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McNealy Calls for National ID Card Too

michael posted more than 12 years ago | from the sun-monitors-actually-telescreens dept.

Sun Microsystems 615

Syre writes: "Well McNealy's at it again calling for a national ID card (a smart card powered by Java, anyone?)." So let's get this straight: Oracle wants a national ID card powered by Oracle. Sun wants a national ID card powered by Java. (Even though the U.S. already has a national ID card, since the states are in the process of linking their driver's license databases together.) Is there any company that doesn't want to exploit a tragedy for financial gain? And didn't each and every one of the hijackers present valid ID?

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615 comments

no! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417756)

i refuse to let such a draconian thing happen to me.

Allah u Akhbar (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417778)

141 349 634 525 316 562 941
596 847 249 369 111 479 733
971 765 855 441 685 434 222
692 455 056 062 063 492 341
561 794 576 726 626 311 541
593 514 231 435 642 329 055

Re:Allah u Akhbar (-1)

xXgeneric nicknameXx (463142) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417790)

The cat is in the bag...I repeat, the cat is in the bag.

Thank you (-1)

l00ny_bstrd (218467) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417794)

...for correcting your grammar.

Glad to help where I can! :)

buy, now.........

P.S. Don't forget: La ilaha il Allah

werd.......

Re:no! (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417804)

No problem. You can rot in the internment camps with the rest of the ragheads.

Re:no! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417834)

you must be a fucking idiot.

Re:no! (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417854)

You'll find he's telling the truth. YOU must be a cunting turdwank.

And just think... (1)

ekrout (139379) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417758)

I'm still waiting for my Slashdot ID card!

OT - Bucknell (-1, Offtopic)

isolation (15058) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417768)

Hey do you jbolle at bucknell?

Re:OT - Bucknell (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417783)

Yes, he was in my computer architecture class last semester. Who are you?

Re:And just think... (1, Offtopic)

MaximumBob (97339) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417815)

I think a lot of Slashdot users would just as soon that their posts weren't connected to their real names in any way... "Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back" makes me think they should, anyway.

Re:And just think... (1)

ekrout (139379) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417857)

Heh :-)

I have nothing to hide, though.

It's true (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417760)

I just lost at soggy cracker . It is the 2nd time in 3 days. I've decided I really like losing at this game. We've scheduled a huge soggy cracker party all weekend.

Exploiting the Tragedy is GOOD (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417765)

You have to understand that under the current circumstances the United States economy truly does need someone to encourage growth and investment.

cunt (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417766)

cunt

ID CARDS for MEAN EVILS. (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417767)

Id cards are good for deporting deranged maniacs.

I want to deport all weirdoes so that I can see the end of the evil people who ruined my gingerbread house.

There is peace and love and good happyness stuff if the evil mengrols who fling thier scuzz like rabid animals festering out of the barn.

I CALL FOR A CARD TO MAKE THEM GO AWAY and I can be safe.

I want a Microsoft National ID card! (2, Flamebait)

WillSeattle (239206) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417769)

Think about it. Easy to hack, no security, have to reboot all the time, and you always have a lawyer on call.

but wait, if you... (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417887)

...lick my balls a little more i'll show you where to download a proxy to crack the ID card registration scheme.

Arghhh!!! No Friends!!! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417773)

President Bush is pre-empting the Friends episode. How can he do that?

Ross is the father! (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417792)

Who'd have thought it, eh?

Nice try. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417799)

That was stated in the previews.

And in other news... (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417822)

Lorks a-lordy! President Kennedy's been assassinated!

Especially that it's a turd baby! (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417863)

That Ross and his anal sex (him and Chandler go at it a lot, so he stuck to what he knew with Rachael). Now they're going to have a 7lb shit baby.

yes, they had ID (1)

Splork (13498) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417774)

but if Sun and Oracle had their way at least the hijackers would've had to pay them a royalty first.

Can you imagine... (-1)

xXgeneric nicknameXx (463142) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417775)

...a Beowulf cluster of ID cards?

Great... (0, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417777)

Well, that sounds like the first trumpet...

We should be expecting a bunch of losers to be carried away in chariots any minute now. Then a couple dudes will be standing around the Mid-East shooting fire out of their mouths.

Thanks, Scott. Do you have a particular design you'd like us to tattoo, also?

What a shocker (-1)

l00ny_bstrd (218467) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417779)

Rich bastards who can buy freedom and privacy want to create a system where all the proles like us get tracked 24/7 and they get even richer.

What fuckers.........

buy, now........

Now it becomes clear (0, Redundant)

alen (225700) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417780)

They want an ID card with Oracle databases being run on Solaris servers.

ANOTHER one? (3, Insightful)

keytoe (91531) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417781)


So, what's wrong with all the other national ID cards we carry around in our wallets? Social Security card not good enough? My drivers license not good enough? Passport? Credit cards? As if the government can't find out who I am using these 'old' methods.

Exactly what advantage does yet another card have? I'm sure they'll be just as easy to counterfeit as current identification methods...

Re:ANOTHER one? (3, Funny)

jiheison (468171) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417816)

No, no, NO!

This time, it's gonna work. You just watch and see!

Oh, and by the way. . .how DARE you criticize our government during this time of crisis and national unity behind our leaders?

Re:ANOTHER one? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417846)

The next one will be a barcode tattooed on our foreheads.

Re:ANOTHER one? (1)

jmauro (32523) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417851)

Not powered by Oracle and Java. Haven't you been reading. Must be powered by Oracle and Java or the entire system is completely worthless.

Re:ANOTHER one? (1)

danablankenhorn (415290) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417882)

We do have a lot of ID, and it sucks. This causes a great deal of fraud and commercial identity theft. A national standard based on encryption and biometrics may not be perfect, but it would be better than what we have. And it would have a million-and-one commercial applications, applications we all want and need and now deal with using insecure, incompatible, easy-to-hack systems that let anyone steal your identity by simply finding your social security number and doing a bad forgery of your signature.

I think a better question is... (5, Insightful)

Randy Rathbun (18851) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417883)

why?

What is a national ID card good for? What is it going to prevent? Will it prevent a guy from walking into a bank and holding it up? No. Would it prevent what happened one month ago? Definitely not, based on all the safeguards the perps passed right on through.

Guess I should just say it now - Ellison and McNealy are nothing more than opportunists who are taking advantage of a bad situation in order to pump up their stock prices.

Words from the mouths of babes (3, Interesting)

DoomHaven (70347) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417782)

"Absolute anonymity breeds absolute irresponsibility"

So, Mr. McNealy, shall we assume you are now absolutely anonymous?

"I'm tired of the outrage. If you get on a plane, I want to know who you are. If you rent a crop duster, I want to know who you are,'' he said.

If you head a large corporation, I want to know who you are.

A long time ago, this man was respectable. What happened?

Re:Words from the mouths of babes (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417798)

A long time ago, this man was respectable.

Dude, you must be way older than me, because I can't remember a time when McNealy was ever respectable.

Mockable? Loud-mouthed? Two-faced? Yes.Yes.Yes.

Re:Words from the mouths of babes (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417805)

I have no problem with McNeally's views on anonymity - just his view on everything else.

Re:Words from the mouths of babes (4, Funny)

Ghoser777 (113623) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417879)

If you build a house, I want to know who you are. Otherwise you might be able to combine different household chemicals to create chemical weapons that could wipe out the world.

If you have privacy, I want to know who you are. Anytime the government does not have complete control over what you are doing is a security risk. We cannot not let petty issues like "freedom" stand in the way of protecting American ideals.

F-bacher

And meanwhile... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417784)

...Microsoft wants a national PocketPC running Microsoft ID Card 2.0! Paid for with tax dollars of course!

What are the exact criteria? (5, Interesting)

dan_bethe (134253) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417786)

I never see mention of the Social Security system as a form of national ID. Why is that? Is it because the card doesn't directly identify more personal characteristics such as a photo, address, or phone number?

What info do these "authorities" want? Under what circumstances can they requisition this information, or ask the person to make an ID?

I can understand using it in a fully secure situation such as boarding a plane, assuming that such a thing is Constitutional and isn't yet another link into the Revelations style end of humanity, and assuming that it can be used accurately.

Of course the answer to that last question fades off into potential violation of independant liberty, as in requiring national criminal ID for renting a truck in case you intend to load it with a fertilizer bomb. But I think at least the previous questions should be reasonably answered.

Re:What are the exact criteria? (1)

jiheison (468171) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417844)

I never see mention of the Social Security system as a form of national ID. Why is that?

Probably because it is one of the most widely abused forms of ID the government issues, and they don't want to answer a bunch of cynical questions about identity theft.

Re:What are the exact criteria? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417864)

don't forget that the government could setup scanners anywhere in order to track your every move. Man, doesn't this asshole believe in freedom. What is wrong with all these people that are so willing to give up freedom for NO SECURITY. These people are weak, plain and simple. People like McNealy should be ridiculed.
This is pathetic.

Re:What are the exact criteria? (2, Informative)

FrostyWheaton (263146) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417869)

SSN's are not to be used as a "national ID" because it is prohibited by law. No person, except the SSA and the IRS can force you to provide your SSN. Sure everyone asks for it wen tyou sign up for anything, but you are never obligated to give it. And no one can deny service because of it.

Re:What are the exact criteria? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417877)

There's a good reason for that, shrouded in the mists of time.


When the SSN was introduced, no-one wanted it. They feared that a single unique number would make people more easily tracable, and cause them to lose their privacy. Sound familiar? So the government had to promise that the SSN would never become a National ID Card.

Re:What are the exact criteria? (1)

nunaat (306264) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417892)

I never see mention of the Social Security system as a form of national ID. Why is that?

I believe that when Social Security was enacted, one of the provisions was that it wouldn't be used as a form of id...

Oh well...

Dan :)

Need freeze on immigration (0, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417787)

USA needs to freeze immigration, revoke all visas for visitors from hostile middle eastern countries. I would included student visas in that mix too. All middle eastern non-citizens should be deported back to their homeland. It is time that the USA regains control of her borders. Military should be deployed to assist border patrol to prevent terrorists and their weapons from slipping into the country unchecked. Write to your senator and representative and demand action.

Re:Need freeze on immigration (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417811)

Heh. Weren't you just saying the same thing about Mexicans a month ago?

The more things change, the more they stay the same.

Re:Need freeze on immigration (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417837)

ha ha ! this is a good one, I think the original poster was sarcastic.

YEAH! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417868)

Fuck yeah! The voice of reason!

If we had done this a long time ago, there is *NO WAY* the WTC disaster could've happened! We could've prevented Oklah...

err, wait.

Driver's Licenses (3, Interesting)

vicviper (140480) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417788)

How can a driver's license count as a national ID card if everyone doesn't drive, or qualify for one?

It's very easy (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417806)

All you have to say is hey, you have to drive a car to live in this country.

Re:It's very easy (1)

Platinum Dragon (34829) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417865)

All you have to say is hey, you have to drive a car to live in this country.

Well, that fucks over the blind.

Re:Driver's Licenses (2)

SIGFPE (97527) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417810)

In the US DMV's will issue cards even if you can't or won't drive. See this [state.ny.us] or that [digitalcity.com]

Re:Driver's Licenses (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417818)

Since when are Americans capable of driving a car?
I haven't seen at least ONE, yet ...

Re:Driver's Licenses (3, Informative)

Heem (448667) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417821)

Because you can (and should) get a state ID if you choose not to drive, or cant pass the test. How else you gonna buy porn,smokes and lotto tickets, or go out to the bar? Seriously though.. ID cards are great and all, but we already have them, and its NOT going to do anything for us. Having an ID does not stop one from blowing things up. Especially the breed we are dealing with now - ones who DONT CARE if they die, and PREFER that we know who they are.

Re:Driver's Licenses (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417872)

>How else you gonna buy porn,smokes and lotto
>tickets, or go out to the bar?

Everyone does not look like a teenie bopper :)

and another thing! (2)

mysticbob (21980) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417791)

q: and, do we know the hijackers got their knives on the planes through check-in?

a: no - let's increase check-in security.

q: do we know that bin laden is _actually_ responsible, not just capable?

a: no, let's bomb the hell out of the taliban.

this type of reactionary non-critical thinking is rampant so many places and it makes me grumpy. grr.

but i digress...

Re:and another thing! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417838)

You're not alone.

Oracle ID - the price of freedom? (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417793)

The Oracle ID card would have an initial cost of $100,000 and require a fulltime DBA to administer.

TCL (1)

vaxtor (520122) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417796)

how about a card using TCL :)

COBOL (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417853)

I vote for a system based on COBOL, for its robust features and user-friendliness. Plus, I'm sure Muslims hate hacking it as much as we hate programming it...

Hijackers' ID (1)

jpm242 (202316) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417797)

"And didn't each and every one of the hijackers present valid ID?"

Yup, but the airport security couldn't make out the names because the cards only support 7 bit ASCII chars.

Re:Hijackers' ID (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417858)

That's not funny.

Hijacker's IDs (1)

woogie (18354) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417802)

>And didn't each and every one of the hijackers
>present valid ID?

No. That's why a couple was arrested for selling fake IDs to some of them.

Woogie

Terriorist ID's (3, Informative)

leinerj (115797) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417803)

The terriorist did indeed present valid ID's, but under more careful exam. some of the id's were expired which should have set alarms off in securities head...

Business as usual (2, Insightful)

Maskirovka (255712) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417807)

Sorry to play the devil's advocate here, but these people are payed the big bucks to enrich their stock holders. It's their sole purpose. This is an excelent oportunity for them to do so. Wtf do you expect from any self respecting CEO?? (excluding Steve Jobs maybe)

Maskirovka

Obviously the only thing to do.. (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417813)

.. is to kill all non-Whites.

Re:Obviously the only thing to do.. (-1)

l00ny_bstrd (218467) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417880)

Yeah! Cuz no God-fearing, white-skinned American would ever blow up a building in the US or anything like that, right?

Yeah, I know, IHBT, but I just couldn't help myself...

buy, now....

We need ID cards (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417814)

People who oppose ID cards will have the blood of innocent civilians on their hands.

You don't like being identified, fine, fucking leave America and fucking get out of my country!.

If you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear!.

Re:We need ID cards (1)

blibbleblobble (526872) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417843)

Do you brown-shirts have nothing better to do than post your nazi ravings on slashdot? I respected this area as a place for the most intelligent people I ever knew to post, and I still do, so I hope never to see such as this posted under the guise of "comment".

Re:We need ID cards (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417852)

People who exploit tragedy for finantial gain have the blood of innocent civilians on their hands.

You like forcing your views on others, fine, fucking leave America and fucking get out of my country!.

If you have nothing to hide, that's no reason to give up freedom!

Re:We need ID cards (1)

jiheison (468171) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417881)

Why don't you log in and post that, Mister Full Disclosure?

Exploiting the tragedy (1)

wrinkledshirt (228541) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417819)

Is there any company that doesn't want to exploit a tragedy for financial gain?

I know exactly what you're talking about. Trust me, you're not alone. Don't you feel like you should say something? Don't you just want to scream out loud, "Let's have some dignity!" Of course you do! And for $12.99 you too can get a T-Shirt that says just that! Just call this 1-800 number and get yours...

(sorry, it's pissing me off too. thought maybe some black humour would help)

Re:Exploiting the tragedy (1)

czardonic (526710) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417898)

Take heart!

The presence of this kind of craven capitalism is further evidence that terrorism can not shake America from it's fundamental values.

ID card schmard (1)

DrSkwid (118965) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417825)

crime isn't prevented by positive identification

we already have many forms of ID
Passport, Social Security Number, Driving Licence etc. etc.

There's not much more security for anyone by introducing another sort but it does introduce an excuse for cops to run you in or generally hassle you for "ID please" as no doubt you'll be obliged to carry it at all times. Imagine that. An object you have to carry everywhere on penalty of criminal punishment.

One step away from chip implants or an iButton [ibutton.com] welded to you at birth.

if you paid attention (0)

bkthomps (519572) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417826)

if you paid attention, you would notice that the president of oracle offered to donate the technology needed to organize a national id card he just wants - if anything - to have bragging rights for being trusted by the government

Ever heard of a ... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417827)

... United States Passport?

I have one, shown it around in various countries a bit, sort of shows where I'm from and where I stand, they usually let me come and go.

Not JAVA enabled though ... BFD.

Make them more appealing (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417830)

make the cards in pleasing shapes like yelow stars, pink triangles...

Oracle's plan (5, Insightful)

aralin (107264) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417831)

You should maybe try to find the recent speach or article published by Larry Ellison on the topic. Oracle does not plan to take away any of your liberties or profit on a national tragedy.

Larry Ellison pointed out that all the information is already in some databases, but while businesses like VISA, AMEX and others poll their databases and link these data together, federal agencies do NOT. If they did, 6 of these 19 terrorists would have been CAUGHT at entry and the attack would likely NEVER happen since they were sought for in some counties in US. How can someone get into the country without notice by INS when he is on 'Wanted' list on Florida?

The other point I've heard was that (as I've heard) Oracle planed to donate database software for the purpose of creating the global ID.

And last, but not least, the plan for global ID proposed by Larry Ellison should have been on voluntary basis to make things for you convenient and avoid these long and thorough checks of identity that will definitely appear on different wanna-be-secure locations like airports.

Get your facts straight, please, before starting to slander someone's ideas.

Re:Oracle's plan (2)

corky6921 (240602) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417895)

"...while businesses like VISA, AMEX and others poll their databases and link these data together, federal agencies do NOT. If they did, 6 of these 19 terrorists would have been CAUGHT at entry and the attack would likely NEVER happen since they were sought for in some counties in US."

And exactly how would a Java/Oracle/.NET/AOL/{insert company here} card have prevented this?

"Oracle planed to donate database software for the purpose of creating the global ID."

Aw, now, shucks, Larry. We all know that you're such the humanitarian, [bcentral.com] but to know that your donation would not help you financially in any way, now that just warms my heart...

Of course they're trying to make money. (1, Interesting)

drinkypoo (153816) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417832)

...Oracle wants a national ID card powered by Oracle. Sun wants a national ID card powered by Java. ... Is there any company that doesn't want to exploit a tragedy for financial gain? And didn't each and every one of the hijackers present valid ID?

Rant first, content on a national ID card system below.

I hate to be the one to break this to you, but you're in a capitalistic society (Assuming you're in any of the first world nations, at the very least) which is busily reforming the entire world in its image, which is the way it always goes. Whoever's on top has the most time and money to throw away on cultural nonsense (Hollywood, Big Music, et cetera) which shapes everyone who comes in contact with it. These days, that's pretty much everyone. Even world music is becoming more and more like the music we listen to here, with very little exchange in the other direction - At least comparatively.

In fact, Big Music has put together several compilations, a small part of the proceeds of which go to disaster relief. But they're just the ones we have the jihad against (While at the same time buying albums from them) so they're the ones that stick out the most, except for one notable example.

That example is the set of flag crap that they're selling on late night TV for $19.95. They're little flags that clip onto the tops of your windows, which is an okay idea if you drive with the windows up all the time. In the final shot of all the products (which includes a "god bless america" flag or something like that, a normal american flag, and some other kitsch) they put their stupid flag IN FRONT OF the real American Flag, Capital A, Capital F. I mean, I'm not all that worked up about it, but that shows the nerve of these people. They might as well have had a big million dollar bill flag that was in front of both of them.

On The Other Hand, you could see this whole thing as a Triumph Of The American Spirit(tm). Here we are making shit-ade out of the shit we've been handed, and we're drinking it up and smiling as we clean our guns. Say, while we're on (off?) the topic, does anyone else think that we ought to send some militias to Afghanistan to kick some ass? Those people have too much time on their hands anyway.

Anyway, now the content; A National ID card is coming, like it or not. I suspect that they'll just tie all the state databases together for a while, then work on a system to replace it while people get used to that. When it comes, I'm going to have to rush out and pay Texas some traffic ticket fines I've been blowing off (mostly due to a lack of employment due to the tech crunch) so they don't take my license away. Unless, of course, various states choose to only maintain the working relationships they have now.

as a devout moslem (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417833)

As a devout Moslem, I am beginning to take offence to Slashdot's biased and often degrading view of the Arab world. I realized this when I read this post [slashdot.org] . Normally posts on slashdot that insult any race are instantly pegged as trolls or flamebait, however since the subject of the joke happened to be arab and they are 'terroists' according to the site and most of it's audience, it was considered funny. This is the type of treatment of the Islamic world that drove those terrorists to do what they did. Perhaps instead of blaming it on Arabs you should begin to take some responsibility for yourselves. Other articles on slashdot such as one written by John Katz spoke of how we should be protecting the lives of American soldiers, while many Afghani civilians are being killed. I find this disgraceful, and slashdot has thrown away any chance of becoming a source for reputable news. May Allah forgive you all.

fuck you raghead (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417886)

Instead of hijacking planes and crashing them into buildings maybe you guys should pay a little attention to your home grown tyrants instead of blaming the Jews and America for everything. So take a break from beating women running around in public without a burqa and do some reading on what it takes to create a half decent nation-state.

McNealy is a... (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417839)

nazi asshole, and so is anybody else that supports a national id card.

we need... (1)

giantsquidmarks (179758) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417840)

national ID underwear, tongue-studs or bracelets... cards are so overused...

Forged ID and Illegal Immigrants (1, Flamebait)

StevenMaurer (115071) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417842)

Actually, many of the hijackers presented forged ID, and to this day we don't really know who they are.

Furthermore, as many of them were in the country on temporary visas, with a national ID there might have been a way to root them out. So do not pretend that there are absolutely no benefits to having a national ID.

Still there are drawbacks, and no it doesn't have to do with any silly 1984-type distopian fantasies. With a national ID used everywhere, all those lovely illegal immigrants from Latin America would be kicked out. Why is that bad? Because it would very quickly drive the U.S. into a full fledged depression. The U.S. needs its illegals just as much as they need us; it's just that we don't admit it to ourselves.

Just because the U.S. isn't being hypocritical dealing with the Taliban doesn't mean we aren't hypocrites in many other places.

IDs at airline checkin not for security (5, Insightful)

Crispy Critters (226798) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417849)

As Bruce Schneier mentioned in a special Cryptogram, IDs at airline check-ins don't do anything for security, partly because getting fake IDs is so easy. What it does accomplish is to keep semi-honest people from selling their airline tickets to each other.


There are two separate issues here. A national ID is not necessarily so bad. However, assigning a uniques identification number to each American is what threatens privacy. Having a unique ID number which is accessible to anyone permits cross-correlating databases and other methods of mining data and constructing profiles of people. Also, if there was a bar code or similar machine-readable encoding of the number on the ID card, then soon anyone (airline, dentist, grocery store, border guard, building security) would start swiping the card and recording our movements and activities in a way that would be very easy to combine in giant databases.


I am not saying this would happen, or is even likely, but it would be possible and that is scary enough.

Big push for services.... (2)

reaper20 (23396) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417850)

Ok,

So now everyone thinks that services is the next big thing that will save the IT world and all the tech companies, so everyone is lining up for a universal ID system, which will somehow be tied to .NET/Java2EE or whatever like this:

<conjecture and humor>

The Microsoft Network, the only online service that ties directly into your NationalID, so you can do your taxes, use government services, and chat all with one service! Use your NationalID at amazon, cdnow, and others. Remember, the IRS deadline for NationalID is next month, don't get stuck using 'non-standard' protocols like Quicken, or paper.

Oracle - Oracle saved 34 billion running its ID on its own ID system, how much will the country save?

Sun - We're the ID behind NationalID.

</conjecture and humor>

By selling a National ID Card system that is smart, these large companies can leverage that to tie in more 'services' to 'integrate' this to whatever they are selling. In other words, more spam for everybody ....

As much as we hate to admit it, the government sets a standard, not really on purpose, but because they pick something and stick to it (MS Office for example). Now, take that standard and use it to get a leg up in industry ... the goverment uses it, you might as well use our system, because they do too ...

No comment on Microsoft in the article? (2)

leucadiadude (68989) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417856)

Interesting that fully half the referenced article was about Sun and Microsoft fighting over who get's to be the big bad ID authenticator of the digital age.

No has yet mentioned Microsoft, not even to rant at them. Amazing.

The Enemy of Your Enemy is NOT Your Friend (1)

Bud Dwyer (527622) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417859)

US foreign policy has proved this again and again, the most relevant case being that of Osama bin Laden. Just because someone is fighting the person you're fighting doesn't mean you should help them.


I think the Slashdot, anti-Microsoft crowd should learn this once and for all. Sun, and all the other Microsoft hating companies, will come back to bite you in the ass if you help them fight Microsoft.


McNealy's statement is fucking disgraceful. That is all.

Michael you fucking raghead loving communist (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2417862)

We should forgo the nation ID card and just deport fuckwits like yourself.

Conspiracy Theory (1)

TroyFoley (238708) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417867)

It's a push to indirectly give police officers power to murder. Remember the black/hispanic immigrant in NY who was shot with 41 bullets?
"LOOK OUT! HE'S GOT ID!"

hijackers (1)

Monofilament (512421) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417871)

the hijackers not only presented valid ID but also the ID they had were completely legally obtained by naturalization or VISA Identification... soo really how does this solve the terrorism problem.. It so sad to see so many people using these tragedies as a spring board for their own personaly gain and political platforms

What I want is... (2)

CleverNickName (129189) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417874)

What I want is a national ID card powered by Microsoft.

If I get stopped by the cops, I just show it to them, and they are so filled with FUD that they let me off, scott-free.

Knee-jerk reactions (1)

EnderPax (173293) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417875)

Start with the summary for the story:

Is there any company that doesn't want to exploit a tragedy for financial gain?

Certainly there are many who have no intenion of profiting from tragedy. Probably at least as many as intend the opposite. The question is, I hope, rhetorical, even if silly its face. I'll ask one that's going to get an equal, but opposite response, and is just as useless:

Can a company intend to do something that is not purely profit-based? Is it possible for a Company to be less than Wholly Evil?

And didn't each and every one of the hijackers present valid ID?

Possibly. Although the interesting thing is that this presumes that presenting ID, as such, would have prevented the events on 9/11 in some way. I think everyone knows that presenting IDs and answering three questions isn't a security system. Many, many people get credible IDs merely to drink alocohol. Many people follow this up by lying when asked their age. So clearly, the system as a whole was completely inadequate.

ID cards, such as they are currently, are indeed, largely useless for security purposes. But what if we had a national ID that would be useful for increased security? There are, of course, many, many potential pitfalls. But also many potential benefits. I will not argue the case for or against ID cards. Many people much smarter and more eloquent have done so. But it seems that this is an issue worth considering, regardless of the companies that may or may not profit from it. Skip the knee-jerk anti-corporate reaction and actually consider those arguments.

I don't mind (1)

mozumder (178398) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417876)

Saves space in my wallet if they can link this ID card to Drivers license, Bank Accounts (cashless society), Credit cards, Discount Programs, Passport/Citizenships...

Actually, you probably wouldn't need an ID card if everywhere you went had computer terminals linked to the system, and all you needed to do was punch in your SS number to bring up your ID.

But man the fraud/abuse potential for such a system... scary!

The ultimate ID system: (2)

mikeage (119105) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417884)

Slash! Seriously... think about it. You can always hide yourself, but it makes fun of you. You get promoted for group-think, and struck down for originality. Almost everyone has a connection to Natalie Portman (usually in the form of hot grits-- great for down south... both the South, and the other meaning ), and finally-- everyone will be able to spot and avoid JonKatz just with one checkbox! W00t@ge!

Scott McNealy isn't a friend of mine (1)

z7209 (305927) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417889)

I heard him speak on computing power not so long ago may two or three months) and he was adamant that users should not have computers much more powerful than today and something to the effect of limited availability of computing power except when licensed.

I wish I could find a transcript because I can't vouch for the details, but it was shocking.

Oh well, big business is quite happy with big brother, what's new.

Gataca (2)

mestreBimba (449437) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417891)

Forget about Id cards, I want Gataca style instant DNA id. A quick pinprick, a little analysis, and a check against a database.

The day this is implemented is the day I become a hermit in the Middle Fork Wilderness area.

Microsoft Vs (Sun/Oracle) Vs U.S. Government (1)

Gulfie2 (310175) | more than 12 years ago | (#2417894)

And they are off. First one to a widely accepted authenticantion system wins.

But seriously, it looks alot like this would be a great tie in with the reciently proposed .net competitor. Especialy they got a primary dataload that contained all 280+ million Americans. From the Sun / Oracle perspective it woudl be perfict, and would define any other system as a second class wana -be-competitor.

Personaly, I don't trust any of them to build a secure system, or even something reasonibly secure.

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