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For Sale: 1 Damian Conway, 1 Dan Sugalski

chrisd posted more than 12 years ago | from the here-comes-another-one dept.

Perl 96

Kurt writes "Yet Another Society, through its newly formed Perl Foundation, is launching yet another fund drive to help support the Perl community. This year we will be supporting Damian Conway and Dan Sugalski. Damian will continue to work on a variety of Perl 5 modules and the design of Perl 6. Dan will continue his work on the implementation of Perl 6. More details are available at the Perl Foundation web site. Contributions are tax deductible, so donate today!" Many people will remember when we did this last year. I think it's been a roaring success. So go donate!

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No way (-1, Offtopic)

jargoone (166102) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701069)

2 in a row?

Re:No way (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2701327)

suck it bitznach.

Speechless (-1, Offtopic)

jamshid42 (218149) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701070)

In 5 years of lurking I finally get a pirst fost

Re:Speechless (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2701090)

You are a fucking loser. You couldn't have been lurking for five years, your UID is higher than mine. Hell Slashdot isn't five years old ya dumb fuck. Get the fuck over it. Fuck you.

Re:Speechless (0)

jamshid42 (218149) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701512)

Dude, I lurked for a long time before getting a username. Try looking up the definition of lurking sometime, dumbass. Oh, and get a real username. Only lamers post as anonymous cowards.

it still doesn't change the fact that you're a fag (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2705331)

nor the fact that you STRAIGHT UP missed the first post. now go crawl back into your lurking hole and leave the FP's to the men.

(a different AC)

Buying people... (2, Funny)

Violet Null (452694) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701074)

Do they cook? Clean?

How much will feeding them / boarding them cost?

Re:Buying people... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2701138)

Nope, they just code... Damian will continue to work on a variety of Perl 5 modules and the design of Perl 6.....

of course, there are two known holes in some of damian's old modules, more details here [edujeffsecurity.html] .

Re:Buying people... (5, Funny)

xanadu-xtroot.com (450073) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701157)

I can't answer those questions of yours directly, but it's probably fairly safe to say:

"They don't do Windows"...

(nuck, nuck, nuck...)

:-)

Re:Buying people... (2, Insightful)

Howie (4244) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701237)

duh, they do Windows and Macintosh, and anything else you care to mention (Psion5 Perl?)

*you* may not do windows, but why would such a prolific programming language cut off a huge chunk of potential audience.

Oh sorry, you implied microsoft was bad, so I should laugh. nyuk nyuk.

Harsh moderators! (0, Offtopic)

Descartes (124922) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701259)

Man can't someone make a joke on ./ anymore? It's not like this is a topic that needs lots of serious discussion. If anyone gets a chance to meta moderate this, get rid of the offtopic.

THC bubble (-1)

peepoh (537606) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701082)

I'm 23 years old and I live at home with my parents. Okay, so I'm a loser. Shut the fuck up. Last night I stuffed a towel under the door, spritzed apple-cinnamon Odor Absorber(TM) all over myself and smoked pot in my room. I accidentally smoked a little too much, though, because I got FUCKED THE FUCK UP. I only remember setting at my iMac, listening to music and flailing my arms and head around like a madman. Why am I writing about this now? Because I'm at work and I just popped a whopper of a THC bubble. God I'm stoned.

Re:THC bubble (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2701211)

Can we just call this website: "Links for nerds, old stuff that no longer matters"?

P.S. Quit smoking weed you buttcheese!

Re:THC bubble (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2701316)

Um, I have been smoking weed a long ass time and have never heard of a THC bubble. Is that supposed to be like Acid flashbacks? What the fuck are you talking about?

Re:THC bubble (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2701341)

good job dude... I can't really identify with the "THC" bubble phenomenon though. Is it kinda like you get a feeling like you're high again for no apparent reason? I think I remember that, but I've been high for the past 5 years straight and can't really remember NOT being high. =)

Anyways, keep up the good work.

Can I pledge money to get them to stop? (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2701083)

Please?
I hate perl. It suXXors.

For Sale: What's with Wil Wheaton? (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2701086)

Wil Wheaton is a fucking poseur. I can't stand how you fucktards get all drippy and excited every time that his name is mentioned. Ever since that stupid fucking Slashdot interview, all of you twerps have been ready to suck his dick. Don't you understand? It's all a sham! Your little hearts fluttered when he chose the EFF as his sponser on The Weakest Link, but the kid runs fucking Windows 2000. I mean, come on! Rob Malda had to run an anti-Microsoft "news" website for two years before anyone would believe that he only used Windows "for games," and you fall for Wil Wheaton's schtick immediately, without question? That's proof that the only intelligent posters left on Slashdot are us trolls.

He was a bad actor, and now he's a wannabe geek. The fact that he was a minor celebrity five years ago is immaterial. Maybe the new Linux mascot should be Alf! We should have Tony Danza on the new GNOME committee!

Wil Wheaton is such a moron that someone guessed his Slashdot account [slashdot.org] password and started crapflooding with it within a week. It's a newbie UID, by the way: Wil hadn't even heard of Slashdot until the interview!

It's almost fitting, though: both Linux and Wil Wheaton are immature hacks unsuited for work in the Real World. Both are yesterday's news. Both are pointless. Hey, maybe Wil does have a place on Slashdot!

-- The_Messenger [geocities.com]

Perl, eh... (0, Troll)

JonathanF (532591) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701088)

Perl? Isn't that the horribly complex programming language that people dread? Why would we want to support that? :)

Seriously, I hope it does well - regardless of your personal coding choices, Perl is used in many places and ought to be supported and improved.

Re:Perl, eh... (3, Interesting)

mrpotato (97715) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701188)

Perl? Isn't that the horribly complex programming language that people dread?

Yes, it is horribly complex.
Look at that hello world program for example:
print "Hello World!";

Now, that's some complex piece of software. Ok, let's say you want to have a list of strings. You could do so like that:
@list = ("element1", "element2", "element3")

Well, just try to do the same in C.

Contrary to popular belief, Perl is easy. The thing is that you don't need to know everything to use it. Just a small subset will satisfy you.

People think it is hard because of the syntax and variety of constructs you can use. Well, for sure Perl is very flexible. But in no way it is a defficiency of the language. Perl is of course better suited to some tasks, as is any programming language.

And to those who think that all Perl programs are incomprehensible pieces of rubbish, remember this: Only Bad Programmers Code Badly in Perl(tm).

Re:Perl, eh... (1)

JonathanF (532591) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701271)

That certianly seems easy enough - it's just that there's a reputation for indecipherability. Maybe I'm just longing for the days of BASIC or Logo (I can remember learning those back in elementary school)!

Re:Perl, eh... (1)

redcliffe (466773) | more than 12 years ago | (#2702154)

Some perl people like to try and fit as much functionality into a minimal number of lines. That is where the confusion comes in, but you don't need to go that far.

Re:Perl, eh... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2701322)

I'm sick to death of the standard argument in defense of Perl, namely that you can write unmaintainable code in any language. Perl ENCOURAGES you to write unmaintainable code, like no other language I've ever seen. That is the problem.

Try the range operator sometime... (4, Informative)

Wee (17189) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701405)

Ok, let's say you want to have a list of strings. You could do so like that: @list = ("element1", "element2", "element3") Well, just try to do the same in C.

Actually, you wanna see something would really twist C's noodle? Try this one:

push(@list, "element${_}") for (1 .. 20);

And of course, there are all sorts of cool things built into Perl. Like the "spaceship" operator, regexes, the || and && operators returning the last value evaluated (as opposed to 1 or 0), about five hundred ways to iterate/loop, $_, etc. There's also my personal favorites: lack of strong (any, really) typing and being able to create any type of variable/structure on the fly. They're also Perl's largest complaints, which is probably why I'm so partial to them. There's nothing like being able to just make a "$foo = 123;" statement and then append a string to it... :-)

But the orginal poster was correct: Perl can be very complex. It can also be very simple. It's like they say, Perl makes easy things easy and hard things possible. I love having enough rope to hang myself; others need more structure. To each his own. Choice is a very good thing.

-B

Re:Try the range operator sometime... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2701450)

I've been using perl since about 94 but know nothing of this "spaceship operator". What's that?

Re:Try the range operator sometime... (3, Funny)

Wee (17189) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701537)

I've been using perl since about 94 but know nothing of this "spaceship operator". What's that?

It's the "greater than equal less than" comparison operator, like from the Schwartzian Transform or some such:

sort { $a->[1] <=> $b->[1] } map { [$_, -s] } @array;

The Jargon File has a good definition [tuxedo.org] . I've also seen people use the term for something like this:

while (<>) { print };

That looks more like the goatse operator to me, though.

-B

Re:Try the range operator sometime... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2701640)

oh, so it's like the "arithmetic if" from FORTRAN.

Re:Try the range operator sometime... (1)

cei (107343) | more than 12 years ago | (#2702106)

I did my first Schwartzian Transform in a program today.

I feel so dirty.

Re:Try the range operator sometime... (1)

mrpotato (97715) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701804)


&lt=> returns -1, 0 or 1 if the left argument is respectively smaller, equal or greater than the right argument.

(1 &lt=> 2) == -1
(1 &lt=> 1) == 0
(2 &lt=> 1) == 1

Re:Perl, eh... (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2701525)

> Yes, it is horribly complex.
> Look at that hello world program for example:
> print "Hello World!";

> Now, that's some complex piece of software.
> Ok, let's say you want to have a list of strings.
> You could do so like that:
> @list = ("element1", "element2", "element3")

Ok, now show me a list of lists. Extra points if
you can do so without looking at the manual, and
when saying some sarcastic remark like "Now, that's
some complex piece of software", you can do so
with a straight face and can do so without looking
down at your shoes.

List of lists (1)

bruckie (217355) | more than 12 years ago | (#2702245)

I realize you're trolling, but I'm taking the bait. Complex data structures like this are where Perl shines.

For example:

my $list_of_lists = [
['foo', 'bar', 'baz'],
['a', 'b', 'c'],
];

And then to print it out...

foreach my $list (@$list_of_lists) {
print join (' ', @$list);
print "\n";
}

It's really quite easy.

We use Perl for many tasks where I work, and have several thousand lines of our own library files. I've found it to be very maintainable and incredibly flexible. Our coders write excellent, well-designed, readable code in Perl. Most of the time we take advantage of Perl's easy, powerful features so we can develop quickly. However, when we need to optimize, that's available as well. It's turned out to be a great tool for us.

--Bruce

Re:Perl, eh... (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2701618)


> print "Hello World!";
printf "Hello World!";

> @list = ("element1", "element2", "element3")
char list[]={"element1","element2","element3"};

> Well, just try to do the same in C.

i just did. of course, to compile it, you need to:

#include

int
main()
{ }

but those lines are trivial in any program.

OOOPS! Re:Perl, eh... (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2701775)

>> print "Hello World!";
> printf "Hello World!";
i mean:
printf("Hello World!");

Re:Perl, eh... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2703263)

" Only Bad Programmers Code Badly in Perl(tm). "

Then I am yet to see good programmer's code in Perl.
All of this stuff looks like glorified random noise.

Re:Perl, eh... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2701686)

I fear the day perl gets unicode operators, then it will really resemble line noise, or encrypted secrets. That's it, screw the feds, write in perl so they think it's encryption.

I should have stuck with it (-1, Troll)

Dancin_Santa (265275) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701095)

I could have been the next Damian or Dan had I just stuck with Perl for a couple more years.

Lost opportunities... *sigh*

Dancin Santa

Donate!! (0, Flamebait)

Renraku (518261) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701102)

Finally, something to donate to that doesn't involve fat, starving black children in Africa, or barefooted American folks with a dirt floor and a Dodge Viper in their driveway. Hopefully this charity won't fall prey to the usual enemy of charities, greed.

What do I get for $20? (0, Funny)

torklugnutz (212328) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701152)

How much for a PERL necklace?

no, thanks.... (2, Funny)

msouth (10321) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701154)

...we've already bought a Damian Conway. We're not interested in whatever cheap imitation you're trying to foist on us.

Re:no, thanks.... (1)

HRbnjR (12398) | more than 12 years ago | (#2702310)


[outrageous_french_accent]

I can ask im, but I don think heel be very keen! You see, we've already got one!

[aside]
Hehe, I told im we already got one!! heheheh.

Donate all ! This might be very good. (1, Troll)

Krapangor (533950) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701182)

Hobbiest programming languages like perl or basic are of course not suitable for professional purposes.
For this reason many computer scientist like very lowly of perl, basic or even lisp. But I think this is not right. Such easy to learn languages serve very well to make children interested in computers. This has many good effects.
  • Many of these children become addicted to computers and become in later life computer scientists or electrical engineers.
  • You have to read a lot when using a computer, so programming languages fight illiteracy. The best example for this are the slashdot editors who improve their spelling by programming in perl.
  • It keeps the children off the street and keeps them from smoking crack or raid candy stores.
  • It make people buying computers and help the ruined computer industry.
So donate please all money ! This is all very good.

With IRS looming over my head... (-1)

AnonymousCowheard (239159) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701192)

...how about we all help the Perl authors with developing a product with a perl dominated user environment? In USA, the way people started conducting business with eachother is by exchanging services, like a barter system, and I see the best way of supporting perl and its developers is by contributing not money, but stable perl code to an electronic product running the linux kernel and using a system of perl scripts/errm programs; think of vaporware platform to develop for, think of endrema.

Loki is working with Nokia to port their games to Nokia's competing product of Tivo. I also see people porting Linux and a few simple utilities to compaq's and Hp's PDA's. Why not help start a PDA prject that makes the perl authors some money and they won't have to axe everyone for money? I see potential...being perl runs on many, many platforms and OS's and perl programs being accepted by everyone with a perl-dominated environment/gui

Ebay (4, Funny)

Descartes (124922) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701199)

I wonder if you could see them on Ebay? Maybe try selling of shares or something like that... probably againt their rules. I bet you'd get lots of visibility that way though.

A few questions:
Are they housetrained? If I buy both of them do I have to keep them in seperate cages or can I let them play together? Is there any sort of special diet I need to be aware of? (I'm not sure if the dollar store is still selling six packs of Jolt and I'm morally against "extreme" doritos)

Ack! is it finals week already (1)

Descartes (124922) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701234)

ok I'm probably just a victim of sleep derprivation

I meant "sell them on Ebay" not "see them on Ebay"
and I don't know why I put the "of" in the second sentance, "againt" should be "against", etc.

sorry folks

Maybe slashdot... (-1)

Allah_Spork (524500) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701275)

Should research its stories a bit more. Yahoo! [yahoo.com] has a GREAT story about how to get large companies to donate to projects like this, since they get so much use out of them!

These guys should contact O'Reilly ... (4, Insightful)

cygnusx (193092) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701204)

... with the money they make out of selling Perl books, they could easily fulfil a goodly part of the modest $55000 [yetanother.org] they talk about on this page. (Yes, I know 55k was the *2001* budget.)

But dunno how much people will be willing to fork out to charity during tough times.. last year this time, things were much better.

Re:These guys should contact O'Reilly ... (3, Informative)

jas79 (196511) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701272)

they already did pay a large part of the 55k.

"The list of contributors, as well as the work produced under the grant, are at http://yetanother.org/damian. BlackStar, Morgan Stanley, VA Linux, Manning Publications, O'Reilly and Associates, and Stonehenge Consulting also made major contributions. "

Re:These guys should contact O'Reilly ... (4, Insightful)

doom (14564) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701527)


O'Reilly also keeps Larry Wall on staff, and just let
him do whatever he wants.

Lack of support for the perl community is not
one of O'Reilly's problems.

No more Larry (2)

Matts (1628) | more than 12 years ago | (#2703279)

Actually Larry got laid off in the recent cuts at O'Reilly.

Re:These guys should contact O'Reilly ... (1)

mrpotato (97715) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701828)

.. with the money they make out of selling Perl books, they could easily fulfil a goodly part of the modest $55000 [yetanother.org] they talk about on this page. (Yes, I know 55k was the *2001* budget.)

Because you think they are not already making money with O'Reilly?

And don't worry, someone will come up front to pay them, some companies are very interested in funding Perl development further.

Money for Camels (1)

mbrod (19122) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701218)

Damien writes many great modules and great articles for the community. I don't know anything about the other guy but this is a great charity to give to so we can free up uber 3l337 Perl hackers from their day jobs to make Perl even better.

Re:Money for Camels (1)

chromatic (9471) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701295)

Dan [perlcabal.com] is in charge of the Parrot [parrotcode.org] internals for Perl 6.

Re:Money for Camels (1)

FatHogByTheAss (257292) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701304)

Sugalski is grade 'A' people. He once gave me an entire MicroVAX and storage shelf for nothing but the shipping costs.

Groovy dude...

Re:Money for Camels (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2701477)

Speaking of camels, did anyone else find that watch out python/night of the camels thing on perl-porters yesterday bloody hilarious?

Perl.NET? (2, Funny)

phloda (530937) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701219)

Are these guys working on Perl.NET? Do I have to have a Passport account to donate?

Re:Perl.NET? (2)

embobo (1520) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701700)

I don't know if you are making a joke, but somebody [activestate.com] already is [activestate.com] .

REMEMBER TROLLS (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2701226)

vegdot.org. A slash like site dealing with vegans. Troll often.

But wait, there's more!!! (5, Funny)

cei (107343) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701231)

Order today, and we'll include a Randal Schwartz [stonehenge.com] at no additional cost!!!

Re:But wait, there's more!!! (2)

msouth (10321) | more than 12 years ago | (#2702242)

heh, yes, I get the joke, but thought I would point out the irony, too:

(From perl-foundation.org's front page, emphasis mine)

BlackStar, Morgan Stanley, VA Linux, Manning Publications, O'Reilly and Associates, and
Stonehenge Consulting also made major contributions [to the orginal Damian Conway grant].

donations (2, Insightful)

CmdrSanity (531251) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701289)

This article kind of got me thinking. Initially I thought it would be a great idea to send these guys some money for their hard work (and take a little tax deduction for myself on the side :) ). But then I saw some troll post about how he was glad that there was charity that didn't involve "starving black children."

That got me thinking: could the money be better used elsewhere? A $10 donation to a PERL hacker will buy him a six pack and some chips. $10 to the right humanitarian organization will literally save people's lives. But I guess that with donating to the PERL guys, you'll actually get to see some results from your charity. With most humanitarian groups you never know where the money goes.

Your Right!! (2)

DAldredge (2353) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701320)

And if we cut out all the extras* we spend money on we can feed a lot of people!!!

*extras mean anything other than basic food stuffs, no cable tv, nothing not absolutly needed for everyday life....

Re:Your Right!! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2701446)

It must be great being such a sanctimonious, self-absorbed prick!

I'm feeling rather cynical, but not about this (1, Troll)

FreeUser (11483) | more than 12 years ago | (#2702254)

And if we cut out all the extras* we spend money on we can feed a lot of people!!!

Donating to support these guys, and keep them working in the public interest benefits me immediately, as I use software that uses perl, or at the very least I use software that uses software that uses perl. They do good work for us as a software community, so turning around and supporting them has immediate, tangible benefits.

On the other hand, feeding the otherwise doomed throughout the world provides us with no real benefits and is indeed detrimental, as there are more people with whome we must then compete for oxygen, or at least listen to their bitching and moaning because we have something they don't, or don't worship their god, or do worship their god but not by the same name, or do worship their god by the same name but not in the same way, etc. etc. ad nauseum. Better that they just die and clear out the way for more sensible, or at least more civil, folks.

Besides, the Saudis have returned the favor of having the industrialized world make them incredibly wealthy by becoming a source of hatred and terrorism directed against the very cultures that made them rich. What makes you think helping some other disadvanted sop with free handouts is going to have any better effect down the road.

Yes, I just got done watching the Osama tape and it shows. :-/ Quoting a old film: "fuck the doomed"[1]

[1]Where the Buffalo Roam

Shilling For Amazon... (4, Insightful)

ObligatoryUserName (126027) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701333)

I hate to sound like an advertisement, but as a rule I'm probably 2-300% more likely to donate money if people use the uber-easy Amazon Honor system. I don't have to give anyone new my personal information, it all happens in a few quick clicks, and it doesn't have fits with my debit card like PayPal does (they require a 1 time refunded charge to verify the card since it isn't linked to a billing address like a credit card is - I know it's for my own good, but knowing that it would take a month to process always saps my will.)


In this case I might go against my set ways, but if they'd set up an Honor System account I wouldn't be writing this note right now, I'd be donating!

Re:Shilling For Amazon... (2, Informative)

jslag (21657) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701422)

In this case I might go against my set ways, but if they'd set up an Honor System account I wouldn't be writing this note right now, I'd be donating!


Disadvantage of using amazon: they charge $0.15 per donation, plus 15%. If you donate $20, then, the perl peeps only get $16.85.

Re:Shilling For Amazon... (4, Insightful)

ObligatoryUserName (126027) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701532)

85% of $20 is a heck of a lot more than 100% of $0.

Especially because I hate to use credit cards/love to use my debit card, I like sharing the card number as few places as I can get by with. That 15% they lose is the cost of my piece of mind and the convenience of my donation. (Though, like I say, I'll probably make an exception in this case, but that doesn't mean I don't reserve my right to grumble about it.)

Re:Shilling For Amazon... (1)

Elian (10270) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701565)

I'll nudge the perl-foundation.org folks and see what they can do. (No idea how much work's involved, or what paperwork needs filing for access)

Re:Shilling For Amazon... (2)

graxrmelg (71438) | more than 12 years ago | (#2702367)

Many geeks (including Perl geek Mark-Jason Dominus [plover.com] ) are still boycotting Amazon because of their software patents.

already had one (5, Funny)

austad (22163) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701345)

I ordered a Tim Conway awhile back because he was on clearance. The first sales rep didn't even know they still had one around. Well, they sent me a Damian Conway instead. I couldn't get him to do the "Dorf" bit, and he wouldn't wear stupid clothes or talk like a Norwegian at all. I tried to return him, but they wouldn't take him back because when I opened the box, I automatically agreed to their EULA which was inside.

Finally, after several weeks of complaining they let me ship him back for an exchage. Except they accidentally sent me Conway Twitty this time. Actually I'm not so sure it was an accident. Anyway, Conway Twitty happily does a norwegian accent so I'm fairly satisfied. Except he keeps trying to seduce my grandma...

Re:already had one (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2701736)

I've had no problem trying to seduce your grandma. That bitch goes down faster than a two cent crack-whore.

Recommend a contribution level? (4, Interesting)

Michael Woodhams (112247) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701361)

Perhaps the Perl community could calculate some recommended annual contribution per line of code for companies that use Perl. (E.g. 100k lines of code at $0.01/line/year = $1000.) Do some comparisons with how much companies pay for commercial compilers compared to how many lines of code they have to show them that they are getting a good deal (applying corrections for the absence of tech support and manuals not being included in the price.)

Of course, the Perl Foundation is not the only ligitimate recipient of such contributions.

Re:Recommend a contribution level? (1)

boopus (100890) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701643)

Your calculations don't take into account the amount you can do with one line of perl, let alone several of them...

fantastic! (-1, Redundant)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2701458)

I am not sure how much I should shave off my donations to sick and homeless, but I am sure that this will be WELL worth it!

OUTSTANDING!

jamie sucks my ballsack (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2701503)

to klerck - love the penis birds

<a href=Hi,.I'm.the.page.widenere.man!.I'm.here.to.wi den.the.pages.of.slashdot.for.this.one.post.at.a.p ositive.score!.I.hope.you.all.enjoy.reading.my.pag e.widening.post.as.much.as.I.enjoyed.writing.it!.N ow.I.will.proceed.to.have.sex.with.a.horse.and.sho ve.the.goatse.cx.guy's.ass.right.up.my.own.ass!.Ch eers.folks!.For.years.now,.the.common.American.pen is.bird.has.been.a.staple.of.every.American's.dail y.diet..Whether.it.be.penis.bird.sandwiches,.fried .penis.bird,.or.perhaps.penis.bird.under.glass.for .the.rich,.we.all.have.penis.bird.at.least.once.a. day..Many.Americans.have.no.clue.how.the.penis.bir d.became.so.important.in.the.pyramid.of.a.balanced .diet,.so.in.this.article.I.will.attempt.to.explai n.its.history.and.why.it.is.so.useful..In.the.earl y.1870s,.Francis.Zefran.became.the.first.penis.bir d.breeder.in.North.America..He.started.his.famous. Penis.Bird.Ranch.in.Canton,.OH..At.the.time,.not.m uch.was.known.of.the.penis.bird's.nutritional.valu e,.but.the.Penis.Bird.Ranch.changed.all.of.that..N ot.only.did.Francis.Zefran.raise.penis.birds.to.se ll.their.colorful.plumes.a.VERY.lucrative.business ,.he.also.set.up.the.world's.first.research.lab.de dicated.solely.to.the.study.of.the.penis.bird.The. lab.found.many.interesting.things..First,.it.was.d iscovered.that.thepenis.bird.was.actually.semisent ient..Second,.the.scientists.found.that.the.meat.o f.the.penis.bird.was.high.in.protein,.vitamin.A,.v itamin.B,.and.calcium,.while.low.in.fat,.cholestor ol,.and.sodium..Never.before.had.such.a.nutritious .meal.been.had.without.supplement.or.fortification ..The.scientists.of.the.lab.recommended.immediatel y.that.the.penis.bird.become.a.part.of.every.Ameri can's.daily.diet..When.the.news.of.the.penis.bird' s.usefulness.reached.president.Rutherford.B..Hayes ,.he.was.absolutely.ecstatic..You.see,.President.H ayes.owed.a.number.of.favors.to.Francis.Zefran.bec ause.as.I.said.earlier,.the.penis.bird.plume.trade .was.an.extremely.lucrative.business.and.Mr..Zefra n.was.important.in.getting.RBH.elected.through.a.n umber.of.monetary.gifts..President.Hayes.immediate ly.asked.Congress.to.pass.what.we.all.know.today.a s.the.Hayes/Zefran.Penis.Bird.Consumption.Act..The .act.did.a.number.of.things.to.make.the.penis.bird .a.daily.meal,.most.important.of.which.was.the.req uirement.that.for.every.four.people.in.a.household ,.one.penis.bird.must.consumed.every.day..Another. thing.the.act.did.was.create.an.artificial.monopol y.for.Francis.Zefran's.Penis.Bird.Industries..The. act.stated.that.the.only.supplier.of.penis.bird.me at.in.the.US.would.be.PBI..As.one.would.imagine,.t his.quickly.made.Francis.Zefran.into.the.richest.m an.in.the.world..He.was.soon.a.multibillionaire.qu adrillionaire.with.today's.inflation..Never.before .had.a.single.man.seen.such.wealth..Many.challenge s.were.made.to.the.Hayes/Zefran.Penis.Bird.Consump tion.Act,.and.several.even.made.it.the.Supreme.Cou rt..It.was.argued.that.the.act.was.unconstitutiona l.and.went.against.liberty.itself,.but.once.the.de tractors.tasted.delicious.penis.bird.meat.for.the. first.time,.they.immediately.dropped.their.cases.a nd.followed.the.law.to.the.letter..We.all.know.tod ay.that.penis.bird.is.the.most.delicious.meat.man. has.ever.known,.but.at.that.time,.the.only.meats.p eople.ate.were.pork.and.beef..In.the.early.1970s,. though,.challenges.to.the.act.began.again..Many.ar gued.that.the.monopoly.given.to.Penis.Bird.Industr ies.by.the.act.was.in.all.ways.unamerican..The.Sup reme.Court.finally.agreed,.and.in.1974,.Section.II .of.the.act.was.struck.down..This.in.effect.opened .the.market.to.competition.for.all..Today,.Penis.B ird.Industries.is.almost.no.more..Today.we.have.th e.market.leader.Penis.Bird.Meat.International.faci ng.against.Penissoft,.a.recent.startup..Where.will .the.future.lead.the.penis.bird.market?.Only.time. will.tell.us,.but.one.thing.is.certain:.penis.bird s.are.here.to.stay!></A>

Re:jamie sucks my ballsack (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2701572)

That was the weakest link. Goodbye!

jamie fix this you lazy slashbitch (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2701524)

wide load coming thru
[slashdot.org]

Who is Dan Sugalski? (2)

pdqlamb (10952) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701590)

And what will he do? OK, maybe I don't get around CPAN enough. But Damian Conway I know from his books and modules. I just don't recognize Dan's name.

Damian has a nice description of things he wants to work on at the yetanother.org link above (terrible color scheme, btw - only suitable for very late-night browsing).

And who are they going to "buy" if they can only raise half the necessary funds?

Re:Who is Dan Sugalski? (0, Offtopic)

thoughtstream (140380) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701721)

terrible color scheme

Try http://www.yetanother.org/damian/b+w/ [yetanother.org] instead.

Same great taste; less moody. ;-)

Re:Who is Dan Sugalski? (1)

nambit (264147) | more than 12 years ago | (#2703616)

dan sugalski is working on perl 6. a lot. take a quick look through the perl6-internals [develooper.com] mailing list archive to see just how active he is.

without dan perl 6 just won't be the same.

FAGS! (-1, Troll)

AbbaZabba (540689) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701609)

You = Fag. I rest my case.

It's a poor system... (4, Interesting)

ab315 (443209) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701715)

...that makes its best developers beg for money.

The more examples I see of this the more I've come to see that the open-source development model is getting less and less credible as a way to do large-scale projects.

Developing software using the proprietary model may not always produce the greatest code, but there's no doubt that it provides a good income to thousands of developers with average skills that allows them to support their families.

Re:It's a poor system... (1)

iBod (534920) | more than 12 years ago | (#2702205)

Developing software using the proprietary model may not always produce the greatest code, but there's no doubt that it provides a good income to thousands of developers with average skills that allows them to support their families.

Thanks for pointing this out. For some of us around here, coding is our day job!

Re:It's a poor system... (1)

chromatic (9471) | more than 12 years ago | (#2702783)

How is this a failing of the "open source development model"? If anything, it looks like a success.

I read it as an acknowledgement that both men have done good things in the past, and that sponsorship would allow them to produce more work at the same (or greater) levels of quality.

If either Dr. Conway or Dan were *begging* for money, that would be one thing. This, however, wasn't their idea. I suspect they'd keep doing what they're doing anyway. Well, except for the Damian World Tour. :)

Re:It's a poor system... (2, Insightful)

sparkyz (256676) | more than 12 years ago | (#2702787)

Back-up folks. Soliciting contributions to fund the work of major contributors to the significant development of a great tool is in no way a sign of failure. It's a time tried model that has brought us a lot of great advances in a multitude of other areas. Here's a great example: A pharmaceutical company gives a research grant to a university professor to conduct a study or work on a treatment for a specific condition that he/she/it may not otherwise be able to dedicate time to. Yeah, I know, there are attendant patent issues and all that; but the idea is still sound. Some life saving drugs that were produced on the same model:

Synthroid
Fosamax
Rezulin
and the inattentive programmers perennial favorite: Ritalin

Count me in when the time comes. Lord knows I've made enough money hacking Perl. I can give a little back.

Re:It's a poor system... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2707885)

average skills my ass.

Surely this just sucks (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2701879)

Open source gurus with a begging bowl?

A clear demonstration that the system as-is has failed.

Invest in Schwern (1)

drowsy (4335) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701969)

http://search.cpan.org/doc/MSCHWERN/Test-More-0.08 /lib/Test/More.pm

This kind of yeoman's work is representative of the stuff Schwern does to make Perl better. Complements the Conway.

I'm torn . . . (5, Interesting)

DeborahArielPickett (336742) | more than 12 years ago | (#2701981)

I suppose I have a slightly different perspective on this than most folks on slashdot. I teach the one and only Perl course at Monash University. Damian's office is three doors down the hall from mine (when he's in his office at all, which isn't often). I had the good fortune to be taught by Damian when I was an undergrad.

On one hand: This is great for Perl. Anyone who has dabbled in the language knows that Damian has Plans for Perl what we mere mortals can never truly understand. I'm still drooling over the thought of a proper switch statement in Perl. As for curried expressions, well, if they're anything as good as curried chicken, I'm all for it.

On the other hand: There's a whole generation of Monash University students growing up without having the joy of being taught by Damian. The poor things are getting substandard teaching (well, actually, they're probably getting standard teaching; what I know they're not getting is superstandard teaching), and they are graduating without the fond memories of the acted-out-in-lectures singles-bar analogy for C++ polymorphism. (You Monash graduates know what I'm talking about.)

On the gripping hand: I'm easily the next-best Perl programmer to be teaching at Monash University. With Damian out of the way, it's only a matter of time before total domination of Monash is mine . . .

Re:I'm torn . . . (1)

Michael Woodhams (112247) | more than 12 years ago | (#2702866)

I had a physics lecturer like that once - describing how in a semiconductor the lonely holes and electrons would meet and annihilate each other in a burst of passion. A great teacher is a joy to behold.

I enjoy teaching when I get the chance, but I know I'm way short of these heights. I've volunteered to do some mathematics and astronomy teaching for the local 'gifted kids' program to keep my hand in. Teaching *and* perl programming - the ideal job :-).

Ah well, time to stop wasting my employer's time by posting to slashdot and instead to continue wasting it by writing Perl programs to generate random sentences in English and Latin.

The free money thinks about ancient gates.
Pecunia libera portis antiquis cogitat.

Re:I'm torn . . . (1)

Pento (115091) | more than 12 years ago | (#2703029)

Actually, we're getting substandard teaching. But that's a personal gripe.

Though I'm looking forward to getting above standard teaching when I do Perl next year. So, about my marks... *grins*

Re:I'm torn . . . (2)

onion2k (203094) | more than 12 years ago | (#2704066)

Female.. Perl.. coder.. must.. res..ist..

Re:I'm torn . . . (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2707890)

she's not hot, but I guess you're into those sort of things.

Is this a way to compete against Microsoft? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2702315)

I have to wonder if this type of system would work by renting major contributors to other open source
projects such as Linux, KDE, Gnome, Office etc, so that they could devote their full time to developing the software much like Microsoft is able to keep a full time staff of programmers working on nothing but Windows or Office.
Could even work on a voting system. Maybe a dollar a vote up to 20 votes. If someone gets voted in that can not maintain/manage the code and improve it, the dollars/votes get donated to another candidate.
Maybe its already being done and I am just not aware of it.

I can't wait for the T shirt... (1)

cliveholloway (132299) | more than 12 years ago | (#2702777)

#!/Damian/is/my/bitch

cLive ;-)

Moving free software development "offshore?" (1)

mparaz (31980) | more than 12 years ago | (#2703205)

Given the programmers' salaries paid to programmers in "First World" countries, how about pushing development to countries with lower cost of living, salaries, etc.?

Of course you won't get stellar free software gurus at once, but you can grow the developers.

Wow (-1)

The WIPO Troll (267426) | more than 12 years ago | (#2703225)

Halfway down the page and only 87 comments. Looks like no one uses Perl anymore. They must all be using my penis now. It works better than Perl, and gives you a special surprise when you're done!

#!/bin/penis
use WIPO::Penis;
print spooge( \$face );

Sincerely,

at least it's not like PBS ... (1)

cursion (257184) | more than 12 years ago | (#2704114)

At least the Perl community hasn't rigged up PBS.pm that breaks in while a program is running to ask for money....
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