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Welcome to the Slashdot Beta site -- learn more here. Use the link in the footer or click here to return to the Classic version of Slashdot.

Thank you!

Before you choose to head back to the Classic look of the site, we'd appreciate it if you share your thoughts on the Beta; your feedback is what drives our ongoing development.

Beta is different and we value you taking the time to try it out. Please take a look at the changes we've made in Beta and  learn more about it. Thanks for reading, and for making the site better!

Graphene Conducts Electricity Ten Times Better Than Expected

Soulskill posted about 9 months ago | from the keeping-you-current-on-graphene dept.

Science 161

ananyo writes "Physicists have produced nanoribbons of graphene — the single-atom-thick carbon — that conduct electrons better than theory predicted even for the most idealized form of the material (abstract). The finding could help graphene realize its promise in high-end electronics, where researchers have long hoped it could outperform traditional materials such as silicon. In graphene, electrons can move faster than in any other material at room temperature. But techniques that cut sheets of graphene into the narrow ribbons needed to form wires of a nano-scale circuit leave ragged edges, which disrupt the electron flow. Now a team led by physicist Walt de Heer at the Georgia Institute of Technology in Atlanta has made ribbons that conduct electric charges for more than 10 micrometres without meeting resistance — 1,000 times farther than in typical graphene nanoribbons. The ribbons made by de Heer's team in fact conduct electrons ten times better than standard theories of electron transport they should, say the authors."

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fUCK BETA (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186221)

Please post this to new articles if it hasn't been posted yet. (Copy-paste the html from here [pastebin.com] so links don't get mangled!)

On February 5, 2014, Slashdot announced through a javascript popup that they are starting to "move in to" the new Slashdot Beta design. Slashdot Beta is a trend-following attempt to give Slashdot a fresh look, an approach that has led to less space for text and an abandonment of the traditional Slashdot look. Much worse than that, Slashdot Beta fundamentally breaks the classic Slashdot discussion and moderation system.

If you haven't seen Slashdot Beta already, open this [slashdot.org] in a new tab. After seeing that, click here [slashdot.org] to return to classic Slashdot.

We should boycott stories and only discuss the abomination that is Slashdot Beta until Dice abandons the project.
We should boycott slashdot entirely during the week of Feb 10 to Feb 17 as part of the wider slashcott [slashdot.org]

Moderators - only spend mod points on comments that discuss Beta
Commentors - only discuss Beta
  http://slashdot.org/recent [slashdot.org] - Vote up the Fuck Beta stories

Keep this up for a few days and we may finally get the PHBs attention.

-----=====##### LINKS #####=====-----

Discussion of Beta: http://slashdot.org/firehose.pl?op=view&id=56395415 [slashdot.org]

Discussion of where to go if Beta goes live: http://slashdot.org/firehose.pl?op=view&type=submission&id=3321441 [slashdot.org]

Alternative Slashdot: http://altslashdot.org [altslashdot.org] (thanks Okian Warrior (537106) [slashdot.org] )

Re:fUCK BETA (-1, Flamebait)

emmagsachs (1024119) | about 9 months ago | (#46186327)

Turns it, this was bound to happen. The reaction of slashdot's userbase was accurately predicted [slashdot.org] two years ago.

Re:fUCK BETA (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186465)

At this point I think the damage is done, and any attempt to fix it is too little, too late. I have no doubt left that slashdot is over, or as Python, Monty might say:

'E's not pinin'! 'E's passed on! This SLASHDOT is no more! He has ceased to be! 'E's expired and gone to meet 'is maker! 'E's a stiff! Bereft of life, 'e rests in peace! If you hadn't nailed 'im to the BETA 'e'd be pushing up the daisies! 'Is metabolic processes are now 'istory! 'E's off the twig! 'E's kicked the bucket, 'e's shuffled off 'is mortal coil, run down the curtain and joined the bleedin' choir invisible!! THIS IS AN EX-SLASHDOT!!

We don't know that. (-1)

Dcnjoe60 (682885) | about 9 months ago | (#46186491)

We don't know that those predictions will come true. The fast majority of the F*ck Beta comments are coming from ACs. For all we know that could be a single individual or even a bot.

Slashdot has always had disgruntled people participate with it. But a lot of postings by an AC really are worthless to base anything on.

However, if slashdot dies because of this, it won't be because of Dice. It will be because like the dinosaurs, we couldn't adapt.

Re:We don't know that. (0, Offtopic)

emmagsachs (1024119) | about 9 months ago | (#46186527)

If it is only a handful of disgruntled anti-Beta posters, where did all the normal comments go?

Re:We don't know that. (1, Offtopic)

schneidafunk (795759) | about 9 months ago | (#46186661)

Probably here [altslashdot.org]

Re:We don't know that. (1)

KingOfBLASH (620432) | about 9 months ago | (#46187081)

Funny they state part of their goal is NOT to poach from slashdot. Which is what you are encouraging.

Re:We don't know that. (1)

schneidafunk (795759) | about 9 months ago | (#46187157)

Funny because the reason it started, and its name, implies they will be poaching from the slashdot community.

Re:We don't know that. (0)

bunratty (545641) | about 9 months ago | (#46186739)

I haven't been making comments because there's no point with all the beta trash talk. Once the betatards leave, I'm sure things will get back to normal. Probably better than ever, in fact.

Re:We don't know that. (0)

cyborg_monkey (150790) | about 9 months ago | (#46186775)

And that explains why you're a moron.

Re:We don't know that. (1)

bunratty (545641) | about 9 months ago | (#46186887)

Wow, good comeback! I'm sure the site will be much better with people like you gone for good. So long!

What, exactly (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186889)

is wrong with the comment system here?

I've deliberately gone to beta to check it out, seems OK.

Re:We don't know that. (1)

i kan reed (749298) | about 9 months ago | (#46186913)

They'll go away when the beta is a steaming crater in history. Part of the point of protests is to keep the apathetic crowd from enjoying a world where the specified injustice continues.

Re:We don't know that. (1)

i kan reed (749298) | about 9 months ago | (#46187043)

And no, my use of the phrase "injustice" isn't meant to compare the severity here to the severity of much more serious problems.

Re:We don't know that. (5, Insightful)

glavenoid (636808) | about 9 months ago | (#46186669)

I can assure you it's not the same AC over and over because AC comments are throttled by IP address.

However, if slashdot dies because of this, it won't be because of Dice. It will be because like the dinosaurs, we couldn't adapt.

Why should we have to adapt to garbage? I don't think anyone would refuse to adapt to a new paint scheme, it's the fact that the new site is fundamentally and functionally broken by design. The fact that dice felt now was a good time to start forcing users to something so broken shows that they have a fundamental misunderstanding of what this place is about. It's not that the beta site is a little buggy, it's that it is completely broken.

At the very least they should have waited until commenting was at functional parity before revealing their hand but now it's too late, they have revealed the direction of things to come and it does not bode well for the future of the slashdot.org domain.

Re:We don't know that. (1, Informative)

mcgrew (92797) | about 9 months ago | (#46186691)

The fast majority of the F*ck Beta comments are coming from ACs.

One was mine, I don't log in or comment at work and was thrown into that mess with no way out (?&"nobeta=1" didn't work) and no way to log in.

But yeah, many of us feared this clusterfuck would happen when a corporation bought it and Malda left. Meanwhile, slashdot's replacement is being worked on now (I registered an account this morning, user name mcgrew UID 123).

Re:We don't know that. (1)

fliptout (9217) | about 9 months ago | (#46187287)

What replacement?

Re:We don't know that. (3, Insightful)

anagama (611277) | about 9 months ago | (#46186713)

However, if slashdot dies because of this, it won't be because of Dice. It will be because like the dinosaurs, we couldn't adapt.

Yeah, Beta is like world destroying comet, and we the inhabitants of that world.

The real question is, in what way does the fucking beta make slashdot better? Just take one example, the ridiculous amount of whitespace around posts. That's millions of monitors burning electricity displaying absolutely nothing. Secondly, because so little information is displayed, there will be a lot more scrolling required. That will contribute to wrist and elbow problems for those who don't yet have them, and for people like me who do, aggravate them.

Fucking beta is killing the planet and it's bad for your health. So yeah -- dinos like me are gonna bitch. Suck it up.

Re:We don't know that. (4, Insightful)

TWiTfan (2887093) | about 9 months ago | (#46186791)

The fast majority of the F*ck Beta comments are coming from ACs. For all we know that could be a single individual or even a bot.

No, actually, I've been surprised by the number of real posts here against the beta, some of them with some incredibly low UID's. Much as I hate the beta, even I never expected such an overwhelming response (and, believe me, I've been around here a lot longer than my UID would indicate).

Re:We don't know that. (1)

someone1234 (830754) | about 9 months ago | (#46186891)

What are you talking about? Dice didn't have to adapt, just keep everything unchanged and take the coin.

Re:We don't know that. (1)

Dcnjoe60 (682885) | about 9 months ago | (#46187323)

What are you talking about? Dice didn't have to adapt, just keep everything unchanged and take the coin.

Slashdot wasn't profitable, so exactly what choice does Dice have for their shareholders. It is either trying to make it profitable, by attracting new users (thus increasing advertising revenue) or shutting it down. Dice most certainly had to adapt. In business, if you don't adapt to the changing environment, well, you aren't in business long.

Now, whether this particular adaptation was the correct one, that's open for debate.

Re:We don't know that. (1)

Curunir_wolf (588405) | about 9 months ago | (#46187099)

However, if slashdot dies because of this, it won't be because of Dice. It will be because like the dinosaurs, we couldn't adapt.

Well, first, why should a user base be required to "adapt" to a broken system? If they functionality they want goes away, they'll go somewhere else. Try to learn from other mistakes or you will die. Just check out all the comments there, most are along the lines of "Well it's too little and too late, me and all my friends have gone elsewhere."

Re:We don't know that. (1)

Curunir_wolf (588405) | about 9 months ago | (#46187119)

However, if slashdot dies because of this, it won't be because of Dice. It will be because like the dinosaurs, we couldn't adapt.

Well, first, why should a user base be required to "adapt" to a broken system? If they functionality they want goes away, they'll go somewhere else. Try to learn from other mistakes or you will die. Just check out all the comments there, most are along the lines of "Well it's too little and too late, me and all my friends have gone elsewhere."

Hmmm... linky failed. Should have been this [uservoice.com]

Re:fUCK BETA (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186711)

The only viable path is obvious. Bring back the ponies. OMG

Re:fUCK BETA (2, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186427)

Yes, Altslashdot.org while the name is only tentative and a better name will replace it, it is a greenlight project and has already gotten a lot of interest. DICE killed what was good about slashdot (the community) and the people have spoken, they want the old slashdot and the people are making it happen. Slashdot was FOR the people by the people and that's what project altslashdot is about.

DICE will without a doubt go in their own direction and with that said, they don't care about its current audience but want to tailor to a broader but bigger audience. We get it, it's for the money, not for the people. Ultimately those that were around for a long time will likely want a new home which seems pretty understandable after the mistreatment. It's up to the community to decide but we'll see how it goes. Good luck dice!

Re:fUCK BETA (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186477)

We should also make a list of alternative sites where /. users can go for their news.

Post it here...

Re:fUCK BETA (2)

boris111 (837756) | about 9 months ago | (#46186965)

I didn't realize what the hub bub is about until I clicked on the beta link. I'm not even the picky type and all I could say is wow this sucks!

Boycotts Dont Work (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46187375)

Talk to them in terms they can understand -- go to classic mode and continually click-through all of the ads. But given the track record of the UI, they are probably too dumb to see where the bump in the ad traffic is from.

Slashdot Beta (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186231)

Whatever is going on around here was predicted a long time ago.

See the news from the time. [slashdot.org]

Captcha - "Predict"

Beta delenda est! (-1, Offtopic)

emmagsachs (1024119) | about 9 months ago | (#46186233)

I will keep repeating this until Beta is gone, no matter how many times you'll downmod.

Nobody buys Playboy for the articles. They do it for the hot, nude women (sadly, sans grits). It just so happens that /. is exactly the same. No one reads /. for the articles. The articles were news two days ago. And no one reads /. for the summaries. The summaries are almost always wrong.

Everyone reads /. for the comments. The comments are the /. equivalent of Playboy's naked chicks, with one crucial difference. Without the gentlemen at Playboy, there will be no naked chicks to look at. The service they provide is, for the most part, finding women that will agree to pose nude for pictures, which they most graciously distribute to their readers.

But as for Slashdot -- the good people at Dice and their "editorial" team do diddly squat around here to generate content. The articles, old as they may be, are submitted by the users. The summaries, mistaken as they may be, are provided by the users, not by Timothy, Soulskill, et al. The comments, trollish as they may be, are written by the users.

/. is of the users, by the users, for the users. The only people at Dice who deserve their paycheck are the IT people. The rest of you -- what is it that you do for our benefit? Why the hell do we need you clowns? Your music's bad and you should feel bad!

Beta delenda est!

Re:Beta delenda est! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186287)

Maybe they could use graphene to improve beta. And bitcoins.

They could fix healthcare.gov with them both too.

Re: Beta delenda est! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186305)

Your assertion that /. discussions are the equivanent of hot women certainly is intriguing.

Re: Beta delenda est! (0)

emmagsachs (1024119) | about 9 months ago | (#46186343)

Would you like to subscribe to my newsletter?

Re: Beta delenda est! (0)

koreanbabykilla (305807) | about 9 months ago | (#46186583)

I would!

Re: Beta delenda est! (0)

mcgrew (92797) | about 9 months ago | (#46186715)

Someone else has started new slashdot. [altslashdot.org] I registered an account this morning, even though there's no real content there yet.

Re:Beta delenda est! (0)

jellomizer (103300) | about 9 months ago | (#46186367)

Beta will be gone when they put it in full Production.

Instead of being an ass, Clearly post your issues to the correct authority, instead of spamming the message boards over and over again.

Re:Beta delenda est! (0)

emmagsachs (1024119) | about 9 months ago | (#46186483)

A. Crap, by any other name, stills smells like crap.

B. Slashdot, without its high quality comments, has no appeal.

C. Vote for the worst! [wikipedia.org]

Re:Beta delenda est! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186701)

A. Crap, by any other name, stills smells like crap.

And juvenile whining and bitching, by any other name, is still juvenile whining and bitching.

Seriously, get over your fucking self. They will either listen to us or they won't.

But some of us are tired about you idiots constantly kvetching about it. It's not the first nor the last time Slashdot has done a redesign, and nobody liked any of the previous ones either.

Now STFU.

Re:Beta delenda est! (3, Insightful)

glavenoid (636808) | about 9 months ago | (#46186883)

It's not a mere redesign, it's a fundamental change in the way slashdot works by changing what slashdot is all about. They should have waited until things actually worked before revealing the beta, but as it is, by forcing users to the fundamentally broken beta site they've shown that they no longer care about the community.

Forcing users to a completely unusable site shows nothing but contempt for the users.

LOL!! :) (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186507)

You must be new around here.

Precious.

Re:Beta delenda est! (0)

Joce640k (829181) | about 9 months ago | (#46186509)

Instead of being an ass, Clearly post your issues to the correct authority, instead of spamming the message boards over and over again.

People have been saying "Beta sucks" for ages.

It's not just a matter of them using the wrong colors, the new comments system is unusable.

I am in Beta Now, (-1, Offtopic)

jellomizer (103300) | about 9 months ago | (#46186571)

It seems to work. OK for me. I see myself typing a comment. Perhaps you are just not smart enough to use something slightly different.

Re:I am in Beta Now, (4, Insightful)

mcgrew (92797) | about 9 months ago | (#46186873)

Try using bold or italics or posting a link. Try to find the URL of a comment. Log off and try to log back in, I couldn't log in at work (they use IE7).

No, they added nothing of value and removed much of value. Does Microsoft own Dice?

Re:Beta delenda est! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186523)

Instead of being an ass, Clearly post your issues to the correct authority, instead of spamming the message boards over and over again.

People already tried that for half a year now, the powers that be have simply ignored it. The time for diplomacy is over.

GTFO (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186573)

please, new guy GTFO

Re:Beta delenda est! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186589)

Beta will be gone when they put it in full Production.

Instead of being an ass, Clearly post your issues to the correct authority, instead of spamming the message boards over and over again.

Fuck beta!

Re: Correct Authority (4, Insightful)

j-stroy (640921) | about 9 months ago | (#46186635)

I feel the loss of the comment threads as much as you jellomizer. Which is exactly what this whole thing is about. The new site model nukes the existing message board structure.

Rather than see these as off topic posts, spamming the message boards, try the perspective that there is only one topic until this issue is resolved to the communities satisfaction and that these comments are in fact using the message boards for their intended purpose: maintaining a moderated discussion guided by the consensus generated by the readership.

These posts have become the most effective manner of communicating to the correct authority. The correct authority in this case is the broad readership, some of whom are just learning about this. The other authority is the controlling entities who have thus far made some poor choices about not responding to the communities posts in the designated channels. Therefore this is the next step in a spectrum of responses.

I personally apologize to you for the necessity of this step which has been provoked by the site operators. I do hope things change quickly, since I love slashdot. I am slashdot.

Re:Beta delenda est! (2)

mcgrew (92797) | about 9 months ago | (#46186837)

Beta will be gone when they put it in full Production.

It doesn't matter if Beta leaves or not, most of slashdot's posters will be gone when Classic is gone. I will be. If they keep Classic as an option it won't matter, we'll stay. The issue is their getting rid of Classic, not the existence of Beta.

Instead of being an ass, Clearly post your issues to the correct authority, instead of spamming the message boards over and over again.

It's a protest. Lets hope it's effective. I posted in the page about beta and several user journals decrying Beta, wrote a journal about it myself and wrote an email telling slashdot how much beta sucks. Answering positively to anti-beta comments may annoy you, but I think it's important and needs to be done.

Meanwhile, I'll be looking for an alternate site. In a year this place will be as empty as kuro5hin.

Re:Beta delenda est! (0)

Laxori666 (748529) | about 9 months ago | (#46186453)

So was that post enough to turn the tide so people started modding these down, or are the powers-that-be modding these down to make it look like that post was enough?

Re:Beta delenda est! (0, Offtopic)

samkass (174571) | about 9 months ago | (#46186641)

I've used all my mod points on "Offtopic" today. I was fine with the protest until Slashdot responded and opened a discussion area for it. Now, if you want to discuss beta, go to the beta article. Other people who care will be there, too. Maybe you can even effect positive change.

Spamming every single discussion is, quite obviously, now Offtopic and other people with mod points seem to agree with me.

Re:Beta delenda est! (4, Insightful)

emmagsachs (1024119) | about 9 months ago | (#46186799)

These comments are Slashdot's response. The management-speak in the Beta article is Dice's. They made it perfectly clear that, even after all this backlash, Classic will soon be gone:

I, too, am here for the intelligent discussion. So I do apologize. But Dice ignores our complaints, while pretending to listen. Ruining every single discussion is the only option we have left.

Re:Beta delenda est! (1)

i kan reed (749298) | about 9 months ago | (#46186959)

Well, there's always terrorism.

Re:Beta delenda est! (1)

DoofusOfDeath (636671) | about 9 months ago | (#46186557)

Without the gentlemen at Playboy, there will be no naked chicks to look at.

Spoken like a true /. member!

About the beta. (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186271)

It is now official. Netcraft has confirmed: Slashdot is dying.

        One more crippling bombshell hit the already beleaguered Slashdot community when IDC confirmed that Slashdot page views has dropped yet again, now down to less than a fraction of 1 percent of all websites. Coming on the heels of a recent Netcraft survey which plainly states that Slashdot has lost more market share, this news serves to reinforce what we've known all along. Slashdot is collapsing in complete disarray, as fittingly exemplified by the stupid fucking beta website and the wholesale discard of user feedback with only a token attempt at communication.

        You don't need to be the Amazing Kreskin to predict Slashdot's future. The hand writing is on the wall: Slashdot faces a bleak future. In fact there won't be any future at all for Slashdot because Slashdot is dying. Things are looking very bad for Slashdot. As many of us are already aware, Slashdot continues to lose market share. Red ink flows like a river of blood.

        Slashdot Beta is the most endangered of them all, having lost 93% of its core users. The sudden and unpleasant departures of long time Slashdot users Jordan Hubbard and Mike Smith only serve to underscore the point more clearly. There can no longer be any doubt: Slashdot is dying.

        All major surveys show that Slashdot has steadily declined in market share. Slashdot is very sick and its long term survival prospects are very dim. If Slashdot is to survive at all it will be among S&M enthusiasts. Slashdot continues to decay. Nothing short of a miracle could save it at this point in time. For all practical purposes, Slashdot is dead.

That crippling bombshell sent Slashdot fans into a tailspin of mourning and denial. However, bad news poured in like a river of water.

Your contributors (not audience) are giving you a clear message.

Re:About the beta. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186467)

Very much so and thanks for your contribution. DICE will not listen, but altslashdot.org will listen. The name is tentative but the goal is clear: community first.

yeah, right (2)

Dcnjoe60 (682885) | about 9 months ago | (#46186543)

Very much so and thanks for your contribution. DICE will not listen, but altslashdot.org will listen. The name is tentative but the goal is clear: community first.

Yeah, right, don't you mean community first until the community doesn't like something that owner/provider doesn't like?

If altslashdot.org users start posting porn, will that be acceptable? If they decide only whites or males should be allowed to post, will that be acceptable? The moment you post rules, you have dimminished community first, even if the community votes on them. Why? because future members of the community don't get a chance to vote on them, so really what you have is founders first, not community first.

Re:yeah, right (1)

ElectricTurtle (1171201) | about 9 months ago | (#46186795)

Shut up Lysander Spooner.

Creating a site with a coherent and congruent purpose for the people using it at least establishes clear compatibility for users going forward. People who agree with the founding principles will want to become involved, and people who don't can GTFO.

And your hyperbolous mythical monsters of bigotry by a majority are extremely unlikely. How many mainstream sites do you know of that are openly racist or misogynist? And I don't mean the sort of soft bigotry of disagreement being pushed as equivalent in academia, I mean hardcore 'minorities are evil' bigotry, since that's what would be predicate to your fantasy scenarios of a white male only power structure.

I wasn''t expecting... (-1, Offtopic)

zentronium (261068) | about 9 months ago | (#46186299)

... Beta sucked so much!!

In other news... (1)

fuzzyfuzzyfungus (1223518) | about 9 months ago | (#46186337)

Apparently carbon isn't very good at introspection...

Re:In other news... (0)

emmagsachs (1024119) | about 9 months ago | (#46186369)

Neither is Dice.

Re:In other news... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186547)

In related news...

FUCK BETA
(buck feta)

fuckwit (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186363)

Please post this to new articles if it hasn't been posted yet. (Copy-paste the html from here so links don't get mangled!)

On February 5, 2014, Slashdot announced through a javascript popup that they are starting to "move in to" the new Slashdot Beta design. Slashdot Beta is a trend-following attempt to give Slashdot a fresh look, an approach that has led to less space for text and an abandonment of the traditional Slashdot look. Much worse than that, Slashdot Beta fundamentally breaks the classic Slashdot discussion and moderation system.

If you haven't seen Slashdot Beta already, open this in a new tab. After seeing that, click here to return to classic Slashdot.

We should boycott stories and only discuss the abomination that is Slashdot Beta until Dice abandons the project.
We should boycott slashdot entirely during the week of Feb 10 to Feb 17 as part of the wider slashcott

Moderators - only spend mod points on comments that discuss Beta
Commentors - only discuss Beta
    http://slashdot.org/recent - Vote up the Fuck Beta stories

Keep this up for a few days and we may finally get the PHBs attention.

-----=====##### LINKS #####=====-----

Discussion of Beta: http://slashdot.org/firehose.pl?op=view&id=56395415

Discussion of where to go if Beta goes live: http://slashdot.org/firehose.pl?op=view&type=submission&id=3321441

Alternative Slashdot: http://altslashdot.org (thanks Okian Warrior (537106))

Re:fuckwit (2)

emmagsachs (1024119) | about 9 months ago | (#46186415)

Beta turned me into a newt!

Re:fuckwit (1)

Twike (2327908) | about 9 months ago | (#46187177)

It turned you into a newt?

Re:fuckwit (1)

emmagsachs (1024119) | about 9 months ago | (#46187231)

... I got better.

In other news... (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186411)

Scientists discover that Beta conducts vapid corporate mentality better than theory predicted, even for the most idealised forms of Slashdot.

How about making Macroscopic wires? (1)

DickBreath (207180) | about 9 months ago | (#46186487)

How soon before they can commercialize it to produce macroscopic wires that are used outside of an IC package?

Then produce big enough cables of wire to deliver electricity long distance?

And produce these wires economically?

Re:How about making Macroscopic wires? (1)

glwtta (532858) | about 9 months ago | (#46186577)

Is transmission speed an issue with long distance electrical cables?

Re:How about making Macroscopic wires? (1)

mcgrew (92797) | about 9 months ago | (#46186615)

It is if you're moving data, but not for delivery of power (faster wires won't make your stereo sound better or toast your bread any faster).

I doubt it's faster than fiber, though.

Re:How about making Macroscopic wires? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186845)

No, speed isn't an issue, but loss is. The dozens of feet from your circuit breaker to your speakers has negligible loss due to resistance, but the (maybe hundreds of) miles from the power plant to your house does incur significant loss. If these wires could be produced at a sufficient scale and economy, utilities would likely start using them instead of copper because it would save them money.

Re:How about making Macroscopic wires? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186897)

The speed of propagation of signals along wires typically has more to do with its shape and the material around it (e.g. dielectric constants). For twisted pair data cables, you can gets speeds from 0.5 to 0.7c, while fibers, both typical plastic and glass ones, tend to be around 2/3 of c. You can have coax cables with propagation speeds up to 0.8 c though, and ladder lines are closer to 0.95c.

Re: How about making Macroscopic wires? (1)

LordWabbit2 (2440804) | about 9 months ago | (#46186723)

I think you are missing the point, if it has less resistance there will be less lost in long distance transmission.

Re:How about making Macroscopic wires? (4, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186653)

Graphene has very high conductivity for what it is: a monoatomic layer. This is important in ICs where certain material thicknesses are in the nanometres. Also graphene has a very specific and uniform thickness, which solves uniformity problem when trying to deposit 1 nm material uniformly across 300 mm wafers. But when you can afford to increase the thickness (in macroscopic systems), metals become much more conductive than "macroscopic grahene," which is just regular graphite and is not so conductive. Actually graphite is used as electronic resistors and in certain heater elements (as it is conductive enough to pass large currents, but resistive enough to heat a lot by Joule effect and finally stands very well high temperatures).

Graphene beaten by Beta (0, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186525)

The conductivity of graphene pales in comparison with Beta's ability to direct users away from Slashdot.

BETA FAILS ON MY BROWSER (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186535)

idiots. So i can't block google analytics or i get the "NANU NANU" shit? go fuck yourselves with a fork

Re:BETA FAILS ON MY BROWSER (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186689)

I don't block google analytics and I still get nanu nanu until I press the "get more comments" 3-4 times. Never ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.

10x better than standard theory says? (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186549)

I am skeptical about such an extraordinary claim.

Side note: Please, stop with the "fuck beta" campaign; I find this campaign FAR MORE DISRUPTIVE to the enjoyment of /. than the beta itself. Get over Yourselves already.

Re:10x better than standard theory says? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186603)

/. will die without Jon Katz.

Re:10x better than standard theory says? (3, Insightful)

anagama (611277) | about 9 months ago | (#46186659)

Please, stop with the "fuck beta" campaign; I find this campaign FAR MORE DISRUPTIVE to the enjoyment of /. than the beta itself

An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. Fuck beta now, or be fucked by it forever.

Re:10x better than standard theory says? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186923)

It is more like decapitating someone so the venom from a snake bite on their foot doesn't do brain damage... people are and will leave regardless of what happens with beta if comments are nothing but beta spam.

Beta Beta (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186559)

derp beta derpa

Real question (3, Insightful)

Dcnjoe60 (682885) | about 9 months ago | (#46186567)

While it is interesting to see the advances with graphene, if used to make super fast computers, isn't the "wiring" on the chip only a small part of the problem? Have they found a way to make the transistors and resistors and parts on the chip out of graphene? If not, wouldn't the speed improvements be nonexistent? It would seem that it would be like taking a super highway and bringing all the traffic down to one lane at the exits (or maybe a bridge in NJ).

Re:Real question (3, Interesting)

Narcocide (102829) | about 9 months ago | (#46186805)

I'd imagine that the immediate benefits would be: lower power requirements and less heat at equivalent speeds (which can indirectly lead to higher safe clock-speeds) as well as bigger limits on max physical bus lengths due to extremely reduced latency.

Re:Real question (5, Informative)

JustinOpinion (1246824) | about 9 months ago | (#46186855)

You are correct that using graphene [wikipedia.org] or carbon nanotubes [wikipedia.org] (which are close cousins) only for the wiring wouldn't gain you much; especially since large resistances can arise from the junctions between two conductors/materials.

People are certainly investigating how to turn graphene and nanotubes into transistors. There have been demonstrations of using an applied voltage to mechanically 'kink' a nanotube so that its resistance changes. Thus it can be used as a non-volatile memory element. (The kinking is reversible and fast.) Others have looked into ways to 'dope' graphene by controlling what material it is sitting on top of (which changes its electrical properties, similar to doping atoms into silicon). Things like this can be used to make transistors out of these carbon nanomaterials; and in principle to do it in a way where the conducting carbon network is unbroken.

Of course, the devil is in the details. We've seen demonstrations of many pieces of the puzzle, but turning it all into a technology (where you can build it all easily on a single substrate, in a scalable way, etc.) is still a ways off. But there is at least a chance these materials will pan out.

P.S.: Don't let this comment distract from the legitimate outcry against Slashdot Beta.

Re:Real question (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46187007)

IBM and they typical universities are making pretty decent headway into the research on these. None ready for prime time but if you really want to keep read more on these methods this site isn't bad http://www.graphene-info.com/ (http://www.graphene-info.com/tags/graphene-applications/graphene-transistors?page=1).

Re:Real question (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186907)

That's certainly one possibility, but it depends on where the bottleneck currently is. I'm no expert, but it could be that routing traces is very difficult for high speed signals. By using this graphene, the lower resistance would make it possible to run high speed signals out of the chip.

Re:Real question (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186973)

Graphene has been abandoned some years ago for digital transistors as the off/on ratio is orders of magnitude below the value for emiconductors (because graphene has zero bandgap, the transistor is never completely off as it happens for semiconductors). However graphene is still a very good candidate for radiofrequency and optoelectronic analog chips in particular because of universal optical conductance in this range (all the way from MHz to near UV actually).

Re:Real question (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46187113)

Actually, the trends are going this way: the smaller and smaller we make the transistors, the faster they can switch on/off and using fewer electrons to boot, but then we need to make the wires smaller, too, to actually get the density improvements Moore's Law *actually* predicts, and the smaller we make the wires, the more resistive they become, so then they burn more power, and the greater their parasitic capacitance becomes, so they become slower, to boot.

We're at a point where the wiring is becoming a significant source of delay in the circuitry and needs to be modeled accurately to understand the real circuit performance, instead of ignored like before, so if we can reliably reproduce these results in fabs, it would be a *huge* boon for electronics because we can dial back the circuit complexity to the circuit diagrams we learn in college, focused only on the components, instead of also needing to worry quite a bit about where those components are and how they're connected together to determine circuit behavior.

Re:Real question (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46187383)

While it is interesting to see the advances with graphene, if used to make super fast computers, isn't the "wiring" on the chip only a small part of the problem?

That is the thing, isn't it? Processors are a very small part of all integrated circuits out there and not all components are limited by the same factors.
For example there are plenty of transistors that aren't limited by the chip but by the legs of the package.

Slashdot Beta = New Coke (0)

kensai (139597) | about 9 months ago | (#46186595)

why mess with what works and fans love. FUCK BETA

FORK ./ (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186649)

FORK->FORKFORK-FORK

I love it (3, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186677)

For people who claim that science is wrong/bad/not complete - this is the kind of thing that research and study can do.

The expected result was off by 10x. This doesn't mean that science sucks - but rather there is a new question to be answered that will allow us to understand the world just a little bit better.

AWESOME.

Technical question about electricity transmission (1)

kartaron (763480) | about 9 months ago | (#46186685)

When electricity is conducted on a wire,are new electrons sent down the wire riding on the surface? Or are they pushed through the mass of existing electrons and cause one currently in line to bounced off the back end (like a newton's cradle)? Something Ive always wondered...

Re:Technical question about electricity transmissi (1)

zenlessyank (748553) | about 9 months ago | (#46186827)

It works almost exactly like a newton's cradle. The whole mass of metal atoms transfers its electrons through the whole wire. At least that is the theory that is accepted. "Electronics All-In-One Desk Reference For Dummies" is a good book for understanding how electricity works.

Re:Technical question about electricity transmissi (3, Informative)

oldhack (1037484) | about 9 months ago | (#46187163)

Hey slashdot, keep the javascript-free version.

It's been decades since I took solid state physics courses, but here's what I remember.

Conducting solid, like metal, is modeled as a single monolithic entity as opposed to a set of individual elemental atoms. Each atom's high(est) energy electrons become "free" electrons that can move about the whole solid with minimum provocation (i.e., voltage). So when electric field or voltage is applied across the solid, these free electrons bunch up towards positive charge - i.e. the "skin" you referred to.

Because, you know, electrons have a negative charge. Haha.

So when voltage is applied to the solid, and there is a route out of the solid towards positive charge, the free electrons will move that way. If there is also a route into the solid through which new (to the solid) electrons move in, then you have a circuit where electrons flow in and out of the solid (as you say) along the skin, and hence you have current.

That's what I remember of the simple version of solid state model that look at solid's free electrons as a group. Because the free electrons are treated as a group, it doesn't deal with whether the electron that just popped out are new (to the solid) one or the last one in line - the model doesn't give individuality to each electrons.

Not sure it answers your question adequately, but that's what popped into my head. Maybe others will do a more proper job.

Like I was saying, KEEP THE JAVASCRIPT-FREE SLASHDOT, you dirtbags! :-)

I think we can all agree.. (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46186993)

I think with this whole Beta flap we can all agree on two things.

First, SlashDot Beta sucks. OK - whatever, who gives a shit.

Second, Slashdot is infested with the most annoying, entitled, childish fucking little neckbeard cumstain dweebs on the Internet. Most of you fucking dolts make 4chan users look like Rhodes Scholars.

Technically most of you are stuck in 1978, just completely fucking clueless. You post the same repetitive, boring as _fuck_ "memes" (what a stupid fucking word). Your personal hygiene is atrocious and women don't like you because you're ugly as shit and your personality is terrible. It's not that she's shallow and won't love you because she doesn't know you, it's that you are a sub-par human being. I promise.

I think all the repetitive, boring posts being spammed by you fuckers concerning the beta seals the case. Shut the fuck up already, no serious person gives that much of a fuck. But that's the thing, I guess. None of you are serious people, just caricatures - cardboard cutouts of a stereotype regarding socially inept misfit losers.

Re: I think we can all agree.. (1)

macinnisrr (1103805) | about 9 months ago | (#46187073)

And you are an asshole. Pot -> kettle.

Re: I think we can all agree.. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46187135)

AKA "Fuck You, Clown."

I like your style.

Theoretical flaw, anyone? (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46187221)

That's very great news for graphene and everything that could be built out of it.
But didn't these results just invalidate a theory? Is there someone that is actually looking why the current theory fails to explain the observed behavior?

re: Theoretical flaw, anyone? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 9 months ago | (#46187393)

I'm sorry - but your comment is getting in the way of all the Fuck Beta! discussion. Despite your valid points (at least on reading the summary of the article), having though provoking questions just won't work right now.

I do however agree with you, this shows either an error in the theoretical underpinnings of the current theory if and only if the results can be reliably duplicated. Let's verify that it is happening like stated before tearing apart a theory that works (so far).

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