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Microsoft Finally Selling Xbox One Without Kinect

Soulskill posted about 4 months ago | from the paranoid-gamers-to-save-big-on-tinfoil dept.

Input Devices 227

DroidJason1 writes: "Microsoft has unbundled the Kinect from the Xbox One. The unbundled system's price now matches the PlayStation 4. Microsoft is touting 'your feedback' as the reason for this move. Any Xbox One functionality that relies on voice, video, gestures, etc, will not work without a Kinect, and users will be able to purchase a standalone Kinect later this year."

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LOL (5, Funny)

sexconker (1179573) | about 4 months ago | (#46991979)

The 180s never cease.

Re:LOL (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992013)

We may get our xbone720 yet

Re:LOL (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992029)

Just a few short comments on your code:

Separation of concerns:
You should separate functionality into different parts. Currently your main method does everything. For small applications like this, that may not be a problem, but as soon as you have larger applications, it becomes more and more unpractical.

You should thus extract your "logic" into a method:

private static int countSuccessiveZeros(int[] values) {
            int maxLength = 0;
            int tempLength = 0; //.... // Looping here
            return maxLength;
}

Now if you wanted to not count zeros, but twos, you could simply modify the code to the following:

private static int countSuccessive(int[] values, int target) {
            int maxLength = 0;
            int tempLength = 0; //Your loop here, instead of 0 use target to compare
            return maxLength;
}

This also makes your main-method more readable:

public static void main(String[] args) {
            int[] values = {1, 2, 0, 0, 2, 4, 0, 2, 0, 0, 0, 5, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 7, 0};
            int successiveZeros = countSuccessive(values, 0);
            System.out.println("Maximum number of consecutive zeros : " + successiveZeros);
}

Naming:
Very nice, a compliment. Your variable names are short, clear, descriptive and follow Java conventions (camelCase). Keep it up ;)

Re:LOL (5, Informative)

NotDrWho (3543773) | about 4 months ago | (#46992103)

With the Xbox One, MS has been backpedaling faster than Lance Armstrong approaching a drug-test checkpoint. Suddenly all those bad ideas that were so "essential" are turning into what they were all along: just fucking bad ideas.

Re:LOL (4, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992219)

And it should still be at least $100 cheaper than the PS4, considering it is inferior (slower GPU, slower RAM, less RAM, no secondary CPU).

Re:LOL (4, Interesting)

nine-times (778537) | about 4 months ago | (#46992387)

Not just that, but they're putting the start menu back in Windows. I'm starting to like this new CEO.

Re:LOL (2, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46993151)

Now that Bill Gates is back at the helm, I have more hope for Microsoft. Good riddance to Baldmer the sweaty blob.

Re:LOL (0)

Spy Handler (822350) | about 4 months ago | (#46992423)

mod parent up for knowing the difference between pedal and peddle. I do believe this is the first time I've seen it spelled correctly on Slashdot; everyone else thinks it's "backpeddling".

Re:LOL (2)

CanHasDIY (1672858) | about 4 months ago | (#46992445)

mod parent up for knowing the difference between pedal and peddle. I do believe this is the first time I've seen it spelled correctly on Slashdot; everyone else thinks it's "backpeddling".

It's a comon error; nothing too loose your shit over...

Oh I dunno (3, Informative)

goldcd (587052) | about 4 months ago | (#46992719)

In this context "peddle" seems pretty appropriate.
We tried to peddle something, nobody wanted.
We reversed our unpopular stance by back-pedalling, and now we're back peddling.


Just whilst I'm on the topic, I'm most narked (and I accept alone), in actually *liking* the original "always-on-in-the-cloud" original XBone pitch.
The kinect can just wither and die though - voice was great. Camera...oh I'm sure it looked great in the pitch.
Media stuff looked pretty damn good when I was convinced they were going to sell it as a cable/ADSL streaming trojan Tivo+ box. I've now no idea wtf they were thinking.
Sell an XBone+ with 1080 games and you can refurb the millions you've sold as leased cable boxes.

Re:LOL (4, Funny)

Megane (129182) | about 4 months ago | (#46992819)

It's a comon error; nothing too loose your shit over...

Your right, their's alot of things worse then that.

Re:LOL (2)

Billy the Mountain (225541) | about 4 months ago | (#46992465)

Yeah but I would think that unbundling would be a form of backpeddling.

No. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46993083)

Maybe if they were buying the unit back from you, that would be "backpeddling."

As it is, they are just providing a new offering.

Re:LOL (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992501)

Bad analogy. Backpedaling that bike doesn't change your forward momentum.

Re:LOL (1)

John Nemesh (3244653) | about 4 months ago | (#46992681)

Nor will it change Microsoft's downward spiral....

Re:LOL (2)

Ravaldy (2621787) | about 4 months ago | (#46992809)

You could be naïve and think that their original strategy to launch the product as a bundle had deeper rooted issues. Issues that would now have been weeded out. What I mean is that it could have been viewed as a good strategy to have a full package but when the public showed disapproval it was already too late to turn around. Months of code had already been written around the Kinect so to release on time they needed to keep it as is. Only later does the team manage to re-write the critical code and allow for a non-Kinect experience.

Re:LOL (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46993261)

The worst part was the dual-edged bait and switch they did at E3 and the eventual result that launched.

The whole "good and bad" situation where they actually had some really good features, but awful features too. Everyone moaned. THEN THEY REMOVED ALL OF THE FEATURES.
Even Sony aren't that bad/stupid. They only removed Linux, which upset like 5 people that actually used it since it was worthless even if you were good at Linux. I think literally the only good use it had was as a boot-to-browser so you never had to use that piece of crap Netfront browser. WHICH THEY STILL USE. WHY?!

I somewhat wonder if Don wanted to destroy the Xbox division on purpose. Even though he got fired, he already had another job waiting for him with no effort.
I wonder if he was paid to do it. That would be hilarious. Is that legal actually? Can you pay a competing companies employees to deliberately worsen a product? I assume that is probably illegal. Even though it is only morally wrong, offering another companies employees more money than the company is paying them isn't as far as I know. Eh, not a lawyer, etc.

Correction / FTFY (5, Funny)

brunes69 (86786) | about 4 months ago | (#46992007)

s/Your feedback/A massive lack of sales

Re:Correction / FTFY (5, Informative)

rsborg (111459) | about 4 months ago | (#46992153)

s/Your feedback/A massive lack of sales

In Capitalist USA, where dollars = votes, this is the best form of feedback.

Re:Correction / FTFY (0)

cyborg_monkey (150790) | about 4 months ago | (#46992591)

Then Windows 8 would be a different experience, if that were true.

Re:Correction / FTFY (1)

ArcadeMan (2766669) | about 4 months ago | (#46992901)

It totally is a different experiene! It's called Mavericks!

Re:Correction / FTFY (1)

ArcadeMan (2766669) | about 4 months ago | (#46992907)

*experience*

Turning spellcheck back on...

Re:Correction / FTFY (2)

Opportunist (166417) | about 4 months ago | (#46992531)

Well, technically it's feedback. Not only that, but it's also the only feedback they care about.

Re:Correction / FTFY (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992789)

"s/Your feedback/A massive lack of sales"

There's no difference. Sadly if only people would vote with their wallets all the time we'd all have the things we actually wanted available from the get go.

Microsoft misses the point. (-1, Troll)

jellomizer (103300) | about 4 months ago | (#46992019)

The Price isn't what is making people choose the PS4 over the XBox. But the fact you can access internet services such as Netflix without having to pay a monthly fee, to access data you are already paying for.

The PS4 gives you Netflix without PlayStation points, but you need XBox Live Gold to get get Netflix.

No Xbox live gold isn't that expensive... However if you need to cramp down on a budget, it is one of the first things you will stop paying for.

Re:Microsoft misses the point. (5, Informative)

MozeeToby (1163751) | about 4 months ago | (#46992057)

The very same announcement also announced that a Gold membership will no longer be required for streaming services.

Re:Microsoft misses the point. (2)

Opportunist (166417) | about 4 months ago | (#46992539)

And I bet if people who care about that didn't have a PS4 already, that could actually be beneficial for sales.

Re:Microsoft misses the point. (2, Insightful)

Anubis IV (1279820) | about 4 months ago | (#46992697)

You'll pardon me for not being thrilled that they've finally stopped charging a fee to use services which we already pay for. That they've finally stopped doing something they never should have done is good news, to be sure, but not exactly something to get excited about, given that all of their competitors (e.g. Nintendo, Sony, Apple, Google, Amazon, Roku, etc.) have been doing it the right way from the beginning with their boxes that connect to TVs.

Re:Microsoft misses the point. (1)

MozeeToby (1163751) | about 4 months ago | (#46992919)

Oh, I'm not defending it, merely pointing out that the parent's concern has been addressed. I don't have any particular side in this generation's fight, haven't yet found the time to play through more than a couple games from last generation. If I did have a preference it would reluctantly be for the PS4 because they managed to have reasonable policies from day one; reluctant because of all the crap Sony has pulled over the years.

Re:Microsoft misses the point. (2)

Anubis IV (1279820) | about 4 months ago | (#46993063)

Fair enough.

And yeah, I don't have a horse in this race yet either, though I have all three from the last generation. Even so, I distinctly remember the sour taste in my mouth when I got my 360 and discovered I'd have to pay them for the privilege of viewing Netflix, and then being thankful that I already had my Wii, PS3, and Apple TV hooked up and ready to go.

Re:Microsoft misses the point. (1)

Ralph Wiggam (22354) | about 4 months ago | (#46992061)

The PS4 gives you Netflix without PlayStation points, but you need XBox Live Gold to get get Netflix.

Microsoft announced yesterday that starting in June you will not need Gold to use Netflix and other apps.

http://www.theverge.com/2014/5/13/5712696/microsoft-dropping-xbox-live-gold-requirement-netflix-rumor

Re:Microsoft misses the point. (1)

Desler (1608317) | about 4 months ago | (#46992097)

Even if true, a rumor is not an announcement from Microsoft. Just sayin...

Re:Microsoft misses the point. (1)

Desler (1608317) | about 4 months ago | (#46992119)

Never mind, the did make an announcement to affirm the rumor.

Re:Microsoft misses the point. (1)

gstoddart (321705) | about 4 months ago | (#46992207)

Well, given their track record of circulating rumors, then making announcements to deny the rumor, then making a contradictory announcement denying the previous announcement denying the rumor, then having more rumors, then having an announcement to confirm the rumor followed by an announcement to deny the previous announcement ... you'll forgive us if we don't actually put any stock in what Microsoft says on the topic anymore.

Microsoft has changed their messaging on this product so many times as to make anything they say in the future something you have to assume is completely false.

Sorry, but no. They've been floundering on this all along, and mostly doing it in such a way that people aren't willing to invest in the game.

Re:Microsoft misses the point. (2)

LoneTech (117911) | about 4 months ago | (#46992063)

But the fact you can access internet services such as Netflix without having to pay a monthly fee, to access data you are already paying for.

Funny you should mention this.. that's another thing they just did a reversal on [engadget.com] .

Re:Microsoft misses the point. (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992071)

The Price isn't what is making people choose the PS4 over the XBox. But the fact you can access internet services such as Netflix without having to pay a monthly fee, to access data you are already paying for.

The PS4 gives you Netflix without PlayStation points, but you need XBox Live Gold to get get Netflix.

No Xbox live gold isn't that expensive... However if you need to cramp down on a budget, it is one of the first things you will stop paying for.

No, Microsoft in fact didn't miss that point, but you missed TFA:

Coming in June, anyone with an Xbox will be able to access popular entertainment experiences – whether or not you have an Xbox Live Gold membership. This includes great gaming apps like Machinima, Twitch and Upload, popular video services like Netflix, Univision Deportes, GoPro, Red Bull TV and HBO GO, sports experiences like the NFL app for Xbox One, MLB.TV, NBA Game Time, NHL Game Center and more.*** Microsoft experiences including Internet Explorer, Skype, OneDrive and OneGuide will also be available to all Xbox customers.**** You can find a full list of apps and features that will be available below.

Re:Microsoft misses the point. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992087)

The other announcement was that Neflix, Hulu, etc. would be available w/o a Gold subscription.

Re:Microsoft misses the point. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992111)

They're dropping the XBL requirement to get these services too.

Re:Microsoft misses the point. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992137)

And that is why (if you RTFA), Microsoft will be allowing access to all of it's entertainment apps, like Netflix, without the need for XBox Live Gold this June.

Re:Microsoft misses the point. (1)

necronom426 (755113) | about 4 months ago | (#46992181)

I'd also say the fact that PS4 games are usually in 1080p and XBone games are lower res is a factor, plus all the restrictions they were planning on that everyone hated. The whole thing was a PR nightmare.

So now they are the same price, but the PS4 is still more powerful.

If two things are the same price and one is more powerful, then I would expect people to buy the better, more powerful one.

Re:Microsoft misses the point. (1)

Billly Gates (198444) | about 4 months ago | (#46992187)

That my friend is why I did not bother to purchase one. MS got greedy here.

Now with the Amazon Fire I see no reason to buy such a device unless I want to game occasionally. I prefer PC anyway and I am rather busy these days

Re:Microsoft misses the point. (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992229)

Not only that, but the PS4 actually out performs the Xbox one by a decent margin despite them having very similary specifications in certain areas.

Re:Microsoft misses the point. (1)

UnknowingFool (672806) | about 4 months ago | (#46992491)

Now that Ballmer has left, hopefully MS will learn from its past mistakes. I understand that the strategy was to make Xbox One the centerpiece of a consumer's entertainment room. However the integral pieces of that strategy, the DRM, Kinect, phone-home, etc.has been a PR nightmare for them. At least MS seems to be listening to their fans and critics.

This is what happens (2)

nwaack (3482871) | about 4 months ago | (#46992037)

when you treat optional peripherals as though they were as integral as the controller itself. I'd say that hopefully MS learned their lesson but we all know they haven't.

Re:This is what happens (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992157)

And am I the only one creeped out about having an always-on camera connected directly to microsoft in my bedroom?

Re:This is what happens (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992259)

No you are not, however too many people are ok with it even though they should be concerned with this.

I'm watching you (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992039)

Every step you make
every move you make
I'm watching you.

Live membership requirement (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992045)

Microsoft also announced they are dropping the requirement to have an XBox Live membership to access third-party services like Hulu, Netflix, and HBO To Go. I couldn't understand why that was a requirement to begin with.

Re:Live membership requirement (1)

NotDrWho (3543773) | about 4 months ago | (#46992173)

Because they got away with it on the 360 and figured that they were so fucking awesome that everyone was going to put up with the same shit this generation too.

Too little, too late (5, Insightful)

gstoddart (321705) | about 4 months ago | (#46992047)

Starting from when they said there would be an always-on internet requirement (and then there wasn't), and then the whole "no selling of used games policy" (and then there wasn't), Microsoft has more or less annoyed. confused and alienated their potential user base.

Sure, some people will buy it no matter what.

But, for some of us, give us a gaming platform which doesn't need an internet connection, isn't providing an always on internet connected camera, and doesn't handcuff us to how you think we want to use it.

I don't want a gaming platform for Netflix, Hulu, Bing, Dong, Boing, or anything else. I'd also like to be able to play motion controlled games without an internet connection, because I'm not playing on-line games. Ever.

And, if you can't provide that to me, I don't want your product.

At this point, I see more value in buying a spare XBox 360 than even considering the XBone.

Re:Too little, too late (-1, Flamebait)

Mike Buddha (10734) | about 4 months ago | (#46992123)

You should learn how to read. There was never a "no selling of used games policy" and there was never an "always-on internet requirement". The Xbox One would check in with servers once a day to verify software licenses. If you wanted to sell used games, you'd have to use a mechanism to de-list the game from your Xbox One to make that license available for the person who bought it.

If read past the headlines you'd know this. I can't blame you for being confused, having never read the actual articles.

Re:Too little, too late (1)

Drethon (1445051) | about 4 months ago | (#46992183)

Well what this article says they had planned is about as annoying to me as a no used game policy: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/tec... [telegraph.co.uk]

Re:Too little, too late (2)

rsborg (111459) | about 4 months ago | (#46992269)

You should learn how to read. There was never a "no selling of used games policy" and there was never an "always-on internet requirement". The Xbox One would check in with servers once a day to verify software licenses. If you wanted to sell used games, you'd have to use a mechanism to de-list the game from your Xbox One to make that license available for the person who bought it.

If read past the headlines you'd know this. I can't blame you for being confused, having never read the actual articles.

You might want to actually read it yourself: http://www.cnet.com/news/micro... [cnet.com]

Parse the words all you like, but MSFT actually wanted to inactivate your console if it didn't phone home every 24 hours - despite the craziness of this idea, the practicality of it was insane - if I took it with me to another state and the trip took > 24h then I couldn't play it. If my internet died for 24+h I couldn't play it. Stupid.

Whoever is heading the Xbox division recently (or is pulling their strings on-high) is a complete moron, or they think you're the product that they're selling to the game manufacturers (or spy agencies).

Re:Too little, too late (4, Informative)

gstoddart (321705) | about 4 months ago | (#46992337)

You should learn how to read. There was never a "no selling of used games policy" and there was never an "always-on internet requirement".

Perhaps you should learn how to use Google?

Because at various times, Microsoft has announced those were (or would be) requirements.

I can't blame you for being confused, having never read the actual articles.

And I can't blame you for being a tool who hasn't really been following this saga. But, nonetheless, I will.

Because you're clearly ill-informed about all of the things Microsoft has said, and then retracted about this console. And, I can assure you, BOTH of those things had been announced and then changed by them.

Re:Too little, too late (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992535)

And how exactly is it supposed to phone home every 24 hours without a connection that's available at least every 24 hours? Dumbass.

Re:Too little, too late (1)

NotDrWho (3543773) | about 4 months ago | (#46992877)

Magic!!

Re:Too little, too late (5, Informative)

Anubis IV (1279820) | about 4 months ago | (#46993273)

You should learn how to read. There was never a "no selling of used games policy"

People in glass houses shouldn't call the kettle black. When Microsoft first spelled out how the One would work [ign.com] , they made it pretty clear (well, as clear as Microsoft legalese can be) that gamers couldn't sell their games to just anyone. Rather, gamers would only be able to sell their games to participating retailers, and even then, only if the game's publisher had opted-in to allowing resales for copies of that game (and then the publisher could optionally tack a fee onto the transaction too, thus decreasing how much money you get to take home).

Similarly, you couldn't sell it to friends or online folks. The only option would be to give it away to them, and, once again, you could only do so if the publisher had opted-in to allowing game trades between individuals. Oh, and an additional restriction was that each game could only ever be given away one time, and even then, only to people who had been on your friends list for at least 30 days. They also outright prohibited renting of games or loaning of physical copies of games to friends.

Given all of those ridiculous terms and conditions [time.com] , I can see how you might have been confused and failed to realize that the One had those policies in place when it was first announced. Even so, since you read the actual articles, I'd have hoped for better.

As for the always-on requirement, sure, you can play the pedant by pointing out it only needed to phone home once a day rather than constantly, but that's pointless, since it does nothing to address why the requirement was such a source of contention. The reason it was annoying was because it immediately eliminated a number of valid and legitimate use cases in which gamers wouldn't have a regular connection to the Internet. In the armed forces? Too bad. Internet down for a few days? Too bad. Just moved? Too bad. Traveling? Too bad. Out at sea? Too bad. Vacationing in your summer cabin? Too bad. Don't want to connect devices that have no practical need to be online? Too bad. Don't think a company has any business tracking what you're doing with offline, disc-based, single-player games? Too bad.

And the OP was being kind, since he skipped over all of the indie developer controversies that were around early on after the One's announcement, such as requiring that they work with a major publisher [eurogamer.net] . I also noticed that you didn't address his issues with the always-on camera and that they've since flip-flopped on that requirement as well.

The fact that Microsoft managed to make Sony look good, despite the fact that Sony was in the doghouse with virtually every gamer after all of the PSN stuff a few years back, just goes to show you how badly they messed up with the One's launch.

Disclaimer: I own all three consoles of the last gen, and none of the current gen consoles.

Re:Too little, too late (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992283)

I had only ever owned a Xbox and 360 since I was a kid. But I bought a ps4 this time. They've been pissing me off for a while now. But that E3 show was the last straw.

Re:Too little, too late (4, Insightful)

Graymalkin (13732) | about 4 months ago | (#46992863)

Microsoft has more or less annoyed. confused and alienated their potential user base.

Microsoft's big problem with their policies and backpedaling is that people like me simply cannot trust anything they say. Rational buyers aren't now going to run out and buy XBones because there's no guarantee Microsoft won't go back to their original policies once sales improve.

If anything they need to abandon disliked policies and declare publicly with some manner of legal obligation that they will never go back to them. Until then I won't even consider buying an XBone or any subsequent Microsoft console.

Re:Too little, too late (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992921)

I actually love my XB1 , more then my kids anyway. Dead Rising 3 is one of my favorite games , sure it's not perfect but I like it. I think the Amazon and Hulu apps work alot better then on my 360.

Re:Too little, too late (4, Interesting)

Dutch Gun (899105) | about 4 months ago | (#46993229)

For the past two console generations (since the original Xbox came out), I've owned every major console brand, but have generally preferred the Xbox. As such, all my games, except for console exclusives, were for Xbox. I found the original Xbox controllers to be superior to Nintendo's or Sony's consoles, and this trend continued until now. MS's "gamer score" was also rather addictive, and was one of their more brilliant ideas of the last generation of consoles. I've also been maintaining a gold account for many years, since most of my friends are on Live, and let's face it, the service was *vastly* superior to the offerings of any other company - of course, for a paid service, it damn well better be.

I may eventually purchase an Xbone, but it might very well come after a PS4, which surprised me. For every Wii or PS3 game, I probably have seven or eight Xbox/Xbox 360 games. I'm thinking about cancelling my Live account (although I recently signed up for another year, so it will be a while), as I rarely seem to play online with my friends these days, preferring solo play.

How did Microsoft lose me as a customer, at least so far?

1) No backward compatibility. I've got a pretty big Xbox 360 library, with a number of games I haven't started/finished or would like to perhaps play again. Backward compatibility would have virtually assured a purchase of an Xbone device, since I know that eventually there will be games on it that I'd like to play. However, I've got to decide now which console in my entertainment center will be displaced by a new console (I've currently got four - all three last gen plus a PS2), and that's my current limit of the switching box I have installed. Microsoft should have stuck with an x86 architecture for the 360, and we'd be able to play all three versions of Xbox games on the latest console with few issues. People argue that compatibility isn't critical (which is admittedly true), since I obviously already have a 360, but I'm literally at the point where I don't have any more room to plug in another console. So now that's just one more device I need to keep connected indefinitely as long as there exists a possibility of wanting to play a 360 game. There's also another message that no backward compatibility sends: we don't care about your loyalty as a customer.

2) Xbox as an advertising billboard. Microsoft decided to heavily monetize their console's connectivity with ads, even for those of us with Gold Live accounts. Either/or, Microsoft. I don't appreciate you double-dipping like that, and every time I see the massive wall of advertisements on every single page of my Xbox One, I get annoyed when I realized that I'm also paying for that service. At this point, I'm largely paying for Microsoft to simply serve me advertisements on my gaming console. Fuck that. Why should I pay hundreds of dollars for another platform that can assault me with non-stop ads between gaming sessions.

3) Disappointing "next-gen" experience. In general, the next-gen experience hasn't really wowed me. Games can barely even render at a full 1080p, for heaven's sake, which I certainly didn't expect of a "next-gen" console at this point. The hard drives are pathetically small, and the Xbone's, of all the idiotic things, is not user-upgradeable (unlike the PS4). It won't take too many installs or downloads before that's all used up, and then you're playing the shuffling game with your drive space.

4) Consumer-unfriendly arrogance. Phone home once per day or your Xbox bricks? Ok, I actually like the idea of being able to install your games and not having to put the disc in for validation. The only practical way to do this is to have an online check to make sure more than one person isn't using the same disc, but this could have been an optional setting, and the way they decided to ram this down people's throat was ridiculous. There was also the specter of killing the used-game market, and frankly, MS didn't have a lot of trust to spare at this point. Looks like MS didn't learn much about the incredible arrogance of Sony when the PS3 was launched, and how well that was received.

5) Kinnect. Good God, how did anyone think it should be a mandatory peripheral? Yes, a cute toy that *some* people would enjoy, but why make it part of the core experience and jack up the price by $100 for everyone? Good to see even MS can learn if you beat them over the head long and hard enough.

6) Focus on non-gaming features. An enormous amount of effort in Xbox One has gone to the "entertainment hub" portion of the console. Good for those who actually *use* those features, but really, other than streaming ripped movies from my media server (simply out of convenience), I use my console to play games. That's it. Every other feature they've added and talked incessantly about induces a yawn from me. I'm not opposed to them, as I know there's interest there from some folks, but if I'm going to buy a gaming console, you'd better have something to talk about other than the non-gaming features. And other than Kinnect.

7) No must-have next-gen games for me so far. I'm a huge fan of RPGs of nearly any stripe (bother western and JRPGs), but I also enjoy action/adventure games (like Uncharted), the occasional shooters (Halo series), puzzle/platforms (Limbo, Puzzle Quest), and a few other scattered genres. I never game online with strangers, and when I do play with friends, I tend to prefer co-op games - not really all that into competitive gaming. Until I see a next-gen game as compelling to me as Skyrim, I'll probably sit on the sidelines and watch the brands duke it out.

I've been sitting back since a year ago, and have been astounded by how badly Microsoft has handled this console generation. I was one of those customers who was theirs to lose, and they did a pretty amazing job of killing my enthusiasm in their newest console. Unbelievable, really.

   

Gamers no Likey (1)

puddingebola (2036796) | about 4 months ago | (#46992135)

Gamers don't like to Kinect, maybe because when the One was released, they were told they would always have to connect. Then when MS said developers could remove the ability to play used games, the gamers began to connect the dots. MS seems to have connected with their customers and made a connection between things they don't like about the new console and their sales numbers relative to their biggest competitor. Has this connected?

Re:Gamers no Likey (1)

Billly Gates (198444) | about 4 months ago | (#46992221)

Kinnect does show promise with voice activation and skype which is cool. I wanted one for this reason. The xboxONE had a promise of being more than just a gamer system like the Sony is.

  That is until I found out I needed a gold account with a monthly payment. No thanks I will just use my pc for this thank you very much.

Re:Gamers no Likey (1)

NotDrWho (3543773) | about 4 months ago | (#46992475)

You needed a Gold account to do ANYTHING on a Xbox One. That's something else they just backpedaled on too.

Get rid of gold acct for Netflix (1)

Billly Gates (198444) | about 4 months ago | (#46992151)

I know this is an anti MS tech site but I was favoring an xbox over a PS4.

The reason being is I am not a heavy gamer. I wanted a nice OS platform that was more a media center with a dvr, netflix, skype ready, voice activated system that could play games too but did a little of everything.

Sony fanboys have been saying it is sooo much faster thinking it is 2007 all over again. But in reality the performance differences have been similiar. They are almost the same hardware with the xbox slightly slower but with faster shared ram for more multitasking stuff.

Unless you are talking exclusives I see no reason to chose a ps4 for my needs. ... however I did not bother purchasing one as I did not want to pay twice for Hulu and Netflix with a gold account. It wasn't the $100 difference up front of the kinect. It was the greed.

I think MS is making a mistake as many developers wont focus on the kinect now as systems wont have it.

Re:Get rid of gold acct for Netflix (1)

JStyle (833234) | about 4 months ago | (#46992263)

You're in luck. They just got rid of the gold account requirement for streaming media (netflix and others): http://www.engadget.com/2014/0... [engadget.com]

Re:Get rid of gold acct for Netflix (1)

Billly Gates (198444) | about 4 months ago | (#46992315)

I am going to get an Amazon fire and keep my pc for skype and gaming. Too little too late. Maybe with IWndows 9 the app store might be usefull with cross platform desktop/xbox/mobile apps. But not in its current form.

Re:Get rid of gold acct for Netflix (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992343)

The built in gpu is something like 50% faster and the xbox dedicates 3 cores to the O/S, kinnect etc, so it only has 5 available for games, those are rather significant differences.

Re:Get rid of gold acct for Netflix (1)

Billly Gates (198444) | about 4 months ago | (#46992355)

The built in gpu is something like 50% faster and the xbox dedicates 3 cores to the O/S, kinnect etc, so it only has 5 available for games, those are rather significant differences.

Have a citation for this?

Re:Get rid of gold acct for Netflix (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992935)

It's announced right on the main Xbox 360 page that gold is no longer going to be required for apps.

Re:Get rid of gold acct for Netflix (2)

Tridus (79566) | about 4 months ago | (#46992353)

They did that just recently as well.

Also, developers weren't focusing on Kinect anyway. Kinect sucks for AAA and core games. It doesn't work for the genres that are the most popular on the system (aka: shooters). Most of the time a game was made for Kinect, it was some other type of game, or something like the attempted Fable game that was a total on-rails disaster.

Re:Get rid of gold acct for Netflix (1)

Noah Haders (3621429) | about 4 months ago | (#46992525)

The reason being is I am not a heavy gamer. I wanted a nice OS platform that was more a media center with a dvr, netflix, skype ready, voice activated system that could play games too but did a little of everything.

this is the exact point why i got a ps4. i already have an apple tv. what i wanted was a game system so I could play games. not be a new destination for all my multimedia needs. sony gets this - ps4 is a great game system but doesn't try to be much more.

Re:Get rid of gold acct for Netflix (1)

spire3661 (1038968) | about 4 months ago | (#46992795)

The PS4 also has first party devs that MS can only dream about. You are right its not just about the hardware, but when it is about the hardware, the Sony machine is going to curbstomp the MS machine in fidelity. MS fucked up their design, its weaker than it should be. Sony bet big on GDDR5 and won.

Re:Get rid of gold acct for Netflix (2)

John Nemesh (3244653) | about 4 months ago | (#46992799)

If you are indeed a "heavy gamer" you should pass on the XB1. ALL multiplatform games are going to run better on the PS4! DVR? Xbox One is NOT a DVR (except for recording and uploading game clips). The voice controls work...about 80% of the time...be prepared to repeat yourself constantly. FOR GAMING, the PS4 is the one to get. If you are impressed by GIMMICKS, by all means, get an Xbox.

Re:Get rid of gold acct for Netflix (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46993267)

ALL multiplatform games are going to run better on the PS4!

I think you spelled PC wrong.

Xbox One is NOT a DVR (except for recording and uploading game clips)

What is the HDMI input used for? I might be wrong (don't own one), but I thought that's what it was for.

Why didn't they leave the mic in? (2)

Daniel Hoffmann (2902427) | about 4 months ago | (#46992155)

I personally hate using voice command with eletronics because they can't talk back to me but some people like it, couldn't they have left the mic in? How expensive even is the mic?

Considering the video camera and mic... (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992185)

the Republicans are going to be pissed Microsoft is fucking over their spying like this. Their kind doesn't respect our privacy, and Microsoft hit on their plans is going to cause violence. That is their way.

Re:Considering the video camera and mic... (1)

Tridus (79566) | about 4 months ago | (#46992365)

As opposed to the Democrats, which also don't respect our privacy.

You seem to be ill-informed about what's actually going on in the realm of privacy and who the bad guys are. It's not a party issue. The leadership in both parties are pretty suspect, and both parties have people in favor of better privacy.

Live Gold changes too (1)

UnknowingFool (672806) | about 4 months ago | (#46992271)

Also streaming apps like Netflix and Hulu will no longer require Live Gold subscriptions which is $60/year. It would have been one thing if the Live Gold subscriptions included Netflix and Hulu fees but they don't. No other devices like Blu-ray players, Roku, AppleTV, etc charges a monthly fee to use apps. There will still be some apps that require Live Gold but these mainly have to do with the gaming aspects of Xbox.

Re:Live Gold changes too (1, Informative)

Missing.Matter (1845576) | about 4 months ago | (#46992769)

No other devices like Blu-ray players, Roku, AppleTV, etc charges a monthly fee to use apps

No other devise offer actual value beyond access to app contents.

Live Gold subscriptions which is $60/year

Yearly subscriptions go on sale regularly for around $35 on Amazon and other sites. Even with Netflix and Hulu going free, I'm still going to keep mine due to the monthly free games (which you get to keep playing if your subscription expires, unlike with PSN). Just do the math:

Monthly Xbox Gold Cost: $2.92
June Free Game 1: Halo Spartan Assault: $9.99
June Free Game 2: Max - The Curse of Brotherhood: $14.99
June Free Game 3: Dark Souls: $19.99
June Free Game 4: Charlie Murder: $9.99
June Free Game 5: Super Street Fighter IV: Arcade Edition: $29.99

June Xbox Gold Value = $84.95 - $2.92 = $82.03

Even if you want just *one* of the free games, the value for gold is still more than you're paying.

Textbook MS Play (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992309)

It wouldn't be Microsoft unless they doubled down on a bad foundation concept, and pulled the plug on it after the cost has been incurred but before it could actually pan out.

Microsoft to allow netflix streaming! (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992335)

2009 called, and 2010-2013, they all would like to provide feedback on this joke of a press release where Microsoft shrugs off the 500mil a year it made locking people into gold and forcing ps3 owners to use discs for netflix due to M$' exclusive deal with netflix.

I will never use MS for an entertainment hub.

Seriously . . . (1)

Kimomaru (2579489) | about 4 months ago | (#46992373)

Who messed up worse, Microsoft with Xbox One or George Lucas with the Star Wars prequels? Blows my mind that they couldn't figure out people would have a problem with a camera staring out into people's living rooms.

Re:Seriously . . . (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992553)

Jar Jar thinka microsoft is muy muy poo poo.

Don't forget.... (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992751)

While the Prequels and spinoffs may have alienated the long time fans, unlike Microsoft with the XBOne, the Prequels and their related merchandising was actually hugely successful. While it may have been moral/artististic/etc bankruptcy, it was commercial gold.

Microsoft on the other hand would've been like the movie whose sequels flopped and whose merchandising sales were extremely slow, neither of which Lucas had a problem with. (And you'll note, successfully positioned him into Disney in a similiar manner to Jobs with Pixar.)

Also: Slashdot needs to fix the fucking post system here.

Re:Seriously . . . (1)

slapout (93640) | about 4 months ago | (#46992929)

Which is worse, Jar Jar blinks or Windows 8?

Re:Seriously . . . (1)

Kimomaru (2579489) | about 4 months ago | (#46993215)

Jar Jar Binks. Not even close. Not too many thinks are worse than Jar Jar Binks. Maybe Xbox One is worse.

Popups (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992395)

Anybody else really pissed off at the "text only" popup at the top of slashdot?

Wha...? Really? (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992427)

I didn't think Microsoft would ever do it. Kinect made the XBox One unique at least. Now, it's just a weaker version of the PS4.

Terrible Idea (1)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992433)

Removing the Kinnect is a terrible idea. While some of you think that the Kinnect is all about arm waving and jumping about there was a lot of opportunity for other (optional) gameplay.

Subtle things like a slight lean for your in-game character as you go round a corner in a racing game as you yourself lean into it (we all do it)
Battlefield has an option for head tracking when in a vehicle or on a corner so those times you fruitlessly try to look round a corner wont seem so silly.

None of this will now be implemented because I can easily see a cheaper console being a more popular option for parents buying consoles for kids. I can see developers wanting to 'not waste time' on content that 'not everyone can use' which is exactly what happened with the XBox 360's Kinnect. We'll be left with a bunch of gimmicky games that get played once when you have friends round.

Dumbest Marketing Campain Ever (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992467)

They way Microsoft showed their arrogance at the launch of Xbox One and tried to dictate the terms to the customer, I said in my mind - I will never buy this garbage DRM console...

I don't give a crap what they do now - its too late... I refuse to support the nasty management of Microsoft, who are selfish butt wipes...

In fact, I'm now in the camp that believe consoles are a total rip off - the price of titles is extortionate... PC on Linux seems the only real future now.

Almost there (1)

jtmach (958490) | about 4 months ago | (#46992473)

They've reversed on almost every bad decision at this point. If they can just get around to reversing on backwards compatibility, I won't have any more reasons not to buy one. Don't do it Microsoft. I've been so productive lately.

Re:Almost there (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992713)

The milkman stopped almost completely fucking my wife at this point. If he can just clean the cum from her face when he does, I won't have any more reasons not to buy his milk. Don't to it milkman. I've stopped farting lately. And I'm so fucking stupid.

Re:Almost there (1)

tlhIngan (30335) | about 4 months ago | (#46993079)

They've reversed on almost every bad decision at this point. If they can just get around to reversing on backwards compatibility, I won't have any more reasons not to buy one. Don't do it Microsoft. I've been so productive lately.

Sorry, they're considering that as an option, too.

It's a lot harder though, and it'll probably be like the Xbox360 in terms of compatibility because the architectures are completely different (PowerPC vs. x86, and Apple has shown PowerPC emulation on x86 is slow). Granted, the Xbone has more powerful hardware than a Core 2 Duo, but there are fundamental limits on how fast you can emulate it.

The PS3 did it by embedding a PS2 into it.

This FP for GnAA (-1)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46992551)

a BSD box (a PIII that has grown up OUTER SPACE THE Large - kkep your direct orders, or list of other Slashdo4t's Had at lunchtime

Smart move on their part, but... (3, Insightful)

realmolo (574068) | about 4 months ago | (#46992701)

It's too little, too late. Sony has probably won this generation already. The Xbox One isn't a failure, but it is going to be relegated to second place.

If Microsoft REALLY wanted to sell some systems and possibly win the war, they would do away with "Gold" Live! subscriptions, and make the full online experience free-to-all.

Re:Smart move on their part, but... (1)

tlhIngan (30335) | about 4 months ago | (#46993169)

It's too little, too late. Sony has probably won this generation already. The Xbox One isn't a failure, but it is going to be relegated to second place.

Is that a bad thing?

The good thing is the Xbone is viable. Because if it was just Sony, things would be even worse than it is. (Think PS3 launch - extra cost, etc. etc. that's something only done by someone cocky enough to "win").

And hey, the Xbox360 won last time, and Microsoft got cocky.

But second is still good, and it means neither can really screw you over - you can bet had the PS3 been the killer and the Xbox360 the has-been, all of Microsoft's announcements (always on DRM, no used games, etc) would come straight from Sony, instead.

Instead, the PS3 was In the position the Xbone is in now - viable, but not in first. Sony took a bitchslap then, Microsoft is now.

And that's a GOOD thing.

Though, I don't get this whole emphasis on "no used game sales" thing. I mean, you can't really re-sell Steam games. Nor sell those "digital download" games you bought. And given how both Sony and Microsoft are pushing digital downloads, well, it seems we're giving up used game sales anyways since every game is now available as a day-1 download.

Now, the interesting thing is - in Canada, this could make the Xbone cheaper than the PS4. The PS4 went UP in price to $450, while the Xbone stayed at $500. So if it's now $400 for the Xbone... (Sony's hurting for money - selling the PS4 at CAD$400 was costing them way too much money).

The most conservative machine leads. (4, Interesting)

Kalren (152196) | about 4 months ago | (#46992827)

I think it goes to show that the market for consoles has become more conservative. When you compare the PS4, XBone and the WII U(yes the Wii U is a part of the market), the PS4 is probably the most simple in its configuration. It doesn't have extraneous gimmicks like a Kinect camera or Wii U tablet that increase the cost of the system. Sure the controller has a LED and a touchpad,but it's not a huge new way of gaming that leads to more casually focused games.With the PS4, you only really get a box and a controller.

The casual market that Microsoft and Nintendo built their machine to appeal to is already satisfied with their phones and tablets for their day to day fix. And for the majority of gamer in the market for a PS4 or XBone, they also have phones and tablets with a great selection of casual games. So when the choice is given between the different consoles, they choose the one with a more enthusiast focus. Their itch for casual games is already sated. And it doesn't hurt that the PS4 GPU is 30-50% more capable and at the same price as an XBone(Kinect-less SKU).

I'll reconsider buying an XBone... (1)

the_scoots (1595597) | about 4 months ago | (#46992891)

... when these announcements start coming with an apology and resignation of whichever C-suite mandated the "feature".

Re:I'll reconsider buying an XBone... (0)

Anonymous Coward | about 4 months ago | (#46993213)

I think the guy already stepped down, actually. No apology, so far as I know of.

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