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Dual 1Ghz G4 PowerMac With Extra Yummy

CmdrTaco posted more than 12 years ago | from the sign-me-up dept.

Apple 875

A huge number of readers submitted the new Dual Ghz Power Mac that Apple has announced. Includes a Geforce 4 and assorted other bells and whistles that will ring and blow for the Mac Junkie. They start at $3k and seriously make me want a Mac.

cancel ×

875 comments

frist ps0t (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2913674)

i'm going nucking futs over here. how about a reply email, dammit!

Re:frist ps0t (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2913756)

please stand still while i give you a good assfucking

First Post! (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2913680)

Ya, I knew it would come sooner or later!

Re:First Post! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2913706)

unfortunately, i beat you to it. better luck next time.

yes (-1)

IAgreeWithThisPost (550896) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913683)

It's been 19 seconds since you hit reply.
Tubgirl is the greatest

Here's the C|NET Article (-1, Informative)

qurob (543434) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913684)

C|NET [com.com]

Gimme Karma!

Moore's Law in effect? (5, Informative)

toupsie (88295) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913686)

I just bought a dual 500 G4 PowerMac about 1 1/2 years ago for $3,000 w/ an ATI Rage Pro 128. Now I can get a dual 1Ghz PowerMac w/ a GeForce4 for $3,000. Awesome!

Doesn't apply to Apples (2, Interesting)

qurob (543434) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913704)

For some reason they hold resale like a fucking BMW.

It can be a few years old and almost cost what it did, fucking new.

There's 604's going on eBay for $800+

Intel hardware retains value about as well as lunch meat.

Re:Doesn't apply to Apples (2, Insightful)

RazzleFrog (537054) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913753)

A few things for you to consider:

1) Second hand Apple market is about 1/20th the size of the second hand PC market therefore supply is lower, price is higher.

2) Everybody and their mother sells PC components but there are relatively few Apple resellers and pretty much no Apple component sellers.

2) Prices on Ebay are incredibly inflated for everything. I seen items like digital cameras go for $400 when I could buy the same camera from Best Buy for $360 and online for $300.

Re:Doesn't apply to Apples (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2913850)

its called supply and demand. There is a low supply of resale Apple hardware and a high demand for resale apple hardware (mainly because the new stuff is way over-priced). I think a comparable pee-cee with dual 1GHz procs, 80 gig HD, 512 DDR-RAM (not SDR), etc would be about 1/2 the cost.

Re:Moore's Law in effect? (3, Insightful)

ptomblin (1378) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913775)

And two weeks ago, I bought a dual 450 G4 Powermac for $1200 from some guy who was clearing off his desk in anticipation of these new guys.

If you don't need the latest and greatest, last year's computers can be pretty cheap and extremely functional.

Re:Moore's Law in effect? (5, Funny)

foobar104 (206452) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913783)

I just bought a dual 500 G4 PowerMac about 1 1/2 years ago for $3,000 w/ an ATI Rage Pro 128. Now I can get a dual 1Ghz PowerMac w/ a GeForce4 for $3,000. Awesome!

I've heard it said many times, and I'll repeat it myself: the computer you want always costs $3,000.

(I've heard another version that names a cost of $5,000. I guess that guy's computer is just a little more than I really want.)

Re:Moore's Law in effect? (2)

toupsie (88295) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913845)

Bingo!!! It used to be $5,000 in the 80s and early 90s. But now that # is $3,000. Every freaking CPU I want own costs $3,000.

huh? (1, Funny)

tux-sucks (550871) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913689)

CmdrTaco wants a mac?! Good lordy, they must be doing something right.

I predict that... (1)

Maddog_Delphi97 (173780) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913690)

I predict that the first thing people will do is to benchmark this against other dual systems, such as Dual Athlons, or Dual Xeons, or something like that.. with all of the hardware components being the same as much as possible (with the exception of the motherboard and the chip itself)..

I guess the question is... how much of a performance will we see on the different systems?

Apple Sucks tho (-1)

ClickWir (166927) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913744)

I doubt it will come close to a real pc in performance. Apple spends most of their time making things look pretty and keeping other people out, than actually making a decent product.

It's a wonder they are still in business sometimes. Granted they had some breakthrough technology back when the Apple IIe came out... but since then it's pretty much just been a downward spiral. Apple sucks. PC's can do all an apple can... cheaper, faster, better, more.

Wrong Pricing (3, Informative)

alernon (91859) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913691)

The high end is 3k, the low end starts at 1,600. But that's without a superdrive or the GeForce4

and if you're a student, the low end is (1)

protein folder (228881) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913770)

a 733 mhz at about 1250$.

New g4 (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2913692)

And they come with the Geforce 4! I'm getting me one.

All that POWER ... (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2913699)

... and no software to take advantage of it

Re:All that POWER ... (1)

Toraz Chryx (467835) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913707)

with the exception of all the BSD/linux source that'll compile without too much hassle..

Adobe will have Photoshop on OSX 'any day now'
the iApps that come with OSX..
etc etc..

Apples software sucks (-1)

ClickWir (166927) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913769)

Granted it can run *nix that were written for em. But, personally, I think the OSX and iappps.... suck. I don't think they look friendly or efficent.

lunix (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2913701)

does ti run lunix?

Re:lunix (1)

Toraz Chryx (467835) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913724)

In all honesty, why would you WANT to run linux on a machine rather than Darwin/Aqua ?

the only people that would, as far as I can tell, are the diehard open source zealots.. (I'm sure to get modded down for this.. ah well)

Re:lunix (1)

zaqattack911 (532040) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913778)

your kidding right? Darwin/Aqua is just terrible. You'll find way more software out there for linux, and much less bloat. Aqua is pretty looking... that's about it.

Re:lunix (0)

jbloggs (535329) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913848)

you couldn't be more wrong. in terms of quality apps os x still outnumbers linux in commercial applications, and apple is doing a very good job at reducing the bloat through the os x updates considering what they've taken on and can do. have you checked out gnome/kde lately? i use to claim linux ran faster than windows...not so much anymore. i attempted at putting linux on my 867mhz g4, then realized there was no point: os x gives me the ultimate desktop os.

Re:lunix (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2913847)

TI? What, the 99/4A?? I don't think there's been a port. Now the TI Professional, that might have had a port sometime, but there'd be no memory protection, etc. Can Linux run w/out an MMU? Hmm...

blakespot

It needs more features! (5, Funny)

NiftyNews (537829) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913702)

Darn, Mac missed a chance to start off a new line of hyper-cute with some quality components.

Where are the crazy features? How about four little feet that walk around to amuse the user? Or a spout that collects humidity to make a wicked glass of iced tea every few hours?

Re:It needs more features! (5, Funny)

foobar104 (206452) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913796)

Where are the crazy features? How about four little feet that walk around to amuse the user? Or a spout that collects humidity to make a wicked glass of iced tea every few hours?

I just picked one up at the local Apple store. When I got it hope, it jumped out of the box, handed me a card, and ran around my neighborhood. The card said, "I have been trained to gather fruit for you."

*munch, munch* Quite possibly the world's finest dog^H^H^Hcomputer.

Re:It needs more features! (2)

Mondrames (242558) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913858)

Just give your old 486 to the repo man when they figure out you commited credit card fraud!

My DP G4 800 (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2913708)

I will now remove the Ring of Power from my "new" dual G4 800...

[tear runs down cheek, falls to floor]

blakespot

3k or 3 PCs? (-1, Flamebait)

Frank of Earth (126705) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913709)

*cough* You have to be a moron to spend 3k on a mac that will be next year's garbage.

Save your money and buy a new PC ever year.

Re:3k or 3 PCs? (2, Insightful)

mkarr7 (539956) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913741)

Please. My beige G3 from 1998 is still a very powerful graphics machine. One of the reasons people buy macs is becasue the have much greater staying power than any intel or amd product.

Re:3k or 3 PCs? (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2913763)

totally agree!
someone mod this guy up

next years? (-1)

ClickWir (166927) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913805)

Next years garbage? It's garbage right NOW! Frilly crap.

GeForce4 ? (2)

at_18 (224304) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913710)

As far as I know, the biggest NVIDIA graphics card is the GeForce3. What's this model n.4?

Re:GeForce4 ? (0)

Toraz Chryx (467835) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913739)

the geforce4 is supposedly being announced early Febuary.

(if you remember, the geforce 3 was shown off at Macworld tokyo last year, before anyone else saw it :))

Re:GeForce4 ? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2913800)

Rumors peg the day Feb 5th for the GF4's announcement.

Re:GeForce4 ? (-1)

ClickWir (166927) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913856)

Lets assume you've been living under a rock. Now lets take a look at some basic math/counting. First there was the GeForce card. It was good.

GeForce 2 was the next, it was better.

Still counting in a normal manner, GeForce 3 came next. Improving more still.

Now, if you ever played those "complete the pattern" or "what comes next" games in preschool... one would say the next logical step would be ... GeForce 4. Which, unless they are going backwards, should be even better still.

This concluded our lesson for today. Oh, and class. Matrox G550 has the best performance in Windows, not top notch 3d performance tho.

Press Release (2, Informative)

lyonsden (543685) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913711)

Apple Press Release http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2002/jan/28pmg4.ht ml

Geforce 4 (1)

perlyking (198166) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913712)

Its got a geforce 4 in it!

Cant stop progress eh :(

more macintosh follies (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2913717)

So,

a nice dual machine. Never mind that there are so few apps that actually use both processors.

I guess you need two cpu's to run that sluggish OS X.....

Re:more macintosh follies (1)

joshsisk (161347) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913819)

Most graphic design and video programs use both. Those are two of Apple's biggest markets.

Re:more macintosh follies (1)

martyn s (444964) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913821)

I hate this misconception. There are other ways to take advantage of a dual proc machine than to run programs optimized for dual proc. Like, how about running two programs at once without them stepping on each other's toes.

ring and blow? (-1)

IAgreeWithThisPost (550896) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913719)

CmdrTaco likes things that ring and blow?

Not bad, for starters (5, Insightful)

jht (5006) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913720)

Well, it differentiates the Pro Macs from the iMac, for the short term. The price has nudged down, and the features have gotten boosted. All this is good.

However, the chipset hasn't been updated yet (ergo no ATA100 or DDR support yet), it's the same FireWire (meaning the newer high-speed FireWire isn't ready for Prime Time yet), and the top-end speed isn't quite as fast as I had hoped/expected. I was thinking the speeds would be more like 933/1000/dual 1133 this time out.

But all in all, it's a good short-term move assuming the G5 is available in the next couple of months. But despite the specs, it reminds me of the original "Yikes!" G4 towers, which were just Yosemite towers tweaked for a G4 to hold the line while Apple got more of the high-speed chips that their real G4 was designed for. Yikes only lasted a few months before the Sawtooth version took over.

This is, I hope, pretty much the same thing.

Changes to mobo architecture? (2)

frankie (91710) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913828)

There's a new tab on the PowerMac page, labeled Architecture [apple.com] . It wasn't there before, as confirmed by the Google cache [google.com] .

Unfortunately, the page is slanted more towards marketing than geekspeak. I couldn't see anything significantly different than the previous Quicksilver models. Could someone provide a more ArsTechnica-style overview of this little gray box labeled "System Controller" and say whether it really is any better than before?

Mod this down, but... (0)

DougLandry (27581) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913722)

Malda.

Seriously, are you ok, man?

This 'makes you want a mac'?

Three years of nothing more than misinformation and poor characterizations and understandings of each and every one of Apple's products and now this?

We in the Mac community worry for your health.

Re:Mod this down, but... (0, Offtopic)

martyn s (444964) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913839)

It was a defense mechanism.

help save taco! (5, Funny)

flynt (248848) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913726)

seriously make me want a Mac.

My friend started saying things like this after he got a girlfriend too. We had to set up an intervention session. I propose we do the same before Taco starts posting reviews of "A Walk to Remember". :)

*sigh* (1)

graveytrain (218936) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913727)

Ughh... couldn't they be happy that the apple //gs at a blistering 2.7mhz was fast enough? :)

Get your facts straight! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2913825)

It's was the IIGS, not //gs!

They do not *start* at $3k (5, Informative)

MatriXOracle (33400) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913729)

The lowest priced PowerMac model is $1599 (US, no display). That's with the single-800 MHz processor.

The *top of the line* model with the dual-GHz is $2999.

I know that this article is specifically about the dual-GHz model, but don't give the impression that PowerMacs start at $3k. They're not all that expensive.

This just in. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2913730)

Several major PC manufacturers including Dell Gateway and Compaq, today acknowledged that they are extremely concerned about their future prospects. This concern as generated by Apple's recent announcement of yet another $3000+ Mac.

Michael Dell, of Dell Corporation, stated that "this new Mac scares the shit out of me. My sales are going to tank." Dell continued that "I putting out my resume to all the local carwashes, the PC is dead."

Other leaders of PC manufacuturing companies also expressed similar concerns but, refused to comment on the record for fear of further damaging their sales.

Carly Fiorina (HP)however, was overheard in a local San Francisco restaurant pleading with the management to let her start waiting tables next week.

"Faster-than-light processor speed?" (5, Funny)

dpbsmith (263124) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913731)

The blurb at http://www.apple.com/powermac/ has a section entitled "Cache Advance" that should be good for a smirk, or at least a raised eyebrow.

It says, and I am not making this up, "In the 933MHz and dual 1GHz Power Mac G4 models, faster-than-light processor speed gets an additional boost with [now here comes the technical stuff--DPBS] advanced cache memory architecture that provides ultrafast, dedicated memory with massively enhanced throughput."

You know, as opposed to lesser machines that have only fast, dedicated memory with enchanced throughput.

But, wait, there's more... in this remarkable machine, "Accessing data from main memory is significantly faster than accessing data from the hard drive..."

Re:"Faster-than-light processor speed?" (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2913820)

It probably Oopses alot whit that faster than light prosessor.
Or, maybe they invented "TMTP(tm) (Time-Machine Technology for Processors(tm)) :-)

yay! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2913732)

go fuck an apple or an orange, phytophile!

I've always been a fan of Macs, but.. (1)

zaqattack911 (532040) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913733)

There is some funky marketing going on here.

"the new twin-engined G4 runs professional applications like Adobe Photoshop up to 72 percent faster"

Uuuuhh... a 3d card runs a 2d app 72 percent faster? No I don't think so.
Anyways, aside from that.. this is a great machine. I actually run many of my linux servers at work off of "older" Mac G3 hardware. Yellowdog linux is a god-sent!
Would Yellowgod automatically take advantage of the dual-cpu mac hardware? I'm not well versed in Multi cpu OS behavior.
And of course it's a shame that I can get a dual ghz PC system for like half the price... but hey 1.5k for the pretty colors!!! mmmmm pretty colors.

Re:I've always been a fan of Macs, but.. (1)

zaqattack911 (532040) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913748)

oops

lol I read G4 as geforce4...
my brain is different this morning :) sorry

Re:I've always been a fan of Macs, but.. (1)

Toraz Chryx (467835) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913768)

uh..

the G4 is the processor, the GF4(GeForce) is the videocard...

hence, the G4's speed up photoshop...

Re:I've always been a fan of Macs, but.. (2, Informative)

SirSlud (67381) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913784)

> a 3d card runs a 2d app 72 percent faster?

When you run your filters (which is where most photoshoppers are able to judge the 'speed' of their platform compared to past experiences or other platforms), the PowerPC-optimized version of Photoshop screams. I've seen it first hand, the G4 beside a higher-clocked P3, and the G4 simply obliterates the P3.

Now, I'm a PC guy, but I respect that when it comes to raw performance given a properly optimized and compiled app, the PowerPC chips just scream.

But most important lesson, geez, your videocard is not doing your calcs in a hardcore photoshop session ... your CPU is.

Re:I've always been a fan of Macs, but.. (1)

rworne (538610) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913812)

G4 is the processor, GeForce4 is the video card. Photoshop is one of a few applications that take advantage of dual-processor machines running the "old" MacOS. The "old" MacOS is not multiprocessor aware--certain applications are. The "new" MacOS supports multiprocessor machines at the operating system level instead of the application level.

Damn (4, Informative)

Uttles (324447) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913735)

In addition, the PowerPC G4 can perform four (in some cases eight) 32-bit floating-point calculations in a single cycle -- two to four times faster than processors found in PCs.

That's fast. I just love the details behind the facts: Pentiums suck, I'll take 1 G4 over a P4 at ANY speed. Anyway, enough trolling, if you click on the processors link [apple.com] in the article, apple gives a pretty nice overview of why their dual processor G4's are really, really nice.

*whistle* (1)

andfarm (534655) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913736)

Even if there is going to be a *cough* G5 in the next few months, this is still a nice, FAST machine.

geforce4? wow! (2)

Lumpy (12016) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913740)

neat considering that Nvidia won't own up to it's existance on their website, or the fact that you cant buy one. So is Apple going to delay release until the Geforce 4 is an actual product and not something that is in the development stages?

Re:geforce4? wow! (1)

Toraz Chryx (467835) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913782)

The GF4 release is only 9 days away or so. (allegedly)

Re:geforce4? wow! (1)

ztr (549393) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913844)

Nvidia will announce the "Geforce4" Feb. 5. See here [extremetech.com] .

Where's the audience? (-1, Flamebait)

lkaos (187507) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913743)

I just don't quite understand who Apple is going after with this. One would think that they need to expand more into the desktop arena since they have no chance in the server or production world.

Let me rephrase that though to avoid being flamed, they have no chance in the server world or in _most_ production environments.

Anyway, Macs are cute and if they stress thrift and ease, they could probably make a big dent in the desktop market.

Re:Where's the audience? (1)

mkarr7 (539956) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913798)

Mac servers tend to work fairly well in the educational market. 3-d and video production folks like them too. Web serving? maybe not, but we leave the chepa stuff for that.

"the keyboard that gets with the program" (1, Flamebait)

archen (447353) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913747)

"The Apple Pro Keyboard also comes with full-sized keys for Page Up and Down, Home and End, Insert and forward Delete.."

Oh wow!

Nice to see apple finally backed down from having stupid irregular key sizes. I think using the idiotic small arrow keys (along with the small F keys) along with the stupid puck mouse on a G3 scarred me for life . Now for the mouse button thing...

Re:"the keyboard that gets with the program" (0, Flamebait)

superpeach (110218) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913808)

First thing I checked was 'what kind of mouse does it come with'. One of these [apple.com] aparently. What is it mac people have against mouse buttons? I remember thinking macs were silly for only having single button mice ages ago but I thought that had all changed now. I was looking at the pics on that page for ages trying to see how many buttons it had, none from what I could see..but the text explains its not a mouse, its just one big optical-motion-tracking-button.
Of course, I guess you could always just buy a new mouse :)

I'm converted (3, Interesting)

Troed (102527) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913751)

I've had PCs since -93 (Atari STs before that) - I liked building my own computer, I liked (!) resolving problems in DOS/Windows configurations etc.


No more. I've got friends with Macs and knowing a thing or two about operating systems I'd pick Mac OS X over Windows any day - and thus I'm now also going to convert from PC/Windows to Apple computers. I seriously hope more and more people will do this, not just those with a techie background that can see through the MS commercials and understand that for what they use their computer for, they really really should go Apple.


Price? Umm. Let's not go there. I'm going for the iMac instead .. I'm not a gamer and can live without the GeForce 4.

Dual 1Ghz G4 PowerMac With Extra Yummy (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2913754)

You, sir, are a faggot.

END COMMUNICATION

Dual Processors and Software (4, Informative)

BoarderPhreak (234086) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913757)

It seems a LOT of people are simply mistaken about dual processor Macs...

Under MacOS 9 you needed specially tuned apps to take advantage of that second CPU... Like Photoshop.

Under MacOS X, it's no longer required, and EVERY app now benefits from that second CPU. Just like Linux or Solaris would.

Re:Dual Processors and Software (1)

Rude Turnip (49495) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913823)

Of course when OS X recognizes your Photoshop and Quark binaries as "documents" rather than apps, you can't even take advantage of a SINGLE processor.

Yes, this is a desparate plea for help.

300 percent faster?! (1, Funny)

af_robot (553885) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913762)

"...the new twin-engined G4 runs professional applications like Adobe Photoshop up to 72 percent faster -- and crunches digital video over 300 percent faster -- than a 2GHz Pentium 4-based PC."
Hmm.
So will it play all my DIVX movies 3 times faster???
Is it sounds a little stupid?

Re:300 percent faster?! (1)

Toraz Chryx (467835) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913809)

crunching digital video = video compression, not playback. (the altivec unit is something of a beast of videocompression code :)

Re:300 percent faster?! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2913814)

Divx movies play at a set framerate as long as your CPU is up to the challenge. The crunching he's referring to is the ENCODING of digital video (creating a DVD, MPEG-2 encoding).

Dumbass.

blakespot

Re:300 percent faster?! (1)

jrockway (229604) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913859)

Okay, idiot... crunching video means ENCODING, which can always be sped up. Rember that (these) macs aren't aimed at you, the M$ loving, porn-watching group. Some people use their computers for real work (like encoding video, for TV; or Photoshop stuff, for ads and the like). Okay!?

nice (3, Insightful)

4im (181450) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913765)

I've been using mostly PCs and Sun workstations, but these new Macs with OS X actually make me reconsider... the pricetag is ok I guess, the OS is solid (unix-based), PPC is a clean architecture, and it could be used by my mom while I can run all the GNU goodies I want.

Now if they have standard connectors for the display etc. (unlike some older models), it's definitely an option. That "superdrive" starts making DVDs interesting, even though 'til now I boycott them on principle (region code, CSS) - CDs are getting a bit limiting in size...

Oh well before I get serious about replacing my current setup, the G5 will be available...

Re:nice (2, Informative)

Pfhor (40220) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913842)

The video cards have VGA connectors on them, they always have. They also have the ADC connector, which is what you need to plug in an apple monitor (it is a spec that ibm made a while ago). Of course, there are boxes you can buy to plug the monitor into machines that have DVII on them also (almost all shipping geforce3 cards have them, IIRC)

Blah blah blah no cheap motherboards blah blah (-1, Troll)

Moderation abuser (184013) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913773)

Ignore PPC, it'll go away and be consigned to the evolution dustbin until someone comes up with a cheap motherboard that will allow the chips to compete in the open marketplace.

Until then, it's sales numbers aren't going to be distinguishable from background noise. Of niche interest only.

Re:Blah blah blah no cheap motherboards blah blah (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2913810)

disagree with there bud. Apple is making a big comeback. New operating system, new sleek styled computers. The stuff that has come out so far have been really cool....
If you disagree with me, thats your opinion, but the numbers do not lie Apple beat market expectations and has signed an agreement with sony enterianment online to port its games to apple! Take that loki and VA LINUX

Re:Blah blah blah no cheap motherboards blah blah (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2913855)

Motorola semiconductor doesn't make its money (when it is making money) selling chips to apple, they make it selling them to cisco, 3com, and other vendors where a high performance, low power, embedded processor is required. Apple is a second tier customer, seeing as they don't buy nearly as many PPCs as these other companies.

New imac placement (2)

Perdo (151843) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913785)

Here is to hopeing that the new G4 towers Provide enough product placement seperation from the imac so they can uncripple the imac's 100mhz fsb. There was no reason to take a perfectly good computer and run it slow except marketing. Now Apple has some faster models, they can give the imac some breathing room.

Geforce 4 MX? (2, Insightful)

Drakino (10965) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913787)

What NV number is the GeForce 4 MX? The NV17? If so, it's not that impressive, just marketing renaming a card. Apple has rarley had the top of the line graphics ship as default. And right now, it's not even an option (No 8500 or GF3Ti500)

Re:Geforce 4 MX? (2, Informative)

Toraz Chryx (467835) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913831)

the NV17(-M) is NOT a Geforce 4 level product (it's the part to replace the Geforce2Go in the notebook arena)

the Geforce 4MX should (apparently) outpace a Ti500 slightly.

I should point out that the Mac had the Geforce 3 slightly before everyone else did. (only a couple of days, but hey, they WERE first)

Re:Geforce 4 MX? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2913843)

The reason there's currently no Radeon 8500 support is that ATI hasn't released a version of the 8500 that will work with a Mac. There's some firmware differences between the PC and Mac version (it's possible to make a "dual version" card that will work on PCs and Macs though). Usually the cards get rushed to the PC market, then tweaked and added to the Mac. The 8500 will be out very soon for the Mac (this quarter).

I've actually held one. :>

Editted Summary ... (5, Funny)

tjwhaynes (114792) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913792)

For those in a hurry, here is the editted summary ...

A quantum ... revolutionary ... and ... Mac ... floating ... fearsomely fast ... through the ... barrier ... runs ... and crunches ... Pentium 4-based ... super models.

Off the charts, with hot ... fluid motion and ... phenomenal ... overdrive ...snap ... three brilliant ... creative professionals.

Faster-than-light ... ultrafast ... massively enhanced throughput ... significantly faster... even faster ... boosting ... for shooting large ... Keyboard features.

What more do you need to know?

Cheers,

Toby Haynes

60 Posts... (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2913801)

and no one can imagine a Beowulf Cluster of These??

I'm disappointed.

DDR SDRAM for the Cache??? (2)

A Commentor (459578) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913811)

Why would this be an advantage? It's clocked at 'upto' 500 MHz, but I thought it was latency that was critical in cache, so typically SRAM is used.

It looks like they are trying to make up for have their system memory just PC-133 SDRAM, instead of DDR SDRAM...

Some power... (3, Insightful)

Qwerpafw (315600) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913813)

hrmph. As both a Mac and windows user, I can't say that I was particularly impressed at first by these new machines.

Apple really needs to ramp up their speed--and since most people were expecting 1.2 Ghz G5 machines, this upgrade will come as a dissapointment to many.
The new machines also use PC-133 SDRAM, which is, to say the least, sad.

There are some nice points about the new macs, though. Apple seems to have greatly improved the interior architecture [apple.com] of the machines, enabling the PCI bus to run at 215MBps instead of 133MBps, and giving more dedicated bandwidth to hard drives et ect. The new machines also feature an AGP 4x slot, whereas (to the best of my recollection) the older PowerMacs only had AGP 2x. The GeForce 4 MX is nice, of course, though until I see some real benchmarks comparing it to Radeon 8500 and the high-end older GeForce 3 cards, I won't be impressed.

Well, here are the total specs [apple.com] of the new machines.

My overall impression is "Nice, but not nice enough."
I, for one, will wait for the G5 to buy a new mac. MacWorld New York, anyone?

Pity (0, Flamebait)

prisoner-of-enigma (535770) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913817)

It's a pity that even in a dual configuration it will get spanked by a dual Athlon. Or perhaps it isn't a pity if you've got Athlons ;-).

The article notes that the PPC chip can perform more operations per cycle than it's PC counterparts. They are comparing themselves to the P4, which specifically DOES NOT try to do a lot per clock cycle (deep pipelining prevents this). If they were to compare it with an Athlon, things would be different.

And let's not forget the staggering (for PC's anyway) power of the Athlon FPU, which spanks the P4 quite cleanly. Even though I'm sure Apple will again claim their system performs a Photoshop blur 500 billion times faster than any computer ever made, real-world testing will probably end up showing this dual system to be marginally better than its predecessor. Software that can take advantage of dual CPU's isn't found everywhere. Even Photoshop doesn't use dual CPU's (although some of the plugins do).

You can get better system responsiveness with a dual system even if your app does not support duals, but it does not necessarily translate into faster programs.

I've got 5 dual Athlon's right now in a rendering farm, and they absolutely stomp any system I've ever seen in 12 years of being in the 3D industry.

Macs are comming back (sort of) (5, Insightful)

yoink! (196362) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913818)

At least Apple has done well in the last few months. Although I don't think I would purchase an Apple desktop computer, their Powerbooks running OSX would make me reconsider buying an x86 compatible laptop.

Unfortanately for us, the mainstay of application toolkit consists of programs designed exclusively for Windows. On the background side, we have confugured our network services exlcusively around linux servers. Sure, maybe OSX is capable of handling such things in the near future, maybe even now; I really don't need a (reasonably) expensive Apple computer to the work an old PII can.

On a more positive side, I have seen the grass on the other side of the fence. My first subject revolves around a family, who for several years used windows. First 95, then 98 then ME. This family had so many issues with their computer system, and no idea how to correct them that they just went out and bought an iMac because "everything worked." Now they want iPod's, iBooks, and the likes because Apple products work both for those without an inkling of knowledge as well as those who know exactly what they're doing.

It is also my opinion that the best applications for sound recording (please read audio, not MIDI sequncing, not waveform generation ala Max/MSP,) but straight recording are available only for the PC (Samplitude 2496 and Sequoia.) As always you are free to disagree. Our studio uses such software exclusively, but a young woman asked us for advice on buying her first computer. We suggested an Athlon-based PC and an inexpensive but high quality recording card (M-Audio, Echoaudio, Terratek etc.) So she buys a Socket 423 P4, with a SoundBlaster live. Needless to say things didn't work right from the start. The system came preloaded with ME, and when we helped her switch to 2K for stabilitie's sake, Dell informed us the warranty was void without the original OS supplied with the system. On top of that this woman's knowledge of computers was non-existent (not necessarily a bad thing, just a drawback.) She is the type of demographic for which the Macintosh is perfect, and it was silly of us to recommned otherwise because we've been back there setting up the computer on many occasions.

Apple's current efforts to provide not just an alternative but a viable one should be applauded. Though Apple is, in business models, equaly monopolistic as /.'s archnemesis (no name required,) the amount of options people have, especially in the day-to-day tasks of word processing, spreadsheets, collecting SPAM etc., are much better now that Apple is putting out products everyone wants to use.

Einstein's theory of relativity just been canceled (1)

af_robot (553885) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913833)

"...In the 933MHz and dual 1GHz Power Mac G4 models, faster-than-light processor speed gets an additional boost with an advanced cache memory architecture that provides ultrafast, dedicated memory with massively enhanced throughput"
Wow! That's an achivement. :)
Say "hello" to mr. Einstein.

Question about Edu discounts. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#2913840)

Are the student discounts just 50$ per computer (as it states on the Apple.com site , or is there anything greater to be found for individual college students?

Thanks,

Chao

115 fps Quake 3 1024x768 32bit (2)

SirStanley (95545) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913841)

115 Frames per second.... Must... Have...Now... Powerbook... too... sloww...

http://www.apple.com/powermac/graphics.html

GForce 4 !MX! (2, Interesting)

Everybody (59419) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913849)

While semantically this is a GForce 4, technically the real GForce 4 (non-MX) is based on the NV25 core (dual vertex shaders and improved pixel shader).

The GForce 4 MX used by Apple usese the NV17 core (one vertex shader and no pixel shader). This might still be a nice chipset, but it is not anywhere near XBox or real GForce 4 performance.

macs (1)

PH15H3R (554373) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913852)

well it sure is nice to look at, and im sure that most of its sales are going to be based on the purdy case (as most mac sales are and have been since the imac), but isnt this all going to be out and 10x better in the PC world in a matter of months? i dont even think that you could get that much out of having dual cpus, and i wouldnt want to touch that.... cpu drivers and the cooling situation.... ick. macs have always been bringing out the latest and greatest, sure, but PC manufactuors bring stuff like this into the mainstream (and lower prices) if you want one of these so bad go buy one, take the case, replace the power supply, put in motherboard+cpu+ram and voila! a 2.2 intel P4 a nice purdy case for all those out there that love purdy cases.

We are many, they are few (1, Flamebait)

Perdo (151843) | more than 12 years ago | (#2913853)

We /.'ed apple... I think legoman's DSL lasted longer. And he had big pictures of his lego mural.
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