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HP Drops Microsoft Word in Favor of WordPerfect

timothy posted more than 11 years ago | from the when-word-isn't-perfect dept.

Corel 726

nexex points to this Financial Times article, which says that HP has dropped Microsoft Word from the software lineup in the personal computers it sells to customers. From the article: "The move follows a decision last week by Dell Computer, the number two PC maker, to replace Microsoft software. Both companies said they would offer WordPerfect productivity software from Corel of Canada instead of Microsoft's Works, a scaled-down version of its top-selling Office software." Nexex writes:"I think it should be noted, MS Works does include the full version of Word."

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726 comments

OK, that pretty much confirms... (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4153498)

... that Fiorina is a flake-o-rama.

"Microsoft sucks. And to prove it, I will now blow off my own feet and most of both legs with this Armalite."

ASDF MOTHAFUCKAS (-1)

This_Is_ASDF (587337) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153499)

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LAME........ASDF MOTHAFUCKAS (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4153512)

I clicked onthe rest of the comment expecting besides a,s,d,f.

My cunt ached when I read it

wow, MS is brilliant (3, Insightful)

edrugtrader (442064) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153501)

buy are overpriced non-OS software product... or buy the scaled down version and get the full version free.

HP, why not just go OpenOffice? Word Perfect has just as many bugs, and you'd save yourself (ultimately your consumers) a lot more money.

Re:wow, MS is brilliant (1)

Dave2 Wickham (600202) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153528)

HP, why not just go OpenOffice?
One simple reason I can think of; support. Maybe they would put StarOffice in, but I doubt it would come with OOo (OpenOffice.org) because they simply do not want to handle support on it.

WordPerfect is great (4, Interesting)

DragonMagic (170846) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153670)

As someone who's used OpenOffice, Microsoft Office, Microsoft Works, ClarisWorks and WordPerfect, I can say from a writer and printer standpoint, WordPerfect is the best choice.

The ability to have nearly full DTP style justification and control, as well as being a great word processor, grammar-checker and thesaurus, WordPerfect for the price is just the best choice for most people who would use Microsoft Word anyways.

Re:wow, MS is brilliant (3, Insightful)

ocelotbob (173602) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153675)

Because there are still some pretty useful features in WP that aren't in Star/OpenOffice, like a good grammar checker (which has saved many writings of mine =3), plus the fact that WordPerfect is still pretty much the standard in some circles, like the legal/medical profession.

It's also worth noting that some vendors, such as Sony, went to WordPerfect as their word processor a few years back. Of course, their PC marketshare isn't as big as HP or Dell's, but it's still fairly significant. Could this be the start of a trend towards WordPerfect regaining at least some of its dominance?

Re:wow, MS is brilliant (1)

jasonditz (597385) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153706)

We must not forget "Export to PDF". Besides which, WP hogs a lot less systems resources than OO

Real cost (-1, Flamebait)

stryders (564863) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153504)

I wonder if MS will just raise the license fees for windows to makeup for the lost business, so the consumer would still pay the same.

Re:Real cost (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4153527)

Let them raise the price. The problem with the current situation is that customers are eith er unaware, or unconcerned about the MS tax. The only thing that wil raise faster than the fee, would be customers awareness of it.

When Windows gets too expensive then we might see more people looking around for soemthing better.

Re:Real cost (5, Informative)

Bilbo (7015) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153561)

I just bought a computer for my son from Dell, and by dropping the option for MS Office Professional, I saved close to $400. Now, that's Dell setting prices, not MS, but it still saves me a bundle. My son (just entering college) seems perfectly happy using OO.

Re:Real cost (2)

cscx (541332) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153577)

Depending on the school he attends, he may be elegible to get MS Office Professional for $5. If not, he is elegible for their academic version, which runs $150 methinks.

Good ... or bad (1)

josh crawley (537561) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153507)

Quite nice to see a company turn away MS software like this. Still, I'd love to see them to support OpenOffice instead...

Makes me wonder how much stock they have in Corel (or did they buy them out?)

fp?

FP!!! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4153508)

FP!!!

No Star Office? (5, Interesting)

sapphire42 (178537) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153518)

I am surprised they aren't going for something more compatible with Microsoft Office like Star Office. People are used to using Office products as the 'standard', so why not give them an alternative that will operate approximately the same. Putting Word Perfect on them will just confuse the people who are used to Word, and they will be upset when their Word at work will not read what they did at home. They won't understand enough to install the converters, and even those don't work 100%. I realize that SO and Open Office aren't perfect either, but I am not sure this is the best way to go Microsoft-free for the average consumer.

Re:No Star Office? (2)

systemapex (118750) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153544)

It's not surprising at all. When Joe Consumer thinks of word processors, only two come to mind: Word and WordPerfect. It's all about branding. Saying your computer includes WordPerfect is far more valuable to Joe Consumer than saying it includes StarOffice. No matter how good StarOffice is, a lot of non-techies still remember (fondly at that) WordPerfect from the days of WordPerfect 5.1 for DOS.

WP was the standard... (4, Informative)

Planesdragon (210349) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153545)

People are used to using Office products as the 'standard', so why not give them an alternative that will operate approximately the same.

Word is MS's crown jewel, but Word got where it is today buy stealing users from WP.

Wordperfect is *still* used in the Legal Industry far more than MS office. When I worked at the NYS DEC a few years ago, I didn't have word on my shiney Dell PC--I had wordperfect, and so did everyone else in all of EnCon.

Though it's a mind-boggling hack, Wordperfect and MS Word can and do talk to each other. In fact, having the two of them duke it out might be just the thing that OO needs to get some real work done on it, and get to be a usable beast...

Re:No Star Office? (2)

gadfium (318941) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153560)

And why do you think WordPerfect is less compatible with Microsoft Office than StarOffice is?

I haven't used WP since version 8 for Linux, but it was more capable of reading and saving MS Word documents then than other Linux word processors. I know the other word processors have improved a lot since then, but I assume that so has WP.

Yes, it would be nice if HP went with StarOffice, but I'm happy to see some diversity in the office software used.

Re:No Star Office? (1)

Jucius Maximus (229128) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153579)

"I am surprised they aren't going for something more compatible with Microsoft Office like Star Office."

Staroffice? StarOffice may be good, but I have yet to find a single MSFT Word file that Staroffice 6 for Linux can open. (Yes, I have version 6.) Even the simplest file where you open Word 97, type a sentence and then try to open it in StarOffice will cause SO6 to crash and burn. I cannot find any exceptions.

It is a good Office Suite I think when you are using it without interchanging between MSFT Office, but I still would have preferred GobeProductive. I downloaded the demo and very much liked its table support. Does anyone have news about when the GPL version [osnews.com] will be available for download? I am really interested in exploring switching fully to Gobe!

Re:No Star Office? (3, Interesting)

gadfium (318941) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153636)

Sorry, this is getting a little bit off topic.

I'm surprised at this. I can open almost any Word document with OpenOffice 6, and at worst I see a few formatting glitches. Even documents with lots of equations mostly convert well. Going in the other direction, I see more problems, mainly font ones.

I use Word 2000 (when I have to, since I find it more buggy than OpenOffice for those types of WP applications I have, which aren't really mainstream). Maybe the support for Word 97 isn't as good. Try saving your Word 97 documents in RTF format, although this won't help people who are sent .DOC files and don't have Word.

I only wish OpenOffice supported Excel spreadsheets as well as it did Word files. I'm almost in your position there - I have yet to see an Excel spreadsheet containing charts that OpenOffice can do even a mediocre job with. I haven't tried truly trivial cases as you mention.

Re:No Star Office? (2)

einstein (10761) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153705)

that's odd. I haven't run across a single .doc file that DOESN'T work in SO. what's wrong with your computer?
---

HP is going gung-ho (5, Interesting)

ergo98 (9391) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153519)

HP also just became [hp.com] the first big VAR to base "business" PCs around AMD's processors. HP is busy kicking sand in the faces of the big boys. Then again with Compaq HP isn't no small player itself.

It really is remarkable though: It seems that Microsoft was their own worst enemy, and they've pissed off so many of their large corporate partners that they have very few allies, and absolutely no one trusts them. I doubt that Microsoft is going anywhere for years to come, but these are fascinating twists that would never have been considered but a few years ago.

Profit Margins (1)

themaddone (180841) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153690)

Don't forget that AMDs, which have better performance at lower clock speeds than Intel P4s also cost less.

But HP probably makes the same (or close enough) in profit on either machine.

The difference is that the savings is passed on to the consumer -- but here's the kicker:

The average Joe will not believe that AMDs are outperforming P4s; they'll buy higher clocked AMDs, and discover that the performance is indeed better than expected, for the same price.

Now, not only have they gotten a good deal (vs. buying a P4), they're much more likely to bring return business to HP!

IT people, who need to buy namebrand computers also can flock to HP (for a short time, at least)... It's a great move by HP, as long as they measure up in the other departments...

WORKS DOES NOT INCLUDE WORD (-1, Informative)

freeefalln (541648) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153521)

Sorry, but the poster got it WRONG. MS Works does NOT include Word. Its a separate entity. it is NOT a stripped down version of Word.

Re:WORKS DOES NOT INCLUDE WORD (1)

sapphire42 (178537) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153536)

The Microsoft Works Suite, as names by Microsoft DOES INDEED include a full version of Word. You get Works, Word, and Money, and I think Encarta. That's what came on my HP that I bought before I knew better.

Re:WORKS DOES NOT INCLUDE WORD (1)

waerloga01 (308176) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153542)

Quoth freefalln:
Sorry, but the poster got it WRONG. MS Works does NOT include Word. Its a separate entity. it is NOT a stripped down version of Word.

According to this Microsoft website [msn.com], Word 2002 (WordXP) is in MS Works 2002 as the word processor.

Re:WORKS DOES NOT INCLUDE WORD (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4153576)

Yes it does. I work on HPs that have the Works suite installed along with WinXP. Notice that it's called a suite...as in a combination of existing MS software such as Word.

Yes, it does. (2)

Cryptnotic (154382) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153583)

It's called the new "Microsoft Works Suite 2002 [msn.com]", and is an upgraded version of Works 6.0, now including the full version of Word 2002.

It is quite a good deal too at $109, compared to $339 for Word 2002 by itself. Of course, there may be some restrictions on the usage of the Works Suite version of Word 2002. Works Suite 2002 seems to be marketed towards home users. Perhaps there is a "no commercial use" clause in the EULA.

Re:Yes, it does. (2)

MsGeek (162936) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153664)

It's the self-same version. And there is no "no commercial use" clause in the EULA.

Re:WORKS DOES NOT INCLUDE WORD (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4153592)

You sir, are a moron FUD-packer. Works comes with Word XP (2002) along with Money, Encarta, and Streets and Trips and some other goodies.

Re:WORKS DOES NOT INCLUDE WORD (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4153678)

No, You sir, are a moron FUD-packer. Works Suite includes Word. Works doesn't. jackass

REVEAL CODES IS GOOD (3, Insightful)

Ark42 (522144) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153522)

I still use WP to this day, and have since v5 for DOS. Reveal codes is good!! it makes word processing closer to html editing in notepad. Total control over the document layout. I can not stand Word at all with its lack of this hugely important editing feature. Go HP!!!


Re:REVEAL CODES IS GOOD (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4153607)

Word doesn't have Reveal Codes because Word doesn't have codes...at least not the way WP users think of codes. Word uses a different model altogether, there isn't a hidden tag markup like WP.

Re:REVEAL CODES IS GOOD (3, Informative)

stubear (130454) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153620)

Depends on what you're doing but Word can reveal field codes and non-printing codes. If you want to know about a particular block of text, click on help -> what's this -> then click on the block of text. A dialog baloon will appear informing you what's going on with the block of text. Paragraph and font formatting are both revealed in this dialog. Alternatively you could press shift-F1 to call up the what's this pointer.

Re:REVEAL CODES IS GOOD (2)

Papineau (527159) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153625)

I agree. It was the feature I liked most in WP, and that I missed most in Word when my father installed Word from Office 4.2 (Windows 3.1) rather than WordPerfect for Windows, which was quite buggy for the first few versions.

It really let you specify where each formatting would begin or end, and could be hidden if you didn't like it. And Word still doesn't have something comparable (Word is too WYSIWYG to include it now, it would mean they should've included it earlier).

Re:REVEAL CODES IS GOOD (1)

ultimabob (590133) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153709)

That and with the Word Perfect Reveal Codes, you can find and remove strange formatting errors by finding the code and removing it. I loved that feature of Wordperfect, and wished that it was in OpenOffice.org, if it is there, would someone let me know where it is at.

Works: Doesn't Necessarily Contain Word(?) (2, Informative)

geogeek6_7 (566395) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153524)

It would seem that you can only get Word included with the 2002 edition of Works Suite, which costs twice as much as Works.

Here are some links from newegg that seem to indicate as much:

Works, Standard [newegg.com]
Works Suite [newegg.com]

~geogeek

Sniff (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4153530)

Sniff my arsehole, you cunts!

Bad decision (non standard software) (0, Insightful)

GoatPigSheep (525460) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153533)

Word is the standard for word processing on windows. If HP doesn't ship it people will be forced to buy it. Wordperfect hasn't had widespread use since 1995, and I doubt people would want to switch back from the MS word standard. Buying a HP box would now be a bad choice for a student, as most schools including mine use word exclusively and students are expected to know how to use it. Bad move HP!

Re:Bad decision (non standard software) (1)

Planesdragon (210349) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153559)

Buying a HP box would now be a bad choice for a student, as most schools including mine use word exclusively and students are expected to know how to use it.

Office still has "help for Wordperfect users." Students are better off with WP than they are with OO or SO, unless you think that a "MS Office help for cheap Sun communists" add-on is in the works... ;)

Re:Bad decision (non standard software) (1, Insightful)

echosilex (558233) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153614)

Sadly, this is the kind of problem that standards have. Because Microsoft Word is the only accepted word processor among students (and professionals), there is no other choice for a purchase but MS Word.

Yet another facet to Microsoft's monopoly..

Re:Bad decision (non standard software) (2)

zerocool^ (112121) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153617)

as most schools including mine use word exclusively and students are expected to know how to use it.

My school requires all engineers, architects, and sciences majors to purchase a software pack, which includes the educational version of MS Office, so I don't think it would be a huge problem to buy a computer with word perfect. It also includes AutoCad, Mathmatecia, Matlab, and alot of other stuff. For $500, it's not a bad deal, compared to actual software costs. Insert random comment about opensource software prices here, but first find me a substitute for AutoCad or Matlab.

~Will

Re:Bad decision (non standard software) (2)

(startx) (37027) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153668)

wow, that seriously sucks for you. We have all of that on the lab machines around campus, but they don't force us to buy anything. (cept the god damned HP49g I've touched twice)

Re:Bad decision (non standard software) (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4153619)

"as most schools including mine use word exclusively and students are expected to know how to use it. "

How can a prof even tell what word processing program you used to write a paper? And how many are so pro-Microsoft that they'd really care?

"I'm not accepting this Word Perfect spawned horror! True scholars only use fine Microsoft products."

Uh huh. Smells like something from MS' own PR FUD department.

Re:Bad decision (non standard software) (2)

NeoSkandranon (515696) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153710)

Well if you have to email your papers in then I'd say it's fairly easy to tell when word mangles the formatting or won't open it at all

Re:Bad decision (non standard software) (2)

garcia (6573) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153626)

most schools offer a seriously REDUCED rate for students purchasing MS Office.

It can only be installed twice or something but usually costs around $10. Even if you have to install it more than twice, at $10 you are still having major savings.

I haven't used MS Word much until recent when I started doing massive resume/cover letters. Businesses DO NOT appreciate text only formats unless they SPECIFICALLY ask for them.

Abiword has done wonders for me.

Re:Bad decision (non standard software) (1)

jasonditz (597385) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153723)

When I was in college (its only been a couple years) we had both WP and Word in all the computer labs. The bookstore sold Office for $150 (student discount) and WP Office for $9.99

Wasn't a hard choice for me.

Re:Bad decision (non standard software) (2, Insightful)

bgfay (5362) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153628)

My guess is that 80% or more of the word processing public doesn't care what they type in so long as it prints. As for students and the like, I have always found that it is trivial to work in any word processor no matter that the college or institution "demands" Word. Most documents at these places are simple, there is always WordPad or another viewer, and the conversions in the latest versions of WordPerfect are pretty good.

I admit, I've never liked Word because I came into word processing on a weird little local text editor which featured strange embedded commands for formatting (PC Galahad at Clarkson University) and then went to WordPerfect 5.1. I got used to working with codes and being able to see those codes in my documents. WordPerfect feels like HTML for the desktop publishing sector to me. It just works really well. If this got a thousand more people to use WP, great.

One last thing about college use: most students have no idea how to really work with a word processor. They just know how to type. It's not going to take much to please them.

Re:Bad decision (non standard software) - BULLSHIT (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4153655)

BULLSHIT!

No school has any business mandating a particular BRAND of a software product (or any other product, for that matter - how many schools mandate a particular brand of notebook paper?). It would be perfectly acceptable to say "you must know how to use a word processor", but to require a specifc one - Again, BULLSHIT! It would even be aceptable to say "you must have a word processor which is capable of reading and writing format X (where X is a published and documented format for word processing files.) But it is completely wrong to require a particular brand of any product.

Besides, you pay for it anyway, this is just making the price more obvious, and giving those that DONT want it a choice NOT to pay for it.

You're right, but HP should still take the risk (2)

Ars-Fartsica (166957) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153693)

I agree that Word is the de facto standard, but HP also wants to differentiate itself, and price is one way to do that. By going with cheaper AMD processors and getting rid of MS software, they may be able to do that.

Its a risk, but HP needs to take a risk - even with Compaq, they are no match for the cost cutting and distribution that Dell offers.

Why not Open/StarOffice? (2)

Bilbo (7015) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153534)

I'm curious why they don't go with StarOffice, unless they don't want to be seen as promoting Sun.

Of course, in spite of the fact that I personally find WordPerfect to be horrendously confusing, there are some segments of the industry that are still standardized around it as a word processor. I've been told that lawyers still use WP, mostly for historical reasons. (That's what they are used to, and there are a lot of old documents and standard forms in that format.)

Ya, right ... (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4153541)

Well, this is the moment that historians will point to and say 'that was the beginning of the end for Microsoft' ... have you seen the monkeys flying out of my butt?

I can't imagine Microsoft is quaking about this one ... now, if it were open office, then it would be giving a miniscule threat some (albeit very little) legitimacy.

grip

Can't be good for users (1, Interesting)

spoco2 (322835) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153547)

I can't see this being anything but bad for the end users. As much as everyone loves to bash MS, the Office package has served me very well for a very long time, since I switched from WordStar way back when.

I would have to agree that if you're going to offer anything else then Open Office or its ilk would have to be the way to go, don't give products to new users that end up making incompatible files with the vast majority of other users. It'll just leave them confused, frustrated and annoyed.

I'm all for using alternate products, but not at the expense of usability.

Wow... (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4153550)

now the slashdot editors aren't even reading the submission itself, let alone the article

MS Works Suite (5, Informative)

zerocool^ (112121) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153553)

MS Works does *NOT* always include word. The MS Works suite, full version ($99) includes word. The pre-installed version of works on your friendly OEM Computer MAY or MAY NOT have MS Word.

Back when I worked for Best Buy a year ago, this was a big advantage of buying a sony computer. They included the full works suite. Many (read: HP / Compaq) only included the MS Works Word Processor, MS Works Spreadsheet, etc.

MS Works Word Processor is a very stripped version of MS Word. It has no spell check, no auto format, and is missing many key functions of Word. As far as I could tell, it's existance was only to whet people's tastebuds to get them to buy office, because after using Word, trying to use "MS Works Word Processor" is a joke.

~Will

Re:MS Works Suite (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4153589)

This is correct. Mod up PLZ K THX

Re:MS Works Suite (1, Offtopic)

Andy Smith (55346) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153602)

Works word processor does have a spell checker, and a grammar checker and thesaurus too.

Re:MS Works Suite (2)

1010011010 (53039) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153712)


no auto format, and is missing many key functions of Word

Sounds great! I hate autoformat.

Crap office suites. (1, Troll)

saintlupus (227599) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153554)

Both companies said they would offer WordPerfect productivity software from Corel of Canada instead of Microsoft's Works, a scaled-down version of its top-selling Office software.

Nice to see so much competition in the painfully crippled office suite space. What's next, Gateway selling machines with preinstalled copies of AppleWorks for Windows?

Hey, maybe IBM will start packaging that Lotus SmartSuite again. That was a real winner.

I think the part that disturbs me the most is this: I work at a college, and this means there's going to be that many more students running around with word processor documents that they can't print in our labs. Headaches, ahoy.

--saint

Re:Crap office suites. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4153647)

I have NEVER understood the appeal of the Word
'.doc' file format. Maybe this will lead to a
better industry-wide standard -- HTML?

Re:Crap office suites. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4153649)

I believe Word has had from day one support for Word Perfect format. Unless your lab administrators have somehow deliberately disabled such.

Re:Crap office suites. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4153663)


Just another sympton of MS's monoploy. If it wasnt for that, there might be an open, well known standard that all popular WP's saved in, and you could load in different packages. But no, "DOC" has become a de-facto standard and stood in the way of competition.

Re:Crap office suites. (4, Funny)

MisterBlister (539957) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153721)

Hahah yeah Microsoft is the only company in the world that tries to lock people in with propreitary formats!! Haha, have another bong hit!

I work at a college, too (2)

Bastian (66383) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153696)

And our official stance on that issue is that anyone who can't be taught how to save documents in rich text format needs to go back to high school.

shrug (-1, Offtopic)

Brainboy (310252) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153555)

Word, WordPerfect, Works The words all look the same. You'd think someone would make a name that would stand out. I'll just blame the whole thing on Marketing.

Re:shrug (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4153575)

StarOffice sorta stood out.. to bad java SUCKS DONKEY BALLS

This is fine and dandy... (1)

RealBeanDip (26604) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153556)

Except it won't really matter because MS Office has absolutely saturated the market. If you don't have MS Office, you can't trade documents with your clients, and if you can't do that, you're out of business.

The sorry truth is, if this became an issue for MS, they would make the next version of Word completely incommpatible with whatever filters WP has. Whoever was offering Corel WP would simply see their sales drop and find out it was because of not offering MS Word.

I'm completely shocked why the corporate world hasn't seen through the bi-yearly upgrade cycle MS has inflicted on its customers and revolted.

The only real hope would be to start offering OpenOffice as an option letting everyone know they are free to copy it not only to their laptop, but to everyone elses machine in the building!

OO: The means to a new office document standard/nt (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4153660)

Noooo txt

Re:This is fine and dandy... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4153679)

Except it won't really matter because MS Office has absolutely saturated the market. If you don't have MS Office, you can't trade documents with your clients, and if you can't do that, you're out of business

And what kind of an idiot sends document *source*, being riddled with virus, editing histories and so forth?

Just use pdf or postscript!

Re:Yes it matters... (1)

scottt (447420) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153682)

Once this thing is really happening, maybe people like you will stop trying to convince me that M$ office is the "standard". It is everywhere, but I don't accept it as a standard since it's not open enough to work with. OpenOffice has done an incredible job of making it a non-proprietary format but I'd rather just simply reject it. I have no problem telling clients and others that DOC files as email attachments are a waste of my time, even though I can open them with the word processor of my choice.

And as for Corel, I've been mad at them since they gave up shipping a word pro for Linux. Not that they were ever really good at it but they were trying for a while. WINE is not a word pro for Linux.

HP drops log (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4153571)

big, smelly, slimy, in your mouth.

Wouldn't it be nice? (-1, Offtopic)

Nicopa (87617) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153572)

... if they also included Mozilla installed on their machines? :)

Is there something missing? (2, Interesting)

EggplantMan (549708) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153573)

The article is very scant on details, it's merely a statement of what happened. I'm curious as to why HP would replace a stripped down office suite (Works) with just a word processor (WordPerfect)? Perhaps they should also look at some of the available office suites like StarOffice or OpenOffice.

Why does no one ever mention AbiWord? (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4153585)

I know it's not an office suite, and is missing tables... but it is GPL, has a spell checker, and does a great job at being a word processor.

http://abiword.com/screenshots/

Ouch! (-1, Offtopic)

Amiga Trombone (592952) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153618)

This has got to hit His Billness right where it hurts! These are the two largest PC vendors in the world. You can be sure it won't be much longer before the rest of the PC vendors start showing some cajones, now that the two biggies have started the revolt. Wonder how long it will take before the next round of defections begins?

Victory... NOT! (2, Informative)

r_j_prahad (309298) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153623)

Have you all just come out of a coma recently? Microsoft owns about 25 percent of Corel. So MSFT won't make as much money as they could have, they still get some percentage off the top of this sale. Plus it looks good to the illiterati (aka the DOJ) who think that Corel is still a competitor to Microsoft.

This is like cussing at Arab terrorists while you're standing at a gas pump.

Re:Victory... NOT! - incorrect (2)

Andre060 (99353) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153689)

Bah, this is BS. MS sold all their (non-voting) Corel shares a long time ago....

Re:Victory... NOT! (2)

danheskett (178529) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153711)

Plus it looks good to the illiterati (aka the DOJ) who think that Corel is still a competitor to Microsoft.

Okay, well, since Corel hemorages money on a nearly perfectly consitent basis, MS won't be making any money from that arrangement.

Also, MS lost a sale to Corel. That means they were by definition competitors for that sale. I can't imagine how you could argue with a statement of fact like that.

WP Userbase (5, Insightful)

vinn (4370) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153629)

Before people go trashing on WordPerfect, let me point out some things you might not know about it:

  • They've supported Unix platforms for a hell of a long time. SCO, HP-UX, Solaris, etc.
  • They still sell a character-only interface for people who use terminals - useful in large organizations; useful for people who want to maintain compatibility with older versions.
  • The legal profession still relies on it - your lawyer uses WordPerfect and most legal forms are available in that format. And we all know, once a lawyer makes a document it never goes away.
  • At times they've had one of the best commercial apps for Unix - print spool manipulation, import/export, spellcheck, desktop publishing, etc. (Although, from release to release some things became dated.)

And if you say it's not for you, you're right. It definitely fills an important niche that a lot of other apps can't or don't want to.

WP is flat out better (5, Insightful)

io333 (574963) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153639)

Ask any secretary that actually TYPES for a living, especially the ones that need to do complex text formatting (e.g., legal secretaries) -- the secretaries that type 90+wpm. They *all* agree, and I mean every single last one, that nothing can *touch* word perfect for speed of text input. The function keys, which have mapped to more or less the same functions since 1985 (...earlier?), allow experienced users to do many things in less than a second that would otherwise take quite a while to do with a mouse. WP was, and is still *keyboard* based -- that means that if you know what you are doing, you can do everything in WP, very quickly, without ever taking your hands off the keyboard. I can't imagine ever having to use that horrible MSword to do anything except under threat of starvation. Of course the very best thing about WP, that I have never seen any other WP do, is that the "control codes" option always lets you see exactly why a document is behaving the way it is on screen: each formatting option is just a simple code between text brackets in a text document. There's never any question of why something looks the way it does in WP. No matter what the function, whether it be bold, or column size, or printer type, or whatever, it is just a simple code between brackets. In contrast, MSWord users are constantly baffled by a program that is trying to "assist" the user, by doing things it wasn't asked to do (and of course, cannot be undone) -- which is generally chalked up as being "just the way the program is,;" or else the users just feel like they are stupid and don't know how to use the program properly.

MSWord exists today only because it was bundled by OEMs (originally as MSWorks, in crippled form... though the full version is still crippled...) It never could have caught on otherwise as no one that actually knew about word processors would have chosen it over WP if they actually had to pay for it.

Oh yea, what platforms does WP work on right now? At least these:

Amiga, every version ever made
Linux, every version ever made
Unix, every version ever made
Windows, every version ever made
Mac, every version ever made

I'm sure there are other versions -- the above ones are just the ones that I have personally used.

Do I know what I'm talking about? Well, I used to be a legal secretary before I started accumulating degrees. I have been tested out, several times, at 100+wpm. I was word processing on a Prime mainframe (using a text editor) before word processors (and PCs) existed.

When making a living depends on how fast you get a document out of the printer -- which word processor you use is extremely important.

The typing ability requirements for a legal secretary are far more stringent than any "normal" secretary. Glance in the want-ads in your local paper and you'll see what I mean. Legal secretaries are, on an almost daily basis, required to pump out GIGANTIC documents, always suddenly, always in a complete crisis situation, and always mere minutes before they must be faxed out. It is the rare law office that does not use WP, and the secretaries in the occasional law office that uses MSWord instead are extremely unhappy about it, bitch continuously, and quit constantly.

Re:WP is flat out better (1)

John Miles (108215) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153699)

WTF? If you're typing faster than your word processor can accept text input, it's time to upgrade that 1981-vintage copy of AppleWriter ][.

Re:WP is flat out better (1)

io333 (574963) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153717)

Perhaps I wasn't clear: I don't *type* faster on WP, rather, I produce more document per minute with WP because I never struggle with formatting issues: WP always allows me to put the text where *I* want it... as opposed to MSWord which is always trying to put the text where MSWord things it ought to be.

Re:WP is flat out better (1)

io333 (574963) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153703)

duh... not "control codes," but "reveal codes." Stuff like that happens when I type faster than I think... although the reason that I don't remember what it is called is 'cause I never have to use a mouse to go find it but just hit the function key that immediately opens the codes window.

First step (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4153641)

well its the first step to have companys to move away from the lie that they HAVE to use m$ office

Wow... (5, Insightful)

stirfry714 (410701) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153645)

Slashdot never ceases to amaze. Two of the biggest computer manufacturers kick Microsoft in the groin, and all most of you can say is "Why not StarOffice or OpenOffice?"

Come on, people... (to mangle a phrase) the perfect is the enemy of the good. Sure, it ain't perfect yet (but neither are StarOffice or OpenOffice), but it's definitely GOOD.

Let's be honest - Microsoft Office is one of the two key things that binds the vast majority of users out there to Microsoft. If nothing else (for example), Apple can't piss off MS *too badly* or else there's suddenly no new MS Office for Mac, and the Mac *instantly* becomes a much less palatable choice (logically or not).

If Microsoft can be reduced to a bully with the top OS, it's a lot easier to handle than a bully with the top OS and the top office suite.

Let's give credit where credit is due. It's a good first step.

This is a pile of marketing bullshit (3, Insightful)

coupland (160334) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153658)

This is talking about personal PCs, how many PCs do you really think HP sells through Best Buy??? There is no real stand being taken here, two companies are thumping their chests by sending press releases to the media. This is a marketing stunt to counter Microsoft Select pricing, nothing more. Don't be a party to the hype...

Excellent (5, Insightful)

d3xt3r (527989) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153665)

This is an interesting move and I really have to wonder what motivated it, but none the less, i think it's a good thing for the future of office suite compatibility.

To all those of you already posting saying, "but Office is the standard...": Come on. MS Office is not the "standard", it just holds the majority of the word processing market. And its not because it was a superior product when it came out to Word Perfect, it was because it was free (or bundled with your Wintel box).

To all those of you saying, "but what not OpenOffice?": Who cares? As long as it isn't MS office, it means competiton. Competition is always a good thing, even if its between minority market share holders. Once MS office isn't the only game in town, file formats will open up.

If the office market becomes segmented again, we should see a common file format emerge. Then it won't matter who's using MS Office, Word Perfect, or Star/Open Office.

No, no, no (2, Funny)

Rui del-Negro (531098) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153694)

They did it the wrong way around. Word is actually a pretty decent word processor. They should have kept Word and ditched Windows!

RMN
~~~

Price competition (3, Interesting)

MicroBerto (91055) | more than 11 years ago | (#4153700)

If this takes hold and becomes a small success, I just hope that Microsoft decides to work some smart business and just drop their prices to reasonable levels for both corporations and consumers.

After working extensively with all of the office suites debated here, and as much as i hate to admit it, to me, Microsoft Office is still the best product (heh only if you uninstall that damned paper clip office assistant). I just think they should lower their prices and a touch of that drop can be forwarded onto Joe Consumer next time he decides to become a dude and get a dell.

Screw Windows, everyone should use linux. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4153722)

I stopped using microsoft word when it locked up on me and I lost my assignment. Ever since, I've been using linux and OO and haven't looked back. People can complain all they want about windows and office, but if the situation is to get better, the general public needs to learn how to use linux.
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