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Discarded AT&T Microwave Bunkers For Sale

chrisd posted more than 12 years ago | from the good-place-for-a-party dept.

Hardware 342

InitZero writes "American Tower is selling nearly 2000 old AT&T Long Line microwave locations that are no longer needed thanks to fiber. These towers -- spaced about 50 miles in every direction -- and their associated bunkers were designed to withstand World War III. The average location (find one near you) has two acres of land, 1,800 square feet worth of bunker and a tower of 200 feet. Some locations still have their hardware (60KW generator, microwave feedlines, equipment racks, feed horns, etc.) All this for an average price of just $25,000. If you're a ham radio operator, building a data center or just looking for a place to put your wireless access point, these locations look awesome."

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Slashdotted? (2)

Phroggy (441) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242049)

No replies yet, and it's slashdotted already?!?

This sounds pretty cool. Who here has an extra $25,000 lying around?

Re:Slashdotted? (0, Offtopic)

HappyPhunBall (587625) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242113)

" No replies yet, and it's slashdotted already?!?"

Well, I tried to post a reply several times before there were any comments and was confronted with failure as slashcode seemed unable to realize that I did have both a Subject Line and Body to my post. I suspect others were trying to post too and got shut down by some bit of flakiness in slashcode. Oh well. Wonder what kind of condition these things are in what it would take to make them livable?


Me too. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#4242283)

I reported the error on Sourceforge. Damn slashcode ;)

Re:Slashdotted? (3, Interesting)

rmohr02 (208447) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242116)

If I had it, I'd buy one. That is, if I knew where they were. I guess the site was preemptively /.ed.

Re:Slashdotted? (5, Funny)

Anonvmous Coward (589068) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242143)

"No replies yet, and it's slashdotted already?!?"

Wouldn't most people read the article before replying? ::eyeroll::

Okay, getting back on topic, is it possible to aim these things? I have a noisy neighbor that I'd like to ...uh.. provide free heating to.

Re:Slashdotted? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#4242339)

Wouldn't most people read the article before replying?

On Slashdot? Are you kidding?

Re:Slashdotted? (1)

TheKey (465831) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242146)

This happens with nearly every page, yet people continue to be amazed when there are no comments but the site is /.ed. Really, it happens all the time. Let's move on? :D

Re:Slashdotted? (2)

brad3378 (155304) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242178)

> No replies yet, and it's slashdotted already?!?

It appears slashdot has also been slashdotted.
Take note of your 10:04 EST post and the 9:38 posting of the story.

I'd like to see one of these towers put to better use with some bungi cords :-)

Re:Slashdotted? (2)

sporty (27564) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242275)

What do I look like, a .com millionaire? *snicker*

slashdot - slashcode disclosing passwords (-1)

Genghis Troll (158585) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242050)

Subject: slashdot / slashcode disclosing passwords
Date: Wed, 11 Sep 2002 13:25:45 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Michal Zalewski"
To: bugtraq@securityfocus.com, vulnwatch@vulnwatch.org

Hey,

I noticed that Slashdot has a nasty bug, which, I imagine is a fault of
Slashcode. On certain occassions, you can find a very interesting Referer
string for some visitiors of pages mentioned on this site. One of such
entries:

63.XXX.XXX.175 - - [11/Sep/2002:18:13:33 +0200] "GET /newtcp/ HTTP/1.1"
200 33541 "http://slashdot.org/?unickname=dXXg&passwd=rXXXX3 "
"Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Win98; en-US; rv:1.1) Gecko/20020826"
[lcamtuf.coredump.cx]

Go figure. This does not seem to be a consistent pattern, of thousands
hits from Slashdot only about 15-20 were like that today, so it seems like
a specific condition have to be met, yet it's not that uncommon - I'd
guess it happens right after you login and click on the link. I did not
investigate it too much, but it seems to me that Slashcode is fairly
popular and used in quite a few places - and that's a nice example of why
GET shouldn't be used for forms. This is based exclusively on the real
world observation of this pattern.

I gave Slashdot a short notice because it does not really matter how fast
you patch it - once public, people can grep their webserver logs for past
entries anyway.

--
Michal Zalewski

first post and more... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#4242051)

This is a damn good deal. 200 feet towers cost about 25000 by themselves, not just the materials, but the labor in erecting one... on a 200 foot tower, at 5 watts, in the 2 meter band, you are looking at 100 mile range on a homemade 1/4 wave clothes hanger antenna.... Not bad at all.

microwaves kick ass (2, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#4242052)

In many parts of the US, it gets very cold in the winter. The cold is even worse if you're working on a tower - they tend to be in high, exposed places due to their nature. This means more wind, lower temperatures, etc. Legend has it that tower crew would sometimes crawl into the microwave horns for a few seconds/minutes to warm up (for the same reasons you use a microwave to heat your dinner). That was all well and good, until one day a tech fell asleep in the warm, cozy horn.

oops.

that's hilarious (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#4242122)


can anyone corroborate this?

Re:that's hilarious (1)

buck_wild (447801) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242198)

Only to say that I'v heard a strikingly similar story. I'd not heard that the tech fell asleep.

mod up (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#4242230)

because it's funny

Yeah right .. reminds me of.. (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#4242248)

a story my teacher told me back in school about a tech at the Tokamak Fusion Chamber in Princeton, nj.. guy went in, someone (oops) turned it on, ridiculously strong magnetic field (used to drive fusion process of hydrogen and isolate fusioned material from metal walls) took all this guy's hemoglobin right out through his pores. stupid liar

Re:microwaves kick ass (1)

chamenos (541447) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242288)

the news article i read was that this security guard in charge of one such tower had a habit of sitting above the dish to heat up during the winter. the problem was that during new year's eve, all the new year greetings that people make requires the power of the microwave dish to be increased a few times over, and the security guard had no clue and sat at his usual spot as per normal.

the security guard taking the next shift reported that he smelt "barbecued meat" just before he discovered the cooked corpse of the other security guard with his cup of coffee long evaporated by the heat.

damn (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#4242054)

Not one near me :-(

Land? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#4242055)

That doesn't include the land, does it?

This is sad. (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#4242056)

I used to picnic next to these microwave towers so I could have a hot meal. Now I can't. Well at least my skin rash isn't as bad now.

Nah.... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#4242058)

The freeloaders here would rather continue wardriving and mooching off other people's wireless access.

Oh, and FP.

'dotted already? (-1)

Zapper (68283) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242059)

Can't seem to get American Tower site.
Google cache here [google.co.nz]

Shopping for the hard to buy geek (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#4242061)

Now that is a great weekend retreat for the /.'er who has everything!

Google cache (1)

diesel66 (254283) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242062)

slashdotted already?!

http://216.239.39.100/search?q=cache:lletWv9j9h8 J: www.americantower.com/OASISPublic/SiteSearchADO/de fault.asp+%22%2Bwww.americantower.%2Bcom/OasisPubl ic/SiteSearchADO/%22&hl=en&start=1&ie=UTF- 8

Cool (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#4242063)

Sounds like a great place to set up a new "Lone Justice" squad!

Survive WW3, but not a good slashdotting... (0, Informative)

victim (30647) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242065)

Some google cache hunting reveals that you can get the complete list in Excel format from... http://atcsdmaftp01.americantower.com/excelReports /NationalSiteList.xls [americantower.com] . Now that "I got Mine!" I'll share the URL with you. :-)

WTF? Slashdot says I'm missing a subject or a body? I suppose that is the lameness-required filter that made me add this stupid paragraph.

nevermind (3, Informative)

victim (30647) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242121)

Someone please mod the parent into oblivion. I believe that is the active site list, not the surplus site list.

Re:OT Survive WW3, but not a good slashdotting... (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#4242326)

so can i post yet?.. oooh ,I get to choose what format this is it.. thats a start...

dead link (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#4242066)

the "find one near you" link is dead. either slashdotted or otherwise.

EMP Hardening (1)

davidstrauss (544062) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242068)

I don't think the electronics of such a complex system, especially one designed to capture signals, could withstand the EMP effect of a nuclear explosion 5 miles away. Vacuum tubes are some of the only "advanced" electronics that can withstand anything, let alone transistors. The EMP effect was only well understood in the 1960s and later, a bit after these towers were built.

Oh, and imagine a nationwide Beowulf cluster of these. [Ducks moderators]

Re:EMP Hardening (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#4242110)

I think there already is a cluster of them. Didn't read the article did you

Re:EMP Hardening (4, Informative)

Phasedshift (415064) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242158)

According to the page that is linked in the summary http://www.drgibson.com/towers/ It mentions:

The buildings supporting the towers were hardened against a nuclear blast, and some of them in high-danger areas were underground. The towers themselves were engineered to withstand all but a close (within 5 miles) blast. The microwave horns were covered with a protective shield to keep out not only the elements, but also radioactive fallout. The buildings were shielded with copper to protect the equipment against the Electromagnetic Pulse associated with a nuclear explosion. Foot-thick concrete walls protected the vital electronics and people inside the base installations of these towers. Thick copper grounds went deep into the bedrock beneath each tower. Fallout showers, backup generators, sleeping facilities all existed to keep the network up in times of war.

So while the equipment itself is likely hardened, the building is shielded.. It doesn't say how much shielding, etc there is however :)

Re:EMP Hardening (1)

davidstrauss (544062) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242213)

You can't shield against EMP with a conductor unless it completely encloses the entire system. A communication tower MUST have cables going to unsheilded equipment. Shielding communication equipment would cause the equipment to malfunction, and I didn't see a giant copper shield around the towers in the pictures.

Re: EMP Hardening (2)

Black Parrot (19622) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242196)


> Oh, and imagine a nationwide Beowulf cluster of these.

Actually, it might be a good way to set up a disaster-resistant beowulf cluster. One node per bunker, interconnect via the towers. Keep those protein-folding analyses running even after the species is extinct...

Well, at least it would give the alien archaeologists something interesting to puzzle over. And introduce them to the idea of beowulf clusters, so the joke could infect their civilization as well.

Re:EMP Hardening (1)

djupedal (584558) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242331)

I worked on some of these (underground bunker types), as an Inspector (concrete/steel), during the early '70s. I recall at least one had to be abandoned due to several batches of concrete that failed strength testing in the lab. They simply covered it with dirt and moved over several hundred yards to begin again.

They were heavily compartmented, and built much like a bank vault, where you have a box inside a box inside a box. There was at least one central cavity that was meant to be home for worst case attacks.

GeekNet (1)

ni5mo (590178) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242071)

Awesome! If we all got one of these we cauld create and independet microwave network. Of course you'd have to get transmitter licences and stuff, but it would be kewl. Oh yeah, and I'd have to move to the States too :)

Let me get this straight ... (1)

RimmerExperience (456643) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242072)

The internet (and swelling need for bandwidth) kills off the old technology, making old bunker locations obsolete.

Meanwhile, the internet (and swelling need for bandwidth) makes bunker technology highly desirable.

Thousands of years of evolution and we still can't get this predilection holes in the ground.

Re:Let me get this straight ... (1)

RimmerExperience (456643) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242106)

Thousands of years of evolution and we still can't get this predilection holes in the ground. Thousands of hours of education and I still can't proofread.

Re:Let me get this straight ... (1)

Mage Powers (607708) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242155)

bunkers spaced 50 miles apart with microwave towers isn't really economic, personally I think these things are a neat piece of history. Hopefully one is kept intact for boring little kids.

yes maybe but... (1)

neo8750 (566137) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242073)

Sure. they may be a good place for a wireless accesspoint but hell for 25k you could probly work out a way to get more locations.

/.ed Already (1)

Honig the Apothecary (515163) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242075)

Its fried and there is not even a comment...so here is the Google Cache. Sorry no link to the list of sites :(

Google Cache [216.239.39.100]

No kidding... I remember these well. (5, Interesting)

djupedal (584558) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242077)

I was an Inspector on these in Northern Calif. I monitored the construction for a private firm. Concrete pours and steel, etc.

They are hell-for-stout, no doubt. You could wipe out everything above ground in the US, and still get a dial tone. Most are in remote locations, naturally, and include fuel storage tanks (propane) and blast shielding. Just the ticket for anyone looking for the ultimate private bomb shelter.

Sadly... (5, Funny)

descentr (296258) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242079)

It appears these bunkers will NOT protect you from the fury of Slashdot.

World War III... really? (3, Insightful)

Devil's BSD (562630) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242082)

Assuming there was a nuclear holocaust/World War III, how would a 500 ft microwave tower resist being blown down by a nuclear blast? Even if there is the bunker, the transmission effectiveness will be effectively zero without the tower.

Re:World War III... really? (2)

descentr (296258) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242112)

Err, that's a 200 foot tower, buddy.

Re:World War III... really? (2)

garcia (6573) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242141)

the tower could be re-erected (sounds like pr0n I know) quickly in the event that it was actually hit by the shockwave or direct blast. The important part is that the actual bunker remains intact.

blast pressure (5, Informative)

rebelcool (247749) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242147)

is measured in lb/sq. inch. The reason the blast is so damaging to buildings is because of wall size magnifies the force to a few tons of pressure on the side of the wall. The towers if you notice, are open, thin bars that present little surface area for the blast to contact. What is exposed is well anchored.

Re:blast pressure (-1, Troll)

domninus.DDR (582538) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242296)

please, stop biasing your posts to the US. I preffer my pressure in kg/m^2 thanks!

Thats a lot of pixels... (1)

DrShaggy (582315) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242083)

Am I going to need that 3840x2400 monitor just to view these pics? How convienient that they were announced so close together...

This brings back fond memories. (2)

Gumber (17306) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242084)

I have fond memories of spending a strange summer night in the vicinity of one of these situated on a mountain pass when I was in high school. I'm just glad my fiends didn't climb the tower durring the gathering thundersorm.

Re:This brings back fond memories. (3, Funny)

sconeu (64226) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242244)

I'm just glad my fiends didn't climb the tower

I'm sure Satan is too... He hates to lose fiends in electrical storms!

Not useful, is it? (1)

Dancin_Santa (265275) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242085)

Even if someone were to get their hands on one of these sites, wouldn't the upkeep cost outweigh the benefits of stronger ham radio signals?

Also, wouldn't there be some kind of FCC regulation regarding what you could do with these towers?

It sounds like a moneysink to me.

Re:Not useful, is it? (0)

Cubeman (530448) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242149)

The FCC has *nothing* to do with the towers, only the transmission equipment. You'd have to get a license to be able to transmit with the microwave equipment, but otherwise you could just cook really big TV dinners :)

terror (0, Offtopic)

h4x0r-3l337 (219532) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242086)

oh no! Terrorists have attacked the slashdot comment system!

I would like one of these (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#4242087)

Yes, it's true.


Slow down cowboy!
  • AD 2001: Martial Law was beginning
  • the islamic movement began the day the CIA put the Shah into power in Iran
  • bush dodged the draft
osama is here: blah blah [oralse.cx]

ATT sliders lower into the gutter (-1, Flamebait)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#4242088)

Once upon a time ATT was the big guy on the block. Now they are limp wristed petunias, swishing along aimlessly with the rest of the cookie cutter telecom pansies. How sad. I wonder what ball-less 25 year old wonder cooked up this fiasco.

Message to ATT: grow some, and show some leadership. Your microwave longlines are an asset. Use your imagination, schmucks.

Fiber + Microwaves (1)

messiertom (590151) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242090)

Seems to me it's best to have them both:

Let F = Food high in fiber. Let M = Microwave.

F = Bad

F + M = Good

Re:Fiber + Microwaves (1, Offtopic)

NanoGator (522640) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242338)

Let F = Food high in fiber. Let M = Microwave.


F = Bad

F + M = Good


Just start your BASIC class there, buddy? :)

Pink MW Horns? (0)

lhaeh (463179) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242092)

One of the links shows the microwave horns painted pink. Anyone know why this would be done? The site (http://www.drgibson.com/towers/frank_schmid.html) suggests cosmetic reasons, which might not be far off as I've seen cell towers made to look like trees in suburban neiborhoods.
Could it have been to block/filter fallout?

Idea! (2)

Com2Kid (142006) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242093)

1800 square feet? Larger then many studio apartments. Heck larger then most studio apartments.

I say setup a decent 'net connection and become a digital hermit. (e-hermit?)

Re: Idea! (0, Offtopic)

Black Parrot (19622) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242171)


> I say setup a decent 'net connection and become a digital hermit.

Yeah, you could download a lot of porn over one of those receivers!

Cool... (1)

Mikeydude750 (607965) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242094)

Interesting. I'd like to put my house on one of those things. Think about it...a bomb shelter, and a radio tower to boot! All for only 25 G's. Nice deal.

take that, SIGINT sattelites! (3, Funny)

cygnus (17101) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242105)

AT LAST! a location for my echelon spoofing site. ;)

Re:take that, SIGINT sattelites! (0, Offtopic)

cygnus (17101) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242256)

whoever modded that down doesn't know dukey about SIGINT or Echelon or the security failures of line-of-sight microwave telco transmissions.

your cluelessness shouldn't result in my punishment.

WTC Towers (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#4242107)

I know this is unrelated, but I was wondering what anyone thought about this evidence of demolition of the World Trade Center Towers?
http://serendipity.cia.com.au/wtc.html

Um, laws? (0)

VTg33k (605268) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242117)

Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't there laws against Joe Schmoe owning something capable of generating signals like that? The bunker and land, sure, but doesn't the FCC have a problem with some weirdo buying a tower and broadcasting Eminem on all frequencies?

Re:Um, laws? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#4242157)

Partially right. The FCC only has laws regulating White music. If you want to broadcast Nigger music your are allowed to use as much spectrum and as many channels as you want.

a thought (1)

sstory (538486) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242125)

I suppose it would make a cheap nerd house. perfect if you're the kind of guy who supposes that women are turned on by Darth Vader t-shirts. Not awfully practical, though. If you want a house in the middle of nowhere, find a 500-resident ghost town, in, say, South Dakota, where they go for $6k. Think about it--a vacation home on a grad student's salary. :-)

When in the market, also consider.. (1)

tedDancin (579948) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242126)

Something like this [bbc.co.uk] , a UK nuclear bunker which was auctioned in July. No better place to store important information, might have some problems with the wireless transmission though. (:

Awesome and cheap.. (1)

mcraw (571702) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242136)

...but still more than I can afford. Plus, who wants to sit in there getting cancer? I suppose you could set up an ISP business and hire someone else to watch the servers for you.

These sites are awesome! (3, Interesting)

Newer Guy (520108) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242140)

I've been inside of several of them and they're simply awesome and must have cost a fortune to build and maintain. They have living quarters and water tanks. The equipment mostly ran off of banks of single cell (2 volt) batteries that were kept charged by utility power and generator. They used klystron transmitters I understand. Another cold war relic made obsolete I guess..but I can't help but be nostalgic for just a bit.. Can you?

Re:These sites are awesome! (5, Interesting)

Nate B. (2907) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242254)

I'm too young in the business to know, but I've been told by some of the elder techs in the company (we maintain a private microwave system) that the AT&T sites were laid out so identically to each other that a tech who knew his way around one could be blindfolded and taken into any site and would be able to work on the equipment. AT&T and the Bell System were big on standards so I don't doubt the accuracy of this claim.

Even as careful as we are to try to maintain a standard layout, each of the sites I maintain all have their own quirks. But then, we have auxillary equipment that varies from site to site so that screws up the attempt at standardization.

More Long Lines information (5, Informative)

ISAKMP (85791) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242144)

Mark Foster has another really nice Long Lines site [shore.net] that includes a table [shore.net] that lists many Long Lines facilites in many states, describes the equipment installed there and has photos of some of the facilities. He also provides the technical specifications [shore.net] for the construction of these sites, as well as photos from tour [shore.net] he took of a still-operating one.

Slashdotted Already? (5, Informative)

MoodyLoner (76734) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242150)

Guess I'm not the only one to dream of owning a nuke-resistant bunker.



Here's the Google cache [216.239.51.100] of the site map to salivate over...



Good news if you're back east or in the Bay Area, bad news otherwise.



Say, wonder if Mrs. Moody would mind running a home daycare out of one of these?



Re:Slashdotted Already? (5, Informative)

no soup for you (607826) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242229)

Here's the Google cache [216.239.51.100] of the site map to salivate over...
google does not cache images. You really could have just linked to this picture [americantower.com] of the states' tower locations

I appreciate the effort, but I think we should all know google's capabilities.

Re:Slashdotted Already? (1)

justsomecomputerguy (545196) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242273)

From looking at the map of locations, it occurs to me that these might be great places to set up new, upstart and possibly, just possibly good FM radio stations...

Made for parties (5, Funny)

fiori (45848) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242165)

Just fill the microwave horn with popcorn and fire-up that 60kW generator.

Built to withstand World War 3? (2)

cperciva (102828) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242169)

What's the point behind having bunkers here which can withstand nuclear attacks?

The obvious answer would be that they wanted to ensure that the communications infrastructure would survive, but that doesn't make sense -- the towers would be destroyed quite easily, and without the towers, all the equipment protected in the bunkers would be useless anyway.

Am I missing something here?

Re:Built to withstand World War 3? (2)

TheOnlyCoolTim (264997) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242205)

It's probably a lot easier to rebuild the tower after nuclear holocaust than to rebuild the tower and all the delicate equipment hooked up to it.

If I could read the article, for all I know there could be an entire extra in pieces inside the bunker.

Tim

Re:Built to withstand World War 3? (1)

buck_wild (447801) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242243)

Yes you are, according to a previous post.

To quote rebelcool:
(Blast Pressure) is measured in lb/sq. inch. The reason the blast is so damaging to buildings is because of wall size magnifies the force to a few tons of pressure on the side of the wall. The towers if you notice, are open, thin bars that present little surface area for the blast to contact. What is exposed is well anchored.

-Build your own community. Free and powerful. Demo Site-

Not just microwave (2, Informative)

Nate B. (2907) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242170)

It seems AT&T had a considerable investment in long distance buried coaxial cable. Apparently there was a pair of these cable laid a few miles away from here as a contractor was going through a few years back digging them back up and recovering them.

As I recall from the local paper's article the cables were probably 4 to 6 inches in diameter and were then encased in lead. I also recall that they were buried several feet deep, at least deeper than water lines and regular phone cable gets buried around here.

From my youth I recall an AT&T Long Lines bunker a few miles south of US 36 on US 75 north of Topeka, KS. I believe these cables went through there as they were on an east/west run through northern Kansas. Where the ultimate terminating points were would be a good exercise.

Many old microwave sites are still standing around these parts. The tower lights and painting are still maintained. It's interesting that it apparently cost more to disassemble them than to leave them stand.

build a giant tesla coil (1)

fleps (241451) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242183)

on top of the bunker instead of a dull microwave tower. You can power the coil off your bonus 60kW generator, and lurk in the bunker.

Good for isolationists, not many visitors will get past the flaming lightning bolts of doom. Or invest in a network of coils (one every 50 miles) and see if you can block out Seinfeld with the RFI.

I'd link to Lightning on Demand/Electrum Project (in NZ, raay) (http://www.lod.org) but they seem to be broken.

Broadband 2 boonies (5, Interesting)

CrazyDuke (529195) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242185)

Am I the only one thinking of the possibility of buying 2 within signal distance of each other, one in a city where broadband is actually affordable, and one out in the boonies or small cities where at best people get 53K dialup and using it to set up a broadband ISP? $50,000 initial investment + permits is pretty steep still, though.

Hell, or get paid for offering an alternative route for congested hops.

Re:Broadband 2 boonies (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#4242321)

You're forgetting that the microwave towers are very inefficient at transmitting data. If it were possible to support an entire ISP over these links, then Ma Bell would already be doing it, instead of selling them off at a loss.

Call me one of no faith but (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#4242195)

"associated bunkers were designed to withstand World War III.."

How was this ever tested?

not only (1, Redundant)

Gavitron_zero (544106) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242207)

would this make a great fallout shelter, but you could heat up all of your cans of food with all that microwave goodness.

World War III? (2)

thelinuxking (574760) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242211)

World War II involved the dropping of "The Bomb". The destructive force of the atomic bomb completely destroyed entire cities.

World War III (for those not in the know, it hasn't started yet...) will probably involve much more powerful weapons than even the atomic bomb. Chances are this structure won't be able to withstand the force of this kind of weaponry.

And if it does still stand after a bomb, chances are no one in your 50 mile area will be alive to hear your ham radio station.

Re:World War III? (3, Interesting)

be-fan (61476) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242270)

Umm, World War III was planned to happen back in the 60's. That's what these things were built to withstand.

Wichita Horror: Sub-Human Negro Savages On Trial (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#4242222)

'Wichita Horror' trial to begin

Monday Sept. 9, 2002. When Reginald and Jonathan Carr go on trial today for a crime spree now known as the "Wichita Horror," there probably won't be any mention of race. But that doesn't mean the people of Wichita won't be thinking about it.

The Carr brothers are charged with a whopping 113 counts stemming from the murders of five Wichitans in December 2000, including the execution-style slayings of four young roommates on a frozen soccer field. Because the Carrs are black and their victims white, many observers expected the brothers to be charged with hate crimes. When the District Attorney's Office failed to do so, it touched off accusations of racial favoritism and a flood of angry letters and e-mails from as far away as Europe.

That sense of racial injustice was exacerbated by the dearth of national media attention on the crime. Although the Associated Press covered the story, only a handful of newspapers outside Kansas picked it up, even though locals said the murders were arguably as horrific as those of James Byrd in Texas or Matthew Shepherd in Wyoming.

"If this had been two white males accused of killing four black individuals, the media would be on a feeding frenzy and every satellite news organization would be in Wichita doing live reports," said Trent Hungate of Wichita in a letter to the Wichita Eagle shortly after the crime. District Attorney Nola Foulston argued that she couldn't charge the brothers with hate crimes because Kansas had no hate-crimes statute. Furthermore, the prosecution is seeking the death penalty, which cannot be enhanced by hate-crimes status.

Still, accusations of a double standard have persisted. "To say 'They'd get the death penalty anyway' mitigates the whole purpose of having hate-crimes statutes," said Lou Calabro of the European-American Issues Forum in San Francisco. "Often a criminal will get 102 years or more, and what's the point of that?" he said. "The whole purpose of having them is that it's more serious to attack a racial group than just a guy."

The only network to cover the Wichita killings is Court TV, which plans coverage of the trial from Sedgwick County District Court following jury selection, which begins today. A jury pool of 517 persons -- a county record -- has been selected for interviews, a process that is expected to take about two weeks.

The problem is finding a dozen people who haven't already made up their minds about the crime. The defense, which tried unsuccessfully to move the trial, released a survey earlier this year showing that 74 percent of county residents said the Carrs were either "guilty" or "definitely guilty." Even so, Paul Cromwell, a professor of criminal justice at Wichita State University, said he was confident that District Court Judge Paul Clark would be able to seat an impartial jury.

"It might have been difficult two years ago, but I think they can get a fair trial now," he said. "It's hard to find someone who hasn't read about it or heard about it, but the fever pitch is gone, although that hasn't diminished the seriousness of the crime."

Key to the prosecution's success will be the testimony of H.G., a young woman now known only by her initials and the sole survivor of the Dec. 15, 2000, attack. In an April 16, 2001, deposition, she told the court that the Carrs broke into the townhouse where she and four friends, all in their 20s, were winding down after a day of work. She said the Carrs forced her and her friend Heather Muller, 25, at gunpoint to perform sex acts on each other, then instructed their three male friends to have sex with them, then raped the women themselves. The brothers drove the five to an ATM to withdraw money from their accounts and then to the snowy soccer field at about 2 a.m.

The Carrs told the five to kneel in the snow with their backs to them, then shot them in the head one by one. Somehow, H.G. survived, and after the brothers drove away, she ran naked across the frozen field to seek help. The Carrs are also accused of shooting and killing a local cellist, Linda Ann Walenta, in a robbery attempt outside her home four days earlier. They face additional robbery charges for an ATM robbery earlier that month.

Judge Clark refused defense motions for separate trials for the brothers, leading to speculation that the two could try to save themselves by pointing fingers at each other. The Carrs, both from nearby Dodge City, Kan., are also expected to argue that they were nowhere near the scene of the weeklong crime spree.

Too Much of a Good Thing (2)

Stephen VanDahm (88206) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242231)

To quote Strong Bad [homestarrunner.com] , "too much of a good thing is an awesome thing. But too much of an awesome thing is ... umm ... really, really dumb."

This is almost too much of an awesome thing. But it's awesome nonetheless.

Re:Too Much of a Good Thing (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#4242291)


Please do not quote StongBad. He is really, really dumb.

Build a house! (2)

Alizarin Erythrosin (457981) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242262)

Heck, 2 acres is a decent plot of land for a house. Plus you got a generator! How can you lose? Use the tower to put an access point up and you can have wireless all over your land, and charge neighbors for access :-)

Re:Build a house! (1)

jsimon12 (207119) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242323)

Do you have any idea how much diesel a 60kW generator uses in an hour? Hope you own lots of Shell stock ;) Heck if you are gonna run off a 60kW generator I think I am gonna buy Shell stock ;)

die of boredom (1)

SlugLord (130081) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242290)

Well it's good to know that I can continue playing Quake 3 after nuclear winter kills off all other life. With all that space I can live for a long time, and I wouldn't want to die of boredom.

Friend bought one (5, Interesting)

Lewie (3743) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242298)

A friend who owns a paging company just bought one of these. I tagged along during the negotiation and purchase. They are indeed, as a previous poster put it, "hell for stout." The scale of the tower, building and microwave cones makes the whole thing seem like a toy. It's just that weird. The towers are huge, this one is a 100 ft free-standing, 30 ft on a side IIRC with 25 foot tall microwave cones at the peak and associated waveguide down into the concrete buildings. This is a smaller installation, but still has huge power service and infrastructure, neat-o VW diesel inline 6 backup generator and enormous battery supply (the size of a truck or so), later added hardline to the top, it was a hell of a deal (more so considering how difficult towers are to get up these days).

What really boggles my mind is the BILLIONS and BILLIONS of dollars that went into building these things in the 60's. They are truly incredible, inside and out. Someone decided that there WOULD be long distance (and there was).

Re:Friend bought one (4, Informative)

djupedal (584558) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242320)

I worked on some of these (underground bunker types), as an Inspector (concrete/steel), during the early '70s. I recall at least one had to be abandoned due to several batches of concrete that failed strength testing in the lab. They simply covered it with dirt and moved over several hundred yards to begin again.

They were heavily compartmented, and built much like a bank vault, where you have a box inside a box inside a box. There was at least one central cavity that was meant to be home for worst case attacks.

As I recall, this was pre ATT, and they were built for ITT, under a government contract to provide domestic communications if WWW III (as stated) broke out. And yes, there was considerable money invested.

just testing stuff (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#4242307)

testing posting

The Dust Puppy Walks at Midnight (2)

doublem (118724) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242316)

Now I and my friends can LARP the userfriendly.org story arc where they moved into a missile silo!

Yes!

Imagine the possibilities (0, Redundant)

eviljolly (411836) | more than 12 years ago | (#4242329)

So could I hook them all up, then focus them at a single point to cook my hot pockets in a matter of a few seconds?

Arr! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 12 years ago | (#4242330)

yee scurvy sea dogs are no match for yee slashdot effect.

please mod me a troll, because instead of posting something about the article, i like to talk bout how a server will be temporary unavailable due to overwhelming traffic.
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