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Toshiba's iPod Competitor

timothy posted more than 11 years ago | from the mmmm-competition dept.

Hardware 395

a lonely moose writes: "It looks like Toshiba basically copied Apple's iPod. They got cheap on screen size and unit weight, and without iTunes, it'll be darn hard to handle as elegantly as the iPod. Anyway, check out MacCentral's article and the smoking forum at the bottom."

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395 comments

NERDS! (-1)

Jon Katz on Tuesday (578508) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724110)

It just seemed so right!

You Open Sores Hippies

First for CLIT!

ur stupid cljt suks @ss (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724163)


You Suq!!!!


wtf is wrong with u gey trolls have u had too many djcks up ur @ss or something? go get a life fhucking qeers

i bet u dont really have a cljt u probably just have a really small djck w/ 2 really small bhalls

FROM THE DESK OF CHRISD (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724269)

In Minority Report, John Anderton kills General Kaplan, as predicted.

The reason he does this is to protect the system of precrime.

Each "report" is a prediction of the future as predicted by precognative mutants.

In the original report, he was supposed to have killed General Kaplan when Kaplan revealed his plans to do away with the precrime system.

In the second report, Anderton does NOT kill Kaplan, because he knows about the original report. However, this is used to prove that precrime does not work, and the precrime system is shut down.

In the final report, Anderton publicly kills General Kaplan after he plans to present that he was NOT killed and that the precrime system is flawed. This "proves" that precrime works, and the system is kept intact.

Thank you. This has been a chrisd moment.

Hm... (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724111)

That sucks on one hand because they copied it, but on the other hand maybe it will be cheaper. Tough to say, really.

Re:Hm... (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724307)

Easy to say, idiot. The article itself shows it at about the same price.

Read the article, fool.

Advantage? (1, Insightful)

swordboy (472941) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724119)

I'd say that Toshiba definitely has the advantage here because:

1) They can buy the drives from themselves at cost
2) They support Windows users (officially)

I think that we can declare them the winner.

Re:Advantage? (3, Insightful)

fishboy (81833) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724181)

toshiba can't afford *not* to sell drives at competitive prices to all other manufacturers (i'm sure apple has leverage here with their other drive purchasing), so i imagine that their price advantages are not significant to us the consumer.

plus, the work-arounds to using an ipod on a pc are well known. anyone who drops $400-500 on one of these is going to be at least a somewhat serious user.

and, in the end, the itunes interface with the ipod is simply superior to anything else out there.

i'm not so sure anyone is the winner-- except us as apple must have to lower the high prices on ipods now that they have direct competition on size and price.

just my two cents.

OT: SwordFishboy? (2)

SPYvSPY (166790) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724254)

I agree. Toshiba's device isn't meant to steal Apple's thunder. It's just going to fill the enormous gaps outside iPod's market. I mean, what Apple user would buy the Toshiba? Also, Firewire and a kick-ass OS is still an advantage over USB2.0 and another goddamn confusing, cheap-o OS with a dolphin screen saver.

Re:Advantage? (5, Informative)

Latent IT (121513) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724281)

I'd say that Apple definitely has the advantage here because:

1) The Ipod is smaller, lighter, and has a bigger screen.
2) The battery is a Lithium Polymer, which can support playback of up to 13 hours, by some user reports, while this hunk of junk may very well use AA's.
3) It costs, oddly enough, $10 more, even though Toshiba makes the hard disc, and it has *ahem* a smaller screen.
4) The backlight can't be nearly as good.
5) USB 2.0 can't power the unit, while firewire can, so I never have to bring an AC adaptor *anywhere*.

I think that you maybe didn't read the article?

Re:Advantage? (1)

captain_craptacular (580116) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724318)

You might as well scratch 2 and 4 from the list because they are totally speculative. If you want people to take you seriously, put up a serious argument.

Re:Advantage? (3, Insightful)

Latent IT (121513) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724331)

You mean like 1, 3, and 5, genius?

Oh, wait. We just read a product bragging page, and they didn't spend even a single line talking about their great battery life. What do you think that means, champ?

*yawn*

Still no Ogg... (1, Insightful)

Joseph Vigneau (514) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724124)

I not spending my hard earned dollars on any digital audio hardware until it supports Ogg Vorbis [vorbis.com]...

Re:Still no Ogg... (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724158)

Ogg is for lamers.

Then you'll NEVER spend your hard earned dollars. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724290)

The companies don't even know that Ogg exists. Neither do 90% of consumers. MP3 is ubiquitous, accepted, and perfectly sufficient for the task at hand. Why wait for Ogg? It will never come.

Apple Users (1)

DarkZero (516460) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724139)

Wow. At first, I thought, "It's an MP3 player for the Mac. That isn't necessarily a rip-off of the iPod". But then I saw what it looked like...

I can feel thousands of Apple-print panties bunching as we speak.

Re:Apple Users (1)

MaxVlast (103795) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724360)

You mean like a mutation between a Sony MD player and a rejected XP theme? The iPod is elegant and simple. The Toshiba thing isn't ugly, but it's no iPod.

say it with me (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724141)

g to the oatse
c to the izzex
fo shizzle my nizzle see me buy toshiba's ipod competitor

I will buy it (1)

sheepab (461960) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724142)

If I can copy songs FROM the unit TO the computer. Does it? The iPod prevents you from doing this am I correct? <sarcasm> Now I can be like those Mac pirates and walk into stores and steal WINDOWS software!!! Yay! </sarcasm>

Re:I will buy it (3, Informative)

sith (15384) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724162)

iTunes doesn't have a way to do it, but there are a number of freeware/shareware programs that will copy music off the iPod, including some that integrate directly into iTunes. Check out versiontracker.com for more info..

iPod copy "prevention"... (2)

mellon (7048) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724191)

Yes, the iPod "prevents" you from copying the music from the iPod onto your computer, but it's trivial to get around it - all the data is there. The "prevention" is in iTunes. If you just plug the thing in and fish around on the drive, all the data is there in discrete files, and writing a perl script to extract it back into a music folder would be very easy.

Re:I will buy it (1)

yasth (203461) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724286)

Since it has an actual drive that you can remove and play with yeah it shouldn't be a problem. I like the idea of having upgradable storage, I'm never going to have that many MP3's to really use disks as swapouts

Re:I will buy it (1)

clmensch (92222) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724320)

Hah! Unfortunately, it is a lot more difficult to steal installed Windows software than installed Apple software. Most Windows software requires the installation executable so it can do fun things like inflate your system registry even MORE, install necessary .dll's to the obligatory (and sometimes arbitrary) locations, and place crappy AOL shortcuts on your desktop/install spyware.&lt/sad truth&gt A notable exception is games, however. At least that's true in my experience.

All you need to execute virtually all Mac software is the application/package itself...with the occasional prefs file for Classic apps. Ahhhh...simplicity.

Removeable 5GB HDD (5, Insightful)

jpaulson (463520) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724154)

Removeable 5GB HDD, that fits in a card slot...
That has potential... I see many options... Most of them along the lines of a decent replacement for the floppy disk finally.

The player itself seems no different from a host of others.

Re:Removeable 5GB HDD (1)

carlos_benj (140796) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724205)

I'm with you. The drive has piqued my interest. As for the rest of the package, I'd prefer a solid state player for its better performance under duress (during exercise) and cheap media.

Re:Removeable 5GB HDD (2)

Neil Watson (60859) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724243)

Isn't it just a laptop hard drive? Possibly some hotswap hardware may be coupled to it but, it's still just a laptop drive. That makes it an expensive floppy replacement not to mention somewhat fragile.

Removable... why? (2, Insightful)

mblase (200735) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724259)

You've got 5GB of songs. An average 128-kbps MP3 file takes up, say, 5MB of space. That means you've got room for about a thousand songs on one drive. That's a thousand songs. Approximately the size of my entire music collection, including the ones I hate.

So, aside from swapping your entire music collection with a buddy -- why in the world would you care if you can take the drive out and replace it?

Competition is good (2, Insightful)

jellomizer (103300) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724167)

Now hopefully this will create better faster cheaper iPods and also have them a bit more open so many platoforms can use it. For me the fact the iPod only works on a mac isnt an insentive to buy a Mac or and iPod. It would actually be a turn off for both. Apple should put more concetration on open standards then making hardware that is incompatible for the reason "just because"

Re:Competition is good (2, Insightful)

chris_martin (115358) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724206)

Whatever, the iPod hardware is not incompatible in any way. The software just isn't provided from Apple. do you think Toshiba will ship Mac software? I doubt it. Does that mean that it won't work? doubtfull. Several companies have produced software that makes the iPod work with Windows, and I'm sure you could do the same for Linux, et. al.

Re:Competition is good (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724301)

Right, so with the iPod you have to spend more money and/or more time to get Windows compatability. Seeing as the VAST majority of people out there in the world use Windows, I don't see how anything you said contradicts the fact that this Toshiba player is a better choice than an iPod for Windows users.


Also, I'd love to know where I could find the specifications necessary to make the iPod work with Linux.

Re:Competition is good (5, Insightful)

mblase (200735) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724326)

Apple should put more concetration on open standards then making hardware that is incompatible for the reason "just because"

Apple's iPod hardware is entirely compatible. It's just a hard drive, with MP3 data stored in a particular sort of file tree. It's the software that Windows and Linux need to access it, and Apple hasn't bothered making that for the simple reason that they're not in the business of making PC products.

XPlay [mediafour.com] and EphPod [slashdot.org] both work, separately or together, to bridge the iPod/PC gap just as iTunes already does for Macs. And they do so with Apple's blessing, because Apple already knows that being able to sell iPods to PC users would be a good business decision -- but using iPods to help sell iBooks and iMacs is, from their end, an even better one.

Re:Competition is good (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724328)

Who decided that the barely literate ramblings of a troglodyte are worthy of "Insightful"? Perhaps, if Apple included a fully functional spellchecker in the iPod, the poster might then find it an INCENTIVE! Come to think of it, a distressingly large number of /. posters could use it.

And may I remind the poster that Apple's hardware is quite compatible with...well, Apple's other hardware. And this is a problem because..?

Biased (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724169)

Can we lose some of the hideously biased story submissions?

Sans the lcd screen, I have a minidisc player that looks exactly like that. Manufactured before the iPod was even in the design stages.

Sure, Apple makes some nice stuff, but it's really not worthy of hunting down anything silver or translucent and beating it to death. Aren't you guys supposed to be against trademarking trivial works? Or does that just apply to things you dislike?

Here's a mirror (-1)

Jon Katz on Tuesday (578508) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724170)

For all you nerds to get your panties in a bunch over:

Toshiba launches iPod competitor
By Martyn Williams IDG News Service and
Jim Dalrymple, jdalrymple@maccentral.com
June 18, 2002 2:10 pm ET

Toshiba Corp. has chosen a removable hard drive for their new portable music player, which means a physically larger player but one with a much greater capacity for your favorite music.

The Gigabeat will playback music stored in the MP3, WMA or WAV digital audio file formats and Toshiba says the bundled 5GB hard disk offers enough space for around 1,000 MP3 files of 5 minutes length recorded at 128Kbps (bits per second). That's 20 or 40 times the capacity of current memory cards.

[picture of a iPod wannabe]

The hard disk drives are 1.8-inch models developed by Toshiba. They are encased in PC Cards and so can also be used with most notebook PCs or other devices with PC Card slots. Of course, using Apple's iPod, simply connecting the player to your Mac via the FireWire cable mounts the drive on your desktop.

With all this data storage space, transferring files to the player could take some time and here Toshiba has implemented the new USB2.0 interface, which can transfer data at 480M bps -- a much higher speed than the 12M bps supported by USB1.1, which is found on most digital music players today. Using the bundled application software, Toshiba says an entire CD worth of audio can be transferred to the device in 30 seconds.

With its rectangular shape, liquid crystal display and circular control panel, the Gigabeat bears a passing resemblance to Apple Inc.'s iPod, which has a fixed 1.8-inch hard disk drive (produced by Toshiba) buried inside. Apple's current model of the iPod contains a 10GB disk, allowing for approximately 2,000 songs.

Partly because of the hard disk slot and ejection mechanism, the Toshiba player is slightly larger but not by much. It measures 7.2 centimeters (cm) by 2.2 cm by 11.2 cm, which puts it around 1 cm wider and taller than the iPod. At 180 grams with no disk and 235 grams with the drive inserted, it also weighs more than the Apple player, which is 185 grams including its internal hard disk.

Other features include an on-screen menu in English, Japanese, French, Spanish or German. The screen has 160 x 120 pixel resolution and is slightly smaller than the iPod's 2-inch screen.

The Gigabeat MEG50JS will go on sale in Japan on June 22 and is expected to cost around 50,000 (US$402) bundled with a 5GB hard disk. At the same time, Toshiba will put removable hard drives in 2GB and 5GB sizes on sale for 20,000 (US$160) and 40,000 (US$321) respectively.

Toshiba said it has plans to put the Gigabeat on sale in the U.S. and then Europe although the company has not decided on a schedule for an overseas launch.

Toshiba is cheap. (0)

macdaddy357 (582412) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724171)

Toshiba was once at the top of the notebook computer industry because they are cheap, but people have caught on. You get what you pay for. I am an A+ certified tech, and have repaired hundreds of Toshiba laptops. Junk! Did you know a part has to fail in the field three times before they will accept that it is defective? Don't buy their i-pod rip off. It will be garbage.

Re:Toshiba is cheap. (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724201)

As the japanese farmer said, "Go out in the pasture, have a look at my cows, but be careful not to step in the toshiba"

Re:Toshiba is cheap. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724347)

As your japanese whore-mother said, "Go out in the pasture, and suck my tranny dick. And a cow."

Re:Toshiba is cheap. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724212)

Hmph. Your only an A+ tech, I'll ask a real MSCE tech, he'll know the answer.

Re:Toshiba is cheap. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724248)

My mom went back to college a few years back and all the students had Toshita laptops...they are shit and I believe Toshiba was even sued for the quality of their laptops and their defected hardware (for some models). In the laptops lifespan it went in three times for repairs before being replaced by a new one that was repaired twice before hitting the dumpster...
Since then I vowed never to purchase another Toshiba and would recommend anyone from doing so, not matter what it is...

Certified Ass Hat (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724251)

A+ Certified means dick. The A+ test was nothing but memorizing what IRQ meant what and a whole bunch of obsolete information. I went to Barnes & Noble the day before I took the A+ test and picked a study book off the shelf, read it twice, took the test, and got certified. The test was a joke. I worked at a computer repair store for 3 years [i worked there for 2 before I took the test to get a $0.50/hr pay raise, getting my CCNA got me another $2.00/hr], and the majority of laptops that came in where off-brands. Toshiba was no more frequent than Dell or Compaq or Gateway. The Toshiba Satellites are very very good laptops. Oh well.

Re:Toshiba is cheap. (2)

spectecjr (31235) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724260)

Toshiba was once at the top of the notebook computer industry because they are cheap, but people have caught on. You get what you pay for. I am an A+ certified tech, and have repaired hundreds of Toshiba laptops. Junk! Did you know a part has to fail in the field three times before they will accept that it is defective? Don't buy their i-pod rip off. It will be garbage.

I wouldn't buy an iPod then; they both use the same hard drive internally.

You did know that Toshiba make the hard drives for the iPod, didn't you?

Simon

Re:Toshiba is cheap. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724279)

there's more in toshiba's new player than just the hard drive.

Re:Toshiba is cheap. (1)

CoolCash (528004) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724316)

I WAS an A+ tech fixing Toshiba laptops also, even "Toshiba" cerified. The major computer company I worked for sold more Toshibas that any other laptop, so of course we fix mostly Toshibas. That does not mean there junk. And the fail three times thing is mis-leading. A hard drive "fails" once, it's bad, they replace the hard drive. All laptop manufactures have some type of policy on this. At least you can get parts for Toshibas, try to get a part for a Sony (under warrenty)!

Yay competition! (2)

2nd Post! (213333) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724173)

Let's see how Apple responds to a *little* bit of pressure?

I say a little because it's USB 2, meaning it won't work with Macs right off the bat (connecting at USB1 speeds is a horrible idea).

$402 vs $399 means that they are *exact* price competitors for each other, where one has FireWire support and the other has ejectable disc support.

I suppose this means I can plug into my PC card slot and use iTunes (or the Finder) to update it at PCI speeds. Of course the laptop or PC card drive is still the speed bottleneck.

I wanna see if Apple ignores it (possible, since it isn't cheaper or exactly platform compatible) or 'improves' the iPod. It's plausible that the pricing of the Gigabeat is because the market will 'bear' the price of a $400 iPod :)

Re:Yay competition! (2, Informative)

Cryptnotic (154382) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724242)

USB 2.0 is faster than Firewire (current IEEE 1394 spec). Gigawire should be faster than USB 2.0.

Re:Yay competition! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724305)

And both are way faster than the hard drive, so it doesn't really matter

497 (-1)

Guns n' Roses Troll (207208) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724179)

This is my 497th post, if I'm not mistaken. I would like #500 to be something special. A 20 page faggot sex novella would be superb. Can anyone provide the goods? I certainly won't look for it myself.

Re:497 (-1)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724246)

its not gay sex, but perhaps a "touching" story of a pervert and his little jewish girl fucktoy (who is also dying of cancer). very sick, yet strangely erotic.

http://www.aracnet.com/~jaydog/predator2/the_tin y_ toy_1.txt

http://www.aracnet.com/~jaydog/predator2/the_tin y_ toy_2.txt

http://www.aracnet.com/~jaydog/predator2/the_tin y_ toy_3.txt

(ps - Axl is cool)

Re:497 (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724274)

You can take this one [stallman.org].
However it might be too much, even for slashdot.

Digital Media Timeline in Windows (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724195)

In 1991, Microsoft Corp. added the first digital audio and video capabilities to the Microsoft® Windows® operating system with Multimedia Extensions in Windows 3.0. From that simple beginning, Microsoft has continued to develop the core digital media capabilities of Windows, responding to customer demands for ever-more powerful, integrated and easy-to-use digital media features. This timeline illustrates how these capabilities have grown and evolved over the years.

Windows 3.0 with Multimedia Extensions
Player for Windows 3.0 Introduced: Fall 1991, about six months after Sound Blaster card adds digital audio sound capabilities to PC platform.

Key features and formats: First media player in Windows. Simple audio playback takes advantage of new PC sound capability. Plays CDs and waveform files.

Windows 3.1
Player for Windows 3.1 Introduced: April 1992

Key features and formats: Visual refresh.

Windows 95, 98
Player for Windows 95, 98 Introduced: December 1994

Key features and formats: First 32-bit Media Player. Adds support for Microsoft MPEG4 v1 and v2 video codecs, ACELP filter, FHG filter, Voxware MetaSound/MetaVoice audio codecs, Vivo G.723 audio and Vivo H.263 video.

Windows 2000
Player for Windows 2000 Introduced: October 1999

Key features and formats: Unifies Windows Media Player with the streaming functionality previously found in NetShow® server. Adds support for Microsoft v3 video codec and Windows Media Audio codec.

Windows Millenium Edition
Player for Windows ME Introduced: September 2000

Key features and formats: Adds digital media library, CD copying, new user-interface, CD metadata from All Music Guide, Media Guide, Radio Tuner, CD burning and more. Adds support for Windows Media Screen Capture codec and Windows Media Audio and Video 7 codecs.

Windows XP
Player for Windows XP Introduced: October 2001

Key features and formats: Integrated CD burning in the operating system, improved user-interface, DVD playback, improved sound quality, Intelligent Media Management, improved MP3 support including optional MP3 encoding, and improved device support. Adds support for Windows Media Audio and Video 8 codecs.

mmm.... iTunes (1)

Your_Mom (94238) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724196)

...and without iTunes, it'll be darn hard to handle...
Why can't someone make an iTunes clone over on Linux? I really don't want to pay $800 when I am just going to listen to MP3s.

God, Apple ticks me off when they don't port good programs over to non-Apple platforms.

Re:mmm.... iTunes (1)

DLWormwood (154934) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724258)

Wah.

How do you think Mac users feel for not getting "all those titles" that show up on Windows? If dozens of software companies won't port their titles over, why should you expect Apple to do so themselves?

Re:mmm.... iTunes (1)

Your_Mom (94238) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724317)

If dozens of software companies won't port their titles over, why should you expect Apple to do so themselves?
Would you invest $BIGNUM dollars to reach ~5% of the PC market?

Now, would you rather invest that money to reach ~95% of the market?

People who have stuff on Apple have a larger audience to gain if they ported stuff over to Win32, as opposed to Win32 coders who have a tiny market segment to gain if they port stuff over to Apple. I don't see whay Apple ignores this large market segment.

God, I hope Apple continues to piss you off. (1)

2nd Post! (213333) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724300)

I'm quite happy with iTunes, iMovie, iPhoto, the iPod, etc, etc :)

If you want the software, feel free to buy it. I think it only costs, erm, $1199 to get access to iTunes, iMovie, iPhoto, the iPod, iDisk, the iTools suite, etc, etc. If you get an older model, the price drops down to a much more reasonable ~$800.

Re:God, I hope Apple continues to piss you off. (1)

Your_Mom (94238) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724355)

I would /gladly/ buy the software, its just tht I don't feel like buying hardware just so I can run it. $800 isn't reasonable when the only thing you are going to do with it is listen to all your ripped CDs. Apple is defying logic when they are ignoring a large audience that would gladly buy their software if they ported it to another platform.

apples secret (1)

GoatPigSheep (525460) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724340)

why would someone spend 2 times as much money on a system that is generally slower than a pc that costs half as much? The programs and the OS.

As much as apples hardware is lagging way behind pc's, their OS and programs are easier to use and the average consumer is impressed by that.

Looks like a nice product... (4, Interesting)

mellon (7048) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724208)

I have friends who use PCs, and I can't recommend the iPod to them. This looks like a fine substitute. However, if you have a Mac, I think the iPod is a better choice. My wife has an iPod, and I _really_ like the user interface. The Toshiba's user interface looks like it would be hard to operate while rollerblading, which is when I usually use it.

and it uses electricity! what an obvious clone.... (1)

mattdm (1931) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724209)

With its rectangular shape, liquid crystal display and circular control panel, the Gigabeat bears a passing resemblance to Apple Inc.'s iPod....

Okay, I can see the "circular control panel" as an iPod reference, but come on -- rectangular shape? liquid crystal display?!? Those are hardly unique hallmarks of Apple design.

In any case, the removable PC Card hard drive makes this way more than an iPod clone. Who needs iTunes -- or any other special software?

Re:and it uses electricity! what an obvious clone. (1)

kwerle (39371) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724267)

Who needs iTunes -- or any other special software?

Anyone who wants to be able to easily organize and sync their music collection. You sound like someone who has not used iTunes. As any TiVo owner will tell you: "The difference IS the software."

Re:and it uses electricity! what an obvious clone. (1)

mattdm (1931) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724342)

Doesn't make it easy to organize and sync *my* music collection, at least not with the additional $1000 purchase of an Apple computer (and finding some space to put it). That's hardly high-value proposition.

As it is, I have a nice organizational scheme called "a directory tree" and a sync system called "rsync". It might be missing a few frills, but it's very quick, doesn't rely on anything special, and works perfectly well. If I wanted to do more sophisticated cataloging, it would be next to trivial to set up something with namazu. Unlike the iPod, the Toshiba device would fit right into this.

Of course, the ability to slip it into any computer (give or take) isn't the only advantage of having a removable drive -- as I'm sure dozens of people have pointed out by now, it makes it easy to upgrade as well.

This thing looks awesome. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724210)

It'd be pretty cool to be able to hook it up easily to the car stereo. Better yet, maybe they'll make a car stereo capable of playing those 5GB wafer things they're using in this unit?

I'll bet that the medium is loaded to the gills with DRM, though.

Using standards is always better (2)

pinkpineapple (173261) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724218)

The pc card is definitely a win on the system. Lots of time I've talked to people who would buy the Apple iPod if it could mount on a PC WITHOUT a 3rd party vendor util software. What were they thinking in Cupertino when they decided the format of the drive should be HFS? Even Linux doesn't have HFS support in the kernel. vfat would have been so much interoperable.

PPA, the girl next door.

Re:Using standards is always better (1)

Microlith (54737) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724266)

Because Apple did not intend on selling it to anyone but MAC USERS.

It was supposed to be an addon to the Mac, not an independent product.

Guess why they used HFS+

Can you?

Because everyone they were aiming it at had a system that supported HFS+

Re:Using standards is always better (3, Insightful)

2nd Post! (213333) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724268)

I dunno, I suppose being able to encode metadata, boot off the drive, retain permissions (another form of metadata), and a few other things, makes the argument for HFS+

Oh, and perhaps compatibility with over, what, 10 years of legacy might have helped too.

HFS+ is interoperable, it's just that Microsoft doesn't implement HFS+, so yeah it's a pain to pay someone $40 to implement HFS+ support for you, but then what do you think Apple users have to deal with when buying PC oriented products?

Re:Using standards is always better (-1)

Guns n' Roses Troll (207208) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724271)

What were they thinking in Cupertino when they decided the format of the drive should be HFS?

Oh, I don't know. MAYBE BECAUSE IT'S AN APPLE PRODUCT FOR USE WITH OTHER APPLE HARDWARE? You Communist cock-fondling Linux shit-heel. Sometimes I don't know who I hate more - Linux users or niggers.

They were thinking it would work on Macs (2)

SPYvSPY (166790) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724302)

They were thinking it would work on Macs, which is what it does, and it does it well. When are you going to learn that Steve Jobs doesn't want grubby little nerd whiners like you in his club?

good news for Linux? (0, Offtopic)

tps12 (105590) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724221)

I think this bodes well for Linux. Though SourceForge [sourceforge.net] likely features many Open Source projects attempting to provide iPod support on Linux and other free *n*xen, Toshiba is giving us a product that works now. This sure makes Linux look pretty good.

Re:good news for Linux? (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724244)

get over it. toshiba didn't make this with the explicit intent that it would work with linux. it's a windows/intel compatible device that happens to also work with linux because most linux runs on intel hardware.

Price Pressure (1)

timothy_m_smith (222047) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724228)

If this device is a quality piece of hardware, maybe it will help push down the price of Apple's stuff. Of course, I'm not sure that Apple has ever given a crap what other people are charging for similar products (or at least as similar as you can be to Apple).

software integration!!!!!!!! (2)

paradesign (561561) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724232)

the greatist part of the iPod is the seamless software/hardware integration. where is that here?

with the iPod had the in line remote though:( oh well maybe soon, if you inspect the headphone jack there appears to be three unused contacts arround it. rumors have been on the iPod sites that apple will release an external control for it but nothing official yet. maybe this will bring it to market sooner.

How is this a "basically copied" iPod (1)

writermike (57327) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724233)

I hope I'm not picking nits, but I can't see how this is a "basically copied" iPod.

Because it has a hard drive? Others do.

Because it has a circle in the control area? So does Archos! Does it operate the same way?

Because it's gray? iPod is white!

Because it has a similar form factor? It's too big!

Sorry, I think it's a competitor -- as Maccentral states -- but only in that it's another MP3 player.

Not as bad as all that, Apple nuts (2)

mblase (200735) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724235)

First, Toshiba isn't the first to sell an "iPod competitor". We've already seen the Treo 10 [com.com] ("...which is similar in appearance and function to the iPod...") and Nomad [nomadworld.com] hit the market, with similar press responses.

Second, the iPod has a lot more going for it than 5/10 GB and a FireWire connection. That thumbwheel on the front makes it insanely easy to navigate through the music stored on it (you just spiiiiiiin and click, versus click-and-click-and-click-and-click-and...). Instant sync with iTunes means that you can organize playlists on your desktop with a full-size keyboard and download them perfectly into your portable. If you've never held one, you'd be amazed how small and light it is.

Bottom line: Apple's not the only high-capacity MP3 player on the market, and they know it, but they can sell theirs for higher prices because (a) they're selling to Mac loyalists and (b) they've got ease-of-use down to a science, to a degree almost no other company can match. Believe me, they're far from running scared.

Re:Not as bad as all that, Apple nuts (4, Insightful)

spectecjr (31235) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724294)

First, Toshiba isn't the first to sell an "iPod competitor". We've already seen the Treo 10 [com.com] ("...which is similar in appearance and function to the iPod...") and Nomad [nomadworld.com] hit the market, with similar press responses.

The amusing thing is, even though the press might compare the Nomad 3.0 with the iPod, the Nomad 3.0 was leaked on the Creative Nomad newsgroups about a year before the iPod was announced.

And all the specs were the same as when it was released.

The details of their Audigy stuff were released at the same time.

Simon

It can't be any worse than the i-plod (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724238)

Since apple has publicly stated it won't support linux (despite ripping it off for OSX) in the ipod, and then implemented copy-control in the ipod itself, I say good riddance to their protectionist crap and hello to open-source toshiba.

Re:It can't be any worse than the i-plod (1, Informative)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724261)

macosx is based on bsd and nextstep. how is that riping off linux?

Hmmmm (2)

forged (206127) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724240)

Okay so it looks terrific [macworld.com].

But the bad news is towards the end of the article, when it comes to availability. Isn't it always the case with new products thatr look darn cool, and pre-announcements to make them even more desirable?

  • The Gigabeat MEG50JS will go on sale in Japan on June 22.[...] Toshiba said it has plans to put the Gigabeat on sale in the U.S. and then Europe although the company has not decided on a schedule for an overseas launch.

Dammit, why are none of my friends in Japan for the World Cup. If only ....

Re:Hmmmm (-1)

Jon Katz on Tuesday (578508) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724270)

Maybe if you had any friends in the first place, you could have one that is in Japan for the World Cup so he could buy you this super new and geeky toy.

I know ... fly to Japan and meet a boyfriend! You MUST be a luser of Linux. You and your boyfriend will have so much to talk about!

Alan Thicke DEAD. (-1)

Alan_Thicke (553655) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724250)

I just heard the sad news on CBC radio. Comedy actor/writer Alan Thicke was found dead in his home this morning. Even if you never liked his work, you can appreciate what he did for 80's television. Truly a Canadian icon. [slashdot.org]
He will be missed :(



Show me That Smile (The Growing Pains Theme Song):

Show me that smile again.
Ooh show me that smile.
Don't waste another minute on your crying.
We're nowhere near the end.
We're nowhere near.
The best is ready to begin.

As long as we got each other
We got the world
Sitting right in our hands.
Baby rain or shine;
All the time.
We got each other
Sharing the laughter and love.

Re:Alan Thicke DEAD. (-1, Offtopic)

YourMissionForToday (556292) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724344)

Oh...good. I was waiting for that one to come back.
FFFFFF AAAA RRRRRRR TTTTTTTT !!! F A A R R TT !!! FFF AAAAAA R RR TT !!! F A A R R TT F A A R R TT

As reported in today's Washington Post, the Marijuana Policy Project is now legally permitted to collect signatures to place our medical marijuana initiative on the ballot in our nation's capital. Would you please help us in one of three ways?

We must collect 40,000 total signatures (which translates into 20,000 valid signatures) in D.C. between now and July 7. This is a monumental effort!

1. TRAVEL TO D.C. AND GET PAID TO COLLECT SIGNATURES: Can you commit to gathering 200 signatures per day for 20 days, starting immediately? We will pay for your round-trip plane ticket, provide you with a hotel room, and pay you $2 per valid signature. (200 total signatures per day translates into about 100 valid signatures per day, which means you would be paid about $200 per day.)

Please call MPP's Kat DeBurgh at 202-462-5747 ext. 101 if you are interested in earning about $4,000 in three weeks. Those who are willing to fly to D.C. within the next two days will be given preferential treatment.

2. VOLUNTEER IN D.C.: If you already have a full-time job and live near D.C., would you please volunteer to collect 120 signatures between now and July 7? The training session will take about one hour, and you can collect 120 signatures in about five hours by standing outside of a Metro stop or a supermarket. The first training session is tomorrow (Saturday) at 1:00 p.m. at Armand's Pizza at 226 Massachusetts Avenue, NE, on Capitol Hill. Please sign up at http://www.mpp.org/dcinitiative/volunteer.html if you can come to this training or a future training, where you will be given free pizza and a free medical marijuana T-shirt to wear while gathering signatures.

3. DONATE TO PAY FOR SIGNATURE DRIVE: If you aren't able to collect signatures on a volunteer or paid basis, would you be willing to donate money so that others may be paid $2 per valid signature?

Please donate at http://www.mpp.org/dcinitiative/contribute.html at your earliest convenience.

In 1998, D.C. voters passed a medical marijuana initiative with 69% of the vote. Congressman Bob Barr (R-GA) and other hard-line drug warriors in Congress kept this initiative from taking effect, then barred D.C. residents from ever voting on the issue again -- trampling on the will of the voters and the rights of patients.

Three months ago, MPP beat Rep. Barr and the U.S. Justice Department in federal court, winning the right to run a new medical marijuana initiative in D.C.

And one week ago in D.C. Superior Court, MPP successfully defended the initiative from a legal challenge by a team of local activists who were trying to prevent the signature drive from starting.

Finally, yesterday, the local D.C. government gave us our petitions. We must now collect 40,000 total signatures between now and July 7. If we do, D.C. voters will surely pass our medical marijuana initiative this November, which means Congress will have to debate and vote on whether it will allow the local medical marijuana law to take effect ... or whether Congress will overturn the will of the voters.

We must gather 2,000 signatures a day for 20 days -- from June 16 to July 7, with a one-day break on July 4 -- in order to qualify our measure for the November ballot.

This is a monumental effort. Would you please help in one of the three ways listed above? Thank you!

How the hell is this a copy? (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724257)

Why, when Apple copies something that's already done, and someone else does it too, is it copying Apple? The GUI from Xerox, using Firewire, you name it, somebody else invariably did it first, then Apple did it, a 3rd+ party gets involved, and all the Mac zealots scream COPY!

It's the same price, and it works with PCs without add-on software, same capacity but REMOVABLE media, has USB 2.0, supports more audio formats.... sounds far superior to me. Go ahead, Maccies, flame away, how dare anyone criticize Herr Jobs and his infinite wisdom.

Whats with pricing? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724265)

"The Gigabeat MEG50JS will go on sale in Japan on June 22 and is expected to cost around 50,000 (US$402) bundled with a 5GB hard disk. At the same time, Toshiba will put removable hard drives in 2GB and 5GB sizes on sale for 20,000 (US$160) and 40,000 (US$321) respectively"

So why can't they sell me a harddriveless model for $81.00 (I'm sure someone will hack it). It seems the current trend is to underprice hardware but overprice its accessories (printers/ink scenario)...

I just don't get it...

ITunes... (0)

Nanite (220404) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724275)

'...and without iTunes, it'll be darn hard to handle as elegantly as the iPod'

But at least it won't format your hard drive.

Nanite

Legal Issues? (1)

RAMMS+EIN (578166) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724277)

Let's hope Apple doesn't crack down on this IMO praiseworthy effort the way they did on Aqua-interface look-alikes...

Better than ipod (1, Flamebait)

GoatPigSheep (525460) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724285)

a few notes about the ipod:

-it's overpriced

-it doesn't work with window or linux by default (you need special programs to use it)

-itunes SUCKS. I have used itunes on a g4/500 with 384mb ram and it takes at least 30 seconds just to load a playlist of 7 gigs of mp3s.

Toshiba's will probably be cheaper, won't need one of those expensive plastic boxes to run it (aka a mac), and won't force you to use the horrible itunes.

Re:Better than ipod (1)

Midnight Thunder (17205) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724343)

All the points in the previous post are true ( though I am quite happy with my Mac ), though now that there is a suitable competitor on the market, we can only wait and see what Apple's reaction is.

Canada (1)

darthBear (516970) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724322)

Would be nice in Canada especially if they manage to raise the levy on non-removable media like they want to. At the rates that were being bandied about it could mean that this device is ~$50 cheaper when the hd and player are sold separately.

Apple to sue? (1)

richlb (168636) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724327)

Apple sued eMachines, I believe, back when they copied the look of the original iMacs. They claimed that the overall design was intellectual property. I wonder if they will take the same approach with Toshiba, whom they have a working relation with.

That's Apple for you... (2)

Mulletproof (513805) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724330)

You can sure get it pretty, but it will undoubtably cost you an arm leg compared to a similar performing product... And Windows support strait outta the box ta boot. I might just buy one now...

A copy? (1)

rlthomps-1 (545290) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724332)

It looks like Toshiba basically copied Apple's iPod.

I don't think so at all. Other than the shape of the player (which is a rectangle) it looks very little like the ipod. No silver polish and new features such as removable hard drives. If the form factor is what you're complaing about, you could say that apple ripped off the rio which is also rectangular ;)I wouldn't worry though, nobody can provide the level of integration and sophistocation in their products like Apple.

Haha, funny (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724341)

I'm too busy to create an account right now, but let me say one thing to all those who praise IPod

CDRW + CD Player

And to those who say mp3's just aren't any good without I Tunes

WINDOWS EXPLORER
CDEX
WINAMP

As for money...

CDRW: $100
CD PLAYER: $50
Spindle of 50: $10
Winamp: FREE
CDEX: FRRE
Windows Explorer: FREE if you are using a Windows PC

Mac: $1400
IPod: $400

Do the math, people.

If someone wants to post how quick it is to burn a CD with 700 Mb of mp3 or 80 minutes of audio, feel free to.

.

these mac users are stupid sobs (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#3724345)

read some of the posts in the forums underneath it and you will learn that quite a few are fucking retards... firmware update to support mp4
use the hard drive outta the new one in your old ipod... just read its funny if nothing else.

Sticking with the pod (2, Interesting)

shmert (258705) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724351)

Main plus on the Toshiba seems to be swap capability on the drive. For upgradability reasons, mostly (which Apple never seems too concerned about). Sure, I can fit my entire MP3 collection on less than half my iPod's 5G drive, but then I filled the rest up with backups, documentation, etc.

The things the Toshiba seems to be lacking are:
a scroll wheel (which really seems like the ideal interface for navigation LONG lists)
recharging from USB cable(?)

The main reason I bought an iPod is it seemed like the first device I could actually use that would really take advantage of the Firewire ports on my computer, which I never ever used. The same seems true for this Toshiba and windows users. w/USB 2.0

I've never understood the market for these players (3, Insightful)

southpolesammy (150094) | more than 11 years ago | (#3724352)

If the average CD-RW can hold approximately 650 MB of data, that comes out to needing just under 8 CD-RW's to hold what the single 5GB disk holds. A decent portable CD/MP3 player can be had for around $150, and let's round up to a 10-pack of CD-RW's for $20, plus a carrying case for the CD-RW's for $10.

So here's what I don't get...is the smaller profile of the device worth the extra $220?
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