Beta

# Debian Desktop Subproject Launched

#### Hemos posted more than 11 years ago | from MrOutlander

387

MrOutlander writes "The Debian Project is now officially addressing its usability on the desktop with the launch of the Debian Desktop subproject. Great to see usability being recognized as a very important part of debian. Other than the sometimes daunting install process, Debian is one of the best linux distributions."

cancel ×

### No Comment Title Entered

#### Anonymous Coward 1 minute ago

No Comment Entered

### Wow, two Debians in a day (-1, Troll)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### gazbo | more than 11 years ago

And they're both shitty stories, yet on the front page.

### Debian = good server? (1)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### vkt-tje | more than 11 years ago

Let's hope they don't forget the real server builders in the process

### Sniper is a NIGGER (-1, Troll)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago

Did anyone ever think it WAS NOT a member of one of the lower MUDRACES?

Any realistic PATRIOTIC WHITE MAN should know better now than to trust a filthy NIGGER.

Pictures of the ape and info can be found here.

MSNBC The Struggle

### Re:Sniper is a NIGGER (-1, Troll)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago

And his last name is Muhammad .
Who saw that one coming?

### YOU ARE BOTH HOMOSEXUALS (-1, Offtopic)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

### Isnt Linux Customizable? (1, Interesting)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago

okay, I am not trying to troll/flame here, but I have a question about all these different flavors of linux. If they are soooo customizable, then why need 40 different distros? There is one Apple, there is only 1 Windows (okay, there are two, a prof and a home), why have all these different linuxes? why not just one, make it great, and enter into the desktop market? seems like they are all competing more with each other than with the Big Boys.

### Re:Isnt Linux Customizable? (1, Informative)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### omegakidd | more than 11 years ago

MacOS is one project. Windows is one project.
Linux is opensource and many people can start their own projects if they want to. Finally, different linux falvors have different purposes (ex. For the first time user or for the expert.).

### Re:Isnt Linux Customizable? (5, Informative)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### z-man | more than 11 years ago

When it comes to Debian it is not just a choice of distro, it is a choice of distro built on good principles as well as on good architecture.

The truth is however that each distro exist to offer you even more customizibilty. You have distros like Slack/Gentoo that many like because they don't include many unnecessary packages and the distro offers you much configurability. Many don't like these distros however because they don't have the time to compile(Gentoo)/configure/install everything the good-old-way or that they just want a distro that is a tad more user-friendly. For those you RedHat/Suse and Mandrake that are distros that are based on a binary package system (Gentoo has ports which downloads the source and compiles it). Each of these have their own "touch" as well.
Mandrake offers many patches/programs to make life easier, so Mandrake is a very popular choice for people that are new to Linux.
RedHat doesn't offer as much as Mandrake in the newbie area, and are a bit more strict on what goes into their kernel and distro. So imo RedHat isn't quite as user-friendly as Mandrake.
SuSe I don't know much about, I know that tthey have a configuration utility that has gotten a lot of positive feedback (YaST isn't it?).

So the choice of distro is just a part of the customization. Part of running Linux is choosing the distro that is right for you.

### Re:Isnt Linux Customizable? (1)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### wolfc | more than 11 years ago

The way in which a Linux distribution is customizable makes up the flavor.

My personal favorite is still Debian. I like most of the choices they've made for me, and I don't have (/take) the time to do it differently.

I'm a bit sceptic about (yet another) desktop project for Linux. Mainly because I'm a gamehead so I just follow where game developers lead me, with one exception: a game server must run on Linux.

So for me it's a windows 98se (talk about '1' windows, tsk) on a game station and Debian Linux on my server.

Maybe the focus of a desktop project should go to the games, let's infect the next generation. I for one would love to see my daughter play with a Linux computer instead of one with windows.

### Re:Isnt Linux Customizable? (1)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### rickms | more than 11 years ago

You make it sound that there is someone with a rubber stamp authorizing each new distribution. It is simply a matter of different people having different ideas on the best way to distribute GNU/Linux.

Some people would have you think otherwise, but choice is a good thing.

Rick

### Re:Isnt Linux Customizable? (5, Insightful)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### FooBarWidget | more than 11 years ago

Because they all target a different audience. It is impossible to have 1 distro that fits all.

Let's look at the following targets: server, corporate desktop, home desktop and embedded.
Server: customizability and security is a Good Thing(tm). You don't need GUI tools, they only make the server less stable. You need to have server software installed.

Corporate desktop: you need GUIs. You don't want server software, but office software. Security is important.
This target conflicts with the server target.

Home desktop: *customizability and security* are not important. The home user simply doesn't care and is lazy. He doesn't want to customize everything, and doesn't want to enter a password to install software.
This conflicts with both server and corporate desktop.

Embedded: you want to have as less stuff as possible because disk space and memory are limited. This conflicts with all of the above.

You see? Totally different targets with totally different needs. And this is just an example, the real world is much, MUCH more complicated. Add a graphical installer and you'll piss off the old school power users or users with old hardware. Don't add a graphical installer and you'll piss of the home user. Add an option and you'll confuse the hell out of newbies. Etc. etc.
You can't have one single distro that fits them all, the situations are too different.

### Re:Isnt Linux Customizable? (0)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago

Linux is Open Source meaning NOBODY owns Linux, i myself (or anyone else including you) can make a Linux distro and release it, now thats real freedom as in American Freedom...

USA #1

### Re:Isnt Linux Customizable? (0)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago

is not competing with each others a good thing?
i think it will produce a better solution in the end...

### Re:Isnt Linux Customizable? (1)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### MCZapf | more than 11 years ago

I'd say it's because they are still a pain to customize, at lease from my POV.

### Re:Isnt Linux Customizable? (3, Insightful)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### tetra103 | more than 11 years ago

I totally agree, but only to a point. I think there should be a standard on what a Linux core system is. And that "core" system should be part of every Linux distro. So what's the "core", I'd make it as simple as possible. It should be a simple filesystem structure, standard set of drivers, and the very minimal set of system commands (something less then 20 commands and perferribly NOT anything from FSF). The "core" probably wouldn't be anything more that say 5Mb. Then everything else, like the GNU utilities, GCC, XFree, ... would all be addons. This would be very analogous to the UNIX days with the BSD distro addon. When you think about it, isn't that what Linux is today? And besides, then we could end that whole dumbass Linux vs Linux/GNU naming scheme that RMS and his FSF buddies cry about. Linux would then be LINUX and GNU will then be what is really is....just a bunch of addon utilities. That to me is the cleanist approach to standardising Linux.

### At last (-1, Flamebait)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago

a Linux desktop distro which won't be plagued by bugs!

I'm serious.

Commercial desktop Linuxs are always so buggy, they're worse than Windows.

### Re:At last (0)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago

Thats funny. I gave up Woody after 2 weeks because I was sick of all the small annoying bugs. Went back to Redhat.

### one of the best linux distributions? (5, Funny)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### jiminim | more than 11 years ago

In other news:

-Lemonade is one of the best beverages

-Pink is the best color

-Pi is the best number

### Pi (1)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### MoceanWorker | more than 11 years ago

and the best movie ;-)

### Re:Pi (1)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### vlag | more than 11 years ago

MMMMM ... American Pi.

### Re:Pi (0)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago

MMMMMM.... Hair Pi !

This neat-to-eat treat is my personal favorite!.

### Re:one of the best linux distributions? (1)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Ogion | more than 11 years ago

Actually, Pi is quite boring. It's all about circles. The Euler Number, now that's a cool number. You can do a lot of funny stuff with it.

### Re:one of the best linux distributions? (1)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### leviramsey | more than 11 years ago

Actually, Pi is quite boring. It's all about circles. The Euler Number, now that's a cool number. You can do a lot of funny stuff with it.

e: The Most Powerful Force in the Universe!

### Re:one of the best linux distributions? (1)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### distributed.karma | more than 11 years ago

Well yes.. but since we all know $e^{i\pi}+1=0$ (and yes we all know latex:) then pi and e are deeply interconnected in the fabric of the universe. Without either of them, there wouldn't be people around, discussing the importance of either. :-)

### Required Reading... (5, Informative)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### toupsie | more than 11 years ago

Aqua Human Interface Guidelines and Mac OS 8 Human Interface Guidelines. Don't reinvent the wheel, perfect it.

### Re:Required Reading... (0)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago

No everyone agrees with apple. Though the do have some good ideas.

### Re:Required Reading... (5, Funny)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### toupsie | more than 11 years ago

No everyone agrees with apple. Though the do have some good ideas.

Blasphemy!

### Re:Required Reading... (0)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago

Please don't make it look like Aqua.

### Re:Required Reading... (4, Insightful)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### toupsie | more than 11 years ago

Please don't make it look like Aqua.

Don't worry about that. If Debian dares to mimic Aqua as a theme for their Deskstop, Apple will sue them over look and feel. Jobs is good at that. However, the HIG provided free of charge online will be a good guide for Debian to enhance the usability of their KDE and GNOME desktops for the novice users.

### Re:Required Reading... (4, Interesting)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Bonker | more than 11 years ago

Personally, I would pay more attention to the OS8 guidelines that the Aqua guidelines. IMHO, Aqua is a little broke. (Quicktime, anybody?) There's way too much emphasis on making computer controls look like real-life objects and not like computer controls.

As someone who's used OS8, OS9, Linux, and all the video variants, let me tell you that OS8 comes pretty damn close to being *golden*. Apple spent a lot of time making OS7-9 pleasant and easy to use and it shows.

### Re:Required Reading... (4, Insightful)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### The J Kid | more than 11 years ago

Don't reinvent the wheel, perfect it.

Yes. Yes. Yes. People..read this line and chant it.

And in the process, they could also team up with the 'Debian Graphical Installer' group (see this /. article) to provide a full & finished desktop experience.

### Re:Required Reading... (0)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago

forget the aqua interface guidelines. look at the icons. i mean honestly those arent user-friendly. macos8 is ok but aqua thanks sir

### Re:Required Reading... (4, Interesting)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

### Re:Required Reading... (5, Funny)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### toupsie | more than 11 years ago

What about the GNOME Human Interface Guide?

I'm not interested in interfacing with a fabled race of dwarflike creatures, I'm interested in interfacing through a GUI to a UNIX or UNIX-like system.

### Re:Required Reading... (2)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### FooBarWidget | more than 11 years ago

Then the GNOME Human Interface Guide is exactly what you are looking for.

Oh BTW, GNOME is a desktop environment. Now you know.

### Re:Required Reading... (2)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### digidave | more than 11 years ago

Mod parent up! Funny!

Ok, seriously, Gnome, KDE et al have some serious usability issues to deal with. While at first they seem pretty much like Windows (or whatever else they're trying to duplicate), when you start to use them every day you begin to see how disconnected they are from the rest of the OS. No Linux interface that exists today provides unified system usability.

### Apple == left handed computers (0)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago

I agree i wouldn't think Apple is the holy grail of interfaces

i mean these are the people that put the close/max/min window controls on the left hand side of the interface !

whats wrong with that you cry ?
the greater number of world users are right handed and the scrollbars of said windows/documents are on the right unless you are reading Arabic etc)
therefore just to close a window the user has to navigate their mouse across the entire window area which seems to be bad usability design as the distance travelled is the greatest (meaning increased hand motion and time taken to close window slower)

Surely more sense would be to put the main window controls closest to the scrollbars (like windows(TM)/kde etc have done with hidden lh controls) as only a few document languages have the scrolling mechanisim on the left (and btw none are english)
that way the mouse distance travelled is kept to a minimum making to match the users righthandness and the documents scrollport

makes sense no ? but Apple think different

so take a few pointers from Apple but dont think they are the gods of UI design when clearly they are not from a usability p.o.v after all remember quicktime and its virtual thumbwheel ?

AJC

### How funny because (0, Offtopic)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### cptnapalm | more than 11 years ago

I was just cursing out Debian, which is my main OS, because yet again my XF86Config-4 got overwriten by a default. WinXP to the rescue...

### Re:How funny because (2)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Per Wigren | more than 11 years ago

No, it's because you said "yes" when it asked if it should replace it, or you used some --always-say-yes flag or "yes | apt-get upgrade" or something like that...

### Re:How funny because (0)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago

I alway have found it funny, that people blame linux for doing what they told it to do, or not knowing how to use it... Start blaming yourself.

### Re:How funny because (1)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### hplasm | more than 11 years ago

Hence WinXP to the rescue...something to hang the blame on..uh- hang on, it will probably be to blame..

### Re:How funny because (3, Informative)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

### Re:How funny because (2, Informative)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### mbanck | more than 11 years ago

I was just cursing out Debian, which is my main OS, because yet again my XF86Config-4 got overwriten by a default.

Check out any recent post from Branden Robinson on debian-devel, most of them cover this, this one for example.

Michael

### Start Here: (5, Informative)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Bonker | more than 11 years ago

The Gnome Usability Report:

http://developer.gnome.org/projects/gup/ut1_report /participant_mix.html

I read this about a year ago. It does an *excellent* job of pointing out many of the inconsistencies and gotchas in any given linux desktop situation.

### Re:Start Here: (0)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago

Gnome and Usability, not the 2 words I would put in the same sentence.

### Also (5, Informative)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

### Daunting? (5, Insightful)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### ksw2 | more than 11 years ago

Debian's installer isn't any more difficult than any other distribution, IMHO. Why do people freeze up as soon as they see a text-based installer?

### Re:Daunting? (0)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago

Because they are used to GUIs!?
Wether you like the debian installer, or think text based installers are nice, it doesn't help the other people who don't thinks so(and thats many).
So the "problem" needs to be dealt with.

### Re:Daunting? (3, Insightful)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### marko123 | more than 11 years ago

Because people born after about 1980 freak out when they move a mouse and nothing happens.

Sheesh.

### Re:Daunting? (1)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### GT_Alias | more than 11 years ago

<mangled movie quote>

The sight of the text had triggered bad memories. The glazed look in their eyes said their text had been cut (and, presumably, not pasted). They were still in the grip of paralysis when we left.

</mangled movie quote>

### Re:Daunting? (2, Interesting)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Ace Rimmer | more than 11 years ago

Bah, maybe if you use it for a server. I installed it on a workstation and besides sound, 3d graphics, i18n everything was quite fine (I've chosen minimal instalation and then used apt instead that pigdoggish green spit dselect ;). After a day or two I had everything working fine but mdk or redhat is another story.

Just try to replace a videocard - what will Debian with default xdm do?

### Re:Daunting? (3, Informative)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### jmu1 | more than 11 years ago

I was a Slack user for several years, but the Debian installer was just so darned screwy. I should be able to select a few categories of programs, then edit the contents _if_ i want to. I shouldn't have to pick from some two-thousand package names with terrible(if any) descriptions. I installed Deb once. The system didn't work very well, because I didn't install some of the things I was supposed to. Sure, I could have just started apt-getting. Problem was, I didn't know half of the stuff I needed. Now days, I might be able to cope. Then again, why would I want to cope when I can install Slack or RedHat?

### Re:Daunting? (3, Insightful)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Demona | more than 11 years ago

My first thought is usually, "Maybe they don't know how to read." After all, illiteracy is a growing problem...

### Re:Daunting? (4, Informative)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Sepper | more than 11 years ago

The problem is not the "Text-base install" as much as "No hardware detection" and "too technical centric". The install sometimes looks cryptic to some (have to know that a geforce use the "nv" driver, etc.).

It took me a while to figure out the exact driver for my sparcstation, and in the end, i had to open the box and do a search on google to know.

This new incentive to push debian into the desktop is "a good thing". Even if it doesnt turn out perfect, it's still a step in the right direction.

### Too little, too late? (-1, Offtopic)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

Anyone?

### System Management for User (4, Insightful)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Sam the Nemesis | more than 11 years ago

From the site:

We will try to ensure that software is configured for the most common desktop use. For instance, the regular user account added by default during installation should have permission to play audio and video, print, and manage the system through sudo.

I think giving the root privileges to the user using sudo is a security risk. It will be very easy to wreak a havoc on the system, once you break into the user account.

### Re:System Management for User (3, Interesting)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### larien | more than 11 years ago

Well, let's compare this to other desktops; XP allows me to do all sorts of stuff with the user I created at initialisation, including create other user accounts. What this is probably aiming for is the same sort of user as XP, i.e. one that doesn't want to know about 'root' he wants things to 'just work'. In any event, it's probably more secure than having the user log in as root with a password of 'password'; how long would that take to crack?

If you're going to deploy this in any kind of serious setting, you'll have admins to set up scripts to remove the glaring security holes in any case.

### Re:System Management for User (1)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Sam the Nemesis | more than 11 years ago

XP anyway is not known for its security. Linux IS. Recently there was article where KMail ran the windoze executable using wine, without asking the user.

Just think of a simple script attachment which your mail client runs without asking you. If the user has sudo rights, then a malicious script can trash the computer. But if he/she was a normal unprivileged user, then the damage won't be to that extent.

### Re:System Management for User (1)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### MoceanWorker | more than 11 years ago

very good point.. but it also depends on how one goes about configuring sudo and to what, limited, access they have to certain root commands..

### Re:System Management for User (3, Insightful)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### FooBarWidget | more than 11 years ago

But Joe Average doesn't care about security! Do you have any idea how many Windows users don't have a virusscanner installed, even though they know viruses exist? As far as Joe Average is concerned, security doesn't exist.

### Debian (0)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago

Well Debian is excellent, the install makes you feel like a grunt but other than that it's insane. We need a desktop that is not like our Apple and Windows counterparts. Perhaps something like the movie "Minority Report". I want to wear "mouse gloves" and move windows around my walls that are covered in LCD screens. That's new and exciting.

### Re:Debian (1)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### hplasm | more than 11 years ago

Has no-one tried doing an LCARS (STNG) front end for Linux? Not the Windoze 'skin' , but as an environment?

### Once again, the point is missed (-1, Flamebait)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago

The Debian Desktop is already out for a duck. From their webpage

We recognize that there are only two classes of users: the novice, and the expert.

Wow! Novices and Experts!?! Say, are you guys sure?

Desktop Linux : Failing to understand the user since 1991!
Debian Desktop : Proudly continuing that tradition!

### Re:Once again, the point is missed (2)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### tanveer1979 | more than 11 years ago

I would say the novice dosent really exist. No matter what ppl say, currently there is no distribution which a novice can handle.. some level of expertise or atleast the aptitude is necessary. When we have distributions reaching that point we can say Linux has arrived.

:Peter

### diabian's install is daunting? (1, Offtopic)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Gizzmonic | more than 11 years ago

I guess that makes me 3l33t, since I didn't have any problems with it (despite knowing little about Linux).

I use diabian at home to run my firewall advice. It's an old K5 machine that runs at 100mhz...remember when they bought that other CPU company (what was their name, Ktech?)

I used to play Duke Nukem on it, and my name was K5KICKBUT...

Whoa, I guess I am l33t!

### Re:diabian's install is daunting? (-1, Offtopic)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### omegakidd | more than 11 years ago

it is 31337 ... im bored.

### Finally (1)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### smcavoy | more than 11 years ago

I've been a Linux user for over 6 years now, and a Debian user for 2. I use nothing but Debian on my workstation and all of my servers at work. I am gald to seed they are finally addressing the need for a nicely integrated desktop for Debian. I can only imagine that it will be as solid as the base OS, I just hope it doesn't take as much time to release as woody did :)

### I Have No Problems. (2, Interesting)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### _iris | more than 11 years ago

(disclaimer: I have not installed Debian since 2.2)

Personally I have no problem with Debian's installer. In fact, it is the best I have seen yet. In a desktop situation you can (with the exception of partitioning a disk and one or two other places) just continually hit [ENTER] and come out with a base Debian install.

Which installer is better?

### Debian for the masses... (1)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### zborro | more than 11 years ago

If somebody tries to criticize Debian in the usability arena, he receives a lot of stupid answers like:

* If you cannot use vi why the hell are you using linux?

* Text interfaces are the best!

---
Now we have a project going toward a good installer and one to increase usability...

I'd like to know what the pure debianists think about it!

bye

### Re:Debian for the masses... (1)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### kyoko21 | more than 11 years ago

Personally when I install debian on my various platforms, I never install X. My reasons are simply that why do I need it when I do everything in through command line interface? Not to mention the boxes where I install Debian on all make too much sound and noise and put out a lot of heat. If the boxes don't need X then I won't consider installing it. I wish it could be said the same about Oracle. I hate the fact that they have moved their installer to a GUI format and taken away the ability to install through the commandline. Now I am forced to install X. *sigh*

Personally I find Debian to be very stable and though it is hard to learn, but in the end you will appreciate the knowledge that you have gathered. It's not so much the destination is the key, but the path that you take to get there. That is what Debian is and that is what I think of Debian everytime I use it.

### How about making the apt sources... (1, Troll)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Lord Bitman | more than 11 years ago

not install a spreadsheet, word proccessor, hex editor, and powerpoint clone, when you tell dpkg or apt to install a /window manager/
Since when is a powerpoint clone part of a window manager?

### Re:How about making the apt sources... (2)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### dzym | more than 11 years ago

That would be because Gnome and KDE are "desktop environments", not "window managers". Sawfish is a window manager.

In any case, the "gnome" metapackage only suggests "gnome-office", it does not depend on it.

Debian will not even suggest you install gnome-office if you just install sawfish.

Get your terminology straight.

### Ximian Setup Tools (4, Interesting)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### SmileyBen | more than 11 years ago

Slightly off-topic, but bear with me: they mention using Ximian Setup Tools, but all mention of this project appears to have dissappeared from Ximian's website. Does anyone know what's happened to it? Are the tools orphaned, abandoned, or just moved (and hidden somewhere)? They were looking very promising, and in terms of achieving what this Debian desktop project is trying to, they seem to fit the bill very well...

Anyone...?

### Re:Ximian Setup Tools (5, Informative)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### FooBarWidget | more than 11 years ago

Ximain Setup Tools have been abandoned. Ximian is no longer sponsoring it. Instead, it continues it's life as GNOME System Tools.

### network.img from mandrake (0)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago

Its what debian WANTS to be. It installs from the internet, autodects your hardware, graphical installer, and easy to use desktop, and has urpmi and rpmdrake, the best package managers on earth!

one floppy is all you need.

### Menus (4, Interesting)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### PeterClark | more than 11 years ago

One thing I hope that they will do is have better integrated menus for GNOME and KDE programs. I ran KDE in Debian and always hated that by default, there was a "Debian" submenu for non-KDE programs. Ditto under GNOME. Programs ought to be grouped by task, not by desktop.
:Peter

### there are only two classes of users (2)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### chegosaurus | more than 11 years ago

The article says "there are only two classes of users: the novice, and the expert"

How about all those novices who think they're experts?

### Wow (1)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Kj0n | more than 11 years ago

I must admit that today is Debian's big day: new installer, new desktop environment, new users (thanks to /.).

### Debian dosent support usb mice. (0)

This comment was hidden based on your threshold setting.

#### Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago

IT DOES NOT! I did RTFM, STFW and LTFM, but it still wouldnt work, Since I use a laptop I cant use it. (and no, im not using that shitty touch pad). But SuSE and Mandrake auto Detect it perfectly.

If debian wants people to use it, then its got to support hardware made in the 2000s, and not the 1980's! Its no good having a glitzy desktop if you cant use a mouse.
Slashdot Account

Need an Account?

Don't worry, we never post anything without your permission.

# Submission Text Formatting Tips

We support a small subset of HTML, namely these tags:

• b
• i
• p
• br
• a
• ol
• ul
• li
• dl
• dt
• dd
• em
• strong
• tt
• blockquote
• div
• quote
• ecode

### "ecode" can be used for code snippets, for example:

<ecode>	while(1) { do_something(); } </ecode>
Create a Slashdot Account