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Charmed Announces Crusoe-based Linux Wearable

timothy posted more than 12 years ago | from the gargoyles-take-heed dept.

Hardware 158

isdale writes: "Charmed Technology, founded by MIT Media Lab graduates, announced what it claims is the fastest available wearable computer -- 800Mhz Crusoe TM5800 processor. The CharmedIT comes standard with a 266 Mhz Pentium MMX for about $2k. The Crusoe upgrade costs another $500. The OS is extra ($250 for RedHat or Debian), as is the display, input device, carrying case, battery, charger, usable application ... if that isn't enough options, you can also get a DIY kit."

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Fr1st (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392146)

Fr00st Ps0000t!

Re:Fr1st (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392150)

damn i almost made it

Things to do today (-1)

on by (572414) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392490)

1. Build wearable computer

3. Profit!

fp (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392147)


And for that extra $500?.. (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392149)

You get a chip that runs as fast as the Pentium 200 MMX.

Look! I'm cool cuz I run a Transmeta backpack computer! Freaking l337 d00dz!

Wiiiiiid! (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392152)

Here's a wide page to prove it.

http://www.eveeieyhfgfcdoosammgwsnboivvbsczxlzga bc / /ooieiabdcdjsvbkeldfogjhiyeeejkagclmieooionoepdk / /abcdefmfighyiqxjklmonopqrosoyotuvwxoyqwertyuiov / /sdfghjklqewiuznmbjadzmcloeuirquakndsflksjdflkas / /fskdfasiewurznmcvweroiqewrnamdnzcvuowieramnfkas / /dfhzuxcihskjrnakjzkjcxbviusayrkajsfzxncvizudyri / /bakdnfbzkcvhgiuegriweramdnfzxlcvueirhamdnzkciue / /jranbsdmfzcowierandmfxzncbkjhfabsdifuweajzkxcuw / /erhasdfzxncvkjdfyiuzxcnvsikirkajeajsbdfkzxbuyef / /rahsdjbzcvxmnvcuweyriausdnfzxbcvkwueyrajnbvkjxg / /iwueyajdfkzxjcnbkeyriaushdfkjbzbuowrnasdkfbhuie / /asjmfnkkbyiurnakjsndfkzjbhiuwerajsknfkzbyhweiua / /dkfjbzkxvbjywekrjaskjnvzxjcweruiasdhfkzjxnsjkld / /fasoidfjalskdfasklhfxjdnmenrqoiuozxcopjgneaksjo / /nzxdkfajlsdfkljsdfoiasdfasndflzxkcvozixucoqweiu / /pwoeiruzxmncvoutyqwerizxnvmxmcnvoweurqmznxmbouw / /rmnzbkhuyrtjghanzxcvbkhgjweyriaudfbznbkweruyabz / /bcvnkdhityqhagsdfjglsieurakfsdnfbvfdsajkbiuyqwe / /kweorjasdknfbkjsdoifuzxbcmfgsltjewioahsdfnbzxcb / /heoiroaisjdfzbxckjksrhiuehadsfbzkxjcbhkeuryaksj / /fzbxcvkxlkcnvmndskfjwehaiursdfzjxnbjkdfhskdflas / /yroausdfzxmncvskeyiqozsjhfasdfoiwueranmcnzbkjhd / /ueafhksjfwheuirasdjhbzxiuewjhasmdnkfzxciurhaskj / /roiquwermcvkhiruhasdkjfnzxkjyeiuahsdbzxckjvopwe / /uqweuirjhvxzckjhweriuasydfoiqurnmxckvhweruiahdj / /znkxcvjhwierahsfzkxhhidufhsakjbzxjchiwueryqagsd / /kjhaksdfnbakwreyhaisknfjkzxbcvkoiqwueraskfzxcbk / /nlkwejrasoidjfxzlknvlkwjeroiasudflknzxlkbjeoiru / /slkdjfzxnmvkljdfawienzxveoriuaskdfjzxcmbnkseuri / /kfjlznxcvksjroeijasdklzjfowierqouasdhfzxncbkjhd / /jsdfljkweoriuasdfkjzxmcnvlkjdowuieraksdflkzxjbo / /werklasdnfmzxclkjewoijasdlfknzlkjwoeirqpweoiasd / /kjzxjvwperaksdjfxzweirjaslkdfzxnclvkjweroiasufd / /zxclkjeworijasdflknzlbkoiwuraksjflknxblkwjerois / /jfweknasdkfjzoxijkenraksjdfoizxjvlknwerlkajsdfo / /yroausdfzxmncvskeyiqozsjhfasdfoiwueranmcnzbkjhd / /ueafhksjfwheuirasdjhbzxiuewjhasmdnkfzxciurhaskj / /roiquwermcvkhiruhasdkjfnzxkjyeiuahsdbzxckjvopwe / /uqweuirjhvxzckjhweriuasydfoiqurnmxckvhweruiahdj / /znkxcvjhwierahsfzkxhhidufhsakjbzxjchiwueryqagsd / /kjhaksdfnbakwreyhaisknfjkzxbcvkoiqwueraskfzxcbk / /nlkwejrasoidjfxzlknvlkwjeroiasudflknzxlkbjeoiru / /slkdjfzxnmvkljdfawienzxveoriuaskdfjzxcmbnkseuri / /kfjlznxcvksjroeijasdklzjfowierqouasdhfzxncbkjhd / /jsdfljkweoriuasdfkjzxmcnvlkjdowuieraksdflkzxjbo / /werklasdnfmzxclkjewoijasdlfknzlkjwoeirqpweoiasd / /kjzxjvwperaksdjfxzweirjaslkdfzxnclvkjweroiasufd / /zxclkjeworijasdflknzlbkoiwuraksjflknxblkwjerois / /jfweknasdkfjzoxijkenraksjdfoizxjvlknwerlkajsdfo / /erhasdfzxncvkjdfyiuzxcnvsikirkajeajsbdfkzxbuyef / /rahsdjbzcvxmnvcuweyriausdnfzxbcvkwueyrajnbvkjxg / /iwueyajdfkzxjcnbkeyriaushdfkjbzbuowrnasdkfbhuie / /asjmfnkkbyiurnakjsndfkzjbhiuwerajsknfkzbyhweiua / /dkfjbzkxvbjywekrjaskjnvzxjcweruiasdhfkzjxnsjkld / /fasoidfjalskdfasklhfxjdnmenrqoiuozxcopjgneaksjo / /nzxdkfajlsdfkljsdfoiasdfasndflzxkcvozixucoqweiu / /pwoeiruzxmncvoutyqwerizxnvmxmcnvoweurqmznxmbouw / /rmnzbkhuyrtjghanzxcvbkhgjweyriaudfbznbkweruyabz / /bcvnkdhityqhagsdfjglsieurakfsdnfbvfdsajkbiuyqwe / /kweorjasdknfbkjsdoifuzxbcmfgsltjewioahsdfnbzxcb / /heoiroaisjdfzbxckjksrhiuehadsfbzkxjcbhkeuryaksj / /fzbxcvkxlkcnvmndskfjwehaiursdfzjxnbjkdfhskdflas / /yroausdfzxmncvskeyiqozsjhfasdfoiwueranmcnzbkjhd / /ueafhksjfwheuirasdjhbzxiuewjhasmdnkfzxciurhaskj / /roiquwermcvkhiruhasdkjfnzxkjyeiuahsdbzxckjvopwe / /uqweuirjhvxzckjhweriuasydfoiqurnmxckvhweruiahdj / /znkxcvjhwierahsfzkxhhidufhsakjbzxjchiwueryqagsd / /kjhaksdfnbakwreyhaisknfjkzxbcvkoiqwueraskfzxcbk / /nlkwejrasoidjfxzlknvlkwjeroiasudflknzxlkbjeoiru / /slkdjfzxnmvkljdfawienzxveoriuaskdfjzxcmbnkseuri / /kfjlznxcvksjroeijasdklzjfowierqouasdhfzxncbkjhd / /jsdfljkweoriuasdfkjzxmcnvlkjdowuieraksdflkzxjbo / /werklasdnfmzxclkjewoijasdlfknzlkjwoeirqpweoiasd / /kjzxjvwperaksdjfxzweirjaslkdfzxnclvkjweroiasufd / /zxclkjeworijasdflknzlbkoiwuraksjflknxblkwjerois / /jfweknasdkfjzoxijkenraksjdfoizxjvlknwerlkajsdfo / /yroausdfzxmncvskeyiqozsjhfasdfoiwueranmcnzbkjhd / /ueafhksjfwheuirasdjhbzxiuewjhasmdnkfzxciurhaskj / /roiquwermcvkhiruhasdkjfnzx/

Re:Wiiiiiid! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392252)

The page won't load. Has it been /.ed?

Re:Wiiiiiid! (1)

rusty0101 (565565) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392287)

Or has the host carrier gone and crashed for the night? I mean I would hate to think that someone /.'ed a wearable computer. Wouldn't that make it luggable?


hi! (0)

hettb (569863) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392154)

thank you!

Prices please? (3, Funny)

Rampant Atrocity (559341) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392161)

The Crusoe upgrade costs another $500. The OS is extra ($250 for RedHat or Debian)

*cough* *sputter*

Re:Prices please? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392180)

*cough* *sputter*

How insightful of you to say that!

Re:Prices please? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392687)

*cough* *cough* *Hahck* Atchoo!

Re:Prices please? (2)

56ker (566853) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392188)

I wonder how (thinking of the market this is aimed at) they think they can get away with prices like that!

Re:Prices please? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392262)

It's physicaly imposable to install an OS on the bloody thing (unless it's been "blessed").

Re:Prices please? (4, Informative)

tenman (247215) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392493)

Note: I reply here because I looked down the threads, and there are no real answers to the "who would buy this" questions

Before you go any further, realize that this device is built for commercial applications. This is for a nurse that needs to know who and where all of her critical care beds are. This is for the contruction worker that is out on side, and can look at the land and see a 3D outline of the building and can punch the earth in the right spots. Devices like this could even be good for museums who want to give ppl an interactive tour.

The only people who would buy a box like this are the people who can use these boxes to make (or save) money with them.

Also note, that in the 70's few really saw the use of having a whole floor of your building dedicated to bulky computer, and almost nobody could afford one.

Think about this as you read all the I337 H4z0r'z post about "who would buy..."

Re:Prices please? (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392256)

The Crusoe upgrade costs another $500. The OS is extra ($250 for RedHat or Debian)

According to Netcraft [] 90% of Linux users use Linux because it's free.

At $250 for this copy of of linux I wonder of those 90% will go back to using a real OS like Win2k.

Re:Prices please? (1)

copyconstructor (124033) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392397)

Well, I guess the first buyer would be the only one to pay 250$, as the source would be freely available after that (assuming the first buyer put up a mirror for it that is). That is what GPL means, is it not?

Re:Prices please? (1, Flamebait)

awptic (211411) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392294)

I didn't see any mention of an external media drive (cdrom, floppy, etc.), I think they get away with it by just making it extremely hard to install anything... pretty sleezy if you ask me.

Re:Prices please? (2)

56ker (566853) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392478)

The only thing similar I remember was when I bought a harddrive by credit card over the phone they wanted me to pay an extra £6 for the OS to be installed on it.

Re:Prices please? (2)

pb (1020) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392606)

So? Install it yourself, then.

People are willing to pay for convenience, but maybe not that much. :)

Hey kids.... (2, Funny)

Ooblek (544753) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392162)

Be the first kid on your block to blow $2500 on this ultra cool wearable PC! Not only will you really look like a geek, but everyone will know who to talk to for some extra gas and grocery money! For an additional $15k, you can get the Honda walking robot docking station and play Ultraman with your friends in your front yard. (Turbo Jet and wing kit for robot sold seperately.)

Re:Hey kids.... (0)

hettb (569863) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392173)

Be the first kid on your block to blow $2500 on this ultra cool wearable PC! Not only will you really look like a geek, but everyone will know who to talk to for some extra gas and grocery money! For an additional $15k, you can get the Honda walking robot docking station and play Ultraman with your friends in your front yard. (Turbo Jet and wing kit for robot sold seperately.)

??? Geeks don't have any friends!!!1!

Re:Hey kids.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392201)

Oh, damn. Sorry, I forgot.

If you had Ultraman, you wouldn't need any friends. Just whip him out when Godzilla comes walking down the street.

I bet nobody remembers Ultraman.

Re:Hey kids.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392292)

I do! He was my favorite to watch when I was about 5 or 6. That was way cool!

Re:Hey kids.... (1)

flollywebfrog (462849) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392285)

I remember the envy and hate my fourth-grade friends directed towards me when I was the first kid with Reebok Pumps...The first day I wore them to P.E., they left the field covered with intentional scuffs and mud-prints

I am glad to be grown-up now and can be "wearable-ist in the closet." Who knows what fourth-graders will do to the modern-nerd.

Re:Hey kids.... (2, Funny)

l810c (551591) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392617)

Who knows what fourth-graders will do to the modern-nerd.

Hold him down and upload a virus?

Re:Hey kids....(can i put my penis in your ear?) (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392383)

Troll hunters may soon be cheering, as the Canadian government intends to pass a bill removing trolls from the endangered species list, and making them legal to hunt.

This Northern Canadian Spotted Troll eyes the photographer with suspicion, ready to attack if he moves any closer.

Trolls have been protected by the Endangered Magical Creatures Act, passed in 1958, when only an estimated 300 breeding pairs of Northern Spotted Trolls were estimated to be still in the wild. Since then an active captive breeding program and strict anti-hunting legislation have allowed several sub-species to rebound.

Now with numbers in the thousands, altercations with humans are becoming more common. Also, the expansion of human habitation threatens traditional troll territories, and confrontations are inevitable.

"Everyone likes to see trolls in the wild," said Ed Thunter, a senior officer of the Wildlife Management Branch of the Federal Ministry of Peculiar Animals, "but no one wants them in their backyard."

"Unfortunately, once a troll smells human blood they usually camp out nearby and then people start getting killed and eaten. Nature is funny that way."

Ed Thunter should know. His job includes shooting troublesome trolls with a tranquilizer rifle and relocating the creatures to the barren wastes, far from humans, and hopefully far from trouble.

"There are several sub-species that trouble people along the Rockies," said Ed. "There are the common cave trolls who prefer to inhabitat holes dug into the rock and then venture out to hunt, and then there are the rare bridge trolls. In the wild they live in streams under rotting logs, but they can easily adapt to living under bridges or even in culverts. They will stay hidden coming out to grab prey that walks right over their heads. Those ones are really dangerous."

"They seem particularly attracted to fat German tourists," said Ed, shaking his head, "although they also seem to like environmentalists. I think it may be the teal and purple fleece and Goretex. In those cases we don't mind having their numbers thinned...the environmentalists I mean."

The proposed bill will initially open a hunting season of three months in the Fall, and will be run by lottery.

"It seems some days like there are a lot of these creatures out here," said Ed, "but their recovery is still quite fragile. I'm worried that a legal hunt on them will open the floodgates of poaching. There are a lot of people in rural areas who just see trolls as a nuisance."

Despite the hunting ban for the past 44 years, there has always been a market for trolls shot by poachers.

Troll organs are valuable to some traditional mainland Chinese, who will pay vast sums on the black market for the bladder and other bits of offal. The bladder is believed to aid in the production of sperm and improve virility. Others say that it make your feces turn to stone.

"When I was a young man, living just outside of Jasper, we would shoot trolls for sport," said one ex-poacher, who spoke on the condition of anonymity. "Their hides weren't worth much, and they were pretty slow and easy to shoot--as long as you could spot them. Sometimes you could come up to a group of them arguing on the best way to cook Eskimos. Once we realized there was money to be made on selling their guts and stuff, I used to supplement my part-time paving job with knocking off a few trolls."

"You had to be careful though," he continued, "I lost my brother when his shotgun misfired, and an angry troll crushed his skull with an oak branch."

Both hunters and wildlife management personnel agree that the way to find trolls is to look for where they live.

"You look for their signs of habitation," said Ed. "Things like heavy iron cooking pots, wooden cages, and piles of human bones. They especially like gnawing on the femurs, so if I see a few of them broken up and scattered around the fire pit I know I've found a nest."

The aboriginal peoples call the trolls I'naq'wa, "giant rats with clubs".

Hmmm... (1)

NickRob (575331) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392175)

Well... first of all, it causes a lot of problems when it rains and you don't have an umbrella.
However, it is perfect for 802.11b hunting!

Gaping Anus (-1)

Mao Zedong (467890) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392178)

Hello, there is a gaping anus:


Re:Gaping Anus (-1, Offtopic)

hettb (569863) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392206)

Hello, there are German history sources:

here. []

Enquiring minds want to know . . . (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392345)

why you bothered to obsfucate the goatse link when you clearly announced it as such in the message ?

Re:Enquiring minds want to know . . . (-1) guy (224089) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392583)

He did it as a tribute to me, you moron! To my brown eye in the sky!!

Re:Enquiring minds want to know . . . (-1)

Mao Zedong (467890) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392608)

You speak truths sir.

Reminder of Osbourne (3, Insightful)

standards (461431) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392184)

For some reason, this very much reminds me of the old Osborne "portable" computer.

At the time, it was pretty darn cool. But soon we laughed hard at the people who bought one.

See Osborne History []

Re:Reminder of Osbourne (1)

GenCuster (121609) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392497)

My very first computer was a handme down osborne. Nice machine. The keyboard cliped onto the case. Truely awesoem. Nice link thanks.

Re:Reminder of Osbourne (1)

Quirk (36086) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392660)

I had totally forgotten but the Osborne. I had the 1 tonne portable Compaq. BTW: is your sig meant to quote 'F' Nietzsche ?

Finally. (3, Interesting)

Soko (17987) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392190)

Here's an OEM that shows the true cost of Windows 2000. Directly beneath the RedHat price is the price of Windows 2000 pre-loaded - $450, which means it's $200 more.

This is likely an off-the-shelf, non OEM price (since our Redmond frinds aren't too kind to PC makers who don't feature thier OS exclusively)

Nice to see.


Re:Finally. (0, Troll)

Chemical (49694) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392311)

I don't think so. A full version of Windows 2000 costs $300. They are charging you $150 to install an operating system. Shit, they charge you $250 for Debian, something they didn't even pay for. What a scam. Especially considering OEM computer makers use images and can image a new computer in like 10 minutes. I don't know how they can justify any of their prices.

Let's see... They charge $2000 for 266Mhz computer (I don't care how small it is), $250/$450 for the OS, and other assorted unreasonable prices for the other accessories, and their web site sucks? Can we say Fucked Company [] ?

Re:Finally. (1)

MADCOWbeserk (515545) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392553)

It is rather high for an OS install. Microsoft's OEM price is $129 that is for you or I. Pricewatch

Re:Finally. (1)

MADCOWbeserk (515545) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392564)

Wrong button.. link 39j46rg615&id=450 Linux with manuals and box is rarely over 60 bucks. Any system builder either images or scripts the install so this is rather high. Seems to me like anyone buying these doodads is rather profiecient and is willing to put it on themselves especially to save a couple hundred bucks. So any installation fee over $50 is too high

Charmed? (3, Funny)

Nathdot (465087) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392195)

Charmed Announces Crusoe-based Linux Wearable???

I liked the episode last season better, where the three sisters fought the Gnu Debian C# compiler.


Re:Charmed? (0)

Swix (456262) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392211)

Does this make Coal Bill Gates? With his minions of 'shared-source' programmers?

Yeah, but how much does it weigh? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392198)

With all that gear it'd be like strapping a Desktop PC to your back.

slow (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392199)

why is the site so slow? slashcode bugs again?

what a steal! (0, Flamebait)

i like your eyes (571086) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392210)

$2,000 for a 266 Mhz Pentium MMX Processor Board ?? Wow that's what I paid for mine in 1998. Can't believe prices haven't risen... Must be because the OS isn't included.

Re:what a steal! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392547)

Perhaps this was a JOKE

$250 for Redhat or Debian!? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392212) -- it is much cheaper to get it from their. Might as well donate the $250 to them instead.

They don't have a chance (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392219)

If I could buy a mess of these, throw them into a pile, and create a Beowulf cluster, I could see a future in this product. But I can't, so it's doomed.

Okay, I'll say it... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392231)

These people are idiots.

mit gets it right (1)

christfokkar (575436) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392236)

It's obvious why half of the fundamental computing technologies have come from MIT. They set high standards, their solutions are elegant, and they always stay ahead of the curve.

They set up their wearable computing lab seven or eight years ago already. They were patient and the market came to them. Now they are reaping the rewards. Kudos to MIT, another job well done.

Re:mit gets it right (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392273)

You, being the only person to post anything positive about this company, MIT, and its products, must be a troll. How else can you explain your slavish drooling over this 5 year old piece of crap?

While we're at it, care to list the "half of the fundamental computing technologies" that MIT produced? Does this claim fall into the 83% of statistics that are made up on the spot?

Re:mit gets it right (2)

notsoanonymouscoward (102492) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392705)

I wouldn't characterize them as idiots... just perhaps a bit un innovative. Yes I know thats a horrible thing for lil old me to say about a bunch of seemingly amazing MIT grads. But ya know, they're still using some backwards ass stuff. Wheres the new gear? Wheres the new applications?! Show me the killer apps that these wearables would use. Show me something thats changed in the last few years other than adding a new cpu option. And what about this nanix stuff? Where is it? I couldn't find any place to download it. Everyone seems to know about the blurb... so where is it? So often it seems like people start drifting off into their own little world, and fail to see where things are going and fail to remember that innovation is the key. Especially when it comes to technology, if you stop, you're a market has been.

this thing is worthless (1)

kochsr (144988) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392238)

umm... who is ACTUALLY going to pay 2500 dollars for a piece of crap computer just so they can wear it? if someone wants to make these things mainstream, they have to be somewhat affordable. how much R&D can there possibly freakin be?!? i refuse to believe that the parts come anywhere close to being this expensive.

Re:this thing is worthless (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392295)

Well, you could start with this $999 [] HMD and go buy a low-end $1109 [] laptop, and buy $400 of tech support to set it all up.

Whopsie daisy, looks like we've broken the bank.

Re:this thing is worthless (-1)

on by (572414) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392602)

Stop being such a Jew.

$6,870?!?!?! No way in hell... (1)

Saeculorum (547931) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392275)

Let's see here...

$1995 for the basic board.

$1500 for the EveryDay Use Bundle (it includes Linux, so no $250 charge for a free OS, and I'd like to be able to use the computer for more than 2 hours)

$875 for the TM5800 (I'm not going back to a 266 mhz processor and I'd like to be able to listen to my MP3s with this thing)

$2500 for the CO-3 monitor (so I can actually see what I'm doing)

That'd be a bit expensive for something that's not even as powerful as a laptop. I don't think it's even as useful - those Twiddlers are confusing (I've tried), and I doubt a 1" high screen would be particularly easy to focus on when it's 1 inch away from your eye.

If I really wanted all that, why not just get a Xybernaut poma [] for $1499?

Re:$6,870?!?!?! No way in hell... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392382)

Uhmmm did you notice that the Xybernaut was just a risc based processor running WinCe If all you want is WinCe for 1499, I'll sell you a pocketpc for that :)

Whereas with this (albeit pricey) device we can run anything linux based or if need be windows based.

Re:$6,870?!?!?! No way in hell... (1)

red_gnom (545555) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392459)

How about OQO [] for $1000

Transmeta Powered High-End Portable []

plus Head Mounted Display?

Re:$6,870?!?!?! No way in hell... (2)

Chris Pimlott (16212) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392710)

$875 for the TM5800 (I'm not going back to a 266 mhz processor and I'd like to be able to listen to my MP3s with this thing)

266 mhz is more than adequate for MP3s. I used to have a Libretto 50 with a P75 that did a perfectly good job using mpg123.

$250 for linux? (1, Troll)

interstellar_donkey (200782) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392284)

And for that matter, $450 for Win2k?

Something about that just does'nt sit right. Red hat or Debian typically install with ease.. so does this mean that the hardware is so tricky and propritary they feel they need to charge $250 just to get the thing to work?

Or are the marketing people just on something.

Why not.... (3, Interesting)

pennsol (317791) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392286)

Put one of these in your pocket i'm sure it will run your favorite flavor of *nix and it's half the price..with the docking station...

Re:Why not.... (1)

mlk (18543) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392514)

Why not just stick Linux [ [] ](or BSD [lost the URL] ) on a Psion [ [] ].
They are out NOW, low in price and come with a keyboard! :)

Re:Why not.... (1)

pennsol (317791) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392548)

Good thinking..but i was trying to justify the high cost vs. hardware that you get.. as seeing that the latest and greatest in small portable computers is half the price of this..whatever it is they're trying to pawn off as a real computer.. 266 pentium..just doesn't seem right...

Linux on a Cappuccino... (1)

mr_clem (155428) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392709)

I hate to say it, but we've all talked about this before... why not the Cappuccino?
I know the DC in makes it a problem, but it'd be great for a ultraportable computer. (possibly wearable)...

This'll be great... (1)

Any Web Loco (555458) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392288)

...when i get stranded on a desert island. does it come w/ girl friday?

Zaurus (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392290)

So, I'm thinking one's money might be better spent on a zaurus at this point. Sure, it doesn't have a heads up display, or a twiddler, but if those turn out to be truely useful input devices, I'm sure one of us will hack them to work for the zaurus. I'd like to see some compelling use cases.

haha (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392306)

airport securities would love to have a chat w/ u... :)

mit is death (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392308)

i went to mit and i fucking hated that place. most people are smart enough to avoid it, but every once in a while an innocent kid like me falls for the hype that mit is the best teaching institution in the world, and gets the shaft straight up the ass.

mit is a chaotic place, full of otherwise-intelligent people who could never agree to move a sofa, let alone write an operating system or stratificate into an army for world change. it's a clone farm of supermen who can't tie their own shoes. it's an utter human waste.

linux programmers at mit? never met one. mit people think they are too good for linux, they are too good for everything. but as a result, they never learn to do anything at all. meanwhile the kids at state schools are whipping out device drivers like it's nothing. so much for that top-tier education.

i lost the best years of my life to that place, and in recognition of that fact, today i would gladly hit an mit dork in the face with a baseball bat rather than give him the time of day. and if you look at the way mit dorks are treated by their managers in the workplace, it's pretty clear that this contempt is universal.

mit dorks should be wiped from the face of the earth. let our kids grow up happy and strong, queer and hippify them no longer!

Sufferring in private (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392315)

Thank god someone else feels the same way. I've felt that way for a while, too.

Re:Sufferring in private (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392379)

Thank god someone else feels the same way. I've felt that way for a while, too.

Great, lets meet in chatroom, exchange pics, elevate to voice, beat up some dorks and have wild sex. Jeez man, why are you so coy about it? This is the 2k2, get with the program. Male relationships know no bounds.

Re:mit is death (0, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392526)

As someone who went to MIT for four years, I would like to second this post.

I worked hard, destroyed my health, (only recently lost enough weight that I can start running twice a week again . . . pathetic) and had no social life. If I had gone to a state university, I would have been able to take more of the classes I liked and could have afforded to stay an extra year if necessary to learn what I thought was important -- I wanted to learn Russian and Hebrew in addition to all the technical stuff, for example. But instead I was stuck struggling to pack it all into four years because the damn place is so expensive. I completed all the requirements for the 6-3 degree, and didn't get the degree because a professor rejected the final project/AUP/thesis thing. I got a job in Boston just to be able to stay around the re-write it my spare time, and the guy kept wanting more work out of me, and screwed up an attempt to take an institute lab in my spare time by getting caught doing a lot of traveling for work. Finally I left the place, but where I live now rent is so cheap, and no income tax, that I have more take-home pay on just about half the salary.

I've moved to a big state university town since then. The kids I meet who are in this college are more balenced, and most of the time smarter (but not intensely obsessive about things) than the kids at MIT. I feel happier the more interaction I have with non-MIT people. When I meet MIT people in the course of work, it seems half of them are kind of recovering like me and half are bitterly hated by everyone they interact with.

I have made several career choices in order to make sure I do not have to meet or work with MIT people any more. Among these was a conscious decision to give up lisp, the best way to program there is, but lisp people seem like the worst of MITers even when they are not from MIT. Read Erik Naggum's posts on comp.lang.lisp if you need a striking example. In all fairness, it's not just MIT people, I treat anyone from the northeast, a big school, or jewish as having two strikes against them until they prove they are real people. Only lawyers have more constantly been sub-human than people from MIT.

As for the MIT Media lab, they are a different sort of dispicable character. They seem to be focused on selling the reputation of the rest of MIT for their own gain. They take a corporate donor, wave a bunch of smoke and mirrors and invoke the MIT reputation, get money, and then when the guys finally realize that all they are doing is hooking up random junk to each other about and then hyping it in the most oily dot-com style, they toss that donor and search out more. They had a wearable computer FASION SHOW. Nuff said.

If you are a high school student considering going to MIT, here's what you should do. Find an MIT alumni to talk to who is not a member of the any of the alumni clubs or shit (that means hooking up with them outside of MIT's recruiting, which is hard.) Ask them to look you right in the eye, and say "if you did it all over again, would you go to MIT again ?"

A large portion will have to admit the answer is no. They will point out that their experience wasn't totally bad, etc, but on the balence, they would have gone to a good state school. (A factoid often quoted is that MIT alumni contribute proportionally less than all the other high-reputation places to their school; I think this is only partly due to the fact that a lot of them viciously hate the place, and more related to the fact that the demographic of MITers is more middle class than the likes of Harvard, Princeton, etc.)

I look forward to discriminating again MIT people in jobs and any other way (I'm buying some rental property in the next year or so, no MITers will rent my place) for the rest of my life. I'm still trying to give northeasterners and jews a fair shake in the interest of an equal society and all that, but MITers are right out.

Re:mit is death (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392556)

This ought to be an Ask /.

I went to Georgetown University and can't complain at all about the school, except that the CS department was severely neglected. While they've got some top-notch professors (Mahe, Squier, Denning to name a few), the facilities are sorely lacking.

GU is one of the schools that you'd find alums encouraging people to attend. The breadth of subjects that can be broached there is excellent and the city itself (DC) is interesting in its own right.

The downside is that it's fairly expensive, much more than a state school. A good alternative in the DC area is George Washington which is just down the street. Certainly not as prestigious as GU, but a very good school in its own right.

For CS in DC, try Howard, but as a historically black university, the vast majority of pasty white CS geeks would stand out like a sore thumb.

Re:mit is death (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392663)

GU is one of the schools that you'd find alums encouraging people to attend.

That's not surprising, considering that DC is one of the most livable, well-rounded cities in the nation. Unlike the west coast, where there tends to be a rampant hedonism, east coast cities tend to be progressive, enlightened, and civic-oriented. DC, as our capital, is surely the best example of this.

Question (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392323)

If I overclock it, will it help keeps me warm next winter?

I can't tell you how cool this guy is (1)

Dancin_Santa (265275) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392331)

Just look at his picture [] .

Re:I can't tell you how cool this guy is (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392531)

Like Batman - but more bat-like.

This is cheaper (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392332)

Take this and drink
©1995 Pan Productions
In the Beginning...

Professor Pan was a normal guy until a friend talked him into trying an experimental "smart drug" imported from Switzerland. This drug, known as "Male-X" was touted as an intelligence enhancer, mood elevator, confidence builder, and, most interestingly, a sex-enhancer. Since the good Professor had been a little down-in-the-dumps, and his friend seemed so vibrant, healthy and successful, he agreed to give it a try.
"It just takes a single drop," his friend said. "Keep it refrigerated and a bottle will last you six months."

That night Professor Pan added a drop of the mail-order pharmaceutical to his National Bohemian beer and invited his girlfriend, Chloe, over to his apartment. They had wild jungle sex until 4 a.m., when they were both too sore and tired to go at it again.

"What the hell's gotten into you?" Chloe asked.
Professor Pan winked, but said nothing.
While rooting through the refrigerator the next morning, Chloe found the Male-X hidden behind a jar of cherries. She smiled wickedly
Chloe returned bright and perky the next evening with a bottle of wine. While the Professor was taking a pee, she poured 1/4 of the bottle of Male-X into his wine glass and then, hoping to spend the weekend mostly horizontal, poured another 1/4 of the bottle. She laughed to herself, replacing the bottle in the back of the fridge.
When the Professor returned, she held out her glass in a toast. "To whatever lusty demon crawled into you last night," she said. They clinked classes. "Amen to that," Professor Pan said. He drank his wine.
Within minutes, the Professor felt a rush of lust. His eyes dilated. "Let's get naked," he grunted, pulling off his shorts. Chloe hurriedly pulled her t-shirt over her head and slid out of her jeans. He had never seen anything so beautiful--Chloe seemed to be shining with a supernatural light. His vision was seemingly magnified and enhanced--he found himself staring into her pores, her cells, then backing out to look at her as she changed. She metamorphosed before his eyes, her breasts swelling, growing fantastically large, her hips expanding outward. Her body had begun to balloon into a figure 8, with a small head and legs tapering down to almost nonexistent feet. Chloe's face was tiny and featureless. Am I having some kind of flashback? wondered the Professor. But he was feeling far too good to worry about his state of mind. When Chloe climbed on top of him, he felt like his entire body was ready to shatter into a million little pleasurable supernovas.
The first spasm hit him like an electric shock. The force of his twitching threw Chloe off him and onto the floor. An intense pain wracked his head, and he began screaming. A sudden crack! filled his ears and white light blinded his eyes.
Chloe screamed. "Your head! Your head!"
The Professor, reeling, touched the top of his head.
Something--somethings--were growing there. They were hard. Kind of pointy...
The second wave threw him from the couch. Pain shot through his feet and exploded. He screamed wordlessly. He looked down and saw that his feet had warped, twisted, and become nubby--like hooves. Hair was sprouting out of his skin, thick and coarse.
Chloe had gone silent. She was huddled by the door, terrified.
Professor Pan shook violently again, then slumped against the coffee table. For a moment the room was silent except for Chloe's gasps. Professor Pan's eyes opened and he looked at Chloe--the radiant, archetypal, beautifully misshapen goddess/woman that she had become--and felt a rumbling force rising within him. Color exploded into radiant tadpoles in front of his eyes and he felt all of his soul, all of his being, coalescing into a swirling, white-hot ball of plasma between his legs.
Chloe began screaming, and ran down the apartment stairs when she saw the look in the Professor's eyes. He was no longer the sweet, somewhat melancholy nerd she'd grown to love--he had somehow morphed into a horned, devilish looking,lust-driven beast.
As she ran off into the dark city street, she could hear the clip-clop of his hooves on the asphalt, and his maniacal laughter, approaching from the distance.

Expensive Gadgets (1)

regnuj (516354) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392340)

Yes!!!! One more expensive thing to wear around and end up breaking in one odd way or another. You have got to love this stuff....its great!!!!

Never seen a more poorly designed thing (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392348)

Do you power it by sticking the cord up your ass?
Figures MIT guys would come up with this crap -
only _they_ would use it.

Re:Never seen a more poorly designed thing (1)

christfokkar (575436) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392412)

Figures MIT guys would come up with this crap

Bullshit, MIT is elite. You must be missing something, because if you could pack a micro-atx motherboard into a duffel bag, plug in some pci cards and hook it up to some car batteries, then you would certainly be working at this world-renowned institution right now. You disdain proves my point qed. MIT is #1 in engineering, everybody knows this.

Re:Never seen a more poorly designed thing (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392440)

It must be difficult for you to type your posts with all those MIT guys' dicks in your mouth.

Re:Never seen a more poorly designed thing (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392554)

Who sticks the cord in the what now?

Why do this..? (3, Interesting)

zeno_2 (518291) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392374)

From what I can see this is a company that is just starting up. This thing that they are selling, in my opinion, is pretty overpriced. With the money that it took to buy all the accessories, you could probably make yourself for cheaper. I hope they do well, but I don't see the masses of people buying any of those, let along a single person.

I would do something like this:

Make a wearable computer for lets say.. people that stock large amounts of stuff in warehouses. Would be pretty handy to have the full inventory at the press of a button, without having to look away. Make a few of these units, approach some large company who have a lot of these workers, and see if you can get a few of them to use it for a few days to see if its useful. It probably will, or they didn't make it right. Do this to a few different companies/different markets, and you have quite a base of users out there, and you then market it to the public, using the above examples of how good it works.

I read thru their website a bit, didn't really see much of any of that going on. Like I said, I hope they do well, but I don't think they are doing it right if they want it to take off..

Re:Why do this..? (1)

christfokkar (575436) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392457)

From what I can see this is a company that is just starting up. This thing that they are selling, in my opinion, is pretty overpriced.

Actually, this research team has been around in some form for about twelve years. Early prototypes were too heavy to lift and needed to be carted around. They had an operating range limited by the length of cable, usually about 500 feet, and they had some satellite proof-of-concept. They kept at it, though, and the current product, whatever its faults, is a viable commercial product. You probably shouldn't pick faults unless you are willing to put in that kind of effort yourself. What has the last dozen years of your life produced other than worthless Slashdot trolling?

Re:Why do this..? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392668)

Better yet... floor traders. Instead of running about getting orders from the booth clerk, have orders queue up on the wearable, and confirmations could be entered right there. This is of course assuming that they already don't have this :)

baa! (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392381)

timothy! you FUCK will dunn goats!

Yeah, OK, (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392389)

but I'd still 'do' Ricki Lake. She's cute. Bouncy.

Things to do (-1, Troll)

Metrollica (552191) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392391)

1. Rent movie about mean headmaster spanking bare bottoms of naughty boys at private Britain school.

2. See doctor. Get arm up ass surgically removed.

Is this paid placement? (1)

JumpinJohnny (124823) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392449)

This is one of those ads that's supposed to look like news, isn't it? It just doesn't seem newsworthy enough.

Just keep the fashion shows coming.. (1)

kyoorius (16808) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392452)

I thought Infocharms/CharmedIT, with their cyber-fashion shows, was basically a brilliant excuse for hot models to get close with technogeeks ;) Hrm, I guess every company has to put out a product or two to keep the VC money flowing, and if that's what it takes to retain those models, so be it!

I'm looking forward to the bluetooth G-string and PDA bra (under-wireless of course)in the next show. Keep them coming!

Obsolete no more! (1)

dewboy (22280) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392453)

I've got an old Pentium 266 MMX that I've been using as a server (running OpenBSD)... If you had asked me, aside from use to me, how much it was worth, I'd have said no more than $50, and that's for the new power supply in it.

Thanks to the boys from the Media Lab for giving my computer a new pricetag. All I have to do is fit this puppy into a smaller box. =)

Wearable Computers don't have to be weird (1)

DonaldP (243501) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392460)

I'd like to post the text of a link I have on one of my sites called "What my wearable computer is (and isn't) that may help dispel some preconceptions. Not all of the ideas I have listed below are unique to me - some are mine, some were also conceived by others, and some are taken from people far more intelligent and insightful than I.

What my Wearable Computer Is (and Isn't)

I am developing a device I call the PIASYS (pie' AH sis), or Personal Intelligence Augmentation SYStem. It is a specialized Wearable Computer.

When most people hear the term "Wearable Computer", they usually picture things like big ugly head-mounted displays [] , cumbersome input methods [] (including voice control), bulky hardware [] , and of course, just plain looking too "different" [] (or as described on Slashdot [] : "like a borg reject").

So, there are plenty of preconceptions about wearable computers.

However, the PIASYS has neither a mouse nor a keyboard. Neither does it use voice recognition as its primary interface. The only input is a few conveniently-located buttons (on a ring, a pen, etc). The screen is embedded in a pair of sunglasses, superimposing the computer's output onto the "Real World". A video camera accompanies the display in the glasses. The hardware all fits into a small package, easily worn under clothing. In fact, it's not obvious a person wearing the PISYS is in fact wearing or even using a computer.

Does it replace a "Real" computer? No. Why? Because the PIASYS does mostly totally different things than a desktop system. And for good reason. The PIASYS is not made to allow you to write code on the bus, or to use a CAD program in the park (though you could do these things if you wanted). The PIASYS is instead intended to enhance those abilities we already have and use in our everyday lives. It helps you see, it helps you remember, it helps you memorize, and it helps you think more efficiently (just as a calculator helps you do math more efficiently). And most importantly, it is private. The data, unless explicitly shared, is no one's but yours.

The PIASYS is designed around two core concepts. First, my concept of "Personal Intelligence", and secondly the concept of "Intelligence Augmentation". It is the idea of having a system available to you that is both personal and private, and designed to greatly enhance your ability to gather, store, and recall useful news, information, and resources (intelligence) pertaining to you and your personal space.Also, it serves as an additional "brain", offering the brute force computational ability of a computer at your fingertips, as well as the resources of the Internet, and the resources of other people (whom you can connect to and confer with via the PIASYS or similar wearable system).

For example, the PIASYS effects a great enhancement of personal intelligence by being able to perform such tasks as:

Face Recognition

Intelligent Reminder Management

Navigation Aiding

Retroactive Recording of Audio and Video

Instant Messaging

Providing a limited (and sometimes literal) Photographic Memory

Providing realtime Reference Materials

Allowing Live Collaborative Conferencing

That's only a few of the immense possibilities.

So, without a mouse or keyboard - how does one "use" the PIASYS? The short answer is that it mostly uses itself. It is designed not to be used like a desktop computer, but rather to sit in the background, quietly assisting you in whatever ELSE you may be doing, rather than requiring you to spend your time interfacing to IT.

In practical terms, the PIASYS uses environmental and contextual factors as most of it's input. The rest is supplied in the form of commands or confirmations by the user. A few simple buttons are sufficient to allow the user to tell the PIASYS what to do in any given situation.

Some functions require explicit input (commands). For example, imagine someone has just told you a name and phone number. You could (with a simple button click) tell your PIASYS to "record video and audio from five seconds ago" immediately after hearing the needed information -- which could then serve as a reminder. You could do a similar recording of an event that has already happened in other circumstances: after witnessing an accident, after dealing with an official you suspect may change his or her story, or after seeing or hearing something especially interesting.

Other inputs are implicit, rather than explicit. Your PIASYS may automatically record recent events after your pulse rises sharply, for example. A video or audio or textual reminder may be presented automatically once you have reached a certain location. Or when you see a certain object, or a certain person (Face Recognition).

A simple input from the user (like clicking his or her ring) can serve as confirmation, rather than command. For example, the PIASYS can record every direction change you take as you are travelling, then ask if you would like them replayed to retrace your steps when it detects you may be lost (which it may infer by your uncertain movements).

The point is that the PIASYS is not a desktop replacement - nor is it even a desktop contender. It is a computer, but with a completely different purpose: to help you in your everyday life and allow you more control over yourself, your data, and your private space -- not less.

For more information about the issues I attempt to address with the PIASYS (as well as other solutions), visit the Philosophy [] links here at Man-Machines.

Some good information can also be had from Professor Steve Mann's "Cyborg - Digital Destiny and Human Possibility in the Age of the Wearable Computer" [] .


Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392517)


Sad day ... Stephen King dead at 54 (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392555)

I just heard some sad news on talk radio - Horror/Sci Fi writer Stephen King was found dead in his Maine home this morning. There weren't any more details. I'm sure everyone in the Slashdot community will miss him - even if you didn't enjoy his work, there's no denying his contributions to popular culture. Truly an American icon.

Xfree86 Going Commerical and Subscription based (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392592)


I just came from BSDCon02, and wondered why no one has mentioned this here on /. If you've seen the XFree86 [] webpage lately, you'd notice the realy weird "Commerical Products -- comming soon" and etc. Well what's happening is that Xfree86 is being converted into a corporation (yes yes... I think they are currently an Inc), and guess what! They will be giving the source free, but pre compiled binaries would cost 2 dollars a pop. And if you have some exotic hardware you want xfree86 ported on, hehe, it would cost a lot. So where is this headed? Also, btw, they are going to close the cvs (for stability reasons they say), but you can subscribe to the cvs for 1 dollar per 100 MB (not bad?).

What do you guys think of this? About everthing we know that's not GPL going commerical at some point (even the ones that we thought were GPL ... oh Divx fsckerS?)

One more thing I just remembered, under this the advanced driver modes.. Xv.. blah blah would cost (they are trying to modulize those that arnt already as well). But, the basic core would still be free. And the price is not a set price, it's all subscription based just like m$

Re:Xfree86 Going Commerical and Subscription based (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392707)

Was there. Like Theo's speach BTW. And also, this is why people should use GPL rather than all those prehistoric licences that can be revoked and played around without notice. It's a sad case that Xfree86 is going commerical, that was one of my fav non commerican endevours! I guess now only Linux kernel is left... and debian. Anyway, this should be good, people would get out of the couches and make some good GPled free graphical systems (maybe even a 3d one?)

Re:Xfree86 Going Commerical and Subscription based (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392713)

So the truth comes out. You only like the GPL because it gets you stuff for free.

Crackpot (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392629)

This guy is a crackpot... Apple is not a bunch of devil worshipers, communist, pagans or atheists. Look at the color scheme!!!! They're obviously gay!

There are better things to spend money on (1)

Hyperfrog (575345) | more than 12 years ago | (#3392654)

[This comment for MT readers [] only! :) ]

I'd rather have a better PS2 pherpherial [] myself.

Charmed, welcome to the Land of Wearable Patents! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#3392688)

Xybernaut [] owns nearly all of the significant patents in the Wearable Computing area. Perhaps it's the patent royalties that are causing Charmed to have such high prices (can't just be economies of scale...)
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