Comdex Operators File for Bankruptcy 161
VileScum writes "According to this article in The Australian, Los Angeles-based Key3Media Group, the company operating the giant Comdex trade show, filed for protection from its creditors yesterday in the United States Bankruptcy Court. Does this mean I have to start buying cloths again instead of getting them at trade shows?" Also see a story in The New York Times. Concerns of bankruptcy were voiced last November.
cloths? (Score:5, Funny)
Re:cloths? (Score:2, Funny)
Re:cloths? (Score:2)
Re:cloths? (Score:4, Funny)
Most of my T-shirts are from trade shows. Now I just need the booth weasles to start throwing pants out to the crowd. Some socks and underware would be nice too.
Underware? (Score:3, Funny)
Is that the stuff that turns into hardware if you don't wash it for weeks, or wetware when you get overexcited?
Re:cloths? (Score:2)
This is just a protective move (Score:4, Funny)
Get your clothes at Adultdex instead (Score:5, Funny)
Oh, but I guess they don't do clothing there, do they. Darn.
Re:Get your clothes at Adultdex instead (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Get your clothes at Adultdex instead (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Get your clothes at Adultdex instead (Score:1)
Actually, a large portion of their profits comes from "going under".
And yes, that is "comes" with an O and an E...
Re:Get your clothes at Adultdex instead (Score:1, Funny)
Re:Get your clothes at Adultdex instead (Score:1, Interesting)
economic downturn that has affected Key3media.
Adultdex was started (inspired) by a group of
companies that had gotten kicked out of COMDEX for
selling adult-oriented products (CDs) back in the
mid nineties. At first it was just a competitive
slam back at the Interface group (IIRC), for kicking
them out in the first place.
As time passed, more of the "corporate" adult entertainment
promoters took over the convention and it has become more
of a venue for new and growing franchises looking for market
deals, and local Las Vegas entertainers.
of the COMDEX crowds both for promotion and to get extra bodies
in the door.
Less people going to COMDEX meant less foot traffic showing up for Adultdex.
In past years it was as heavily promoted on taxi and street
signs as any of the marketed high-tech companies that were
on the COMDEX show floor. This last year, I don't recall seeing
even one sign around the LV convention center mentioning it.
I'm sure they suffered less for the cost of their hotel convention
space than Key3media did for all its venues, but that doesn't mean
they did not notice a distinct drop in the amount of horny geeks
showing up after the main show hours ended.
Of course I could be wrong, I didn't get by there last year to see
how much attention ADX was getting. For all I know the geeks may
have been so disappointed with the content at the LVCC that the
made a point to check out what else Las Vegas had to offer.
BTW: Even Adultdex had t-shirts, posters, and other chachkis,
but they usually were sold as souvenir items.
Comdex Memories (Score:5, Interesting)
Long ago, before I had a Real Job(tm), I helped out at one of the very first comdexes to earn money to buy crusts of dry bread.
And there were all these people there, totally focused on building a stand that was better than the next stand, which in turn was trying to be better than the next one. Not because all the people loved stands or anything, but just because they'd all talked each other into believing it was really important.
And they totally broke their backs to get their stands ready, they seriously worked 20 hour days to make sure their glossy stand thing worked perfectly and all the brochures and things were in the right place, although none of them actually cared about brochures or stands.
It was this experience(*) that has made me cynical about capitalism in general and trade shows in particular. The sense of 'why not just stop bothering' that I acquired then has stood me good stead ever since
(*)Along with the Tale of the Uneaten Breakfast, but that's another story.
Re:Comdex Memories (Score:2)
Of course, I merely justified why trade show booths do serve a purpose. The competitiveness you observed is a basic part of human nature - if you are a marketing person for a company, you want it to be known that you are better at your job than the marketing people at your competitor company. The same applies to all people on the evolutionary track to success. If you just don't care about competing and winning, well, you are probably on one of those lines of evolution that will die out sooner or later and make room for those who do. Capitalism is a reflection of nature, which is why it works. Is it always a moral good? No - that's why we need laws and governments to keep it from being too destructive. But trying to impose systems fundamentally at odds with human nature seems to be a guaranteed failure.
Re:Comdex Memories (Score:3, Insightful)
Funny. I thought that having a good product, especially one that people use and want, caused people to buy shit.
Ah... there's the problem (or at least I consider it a problem). Many seem to believe that the economy should be push-driven (companies "sell shit") versus a pull-driven one (people "buy shit").
I've never understood goofy multi-million dollar superbowl adverts, trade shows, cold-calls, door-to-door salemen, pop-ups, or even everyday radio/tv commercials.
Hell, if I want to buy a car, I'm gonna research what's out there. You can be damned sure I'm not going to let a 30-second glossy TV ad influense a $25,000 purchase. That scales down to things as cheap as paper towels and tooth paste.
I realize that the big model is to make people believe thay want crap they don't need, whether that crap is quality or not (more often not). Here's a thought: make quality products that fill a real need (give me better reception on my cell phone, not a dazzling array of colored faceplates for the phone) and people will seek you out. In other words, "Build it, and they will come."
I once worked for a small software firm which produced a niche point-of-sale system. I talked with several of the sales droids there. They honestly believed that without Sales (that is, the department, not actual cash sales) that the world would collapse into economic ruin. I always took the opposing view, but they'd hear none of it.
It's one thing to have a passive presense to have your name in circulation (phone book entry, web page, small ads in the back of trade rags, etc.), but to devote so much money to something as wasteful as salesmen and advertising seems silly to me.
Maybe I'm just a more demanding "consumer" than most, but most everything I buy is based on my own opinion, not advertising.
Sometimes, I've decided to avoid brands solely because of how stupid the commercials are. May Utahns out there who have seen or heard the Totally Awesome Computers ads are sure to agree with me.
And yes, I realize that I just poked a hole into my argument in that past paragraph. That counterpoint to anti-advertising is "brand recognition" -- the philosophy that if you remember a brand (even in a negative way), the advert has done its job. Rubbish.
Re:Comdex Memories (Score:2)
Face it...the average person is dumb, and branding, advertising et al does work. Furthermore, you and I need it too: how else would you know what's out there?
Now the question of whether they (sales, PR etc)could do with a lower budget to accomplish the same, that's another issue...
Re:Comdex Memories (Score:2)
I don't buy that argument.
Think about how may items you buy on a regular basis. Now... think about how many of those items to see actually advertised.
See my point?
When my wife I go to the store for stuff, we buy a lot more than just shampoo, paper towels, beer, and tampons. How did we know about the bounty of other goods? Well... we see them on the shelves, for one. We simply know that certain things are needed. I dunno -- adverts don't seem to come into play much in what we buy. And I really think that it's the same for many others.
Re:Comdex Memories (Score:2)
Appart from that, which energy drink do you use? That dirt cheap one on the bottom right of the shelves? Or 'the one you know'? Trust me...the research has been done many times over, and 90% of the population does buy 'what they know', whether it be the $0.50 macarony of the cheap brand over the noname brand for $0.30 or the branded (and tv advertised) not-cocacola cola over the unknown, but cheaper cola. And more often than not, those products
Go read some marketing books, or talk to that creep in sales. You'll be surprised at the shit that goes on, and how much everyone is influenced by advertising and the 'what they know' principle. You'll be even more surprised at the psychological research that has been done. Me, I'm an engineer by schooling, but those kinds of psych tricks have applications everywhere, from packaging to tech manuals to design to what to say in meetings. Sad, but true.
Re:Comdex Memories (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Comdex Memories (Score:2)
I don't think I said that anything *should* be anything. That would be placing a normative judgement on it. I didn't do that. The undeniable fact is that for a substantial majority of products brand awareness and marketing *DO* affect purchasing decisions. For large ticket items, people do of course do a lot more research, and product quality is genuinely important. But product quality alone doesn't cinch the deal. For example, a BMW 325 and an Acura 3.2TL - very similar cars in specs and capabilities - nonetheless, I'd get the BMW 325 anyday (assuming I had the money).
I agree and understand that stupid annoying advertising can drive away consumers. Not all brand awareness is necessarily good brand awareness - I am not sure what the truth on this issue is, but I suspect it depends greatly on the individual and the type of product you are talking about. So yes, perhaps having a terrible, unprofessional looking trade show booth is worse than having none at all. And no, nobody buys software or hardware *solely* based on a trade show booth. But if two competitors have very similar products, and one has a very slick, professional, organized presentation at their trade show booth, and gives away cool widgets, well, they might find that they get more attention and more people want to talk business with them.
Re:Comdex Memories (Score:2, Funny)
Long ago, before I had a Real Job(tm), I helped out at one of the very first comdexes to earn money to buy crusts of dry bread.
RMS is that you? Oh wait you mention having a job..
noooo!! (Score:5, Funny)
Re:noooo!! (Score:1)
That's OK, he's done the Keynote at CES (scaring the hell out of the little guys there: "And then our parters will put our software into all their home entertainment devices, and crush anyone who stands in the way of our vision, whatever the heck it is."
I steal all my cloths (Score:2, Funny)
unsurprising (Score:5, Insightful)
Then we have trade shows like LinuxWorld that have trouble selling enough booths to cover their costs. I don't think this is anything to be upset over. The Internet is to some extent doing away with the need for meatspace trade shows, and in these lean times it's hardly shocking that businesses don't want to throw away money on a trade show booth that could be spent in their web presence with many times the return on investment.
So, the Comdex bankrupty filing has been found, as legend foretold.
Re:unsurprising (Score:2)
Is this a pretty good joke, or just really really bad spelling?
Re:unsurprising (Score:1)
There, there, sonny, they're not going to unlearn their bad habits.
Re:unsurprising (Score:2)
It is almost a very dry pun, but I don't get it either.
It could be a cry for help.
Re:unsurprising (Score:1)
If it is a joke. It's not very funny. :-/
Re:unsurprising (Score:3, Insightful)
Having worked in the marketing department of a company that traditionally exhibited at Comdex, I'd absolutely agree that the writing has been on the wall for a long time. But I would note that it started long before the ecomonic downturn.
The decline in exhibitor interest was precipitated by a deterioration in the quality of attendees. We used to see a lot of real prospective B2B customers, people who were knowledgeable. Over time, COMDEX seemed to reduce the 'admission requirements' to increase revenue; over time, these customers were mostly replaced by consumer tire-kickers and people looking to drop off resumes.
I'm not knocking comsumers (or job seekers!), but the reality is that most of the exhibitors didn't survive on consumer sales...
Re:unsurprising (Score:2)
age limit was it's doom (Score:2)
lets face it, games drive computer development & without them a day off work to go look at the latest hard-drive advancement is about as much fun as a trip to the dentist.
check out the attendance @ E3.
if i'm going simply to look up hardware specs, i'd rather stay in my cube & get paid. I had to laugh when wired ran articles on kids with their own sucessful web businesses (a few years ago) who couldn't even get into the show.
Too bad (Score:3, Interesting)
I guess I am just nostalgic for the supercooled 800MHz Alpha from Comdex '98. I got to play with that machine in Digital's labs in Marlboro...it was fun
Yay, no more junk mail. (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Yay, no more junk mail. (Score:1)
Corporate accountability (Score:3, Insightful)
Today's corporate leaders are the "Robber Barons" of the late 19th century. Unfortunately (*in the USA*) the Government doesn't seem to watch/regulate corporations, nor do they seem to care. The end result is the rich getting richer, and the average working guys like you and I are getting screwed.
Oh - Don't worry - some other company will spring up and take over Comdex... or they'll re-create it under a different name.
Re:Corporate accountability (Score:2)
Are you crazy? Enron broke the rules, it was destroyed. Andersen broke the rules, it was destroyed. Worldcom broke the rules, it was punished. Tyco broke the rules... and President Bush has just increased the SEC's budget and powers.
Yes, it sucked for the average Enron shareholder, but remember that shareholders own the company. That means taking the rough with the smooth.
Re:Corporate accountability (Score:1)
Re:Moderators Suck. (Score:2)
It wasn't meant to be a troll. It was my $.02 towards the topic.
People who use their politics to slant the use of their moderation points shouldn't be allowed to moderate.
Re:Moderators Suck. (Score:2)
Conventions are doomed anyway (Score:5, Informative)
Just a few of the typical expenses (daily rates):
- $20 to rent an $8 table.
- $25 for access to an electrical outlet. Don't plug anything in yourself, though, or some teamster will break your fingers.
- $200 for access to a fractional T1 (a very small fraction, most times).
- $10 to rent a $4 chair.
- Want carpet? That'll be $100. Want that carpet unrolled?...
- Bring your own equipment? Too bad, you've got to pay a fee to be allowed to use it.
You haven't dealt with monopolies until you've tried to exhibit at a convention. One company controls all access, labor, and equipment, and you've got no say over how any of it is handled.A manufacturer's money is much better spent sending out press releases and designing an infomative web presence.
Re:Conventions are doomed anyway (Score:2)
Re:Conventions are doomed anyway (Score:3, Funny)
Heh. As an electrician and former member of the electricians union in Vegas (IBEW 357) I got to set up a few of these shows. When you see some nimrod powering a bank of 500W halogen spotlights off a 14-gauge Wal-Mart extension cord and wondering where that smell of burning plastic is coming from, you'd do the same thing. I had trouble not trying to strangle them with it afterwards, myself.
Re:Conventions are doomed anyway (Score:2)
Re:Conventions are doomed anyway (Score:1, Insightful)
Preach it, brother. And in a few years when trade shows in general are decimated, I bet we'll see these same unions whine about the unfairness of it all and demanding a taxpayer handout in the billions, oblivious to the economic ecology they are gleefully slaughtering now. You can shear a sheep for many seasons, but you can only slaughter it once. The unions are slaughtering the sheep that enable them to make a living.
The new ways of connecting companies to their clients which are proliferating through the Net (remember Reed's Law) are saying to these unions: your costs are too high for your clients, adapt or die.
Re:Conventions are doomed anyway (Score:3, Insightful)
That is utter crap. It isn't Union labor that is responsible for the conference hall charging $20/day for an $8 chair. The conference hall charges have nothing at all to do with what they pay their employees, they are simply gouging on the part of the conference hall operators.
If you have a meeting in a hotel the hotel will charge you $20 a piece for an 'executive meeting maker', that is a 5"x7" pad of 10 sheets of cheap paper with the hotel logo crudely printed on it and a cheap pen which together cost perhaps $5 cents. Add in another 5 cents worth of hard boiled sweets and thats it.
Of course it is much easier to blather on about evil unions. Predjudice is sooo much easier than thinking for yourself.
Re:Conventions are doomed anyway (Score:1)
No, it's not entirely the union's fault. They only get half the blame.
Re:Conventions are doomed anyway (Score:2)
And you pay the crew directly? No didn't think so.
What you are saying is that the conference organizers gouge you for a minimum of 4 hours on the unload and then gouge you again for carrying it.
Don't blame the workers for being better at bargaining than you appear to be.
Re:Conventions are doomed anyway (Score:1)
Although I still use IATSE labor quite often, I enjoy the luxury of living in a right-to-work state, so the don't have me by the balls like they do in other states.
Bargaining? What's that? Is that where I get shouted at by a steward when I pull up to a dock, and then get my equipment vandalized until I pay the ransom? Then you're right, they are much better at this bargaining stuff than I am.Re:Conventions are doomed anyway (Score:2)
don't forget (Score:2)
Re:Conventions are doomed anyway (Score:2)
* $25 for access to an electrical outlet. Don't plug anything in yourself, though, or some teamster will break your fingers.
* $200 for access to a fractional T1 (a very small fraction, most times).
* $10 to rent a $4 chair.
* Want carpet? That'll be $100. Want that carpet unrolled?...
Man, you got a good deal. My table at the last itec was #80 and the electic was $90.
Sheesh.
Re:Conventions are doomed anyway (Score:2)
Re:Conventions are doomed anyway (Score:1)
Don't forget the cost of *attending* a show. I paid $5 for parking at the last ITEC - almost 1 mile away from the cow barn ^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H exhibit hall in beautiful scenic Novi Michigan. Once inside, $3+ for a coke or a hot dog.
How not to survive a downturn (Score:5, Insightful)
"Crucial exhibitors began dropping out, some going out of business themselves, and others scaled back the elaborate booths that had been a staple of the dot-com era. And as Key3Media's business began looking tenuous this fall, some exhibitors became reluctant to commit to shows even six months away."
Business cycles go up and down, and the smart business will prepare for these down cycles. After all, you cannnot assume that good times will continue indefinitely. There does come a time when companies will hesitate to spend the money to exhibit. Did Key3Media plan accordingly?
" Key3 Media -- built up in the late 1990's as the technology boom was reaching its crest -- around the same time accumulated substantial debt, making it especially difficult to operate when the downturn in technology became sustained."
Oops. Yet another victim of boom mentality. It seems they jumped in with both feet when the feeding was good, did the usual VC thinking of growth, growth, growth at the expense of debt, debt, debt, and now find themselves hurting when the inevitable down cycle occurs.
Comdex provided me with a lot of fun memories. I hope it continues just so we have a place to go poke buttons and admire large screens in person. But it helps when the owners of the show (no longer Shelley Adelson) are focused on the show, not soley on the bottom line and growth for growth's sake.
---------
Where were all the Comdex is dieing posts? (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Where were all the Comdex is dieing posts? (Score:1)
Another victim of the economy (Score:4, Informative)
Once the economy rebounds, either Comdex, or another trade-show will rise from the ashes and become *the* place to be if you're an IT professional. Until then, corporations are more worried about bottom-line and stockholder expectations, than letting Joe IT go on a trip to Vegas...
Re:Another victim of the economy (Score:3, Flamebait)
It used to take me two days to to the trade show in Toronto (before it was overtaken over by Comdex). The last Comdex here, I did in 2 hours.
Computer shows were great when you could find products that you never knew existed and could talk to the actual designers. When it became more focused on the end user, the consumer, the web became a much better medium.
Another victim of bad business practices (Score:1)
Save money when you have it, and spend it when you don't. That's how you ride out a recession, but some companies (and most individuals) do just the opposite: they spend money when they have lots of it, and then valiantly try to save money when money is tight. That's a recipe for bankruptcy.
Comdex has been good to me (Score:1)
I do enough IT work to be called an IT professional. Comdex has really helped me see different computer technologies I wouldn't know existed. I could get detailed answers on the spot rather than just a few words of jargon on a website.
Most people say exhibitors should focus on informing people rather than on wonderful booths and therefore save money, but I found that the people with the nicest booths were also the most enthusiastic while the really plain booths had total dumbasses who treated me like dirt.
Re:Another victim of the economy (Score:2)
We had a similar but opposite problem. Basically the sales people who would normally go to Comdex en-masse were not going because they were not going to meet enough customers to make it worthwhile. So as a result the field marketing people were finding that their booth roster which would normally be oversubscribed was actually short of people.
I think that Comdex have just discovered that they are in a cyclic business - which in part explains the ludicrously high margins that they could make in the good times.
Another area that saw the same sort of effect was training. I used to wonder just how the training companies could charge such huge amounts. Then when the crash came the reason became obvious, training budgets were the first to go. So a training company with 50 people making gross margins of 50% would see their revenue cut by 75% overnight, suddenly they are making a huge loss.
So basically the training companies and the conference companies work in the same type of mode. The companies that succeed do so because they hit exactly the right spot in the business cycle. The market never matures sufficiently to become a commodity business because the market leaders get chopped back or go bankrupt every 10 years or so with the business cycle.
Did you ever find them actually valuable? (Score:2)
I've found that convention booths are almost universally staffed with marketing drones who parrot the marketing slogans and know little about their products and even less about the actual technolgies they implement. The better sales people (am I actually saying this?) are usually out on some golf course or at a whorehouse with their top customers.
Plus, even when I get something out of a booth, it's hard to take that knowledge back to the office unless you're working on a current project proposal and immediately get resellers in and work on quotes. Otherwise its kind of like intellectual flotsam you lose six months later.
The only time I can see it being valuable is if you were involved in a virtual community and the yearly get together involved a lot of panels or other kinds of interactivity you couldn't get otherwise. I don't count Comdex and their ilk in that, they're not specific enough.
Re:Did you ever find them actually valuable? (Score:2)
I get to stay in decent hotels, but I swear I eat 80% of my meals as either fast food or room service, which sucks. I usually find time to squeeze in one $100 meal, but thats it. And since I travel alone, any "spare" time I have is usually kind of a wash -- I'm either too tired or have little interest in roaming around by myself. I've done a lot of Slashdot in hotel rooms!
Perspectives (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Perspectives (Score:3, Informative)
The Exclusive Service Contract (and the Exclusive Labor Contract) is a license to steal. However, it eventually drives off the venue's customers.
Don't worry, the decorating companies aren't going bankrupt, just the promoters and venues.
Re:license to steal (Score:2)
Re:Perspectives (Score:2)
The company I work for is a small company but has a good size presence at certain shows(Networld).
In vegas we put our own booth up though the union doesn't like it.(You're stealing food from our children!).
If it was in Florida, we would have to pay the union to set-up the booth(and damage everything), while charging us huge amounts of money for a sub-par job, because it is Against The Law for us to set it up ourselves. And you thought just big business and governments were corrupt.
Called right to work or something like that.
Re:Perspectives (Score:1)
Conferences will Continue (Score:2, Informative)
Look at it this way: (Score:4, Funny)
On the other hand, while you might not be getting your clothes at Comdex, you are proportionately less likely to get beat up on the street for wearing said clothes and so baldly advertising your geekiness.
JavaOne (Score:2)
Comdex vs other venues (Score:1)
Very upbeat, considering the bankruptcy and all... (Score:4, Informative)
From: Fred Rosen - Key3Media
Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 8:15 AM
Subject: Important News From Key3Media
February 3, 2003
To Our Colleagues in the Technology Community:
We wanted to let you know about some news that will have a very positive impact on our ability to serve you going forward. Key3Media today reached an agreement to recapitalize the Company. It includes a voluntarily filing for Chapter 11 protection, which will allow us to remove the majority of our debt, restore a healthy balance sheet and do business with you unencumbered by extraneous financial issues.
All of our scheduled tradeshows and conferences will take place as planned. And, we can now begin to implement an array of new programs that will help make our industry-leading events even better.
We are pleased that our plan is backed by accomplished investor Thomas Weisel Capital Partners. In addition to providing short term funding ? which will enable us to operate our business and meet our obligations during the proceedings ? they are providing long-term financing and strategic counsel to help the Company throughout this process and beyond. While Key3Media has been impacted by the combination of a recent global decline in the IT and networking industries, a significant amount of debt on its balance sheet, as well as a decrease in business travel and hospitality after the tragic events of September 11, 2001, Key3Media is a fundamentally sound business with a strong portfolio of brands, a large high-caliber client base, and a leading market position.
We recognize that there continues to be significant demand for face-to-face marketing, and we remain committed to providing such forums. We sincerely hope this does not cause you any inconvenience and look forward to your continued support. We greatly value our relationship with you, and are committed to meeting your needs. We plan to exit the Chapter 11 process as soon as possible, with no disruption to our events. We fully intend to benefit from Chapter 11, by becoming a healthier, stronger company with a solid financial footing ? enabling us to continue to offer the world?s best information technology tradeshows and conferences.
To view a FAQ document and for additional information, visit www.key3media.com. We will continue to update you as we move through the process, but if you have questions please don?t hesitate to call your Key3Media contact directly, or reply to this email with your message and we will respond to you within 48 hours.
We look forward to continuing to work with you and are committed to giving you our best.
Sincerely,
Fredric D. Rosen
Chairman and Chief Executive Officer
Key3Media Group
Why Not Combine the Big Shows? (Score:3, Interesting)
Why not combine them all into a single expo in San Francisco? Mac OS X and Linux are second cousins in terms of the OS and have developed a symbiosis of sorts. Many products for Mac OS X work with Linux--and a show such as this would encourage vendors to make such products work.
Every computer uses the technologies hawked at COMDEX, so it should break even, at least.
And all would benefit from the larger crowds, and less expensive space.
I picked SF since Apple has been inclined to stay closer to home for their shows and have considered backing out of other Macworlds in NY and Boston. An East Coast or Midwestern show might more fiscal sense, but I don't know which would be have more exhibitor and visitor oomph.
Re:Why Not Combine the Big Shows? (Score:2)
Larger size != profits, this is now the common mentality that plagues business today. Many of the same problems that led to Comdex's demise would occur if their was one big supershow.
Re:Why Not Combine the Big Shows? (Score:2)
No computer company or technology is an island into itself. Everyone wants to sell. Only Microsoft, for the most part, generates products that are truly proprietary, where no other OS or hardware can be made to co-operate. Would the people who sell Linux software mind if the Mac people bought their software? Hell, no! Would the vendors who normally sell PC-related hardware or software at COMDEX mind if it turned out they could add several million Linux users with just a tweak of their product? No way.
Only Microsoft would not join in the defense as they are the robber barons sitting on the hill, watching for their opportunity to scavenge or exploit. That's business.
are you kidding (Score:2)
Apple is as proprietary as they come. Sure they use OSS for their benefit, but they make sure that their products will only work with their platform. Apple gives lackluster support to third party hardware. Now most mac fanboys will say, well Apple has to make money somewhere but if MS gave preference to their hardware over other manufactures, people would be going nuts. In short, Apple does not play well with others.
If Apple is so committed to OSS, why don't they release the source for what makes a mac different or good, Acqua anyone? If apple is committed to openness, their software should support multiple vendors even when apple has a competitive advantage as in the case with the superdrive.
No, I'm not kidding. (Score:2)
OF COURSE Apple wants people to use only their stuff with their software. They lose their competitive edge if they didn't. That includes the Aqua appearance. It belongs to Apple. If they don't want to share, I'm sure you and other OSS people can make your own.
Why doesn't Apple release their source?
Ask Coca-Cola why they don't release their beverage formula "for the good of the world" and you have your answer. Without trying to insult you, it's a stupid question. Apple is a business. Businesses exist to make a profit. They will do anything to achieve this to the extent of ethics and law. And, they aren't necessarily trying to impress people with views such as yours.
With the exception of the core components of their OS (the rest is available in a form of open source), Apple uses no more unique components than, say, Compaq, or Dell. Apple is as committed to OSS as their business model. You can look at that as half-empty, or half-full. The number of UNIX users switching or adding OS X to their assortment of computers tends to lend to half-full.
Apple has not always played well with others. That logic nearly killed them. Today, they use the same standards as everyone else except where they can show a competitive advantage (such as the DVI-inspired display connectors on their flat screens).
Apple gives excellent support to third party hardware and the proof. Note that this support is typically the responsibity of the company that makes the product, not Apple, whose responsibilty is to ensure that the necessary hooks to use the product work.
I'm not sure where you have your sources, but I'm betting my personal use as well as 17+ years of supporting Macs in businesses trump your source.
Don't confuse OSS with socialism. It ain't the same. Businesses shouldn't share everything or they wouldn't be a business.
You're going to need an Alka-Seltzer for all that stuff I fed you.
here you go (Score:2)
The biggest problem with the Mac user base, is blind loyalty.
here is source one [zdnet.co.uk]
source two [com.com]
this was a great move as well [com.com]
this is a classic [theregister.co.uk]
another example of Apple's fine legal department [macworld.com]
I can link to countless other tales as well and just a little friendly advice, recounting X amount experience comes off as foolish and condescending. Personal experience with anything is not an accurate benchmark. Apple has a great product with OSX, as a tibook owner, I'm very happy, but Apple the company is not as great as their user base perceives it to be and somehow they think buying an Apple product makes them part of a movement, which is completely ludicrous, but a marketing success nonetheless for Apple
Re:here you go (Score:2)
Source one: Just because Apple uses the DCMA doesn't make their action wrong. They simply don't want their products latched onto by a third-party in such a way that diminishes sales for the base product. In other words, Apple made iDVD for its hardware, not for some third-party. Their toys, their rules. Deal with it.
Source two: To clarify, Apple isn't stopping people from burning DVDs with their Macs. They are trying to stop the vendors who make external DVD burners from using APPLE'S software to burn. Else, Apple loses its marketing punch to try to get you to buy a DVD-burner equipped Mac. Also, this is Apple's burning software. Their EULA alone (never mind the ratty DCMA) likely says that "you can't change our software, especially to sell another product." This is just a repeat of 'source one.'
Source three: Again, Apple doesn't want to get itself in trouble with the DCMA (which can easily be used by other group against Apple). Apple's developer agreement is also clear on what this guy can and can't do with the iTunes SDK. Since then, he made the app a standalone, and Apple can't do a thing. Next.
Source four: Apple owns the look and feel it calls Aqua. Copy it, and get their lawyers' wrath. What does this have to do with anything, unless you're implying that protecting what you own is somehow against the law or unethical. In that case, I'll just help myself to your computer and any software you made just for yourself and take it home...
Source five: Again, you're just showing that Apple's lawyers are a bunch of anally attentive bastards. It doesn't disprove anything, or show that Apple is out of bounds for protecting their logo, the name "Mac," or anything that may mistakening endorse a third-party product as that from Apple.
If you don't believe personal experience means anything, try skydiving. Right now. Or maybe even spaceflight.
We do agree on the quality of Apple's products, yes. I don't see Apple as perfect by any means, but it has a right to defend what it owns or it won't make cash. To see Apple go completely OSS is the death of Apple. They aren't angels, no, but in a lot of devils, they're my choice for a devil.
Back to the Roots (Score:1)
CES used to be home to all the video games too, Nintendo, Sega, Atari, 3d0, NeoGeo all had booths. That's another industry that spun off into it's own convention.
Point is, they all did it when the economy was awesome and people could take trips to all these different shows. Now, it just makes sense to re-organize and absorb the smaller conventions back into bigger ones. (Hell, even the porno conventions spun off, those used to be integrated too)
Saw this comming last year. (Score:1)
Them Darned Cloths! (Score:1)
No but you buy them cloths to make your CLOTHES!!
I prefer local conferences and meetings (Score:1)
I have been to both national and local meetings
and shows.
Both as an exhibitor and a patron, I have to say that I much prefer the smaller, local shows than the large national ones.
The smaller local and regional shows are often cheaper in registration fees. Often there is no
travel at all. If there is, it may be a 100 to
200 mile drive and staying at a Motel 6 type of
place or in one event I went to, 4 of us rented
a home for the week.($600 divided by 4 for 4
days resulted is approx $40 per night)
There is a much more community feeling to the event. You can see the whole thing and meet
all of the exhibitors without having to do
a marathon run each day. Seminars are smaller;
you should be able to ask all of your questions.
Granted, there might not be as many models, but
who really needs them?
As an exhibitor, I find that the smaller halls
are much more 'hang loose' in what you can do
and bring. I was involved in one where we all
assembled and dissambled our own boots. AV was
done by volunteers on barter for free tickets.
Chairs and tables were available if you did not
bring in your own. Booths could hand out food
without problems from the hall.
Overall, I much prefer a closer-to-home experience
like this then the national shows.
Too bad ... (Score:2)
A surefire way out of Bankrupcy!! (Score:1)
From what I read, everyone goes to the porn convention anyways.
heh
Dolemite
Goodbye Comdex (Score:1)
If you didn't suck, you wouldn't have gotten to this point.
I've been to a few of your trade shows here in Vancouver, and to be honest, it was pathetic. The people standing in front of cool-looking technology had no technical knowledge to explain it. The costs were prohibitive for vendors, so you ended up with a few huge booths by Apple, Microsoft...but very few small ones. The schwag people were giving away was stupid (plastic balls, golf pencils - no t-shirts, nothing informative about the products). And even though people were barely trickling in and there were no lineups, it took half an hour to process badges to allow people in.
Comdex, you are mismanagement of the highest order. You provided a tradeshow that no one wanted and weren't willing to change to entice your potential customers. You obviously had no idea who we in the technical field are and never cared to ask us what we really wanted to see. You were the worst of the dot-com boom, and couldn't be bothered to change for the dot-com decline.
So I'm not sorry to see you go. Goodbye Comdex, let's hope that you are the last.
Kickstart
As a journalist (Score:2, Interesting)
Comdex registration emails sold? (Score:1)
Out of curiosity, I set up another unique address, and sent a complaint to the Canadian Comdex people from that address about all the spam I was getting. I got a nice reply from them, denying any wrongdoing of course.
Two days later that address started getting spammed like crazy.
So long Comdex.
Thanks for nothing.
Oh No, Vanna! (Score:2)
I'm afraid so. And it looks like you are already saving up by not buying any vowels!
-D
No, he meant cloths (Score:2, Funny)
TOWELS (Score:2)
I'm amazed too. (Score:2, Informative)
But then, I'm also amazed that a person that gets paid to be an [b]editor[/b] doesn't. It'd be a bit like getting paid to paint houses and not bothering with the spots you can't reach.
It's about pride in your craft. Pudge [pudge.net] is an editor. Expecting an editor to produce a single sentence his high school English teacher would approve is not too much to ask.
Re:I'm amazed too. (Score:2)
Considering that we get similar comments every single time there's a typo in an article, yes, I would call it "bitching and moaning"
Does the "cloth/clothes" typo somehow make this article less enjoyable? Does it makes it impossible for you to understand what is being said? Does it somehow make the article less interesting? I would say "no" to all those questions
If you want to talk about grammar and punctuation, go to school. This isn't school, this is
Re:I'm amazed too. (Score:2, Funny)
Slashdot: Even Dumber Than School
Re:I'm amazed too. (Score:1)
Would an article written in hacker speak be any less interesting?
Re:Ouch (Score:2)
Probably a smart idea for Comdex since they are loosing people, but a poor idea for CES since most companies pulling out of comdex are already heading for the CES.
Will be interesting to see what is happening at other computer shows, guess I will find out when I goto CeBit this year.
Re: Sadness .. (Score:1)