×

Welcome to the Slashdot Beta site -- learn more here. Use the link in the footer or click here to return to the Classic version of Slashdot.

Thank you!

Before you choose to head back to the Classic look of the site, we'd appreciate it if you share your thoughts on the Beta; your feedback is what drives our ongoing development.

Beta is different and we value you taking the time to try it out. Please take a look at the changes we've made in Beta and  learn more about it. Thanks for reading, and for making the site better!

Palm Tungsten Models Reviewed

timothy posted more than 11 years ago | from the send-me-your-old-visors dept.

Handhelds 211

Jason Weill writes "MSNBC has a slightly premature review of Palm's brand-new Tungsten models. These models, currently (as of 11:10 PM EST Sunday) unavailable on Palm's own web site, are the Tungsten T and Tungsten W. The Tungsten T includes a fold-out Graffiti area, new cross-key keypad, 144 MHz ARM processor, Palm OS 5, a 320x320 full-color screen, and 16 MB of on-board RAM. At $499, it's more expensive than most handhelds currently on the market. The Tungsten W replaces the Graffiti area with a thumb keyboard and includes GSM/GPRS phone capabilities. Unlike the Handspring Treo devices, the Tungsten W only works with a handset -- you can't put it up to your ear. The Tungsten W will cost $549, although most American service providers will subsidize at least part of the cost. These models will officially be unveiled Monday, October 28."

cancel ×
This is a preview of your comment

No Comment Title Entered

Anonymous Coward 1 minute ago

No Comment Entered

211 comments

please lick my crotch (-1, Troll)

neal n bob (531011) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545367)

it is a bit dry from recent travels. welcome to a new week slashfags!

YOUR FP HAS BEEN CLAIMED BY MICHAEL SIMS (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545381)

fp motherfucker!!! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545368)

hahahahhahah check out my site www.first.post0rz.dud.ez

Re:fp motherfucker!!! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545406)

AC - you seem a likely candidate; care to lick my crotch? I'll trade you this lovely FP for a good crotch licking.

neal

Fuck Palm! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545375)

Nuke Tibet!

Pave the rainforest!

Pathetic (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545379)

North Korea is making nukes, Iraq is producing biological weapons by the truckload, and all you people can talk about is "Palm Tungsten Models Reviewed"???

Dig yourself out of your parents basement, shut off your linux b0x, and GO OUTSIDE!!!!

Re:Pathetic (0, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545389)

watch out for bee's!

Re:Pathetic (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545494)

North Korea is making nukes, Iraq is producing biological weapons by the truckload, and all you trolls can do is post shit like this???

Dig yourself out of your parents basement, stop trolling, and GO OUTSIDE!!!!

First post - first time! (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545390)

First post! yeeehaaaaaaaaaaa!!!

Don't even think about buying one. (-1, Flamebait)

Kip Diamond (620384) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545391)

With the way cell phones are advancing, why buy one? Cell phones already have games, messaging, logs, and other electronic accessories. If you want a decent small computer, just spend your $499 on a cheap lap top.

Re:Don't even think about buying one. (4, Insightful)

Powercntrl (458442) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545471)

With the way cell phones are advancing, why buy one? Cell phones already have games, messaging, logs, and other electronic accessories.

"Those Slashdot editors are right... If I had moderator points - bam!"

Your post is blatant flamebait. Cell phones are NOT PDAs for SEVERAL reasons:

Games and other applications are tightly controlled by the cell phone provider. While you may be able to find "cellphone Java" (the name of the Java variant they run escapes me) applications, good luck getting them to download to your phone. Cell phones ALREADY HAVE the worst of what we expect Palladium to be. If an app isn't signed and delivered (usually with a FEE) to your cell phone by your cell phone provider, you're not getting it on there. Another nice feature of some applications is that they expire or require you to be using Internet airtime minutes while they're running. Even if you want to download something as simple as images or ringtones to your phone, you're likely to be hit with a download fee and only able to download from your cell phone provider or a company that has an agreement with your provider.

Next comes the issue of getting data onto your phone... The screen is small and the entry interface (press each button over, and over, and over) is awful. You can't begin to compare it to the Palm or any other PDA at all.

Cell phones are designed to be a glorified phonebook and self-setting clock if you don't pay for service. The providers nickel and dime you for every feature you're used to getting for FREE with a PDA or portable PC device. If you want wireless communication - get a cell phone. If you want a personal digital assistant - get a Palm.

Re:Don't even think about buying one. (5, Interesting)

wheany (460585) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545719)

Games and other applications are tightly controlled by the cell phone provider. While you may be able to find "cellphone Java" (the name of the Java variant they run escapes me) applications, good luck getting them to download to your phone.
At school we have tested Java MIDP-applications on several phones, and the easiest phones to install to have been Nokia and Motorola. With Nokia 7650 you can use GPRS, Bluetooth or IR (at least) to load the apps (and ringtones :-) ), and with Motorola Accompli 008(?) you can use the cable that you use when you synchronize your phone and desktop.

With Siemens M50 we have not been able to load any midlets by any means. We even set up a WAP-server, but the phone just hangs.

But I wouldn't say the applications are tightly controlled by the provider, I don't think they are actively trying to hinder people, I just think some are being stupid with how you can install them.

Re:Don't even think about buying one. (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545504)

http://quiz.ravenblack.net/blood.pl?1126731698 its good review for cheap laptops

FAQ : Why did I get moderated down? (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545392)

So you're new to Slashdot, you've just posted your first comment and, within seconds, it got moderated down. Don't worry, it's happened to all of us. The first thing to do is calm down and don't take it personally. You know and I know that your comment was wonderful. The second thing to do it realise that moderation points are handed out at random and, therefore, chances are that the person that moderated your comment wasn't really qualified to.

What follows is a guide to the negative moderations available to moderators, how moderators use them, and how to avoid them in the future.

-1 Flamebait.

Traditionally a 'flamebait' was a post that attracted angry responses. However, on Slashdot a post if flamebait if it angers the moderator. Most comments that get moderated flamebait *never* receive a single flame in reply ... it's just one of those Slashdot paradoxes one has to learn to live with.

A comment may anger a moderator for many reasons, but the most likely is that you mentioned an operating system that the moderator doesn't approve of.

This is a hard situation to avoid; moderators come from all walks of life and use a range of operating systems - all the way from "Microsoft Windows '95" all the way up to "Microsoft Windows XP Home Edition.".

The solution is to keep your post vague when it comes to revealing details of the systems that you own and use. So even if your comment hinges on the fact that such-and-such is relevant to, for example, Windows 2000; mentioning this will inflame a large portion of the moderators. Using phrases such as "my computer" and "my systems" will keep you safe in the eyes of OS zealots.

-1 Offtopic

Since the minority of readers actually read the article, let alone any pages that the article may link to; the actual topic of the discussion is usually very vague. The topic is actually defined by the first few posts made to the discussions. To avoid the -1 offtopic moderation, sort by score and follow the lead set by the highest rated comment.

Another way to receive a -1 offtopic is to reply to a point made in someone else's comment. Since this person's point probably wasn't made in the article itself (the article is usually very short and vague) then your reply is bound to be offtopic!

You are probably asking yourself; "Surely that the post I replied to is offtopic as well then?". Yes, it is. However moderators tend to moderate the
'leaves' of the discussion before moderating the 'root' level comments. Although the later is far more efficient in tidying up a discussion, it only really punishes the poster of that comment. It is better to work up and punish everyone in the thread because, frankly, sometimes it is deserved.

-1 Redundant

Using a strict definition, a comment would redundant if it repeated something from the article or an earlier comment. Since moderators read neither of these, the -1 redundant moderation is very rarely used.

You are most likely to receive it if you post something informative and well known early in the discussion. This attracts the -1 redundant moderation for two reasons

i) If the moderator already knows the information that you are presenting then your comment is, obviously, redundant.
ii) Since it is well known, another poster may post something similar after you. In an ideal world, the later comment should be moderated redundant; however most moderators do not know how Slashdot is sorting the comments, therefore the -1 redundant moderation will fall with 50% probability on either of the two comments.

-1 Troll

In the pre-Slashdot days, a Troll was a post or comment designed to attract many responses. In contrast, users who troll other Slashdot users usually do so with well-known in-jokes. It won't take long for you to recognise these and learn what to avoid; but in general a post mentioning the author Steven King, the actress Natalie Portman or the Linux clustering system Beowulf will attract an instant -1 Troll moderation regardless of whether it was one of the proscribed comments or not.

-1 Troll is also used when the moderator suspects a comment of being offtopic, redundant or flamebait but isn't yet a good enough moderator to be sure.

The -1 Troll moderation is one of the worst things that can happen to an innocent new Slashdot user; moderators loathe what they think of a trolls and once a comment receives one -1 Troll moderation any other moderator which sees it will instantly add another -1 Troll moderation. A +5 informative can be reduced to -1 troll in seconds once the first moderation is made; this happens whether the initial -1 Troll moderation was fair or not - the instinct to use the -1 Troll moderation is almost pavlovian.

-1 Overrated

-1 overrated moderations are not subject to Slashdot's meta-moderation scheme. This fact is not widely known amongst the moderators; they don't have time to learn the details and rules of the system - the need to moderate your comment down is more important. The few moderators that do know this will therefore always moderate -1 overrated because it protects them from the meta-moderation system. A -1 overrated moderation doesn't mean your post is overrated, indeed most -1 overrated moderations are applied to comments that have not even been rated - another of Slashdot's intractable paradoxes. The

rest of the -1 overrated moderations are applied to excellent comments that have reached the heady heights of Score 5; the motivation for the moderation is pure jealousy.

Will They Sell Them At Ikea? (5, Funny)

istartedi (132515) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545393)

Allen Wrench: "Help! They found me in a meteor! I need tungsten to live! TTUUUNNNGGGSSSTTEEENN!"

That's some power (3, Interesting)

SexyKellyOsbourne (606860) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545397)

144mhz ARM with 16MB of RAM, along with a nice screen that fits in your hand -- that destroys the Gameboy Advance's 17mhz CPU and measly 256k of RAm.

If PC games took off with the gaming enthusiasts to replace consoles, handhelds should soon become a thriving gaming market to replace Gameboys.

With that much power, a GBA emulator could even be ported to it!

Re:That's some power (2)

cdf12345 (412812) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545419)

Why then, do all the current palm games suck?

probably because users are to cheap to buy the games when they are $30-50, that's an awful lot to spend on a handheld enterainment app.

Re:That's some power (5, Insightful)

stickyc (38756) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545513)

Why then, do all the current palm games suck?

probably because users are to cheap to buy the games when they are $30-50, that's an awful lot to spend on a handheld enterainment app.


No, it's because this amazing new horsepower isn't actually on the market for another few hours and the vast majority of PalmOS developers don't participate in "pre-release hardware" development (unlike the major game companies).

There are quite a few games that push the limits of the Dragonball and look damn nice, but even the top of the line 33mhz isn't close to a 144mhz ARM. Patience, Young Jedi, the wicked games will come soon enough, especially with the new 5-way and improved audio support.

Re:That's some power (2)

g4dget (579145) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545478)

Yes, and that's some price as well. The Tungsten series is way too expensive for the GBA target market.

Re:That's some power (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545537)

AS far as I know, there already are some Gameboy emulators for the Palm, one of them is called 'Liberty'.. Anf there are lots and lots of emulators for the (slightly faster) Zaurus, ranging from Mame to Bochs (x86 Emulator).

Re:That's some power (1)

Kip Diamond (620384) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545606)

The GBA is a better buy if you want gaming. 5.89 mhz per $1 compared to 3.47 mhz $1 with the Tungsten.

Re:That's some power (2)

Fnord (1756) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545648)

Thing its missing though is all the graphic accelerators that the gba has. Thanks to alot of custom chips, that little thing can do far more than its processor should allow. And while the cpu on this thing is impressive, I don't know if its enough to handle all that.

Quote from article ha! (4, Insightful)

cdf12345 (412812) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545398)

"When Palm talks, the industry listens. And users sometimes drool"

The industry then laughs, as their marketshare increase due do stupid palm decisions.

Users on the other hand are probably drooling because they are sleeping through palm's big announcement, having realized long ago, that palm has overpromised and underdelivered over and over.

Re:Quote from article ha! (2, Funny)

v8interceptor (586130) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545593)

What's the sound of one Palm clapping? Or: if a Palm falls in a forest, does it make a sound if no one is there to hear it?

How do they sell anything in Japan? (4, Interesting)

kryonD (163018) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545401)

I only paid $190 for my cell phone and it does everything the palm does, plus surfs the internet and receives full blown email without having to add a modem attachment. It also has a .3 MegaPixel digital camera in it. Why would anyone pay 3x as much for a heavier, less useful toy?

Just curious

Re:How do they sell anything in Japan? (5, Insightful)

Moofie (22272) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545554)

Because they want a useful PDA, with usable text input and a large screen?

Or maybe because they don't want to pay the cell phone company for downloading new applications to them.

Oh, wait, your phone can't use new applications? I'm sure that somebody thinks that the phone's built in games and utilities are worth a damn, but I'm sure not one.

A PDA is more than just an address book. The killer feature of my Palm is the desktop sync. That way, even if my PDA dies, ALL that important information is ready for me to download into a new device. No hassle, no incompatibilities...it just works.

Phones are great, when you want to call people. For doing anything else, they're a user interface nightmare. .3 megapixel camera? Don't make me laugh. I do better with a box of Crayolas.

Re:How do they sell anything in Japan? (2)

lingqi (577227) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545653)

yap yap yap...

actually you CAN download new applications onto your cellphone.

here is a website with some info [nttdocomo.co.jp] on Docomo, by NTT. (the only cellphone provider with english info, AFAIK

The 504i series does what's called "iAppli" (nevermind the silly names for a sec) - but they do let you download software.

And hopefully you can see that the input / email capabilities is no worse than any Zaurus / palm / Sony keypad (it's cool looking at young people franticly thumb in emails on the train).

and the camera actually do better than you think. Imagine web-cam quality color pictures. be sarcastic all you want, but it's pretty neat feature (albeit one I will never use - my ugly mug will probabbly shock the phone system into some fratic emergency mode), and many people uses it.

the only thing you are halfly on-the-mark is the cost... but then, when you think about it, a cell phone that costs 180 bux or so (cheaper yet if you buy older model / longer contract) - that weights like 3 oz. compared to your palm for about 500... and if you are conservative on yapping, the monthly fee is no worse than US plans i have seen. - and considering that you recieve calls for free, it might be cheaper.

and the screen area is not even that much different : cellphones here have resolution as high as 176x216... it's tiny (like everything else) - but again, for the money and convenience and all that... not to quote anybody, but fsck palm... fsck palm in the ear.

Re:How do they sell anything in Japan? (1)

Moofie (22272) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545694)

Hmm. And can I use one? No. So what are you arguing again?

I can imagine people thumbing messages on the train. I just can't imagine ME doing it.

You wanted to know who would buy such a thing...I answered you. Yes, I know the state of the art in Japan wrt mobile technology is most impressive...but I still prefer a large screen and a digitizer, along with a LARGE library of applications and databases, to a cellphone that nobody but the phone company can write apps for.

A tiny screen is great, until I want to read a (cached) web site on it. You can have your phone. I have my Palm. We're both happy. Right?

Re:How do they sell anything in Japan? (2)

krazyninja (447747) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545612)

Several differences. For one, PDAs are just PCs in small form factor. You can add applications, and download programs into a PDA unlike a cell phone. It may not be needed for you, but someone else will.
And cellphones have a limited screen size/ low resolution. And highend cellphones that have all these functionality anyway cost around 500-600$. As they say, the lines are pretty blurred between cellphones and PDAs.

Re:How do they sell anything in Japan? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545678)

Japanese girls are really cute.

This has nothing to do with cell phones, really, except that they all have them, and they're all really cute, especially when they carry their phones in cute little pouches.

Wow (4, Insightful)

J1a2o (526745) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545403)

This thing's more powerful than my old Pentium that I'm using as a router and small webserver right now.. =/ My router is running linux on a 120 MHz box with 32 MB RAM...

Re:Wow (2, Informative)

gnuadam (612852) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545459)

Don't buy into the megahertz myth. Just because the clock speed is greater means nothing. I'd still bank on the pentium.

Until recently [embedded.com], ARM chips designed for handhelds didn't do harware floating point math!

Re:Wow (2)

zulux (112259) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545710)

Until recently [embedded.com], ARM chips designed for handhelds didn't do harware floating point math!

They were smart: they waited untill the Pentium people worked out all the FDIV bugs.

Re:Wow (2)

Stigmata669 (517894) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545594)

no its not, you just think it is. the ARM processor may have a higher clockspeed, but the pentium is much more powerful.

Another Review Here (5, Informative)

tlhIngan (30335) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545405)

Here's another review from the folks at InfoSync: http://www.infosync.no/news/2002/n/2495.html [infosync.no].

Looks nice, but I don't see myself replacing my PalmIIIc yet (c'mon... someone make a non-Sony Palm that's as compelling!)

Cool features for the enterprise (2)

SuperKendall (25149) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545531)

Well, they are cool regardless but targeted at enterprise use:

The CD also includes BlueChat and BlueBoard. BlueBoard is a Bluetooth-based whiteboard-type image editing program. Users create an on-the-fly conference and can then all edit the same same on-screen image simultaneously. BlueChat is a Bluetooth-based chat program that allows users to create ad-hoc local IRC-like chatrooms with any users in range. We foresee a lot of employees talking about a presenter behind their backs this way.

I think the T sounds liek a great device. I like the features, the clever form factor (the telescoping stylus sounds great) and I love the idea of bluetooth support in a Palm and what can be done with it.

I also really like the idea of the web portal Palm provides to let you really browse the web without consuming a lot of bandwith. That is a perfect feature for a handheld meant to be networked. The only missing ingredient (which I assume will be around soon if it's not already here) is a bluetooth hub to give local bluetooth devices network connectivity (just like 802.11 hubs, but instead could act as a repeater to give bluetooth devices more range in an office).

Although an integrated phone/palm seems like a good idea, for my own needs I think I like better the idea of a really good PDA and a really good phone in two seperate devices.

Re:Another Review Here (1)

kormoc (122955) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545572)

Just wondering why not go with a sony? I love my clie...

Re:Another Review Here (1)

Moofie (22272) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545726)

The internal antenna for Bluetooth is, for me, a killer idea.

Mobile device companies take note: If your antenna can't survive getting stuffed into my pocket with my keys and my pocketknife, it's going to break and I'm going to be grumpy. Same goes for laptops with wireless connectivity and my bookbag. Internal antenna GOOD.

Restrictions on free movement? (5, Funny)

Trusty Penfold (615679) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545408)

you can't put it up to your ear

I bet you can.

Re:Restrictions on free movement? (5, Funny)

Skirwan (244615) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545498)

you can't put it up to your ear
I bet you can
Possible responses:
  • Actually, it uses an advanced system of gyroscopes (based on Segway technology) to prevent users from placing it near their ears.
  • Well, okay, you can put it up to your ear. But it'll give you cancer.
  • None of the cool kids put it up to their ears.
  • Putting it up to your ear would be circumventing the advanced voice security features and may violate the DMCA.
  • You can't put it up to your ear because you don't have one. You can, however, put it up to your GNU/ear.
  • Actually, you can put it up to both ears. Imagine putting it up to a Beowulf cluster of ears!
And I'm spent.

--
Damn the Emperor!

Re:Restrictions on free movement? (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545674)

what's your point? I mean, here's a telephone on my desk, I can put that up to my ear too, that doesn't mean I can talk into it and make phone calls or something.

PALM that never needs shaving.. (2, Interesting)

EvilCabbage (589836) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545417)

way cool.

But seriously, when is enough, enough?.

These are trying to fill a gap, somewhere between my mobile phone, and my laptop, but doesnt have enough functionality to do away with either.

With this in mind, it seems counter productive to carry yet another device around with me...

Just my 0.2c..

Re:PALM that never needs shaving.. (1)

kormoc (122955) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545576)

I want my phone to do phone things and I want my pda to be a mini laptop. This is aimed more at people like me. I might have bought it, except that I own a clie and I think I shall get a zarus next.

Who wants honey (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545422)

As long as there's some money

finally, a PDA designed for pr0n? (1, Funny)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545427)

The Tungsten T is, according to Palm, is designed to be perfect for one-handed use...

Especially important, with the high-res screen, and processor no doubt powerful enough to play DiVX movies, you have to have the other hand free.

Too little too late... (5, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545429)

Palm has had five years to get their act together when it comes to PDA functionality. I hate to say it, but the PocketPC devices are far superior to anything that Palm has had to date. The ability to play full-length color feature movies, MP3s, true wireless internet with a real web browser, document creation, PDF reading, chat, console emulators, and actual MULTITASKING has been available for over a year and a half now.

In short, there's no excuse for this device. Palm is dead in the water. For *LESS* than $499 I can get an 802.11b-equipped full color Toshiba E740 that will outrun, outgun, and outfeature any of Palm's new devices. Kiss your butts goodbye, Palm. This isn't 1997, this is almost 2003, and you just sat around on your market share. Watch Small-and-Flaccid(TM) eat the rest of your lunch now.

Re:Too little too late... (1)

PureCreditor (300490) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545495)

Everything u named there, u can do it on a Clie NX. Also, does the PocketPC have 480x320? noooooooooooo...........

Palm and Sony has been in this market long enough to know what's good. Toshiba is a new comer. Leave it at that.

Does the PocketPC have keyboards? No. Clie = Yes.

If PocketPC is so good, why did it take MS so many years, and still haven't even achieved 1/3 market share?

Re:Too little too late... (2, Insightful)

enjo13 (444114) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545616)

Uhm.. most Pocket PC's are 320x480.

Although I disagree with this poster. The market has demonstrated over and over again that place low value on the bells and whistles of your typical pocket pc device.. preferring simple, long lasting PDA's.

I actually think the Cell Phone makers are doing this best. Particularly those utilizing symbian, Nokia has put together some really compelling devices that combine the best of the PDA with the best of the cell phone... its a solid solid combination.

Re:Too little too late... (1)

hyeh (89792) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545700)

Actually, I don't know of any Pocket PC that's 320x480. Every Pocket PC I know of uses 320x240 QVGA resolution.

The Sony Palms & new generation of Palm devices beat Microsoft hands down in terms of screen resolution (and battery life).

Re:Too little too late... (1)

Binary Boy (2407) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545712)

Most PocketPCs are 320x240... in fact I don't know of a single one that's 320x480, though there are many CE/CE.net devices with much higher rez (tablet and clamshell portables).

Re:Too little too late... (4, Insightful)

Moofie (22272) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545735)

Outrun, outgun, and turn the batteries into little Smokie-Links in less than eight hours.

If I can't use my PDA for at least a week without batteries, fuhgeddaboutit. I don't need to watch movies on the damn thing...I need it to WORK FOR A LONG TIME.

If I can get long battery life and all that other crap, well and good. But I won't buy a device that needs to be in its cradle every night before I go to bed.

Re:Too little too late... (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545742)

For *LESS* than $499 I can get an 802.11b-equipped full color Toshiba E740 that will outrun, outgun, and outfeature any of Palm's new devices

Doubtfull, but can you 'outgun' then new Palms seven day battery life? I doubt the Toshiba will go seven hours.

Stowaway XT AKA Palm Ultra-Thin (5, Informative)

miradu2000 (196048) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545434)

Also announced today was the Stowaway XT - AKA Palm Ultra Thin. If you're familier with PDAs you probably know of the Stowaway- the cool foldable keybaord for PDAs. Well they made a new one, just half as small. Seriously. Same full size keyboard- a preview of it is available here [treocentral.com]

Holy crap (0, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545435)

Who in their right mind would spend $500 for an electronic address book?

Re:Holy crap (4, Funny)

istartedi (132515) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545453)

The same people who paid that much for less than 2 shares of VA Linux?

Oh wait... It's not 1999 anymore. I dunno. NOBODY???

Finally... (4, Informative)

GarfBond (565331) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545438)

I'm glad to see the new Tungsten series and Palm OS 5 finally come out. Now, only time will tell whether or not this device becomes successful.

I think Palm OS 5 will be a winner, as long as it does its mainstay well, while adding on some new features and doing those well too. In other words, it does all the organizing you need it to do and it puts that ARM to use.

The only problem I see with the T is the sliding mechanism. Anytime there's physical movement involved with a product like this, you have to wonder how long it'll last. If it's nice and durable, there goes my one complaint about the T. If it's really fragile, users won't like that much at all.

Myself, I hope to get one of these things after they come down in price.

This can't succeed in Norway (5, Interesting)

say (191220) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545442)

...considering the name being "Tungsten". It means "heavy stone" in Norwegian :)

Not what I want in a handheld device, at least.

Re:This can't succeed in Norway (3, Interesting)

Jugalator (259273) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545667)

Hehe... You beat me to it... :-) It's "heavy stone" in swedish as well. In Sweden, we normally use the name "Wolfram" for the mineral (which is also where its atomic symbol "W" comes from).

Re:This can't succeed in Norway (1)

nebby (11637) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545711)

Funny, judging by the weight of "A New Kind of Science", I'd expect it to be the other way around.

Tungsten W (2, Informative)

Frac (27516) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545461)

For some reason the Tungsten W (Palm's answer to Handspring's Treo) is not featured on Palm's website, nor is it accessible from the products page.

However, the URL for Tungsten W is pretty easy to guess - http://www.palm.com/products/handhelds/tungsten-w/ [palm.com]

Re:Tungsten W (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545483)

In latin America they had a hell of a time trying to sell a car named Nova.

vm

Re:Tungsten W (1)

krin (519611) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545515)

It's also featured on the 'products page' as of 1:05am EST. There is a pretty large graphic link on the side of the page.. no clue if it was recently added or everyone just didn't see it (which I highly doubt).

Sounds good... I guess (5, Informative)

steveha (103154) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545468)

If Palm really was losing sales to PocketPC, then this is exactly what they need. But it doesn't make me want to run out and buy one.

What I have always liked best about Palm PDAs is that they run forever on their batteries. Palm is claiming the new device is good for a week of typical use, but how much is that? The InfoSync [infosync.no] review notes that under a torture test, the battery life was a little under 3 hours.

I was pleased to read that the emulation mode runs current PalmOS programs fast enough. Recompiled applications should be very fast.

While in many ways it sounds tasty, I don't really want one right now. And the price is going to need to fall in half before I'll even consider it.

steveha

Sliding design (5, Insightful)

Winterblink (575267) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545472)

The slide-open design is kind of nifty, but I have concerns about durability. Moving parts are typically the first things to go, but in the case of this, it's not like a flip-cover or something that can be easily replaced.

Form factor just isn't there yet. (4, Interesting)

sbwoodside (134679) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545475)

First of all you need a *headset* not a handset. Who the heck is going to carry around a handset when they already have a cell phone inside the W? That doesn't make sense.

Secondly, they're just showing that no one gets the form factor yet. I don't want to have a headset sticking in my ear all the time, but I don't want to hold a big-ass product like the Treo up to my head either (talk about dorky-looking). The new RIM blackberry has a better idea ... just hold the thing to your head without any flip up plastic crap.

They still miss the mark though. I'm going to get my cheekmarks all over the screen and that's no good.

I don't know what the right formfactor is, but I haven't seen it yet. Maybe some kind of clamshell design where the keyboard's on the bottom and the screen's on the top. IT'll open 75% in phone mode, like a startac or whatever, or it'll open 100% in palm mode.

Re:Form factor just isn't there yet. (2)

Doktor Memory (237313) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545535)

Secondly, they're just showing that no one gets the form factor yet. I don't want to have a headset sticking in my ear all the time, but I don't want to hold a big-ass product like the Treo up to my head either (talk about dorky-looking). The new RIM blackberry has a better idea ... just hold the thing to your head without any flip up plastic crap.

Handspring tried that approach with the VisorPhone. Believe me, if you think the Treo looks dorky held up to your ear, the Visorphone/RIM approach is ten times worse [handspring.com].

I honestly don't get the complaints about the Treo's size. At worst, it's a smidgen larger than a StarTAC (and is shaped about the same), and nobody ever complained about them being funny-looking.

Re:Form factor just isn't there yet. (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545607)

The headset is nice because it let's you interact with the palm WHILE continuing with your conversation. If it is held up to your ear, you can't interact with it.

Ogg player! (4, Interesting)

steveha (103154) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545484)

This is the first Palm PDA that will have an Ogg player. It has enough horsepower under the hood to run a software MP3 decoder, so an Ogg player will be possible. Which in turn means that someone will write one!

I wonder how many hours of life you will get from one battery while playing Ogg or MP3 music, with the screen blanked.

You could carry some sort of emergency charger that uses AA cells or something. But that sort of defeats the smallness and convenience; you might as well carry some small player like the Diva.

steveha

slob on my blog like corn on the cob (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545486)

Re:slob on my blog like corn on the cob (-1, Offtopic)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545543)

three six mafia sucks.

naive (4, Informative)

TerraFrost (611855) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545491)

The new OS allows Palms to begin catching-up with some of the things rival Pocket PCs can do, such as watching short video clips, downloading digital audio or photo files and even playing graphics-intensive interactive games.

My Palm m505 already has video clips on it, thanks to MGI's PhotoSuite, which came *included* with the Palm m505. As for it being able to do wave files... so what? PCM Wave files are big. One song takes around 40mb. With 16mb, we'll only be getting maybe audio clips of thirty seconds. So what's the point of having it? And one last gripe... graphics-intensive games are also usually space intensive - Diablo 2 didn't come on 3 CD's because of it's story line, I can tell you that much!

Zaurus - more value for your money (5, Informative)

vlad_petric (94134) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545492)

Really, at ~390$ (Amazon) you get a 320x240 screen, 200 MHz Intel StrongArm processor, 64 MB RAM, and more preinstalled applications (Jeode JVM & Hancom Office are the notable ones). Not to mention that it's powered by Linux/embedix (should it be called GNU/Linux embedix ?), and, as a consequence, there are quite a few opensource applications for it.

The Raven

I couldn't agree more (4, Interesting)

kikta (200092) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545561)

It was $334 when I bought it at Buy.com two months ago ($347.99 now) [buy.com] & I've fallen in love. Seriously, I thought they were kidding when I read the specs for the new Palms. Compare it to the Zaurus specs [sharpusa.com] and decide for yourself...

Cellular carriers (3, Insightful)

Graabein (96715) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545497)

Palm will be announcing cellular carriers for the W in the near future.

Begging your pardon? Isn't this a GSM phone? Do the US carriers lock users in even on GSM networks? What's the point of having GSM then if you can't use whatever phone you like on whatever network you want and roam freely?

We may be behind the US on a lot of things here in Europe, but at least we got that right. My cellular carrier doesn't care, and it's none of their business, what kind of phone I use and where I bought it.

Speaking of my phone, I own a Nokia 7650. Can't see replacing it for the new Palm anytime soon, the Nokia does the same job in a smaller package.

Re:Cellular carriers (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545559)

Palm will be announcing cellular carriers for the W in the near future.


They will be announcing carriers that will sell you the new device at a subsidized price. I think US GSM carriers (T-Mobile, AT&T, and Cingular) do lock the devices they sell, but will likely sell you a SIM card for use with your own device.

Re:Cellular carriers (2, Offtopic)

RzUpAnmsCwrds (262647) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545668)

"but at least we got that right"

No, you didn't. One standard is great, but in the long run competing standards are more benificial. Look at CDMA - there are several healthy CDMA carriers in the US (Sprint, Verizion, etc.), and there are several TDMA/GSM carriers (ATT, T-Mobile). No, you can't use any phone on any service. No, that doesn't matter - phones are pretty much free over here. Some carriers do lock SIM cards, but most carriers don't even use them. I don't know about prices in Europe but I do know that they are falling like plutonium bricks over here. You can choose how you want your cellular too, unlimited local usage for $32/month (Cricket), pre-pay (ATT, Virgin Mobile, Others), free nights/weekends (several carriers), lots of "anytime" minutes (several carriers), no roaming/long distance (Sprint, ATT, others), mobile internet (Verizion, Sprint, AT&T, others), SMS (almost all carriers), etc.

OK, it's nice to have one standard for a whole continent. But, when comparing size and population, the US is pretty much the same as Western Europe. Everytime someone brags about having universal service throughout Europe, I respond with the fact that our service is pretty universal also. Coverage is pretty good, no matter what carrier you use. OK, so you can't use your AT&T phone if you want to switch to Verizion. Big deal, Verizion is perfectly happy to give you a free or nearly free phone.

Cellular service is different here. We are not Europe, and we do not try to be Europe. For better or worse, the government pretty much keeps it's hands out of things (although that is slowly changing). Instead of forcing one communication standard, the government has let the market decide. Ultimately, CDMA will probably win. Europe is stuck with TDMA GSM service. Why is CDMA better? Mostly because it can handle two to three times more calls per channel. CDMA is a better technology; even the European carriers recognize this (and are rushing to change their networks). I am not sure about costs today, but in the long run mobile phone service in the US will be cheaper than it is in Europe. It happened here with long distance (remember 25 cents a minute?), and it will happen with cellular service. Switching to CDMA is not hard in the US because we never had a standard. Sprint was CDMA from the start. No standard = best technology wins. Unfortunately, no standard = chaos. Until a few years ago, US cellular service was a joke - mostly analog service, with terrible digital coverage. Europe laughed, with good reason - our system sucked. Then CDMA came out, and carriers began to use it. CDMA put the heat on, and carriers responded with digital TDMA that didn't stink. The cellular systems in this country became digital almost overnight.

So, no, I can't take my SIM out and use my phone with a different carrier. But there are really only two GSM carriers, and GSM is not the wireless standard in the US. There really is no standard over here, which is a mixed blessing. Ultimately, however, the customer will win. TDMA is going to go away in the US; even AT&T will eventually migrate their network to CDMA.

I wouldn't have it any other way.

decent hardware, hamstrung OS (5, Informative)

g4dget (579145) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545512)

The hardware looks pretty decent; I suppose you pay a premium for the compact size.

However, the software isn't all that great. Basically, under PalmOS 5, your application code runs as interpreted 68k instructions. Only system calls and some specially written subroutines (which, presumably, cannot make system calls), run as native ARM code. Presumably, this will get fixed with PalmOS 6.

What apparently won't get fixed is the basic PalmOS architecture. PalmOS was designed as a very lightweight OS for simple PDA applications: calendaring, TODO lists, etc., on very simple devices. It was fine for that: small and memory efficient.

But $500 devices like the Tungsten are in a different class. With ARM processors, they are more powerful than many workstations of a few years ago. You don't need that kind of device for basic PDA functionality--just buy a $100 Zire instead.

The reason why people pay $500 for a PDA is either because they want an executive toy, or it is for running "enterprise applications", multimedia apps, scientific apps, speech recognition, etc. And for that, PalmOS just sucks: the window system and toolkit are resolution dependent and simplistic, the file system is a hack, the system lacks installers or package managers, multitasking is poor, image support is poor, and on and on.

So, what does it all mean? If you want a PDA, get a Sony SJ-30 or a Palm Zire, or a Palm m500--they are great PDAs with great built-in apps. If you want a handheld to develop custom apps for, to port software to, etc., get a Linux PDA (or a PocketPC if you must)--you'll pay less and get something that's a whole lot better for the purpose.

DANGER WILL ROBINSON DANGER (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545538)

Am i the only one that thinks the end is near for Palm? I mean, come on- look at the economoy in the US right now. Extra, expensive and frivilous items of luxury (at 499 I would say so) are probably the first things to get the axe when times are tight. I bought an m500 when it first came out and returned it after a few days because I thought the screen's visibility was a joke. I now happily own a Vx. It's showing its age now, but it still does all that I need it to do.

Re:DANGER WILL ROBINSON DANGER (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545656)

well usually they start the product cycle when the economy is better or they think it will pick up, then 18 months later they have to bring it to market, whatever the environment. If the economy is soft, then, too bad.

As an example, two years ago I began working on a novel type of penis extender [www.mego.at] (I even have a patent, #7342132) and just when I was ready to "unleash" it upon the world, BAM! Terrorism strikes! So you can imagine how hard it was to sell penis extenders in a post-9/11 context. The market is still soft, though I hope it will firm up again soon, even if the demand just comes in spurts.

If any /. readers are interested, I have plenty of inventory, along with my unsold Osama Bin Laden urinal pucks. I can throw those in for free.

yes but... (1, Interesting)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545545)

does it support USB or Firewire? [www.mego.at]. That's what I'd like to know.

I'd like a palm computer I can hook my iPod up to. Don't ask me why.

Uses TI chipset ??? (2)

krazyninja (447747) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545597)

I believe this is one of the first devices to use the OMAP platform from TI. They started this collaboration last year. Press release here. [palm.com]

Why 16mb?? (4, Insightful)

Jeffv323 (317436) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545600)

The Tungsten T includes a fold-out Graffiti area, new cross-key keypad, 144 MHz ARM processor, Palm OS 5, a 320x320 full-color screen, and 16 MB of on-board RAM.

WHY do even the newest PDA's on the market still come with 16mb of memory?? I mean seriously, when I can get a 128mb CF card for ~$50, you'd think that a $500 palm with multimedia capabilities might have a little more room to work with than a fscking 386!

jokes... (0, Troll)

drDugan (219551) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545603)

I've been making jokes aabout faster f$cking palm pilots for a while now. Oh joy. Just what humanity needs: faster palm pilots.


We watched the tragedy unfold
We did as we were told
We bought and sold
It was the greatest show on earth
But then it was over
We ohhed and aahed
We drove our racing cars
We ate our last few jars of caviar
And somewhere out there in the stars
A keen-eyed look-out
Spied a flickering light
Our last hurrah
And when they found our shadows
Grouped around the TV sets
They ran down every lead
They repeated every test
They checked out all the data on their lists
And then the alien anthropologists
Admitted they were still perplexed
But on eliminating every other reason
For our sad demise
They logged the only explanation left
This species has amused itself to death

Amateur Radio (2)

Kirkoff (143587) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545605)

Was I the only one who saw the clockspeed and thought it would be a fun idea to take a directional and an amplifier and see what happens when one is inbetween you and the local repeater?

--Josh

Mod me up. (-1, Troll)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545635)

What the fuck were these people thinking? HUH!? WhAt ThE BlOoDy FuCk!? FfFfFfUuUuUuUCcCcCcKkKkKk! PaLm BlOoDy hElL fUcKsHiT FuCk FuCk FuCk FuCk.

Re:Amateur Radio (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545643)

No but if you hum a few bars, I'll see what I can do.

MOD PARENT UP!!!! (0)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545664)

No, don't. I just felt like saying that.

Nice, but I'll hold for the new kyocera (3, Interesting)

Lally Singh (3427) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545632)

The non-phone tungsten looks like a good candidate for the enterprise, which is where it's aimed. But, the phone-pda device I'm waiting for is the kyocera 7135 [kyocera-wireless.com], coming out in a month or two.

no speaker? (4, Insightful)

jchristopher (198929) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545641)

What's with this wave of devices that have phone functionality but no speaker? So, now I get to carry it around, but I have to use a headset for all my calls? Basically, I still need a regular cellphone... so what's the point of putting the phone in the Palm? Now I've just got two phones!

Handspring sure got it right when they decided to make the Treo a real phone. They make great phones without this headset nonsense.

overpriced! (1, Insightful)

Anonymous Coward | more than 11 years ago | (#4545642)

Wow! This thing sure is overpriced. Let's see, I could spend $549 for a PDA, or I could spend a little more than double for a nicely equiped small laptop. I got the laptop. Much better value.

I can see someone spending $100 for a PDA, but why spend 5 times as much for about the same amount of functionality. That's what I did.

My recomendation: Buy a cheap PDA like a Palm m105 for $100 and buy a laptop (e.g., Dell Inspiron 4150 with 1.7 GHz P4 and 512 MB memory) for $1200 - $1300 and use that for the stuff the PDA can't handle.

Hey Palm! (1, Flamebait)

teamhasnoi (554944) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545745)

Ditch Palm OS and use what you got! Beos! You have all the IP, lots of the guys who worked on it, a thriving bunch of coders [bebits.com] on the outside, and a soon to be open source, binary compatable OS [sourceforge.net] on it's way.

Beos was working on the Internet Appliance before you bought it (which killed them, you bastards!), so you have some embedded code to work with I'm sure.

Yes, I know you're keeping it on the QT, because you don't want to be stomped into the ground by MS, who would most certainly put you on their hit list if you made noises of a potential Windows CE (hell, XP) competitor.

People want a laptop in their hand, you have the stuff - make it happen!

Palm OS has got speed and battery life sure, why not give it the muscle to compete with the other stuff out there?

(I know I'm playing Monday Morning Quarterback, but it sounds like a good idea to me, since I have no interest in buying any of their present offerings.)

BTW -- Make sure you go over to http://open-beos.sourceforge.net/news.php [sourceforge.net] and vote for your favorite new name for OpenBeos. I'm a lucky finalist (see my journal)

Tungsten W - NO Graffiti ? (2, Interesting)

dimmu (214039) | more than 11 years ago | (#4545748)

The lack of graffiti will be a big disappointed for current palm users. I think they'll rather buy the Thungsten T as it has the graffiti, and i must say that was the number 1 reason why i choose palm instead of another made of handheld (psion et al)
Load More Comments
Slashdot Account

Need an Account?

Forgot your password?

Don't worry, we never post anything without your permission.

Submission Text Formatting Tips

We support a small subset of HTML, namely these tags:

  • b
  • i
  • p
  • br
  • a
  • ol
  • ul
  • li
  • dl
  • dt
  • dd
  • em
  • strong
  • tt
  • blockquote
  • div
  • quote
  • ecode

"ecode" can be used for code snippets, for example:

<ecode>    while(1) { do_something(); } </ecode>
Sign up for Slashdot Newsletters
Create a Slashdot Account

Loading...