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Microsoft To Open Source .NET and Take It Cross-Platform

Soulskill posted 2 days ago | from the april-fools-headlines-from-10-years-ago dept.

Programming 481

An anonymous reader writes: Microsoft today announced plans to open source .NET, the company's software framework that primarily runs on Windows, and release it on GitHub. Furthermore, Microsoft also unveiled plans to take .NET cross-platform by targeting both Mac OS X and Linux. In the next release, Microsoft plans to open source the entire .NET server stack, from ASP.NET 5 down to the Common Language Runtime and Base Class Libraries. The company will let developers build .NET cloud applications on multiple platforms; it is promising future support of the .NET Core server runtime and framework for Mac and Linux. Microsoft is also making Visual Studio free for small teams.

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Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (3, Funny)

iggymanz (596061) | 2 days ago | (#48368951)

Too little too late, Billy Bob Gates

Re: Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (4, Funny)

bill_mcgonigle (4333) | 2 days ago | (#48368985)

They're taking it Mono a Mono.

With nasty patent clauses, no doubt.

Re: Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (0)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369327)

Probably, but at least patents expire decades before copyrights do.

Re: Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (0)

Delicious Pun (3864033) | 2 days ago | (#48369371)

They're taking it Mono a Mono.

Ha!

Re: Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (5, Informative)

ljw1004 (764174) | 2 days ago | (#48369637)

They're taking it Mono a Mono. With nasty patent clauses, no doubt.

:) Microsoft's patent clauses are spelled out here https://github.com/dotnet/core... [github.com]

I guess these are the key paragraphs:

Microsoft Corporation and its affiliates (“Microsoft”) promise not to assert any .NET Patents against you for making, using, selling, offering for sale, importing, or distributing Covered Code, as part of either a .NET Runtime or as part of any application designed to run on a .NET Runtime.

If you file, maintain, or voluntarily participate in any claim in a lawsuit alleging direct or contributory patent infringement by any Covered Code, or inducement of patent infringement by any Covered Code, then your rights under this promise will automatically terminate.

Disclaimer: I'm not a lawyer, but I am on Microsoft's VB/C# language team

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (3, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48368993)

Billy Bob Gates

It's good to know Slashdot's irrational hatred is still firmly entrenched in the '90s.

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (0)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369041)

Billy Bob Gates

It's good to know Slashdot's irrational hatred is still firmly entrenched in the '90s.

Hah, it never ends.

Because it's all on BOOOOSH!!!!

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (3, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369231)

Billy Bob Gates

It's good to know Slashdot's irrational hatred is still firmly entrenched in the '90s.

Hah, it never ends.

Because it's all on BOOOOSH!!!!

LMAO...There was only Bush 1.0 in 1990-1992. And he did absolutely nothing with regard to computing and policy.

If only the Microsoft hatred here at /. was irrational. Most of us that dislike Microsoft do so because we got tired of dealing with the constantly moving goal posts for competency, the ridiculous lock-ins to proprietary software stacks, and the even more ridiculous costs of everything they made. So, if by fact based dislike for an entire segment of the technology sector, then yes, that would be irrational.

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (3, Interesting)

RavenLrD20k (311488) | 2 days ago | (#48369755)

Don't think I'm defending Microsoft here because I am old enough to remember Microsoft at its worst and still have the deep seated hatred of Gates and Balmer era MS. Hell, anti-trust BS aside I still hate them for what they did to my MechWarrior franchise alone! However, under the new leadership that seems to be taking the company towards an era of Glasnost and Perestroika, the hatred is given pause as I wait for the next dick move that may never come. At the very least, Microsoft has moved into a position that is no more or less "evil" than Google (yes, do no evil no longer applies here) or Apple. Given this, I wonder how many people here truly rationally hate MS anymore as opposed to hatred through nostalgia (like me) or hatred through "it's the way we do things around here" syndrome. As a developer that uses MS products and support in his profession, and develops Linux, Android, and Arduino apps as a hobby, I still prefer the current open source way of doing things over the MS way... but as far as the hatred? It cannot be said yet that Microsoft is the same company it was in the Balmer days. They at least *look* like they're moving towards a path that looks similar to the one Sun Microsystems was beating through.

Re: Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (2)

Chuck Burns (3908977) | 2 days ago | (#48369803)

You mean like Linux keeps moving the goal posts for interoperability with other Unix operating systems? Requiring the rest of them to adopt linuxisms just to use things like X?

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (-1)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369073)

Only because Microsoft's douchbaggery is still firmly entrenched in the '90s.

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (0)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369127)

It's good to know Slashdot's irrational hatred is still firmly entrenched in the '90s.

Irrational? In what way?

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (2, Insightful)

tehcyder (746570) | 2 days ago | (#48369241)

It's good to know Slashdot's irrational hatred is still firmly entrenched in the '90s.

Irrational? In what way?

Presumably because Bill Gates is no longer the CEO, so saying "yah boo sucks to Bill Gates" is about as meaningful as saying "Microsoft limits filenames to a ridiculous 8.3 format"

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (0)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369135)

it is one of the things that makes slashdot, slashdot...

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (1)

MightyMartian (840721) | 2 days ago | (#48369165)

Another development stack and application ecosystem is nice, and if it's licensed under a proper open source license, then I'm all for it. I can't say I'd be in any rush to develop in it, and that may be the real problem here, that Microsoft is about seven or eight years too late.

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (0)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369749)

Per the code repository for it at https://github.com/Microsoft/dotnet:

".NET open source projects typically use either the MIT or Apache 2 licenses for code. Some projects license documentation and other forms of content under Creative Commons Attribution 4.0. See specific projects to understand the license used."

Sounds pretty open to me.

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (0)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369319)

Irrational hatred is just the start. If we don't see a lengthy exposition on how this is somehow part of an evil conspiracy - also involving the NSA, of course - then I'll be sorely disappointed. Presumably, it will involve a nefarious plot by Gates and NSA to embrace, extend, and extinguish [wikipedia.org] Mono. Only Richard Stallman himself will be able to save us from yet another evil attempt to enslave us via software. We can only hope that RMS has been producing enough toe jam [google.com] to sustain himself lately.

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369023)

Yeah, they're just quaking their boots for the 3% Apple market and 0.8% Linux share.

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (2)

iggymanz (596061) | 2 days ago | (#48369075)

This is not about the desktop space alone, but rather an architectural one spanning all tiers of server to mobile (and Linux has massive share on those particular endpoints).

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (0)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369171)

Indeed, what they're trying to do is establish themselves as the de-facto way of writing applications on all platforms. Once they're there, they can withdrawl support for other platforms, and bam... 100% market share.

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (1)

meustrus (1588597) | 2 days ago | (#48369493)

Once software is open source, the open source version can never be closed again. If Microsoft made .Net 4.5 open source and closed the source again in .Net 5, 4.5 would still be completely open because open source licenses would permit existing licensees to redistribute the software under their own license terms. That's assuming they use a real open source license, of course, but if they try to manufacture a revokable open source license then the EFF's lawyers will know, it will be another story on Slashdot, and they will gain absolutely nothing.

But then I suppose that "supported" is different from "legally available". But any open source project can pull support, and most don't have great support to begin with, so it's a moot point.

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (3, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369355)

Yeah, they're just quaking their boots for the 3% Apple market and 0.8% Linux share.

Actually, yes, they are. The Mac OS X market is growing on the desktop and the Linux server market has been kicking ass for some time now. Microsoft is losing developers for Windows and they have recently gone through some pretty massive layoffs in the last five years, more than 23,000 employees. They are losing ground in the console wars with the Xbox One, and are struggling to keep their Nokia purchase from tanking. Add to that the abysmal Windows 8 reception and the Surface fiasco that is just starting to show some rays of hope for that device and you have a tech company on a significant downward slide. Also note how most of the older employees are cashing out and going on to other projects. Signs that the ship is going down!

If they're not collectively quaking in their boots, they ought to be!

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (1)

ColdWetDog (752185) | 2 days ago | (#48369505)

And somehow, just somehow, they're making one hell of lot more money that all the ACs multiplied together. Something like half of Apple's profits but about the same as Boeing's - so they have a goal to reach (can't let anyone get bigger than you are, it's just not right). But that ship ain't sinking for a bit yet.

Hold on to your Personal Floatation Device and maybe buy some stock.

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (0)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369687)

P.S. Update your numbers, they are about ten years old:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_share_of_operating_systems

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (1)

pmontra (738736) | 2 days ago | (#48369097)

Maybe not too little, but yes, it's too late. They should have embraced and estinguished the other platforms when they had a virtual monopoly on both the desktop and the server. In the late 90s it was common to write Java web applications and make them run on Windows NT 3.51 and 4.0. Enterprises were comfortable with Windows and were wary of Linux (unproven technology). It took over in the 2000s.

About being it too little: are they going to port Visual Studio to OS X and Linux?

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (0)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369513)

I doubt Visual Studio gets ported, that would be a major undertaking even if it's written more and more in C# these days. Pity, while I'd still prefer Codewarrior, I'd gladly pay for VS on Mac to ditch the abomination that is XCode.

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (1)

Richard_at_work (517087) | 2 days ago | (#48369551)

They are integrating major parts of the development process into other, existing editors rather than porting VS (which would be a huuuuuuuge job) - for example, serious effort is being put into adding debugging and intellisense into SubLime Edit for .Net stuff.

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (0)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369121)

So, uhh... What's Bill Gates got to do with this?

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (0)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369129)

Too little too late, Billy Bob Gates

Agreed. This should have been done a decade or more ago. Well, at least with open source it will now get the bug fixes and improvements its desparately needed for a decade.

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (0)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369273)

Well, at least with open source it will now get the bug fixes and improvements its desparately needed for a decade.

Humorist.

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (1)

duckintheface (710137) | 2 days ago | (#48369179)

Balmer once called Linux a cancer that was eating the world's software. Sounds like M$ now has a terminal case. That's what it sounds like, but I'm sure they are lying.

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (4, Insightful)

ArcadeMan (2766669) | 2 days ago | (#48369387)

AFAIK both Bill Gates and Steve Balmer don't control Microsoft anymore.

This is a new Microsoft with a new CEO, so we should at least give them the benefit of the doubt.

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (3, Informative)

xonen (774419) | 2 days ago | (#48369723)

You are twisting his words. Ballmer was not talking about Linux, but about the GPL and it's 'viral' nature.

And to their defense, MS has released more open-source software and libraries in the past. Also they actually contribute to the Linux kernel.

There's plenty left to dislike MS for without twisting the truth.

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (1)

Barlo_Mung_42 (411228) | 2 days ago | (#48369209)

You're stuck in the past.

Bill is too busy saving lives to care about what you think of him. MS is still making money hand over fist and doing an impressive job adjusting to the changing landscape it finds itself on. They are clearly not going the way of Sun any time soon.

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (0)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369585)

Bill is too busy trying to reforge public opinion of himself so he can go down in history books as a "good guy" to care about what you think of him.

FTFY

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (1)

__keronin (3601667) | 2 days ago | (#48369325)

As professional linux user , yes I confirm, too late. but with fuckload of money microsoft have . nothing is problem for them if them wants truly make good move.

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (0)

Eravnrekaree (467752) | 2 days ago | (#48369437)

You imply that .NET is not used widely and that something like Qt is. .NET is pretty widely used in companies, much more than Qt is. Yes, it is due to brand recognition, marketing and due to companies buying support contracts from Microsoft. Its also due to the labor pipeline, more people are trained for .NET due to Microsofts certification programs and marketing of learning materials to colleges which encourages colleges to teach it. Microsoft is good at marketing and knows to get uptake you need to market to the labor supply and as well to businesses and this means creating off the shelf materials and support systems which makes your product look like a safe, well documented, well supported solution with a large company behind it that won't leave you hanging and require all sorts of unexpected expenses. Microsoft knows you have to get into the colleges where the CS grads are coming from and that by CS grads being exposed to .NET in college they will carry that over into their jobs and as well companies know there is a large supply of .NET labor when they buy into the platform.

This is where open source fails, they have not been able, Red Hat for instance, been able to penetrate the colleges to create a supply of labor for their stuff as well as Microsoft has. They have not created the certification programs that businesses like and which creates confidence in there being a labor supply that is fairly consistent.

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (1)

oh_my_080980980 (773867) | 2 days ago | (#48369491)

RedHat is an operating system. .NET is a programming architecture. You need to look at the programming languages people learn.

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (0)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369579)

You need to look at the programming languages people learn.

You may not like it, but C# is in very wide and very heavy "enterprise" use... Move along, fan boy.

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (1)

iggymanz (596061) | 2 days ago | (#48369661)

My statement has nothing to do with how widely something is used, rather the motive for ploy of finally jumping on open source bandwagon.

Re:Desparate Microsoft pulls a "Sun Microsystems" (2, Informative)

pooh666 (624584) | 2 days ago | (#48369729)

"What the fuck is Qt?", my boss says. He is right. Great news re .Net. Good luck to all of those unable to see the benifit of this. Our companies will eat your companies for peanuts, not because of .Net, but because your tech opinons are so clouded with emotion.

promised this 12 years ago (1)

peter303 (12292) | 2 days ago | (#48369009)

Our company would have used it as a platform then.

Re:promised this 12 years ago (1)

swilver (617741) | 2 days ago | (#48369405)

That wouldn't have fooled me even then.

Too little, too late (1)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369011)

We already have Mono!

Re:Too little, too late (5, Funny)

i kan reed (749298) | 2 days ago | (#48369061)

Oh no, two versions of an open source technology. Thank god Linux still only has that one distribution.

Really, though, I can see no downsides to this change.

Re:Too little, too late (2)

TheRealMindChild (743925) | 2 days ago | (#48369065)

Yeah, without one of the most important parts... WinForms

Re:Too little, too late (1)

NotInHere (3654617) | 2 days ago | (#48369299)

Yeah, and Microsoft won't release it either. Or does the "server stack" include WinForms?

Re:Too little, too late (1)

bangular (736791) | 2 days ago | (#48369131)

You have a good point. Saying you're "open sourcing .net" can mean a lot of things. Mono is actually useful today. An open source .net that's missing a huge number of libraries and Windows specific features is useless. Might as well just stick with Mono at that point.

Re:Too little, too late (2)

Trepidity (597) | 2 days ago | (#48369201)

Mono is impressive, but doesn't have the development resources to really compete with the CLR or JVM for a lot of workloads. The garbage collector in particular is not as good. That's one reason you see languages that want to build on top of an open-source VM, like Clojure or Scala, targeting the JVM rather than Mono.

Illegal to distribute a WIP JVM implementation (1)

tepples (727027) | 2 days ago | (#48369571)

That's one reason you see languages that want to build on top of an open-source VM, like Clojure or Scala, targeting the JVM rather than Mono.

One major practical problem with using the JVM is that Oracle has power to use the courts to enforce a strict cathedral model [wikipedia.org] . Because the license of Oracle's Java Language Specification forbids distributing implementations of subsets of the Java platform, any reimplementation of the JVM has to be kept private until it's complete enough to pass all tests.

Re:Too little, too late (0)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369211)

I wonder if they'll just acquire/absorb Xamarin?

Re:Too little, too late (-1)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369377)

But Mono can't stream Netflix, the only .NET application end users ever actually wanted.

Re:Too little, too late (1)

mister_playboy (1474163) | 2 days ago | (#48369603)

.NET seems to be common for game modding/editing programs, actually.

I can play Borderlands 2 on Linux natively, but I have to use a VM to run the Gibbed save editor which is a .NET 4.0 program.

Re:Too little, too late (0)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369555)

Mono isn't used by serious people and .net wont be installed on most linux dists

Re:Too little, too late (1)

Richard_at_work (517087) | 2 days ago | (#48369589)

Mono is actually very incomplete, and I'm not talking about the major components that people usually bring up like WinForms - its missing a lot of the lesser used method overloads in various places, so if your code uses one then you are SOL. You are encouraged to treat it as a bug and submit a report, but its still an issue when you have deadlines approaching.

Timeo Danaos et dona ferentes (1)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369017)

I fear the geeks even if they bring presents.

Sounds like what Sun did (5, Informative)

ErichTheRed (39327) | 2 days ago | (#48369059)

This is actually a pretty smart idea, but it sounds like what Sun did with Java and parts of Solaris. .NET was designed to be a Windows-only application platform, requiring Windows clients for fat applications and at least Windows servers for web applications. Now Microsoft is seeing Windows become less relevant, but they do want people to be using their software stack regardless of platform.

Same thing with Visual Studio being made free...kind of like XCode being free for MacOS, and the open source IDEs being free. It's a bold move because now the .NET ecosystem needs to stand on its own, and I guarantee they're going to try to tie this in with Azure somehow (like making you run the free VS in Azure VMs you pay for or something...)

One scary thing from my side of the house (systems engineering/integration) is the number of new security flaws and the sheer volume of patches that are going to be released once .NET gets more scrutiny. A good thing, yes, but patching .NET is already a pain in the butt.

Re:Sounds like what Sun did (-1)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369219)

"Same thing with Visual Studio being made free"

Visual Studio still costs over four thousand dollars. Oh, you're talking about the worthless lite version they give away for free! Never mind.

Re:Sounds like what Sun did (1)

baka_toroi (1194359) | 2 days ago | (#48369283)

Is the new free version still worthless?

Re:Sounds like what Sun did (2)

MyLongNickName (822545) | 2 days ago | (#48369531)

No it isn't worthless. Most small shops could probably get by with using it exclusively.

Re:Sounds like what Sun did (4, Informative)

Morpeth (577066) | 2 days ago | (#48369763)

"Visual Studio still costs over four thousand dollars"

WTF are you talking about? That's not even close to true. VS Pro is about $500-600.

The 4k you're talking about is if you buy the entire MSDN suite of MS tools (which will have VS in it), but that includes everything under the sun pretty much made by MS, that's 4k, sure, but you're grossly misinforming, or just trolling, when you say VS costs 4k.

Re:Sounds like what Sun did (1)

UnknowingFool (672806) | 2 days ago | (#48369235)

Open sourcing the server code is just the first step. The compilers for Linux and OS X run on multiple platforms not just x86. Until that happens many companies are probably not going to look at .NET seriously to run on their non x86 servers.

Re:Sounds like what Sun did (1)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369805)

Maybe Microsoft will open source their compiler platform.

Oh wait, they did. It's called Roslyn.

Re:Sounds like what Sun did (1)

MightyMartian (840721) | 2 days ago | (#48369237)

Yes, I'm not looking forward to my apt-get dist-upgrade taking twenty minutes for five patches.

Re:Sounds like what Sun did (0)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369501)

Aptitude dude!

Re:Sounds like what Sun did (1)

Carewolf (581105) | 2 days ago | (#48369669)

Aptitude dude!

Not for upgrades.. I don't have 48 hours to let it resolve conflicts and dependencies apt-get can resolve in 48 milliseconds. Especially not when it does a worse job.

Re:Sounds like what Sun did (1)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369259)

Re: scrutiny. I'm really wondering if MS has thought deeply enough about this. The codebase has been sitting behind a proprietary wall for so long that it's been completely insulated from the real world of code quality. When management asked the developers about this issue surely they all said, yeah, it's great and competes with anything else out there. But those developers haven't peeked outside their fortified proprietary walls to see that the real world expects quality code on par with the BSD kernel. There's no way Microsoft is anywhere near that.

There is going to be a tidal wave of security and bug reports, most likely a tsunami we've never seen before. This will be a huge wakeup call to most of the (locked-in) MS shops around around the world. When they see just how bad proprietary software is behind the iron curtain, it's going to be interesting to see how they respond during contract renegotiation time.

I wish MS the best but the best thing they could is keep the gimp hidden behind the gloryhole and never let him see the light of day.

Any Microsoft alternative to Photoshop? (1)

tepples (727027) | 2 days ago | (#48369683)

I wish MS the best but the best thing they could is keep the gimp hidden behind the gloryhole

Good luck with that. GIMP is already far more capable than Microsoft Paint, and Microsoft's other image editor [microsoft.com] is overspecialized toward editing photographs, such as red eye correction, color correction, cropping, and rotation. It's not for actually painting. Does Microsoft have anything to compete with Paint Shop Pro, let alone Photoshop? If not, I'll only have to keep using GIMP 2.8.x on my Windows 8.1 box at work.

Re:Sounds like what Sun did (0)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369827)

Congrats AC, that post is simply brilliant on so many levels. Bravo!

Re:Sounds like what Sun did (2)

c (8461) | 2 days ago | (#48369811)

This is actually a pretty smart idea, but it sounds like what Sun did with Java and parts of Solaris.

... which then got acquired by Oracle, thus providing a graphic illustration how a large corporation can open source something and then promptly proceed to fuck it up.

oh shit... gaunlet (1)

funkymonkjay (840915) | 2 days ago | (#48369103)

has been slapped. let the battle commence!

I can hear the sigh of relief from all those c# houses.

RIP Java! (0, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369119)

Better languages, library, and environment than Java and, unlike Java, actively maintained and expanded? Sign me up!

Oracle can kiss most of the money the spent on Sun Microsystems goodbye and I, for one, won't be shedding any tears for Larry Ellison.

Re: RIP Java! (0)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369295)

Better libraries? .net collections are a joke compared to java's collections framework.

Re: RIP Java! (0)

meustrus (1588597) | 2 days ago | (#48369619)

Execution-time knowledge of the generic type used in the collection is good enough reason to use C#. If you really want the features from Java, you can always port them as anything that might be superior is user-space code, even if it's part of the standard library.

Re: RIP Java! (2)

Racemaniac (1099281) | 2 days ago | (#48369629)

Can you explain? what part of the .net collections would be lacking?
If you see comparisons between .net and java, it's usually that the past 10 years .net has evolved and java sometimes catches up a tiny bit.
I always thought that java collections were weaker since in .net even an array is also still a collection, they have collections for just about anything you need, and with LINQ you've got an incredibly powerful way of manipulating/creating/accessing collections.

Re:RIP Java! (1)

NoNonAlphaCharsHere (2201864) | 2 days ago | (#48369301)

Anybody know anything about what's going to happen with the C# compiler?

Re:RIP Java! (0)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369601)

The C# compiler coming in 2015 (Roslyn) is written in C# and Open Source...

Re:RIP Java! (1)

Richard_at_work (517087) | 2 days ago | (#48369613)

What about it? The next gen one has already been much talked about (Roslyn) and you can already get access to it.

Re:RIP Java! (1)

UnknowingFool (672806) | 2 days ago | (#48369409)

Pfft. I don't see going to a language less supported would be a panacea to your Java problems. From what I can tell "cross platform" to MS seems to be x86 only. MS has to develop the compilers for other platforms which is not an easy thing.

Re:RIP Java! (0)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369415)

Better languages, library, and environment than Java and, unlike Java, actively maintained and expanded? Sign me up!

Oracle can kiss most of the money the spent on Sun Microsystems goodbye and I, for one, won't be shedding any tears for Larry Ellison.

While I think you have a point, Java is pretty entrenched where it is, i.e., the middle tier and mobile. Like Microsoft shops, Java shops aren't particularly anxious to switch horses in mid-stream. Cost is just too high.

Personally, I don' t think Microsoft had to go to the extreme of open sourcing .NET. Had they acknowledge Mono as a first class member of the .NET family, they would have crushed Java. They treated Mono as a stepping stone to .NET, that is, get people who can't use .NET (because of platform) hooked on Mono and then they'll naturally move to .NET to get the full blown platform. The general view, whether true or not, was that Mono was lacking.

This can mean two things: 1) Microsoft is admitting their arrogance in requiring everyone to use Windows in order to benefit from .NET; 2)Microsoft has given up on .NET and sees no use for .NET/Java like languages. After all, Apps for Windows 8 are supposed to be developed in JavaScript, right?

Re:RIP Java! (0)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369731)

That's not that easy. First, java has a lot more advanced garbage collector when compared to e.g. c#. And second and more important thing is that MS had always troubles to attract developers to use their stacks.

What license? (2)

CAPSLOCK2000 (27149) | 2 days ago | (#48369141)

I've got only one question: What license will they use?

Re:What license? (0, Troll)

NoNonAlphaCharsHere (2201864) | 2 days ago | (#48369253)

The usual Microsoft license: Bend Over And Like It.

Re:What license? (1)

ArcadeMan (2766669) | 2 days ago | (#48369425)

Ah yes, the BOALI license.

Re:What license? (5, Informative)

Barlo_Mung_42 (411228) | 2 days ago | (#48369267)

The MIT license. Are you certain that was your only question?

Re:What license? (3, Informative)

DataPath (1111) | 2 days ago | (#48369655)

While the .NET Core is under the MIT license, Roslyn appears to be under the Apache 2.0 license.

I can see the reasoning behind the different choices - I'm just saying is all.

Re:What license? (1)

ArcadeMan (2766669) | 2 days ago | (#48369459)

License: .NET open source projects typically use either the MIT or Apache 2 licenses for code. Some projects license documentation and other forms of content under Creative Commons Attribution 4.0. See specific projects to understand the license used.

Re:What license? (1)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369519)

It's a trick. (0)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369167)

Get an axe.

High Pressure System (-1)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369173)

What happened was, the remnants of Typhoon Nuri crashed into a high pressure region over eastern Alaska and northwest Canada is forcing cold air from the North Pole southward into Canada, the northern Great Plains, and straight into Hell. Hell has subsequently frozen over.

Perfect Linux Application for .NET (5, Funny)

trandles (135223) | 2 days ago | (#48369245)

I really hope systemd is rewritten using .NET!

Re:Perfect Linux Application for .NET (0)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369389)

And so was born the godwin.. erm .. pottering law.

Re:Perfect Linux Application for .NET (1)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369679)

I really hope systemd is rewritten using .NET!

Don't be stupid - this is obviously not going to happen. .NET will be reimplemented by systemd developers as a service using an incompatible byte-code that also supports elf binaries.

Just like when systemd decides to rename your network interfaces from eth0 to enwtfx1, the .NET enabled systemd will trawl the filesystem symlinking .so to .dll throughout and helpfully convert all your programs to .NET assemblies.

So sick of you anti-systemd luddites standing in the way of REAL PROGRESS!

Irony (1)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369265)

The tag line at the bottom of the page is "We are Microsoft. Unix is irrelevant. Openness is futile. Prepare to be assimilated."

Post-Ballmer Microsoft (3, Interesting)

Ryyuajnin (862754) | 2 days ago | (#48369269)

I fully expect post-Ballmer Microsoft will continue to surprise all of us.

About fucking time (1)

vikingpower (768921) | 2 days ago | (#48369309)

16 years after it became clear that Linux would break through. Well, at least they posted the stuff on GitHub under the MIT license. Let's see if anyone bites.

saywhatnow? (2, Funny)

ihtoit (3393327) | 2 days ago | (#48369403)

bit fuckin' early for April Fools isn't it?

Die, mono, die! (4, Interesting)

damn_registrars (1103043) | 2 days ago | (#48369809)

As much as I don't care for Microsoft, if this brings about an end to all the headaches I run in to trying to use mono then I will welcome it. I love all the applications that I need to run that have 30 pages worth of crowd-sourced (and nearly unreadable) documentation for how to run them in wine with mono. It's time to be done with this bullshit and get back to work. I understand the goals of mono and they were admirable but they just never really worked out. Hopefully those guys can help the development of the open-sourced .NET.

Cross platform but work best in MS eco (0)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369813)

Let me guess, It work best in MS eco and not all functions/features are supported in non-MS platform. This is just part of their embrace and extends strategy. Fool me once... etc

About time (0)

Anonymous Coward | 2 days ago | (#48369817)

They should've thought about this 5 years ago, at least. But it's good to see that Shiva, or w/e his name is, is making some changes.

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