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IBM DeskStar 75GXP Hard Drive Failures?

Cliff posted more than 12 years ago | from the you-might-want-to-skip-this-product dept.

IBM 695

Sean Kelly asks: "Like a lot of other people, I went out and bought myself a nice 60GB IBM DeskStar 75GXP (ATA100, 7200rpm) hard drive to put in my sparkling new computer. Boy was that a mistake! A few months after I got the drive, it failed with horrific grinding and clicking noises, plus random data loss. So I RMA'd the first one and got a 'SERVICEABLE USED PART' replacement from IBM, which died of the same death after another few months. Not getting the hint, I RMA'd that one. Last week, I got the refab. drive back from IBM and it has already died, in less than a week! This time I did some site searching and found many people are having problems with this drive. Sites such as The Inquirer, Hexus, Tech Report, Hardware One, Sysopt, and even this PCWorld have dedicated articles, forums and user reviews to these failing and defective drives. From what I can understand, IBM is not publicly acknowledging that they screwed up here. How many other people out there have had their 75GXP (or 60GXP) drives fail? What size were they? What part number? What did IBM do about it? It is my opinion that IBM should do something about this, since I've seen an unnaturally high number of complaints about this drive now that I started looking for customer feedback. Also, here is a letter I sent to IBM explaining my frustration with them. It has more information in it."

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postus firstus (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2389109)

Yep, all yalls posts are belong to me.

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Food for thought. (-1)

cyborg_monkey (150790) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389153)

Like a lot of other people, I went out and bought myself a nice bowl of hot grits to put in my sparkling new trowsers. Boy was that a mistake! A few months after I dumped the bowl, it failed with horrific grinding and clicking noises, plus random fecal loss.

fucking jews (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2389113)

thats the problem with IBM
bunch of kikes

Re:fucking jews (-1, Offtopic)

Pimp_Daddy_Zaphod (452576) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389157)

Sorry wrong company, I think your refering to TANDY, but as long as we're sluring we might as not forget the japs, zipper heads, whops, guinea's, mic's and other types in the company. IBM won't admit to the issue intill they reach a certain number of claims ect. and lawsuits. When the claims reach a number where it might hurt their reputation then they will finally admit to the issue but not before then. Possibly like the car companies. I think the word we need to look for is bean counter, although Jew Bastard might work just as well.

No problems here (2, Interesting)

Lethal_Geek (156349) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389117)

Mine's been working fine for a full year now. I've never heard a peep about them failing more than they should or anything...*shrug*

Re:No problems here (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2389253)

None here either. I have a mixture of 75GXPs and 60GXPs (a total of 5 drives) ranging in age from a couple months to about a year and a half, and I haven't had a single problem. The machines they are in run 24/7 with varying loads but all run rather quickly. I have actually been very pleased with the performance of these drives, especially compared to my previous unpleasant experiences with Maxtor duds . . . I mean drives.

I have heard about the failure rate before, and I have to wonder if it is heat related. In this case of all my hard drives, there is at least one empty drive bay separating the HD from other devices (all my PCs are built on tower cases). Anyway, it's something to consider.

Re:No problems here (2)

Drakantus (226374) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389265)

I bought a 20 GB 75GXP back in october of 2000, and later a pair of 45GB's for RAID1. They are all still working fine. I have a feeling that part of the problem is environment related- maybe the 75GXP doesn't handle heat or weak power supplies, or vibrations, or something. Otherwise, there isn't much explanation for some people having 3+ failures while folks like me have run multiple drives for months without issues.

Mine are pretty good (4, Informative)

keesh (202812) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389126)

I've been running a pair as RAID-0 (yeah, I know...) for a couple of months, haven't had any major problems. The drives seem to seek to the inner track and back more often than my Seagate drive, but it's rarely a problem.

I've had problems with other drives before because of a power supply which was slightly too low voltage -- it seems a few drives are overly sensitive to minor voltage drops.

Re:Mine are pretty good (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2389147)

The problem is quite simple: IBM sells Western Digital drives re-labeled. I think that spells it out, don't you?

Re:Mine are pretty good (-1)

cyborg_monkey (150790) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389207)

You have not had any problems because you cannot figure out how to turn the computer on (yet! let's keep our fingers crossed).

Good luck!

Your pal,

CM

Re:Mine are pretty good (2, Insightful)

jamesidm (244299) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389264)

I have had no problem with these hard drives. I have 2 30 GB ones in a RAID-0 and 2 60 GB ones standalone partioned to 6 20 GB partitions. I also have a smaller one which I cant remember off the top of my head and I have never had any trouble with any of them. They are very quiet, and nice and fast. My friend also has a 60 GB one partitioned to 4 15GBs and he has had no trouble either. I have only seen people complain twice though dont know any people who had problems in person. Perhaps a particular batch of drives is buggy?

Not only these (1)

Scoria (264473) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389127)

But a couple of my friends had Maxtor 80gb drives "fail" to the point where it was worth buying a new drive to avoid attempting to get assistance from Maxtor's tech support...

Re:Not only these (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2389275)

I have had a few maxtors fail, and I have had zero problems with their tech support. In each case, I had a brand new replacement drive within 3 days -- in once case the replacement was larger than the failed drive!

Maxtor tech support is the primary reason that I still use Maxtor. Replacements are quick, pain free, and, in some cases, better than the failed drive.

but then again, I haven't talked with maxtor tech support lately, so I donno, may things have gotten worse.

Let me get this straight... (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2389130)

The worst terrorist attack in recorded history occurred less than one month ago, followed by another attack just hours ago, and you people have the gall to be discussing the fact that most slashdot trolls have an overwhelming need to anally rape Bert and Ernie??? My *god*, people, GET SOME PRIORITIES!

The bodies of the 6000+ innocent people who died in these unprecedented tragedies could give a good god damn about your Sesame Street obsession. Your childish blow-up models, your nerf toy dildos and whining about the lack of a "fuckable" workplace, your Everquest babe boob fixation, the latest Cowboy Neil gay porn rerun, or any of the other ways you are "getting on with your life" (here's a hint: watching Cowboy Neil in your jammies and masturbating into a bowl of Shreddie's is *not* "getting on with your life"). The souls of the victims are watching in horror as you people squander your finite, precious time on this earth fucking Sesame Street dolls!

You people disgust me! In a way, you're almost as bad as the terrorists themselves. At least they had the conviction to die with eachother's cocks in the mouths...

IBM problems (rant) (0)

crumbz (41803) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389131)

Or to speak with a representative please contact IBM
Global Services at: 1-888-426-4343, and a representative
will be more than happy to assist you.

I just called them and got transferred to about 10 different people. I was simply asking for someone to talk to me about network cabling. None of them got it. Idiots.

Oh the humanity (2, Informative)

Phredward (254393) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389134)

Most of my data is, last time I checked, still on my 60gig drive. It clicks horribly, and I'm sure my data will be gone soon. The 75 gig drive that IBM sent me (took 2-3 weeks to arrive, tho this was across september 11) to RMA my first drive showed up DOA. My only thought is to buy another brand of drive, copy my data off, keep RMAing until I get one that works, and sell it to some pour sob. I'd feel bad about doing it too.

Re:Oh the humanity (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2389261)

>>until I get one that works, and sell it to some pour sob. I'd feel bad about doing it too.

Then don't do it! I know, how about the next time a guy gets caught bludgeoning his wife, he tells the judge that he felt bad doing it. Makes everything ok doesn't it?

45 GB version running like a champ (1)

Maigus (118056) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389138)

Mine has been running well for 6+ months... Never had a problem.

Mine Is Fine. (1)

BiggestPOS (139071) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389140)

Small sample size, but so far My experience with them has been 100% bliss..... I wonder if there is a pattern to the failed drives, you have failed several, I know people who have several (raided usually) and they work fine... Different Powersupplys maybe?

Hmmmm..... (2, Insightful)

lorenlal (164133) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389234)

Could it be there's a certain lot of them that were faulty? Or maybe there was a certain lot that was great until something got knocked in the line....
I'd be willing to bet that IBM is checking the serials to see where the process went wrong/right.
That is, if they ever decide to acknowledge there's a problem.

Too bad... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2389144)

Have to have the bleeding edge, eh? Do you have an Athlon 1.4 GHz too?

I am sorry to hear about your data loss, but... (5, Insightful)

sphealey (2855) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389145)

Unfortunately, because of your manufacturing faults and inability to admit fault, I have lost a large amount of unique and important data, ranging from schoolwork to business-related documents.

May I humbly suggest that if these data are indeed of such importance, that 4 mm DAT, CD-RW, Zip disks, or even the lowly 1.44 MB floppy are suitable backup media?

Fulminating about lost data due to the failure of a mechanical storage system, and vague threats of class-action lawsuits, are in my experience goods ways to get large manufacturing organizations to put your letter in the deep freeze for about 10 years.

sPh

Re:I am sorry to hear about your data loss, but... (5, Funny)

keesh (202812) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389159)

Yes, *click* I can *click* strongly *click* *click* recommend using *click* a Zip *click* drive to *click* back up your *click* work...

good word (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2389171)

Fulminating. Good word. You don't come 'round these parts much, do you?

Re:I am sorry to hear about your data loss, but... (2, Insightful)

notext (461158) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389185)

I back up plenty. The only problem is I didn't back up 10 minutes before the drive died.

You are bound to lose *some* data, unless you are running raid of some sort.

Re:I am sorry to hear about your data loss, but... (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2389218)

Indeed, well said. Each day, I assume it will be the last day my drives turn. Regardless of who made it, it will stop spinning someday. Maybe tommorow, maybe 10 years from now. Don't assume the larger figure, assume the smaller one and you'll always be prepared.

Re:I am sorry to hear about your data loss, but... (4, Insightful)

jandrese (485) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389238)

I can't wait until someone tries to back up their 75GB drive on 1.44MB floppies. By my estimation that's only 53,333 floppies. Given how slow floppy drive transfers are (150kB/sec), your floppies would degrade before you finished your inital backup.

I also can't wait to pay more for the DAT drive than I'd pay just to buy another harddrive and mirror it.
Zip drives are only a minor step up from floppies, and you'd end up spending $7500 on the zip disks alone! BTW, the Click-of-death is widly overblown IMHO. Unless you happened to get one of those defective drives or you play rugby with your zip drive the media isn't going to fail any faster than a floppy (although that's not exactly a ringing endorsement)
At least CD-R (or even CR-RW) is fairly viable, if a little harder to automate (you can't just tar the files to a device).

Grinding and clicking? (1)

exceed (518714) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389148)

I had a Maxtor 10 gig drive (IBM ships Maxtors) that crapped out on me too with the same symptoms. I woke up in the middle of the night to hear odd clunking noises. I kicked my case and it didn't click for about a month. Then, when a month was up, the clunking noises came back with a vengance and my hard drive was shot. I haven't sent it back to IBM yet, but I'm hoping I'll get a free replacement.

Re:Grinding and clicking? (1)

fooguy (237418) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389212)

IBM does not ship Maxtors.

Generally:

IBM == quality
Maxtor == shit

I have an IBM 4.3GB LVD SCSI, 9GB IDB, and (2) 45GB IDE Deskstars - all running flawlessly. I switched to IBM after Western Digial got bad (around the time 4GB was the largest you could get).

Maxtor has always always always been slow, loud, prone to failure shit. When I was a pup and I managed a comptuer store we had the most problem with Maxtor. Where I work now we have about 350 Dell Optiplex's, and the ones with Maxtor's die the most often. The fact that their cheap doesn't outweigh the fact that they're junk.

60GXP vs. 75GXP (1)

camt (162536) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389150)

I heard about this problems MONTHS ago. I heard that the 75GXP's were going to be discontinued because of so many rampant problems with them, and the 60GXP was the replacement line. Not sure if any of that came to be, or was true, but that's what I heard a few months ago. There are many more complaints about that drive than any other I have ever seen.

FWIW - I have a friend running RAID-0 with them (has been running his since the 75GXP's came out) and he has not had any problems.

Re:60GXP vs. 75GXP (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2389163)

The 60GXP is the line using the latest tech and is FAR more reliable.

If you go to IBM.com and look at drive model info you will see this.

Re:60GXP vs. 75GXP (2)

ahknight (128958) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389175)

I had a 45GB 75GXP fail two weeks ago and got a 60GB 60GXP replacement. No problems so far, so that appears to be right.

60GXP replaces 75GXP (3, Informative)

Gandalf_007 (116109) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389215)

I believe you're right, see my earlier post [slashdot.org] . I had a 30GB 75GXP fail after one year, and they sent me a 30GB 60GXP as a replacement.


Note that the 30GB 60GXP only uses one side of one of the platters, since the 60GXP line is 20GB/platter, so in essence I got a crippled 40GB drive.

Obviously a Linux Problem (-1)

l33t j03 (222209) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389151)

It is obvious to me that your problem isn't poor quality disks, it is Linux. I have several of the same hard drives you mention in several different PCs. All of them are still working perfectly well after six months of steady use, execpt for the one I put in the Debian machine that use as a coffee table. (I put Debian on it to scare kids this Halloween)

The disk in that computer is completely screwed up. I think the problem may lie in the fact that Linux has no decent journaling file system, whereas Microsoft has had one for a decade.

Re:Obviously a Linux Problem (-1)

cyborg_monkey (150790) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389235)

I am not wearing pants.

Re:Obviously a Linux Problem (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2389260)

Or you can install a microsoft operating system and have m$ thrash your hard drive every time you boot. it's coincidence, or better yet, because of stupidity that you broke your hard drive. linux rules.

Maxtor (4, Informative)

TheSHAD0W (258774) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389152)

I've had a lot of luck with Maxtor's newer model drives. I have several of their 80-gig HDs, and none has crapped out on me yet. And the price is right; Maxtor 80 giggers can be had at CompUSA for $200.

Re:Maxtor (1)

brassman (112558) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389245)

I've had real good luck with Maxtor, too, but the last "Maxtor" I bought turned out to be a Quantum!

Which would not have ticked me off quite so much if I hadn't been planning to make it part of my first RAID-5 machine, along with two other Maxtors. Wouldn't you know it, this one was not QUITE the same size as the others.

(And when do you find out about this? AFTER you open the box. Argh.)

Another victim of the "Deathstar"... (5, Informative)

Gandalf_007 (116109) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389156)

Count me among those hit by it. I bought a 30GB Deskstar 75GXP (model DTLA-307030) a little over a year ago. It worked perfectly fine until about a month ago, when accessing a certain location on the disk would result in grinding noises, and then the computer locking up completely. The drive failed IBM's drive fitness test, so I RMA'd it. I got a 30GB Deskstar 60GXP (model IC35L030AVER07, which btw is an OEM-only model, since the 60GXP line is 20GB/platter).

I guess they decided there were enough problems with the 75GXP line that they sent me a 60GXP. I haven't heard of any problems with the 60GXP line, and to boot it's much quieter than my old 75GXP -- I can't even hear it seek unless I listen very closely.

pinga es muerte (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2389161)

YOu can blAme The DARK ELROY. he got high last night and told IBM TO SUCKIT

Try StorageReview.com for more information (5, Informative)

ArcticChicken (172915) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389162)

Take a look at the discussion forums over at StorageReview.com [storagereview.com] . There have been several discussions about the 75GXP (and 60GXP) over there.

Case in point, some of their readers are currently running an unofficial survey [storagereview.com] .

No Problems Here... (1)

Archangel (21023) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389165)

I have 2 45Gb drives also in a raid aray, they've been running for several months now without any problems. So far it seems like there are more satisfied ppl that not. Maybe there's something killing your drives.

Heat (4, Interesting)

maiden_taiwan (516943) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389166)

How's the ventilation in your computer case? Is it possible your drives are overheating?

Heat bad (1)

Sxooter (29722) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389272)

Someone please mod the parent to this comment up. Very valid point.

Many people have their shiny new 50+Gig hard drives in an old AT case with inadequate cooling. I had to move my Maxtor 30 gig to a different area in the case of my old box that had better flow and cooling to get it to work reliably. who knows how much life I took off of it running it hot...

We've had that problem (1)

rsimmons (248005) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389167)

I've had one drive crap out that was a 75G. I also had a 30G crap out in the same way.

My 40GB IBM drive bit it, sort of (1)

brassman (112558) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389169)

Had a matched pair of IBM 40GB IDE drives --
IBM-DTLA-305040, according to /proc/ide -- set up as RAID 1. One of them rolled over and died recently. Might be related to power; I replaced the power supply fan same time I replaced the drive.

Reformatted it, and discovered about 8% was gone, all up in the high-numbered sectors. So I repartitioned to make sure those cylinders stayed unused, and put it back into service in another machine where nothing much interesting is going on.

Would have been nasty if it hadn't been mirrored, though.

Certain lots apparently very bad (3, Interesting)

hpa (7948) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389170)

The rumour going around the people who work on the disk subsystem in Linux is that certain lots/fabrication plats have lots of problems, and others are A-OK.

I recently got to experience the latter, when I got a machine with six of these disks as a RAID. To date, FIVE of the disks have had to be replaced, thanks God that did not include the system disk...

Re:Certain lots apparently very bad (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2389206)

I recently got to experience the latter,

You mean the former. (Lots of problems = former; A-OK = latter.)

-- wishing I were the grammar nazi

my desktar 20.3 GB clicks (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2389172)

I have a 20 gig desktar and it clicks every once in a while. A few months ago I lost about 3 gigs of data, but it was only some folders and no system files were affected, so I don't know if it was the drive's fault or some weird software error.

problems in different situations (1)

lanclos (150352) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389173)

I've got two 75GXP's in a striped RAID configuration that haven't given me a lick of problems. They've been humming along for the past six months.

However, we've had an equally recent IBM IDE drive (model unknown) and an IBM SCSI drive give out at work; both failures were easily attributed to the high-vibration environment that these drives were operating in (nearby construction).

Back it up if it's important to you.

Me too (1)

KagakuNinja (236659) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389174)

I have a 20GB 10K RPM Deskstar that has been working like a champ; IBM had a great rep for reliable drives. So I recently purchased a 60GB Deskstar. Fortunately for me, I was unable to get it to work at all, so I exchanged it for a WD. Only later did I start reading about all the reported problems.

I noticed that the drive was manufactured in Romania, rather than the usual asian locations...

Is It Manufactured In Hungary? (4, Informative)

denzo (113290) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389177)

General concensus in messages boards seems to be that IBM hard drives manufactured in Hungary seem to fail at a greater rate than from other factories.

I myself have had a failed IBM hard drive. It was defective upon shipping, and had it replaced immediately with an advance RMA. The replacement failed on me about a month later, and I didn't qualify for an advance RMA because I already RMA'ed it once (even though the first one didn't techically fail on me, it was DOA). This was a 10GB Deskstar 14GXP (I think).

So during the excruciating one-month replacement, I bought a Maxtor drive, and now use it as my primary drive (I'm not trusting my third IBM replacement). The Maxtor's a faster drive anyway, so I'm not complaining. I'll just stay clear of IBMs for a while.

I know what it is (1, Troll)

bitva (206067) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389178)

This definitely a feature. Here's what's going on:


For years Microsoft has been creating operating systems that crash all the time. At first the average user might think: "Hey! This is a bug". Well, they're wrong. Microsoft does this as an added bonus to their products. Do you really think that a company with so much money and so many developers cannot create a stable OS?


IBM, seeing that this added feature obviously creates more revenue, thought: "Hey! Let's add a feature in our hard drives, that makes the drive crash all the time. That way the users OS can crash all the time along with the hardware crashing all the time."


When will the Linux community ever learn that it's not stability that makes money, it's the way you present it.

Drives too fast for the electronics? (4, Interesting)

jandrese (485) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389179)

There was some rumbling on Storage Review [storagereview.com] that these drives may just be too fast for their electronics, and once you start filling up the outer sectors on the disk you will start getting errors. My friend has a pair of the 45GB 75XPs, and at least one of them has "issues". Every so often (now that the drive is full) the kernel will spit out:
ad4s1g: hard error reading fsbn 76293856 of 26874736-26874751 (ad4s1 bn 76293856; cn 8073 tn 63 sn 37)
followed by:
ad4: DMA problem fallback to PIO mode

So far the 60GXPs that I use have had no problems (knock on wood). I've seen at least once source that suggests that the 45GB versions of this drive are the most suseptable to having this problem. I suspect there was some poor quality control on these drives and some very marginal hardware was released onto the world (bad IBM, bad!), but that's more of a feeling since I don't have much evidence to support the claim.

Re:Drives too fast for the electronics? (1)

drdink (77) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389262)

I, being the person who submitted the story, receive the same message in FreeBSD every time I hear the satanic grindings of FreeBSD. It is related to a physical disk location, it seems. It is always the same location in the error messages.

OK by me. (1)

jdawg (21639) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389180)

I've got two 60GB DeskStars in my G4. One was factory installed by Apple, the other I bought from a bargain reseller [it was the OEM model, so no manuals or anything]. Both have worked flawlessly for the last six months. [I even turned off Acoustic Management so they're runnin' at full throttle.]

*shrug*

Died.. days ago (1)

Amadaeus (526475) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389182)

Yea.... this has been a recurring problem. I've been getting weird clicking noises since a year ago, and it finally died on me a week ago. Came home one night, the computer froze, but the HD Access light was on. It was plain on, so I reset, W2K startup screen started, then this weird screeching noise occured, then W2K bluescreened, giving me a HD error. I just sent my drive to IBM to be replaced, but since I live in Canada, I don't expect back for a few months. Last time I checked the store I go to, they pulled the 60GXPs because of some 'unknown fault', and they refused to stock 75GXPs. Not good. I just want a drive I can use without dying.

fine for 6 months (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2389183)

I have a 45GB 75GXP, and I have had no problems with it for six months. At work I bought 2 75GB GXP's four months ago, and those are in our server, and they seem to be fine. For a person that regularly seems to get sent hardware with terminal illness, they have been fine for me so far. (knock on wood)

The designer of this HDD (2)

Rosco P. Coltrane (209368) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389184)

I bet IBM decided to hire Steven Ball [phpwebhosting.com] to design the DeskStar 75GXP :-)

I hope I'm lucky (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2389186)

I've got 2 45GB (75?)GXPs in a RAID 0 and a 27GB GXP. The 27 GB is at least a year old. The 45GBs were bought in January. No problems. Then again I'm using them in a G3. Perhaps you should try making "the switch" if you want to save yourself; I mean your drives.
Heh heh.

i've seen other failures! (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2389188)

my wife fails to give it to me. that's why i switched to 'nother bitch!

30 & 45 GB 75xp's ... only one bad experience (1)

Mr. Eradicator (470089) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389190)

I had one 30GB 75xp for about 6 months when it started making weird noises ... then it had a "bad sector". IBM had me run their software disk utility and I ended up reformatting. I bought a 45GB (same model) at the same time I restarted everything and I haven't had problems since. /me knocks on wood

Vibrating drives good for relaxation... (3, Funny)

hoggoth (414195) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389191)

I strapped mine to the back of my favorite E-Z-Chair. I run a program that alternately seeks the innermost then outermost cylinders. Now the chair hums like a power-sander; It puts me right to sleep!

I still have some unique and important data on it (the drive, not the chair), so I am concerned that this unorthodox use of the drive may lead to problems. I may even start doing backups.

IBM 36.4 10k drive failures (1)

Talsin (164230) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389192)

I am not sure about the ones in the article, I have not used any yet but we had several, 18 out of 30, of their 36.4 gig drives fail along with attendant raid controllers in all of our servers. They would never come right out and say manufacturing defect but that is what was I felt implied. All of them were from the same batch and all failed within days of eachother. The replacement drives have been just fine for almost a year now. Who knows......?

Threats of Class Action Lawsuits (2, Interesting)

bstrahm (241685) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389193)

Why file a class action lawsuit where your lawyer will get rich and you will get $1.24 for your efforts...


You are much better off sueing either in Small Claims court,where the limits tend to be around 1-1.5K dollars, don't require a lawyer on your part, and tend to be settled pretty quickly.


Threats of filling a class action lawsuit are a waste of time, you are much better off going to your county courthouse, filling the paper work, doing a quick web search on where to send the papers, and hire a courier to deliver them to IBMs local legal representative. When the day is done they will pay you your 1500 because it is much easier/cheaper to do that then to send two lawyers at $200/hr to your location to fight it (and still loose quite a bit of money)

It's a great hard drive. (0)

Mental Erosion (13851) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389194)

My IBM 75GXP hard drives havebeen the most reliable hard drives I've ever used. The three I own have run, quietly and reliably, for about a year, 24/7.

My IBM drive also failed (1)

thallgren (122316) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389197)

I bought a 20GB DPTA-372050 1.5 years ago and it failed a week ago. It sure was fast(26MB/s), but far too noisy, so I won't bother replacing it. Bought a nice Fujitsu 40GB SILENTDRIVE instead and are happy with that.

I'll think twice before I buy an IBM drive again. :-(

Regards, Tommy

Bad luck here (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2389198)

Of the 3 in my office 2 died within 2 weeks. we just rolled out a hundred+ to public labs, so far one has died, we'll see how the rest fare.

Our IBM tech has said he's seen more problems with these than any others.

HDD Manufacturers: *quality* not *size*! (1, Insightful)

bc90021 (43730) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389199)

Everyone I know who has gotten a drive 60GB or bigger has had to RMA their drive at least once (and one person four times!). This goes for Maxtor(/Quantum), and IBM.

It seems to me that the hard drive manufacturers should be spending more time producing quality drives instead of trying to one-up each other in the "who's bigger" war.

First to market may be well and good, if you have a quality drive. And even though OSen can take up to 1.5GB of space, few people couldn't survive with a 40GB drive. And the two month difference in time while manufacturers took the extra steps to create quality 60+GB drives wouldn't hurt people or the industry.

30 GB 75GXP died after eight months (1)

willith (218835) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389200)

I bought my 75GXP because it was recommended on Ars Technica's system guide, and because it reviewed favorably on StorageReview.com. It provided me with over a half-year of trouble-free service.

Unfortunately, I too had my 75GXP die. The first signs of trouble showed up about seven months after I bought it. At random intervals, the drive would make strange, non-normal noises (it almost sounded like a head or something skipping across the platters, which is impossible...right?).

The Real Problem happened a few weeks later when I had to install WinME (don't laugh--I had a good reason at the time). I moved all my data to a second HDD, but WinME's install failed almost before it started. A full surface scan via Scandisk produced classic bad HDD noises (CLICK-CLICK-CLICK-CLICK-CLICK-wrrrrr. CLICK-CLICK-CLICK-CLICK-CLICK-wrrrrr. Repeat infinitely).

IBM's drive diagnostic program reported that the drive was indeed bad, and gave me a cryptic error code that I no longer have written down. I RMA'd the drive via IBM's automated web RMA process and received a new (refurbished) one less than two weeks later. That was in March, and the new drive has given me no problems.

Yet.

Perhaps now is a good time to start looking at StorageReview again...

shew! (2)

corky6921 (240602) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389203)

It's a good thing I sold my 60GB Deskstar to my ex-boyfriend for $200... ;)

hard drives in general (1)

archen (447353) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389204)

To me it seems like the quality of hard drives in general is sort of going down. I was considering getting an IBM deskstar, but most any place I've seen online has also documented that these drives tend to fail often (not always but more than they should). At the place I work we've blown about 4 Seagate hard drives in the last couple of weeks - and we don't even have many computers. It seems like perhaps magnetic storage technology is getting pushed to it's limit. I mean when you hear about how the heads float on a cusion of air millionths of an inch from the platters, and the small tollerance needed to read and write, it's quite amazing. But simply put, magnetic technology probably just doesn't have the reliability that we need at this point and it's time for a newer medium.

Well in any event, my next hard drive will probably be a Western Digital

I had the same problem (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2389205)

with a 20 GB IBM GXP HD. The thing lasted about two months. I took back to the store that I bought it from, and I argued that they should take it back, since 100,000 hours is standard. They said OK, but they stoped selling them because of the problems they were getting with them and they gave me a 7200 RPM WD. Been happy with that for about 18 months now.

Me too (1)

Maskirovka (255712) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389208)

How much of your data loss from the 60gb were mp3s? Maybe IBM is implementing CPRM technology without telling us!

We've had tons go bad. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2389209)

Every single one we've had has gone bad. I think that's about six total now. We stay away from them.

Hmmm (1, Funny)

the_other_one (178565) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389210)

The obvious thing for IBM to do is to raise price of the unit and relable the packaging

High Security Write Only Drive

IBM's response to me... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2389213)

I had a similar experience -- my 75GXP failed, was replaced, and the replacement failed in a couple of months. I e-mailed IBM UK support, pointing out that this isn't really good enough, and got the following response:


Many thanks for your email regarding your defective drive. I can offer you
an alternative part number with capacity of 40GB.
Please let me know if this is acceptable to you.


I've not received the replacement yet, but I assume it will be a 60GXP. So it's definitely worth sending IBM a polite but firm e-mail!

My 15Gig's Fine (1)

de Selby (167520) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389219)

I have a 25GB 45gxp and a 15GB 75GXP--both have worked fine for over a year; and I abuse them.

I've only good things to say about these drives.

SCSI drives still better. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2389220)

makes me glad i went with SCSI ultra160 fujitsu drives on my new rig.

Happens on the 30GB drives, too (1)

Martin Blank (154261) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389221)

I purchased the 30GB variant of the 75GXP after reading some rave reviews and seeing them shipped in dozens of new Dell systems at work without any problems. They were a little more expensive than my normal Maxtor purchase, but the speed was supposed to be so much better.

Until the Great Annoying Hard Drive Crash of 2001.

Ironically, I had just bought a new CD-R that day which was to be used for data backups. The clicking noise had been there for a couple of days, but I thought it was the ancient 4GB Quantum drive I used for a swap. I shut down the system, installed the new CD-R drive, and attempted to boot. Windows 2000 gave me an INACCESSIBLE_BOOT_DEVICE error. After two solid days of trying different recovery techniques, I found that I had a dead drive.

Well, mostly. This is when I discovered the wonders of OnTrack Easy Recovery Pro. I'm not doing a commercial here, other than to say it's now a mandatory part of my toolkit. I recovered all but one small website, a total of about 20GB.

Anyway, when I got in contact with IBM, they gave me an address in NorCal to which I had to ship the drive (after denying the reports I had seen on various web sites about severe problems with the 75GXP drive line), and then was told that a replacement would be in my hands in 7-10 working days of their receipt. I live in SoCal, UPS said it was a two-day trip up there, so I figured it would only be a couple of weeks until I could get back to normal.

Wrong. After ten working days, I called, and they were backordered, but expected to be able to ship in three days. Then I called back five days later, and was told that the shipment was coming from overseas. A few days later, the shipment was "stuck in Customs". I finally got my drive (a refurbished unit, dammit) a little more than a month after originally sending it, and it has since worked more or less normally. I am, however, antsy about it, and I am looking forward to getting a couple of good-sized, high-speed Maxtors later this year and setting them up in RAID-1 configuration.

I used to heartily recommend IBM drives, and now my faith has been shaken to the core. Maxtor has regained my respect for top brand, with Seagate second (primarily for price), and then IBM. Of course, I still won't touch a Western Digital if I can avoid it. I've had EIGHT of those go bad in my systems and in those of friends and family.

30 GB Deskstars (1)

JollyTX (103289) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389222)

I've had two 30 GB Deskstars die on me within one year. Luckily I got new ones; the last one got replaced with a 40 GB one because the 30 GB were out of production. Let's hope this one is better...

Anti-IBM propoganda, or is it just coincidence? (1, Offtopic)

netsplit (204917) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389223)

Does anyone else find it slightly odd that this almost 'anti-ibm' propoganda is popping up shortly after they publicised their stance on the DMCA? Nothing against the slashdot crew, but lots of companies make bad hardware, Ive used alot of it.

or .. maybe it is just a coincidence...

What heppened to IBM? (1)

MlBruehlly (307883) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389226)

I've always believed IBM to be the tried and true hardware manufacturer. At least when I toured IBMs Rochester MN plant a few years ago, I got that impression seeing the racks of drives being stress tested, and the extensive thermal and shock tests being done...

If these reports continue, I might have to go out and buy a Western Digital! ;>

This is MOST CERTIANLY the case. (1)

OrenWolf (140914) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389228)

We purchased a half-terabyte IDE RAID system utilizing 8 75GXP Drives. 5 of the 8 drives failed in less than a month. In fact, the drives prompted our RAID vendor to remove them and replace them with Maxtor diamondMAX drives, which have operated flawlessly. If you have a look at storagereview.com [storagereview.com] , you'll notice that the current king of IDE drives are the western digital "BB" Series drives. I'd stay FAR away from the DeskStar's.

My 20gig deskstar is fine (3, Informative)

Billly Gates (198444) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389232)

I love the IBM hard drives. IBM may make expensive hardware but they are always fine quality. I can't even tell that its on because its so quiet and its been working for over a year without a problem. I guess the newer ones are the ones that are defective. Also be aware that Maxtor uses %100 IBM desktar drives. They just slap a Maxtor label on them.

9/18/36GB 10Krpm drive recall (4, Interesting)

sparcv9 (253182) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389236)

At the place I work, we had a few 18GB IBM drives fail on us. They were standard inclusions with the Sun gear we use here (Sun ships a lot of machines with IBM and Seagate drives.) We found out from IBM that there was a recall on 9, 18 and 36 GB, 10,000 RPM drives manufactured between certain dates. These drives are pretty much guaranteed to fail, period. One of our other departments had over 90% of their suspect drives fail already. Our Sun reps came out to count how many we had, so that they could replace them. My department has well over 100 of the recalled drives. Fortunately, most of them are in gear that hasn't been put into production yet.

IBM 75gxp 40gb (1)

digdougSTL (526478) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389239)

I bought one of those drives for my computer last september. Up untill a month ago, it worked great, but then it died, showing the same symptoms as other people here have mentioned. I haven't followed up with IBM about it yet.

My first GXP75 died last week... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2389240)

Yep, I'm now dealing with a bad IBM drive as well. It's a 30GB GXP75, which I bought in Feb. of this year. Manufacture date is Dec. 2000. I've got my RMA number (but only after they insisted that I run "Erase Drive" utility) and will ship the thing out on Friday.

What sucks is the fact that I have two more GXP75s running in a server...a 20GB and a 45GB. I've already replaced one of them with a Western Digital 800BB to prevent that one from losing critical data...it's in my main machine which is much easier to backup. I'm just waiting for it to die so I can send it back ;)

While IBM was nice about dealing with this failed 30GB drive, I wasn't too happy that they refused to cross ship me a new drive (probably since they are getting so many of these back)...some people have indeed been able to cross-ship with a credit card number. I begged for them to send me a GXP60 replacement, but I'm not sure if they will. If I get another GXP75 back, I'm going to thrash the hell out of it until it dies too, in hopes of getting a RELIABLE drive back.

There was an article posted somewhere (sorry, no linkage) a few days ago about the GXP60 drives being bad as well...this is very bad news for IBM if it's true. Until I know for sure that the GXP60 drives are *good* drives, I won't be purchasing any new IBM drives in the future.

60GXP not affected (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2389244)

I own a 40 gig 60GXP and I haven't encountered any of these problems.

My roomate, on the other hand has gone through 3 IBM 30 gig 75GXP's in the last 7 months.

The 75GXP uses 15 GB platters whereas the 60GXP uses 20 GB platters.

I'm no power engineer, but I've read a number of reviews that say its related to power issues in the drive.

(BTW my roomate got his 30 gig 75GXP back on monday and we've since set it up as a public dedicated mp3 gimp on the university network to see how soon it fails.)

I've had 75GXP problems too! (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2389246)

Yes, I've had failures with my two 60GB 75GXP drives as well. Under Windows 2000, I would get read/write errors on them. I would reformat them and the problem went away for a short period of time only to return. I also got timeout problems consistently under Windows 2000 -- this was a wierd problem. When the "timeout" occured, the operating system was no longer able to WRITE to the hard drive, thus causing Windows to basically lock up.

Thinking that the drives might be incompatible with my motherboard, I bought an ATA-100 Promise IDE controller. The same problems continued to occur under Windows 2000.

I finally figured I had buggy drives since I bought them when they first came out. I returned one hard drive to see what would happen and IBM replaced it with a brand new one. The same problems occured. So, thinking the problem might be related to Windows, I moved the hard drives to my Linux box and moved my Linux hard drives (IBM 34GB 34GXP drives) to my Windows box. Windows no longer had a problem. I also installed the ATA-100 Promise controller on my Linux box and hooked the 75GXP drives to it. To my surprise, it's been about 6 months and I've not had a single problem on Linux with the 75GXP drives!! All the problems disappeared when switching to Linux and I've been happy with the drives on my Linux box.

My conclusion is that the drives don't work properly under Windows 2000 for some reason. My Linux box is running with the same hard drives and same IDE controller without a single problem. Go figure.

Same thing here... (1)

macinslak (41252) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389247)

Yeah, I bought a 75gxp for ~$140 when they were shiny and new...that one died in four months, they sent me a refurbished replacement...which died in TWO WEEKS. During which time my WesternDigital drive in the same box experienced no problems.

Eventually I just shelled out another $200 and bought a WD800BB, which has been going good for about a week now.

It would be really cool if I could get some of my money back, as it seems I and a great deal of people on StorageReview.com's (just check the tech support board) forums have gotten totally shafted on this.

Mixed emotions (2)

nevets (39138) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389250)

Our company ordered 8 of these for our department. 7 seem to be good so far, but one was bad. It had the clicking sound and such. Although we keep most of our work on these machines in a CVS server that is backed up daily. Most of us are developers, and do most of our work on our own machines, and when we get something working, we check it in. So if we lose a HD, then we will probably lose a day or two. Not that bad but still bad enough. We may need to invest in some tape machines for these machines, but it will be hard to get procurement to agree. We each have about a gig of work so we would need a tape to do the backups.

Western Digital had similar problems in '98 (1)

billmaly (212308) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389255)

When WD released their 3.1 GB IDE HDD (Caviar 33100)in mid 1998, it was among the first 3 platter, 3 GB + capacity HDD's that were available. Soon after, these drives starting clunking. The procedure was to RMA the drive to WD, and they would replace it with equal or better. It took more than a year for WD to finally admit that the design of the drive was flawed. The company I used to work for, and other OEM's, were left having to explain to their customer's why their data had disappeared, and why their new drives were failing. Very bad policy.

IBM should learn from this, and quickly admit if there is a quality problem. Most people will forgive errors if told the truth and their problem is resolved quickly.

it's a great drive (1)

appleofsod (46839) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389258)

i've got 2 76.8 gig 75gxp's (the DTLA-307075). they're both great. they're fast as hell, and it takes 5-10 seconds to transfer a gig from one drive to the other. i don't have them raided because i didn't get them at the same time, but i've had no problems with them. and on top of that, every time i've ever had a problem with an IBM product, their tech support has been perfect. it's hard for me to imagine someone having a problem with either IBM or one of these great drives.

Running Conditions?? (1)

WallyCanuck (410992) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389259)

Was just wondering under what conditions this drive was running under. Was it in a tiny case with some high end heat generating graphics card and an over clocked CPU and other hard drives with little or no ventilation and only the fan on the power supply to cool it?? I'm not sure how susceptible drives are to heat but was just curious.

Failures Galore! (1)

Bob(TM) (104510) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389269)

I have an 8 node cluster with IBM DeskStar 75GXP drives in each node. The cluster has been operating for about 5 months. In that time, I have had drive failures in four of the eight nodes.

Others in my organization have experienced problems with these drives

Your mileage my vary, but they look like lemons to me!

Remember Caviar ? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2389270)

Ive lost two Westen Digitals Caviar HDD and soon after that they recognised their drivers were deffective (I remember something about 100k drives being collected). Will IBM be wise ?

Mine's okay. (1)

onetrueking (413507) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389274)

Well, just throwing my 2 cents in. I've had a 75gig 75gxp since they were introduced and I've never had a problem. I wonder if these complaints are a little overhyped. I did have a Western Digital 30gig drive that failed, and the RMA failed, and the 2nd RMA failed, and I sold the 3rd RMA on Ebay. Ever since then, I've never had full confidence in harddrives, even though that was the only one that gave be continuous problems.

Find a good brand and stick with it (1)

greysky (136732) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389276)

I take the same approach to harddisks that I take with other high-use/important items that you don't think about too much when they work right, but when the fail you have huge problems (motorcycle tires, condoms, etc.). I settled on Maxtor for harddisks a few years back, and have not had a single one fail. EVERY other drive I've owned that was made by ANY other manufacturer has died, regardless of wether I bought it separate or if it came with a system (Western Digital, Seagate). Really, you might save a few bucks by buying one you don't have experience with, but is it worth the risk?

Quantum Fireball Plus AS 40 gig ATA 7200 rpm... (1)

phranking (134197) | more than 12 years ago | (#2389277)

Has the same problem. I'm currently waiting on replacement drive number 3 (?!). That makes 4 drives in less than 6 months.
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