053333)

Contributions are irrelevant, it's how well you put up with the hazing that gets you into the fraternity.

Thanks! unit tests, naming standards, documentatio (4, Insightful)

raymorris (2726007) | about 8 months ago | (#46053645)

Thanks for contributing! I've contributed very little code directly to Debian, but it may well be like some open source projects where developers are expected to spend ten times as much time on a feature than it takes to submit a patch.

In Moodle, for example, I added a feature that took about two hours to develop a working patch. Just before submitting the patch, I became an official developer. Seven MONTHS later I was done with that two hour patch. First, I needed to document the proposal for the new feature, then get (documented) community feedback. I had to apply a huge list of style rules to the patch, covering things like variable naming standards, whitespace, etc. Then I needed the component owner to review it. He pointed out that while it complied with the CURRENT standards, it didn't use the newly developed APIs that were chosen for the upcoming release. I recoded it to use the upcoming standards, and some design changes the component owner wanted. This process involved rebasing against master at several times - any time someone else needed to look at it. The new feature required very minor tweaks to some existing classes. Since I had touched those classes, I needed to update those old classes to the new coding standards as well. Then the integrator pointed out I was missing the suites of unit tests, etc.

In all, a two hour patch submission turns out to be 80 hours when you do all of the "official developer" stuff like unit tests and all. So that's one distinction between a developer, who is on the hook for all of that stuff vs. a contributor who graciously submits code.

Please understand I'm in no way devaluing any contributions. For most open source projects, I contribute patches only. I now have a new appreciation for the committed developers who do the grinding work required to have my code integrated into a high quality project.

Ps - a LOT of what I mentioned above are tasks a non-programmer or newbie programmer can help with, if anyone is looking for ways to contribute to projects you enjoy or are interested in.

Re:Developer approval (5, Informative)

petermgreen (876956) | about 8 months ago | (#46053861)

which begs the question: Who is considered a developer?

Debian Developer is a well defined status with full upload rights and voting rights. The application process is also documented but well basically it consists of

1: get your key signed by a couple of existing debian developers (in a pinch one debian developer and one
2: find an existing dd to advocate for you
3: make your application
4: wait to be assigned an application manager
5: go through a questioning/testing process with the application manager
6: wait for final approval, account creations etc from front desk, DAM and keyring maint

Nowadays it's generally reccomended to go for the lower status of "Debian Maintainer" (restricted upload rights, no voting rights) first and then move on to applying for Debian Developer (I went straight to DD myself so it IS still possible to go directly in the right circumstances but it's not considered the normal route anymore).

The process of becoming a Debian Developer can take quite some time both in terms of overall process length and the ammount you will have to learn about debian and the contributions you will have to demonstrate you have made to pass it. If you are serious about contributing to Debian then it's worth it, if you are just doing it for the handful of goodies (the ones i'm aware of are lwn subscription, ghandi.net hosting discount, and now valve games) that are given out debian developers then you are wasting your time.

Re:A wise move.... (1)

Bovius (1243040) | about 8 months ago | (#46052859)

Agreed. I'm sure internally, Valve deals with the same circus of foibles that every other tech company sees. But externally, looking at their overarching business strategy, it's really satisfying to see them playing the long game, and knowing that in all probability the PC gaming market will continue to benefit from their efforts.

"Rewarding" free software with non-free software (0, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46052815)

So a proprietary software company perhaps best known for their DRM system is "winning praise" from the "larger free and open source community"? Really?

And now Debian developers (who ostensibly care about software freedom) are being "rewarded" with some proprietary software at no charge. Stay classy, Valve.

Re:"Rewarding" free software with non-free softwar (5, Informative)

Thantik (1207112) | about 8 months ago | (#46052863)

Cough cough: http://linux.slashdot.org/stor... [slashdot.org]

Re:"Rewarding" free software with non-free softwar (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46052965)

Do you know what license they will be using for VOGL? The linked articles don't seem to specify.

Re:"Rewarding" free software with non-free softwar (1)

mikesart (230178) | about 8 months ago | (#46053699)

Do you know what license they will be using for VOGL?

We're going to use the same license as APITrace: https://github.com/apitrace/apitrace/blob/master/LICENSE

Re:"Rewarding" free software with non-free softwar (1)

period3 (94751) | about 8 months ago | (#46053513)

The linked article says 'unspecified open source license'. Not all open source licenses are free (as in libre). Even if it is free, it doesn't change the fact that Valve primarily makes non-free software.

Re:"Rewarding" free software with non-free softwar (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46053603)

Did you know that slashdot is also not fully opensource compliant? Better stop using it.

Re: "Rewarding" free software with non-free softwa (1)

drunk_punk (2841507) | about 8 months ago | (#46053657)

Nothing more than a nicely baited hook...

Re:"Rewarding" free software with non-free softwar (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46052903)

The games do not have to be DRMed and many are not. If you dont' want to play the DRMed ones then don't but don't try to tell everyone else what to play. Some of us want more choice.

Re:"Rewarding" free software with non-free softwar (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46052937)

Valve would do much, much better IMHO if they donated to Debian, both in code and money. Giving away (prorietary, as you correctly point out) video games may be nice, but is useless.

I doubt many of the active developers for Debian have much time to play video games, anyway.

Re:"Rewarding" free software with non-free softwar (2)

msobkow (48369) | about 8 months ago | (#46053233)

I expect the tweaks and changes they've had to make have been or will be posted upstream in due time. Who would want to keep applying patches instead of submitting them to the source projects for integration?

Re:"Rewarding" free software with non-free softwar (2)

Razordude (3505695) | about 8 months ago | (#46053473)

People like you are really, really unpleasant to be around. Just seeing the negative in anything and everything.

What's required to be recognised as a Debian dev? (1)

monkeyhybrid (1677192) | about 8 months ago | (#46052905)

The announcement on the mailing list says that developers need to send a signed email (signed with a key in the Debian keyring) to the Valve contact to request a redemption code. So my question is, what does it take to be recognised by Debian as a developer and get your key added to their keyring? Is this just for core Debian coders, or do documentation authors, package maintainers, etc, count too? This could be a great incentive for more people to get involved with the more mundane tasks that people usually shy away from, although if it's that easy, it would be ripe for abuse too.

Re:What's required to be recognised as a Debian de (1)

monkeyhybrid (1677192) | about 8 months ago | (#46052935)

Looks like tepples comment [slashdot.org] answers my question. The Debian New Member process is outlined here [debian.org] .

Re:What's required to be recognised as a Debian de (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46052987)

It is also open to debian maintainers and others who have their key as part of the debian keyrings.

It is generally a reasonable amount of effort to become even a Debian Maintainer, you have to have:

1. had your key signed by 2 debian developers,
2. declared your intent to become a Debian Maintainer and agreement with the various document (debian free software guidelines, social contract etc), and
3. been "adovcated" by a debian developer, where a debian developer familiar with your work describes it and recommends you.

This implies that you have been doing some work in some capacity for awhile and have been able to get a developer to advocate for you.

It is more work again to become a fully fledged Debian Developer.

Re:What's required to be recognised as a Debian de (1)

petermgreen (876956) | about 8 months ago | (#46053947)

It is also open to debian maintainers

Hmm, the announcement on Debian-devel-announce only mentioned Debian Developers not Debian Maintainers.

Re:What's required to be recognised as a Debian de (1)

Narcocide (102829) | about 8 months ago | (#46052995)

Note: "Debian Developer" != "any developer who uses/contributes to debian"

Don't expect to be able to achieve full DD status within the year. In order to become a DD (Debian Developer) I believe you typically also have to have been a DM (Debian Maintainer) for at least 6 months prior. Candidates are fairly thoroughly screened and trained. There is a mentoring process and everything [debian.org] .

For more information you can ask in #debian-mentors on irc.debian.org (irc.oftc.net) but I wouldn't recommend going there until you've done some research by first googling up and reading the information about the process and its requirements that are posted on debian.org. They don't have a lot of patience for people who refuse to do the recommended reading. They generally expect you're smart enough to know there IS recommended reading and go looking for it first before you ask for a personalized answer to your questions.

Re:What's required to be recognised as a Debian de (1)

vux984 (928602) | about 8 months ago | (#46053049)

I'm guessing its not that big of a deal.

Steam itself is free. And how many valve games are there actually? 2 left for deads, 2 portals, and the half-life/counterstrike series? Anyone who wants those can pick them up for 75% off during any of their many sales... its what $20 or 30 bucks worth of games tops?

Not to diminish the act, or my appreciation of Valve's recognition of the Debian developer team... but I can't really see a FLOOD of people trying to get on the debian development team over a few games, most of which they probably already have.

Re:What's required to be recognised as a Debian de (1)

petermgreen (876956) | about 8 months ago | (#46053981)

You missed DOTA 2, Day of defeat, team fortress classic and deathmatch classic (granted you might consider some of those part of the "half life/counterstrike series").

When I look on steam the "valve complete pack" currently costs £50. Of course if you wait for a sale you can probablly pick it up much cheaper than that.

Re:What's required to be recognised as a Debian de (1)

vux984 (928602) | about 8 months ago | (#46054039)

You missed DOTA 2, Day of defeat, team fortress classic and deathmatch classic (granted you might consider some of those part of the "half life/counterstrike series").

You don't exactly have to be a debian developer to get Dota2 or TFC for free.

The other two titles you mentioned are pretty minor, and usually obtained via a bundle anyway.

When I look on steam the "valve complete pack" currently costs £50.

And if you buy during any of the regular sales you can pick up everything Valve offers for 75% off... so ... £12.50 give or take.

Should have said "Rewarding with HL3" (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46052989)

Would it be a troll or would it really happen?

Re:Should have said "Rewarding with HL3" (1)

RyuuzakiTetsuya (195424) | about 8 months ago | (#46053225)

If I were a Debian developer I'd insert a logic bomb that hosed SteamOS until Valve gave in.

Tragedy of the commons, perhaps. I JUST WANT TO KNOW WHAT HAPPENED TO FUCKING BARNEY

Re:Should have said "Rewarding with HL3" (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46053885)

The bundle being given *does* include future Valve games.

Something to be Steamed about (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46053005)

Valve Software, the makers of Steam OS, is already winning praise from the larger free and open source community – mainly because of their pro-community approach.

Richard Stallman would be rolling over in his grave if he were dead. Luckily, he's still here to insist it be called "The GNU/Steam OS".

The FOSS community is praising this move? (0, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46053167)

"...winning praise from the larger free and open source community"

OK, I use Linux foremost because it's open source. I use Linux also due the excellent GNU userland. That being said, why the hell should the open source community praise Valve for bringing proprietrary software to its most famous platform? If I wanted to use Steam, I would have left used my laptop's Windows key to install to my desktop. The fact is that an addition of proprietary software to a largely open ecosystem is not a benefit, but a threat. If Valve drives more people to Linux, it will only be under a banner proclaiming to developers that proprietary software is OK. Mind you, I think it is ethically OK, but it's not what I want, nor, do I believe, it is what the "larger free and open source community" wants. This statement that the FOSS is praising Valve sends out the message that the FOSS community wants another Windows or Mac OS, i.e. another operating system with a great amount of support by proprietary software vendors. That is not what the FOSS community is about.

Re: The FOSS community is praising this move? (1)

Scowler (667000) | about 8 months ago | (#46053265)

Name a bigger, more effective distributor of non-DRM FOSS games compared to Steam.

Free Textures Foundation? Free Meshes Foundation? (1)

tepples (727027) | about 8 months ago | (#46053393)

why the hell should the open source community praise Valve for bringing proprietrary software to its most famous platform?

For one thing, video games help ease the transition to a free platform. For another, video games by their nature are going to be proprietary [pineight.com] because there isn't currently as much of a reciprocal sharing mentality around the components of a video game other than code (meshes, textures, maps, audio, and the like) as there is around code.

Re:Free Textures Foundation? Free Meshes Foundatio (2)

Arker (91948) | about 8 months ago | (#46053873)

That's fine, no one is expecting them to publish the art portion of the game under a free license. It would be nice to get the actual code, but that is not the problem here either. What makes this a farce is the Digital Restrictions Management. Once I buy the game I should be able to run it without running another binary that I cannot audit or even relink and whose professed function - communicating with Valve and possibly preventing me from doing what I want with my computer if they do not send the right response - is inimical to my own interests.

If I paid for the program I should be able to install and run it on my gaming pc - which is quite deliberately NOT connectable to the internet. I will sneaker-net patches that are needed, but why on earth would I sneaker-net in a program whose only function will be to try to phone home over and over with obviously no response, and eventually effect a hostile take-over of my computer to prevent me from paying the game I bought and paid for?

Re:Free Textures Foundation? Free Meshes Foundatio (1)

PrimaryConsult (1546585) | about 8 months ago | (#46053977)

If your gaming PC does not connect to the internet, I'm guessing you don't do much multiplayer...

That said: Steam's DRM is the least evil of them all, since it lets you re-download your games on any PC, anywhere as long as you remember your password. The "freedom" to not care if my gigs of games are wiped out in a hard drive failure, to copy the steam directory as-is to any PC on the same architecture and being able to straight up play, and to arbitrarily delete game files if I temporarily need the space is far more important to me than the freedom to look at arbitrary code.

I've heard Stallman speak, and he does make sense: if a program isn't behaving the way you want, the freedom to go in and correct that is very important towards reducing your stress while making your tasks easier. However, games by their very nature are unnecessary for getting actual work done. If you don't agree with a game's licensing, etc, you will never be forced to use it. Conversely, how many people are forced to use Microsoft Office every day?

This is a "choose your battles" scenario. Either 1) let Valve attract more people to Debian for desktop use. They'll play their closed source games when bored, and use the open source productivity software to get actual work done. Or, 2) fight them on this, they take their ball and go home, and the people they would have attracted continue to regard the FOSS movement as a bunch of loons that like to look gift horses in the mouth.

Re:The FOSS community is praising this move? (4, Insightful)

Microlith (54737) | about 8 months ago | (#46053469)

why the hell should the open source community praise Valve for bringing proprietrary software to its most famous platform?

Because if anything is going to bring users to Linux it'll be games. Games are what tie me to Windows, and I'd be more interested in testing Wine on my existing library if I can get my newest games out of the (proverbial) box on Linux.

The fact is that an addition of proprietary software to a largely open ecosystem is not a benefit, but a threat.

Not as much of a threat as Microsoft's exclusive ownership of the PC gaming world.

This statement that the FOSS is praising Valve sends out the message that the FOSS community wants another Windows or Mac OS, i.e. another operating system with a great amount of support by proprietary software vendors. That is not what the FOSS community is about.

Please stop talking as if the "FOSS community" was a unified front. I would love to move to a FOSS operating system if I could still play my proprietary games on it. Valve may actually give me a chance.

Re:The FOSS community is praising this move? (2)

Arker (91948) | about 8 months ago | (#46053671)

You're right, the FOSS community doesnt give two squirts about this.

Valve does, however, and they would very much like you to as well. If they can generate a little buzz and fool you into thinking you should be 'praising' them for this then their marketing folks have done their job.

Ain't nothing wrong with free (1)

PopeRatzo (965947) | about 8 months ago | (#46053195)

Mark my words: When the Xbone and Paystation 4 are historical artifacts, there will be young people playing games on their Steam Boxes, most likely Hotline:Miami VII.

And then a meteor will hit earth and nobody will be playing anything.

Seriously, Steam Box will overtake the other gaming platforms. Plus, you can dual-boot and get work done. We will look at the consoles of 2013 approximately the way we look at the Dreamcast.

Re:Ain't nothing wrong with free (1)

Riddler Sensei (979333) | about 8 months ago | (#46053397)

We will look at the consoles of 2013 approximately the way we look at the Dreamcast.

With a sudden, and overwhelming, desire to find a copy of Power Stone?

Platform fighting (1)

tepples (727027) | about 8 months ago | (#46053409)

We will look at the consoles of 2013 approximately the way we look at the Dreamcast.

With a sudden, and overwhelming, desire to find a copy of Power Stone?

Does Super Smash Bros. or Custom Robo come closer to carrying on the platform fighting legacy of Power Stone?

Re:Ain't nothing wrong with free (1)

tepples (727027) | about 8 months ago | (#46053401)

We will look at the consoles of 2013 approximately the way we look at the Dreamcast.

You mean as a set-top gaming device that allowed running homebrew with just a CD burner and no modchip?

Freeware with DRM (0, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46053209)

Closed source software with phone-home DRM. This is the antithesis of what Debian stands for. Maybe offer them a free trial of MS Office while you're at it?

The free software community isn't praising this... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46053425)

The people who actually understand what free software is and isn't aren't praising this. While the software may be less restrictive (less DRM) than the alternatives it's not free software by any stretch of the imagination. It's not good for us or the community. It brings in more non-free software and creates more problems. It's not just an ethical issue. It's a technical issue as well which is almost always overlooked by both free software proponents and 'open source' proponents. It's underhanded tactic by valve and distracts the larger community from the goals of the free software community. People who are 'open source' proponents tend to advocate for non-free software and are the ones supporting this.

“Free software” means software that respects users' freedom and community. Roughly, it means that the users have the freedom to run, copy, distribute, study, change and improve the software. Certainly you have none of this with valves software or the games distributed via it.

So who funds Free games? (1)

tepples (727027) | about 8 months ago | (#46053459)

You appear to suggest that video games instead be developed as free software and free cultural works. So who will feed and shelter developers of Free video games with production values comparable to the proprietary games of 2013?

Re:So who funds Free games? (2)

Arker (91948) | about 8 months ago | (#46053663)

Try to remember that we are talking about Free as in Freedom, not free as in beer.

No one is expected to work for free. But we want to pay them with money, rather than with our rights.

Re:So who funds Free games? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46053863)

Your "rights"? Fuck you. You have no "rights" to my work. You have the right to take my terms or leave them. You have the right to release your own work however you want, but to talk about your "rights" to other peoples work is disgusting.

Fair but interesting fact... (1)

Crass Spektakel (4597) | about 8 months ago | (#46053599)

This is a fair offer but as an interesting fact, you could have gotten the Valve complete pack from a russian reseller for as low as 6-9 TF2 keys = 15 Dollar all day long.

http://store.steampowered.com/... [steampowered.com]
http://www.steamprices.com/us/... [steamprices.com]

Re:Fair but interesting fact... (1)

ArbitraryName (3391191) | about 8 months ago | (#46053867)

Good luck activating and keeping Russian keys on US accounts.

Paying It Forward? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46053773)

You help me, I help you -> Paying it back.
You help me, I help them -> Paying it forward.

Am I getting this right?

I Still Don't Understand (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46053807)

I still don't understand why Steam has to be so Debian/Ubuntu-specific. Why could it not have been developed in a distro-agnostic manner?

Re:I Still Don't Understand (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46054113)

I still don't understand why Steam has to be so Debian/Ubuntu-specific. Why could it not have been developed in a distro-agnostic manner?

Because Debian is about the only Linux distro that doesn't suck giant sweaty gorilla balls.

forward? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46053971)

isn't that paying back, not forward?

is it just that saying "pay forward" is so much cooler, we must now use that phrase to mean its opposite?

Pay them (1)

S Tan (3418641) | about 8 months ago | (#46054091)

Thanks Valve. Now we won't have any Debian developers because they will be too busy playing games. Why don't you give them something of worth.

But (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 8 months ago | (#46054119)

We need those developers coding rather than playing games. Oh wait, I guess if their code is compiling.

Also, where do I sign up to be a debian developer. ;-)

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