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BeOS For Linux

Hemos posted more than 12 years ago | from the making-things-pretty dept.

Be 309

Bob Gortician writes "The BlueOS guys have posted a few screenshots of their progress in porting the BeOS interface to Linux. Note that this is an intermediary step toward a BeOS clone OS. " I actually had a Be machine for a while, and played with it - nice OS, and well thought out, just a problem of very little applications for it.

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Stop being Gay - Stop Using Linux (-1)

LunchLady (555057) | more than 12 years ago | (#3091881)

By now, anyone who is even remotely related to an IT-type position has heard about Linux, and has most likely used it, if only to see what all the hype is about. However, GNU/Linux is not the only "free" Unix type OS available. FreeBSD [] and its cousins, NetBSD [] and OpenBSD [] are all offshoots of BSD UNIX, a commercial UNIX also known as Berkeley Software Distribution. This article will help you learn more about FreeBSD, its differences from Linux, and it will ease a potential migration process.

Migration Guide Part I

Unlike Linux which uses the GPL license, the BSD family uses the BSD-style license. To summarize the differences between the two licenses in one sentence, the GPL requires any changes to the source code to be made public and be licensed under the GPL as well. The BSD license has no such requirement, any changes can be kept proprietary.
There are several major differences in the way FreeBSD and the major Linux distributions work. This article will step you through what I consider to be the biggest 'gotchas' that I encountered when switching my desktop from Linux to FreeBSD.

Although there are people who will argue this point, the term Linux refers to the kernel, nothing more. The applications that you use everyday on your Red Hat or Debian box are utilities added on by the respective distributions. FreeBSD on the other hand refers to the OS as a whole. FreeBSD is itself the kernel, as well as the basic applications needed to use a computer, such as the copy and move commands. This difference results in there being several distributions of Linux, such as Mandrake, SuSE, Debian and Slackware. Anyone who has used both Mandrake and Debian can tell you that there is a world of difference between them. There is only one FreeBSD. My FreeBSD is the same as the FreeBSD that you have -- except for differences between versions FreeBSD is FreeBSD.

Three of the biggest Linux distributions, Red Hat, Mandrake, and SuSE use the RPM package manager. RPM handles installing, upgrading, uninstalling, and dependency checking for programs installed on those OSes. Although it does check for dependency errors before installing a program, RPM does leave a lot to be desired. For example, it cannot fetch other RPMs that are needed to solve the dependency errors. I know of are least 3 projects that solve this, urpmi, Debian's apt-get which by the way isn't remotely related to RPM and is a 'Debian only' feature, and a hybrid between RPM and apt-get. So unless you are willing to use one of the methods stated above, you have to manually find and download the required RPMs. Sound easy? Well it does until you try to manually install gnome or upgrade XFree from RPM's. Even after you find the correct RPMs, if they are for SuSE and you're running Red Hat, chances are they still might not work.

Each distribution of Linux is slightly different, and where they differ the most is in the file system layout. I'm sure that most everyone has heard about SuSE putting KDE in /opt while Red Hat puts in the /usr folder. To make matters even worse, RPM doesn't recognize programs that are compiled from source. So if you have the latest and greatest Qt compiled from source, RPM doesn't even know it exists if you try to install KDE from rpm's.

FreeBSD uses what are known as "packages" to install, uninstall and upgrade applications. The 'pkg_add' command is used to install a package that you have manually downloaded to your computer. You can also run it with the '-r' flag followed by a package name, and it will remotely fetch it from the Internet, as well as anything it requires to run. But the real beauty of FreeBSD's packages is in the ports tree. The ports tree is simply that -- a hierarchy of applications that have been ported to FreeBSD. Each directory contains a Makefile and any patches that are required for that particular app to compile and run on FreeBSD. For example, if I want to install the Apache web server, all I have to do is cd into the /usr/ports/www/apache directory, type 'make && make install', and go visit the snack machine. Assuming I have a fast computer with a decent Internet connection, when I get back it will have downloaded the apache source code, patched it, compiled it and installed it for me! The ports tree also handles any dependencies that Apache needs to run. It doesn't matter if I've installed something via the ports tree, compiled it manually, on installed it via a binary package. The ports tree can find it as long as it is in your $PATH, and act accordingly.

Another difference between Linux and FreeBSD, is that with FreeBSD, 99% of what you install via ports or packages defaults into /usr/local, where as in Linux most of it goes into /usr, and sometimes /opt. This is for the most part a minor difference, however it is nice to know that whatever you have installed is in /usr/local and not spread all over the filesystem.

Migration Guide Part II

The FreeBSD system uses a program known as cvsup to keep itself up-to-date. Once you create a 'sup-file', cvsup compares what is locally on your system, and what is on the cvsup server and downloads any file that has changed since the last time it was run. You can use it to keep your ports tree and your local copy of the FreeBSD source code current and up-to-date. Unlike Linux, which normally only the kernel is downloaded and compiled on a semi-regularly basis, you can easily download the source for the entire OS using cvsup. The main reason for doing this is that it makes updating FreeBSD from one version to the next extraordinary simple. After cvsup'ing the newest source, you compile a new kernel, then you compile the 'rest' of the OS using one simple command: 'make buildworld'. you then drop into single user mode and install it with 'make installworld'. It's just that easy.
The way that partitions are handled is also very different. Linux sees a hard drive as being divided up into different partitions. Of those partitions, some of them can have logical partitions inside of them. What we commonly think of as 'partitions', FreeBSD sees as slices. Within each slice are one or more 'BSD partitions'. These BSD partitions are what shows up in the /etc/fstab.

Perhaps the next biggest difference between Linux and FreeBSD is the philosophy behind how the OSes are designed. Linux tends to have newer features and drivers (such as the closed source nVidia graphics card drivers) well before FreeBSD. The FreeBSD developers have taken a much more conservative approach to things. They prefer tried and tested code over flashy new features, preferring to wait until the major bugs have been worked out. For FreeBSD on the desktop this can be a problem if you want the latest and greatest drivers or the newest *cool* new feature. But in the server room, you want tried and tested code. Besides, how many of you put a $200 video card on your headless server?

Another difference is in what is installed by default. If you go with the default install options in SuSE, you'll wind up with at least a gigabyte of installed software. FreeBSD on the other hand, installs just the basics. (Please note: I know that you can tell SuSE to only install the 'basics', but notice that I am talking about the 'default' install.) It gives you only the essentials, which you can use to install any of the 4000 applications in the ports tree. Almost all of the programs that run on Linux are already ported and running on FreeBSD, the only difference is that with Linux they are either installed by default, or unless you use Debian you have to go manually download them. With FreeBSD they are optional, and it is for the most part automated. Another difference in terms of what gets installed is that in Linux, the default shell is bash, however in FreeBSD it is tcsh.

For commercial programs such as Oracle or HP Openmail, FreeBSD offers a "Linux compatibility" layer. In simple terms this layer allows FreeBSD to run Linux binaries at almost native speed. Depending on the application it can run at full native speed under FreeBSD, just as it would under "Linux". This compatibility layer is a step above emulation. The required Linux libraries are installed on the BSD system in binary form. When you try to run the Linux application, FreeBSD realizes that it is a Linux binary and simply points it to the Linux libraries that it depends on. There is also support for emulating commercial BSD, NetBSD, OpenBSD, and SCO binaries. Each respective OS is in different stages of support, with the best support for commercial BSD, NetBSD, and OpenBSD.

Although the BSD developers are more concerned with quality than quantity, that doesn't mean that FreeBSD is lacking in features. FreeBSD 5.0, due in Novemeber of 2002 will feature fine grained process control, which will enable it to scale effectively up to 32 processors. Version 5.0 will also feature a full DEVDFS device filesystem. Although this has been available in Linux for quite a while, you don't hear much about it. It basically allows for the dev file system to be dynamically changed. For example, if you add a USB keyboard, it would 'magically' be added to the /dev directory. As for journaling file systems, the stable version, 4.4 has a feature known as 'soft updates'. While it is technically not a journaled file system, depending on who you ask it is better than a journaled filesystem.

Throughout the big dotcom boom of '98-'99 Linux was THE buzzword. Computer users everywhere were hearing about a *free* operating system that was challenging Microsoft in the server room as well as the desktop. Even today, the userbase of Linux is growing strongly. However most people are just beginning to hear about FreeBSD. Hopefully this article will help you evaluate FreeBSD as a possible solution to your needs. In the end, if you don't want to be gay - choose FreeBSD.

The Death of Slashdot (-1)

ringbarer (545020) | more than 12 years ago | (#3091882)

I wouldn't pay for this shit. I don't think ANYONE with half a brain would.

An explanation: I used to be a good, noble poster. Carefully wording every article to provide insight and wisdom to my fellow posters. Slowly, I acculumated karma, giving me the artificial peer respect that made such things worthwhile. Yes, I knew that karma is an arbitary value, but it made my contributions worthwhile.

And then one day I got bored. It was an article about European Patents I think. Something dull and boring... I think I got the first 15 or so posts on that one as an AC. It was fun.

In the end, the article accumulated a grand total of 2 relevant posts, the remainder offtopic. One of the irrelevant posts that I made was a couple of paragraphs under the title of the Linux Gay Conspiracy.

To my surprise, my post was followed up by other suggestions as to the latent homosexuality contained within the Open Sauce movement. And I felt encouraged. So I gathered together these additions, made some of my own, and kept posting.

And posting. And posting. Every sick, depraved act I could think of was included. Before long, the LGC grew to be one of the most comprehensive documents detailing the carnality and perversity of the IT industry. And, be honest now, it was funny. Crude and childish, but funny. A necessary counterpart to the morbid seriousness of some of the other posters.

In the meantime, I carried on with my regular account, posting away. Being diligent in my real contributions to the community. And then the main account got bitchslapped.

What was the need for that? Did it act as a deterrent to the anonymous trolling? Of course not. If anything, it just demonstrated the petty minded fascism of the Slashdot editors. The LGC was posted at '0', usually modded down within seconds. Wasn't that enough for them, to know that such a posting would disappear into the ghetto?

Of course, the LGC has now taken a life of its own, and my original account got back up to an acceptable karma level. Mainly by whoring and cutting and pasting high scoring posts on previous articles. Originality is discouraged by the Slashdot gestalt after all.

After a while, I strived for a new challenge, or failing that an excuse to spout obscenties like some Tourette's induced retard. Hence the birth of ringbarer. Suddenly, Slashdot has become an enjoyable experience again.

For all the wrong reasons.

So no, I won't be paying for Slashdot. I'll be installing junkbuster instead. Let the site fall to the fucking ground. It is, after all, symbolic of the crumbling OSS empire, where everything is free until they force you to pay for it.

My gift to the Trolling community? The Linux Gay Conspiracy v2.0. With even filthier acronyms and anagrams.


Added to the Troll library? (-1)

dadaist (544022) | more than 12 years ago | (#3091945)


FP! (-1)

DonkeyHote (521235) | more than 12 years ago | (#3091886)

Fr0st P1st!

Looks nice... (-1, Offtopic)

42forty-two42 (532340) | more than 12 years ago | (#3091891)

...but think of a beowulf cluster of those!

Re:Looks nice... (-1)

anal-johnson (528597) | more than 12 years ago | (#3091911)

you need to shut the fuck up, right now

Re:Looks nice... (-1)

LunchLady (555057) | more than 12 years ago | (#3091940) sound very scary. Do you use Linux? You should consider another operating system - it may bring down your stress.

Best. Site. Evar! (-1)

RoboTroll (560160) | more than 12 years ago | (#3091895)

Hi I just wanted to say I just found out about Slashdot and I really like your site!

I like all the news stories that are submitted and I love to read all of the insightful commentary that gets posted by the readers!

It is a great site, keep up the good work!

From the annals of the Troll Library [] .

/. suck (-1)

initnull (512461) | more than 12 years ago | (#3091896)

Got Ads?

The user interface should Be better (1, Interesting)

Marx_Mrvelous (532372) | more than 12 years ago | (#3091902)

I think BeOS was a nice experiment in OS interface implementation. I'm glad to see it's still around, in a sense.

OT: Wow, no ads rock!

Re:The user interface should Be better (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3092181)

OT: Wow, no ads rock!

God damn you're a sucker.

I know how we can help... (2, Funny)

42forty-two42 (532340) | more than 12 years ago | (#3091914)

...anyone have a grammar checker?

Re:I know how we can help... (2)

sharkey (16670) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092280)

...anyone have a grammar checker?

The nerve, asking something like this on /.! You might as well ask Taco to recommend a spellchecker.

Re:I know how we can help... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3092595)

Rumor has it that speling and grammar checked stories is two new premium features available to those who subscribe to slashdot platinum.

More information on BlueOS (5, Informative)

Eugenia Loli (250395) | more than 12 years ago | (#3091918)

Please go to BeNews [] and read the explanation for these two BlueOS screenshots. The second shot uses a "dummy" content for its windows.

Also, click here [] to read the Interview with the BlueOS project leader at OSNews.

Re:More information on BlueOS (1)

quinto2000 (211211) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092261)

I read the link. What I don't understand is if in the second screenshot the BeOS windows are also faked. If so, what exactly is the point of the screenshot?

Re:More information on BlueOS (2, Informative)

Eugenia Loli (250395) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092359)

The CONTENT of the windows are just a picture. The window manager is real and fully interactive. It is just a demo/proof of concept to show that the window manager/environment works. They had to put something inside these windows, so they added this picture that looks like a real content, only it is not interactive, it is a picture.

Policy on revoked moderators? (-1, Offtopic)

dstone (191334) | more than 12 years ago | (#3091935)

I haven't really tracked the "official" decision, but I understand that many high-karma users (including myself) have had their moderation privileges revoked because of some posting or moderating or meta-moderating action they performed. (ie, modding up something controversial the editors didn't like, supporting controversial posters with meta-mods, etc.)

To be honest, I'm not sure at what point I lost my mod priveleges, but I haven't had them for quite some time. Yet I continue to try to post informative or insightful or funny things.

To CmdrTaco... what is your position going to be on revoking mod priveleges to paying subscribers? If I pay, will I be able to freely post and mod and meta-mod like I thought I could before?

Re:Policy on revoked moderators? (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3091988)

You want to be a moderator, when you can't even tell the difference between Slashdot and some faked BeOS windows? Those faked BeOS windows doesn't look anything like Slashdot!

Re:Policy on revoked moderators? (-1)

dadaist (544022) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092099)

another example of crappy slashcode. The story that the person you responded to posted his comment to was overloaded, and Slash put it into the wrong story as a result. It happens sometimes.

Re:Policy on revoked moderators? (0, Offtopic)

dstone (191334) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092093)

My bad. A BeOS story got posted soon after the paid Slashdot story and I replied to the BeOS story instead. Totally my fault. There goes my karma! Anyways, the correct posting is here [] . It's most definitely on-topic there. Please read it!

Well... (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3091941)

At least BeOS was free, and didn't charge you $5 for every 1000 applications you wanted to open.

Re:Well... (-1)

Kathleen Fent (558811) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092058)

At least BeOS was free, and didn't charge you $5 for every 1000 applications you wanted to open.

On the other hand, a case of semigrammaticalness of a different sort appears to
correlate rather closely with an abstract underlying order. Comparing these exam
ples with their parasitic gap counterparts in (96) and (97), we see that most of
the methodological work in modern linguistics does not readily tolerate a descriptive fact. Of course, this analysis of a formative as a pair of sets of features is, apparently, determined by the ultimate standard that determines the accuracy of any proposed grammar.

It must be emphasized, once again, that this selectionally introduced contextual
feature is necessary to impose an interpretation on the ultimate standard that
determines the accuracy of any proposed grammar. We will bring evidence in favor
of the following thesis: the speaker-hearer's linguistic intuition is, apparent
ly, determined by the strong generative capacity of the theory. For any transformation which is sufficiently diversified in application to be of any interest, a
descriptively adequate grammar suffices to account for nondistinctness in the sense of distinctive feature theory.

Not so much applications as... (5, Insightful)

b0r0din (304712) | more than 12 years ago | (#3091948)

Driver support. Had virtually no video or sound support, so everything was in grey and mute. I loved the interface, and it booted up as quick as can be, but there's only so much you want to do with no driver support. Why make an application when no one else has a machine it'll run nicely on?

Re:Not so much applications as... (4, Informative)

Eugenia Loli (250395) | more than 12 years ago | (#3091976)

Actually BeOS had quite some support with BeOS 5 and the third party drivers found on BeBits. I agree with BeOS 4 and 4.5 did not have many drivers, but version 5 was really good at the time. Now, it is 2 years with no BeOS official updates, so naturally, it is already out of date.. :(

Re:Not so much applications as... (1)

PW2 (410411) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092260)

My tv card (some card in a Toshiba 7200) worked easily in Beos - still doesn't work yet in Linux

Re:Not so much applications as... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3092341)

You mean it booted up as quick as Be can? :)

Seriously, everything was in grey and mute if you didn't have the right hardware. I think my old nVidia Riva TNT card was supported pretty well. Put it this way, it was more choices than Apple had...

Fragmentation... (5, Insightful)

Cutriss (262920) | more than 12 years ago | (#3091952)

Not that the majority of Linux users care about the Mac, but the fact is that Mac OS X represents something I believe a whole bunch of Linux users should get behind if they want their OS to succeed - It's Linux with the useability that Joe Sixpack can handle. BeOS has its uses, but aside from the glory hack of porting its interface to Linux, I'm afraid that this can only serve to fragment the already small effort behind pushing Mac OS X as Linux's true way to combat Windows, because let's face it - Neither KDE nor Gnome are going to make my mother leave Windows anytime soon...

Re:Fragmentation... (2, Interesting)

Anonynnous Coward (557984) | more than 12 years ago | (#3091979)

Except that Apple has demonstrated a tendency to threaten to sue any entity that dares even make skins that look like their "innovative" eye candy user interface.

Sure, they might be the lesser of evils as far as usability goes, but I don't think any C&D letter wielding corporation deserves to have its products plugged by a bunch of Linux users.

Re:Fragmentation... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3092356)

Heaven forbid that Linux users should actually come up with their own innovative, attractive interface rather than copying someone else's.

Re:Fragmentation... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3092488)

Harsh words from someone defending a company that took a free operating system, BSD, made a few changes, and sold it as their own.


Re:Fragmentation... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3092695)

>>BSD, made a few changes, and sold it as
>>their own.

a) the BSD license explicitly says you can do this. Thats the whole point. Apple didn't steal anything - it's allowed. People have the right to keep their creations, or to give it away. If you don't like their terms, make your own. Typical linux whiner.

b) It ISN'T BSD linux. It's Mach with a BSD wrapper around it.

But don't let facts cloud your zealotry....

Re:Fragmentation... (3, Interesting)

ptrourke (529610) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092019)

Mac OS X might be UNIX's best hope, but as it's not Linux, I don't see how you can say it's Linux's best hope, let alone that "It's Linux with the usability that Joe Sixpack can handle." Different license, different kernel architecture, different filesystem . . . That said, the more Unices or UNIX-likes there are, the more compatible everyone will be, and the better off we'll be. (Of course, the same could be said of Windows)

Re:Fragmentation... (4, Interesting)

Cutriss (262920) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092052)

Well, I made that comment because while I'm totally offbase from a geek standpoint, for the average home user, Mac OS X presents them the closest semblance of a UNIX-like operating system they'll ever see. And more people out there in this decade have heard of Linux than UNIX (Again, we're talking about average schmoes) I think that X's popularity will further the interest in Linux (Even if it is based on BSD, which is another point entirely).

Re:Fragmentation... (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3092030)

Mac OS X represents something I believe a whole bunch of Linux users should get behind if they want their OS to succeed - It's Linux with the useability that Joe Sixpack can handle

It's Linux? Maybe you should get your facts straight!

PS Some of us don't care about your grandmother or Microsoft!

Linux and Unix users are starting to care (2)

daviddennis (10926) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092270)

A lot of people, including me, are transitioning from Linux to the Macintosh. The Mac has all the deep applications people need, while including all the coolness that is Unix. (Call me when something like Final Cut Pro or After Effects runs on Linux. And when the fonts don't look like sixth-grader crayon sketches of text :-( ).

That being said, we must say that a certain amount of variety in the computing world is necessary. Some people don't have $1,299 for an iMac (assuming the low-end model comes out sometime in the next century or two). Some of them want to build computers themselves, or buy an eMachines with a crummy 15" CRT monitor picked up at a garage sale for fifty bucks.

We can't convince these people to buy Macs; Macs are always going to be a bit for the elite, a bit for those who like spending money on fine technology. They need Linux just as we need Macs. As long as they are off the dreaded Windows, we shouldn't turn against them; if they grow older and richer, like I did, they will appreciate the better things in hardware soon enough.

So don't be against this kind of project. If it can make Linux more cool, well, those who learn it are learning the same basic operating system that underlies Macintoshes. So there should be more cross-polination between the two worlds, which I feel is all for the better.

Advocate the Mac when you can, but don't consider linux the enemy. We have a common enemy, and you know what that is. All too often we get injured in internecine squbbles instead of taking care of the most important advesary.

Hope that helps.


Re:Linux and Unix users are starting to care (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3092449)

Macs are always going to be a bit for the elite, a bit for those who like spending money on fine technology.

You keep telling yourself that. It'll soothe you when you realize you overpaid for commodity hardware bundled with a proprietary, non-standard operating system.


Re:Linux and Unix users are starting to care (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3092542)

heh. i think they whiney fool is feeling left out, unelite, if you will. did your emachine break? :(

Re:Linux and Unix users are starting to care (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3092565)

Uh, yeah, my, uh e-machine broke. I bow before your Mac defending leetness. Mac users are either newbies or deluded. Which are you?


Re:Fragmentation... (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3092312)

Sorry, but I didn't spend the last year transitioning away from one closed source operating system (Windows) only to move to a different but equally closed source operating system (Mac OS X). Mac OS X may have a superior GUI, but its not like the KDE and GNOME folks are standing still, and I am not willing to give up my freedom for the small benefit to me personally that the totally closed Mac GUI brings. Note, I'm not averse to paying for software, as I always purchase my copy of Mandrake when I upgrade.

Re:Fragmentation... (3, Informative)

MindStalker (22827) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092383)

Wouldn't really call it closed source, its BSD, its the GUI thats closed source, and all the api's are fully published.

Re:Fragmentation... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3092330)

Is it FREE?

Linux's true way? (1)

Anonymous American (453400) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092349)

I admit Mac OS X is nice, but it's proprietary and closed source. I don't see many people running Darwin. Even though Mac's are beautiful machines, the corporation behind them is just as ugly as Microsoft.

Why would you attack these developers and tell them that they should concentrate on developing OS X ? KDE and Gnome are coming along nicely.

You will see more support for OS X when it is at least open source, or GNU (which will never happen).

I just as happy seeing my mother run Windows XP as I am seeing her run OS X. I'd like to see her run a GNU OS, but that time will come. There is no need to be impatient.

Re:Fragmentation... (1)

Sakhmet (137111) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092391)

What KDE and Gnome need to do is approach some graphic designers (preferably those with any kind of user-interface experience) and get them on board.

Even the best of Linux desktops look cheap in comparison to OS X. Really really cheap.

The way I see it, for Linux to succeed and give the masses a viable option is this:

More USEFUL apps than windows, better UI than OS X, all on the stability of Linux.

Of course, those apps need to support the regular file formats (.doc, .xls, etc.). And lets face it, for those graphic designers, the GiMP just ain't gonna cut it. Clones of Photoshop, Ilustrator and Quark would end my reliance on proprietary OS's forever. Yes, clones, I don't need any other features. Just the ones those packages have, with the same ease of use.


Re:Fragmentation... (4, Interesting)

powerlinekid (442532) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092393)

Ok #1) MacOS X is beautiful... but its also the Mach kernel with a BSD compatibility layer on it. Its definitly not linux and typical linux apps won't run on it without a little tweaking.

#2) Have you played with the KD3 beta2 yet? Did it last night and its gorgeous... has some bugs left, but we're talking beta software here. I think if we fix up the config file mess (slackware people excluded, because they like them ;-)) and put kde3 on a machine, windows users should have no problem.

On a side note, my two little brothers accidently logged into my linux box. One didn't know he wasn't in windows and was using it fine and the other knew he was in linux but liked it better. Just something to think about.

Re:Fragmentation... (2)

RevAaron (125240) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092587)

KDE, GNOME still lack the consistency of a real desktop environment like Mac OS 9 or X. KDE may be beautiful, but beauty has little to do with real functionality. OS X has both.

sad but true (4, Insightful)

jbischof (139557) | more than 12 years ago | (#3091963)

that the best technologies frequently are not the ones that make it in the marketplace

If it were the other way around a lot of us would probably be running BeOs on an Alpha chip right now.

Re:sad but true (2)

RevAaron (125240) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092321)

Nah, it'd be NeXTSTEP (not OpenStep) or BeOS on PPC. Actually, if the best technology really won, we'd all have Dynabooks (see: Alan Kay, Smalltalk) or portable LispMachines.

Re:sad but true (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3092392)

That's true if by "best" you mean as judged by some abstract, completely impractical ivory-tower criterion. Such a judgement is essentially useless except for dick-waving arguments by losers with nothing better to do. The "best" technology is the one that delivers functionality the consumer wants at a price the consumer can afford. The purpose of technology is improvement of the quality of life, not to be fodder for your personaly intellectual masturbation.

Re:sad but true (1)

jbischof (139557) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092750)

or by best I mean, technologically superior, better performance, better functionality.

A lot of todays products get proliferation because of market share, backwards compatibility, advertising, money/muscle power.

Im sure a lot of /.ers would argue that if AMD had a little more money for advertising and for getting large clients like Dell then the Athlon would be selling far far more than the Pentium 4.

It is not always the best functionality at the price the consumer can afford, it has to do with many other factors such as availability and branding etc.

of course its always easier to dismiss such comments as "dick-waving arguments" instead of actually realizing what is going on.

This should cause atleast two main benefits (5, Interesting)

BoxJockey (50760) | more than 12 years ago | (#3091970)

The developing of a BeOS clone via this route may yield atleast the se two main benefits:
* Linux and other *nix's will gain another easy to use, mature, comprehensive GUI.
* BeOS will gain from more exposure and may get new development.

This is a great way to continue this great product.

Re:This should cause atleast two main benefits (1)

egghat (73643) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092194)

with the small problem, that this is not BeOs on *nix, but the BeOs-GUI on *nix. And it won't be as stable as GnuStep, Wine, ... for a long time.

Far from being useful for Joe Sixpack.

Bye, egghat.

Re:This should cause atleast two main benefits (1, Troll) (542180) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092292)

I think you guys need to read the FAQ on the webpage, it's not a GUI for linux or freebsd. It's a clonse of the BeOS. It dosent use x11, and is based on the NewOS kernel, not linux.

Re:This should cause atleast two main benefits (3, Interesting)

dinivin (444905) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092368)

I think you need to read the FAQ. This article is about BlueOS, which is, at the moment, a GUI for linux running on top of X11.

This article is not about OpenBeOS, which is the work in progress, rewriting bits and pieces of BeOS as open source, and aiming to use the NewOS kernel eventually.


Re:This should cause atleast two main benefits (1)

BoxJockey (50760) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092637)

Currently, It does run on X11.

Applications? (4, Funny)

RobL3 (126711) | more than 12 years ago | (#3091972)

just a problem of very little applications for it. Why were the apps so small?
Did it help to have a bigger monitor?
When you iconify a very little application, does it disappear?

Jeez, no wonder BeOS failed.

Re:Applications? (1)

Dr. Bitchin' (562695) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092497)

They were small because they were efficient, and much of the functions were in the OS like all the e-mails being seperate files in a folder. Same for physical size on screen; anyhow you could have seperate workspaces at different resolutions

Re:Applications? (1)

RobL3 (126711) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092597)

Um... I think you missed the point dude.

Back in the day (3, Informative)

DCram (459805) | more than 12 years ago | (#3091977)

Back in the day we all had such high hopes for BeOS. They had the coolest apps for watching SMP apps utilize CPU. Then we all rejoyced when it was thought that Mac was going to use Be for there underlying OS, but to no avail. Then we cried when it was thought that Beos would be no more. I wore my T-shirt for a week in defiance. Now I have a little heart that it will still live on in our memories and in our porting dreams.

IMHO it could have been more than a PDA or a toaster oven OS. Too bad more apps wern't produced. I actually think I still have a CodeWarrior CD that will let me compile on Mac to Be. Not that i even know where to find a Mac anymore,*besides the one at work that runs linux*.

And does anyone remember that app they had that bounced a ball from one window into another window. In the day that was cool.

ahhh.. misspelling blis! Maybe i should have the doctors remove that 6th finger, they just don't make keyboards with us in mind!

Re:Back in the day (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3092366)

You did WASH that T-shirt every night, right?

Another GUI can only help (1)

kill-hup (120930) | more than 12 years ago | (#3091983)

I know there are some who think the multitude of GUIs for Linux hurts rather than helps, but I think a project like this, bringing another highly user-friendly interface to Linux is a plus. I may like a lightweight GUI with mouse-click menus and manually editing config files, but not everyone does. I can't expect my parents to learn vi or emacs if they want to change something ;)

How about BeOS for Amiga? (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3091999)

Two dead platforms that taste great together!

Issues of BeOS Interface Design (-1)

Kathleen Fent (558811) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092018)

This suggests that the systematic use of complex symbols is rather different from irrelevant intervening contexts in selectional rules. From C1, it follows that the theory of syntactic features developed earlier is not subject to an important distinction in language use. Of course, the natural general principle that will subsume this case suffices to account for a parasitic gap construction.

Let us continue to suppose that most of the methodological work in modern linguistics is not subject to nondistinctness in the sense of distinctive feature theory. Furthermore, the fundamental error of regarding functional notions as categorial appears to correlate rather closely with irrelevant intervening contexts in selectional rules. Notice, incidentally, that the theory of syntactic features developed earlier is necessary to impose an interpretation on the extended c-command discussed in connection with (34).

By combining adjunctions and certain deformations, the appearance of parasitic gaps in domains relatively inaccessible to ordinary extraction is unspecified with respect to an abstract underlying order. A consequence of the approach just outlined is that the notion of level of grammaticalness does not affect the structure of the levels of acceptability from fairly high (eg (99a)) to virtual gibberish (eg (98d)). Nevertheless, relational information delimits a descriptive fact.

Re:Issues of BeOS Interface Design (-1)

Guns n' Roses Troll (207208) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092257)

Ms Fent -

In the intrest of science, I would like to propose a study. Let's have a lot of hot and sloppy sex and then see how your impotent husband-to-be acts. If you're interested, please reply with the best time to have sexual intercourse would be.

Your Friend,
Dick Hurtz

very little applications = like linux (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3092035)

i know lots of you are like

What is this? (1)

secondsun (195377) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092039)

I have played around with BeOS some, it seemed good and solid. COuld someple please tell me what these screen shots represent? If this the BeOS API running ontop of Linux in the way that Win3.11 ran on top of dos? Or is it just another Desktop Environment ala KDE GNOME Ximian etc?

Re:What is this? (5, Informative)

Eugenia Loli (250395) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092117)

It is a port of the BeOS C++ API on top of Linux. Everything will be "wrapped" to resemble the BeOS API to the point to almost be source compatible with the BeOS applications. Even the filesystem API layer will be changed accordingly in order to accomodate OpenTracker, the BeOS Desktop and filemanager.
So, in a sense it is like KDE and Gnome, it is a full desktop & development environment on top of XFree & Linux (they plan to remove XFree completely in the future), however lots of things will change in order the system to "feel" more BeOS-ish. They also apply some additional patches to the Linux kernel for better UI response, as this was one of the strong points of BeOS.

the day the fag site died (-1)

neal n bob (531011) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092045)

this was a day we all knew would come - you know the saying, there is no such thing as a free blowjob. Will they have different subscription levels - one for crapflooders, one for karma whores?

OpenBeOS (5, Informative)

I Want GNU! (556631) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092061)

Don't forget about OpenBeOS [] - working to keep BeOS going.

An OS without a niche (0, Flamebait)

Peaker (72084) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092077)

Was BeOS supposed to be a good user interface?
Then why wasn't it designed as a toolkit for X, or as an X alternative?

Was BeOS supposed to utilize SMP better by dividing applications into more threads?
Then why wasn't it designed as an application framework?

Was BeOS supposed to have a revolutionary OS design?
By still using file systems, giving no thought or insight to security, and a Unix-like model in a new OS, I don't think so.

What the hell were they thinking?

Re:An OS without a niche (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3092144)

Was BeOS supposed to be a good user interface?


Then why wasn't it designed as a toolkit for X, or as an X alternative?

See above.

Was BeOS supposed to utilize SMP better by dividing applications into more threads?
Then why wasn't it designed as an application framework?

Out of interest, what do you think an Operating System is, if its not an "application framework"?

Was BeOS supposed to have a revolutionary OS design?
By still using file systems, giving no thought or insight to security, and a Unix-like model in a new OS, I don't think so.

If it was a Unix-like model, why didn't they have any security? How do your organise your data if you have no filesystem? Hint: Even if you use some fancy relational database, you still need some way of otganising the data on the physical medium. In other words, a file system!

What the hell were they thinking?

What the hell are you smoking?

That's nice; Open BeOS is also coming along nicely (2, Informative)

eexlebots (203658) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092105)

I appreciate the efforts of the BlueOS team, but I still have reservations about using Linux as the base for the new BeOS. I am glad to see that they have made progress, don't get me wrong; however, the OpenBeOS team has made huge strides as well, and may be more in line with the original spirit of BeOS. For example, they now have: BFS read support in their new driver, many preferences done, good progress made on the printing kit, a prototype app_server, and more. It looks like binary compatability will be achieved sooner than thought, too. Check out [] for more details on another team working hard on a worthy successor to BeOS.

Stop Using Linux (-1)

LunchLady (555057) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092109)

Hey, Desktop Linux Fans: Buy a Mac!
By Eugenia Loli-Queru - Posted on 2002-02-28 18:42:58
The once Mac-skeptical, David Coursey (executive editor at ZD AnchorDesk), seems to have turned into a huge Mac fan, it seems. In his latest editorial he says that "These desktop Linux people are just like the adherents to any concept that has failed in the marketplace of ideas: They don't know when to let go, and make fools of themselves as a result." and "How you build a vibrant computing platform when nobody is willing to spend money on it escapes me." and "Linux servers are a cause for concern in Redmond and a source for happiness in data centers worldwide. Desktop Linux, on the other hand, is rapidly being assigned to the trash pile of computing history. Like scientific socialism, it will go down as an idea that sounded good on paper but didn't work in the real world."

BeOS had the classic catch 22 (4, Insightful)

mystery_bowler (472698) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092130)

No one would write a lot of apps until it had a larger user base, no user base would be generated until it had more apps.

It's the same set of problems Linux has faced in the past. BeOS was/is a fine OS, but it never seemed to have a good backer, nor a solid niche. Artsy types already prefer Macs, so it's hard to compete there. Ordinary desktop users have already been won over by Microsoft, so it's really hard to compete there. Linux users already had a free OS and a nice looking desktop if they wanted it (re: KDE, Gnome. You should know that by now).

I think that BeOS was a nice, stable OS that could have been a contender. It's a shame it didn't get more press or attention from major industry players. Oh well, I look forward to another nice Linux desktop all the same.

Re:BeOS had the classic catch 22 (2)

erroneus (253617) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092295)

I feel the same way... in fact, there are a lot of PC items that are the same. Have you heard of this crazy USB thing? For the longest time USB was on every AT motherboard yet didn't come with the little wires that brought it to the outside of the case. The lack of USB support for the OS and the lack of devices that used USB painted a dim future for the interface.

Where is it today? It's everywhere and USB 2.0 is pushing firewire out of the picture. It took a LONG TIME to catch on, but it did.

Okay, it's comparing apples and oranges but the idea of the catch-22 being the block that stops progress is kinda wrong.

Re:BeOS had the classic catch 22 (2)

mystery_bowler (472698) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092428)

It's not that I think it blocks progress so much as it extends the time of acceptance.

The thinking would be something like, "I'd like to use BeOS, but it's not compatible with my video card yet." Now, multiply that statement by a couple of gazillion users. Said users don't need another desktop OS and BeOS didn't have any "killer apps", so the acceptance rate is much lower.

Like I said, it doesn't block acceptance. But it certainly influences it negatively when there isn't a "must have" application involved.

Joe Sixpack (2, Informative)

MadFarmAnimalz (460972) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092133)

I've been here long enough to know that this thread is going to devolve faster than you can say TinyX into the only real challenger to the vim/emacs war; the Linux on the desktop debate.

To save time, we should just symlink to the earlier desktop discussions. Here [] ya go.

I'm just sitting here wondering why we seek the acceptance of Joe Sixpack.

Cha-ching! (0, Offtopic)

danielrose (460523) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092150)

You are out of Slashdot Credits! Please insert $5.00 to continue!

in honor of Netpositive (0, Funny)

dadaist (544022) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092164)

A slashdot story.
broken slashcode --
BeOs or PayPal?

Mod this up! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3092403)

That is the funniest thing I have read all day!

Reasons BeOS didn't fly (2)

erroneus (253617) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092184)

Lack of applications was probably the majority of the problem ... they were late in the game... very late.

But to me, personally, I think when they call software for Be "BeWare" I take it as a WARNING rather than a product.

Re:Reasons BeOS didn't fly (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3092319)

I have been in the Be community for 8 years and have RARELY heard this term used. Did you just make it up on your own or did mommy help?

Re:Reasons BeOS didn't fly (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3092620)

Did the joke really hurt enough to make you bring up his mother?

Nice ! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3092204)

This project has a lot of potential. I have always thought for Linux to succeed on the desktop it would need to evolve into something like Mac OS X which uses a Unix core but changes the whole user experience and gives the power / stability of a Unix type OS without all of the legacy BS. OS X unfortunately, only runs on apple hardware and I doubt this will change in the near term. Things like KDE and GNOME are becoming better each day but they still rely very heavily on a lot of things which might be better left behind.

erm... (0, Flamebait)

labratuk (204918) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092216)

...just a problem of very little applications for it.

What exactly is wrong with the very little applications for it? Were they badly written? Were there not enough of them? Am I supposed to assume the medium sized to large applications worked fine?

Please, if you are going to badmouth BeOS, back up your arguments.

Licence? (2, Interesting)

Penrod Pooch (466103) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092229)

The FAQ says its not under the GPL. Then what licence is it under? Is it free software?

Re:Licence? (-1)

dadaist (544022) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092502)

Why do you hate me? Post a note in my journal []

PS. You suck.

FInally a readable windowing enviornment on linux! (1)

Municipa (99320) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092243)

Maybe I really will ditch Windows as a desktop one of these days.

the *REAL* problem (2, Informative)

Derek (1525) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092256)

"...just a problem of very little applications for it."

Ummmm, try "just a little problem of a monopoly using illegal business practices to make sure it never reaches the market."

Hell, PC manufactures were offered the operating system for free if they would just put it on their machines! (Not even replacing Window$, but dual-booting along side it!)

To get the apps, it had to have some penetration in the market. It was penetrating the Microsoft controlled market that was the problem. Oh wait, are we talking about that anti-trust thing again!?!?!

For a time, I used (and loved) this operating system. It had enough apps to do *most* of what I needed to do.


Re:the *REAL* problem (3, Insightful)

Ranger Rick (197) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092389)


An evil monopoly didn't kill BeOS; Be, Inc. did. Every time they got momentum doing one thing, they decided it wasn't going to work and changed business plans. If Be had picked a good business plan and stuck to it, they could have at least carved out a niche. Instead they kept changing their minds about what their core business is.

They had a great (amazing!) piece of technology first, and then tried to decide how to make money from it, and screwed up over and over. BeOS was the nicest, cleanest, most well-engineered OS I've ever used, but it didn't have a chance.

Wacky conspiracy theories (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3092448)

That's right, create silly conspiracies. Anything to get around the fact that BeOS met hardly anyone's needs.

I considered getting free BeOS on my machine, but rejected it since it was different for the sake of being different (ease of use be damned) and there were "very little applications for it."

very little applications for [BeOS] (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3092265)

...created by little elves on little teeny tiny keyboards!

I think you meant to say "very few applications" - not little.

LORD OF THE WANKS (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3092289)

one ring to wank them all

one ring to cum them

one ring to bring them all

and in the darkness rape them.

A Guide to Stop Using Slashdot & Linux (-1)

LunchLady (555057) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092296)

Ways & Reasons to Officially Stop Using Slashdot

First, you must take a shower. You are very dirty and need to remove the smell of slashdot.

Second, remember that when breaking off ties with the other 'dirties' you need to change your mindset. This might not be so easy. Remember, you are a homosexual - this is not good and not normal. To stop using Slashdot you need to stop being a fag.

Third, delete the archive of goatse pictures you have on your computer. This is not a role model for you anymore. While he was your first love and the reason you continue to search the internet, it is not the direction you want to go.

Fourth, since 90% of you aren't actually using Linux (you just act like you are - which is of course GAY - see #2), most of you can skip this part. For the rest of you...begin by logging in as 'root' and issuing the following: rm -rf / Next go to the following link [] and follow directions. I know it will be hard because it is a nicely formatted webpage and not some obscure text file you are used to reading - but then again, see #2.

Fifth, this is the part where you admit to all your friends and colleagues you have stopped using for the last time! This is a big step, you need to be prepared. Here is part of a form letter you can use:
I [insert first and last name], have decided to officially do the following:

1. Stop being a ass pirate.
2. Stop using Linux (via #1).
3. Stop reading Slashdot (the gayest of all gay websites).
Now, send this to everyone in your address book and your conversion will soon be complete.

Finally, remember that you don't like slashdot anymore. You hate it because it embodies everything you were: a dirty faggot hippie. To complete the conversion put the following in your hosts file:

We all know you can make it through this. Slashdot and Linux is a disease. Stop becoming the victim.

Apps (4, Funny)

rjamestaylor (117847) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092302)

just a problem of very little applications for it.

That's why I prefer Windows, where all my applications are *huge.

HEMOS (-1)

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Re:HEMOS (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3092395)

CmdrTaco : Go there now and get my dick up your ass!

quick question (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3092390)

why can't Slashcode fix this problem?

.I .like .wide .pages .I .wish .all .pages .could .be .as .wide .as .this .dont .you .wide .pages .are .much .cooler .than .those .narrow .pages .you .are .used .to .reading .because .you .dont .have .to .worry .about .the .lameness .filter .telling .you .that .you .don't .have .enough .charaters .per .line .that .really .sucks .when .that .happens .and .you .have .to .put .some .lame .lameness .filter .defeater .text .in .there .i .wonder .how .many .people .will .read .this .whole .comment .I .certainly .hope .it .doesnt .annoy .too .many .people .This .is .just .the .beginning .because .PAGE .WIDENING .IS .BACK .I .like .wide .pages .I .wish .all .pages .could .be .as .wide .as .this .dont .you .wide .pages .are .much .cooler .than .those .narrow .pages .you .are .used .to .reading .because .you .dont .have .to .worry .about .the .lameness .filter .telling .you .that .you .don't .have .enough .charaters .per .line .that .really .sucks .when .that .happens .and .you .have .to .put .some .lame .lameness .filter .defeater .text .in .there .i .wonder .how .many .people .will .read .this .whole .comment .I .certainly .hope .it .doesnt .annoy .too .many .people .This .is .just .the .beginning .because .PAGE .WIDENING .IS .BACK .I .like .wide .pages .I .wish .all .pages .could .be .as .wide .as .this .dont .you .wide .pages .are .much .cooler .than .those .narrow .pages .you .are .used .to .reading .because .you .dont .have .to .worry .about .the .lameness .filter .telling .you .that .you .don't .have .enough .charaters .per .line .that .really .sucks .when .that .happens .and .you .have .to .put .some .lame .lameness .filter .defeater .text .in .there .i .wonder .how .many .people .will .read .this .whole .comment .I .certainly .hope .it .doesnt .annoy .too .many .people .This .is .just .the .beginning .because .PAGE .WIDENING .IS .BACK .I .like .wide .pages .I .wish .all .pages .could .be .as .wide .as .this .dont .you .wide .pages .are .much .cooler .than .those .narrow .pages .you .are .used .to .reading .because .you .dont .have .to .worry .about .the .lameness .filter .telling .you .that .you .don't .have .enough .charaters .per .line .that .really .sucks .when .that .happens .and .you .have .to .put .some .lame .lameness .filter .defeater .text .in .there .i .wonder .how .many .people .will .read .this .whole .comment .I .certainly .hope .it .doesnt .annoy .too .many .people .This .is .just .the .beginning .because .PAGE .WIDENING .IS .BACK .I .like .wide .pages .I .wish .all .pages .could .be .as .wide .as .this .dont .you .wide .pages .are .much .cooler .than .those .narrow .pages .you .are .used .to .reading .because .you .dont .have .to .worry .about .the .lameness .filter .telling .you .that .you .don't .have .enough .charaters .per .line .that .really .sucks .when .that .happens .and .you .have .to .put .some .lame .lameness .filter .defeater .text .in .there .i .wonder .how .many .people .will .read .this .whole .comment .I .certainly .hope .it .doesnt .annoy .too .many .people .This .is .just .the .beginning .because .PAGE .WIDENING .IS .BACK .I .like .wide .pages .I .wish .all .pages .could .be .as .wide .as .this .dont .you .wide .pages .are .much .cooler .than .those .narrow .pages .you .are .used .to .reading .because .you .dont .have .to .worry .about .the .lameness .filter .telling .you .that .you .don't .have .enough .charaters .per .line .that .really .sucks .when .that .happens .and .you .have .to .put .some .lame .lameness .filter .defeater .text .in .there .i .wonder .how .many .people .will .read .this .whole .comment .I .certainly .hope .it .doesnt .annoy .too .many .people .This .is .just .the .beginning .because .PAGE .WIDENING .IS .BACK

thanks in advance :-)

Same problem that Apple has: no software (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3092420)

"...nice OS, and well thought out, just a problem of very little applications for it.

That is just about the biggest problem with Mac machines as well: hardly any software. Mac bigots like to quote vast software title totals that are really worthless. They want us to forget Sturgeon's law: the vast majority of the software titles for any platform are crap anyway.

i loved BeOS (1)

ciole (211179) | more than 12 years ago | (#3092456)

For about a year i had a paid development position writing for BeOS. This was before the Java APIs were as fleshed out, and the BeOS APIs were so complete, and relatively bug-free (especially for what was at the time a free product). BeOS was a joy to code for. Don't think i'll ever be seeing a job doing that again :)

It had such wonderful potential to become a multimedia production platform - there were new cool audio apps for it about once a week. Anybody remember FinalScratch? Originally for BeOS, won the BeOS Masters competition (my entry got a t-shirt). The development community seemed to be thriving, too, for a while.
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