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The New Zelda

CmdrTaco posted more than 13 years ago | from the i-just-can't-contain-myself dept.

Games 329

freakonaleash881 writes "IGN is reporting that the new Legend of Zelda for the Gamecube is going to be a cartoon...that's right, a cartoon! It's supposedly showing off the Gamecube's realtime cartoon shading abilities. I just don't know about this..." I think it looks sweet considering the general poor quality of the snapshots. I tell ya folks, the next few months are going to be really exciting for console games with the new Final Fantasy, and the release of 2 new systems.

Sorry! There are no comments related to the filter you selected.

fp? (-1, Offtopic)

n3r0.m4dski11z (447312) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213076)

aw yea

Hmm..... (2)

11223 (201561) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213086)

404 not found - do they delete these as soon as they make the /. front page?

Re:Hmm..... (1)

Naigler (216631) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213120)

Only until someone says "There's a 404 error" then they put it back to prove the person wrong...

Re:Hmm..... (2)

11223 (201561) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213154)

Actually, it appears to be not working with Konqueror. Just goes to show that CmdrTaco doesn't use Konqueror as much as he says, right?

Re:Hmm..... (1)

AnalogBoy (51094) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213208)

Or it could go to show that Taco doesn't read the articles before he posts them. :)

BTW.. I love your sig.

Re:Hmm..... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#2213229)

it appears to be not working with Konqueror

It works fine for me using konqueror 1.9.8

Re:Hmm..... (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#2213282)

He obviously doesn't use Konqueror at all. I use it, and it is renders slashdot completely unusable. Every link throughs an extra "" into the middle of it, and no icons render (also throughs an extra into the link to images). All in all, CmdrTaco has never laid hands on Konqueror. He's a fucking lying piece of shit.

Interesting (2, Insightful)

UberLame (249268) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213088)

This could be really interesting. Should Zelda be realistic or cartoony?

It started as cartoony out of nescesity of being a sprite based game, and while moving to 3D, it still maintained what I believe to be a somewhat intentional cartoonish appearence. So, in a way this is going back to basics.

But, so far I haven't been impressed with realtime cell shaded games. They just don't seem right, and the graphics have tended to be rather distracting in the past.

Re:Interesting (1)

ThePreciousRoy (414473) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213140)

niether damn it! It should be an overhead view with beeps for sounds and very blocky characters... why do they have to ruin a good game!

Re:Interesting (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#2213189)

niether damn it! It should be an overhead view with beeps for sounds and very blocky characters... why do they have to ruin a good game!
AMEN! I'll play and beat Link to the Past, or Majora's Mask, or whatever, but the best zelda ever was the very first ones. Remember how hard those whole rooms full of blue kitten critters were? You had to hit em from the side or from behind. They were awesome!

I'll replay the old zeldaa before I'd replay the newer ones

Re:Interesting (1)

spudnic (32107) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213281)

I'm assuming your being sarcastic, but I actually prefer it this way. Maybe not the crude graphics, but the overhead puzzle view felt much better to me.

Call me old fashioned, but it was the kind of gaming that I liked. Too much emphasis is put on graphics these days.

Re:Interesting (2)

wishus (174405) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213320)

I agree. I recently bought a SNES just to play Link to the Past.

The dungeon puzzles are what made LTTP such a great game.. N64 Zelda couldn't touch it.

And maybe they're just bad screenshots, but I think the cartoons look dismal. They could have gotten a much better cartoonist.

Watch the movie (2, Informative)

Midnight Thunder (17205) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213092)

If after reading the text you still think a cartoon approach is bad, check out the movie at the bottom of the page. Although not the same feel as the previous version of Zelda it certainly is a novel approach and one that might find a number of imitators.

Re:Watch the movie (1)

UberLame (249268) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213098)

Yeah, it looks like nice eye candy, but I think that it could distract game play. Of course, we won't really know until it is out.

Also, I kinda pictured it as something that would have a darker and more aggresive shading style than those screen shots indicated. The movie wouldn't work for me, unfortunatly.

This does make me want to get a new n64 and a zelda cart to play it again.

Re:Watch the movie (1)

Midnight Thunder (17205) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213118)

The movie is in Quicktime format so unless you have MS-Windows or MacOS your're out of luck.

Re:Watch the movie (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#2213311)

like always, you losers should be used to it by now...

Re:Watch the movie (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#2213314)

Get the original... actually been playin that at home again :) gotta love the classics.

Re:Watch the movie (2, Funny)

Davace (250100) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213132)

Gotta love that Sorenson codec for linux!

Re:Watch the movie (2)

mblase (200735) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213261)

If nothing else, it allows Link and other characters to depict facial expressions and physical activity that would be difficult or impossible otherwise. This is something that's usually very lacking from 3-D computer games.

I think it's more significant, though, to note what a change in style this is. Nintendo and Sony have already neatly divided the gaming market into two pieces: mature players (PS2) and kids (Nintendo). Sega got caught between the two, which is what ultimately cost them in the console wars. By "tooning" Zelda, Nintendo is trying to make it more appealing to a younger audience who might otherwise be turned off by the renowned complexity of the game.

What about chickens (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#2213093)

Are there going to be cartoon chickens in this release? There is never anything that highlights a console's abilities better than animated chickens.

If they could get the scent thing working where you could actually sniff under the wings of the chicken, that would be grand.

I like to move the little video game chickens around and have them peck about.

wtf? (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#2213096)

"Nothing for you to see here. Please move along."

Looks like there are still some bugs in da house

slashdot is dying (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#2213255)

Just look at the numbers in the last month, there were 4,372,873 trolls on USENET -- the number of trolls on slashdot has declined to 4,372. When we divide out the numbers, you get a adjusted troll factor of 0.17%. This is so low as to be laughable. Obviously the teehting pains of the new 2.2 slashcode -- the lost posts, the "missing" posts, the annoying lameness filter changes, etc, etc have driven away the coluorful slashdot troll community. And you know what they say about rats and sinking ships...

Zelda (5, Funny)

Wind_Walker (83965) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213101)

I have never really been a huge fan of the Zelda series but I do enjoy it. I played the SNES incarnations and they were good and I found them fun to play however when I bought the N64 Zelda's I just didn't and couldn't get in to them like how I did with the SNES games - I didn't like the seriousness of the game so I never actually got around to completing them as they just bored me.

When I first saw the The Legend of Zelda for the GCN, it was a picture, and I did think for a split second, oh my god, what on earth has Nintendo done (around this time I had only had about 3 hours of sleep as I stayed up for Spaceworld as I live in the UK). I could not picture Zelda to look like this after seeing last years Spaceworld footage and the N64 versions. However after a lot of thought I realised Nintendo is going back to their roots and that is when I finally understood Miyamoto's reasons for making the changes - he doesn't want to make rehashes of the same old game with just prettier graphics, he doesn't want to do what most other developers out there would be afraid to do and that is to try something different and go along the same lines that made the Zelda series great in the first place.

I believe that the reasons why many people are upset about this change in Zelda is because the videogame industry hasn't had a wake up call (I apologise if I offend anyone when I say this) and that the Sony Playstation has done something to this industry that Nintendo is trying to prevent from happening - and that (Playstation) is preventing developers from making new and original games and stopping them from making new ideas - instead they just release game after game after game which don't have any different gameplay in them and yes, I know you shouldn't fix something that ain't broke but Miyamoto knows that if he doesn't do something to the Zelda series soon, then that too will follow the path of say the Tomb Raider series.

People complaining should think long and hard and try and understand that what Miyamoto is doing is for the good of the Zelda series as Im sure none of you would like to see Zelda dry up, cause if it did, Im pretty damn sure you would be begging for a change in the series like this to happen.

The Legend will live on!

Re:Zelda (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#2213179)

dude I think you really need te use some more of them comma's and periods and stuff because your post is a pig to read as it just one big fat sentence, with no punctuation except for maybe a comma here or there

or maybe you should get some more sleep that might help too

dude (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#2213235)

I think you need to learn how to use apostrophes correctly before you start to criticize other people's use of grammar because comma's means JACK SHIT and saying a post is "a pig to read" what the fuck does that mean you jackass you know it's stupid people like you who flame others for not being perfect in their punctuation that always fuck up the worst

Besides, what can you expect? I just cut-and-pasted from one of IGN's message boards. It's not even my comment. I went through, found the first long comment that I could that seemed to have capitalization and a good thought structure, then posted it as fast as I could.


Where is this "change" everyone's bitching about? (1)

disc-chord (232893) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213231)

Is the "change" that Zelda is now a cartoony game as upposed to a realistic game? ... uh no, Zelda has always been cartoony.

Is the "change" that Zelda is now aimed at young children... uh no, Nintendo's target audience has always been young children.

Is the "change" that Zelda is now in 3d with the latest 3d technology powering it... uh no, Zelda 64 had the latest 3d technology powering it too.

I can't understand why anyone is in a huff... there is NOTHING different here from all the other Zeldas.

Personally I loved the Zelda games on my NES when I was 8... and I expect the 8 year olds of the world in 2002 will love this incarnation.

"Everybody" is people who follow IGN (1)

Wind_Walker (83965) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213272)

Over at IGN, for a while now, there's been a preview [] of Zelda. It was shown at E3 in 2000. They show an incredibly dark, incredibly detailed, and incredibly lifelike personage for both Link and Ganondorf (also called Ganon). The stills for the preview are just phenomenal (I can't say that enough). Go over and take a look at what the original concept was.

Everybody's bitching because it feels like the old bait-and-switch. Miyamoto dangles these beautiful carrots in front of everybody, showcasing exactly what the Gamecube is capable of, and then he says, "No, sorry, we've completely re-designed the game, and now it looks cartoony. Sorry." He has even admitted that the change was made before E3 of 2000, and the shots were of a game that was not in the works

It's not that the new game is different from other Zeldas... It's that the new game is not the game we were shown.

Re:"Everybody" is people who follow IGN (1)

disc-chord (232893) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213322)

Ahhh... I see. I suppose it comes down to taste then.

I still think 8 year olds will enjoy a game that looks like their saturday morning cartoons more than they would if they had stuck with the original idea... because the original idea, isn't very original... every other game already looks like that.

Re:Zelda (1)

Agarwaen The Tired (471456) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213233)

First off cell shading is a bad idea, period. The media must fit the type of game. A 3-d game needs to have depth perception. Zelda has never been succesfully copied that I can tell. The original Zelda was probably the first game I ever played up into all hours of the night. Granted I was 6 and had to sneak away from parents to do this should tell you how much I love this game. Still the Zelda storyline has always been serious, simple yes, but serious. The only way I can compare it is with the original fairy tales, not the disney crap. No, I don't want Zelda to look photo-realistic, but the 3-d style of the N64 one was nearly perfect even if the world was to small. I feel like I've been raped. You've taken a serious part of my youth and made it look like Power Rangers. This as tantamount to me as if Carmack decided to make Doom 3 cell shading. I still play the original Zelda and the snes ones. I'm not ashamed they were serious games.

Zelda is dying (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#2213294)

Just look at the numbers. Last month, there were 7,328 calls to the Sega helpline on making love to female zebras in heat. In the same period, there were 0 support calls to the Sega helpline about Zelda. The conclusion is obvious, Zelda is not just dying, it is dead. If Nintendo hadn't nailed its feet to the perch, it'd be pushing up daisies.

Re:Zelda (1)

.c (115916) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213318)

I could not picture Zelda to look like this after seeing last years Spaceworld footage and the N64 versions.

No kidding. From a January 26th article at IGN [] :

There's far too much detail to believe that Nintendo would scrap the models and make new ones. So, we think it's safe to say the new Link will look a lot like this.
When they're off, they're off.

Isn't this a cartoon already? (1)

big_cat79 (156695) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213102)

Maybe it's just my opinion, but havent the Zelda games in the past been cartoons? Look at other popular PC and console games like Resident Evil, Diablo 2, and stuff like that. They try to realistically portray the human form. I've never seen Zelda try to accomplish that. I mean, for God's sakes, the characters are for the most part elfin. Of course it looks cartoonish.

Re:Isn't this a cartoon already? (1)

n0-0p (325773) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213180)

Zelda 2: The Adventures of Link was supposed to be more realistic in style, but really it was just a terrible game. The rest of them had a much more cartoon style, though. That really struck me as part of the appeal, and part of why 2 was so bad.

Cartoon Shading, and Dreamcast vs. PS2. (1)

2Flower (216318) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213105)

It's interesting to note that the cartoon-shading technique Sega used for Jet Set Radio was according to developer interviews 'a Dreamcast exclusive; we wanted to do something with the Dreamcast that COULD NOT be done on the Playstation 2.'

Not too long ago, when asked if Jet Set Radio Future (the sequel) would be an X-Box exclusive, Sega said it would be multiplatform after an exclusivity period runs out.

So here we have a toon shader on GameCube, and Monster Rancher 3 uses a toon shader on PS2...

It's getting hard to figure out what's hype, what's system FUD and what's a legit feature set for these machines.

Re:Cartoon Shading, and Dreamcast vs. PS2. (3, Interesting)

Jerf (17166) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213168)

I don't know the details of the systems, but the cell shading may have been done more efficiently using the Dreamcast hardware (clock for clock), or it may have been done more easily (in programmer-hours). However, both the Dreamcast and the Gamecube are Turing complete... with enough power and patience, any effect is possible on either platform.

BTW, somebody get Taco a DC, now that they're dirt cheap. Clearly his Playstation mania has left him out of some great gaming experiences if he thinks nothing has been happening the past year or two in the video game industry. (Then again, I should thank people like him. DC stuff wouldn't be anywhere near as cheap if demand was as high as it should have been...)

Cartoon? Just what we need... (1)

bziman (223162) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213107)

Yuck. Those screen shots don't look too good. I miss the original legend of Zelda -- the graphics were good, considering that all of the sprites were the same size.

If they really wanted to have a "cartoon" look, they should have gone for an Anime motif, rather than a South Park paper-cut-out motif. I dunno... maybe it looks better in motion, but I'm always skeptical: The more toys the developers get, the more the story line and playability seems to suffer.


Re:Cartoon? Just what we need... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#2213192)

Watch the quicktime. It looks really cool while moving in the forest scene. And the cartoonness of the enemeys is wicked :)

Ugh... (3, Insightful)

kypper (446750) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213109)

That cartoon looks REALLY bad.

It may be only to show off lighting and shading, but... you'd think they could design something enjoyable.

Now me, I'd like to see an anime Zelda if they really wanted to make a 'cartoon game'.

Cartoony? How disappointing! (1)

Zoisite (250130) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213113)

I went to see the screenshots and I have to admit I am disappointed. The demo we were shown a few months ago (the 3D rendered fight scene between Ganon and Link) was much more impressive and seemed to me to be the future of the Zelda series.

What we were promised was a beautifully-rendered adult Link (in what seemed a more real & detailed version of the 3D world we first saw in Ocarina of Time) and what we are given is... something that looks like it was stolen from a saturday morning kiddie show.

Even the 80s cartoon based on the Legend of Zelda looked better than this.

I'm wondering why they made this choice when developpers all seem to be converging towards more encompassing (and realistic) 3D worlds...


Re:Cartoony? How disappointing! (3, Interesting)

Junks Jerzey (54586) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213155)

I'm wondering why they made this choice when developpers all seem to be converging towards more encompassing (and realistic) 3D worlds...

This is not true. The wall game developers are running into (and I am one, not just some lunatic fanboy), is that making encompassing and realistic 3D works takes a huge amount of time. We're talking months and months for one medium-sized level. And that's with 'old' technology, not all the new crazy stuff that's coming out in hardware (programmable vertex shaders, for example). So we're headed toward games that will take armies of people ten years to create. Wouldn't it be better to take a different approach and concentrate on fun?

Here's a link to an article [] that Slashdot ran last year on the subject.

Re:Cartoony? How disappointing! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#2213198)

I don't think Nintendo ever promised anything to any of us :)

Just cuz they showed a teaser showing what the systems future could hold and it showed a Zelda bit doesn't mean it was a game in progress.

I will agree with the fact that that was what I was hoping the new Zelda might be like but I don't recall anyone stating that was in game footage (in fact I recall them stating it was specifically not in game footage and seeing Metroid did not necessarily mean there was a new Metroid game in the works).

Plus we all kinda knew a game couldn't look that good realtime yet :(

Re:Cartoony? How disappointing! (1)

archen (447353) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213285)

When I saw the word "cartoon" I was thinking, cool Zelda is going to get some cool anime type form! Unfortunatly Link is now the lost power puff girl.

Sorry, but no thanks.

Good animation, bad stills (2, Informative)

MadMilkman (456690) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213115)

I thought the animation was incredible. Link's movements were decent, but the enemies featured in the shot were hilarious. On the other hand, the shots of Zelda standing still looked like fan-art from a very confused 12 year old. Only time will tell if this method works. But if you're looking for a more conventional game, check out the Mario Sunrise converage. Now THAT looks like a complex 3D environment.

Re:Good animation, bad stills (1)

jt007 (459122) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213307)

any chance you have a link to this Mario Sunrise you mention, id love to see it

It will be a love-hate relationship (2)

Lizard_King (149713) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213116)

According to IGN's poll:

Legend of Zelda for GameCube -- like the new look, or not?

24.6% - This is the worst day of my life

20.1% - I love it!

18% - I'm not so sure

15.7% - Huh? What have they done?!?

10.8% - I like it

5.7% - I don't like it at all

4.8% - It's ok

Seems like you will either love it or hate it

Re:It will be a love-hate relationship (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#2213170)

Seems like you will either love it or hate it

Considering that less than half the responses were for the love or hate options, it's more likely that you will fall somewhere in the middle.

Re:It will be a love-hate relationship (1)

freakonaleash881 (230730) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213262)

When I first saw it, I thought it was a joke...My dissapointment shot sky-high when I realized it wasn't. The original demo looked IMHO a million times better.

I hope I'm wrong, thogh. We have to remember that this is a very early demo, maybe the South Park look will go away in favor of something...I don't know, not South Park looking =).

Shigeru Miyamoto is a frigging genius, though, so maybe he knows something we don't.

first impression (1)

cavemanf16 (303184) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213119)

Reminds me of the old PS game, PaRappa the Rappa. That game was sorta cool, but because of the idea behind the game: Mash buttons in rythm to the beats to become the best 'rappa' around. Why would you change the virtual world of Zelda? It's like going from 2d overhead 'simulated' 3dimensional space (Zelda 1), to an isometric view (SuperNES Zelda), to full 3d (N64 Zelda), and then back to some wierd mixture of 2d characters in a 3d world (Gamecube Zelda). That's like putting us four dimensional humans into a 6 dimensional space!

Jet Set (grind) Radio (1)

BiggestPOS (139071) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213122)

Awesome game. I uhh, downloaded the Japanese version, played through it despite the language barrier, and loved it. Hard game too. This reminds me of that quite a bit.

not lifelike (1)

jeffy124 (453342) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213123)

looking at the pictures, they arent as life-like as past games have been. Character faces are very flat, like pre-Renissance (sp?) era paintings. It looks like the game is not taking good advantage on the graphical performance a system like gamecube offers. Nintendo has prided themselves on graphical performance and have strove for better graphics ever since the original 8 bit system came out in '85. I think they're taking a step backwards in graphics technology development by using cartoony graphics in a game series as popular as Zelda.

Re:not lifelike (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#2213212)

>Nintendo has prided themselves on graphical performance and have strove for better graphics ever since the original 8 bit system came out in '85

Actually as of recently Nintendo has had a lot of public statements inforcing their policy that gameplay is more important then graphics.
I've read a few articles where they more or less trash the way current games are made with 2 year timeframes for a 30 minute game with little to no replay value. Point being a lot of people still enjoy Quake I and II no matter how nice the newer games look comparitively.

Cartoon? CHEESY! (2)

cruise (111380) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213124)

Who cares about cartoons.

All I care about his extreeme detail on eyeballs, bits of brain and skull, rib cage bones, and knee joints as they fly in every direction after killing your enemy.

Race games are fun too.

Kick, Punch, it's all in the mind.. (1)

cyb3r0ptx (106843) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213128)

Is it just me, or does this look like the sequel to Parappa the Rappa? Although Parappa was a fun game, I like the look of the old Zelda better.

Sequels (1)

BLEUU (243214) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213131)

My opinion is that the general look and feel of a game should not change drastically. If it does, then it should be called by another name not XXXIII. I'm tired of sequels anyway, video games are following the path of Hollywood, which I'm not too impressed with.
My two cents.


Hilary Rosen (415151) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213136)

The article says: "it stands to reason it will still have the patented Z-trigger lock-on battle system".


Now I will have to buy an X-Box.


Lord Kenja (45995) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213162)

Hmmm... If I remember correctly the 'Z-Trigger' is the 'gun trigger' like button on the controller of the N64...

So they patented a system for locking on to a target by using their controllers 'Z-Trigger' ?


merlin_jim (302773) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213274)

The article says: "it stands to reason it will still have the patented Z-trigger lock-on battle system".


Software patents are evil, but this isn't a software patent... its a patent on a unique and novel user interface mechanism which Nintendo paid a lot of money (in the form of user interface studies) to develop, and it easily copied by other companies. Now, if they patented the particular method of implementing this user interface, THAT would be evil...

Linkappa The Rapper? (1)

viper21 (16860) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213139)

I'm sorry, but I think that this has to be the wrong direction for this game. Moving from a sprite based game to a 3d rendered game was a great move.... but that is where it should have stayed.

Is Nintendo trying to prove that they can create something that looks as rediculous as Parappa The Rapper? =) When I saw the shots of that trailer, I was just waiting to see a Toon Onion telling me how to dance.


well... (1)

djocyko (214429) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213146)

it looks sweet. for a cartoon. I am really impressed with it, actually. Realtime high quality cartoonage. Now if only they didn't waste zelda on it.

But you gotta realize their target audience. They want kids to play. They want really kid-friendly games. Too bad we lose out.

looks childish... (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#2213148)

i think that the idea is quite fantastic. however the animation looks like what we see on saturday morning cartoons nowadays, it just looks childish to the extreme. if they took more of an anime style high-quality animation, it might make me want to buy a gamecube. as of right now, i'm still going for the ps2... good try nintendo

i cant wait..... (1)

beast6228 (472737) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213149)

Man i cant wait for nintendo to release their new console....nintendo really is a great company...ecspecially since they tend to keep their consoles alive as long as possible unlike other gaming cosole makers.

and that power pc processor nintendo is going to use,will open up all kinds of cool things for it like "linux"

"when im not being mean,im actually a nice guy"

Can't wait (3, Informative)

Nerds (126684) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213150)

I really want to play this game, too bad it's not supposed to come out until next Christmas. It's kinda funny that a lot of people looked at the new Mario title and said "It's disappointing because it just looks like Mario64 but prettier" and then complained when the new Zelda didn't look like Ocarina only prettier.

I've read all kinds of opinions on this thing and it seems that everyone who was actually at the show was apprehensive at first, but by the end of the clip they loved it. That, along with the fact that there is a year of development time left, and, well, because I just think it looks cool, has convinced me that Nintendo knows what they are doing and aren't afraid to try something because they think it would be fun. Sega and Nintendo are the real trailblazers when it comes to video games, the PS2 and XBox can go take a running jump.

Who cares if it looks cartoony? (2, Funny)

PoitNarf (160194) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213165)

Zelda2 looked like crap, but did anyone care? No. The game was almost IMPOSSIBLE to beat. It was good graphics for back then anyways. I really don't care what this Zelda game looks like, as long as it uses the GameCubes full capabilities I'm happy. I just want it to take a LOT to beat it, not 2 days like the first N64 Zelda game took.

Nintendo, there better not be any annoying talking fairy following Link around the whole damn time!

Nice idea, too bad it looks awful. (1)

Dimensio (311070) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213176)

As others have seed, the current screenshots don't look very pretty (I did like the 'art of a confused 12-year old fanboy' comment).

I'm not opposed to a Zelda game taking a cartoon approach -- though I'd rather see a more realistic rendering method -- but I do hope that the character designs being shown were early prototypes and that the finished product will have a more anime look to it. Even if it looks like a cartoon, it could look like an epic-adventure type of cartoon rather than South Park.

(Not that I don't like South Park)

Re:Nice idea, too bad it looks awful. (1)

merlin_jim (302773) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213304)

(Not that I don't like South Park)

My problem is that I don't like South Park for the eigth installment (including GB games) in a series that I *still* buy on release day and play beginning to end.

On the anime front, looks like they're doing cell shading which, unfortunately, is not high-quality. With that kind of technology, I don't think you can do anime-style rendering.

Nintendo, if you're reading this, please look into a better technology! I love the way you went with this, but the rendering has to be a little better. Don't kill my favorite franchise of all time just cause the technology sucks!

Cell Shading = Old News (3, Informative)

derrickh (157646) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213178)

They're just using the age old method of 'cell shading'. 3D apps like lightwave have had this for ages. And the Dreamcast already did a game using cell shading(Jet Grind Radio) last year.

In fact, there's a good chance that cell shading is less intensive than regular texture mapping. You dont have to worry about moving huge textures in and out of memory and your color pallete drops from millions of colors to thousands.


Re:Cell Shading = Old News (2)

SuiteSisterMary (123932) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213241)

When I got Final Fantasy VII for my PC, I thought it looked great. I believe it was Gourard shading; no textures on the models, at least. FF VIII and MGS, however, looked like poodoo, with low-res textures. I think that 3d will become ultimate when there are no textures; it's all shaded polygons. After all, get enough polygons, shade them correctly, and it'll look like your texture. :-)

Re:Cell Shading = Old News (3, Interesting)

egomaniac (105476) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213256)

True, cel shading has been around for a long time (what, ten years or so?). However, Nintendo's take on it is unbelievably advanced, with very impressive lighting and shading -- this makes Jet Grind Radio look like crap in comparison. I think saying that "they're just using the age old method of 'cell [sic] shading'" is doing them a tremendous disservice.

You might as well be saying that we shouldn't get excited about today's 2GHz machines, because after all they're just the same old von Neumann machines we've had for decades, while ignoring the fact that modern machines are millions of times faster and doing tricks John von Neumann never even dreamed of. This really is groundbreaking stuff, folks.

It's not just the rendering technique (2)

interiot (50685) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213278)

  • ... The door warps outward exaggeratedly before it bursts, whereupon the soldier stands in a cloud of smoke. ...

C'mon, it's not just the rendering technique. Video games are always moving closer to looking like your character is part of a movie. Graphics alone doesn't do it... art and atmosphere contribute significantly to that. If Zelda can do all this when you're playing, it will be a lot better than Jet Grind Radio.

Beauty! (2)

ackthpt (218170) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213182)

I like it. Now if they'd consider reviving some older games with this view, I just may have to take out a loan and buy them all, all over again, for the new box. Exactly what game marketing people want to hear, YET, they won't do it because they fail to see there's a lot of gold in the past!

A few games that would do well with this:

Bard's Tale

Impossible Mission

Questron/Legacy of the Ancients

Come to think of it... a version of Larn or Nethack with such a display would kick butt.

ha ha (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#2213183)

The screenshots look like Parappa the Rapper.

In the rain or in the snow, I feel the funky flow.
North-West-South-West; that's the way ya gotta go.

Re:ha ha (2)

leperjuice (18261) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213265)

Now check and turn the signal to the left/
Now chack and turn the signal to the right/
When I say "Boom boom boom" you say "Bam bam bam"/
No pause in between, come on let's jam!

Article directly from the man, about the change. (3, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#2213185)

That article explains it and I think does a decent job of getting his message across.

Looks Like Herdy Gerdy (1)

yunfat (200898) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213186)

It looks as if Miyamoto liked Herdy Gerdy, [] so much... he decided a cartoon game would be a good way to showcase the new system. Its pretty clear that the new console horsepower is allowing Miyamoto and others to design movies (cartoons) you can play.

Greetings from Spaceworld (Wish You Were Here) (2)

BIGJIMSLATE (314762) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213195)

My friend sent me a video he took of it at the Spaceworld show, and I'm still not sure what I think.

It LOOKS like it could be a "remake" of the original game, in a pseudo 3d world, which could be really good, or really bad, depending on how Nintendo handles it. Or, it could just be completely "original", with Link fighting the baddies we all grew up with, ending with the evil Gannon [none of this Mask of Majora or Ganondorf crap]. ;)

And the cartoon cell-shading thing? Isn't it just a BIT overused? Games like Jet Set/Grind Radio pretty much made it look as cool as possible, but now with it being used on dozens of new PS2, XBOX, and now GCN games, I'm starting to think if everyone is just running to make the next "cool" game using this "new" "cool" effect. There's nothing wrong with that if ALL, if all these games use it to their own advantages. But if a game has it for no real purpose beyond it just being there, I struggle to see the whole point of it.

Unfortunately, that's gaming's biggest problem now. They all want to make "the next Half-Life" or "the next Tony Hawk". Very few will try and go ahead and make something original like Shenmue or Max Payne.

And note, if the poor quality shots aren't enough, most people probably don't realize that there's a poor quality video to go along with it (plaintext link): vi es/

Is that Dirk?, or Link (1)

Overphiend (227888) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213199)

Those shots really reminded me of the old Dragons Lair game.

Argh? (1)

Monthenor (42511) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213205)

I'd like to thank all those people making PaRappa I can't get Navi's rapping outta my head:

Navi: Swing, roll, LinkLinkLink!
Link: *swing*, *roll*, *jump*
Navi: Nonono...swing, roll, Link Over-over here!
Link: *swing*, *roll*, *block*
Navi: You're adventurin' bad! LinkLink *tinkle* swing roll over here *tinkle*!

The horror...the horror...

Crap (2)

SuiteSisterMary (123932) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213210)

Zelda looks to be one of the first games to pit gamers in a convincing cartoon environment, complete with all the dazzling animations, particle effects, and exaggerated look one would expect.

I think that would be Jet Set Radio.

polygons (1)

mr100percent (57156) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213211)

It looks less polygon-ish, which is a good thing, though it makes me think of Dragon's Lair, or was it Dragon Quest? the cartoon game?

LAME (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#2213215)

Is this going to be anything like "Dragon's Lair" at the arcades?? If it is then this is the worst mistake Nintendo can make. There's a reason that Dragon's Lair is in the free section of your local nickel arcade: It sucks.

But aren't the graphics great?? And listen to the character voices, so life-like!! But how much fun is it to move the joypad up and down and jam on the sword to trigger a sequence of animations?? It's fucking nar. I want interactivity, and this "cartoon" thing looks like a joke.

ummm (2)

linuxpng (314861) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213217)

what happened to this?

is this not the same game? These are the screenshots for zelda that have been around for months now. Perhaps it's not a launch title because they changed the format recently?

Zelda CD-i (1)

hal0802 (240758) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213227)

Actually, Zelda as already been a cartoon ... on CD-i.
Those were really bad games made by Philips who got the license.
More infos available : Faces of Evil [] , Wand of Gamelon [] and Zelda Adventure [] .

Does anyone remember the 80's Mario cartoon? (2)

mikeage (119105) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213230)

I barely do :)
I do remember that Fridays were Zelda... so this isn't such a new idea after all! If anyone actually does remember this... I don't... and I'd love for you to help me out here ;)

Re:Does anyone remember the 80's Mario cartoon? (1)

Alakaboo (171129) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213297)

Oh yes, that was the best cartoon growing up. They were alway chasing after the TriForce. It was a riot!

My childhood consisted of: Play Super Mario Bros. 3 (remember the racoon tail and frog suit?), play Zelda II, take a break to watch the cartoon, beg parents for Super Nintendo, repeat...

Oh, and excuuuuuuse me, Princess!

In my humble opinion... (1)

AnalogBoy (51094) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213236)


Seriously... The entire reason i've bought ANY of the previous game systems was Zelda, Mega Man [sob] and Metroid... Occasionally Mario. I'm not a huge gamer, but those are the only games i've ever played since I was 5 years old. I'm not a huge fan of 3D worlds - My favorite zelda of all had to be Link to the Past. Theres something to be said about the flat overheads that i just didnt get from N64. I disliked Ocarina of Time's gameplay enough that i sold my N64 and didnt even bother playing the new zelda.

The approach of this new game is just too odd for my comfort - What i'd love to see them do though is bundle that cartridge with a "Super mario all-stars" like redo of all the previous games (well, maybe they can leave out Adventure of Link). Then i'd buy it.

Next: (2)

Satai (111172) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213237)

Next Up: GameCube remake of Dragon's Lair.

But seriously, this looks kind of neat. The Zelda games have always had a subtle sense of humor, and this one seems to make it far less subtle and far more Chuck Jones. (Now, I'm basing that on the article - I don't have a QuickTime viewer on this system.) That doesn't have to be a bad thing; often the unexpected is the best. I've enjoyed every Zelda Game up to this point - and since I'm pretty terrible at games, they've all had lots of time dedicated.

...with the notable exception of the CDi games.

yeah, nice one nintendo (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#2213239)

They just stole SEGA's cel-shading technique from Jet Set Radio. And instead of it looking like an anime, it looks like a wimpy kiddie cartoon. Way to go nintendo, that'll get you the over-6 crowd.

there's no reason for me to get a cube now. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#2213250)

I never had an N64. I got a PSX instead. I was always tempted to get the N64 though because of zelda and the starwars games, primarily zelda. Unfortunately that was all nintendo could do to distract me from Metal Gear Solid and Resident Evil et al. After seeing this zelda nonsense it looks like i'll sooner buy a used cheepo N64 than buy gamecube. I like microsoft just about as much as the rest of you, but I'm kinda psyched about the XBox now. I don't know what i'm saying, i don't even have a PS2.

Well there's innovation.. and then there's lame. (1)

justin_w_hall (188568) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213253)

Is it me or does Link look like a walking hieroglyph in this? I look at that face and I just get annoyed.

The animation looks spectacular, but the characters just look lame. They could have made him look SO much better.

It looks like gameplay may improve a bit. But it's disappointing that Nintendo tried to go with shock value, making the characters look radically (and horribly, IMHO) different, instead of maybe concentrating on innovative gameplay.

Now this is obviously all speculative, as all I've seen is a 20 second clip or whatever, and I can't tell if gameplay's gonna improve, and who knows if they'll keep these changes.

All I know is I liked the look of the graphics in the initial movie from E3 (with Link and Ganon fighting) - THAT'S the Zelda games I remember. Not a Saturday morning battle for the Triforce. Or if you're going to use cartoons, go hire the animators from "The Batman and Superman Adventures" (or the greatest cartoon of all time, Transformers). Don't make Link look like a Nickelodeon cartoon.

Metroid (2)

FortKnox (169099) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213257)

Just don't make metroid a cartoon... that's all I care about...

It's about the *gameplay*, stupid (2)

DG (989) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213260)

Maybe I'm in the minority here, but what has always impressed me most about the N64 Zeldas (my entry point into the Zelda story) has been the wonderfully balanced gameplay and control.

They've always managed to strike a perfect balance between challenge/difficulty, and achievability. Puzzles are tough, but not obscure. Beating bosses are a challenge, but don't take nanosecond twitch responses to pull off. There's no "find the magic pixel" or "die a thousand deaths".

Future game developers would do well to study the N64 Zeldas. They're as close to perfect as any game I've ever played.

SNES Zelda Rocked, N64 Zelda SUCKED (1)

robvasquez (411139) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213306)

The Nintendo 64 Zelda was a cartooony weak, kiddy piece of shit, like 90% of nintendo games. The wrestling games are the only thing that made the N64 what it is

The Super nintendo Link to the Past was nothing short of an epic masterpiece.

They could have done some killer isometric view, Diablo style, or done some nice top view but 3D.

This cartoon style could be promising, in general I'm not much for cartoons but I love to see some variety.

It's the logical move (5, Funny)

novarese (24280) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213279)

It makes sense that they would go back to a more figurative representation of the characters instead of continuing to pursue photorealism.

Once you can do photorealistic images (or even get close to it), what do you do next? We already know the answer, because it already happend in fine art. The greeks and romans perfected realistic sculpture, and all sculpture afterwards became more figurative (see byzantine and gothic sculpture). The renaissance artists perfected photorealsim through use of perspective techniques etc, and what followed?

OK, so we're not yet at real-time rendering of final fantasy-quality movies on our desktop, but it's just a matter of raw computing power at this point; there's no new conceptual territory to cover. Hardware will continue to advance, and we will eventually have realtime photorealistic rendering, but expect the mainstream game designers to go back to figurative representations, at least until the next big technology comes along (holographic games, anyone?)

this is the worst day of my life (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#2213295)

just what it said on the poll...

My Hero, Link (1)

the_ph0x` (170740) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213301)

The Zelda series has captured me from day one with its release of a golden carted game, 'The Legend of Zelda'. and it has kept me entwined in its evolution over the years. Through the different incarnations of Link and his adventures, he has never lost the fantasy-realism feeling. Even though the look and play of the N64 versions was drasticly different from the originals, it still had that feeling. The thing was that I could always feel the game i guess. I'm in no way knocking 'cartoons' either - I can usually empathise with the characters in them - depending of course how they were written..., but it almost seems like the same as re-drawing Ninja Scroll into Dragon-Half style animation.

I just hope it's all still there with this new fandangled thing.


This doesn't feel right... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 13 years ago | (#2213303)

I don't think that Nintendo should take one of the few darker-themed games and make it lighthearted, sunny and happy.

Dragon's Lair ^ 10 (1)

wsapplegate (210233) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213305)

This must be what Don Bluth wanted to do with Dragon's Lair and its offspring, Space Ace. Too bad they weren't interactive enough. This time, maybe we have got a REAL interactive cartoon. But I hope this kind of game will be done on other platforms, 'cause I don't like Nintendo...

It's ok (1)

Steven-LC (257086) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213324)

Reminds me of that game that was in the arcades years ago based around a laser disk.... I forget the name now.

Dragon's Lair?

Lighten up (2)

SirSlud (67381) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213325)

The CPad .. the handheld .. the side scroller ... Nintendo has been responsible for so much of what is taken for granted in the console industry that it's always amusing to see people trash Nintendo.

Sure, you may not be a fan of the style in the screenshots and movie, but it does highlight what Nintendo has always been good at: innovation.

Other developers are usually content to raise the bar on the present set of conventions and standards, in terms up updated graphics (making the characters look more lifelike), etc .. Nintendo has always focused on innovative game play and a unique approach to old franchises.

I for one think that the style Nintendo is going for here is refreshing - way too many games take themselves way too seriously. And Link has always held an element of novelty and humour. I mean, how serious can you be when you're a green-garbed elf who occasionally stops by the chicken coup to ruffle a few feathers for the fun of it?

And, for the 20somethings who really won't touch a game unless its covered in blood, don't worry - Nintendo is handling their licencing issues far better this time around. We've seen some evidence that Microsoft's money will ultimatetly help see tons of the Xbox titles get ported to game cube, hopefully shutting up the thousands of console FANBOYS who only seem to pledge allegiance to systems with the darkest most 'adult' image, regardless of the reality.

New Zelda = Dragon's Lair? (2)

tenzig_112 (213387) | more than 13 years ago | (#2213326)

The move to cartoon Zelda was not just a demo for the GameCube's shaders- it also is meant to simplify gameplay.

Many game fans are put off by the complexity of most RPG's. Zelda titles have been much simpler than most, but all the same, it will be simplified to appeal to a larger audience.

Instead of epic quests for a glowing sword or whatever, you just try to survive from room to room. Example: your guy runs into a room and rocks start falling- what do you do? Pick a direction to run in and that's it. If you choose wrong, you die. Try again. No health status and objects to find- no alternate endings or pointless side quests.

Nintendo has plans to make a space-oriented cartoon Zelda for release in Japan early 2002. []

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